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Thread: Gonzaga vs Duke Post Game thoughts and analysis

  1. #76
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    Although I was disappointed that we lost last night, I was so proud of our guys. The game could have gotten out of control when they went down 27-18 in the first half. But we battled back and it was surprising to see us down by only 3 at the half when it appeared as if we were on the defensive in the opening half - especially with some early foul trouble. Although with Duke losing Banchero for several minutes in the 2nd half and the fact he may not have been himself most of the half - the fact that we went up by 4 with about 5-6 minutes left in the game was truly an accomplishment. Turnovers, foul trouble impacting our aggressiveness and personnel on the floor, and the fact that they went to the line so much more often than we did - was the reason we lost the game. Enough of the game - I, for one, was very proud of our team. But this morning - I feel as positive as I can about a 3 point loss to Duke. (1) I would rather lose in November than March/April so where this is not a meaningless loss - we still get to come back on Monday night to continue our season. (2) We can learn a lot about this game and ourselves. The way Strawther and Bolton stepped up during crunch time when Timme and Nembhard did not have their best games is really exciting to see. (3) To come within 3 points of Duke when we had 17 turnovers, all sorts of foul trouble, they went to the line 14 more times than we did and had 8 more points from the charity stripe (when was the last time we had 24 personal fouls in a game), and (4) we went 6-21 from deep - tells me that the game was very winnable and i would argue that the next time we face them, if we do, just improving on one of those aspects - and we win the game. I am also happy that the pressure of an undefeated season is now gone. They can go out and just play their game which by the way is pretty damn great. Now the people who see the cup half empty will argue that not having Banchero for most of the 2nd half was the big factor that made it closer than it was but this morning I want to say that there are many aspects of the game that we can and most likely will improve upon by tournament time that will more than offset the loss of Banchero. Again I wish the outcome was different - I truly do - but I am one proud Zag fan this morning. This team has already exceeded my expectations. Go Zags - Cannot wait to watch them on Monday night.
    Love the Zags!!!

  2. #77
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    Shades of Baylor out there last night. A big athletic team that isnt gonna let you do what you want. Coach K knows you stop the vaunted GU offense AT THE POINT OF THE ATTACK....and they have the athletes to do it. Too many times the guy with the ball got smothered and mafe a bad pass..they knew how to disrupt us.What did we need to do? The passing game needs to get shortened up. I think our best advantage on Duke was our conditioning...kudos to the GU trainer. There was a point last night where we had them dragging ass up the court...and if we had put 6 or 8 points on them..we win. ALSO,most of our guys have not seen or played against any team close to the athletes Duke has...it takes adjustment...thought Chet played a decent secind half...he needs to practice his 3's more...he missed a few wide open ones. The team needs to practice free throws too....every point counts.

    Would have been nice to win...and we didn't fold...and counter punched right back. We should still be top 5 come Monday....keep learning keep growing keep working...we are gonna win a bunch.
    Kudos to Duke.
    Mr. Strawther has made HUGE strides in 1 season.

  3. #78
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    I feel like the Zags came out a bit full of themselves and Duke came out and punched them in the mouth. The boys did a great job of working their way back into but in the end they fell short. Jmho I feel like they lost that blue collar nose to the grindstone attitude and didn’t get it back until late in the first half. I think this game was what the doctor ordered. Going to make them hungry and angry. Think they’ll steamroll through to the first BYU game.
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by LongIslandZagFan View Post
    I feel like the Zags came out a bit full of themselves and Duke came out and punched them in the mouth. The boys did a great job of working their way back into but in the end they fell short. Jmho I feel like they lost that blue collar nose to the grindstone attitude and didn’t get it back until late in the first half. I think this game was what the doctor ordered. Going to make the hungry and angry. Think they’ll steamroll through to the first BYU game.
    Reminds me of the Baylor start.
    America's Team!

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgadfly View Post
    The big issue I had was how many more fouls GU committed early in the first half even though Duke was playing extremely physical and extended defense. To my eye, the first half officiating heavily favored Duke’s extended defense while penalizing GU for icing pick and rolls and making the same or lesser contact closer to the hoop.
    This. I watched the game w/ my brother, who was a fairly dispassionate observer (first Zag game he's watched this year, fell asleep a couple times) and he said "it looks like they're calling a lot of touch fouls on Gonzaga" and "it only takes a couple of calls to change the momentum".

  6. #81
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    @ big plays first when the duke player flopped and they called Timme for his 3rd foul early in the 2nd half, and when Chet was fouled and knocked down and they called traveling on Chet. Those 2 plays were the difference in the game. Of course if they would have guarded Banchero in the 1st half those plays would not have mattered. Did Banchero hit a shot when he was guarded ? Everything I remember him hitting he was wide open. Banchero other than hitting those wide open shots, did not over impress me. He is not that athletic, did not appear to like contact, is not that good of a rebounder for his size. I was more impressed with Moore than Banchero. Moore and Williams were the ones that beat us, not Banchero. Why was Banchero playing anyway ? He should have been suspended for that dui incident.
    Last edited by TheOtherGreatOne; 11-28-2021 at 04:28 PM.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOtherGreatOne View Post
    @ big plays first when the duke player flopped and they called Timme for his 3rd foul early in the 2nd half, and when Chet was fouled and knocked down and they called traveling on Chet. Those 2 plays were the difference in the game. Of course if they would have guarded Banchero in the 1st half those plays would not have mattered. Did Banchero hit a shot when he was guarded ? Everything I remember him hitting he was wide open. Banchero other than hitting those wide open shots, did not over impress me. He is that athletic, did not appear to like contact, is not that good of a rebounder for his size. I was more impressed with More than Banchero. Moore and Williams were the ones that beat us, not Banchero. Why was banchero playing anyway ? He should have been suspended for that dui incident.
    there was another really bad foul on duke that was not called by the refs, and it was also one of the more dirty plays of the game. There was a loose ball heading towards the out of bounds and I believe it was Timme who was going for it and a Duke player totally shoves him and Timme falls to the ground and can not get to the ball.
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

  8. #83
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    You all know I love Gonzaga and Gonzaga basketball. I was quite upset about the game, as was evident by my thread last night. I do not like games that are called like this one. And I do not like where one team gets a huge edge in foul calls. Duke was more physical by far than Gonzaga was, and yet the Zags were called for way more fouls than was Duke. I have let all of this go today, and I KNOW that the team will benefit hugely from this loss. If there was ever such a thing as a good loss this is the one. And in the end the loss may benefit the Zags more than winning it would have.

    I just don't like losing to Duke. Not so much to the team, the players especially, but to their fans, and to their university. I used to participate on a forum with Duke fans and it was the worst forum you could imagine. I won't go into it in detail, but I only lasted for about a week or two. they said such horrible things about Gonzaga.

    I will always love ALL Zag teams. This is a really great time of year for me. From now until March Madness. I still believe that this will be a great team. The season is young, and we have had a really tough out of conference schedule this year, and so far we're doing pretty darn well. Playing UCLA and Duke in the same week is not an easy task. Gonzaga did not finish the game in the way that they should have, and this MUST be addressed. This game was there for us to win. It was ours to win as much as it was for Duke to win. IMO we did not close the deal, and Few likes to say, and he will address this. And I believe Few needs to address why he is not building more confidence in his bench becausse he has some great players there just waiting to contribute more than they are. For this bench to only score 4 points in a game like this, I believe, is a reflection of Few's impact on them. This must change IMO.

    Go Zags!!!
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reborn View Post
    You all know I love Gonzaga and Gonzaga basketball. I was quite upset about the game, as was evident by my thread last night. I do not like games that are called like this one. And I do not like where one team gets a huge edge in foul calls. Duke was more physical by far than Gonzaga was, and yet the Zags were called for way more fouls than was Duke. I have let all of this go today, and I KNOW that the team will benefit hugely from this loss. If there was ever such a thing as a good loss this is the one. And in the end the loss may benefit the Zags more than winning it would have.

    I just don't like losing to Duke. Not so much to the team, the players especially, but to their fans, and to their university. I used to participate on a forum with Duke fans and it was the worst forum you could imagine. I won't go into it in detail, but I only lasted for about a week or two. they said such horrible things about Gonzaga.

    I will always love ALL Zag teams. This is a really great time of year for me. From now until March Madness. I still believe that this will be a great team. The season is young, and we have had a really tough out of conference schedule this year, and so far we're doing pretty darn well. Playing UCLA and Duke in the same week is not an easy task. Gonzaga did not finish the game in the way that they should have, and this MUST be addressed. This game was there for us to win. It was ours to win as much as it was for Duke to win. IMO we did not close the deal, and Few likes to say, and he will address this. And I believe Few needs to address why he is not building more confidence in his bench becausse he has some great players there just waiting to contribute more than they are. For this bench to only score 4 points in a game like this, I believe, is a reflection of Few's impact on them. This must change IMO.

    Go Zags!!!
    Don't feel bad, Bornie. On the way out of Twin Peaks last night, I walked by some vocal Duke fans that were talking smack. I couldn't resist, I had to ask the portly gentleman, "did you go to Duke?"

    I felt a bit cheesy after that, as his only affiliation to Duke would have been in their Custodial Arts program. I simply don't dig bandwagon fans, North Texas is full of those, especially Cowboys fans.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOtherGreatOne View Post
    and when Chet was fouled and knocked down and they called traveling on Chet.
    This one really raised an objection. Holgrem was essentially knocked to the floor as he gained control of the ball, and then the Duke player fell on top of him. Not even certain that he actually traveled inasmuch as he had his left foot on the ground as he passed the ball.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by daskim View Post
    This one really raised an objection. Holgrem was essentially knocked to the floor as he gained control of the ball, and then the Duke player fell on top of him. Not even certain that he actually traveled inasmuch as he had his left foot on the ground as he passed the ball.
    Replays were clear he did not have possession nor control of the ball until he was on the ground….baseline ref swallowed his whistle and deferred to the trail official who could no way shape or form see through two bodies to see if Chet had control or not Really bad

    I am ignoring the clear bump or push that initially forced Chet off balance as “part of the physical game”
    Basketball...The Toy Department of Life

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  12. #87
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    That bald pated ref last night---hope Zags don't see him again this season.
    "The best players will play. That's the way it will always be." Larry Bird

  13. #88
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    Default Banchero

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOtherGreatOne View Post
    @ big plays first when the duke player flopped and they called Timme for his 3rd foul early in the 2nd half, and when Chet was fouled and knocked down and they called traveling on Chet. Those 2 plays were the difference in the game. Of course if they would have guarded Banchero in the 1st half those plays would not have mattered. Did Banchero hit a shot when he was guarded ? Everything I remember him hitting he was wide open. Banchero other than hitting those wide open shots, did not over impress me. He is that athletic, did not appear to like contact, is not that good of a rebounder for his size. I was more impressed with More than Banchero. Moore and Williams were the ones that beat us, not Banchero. Why was banchero playing anyway ? He should have been suspended for that dui incident.
    Banchero is a stud. Leader. Watched him in layup lines before game and he was determined. Took Chet to the hole and drew a foul with the bucket. Dropped 20 on zags in first half. Gonna be a great player at next level. Great handles and can shoot and d up.

    Good kid. Visited gu twice if I recall. Very interested and then koach swooped in and nabbed him to Durham.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyle dixon View Post
    Banchero is a stud. Leader. Watched him in layup lines before game and he was determined. Took Chet to the hole and drew a foul with the bucket. Dropped 20 on zags in first half. Gonna be a great player at next level. Great handles and can shoot and d up.

    Good kid. Visited gu twice if I recall. Very interested and then koach swooped in and nabbed him to Durham.
    He sure looks like top pick at next level.
    "The best players will play. That's the way it will always be." Larry Bird

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyle dixon View Post
    Banchero is a stud. Leader. Watched him in layup lines before game and he was determined. Took Chet to the hole and drew a foul with the bucket. Dropped 20 on zags in first half. Gonna be a great player at next level. Great handles and can shoot and d up.

    Good kid. Visited gu twice if I recall. Very interested and then koach swooped in and nabbed him to Durham.
    Imagine not being impressed by Paolo. He is incredibly good and the number 1 pick next year. We almost got him!

  16. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reborn View Post
    Great post, Demian. One of the best in this thread. You are such a good writer, and can say things in a much shorter and concise way then i can, Keep writing and contributing more to this Board (forum).

    Go Zags!!!
    Hey thanks Dad. Yeah maybe I will start to get back to being more interactive here on the board like I used to be

  17. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZagLawGrad View Post
    That bald pated ref last night---hope Zags don't see him again this season.
    There were 2 of them.

    One is a WCC/PAC official.

    The other Big 12/Missouri Valley.
    But we don't play nobody.

  18. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by NEC26 View Post
    While I don't agree the refs cost us this game those blocks by Williams were not clean and the right call. Just because you get a hand on the ball does not make it a clean block if you went through the shooters body to get there. Which is clearly what happened. Yes he got ball but he also slammed into him as he was going up as well.
    Not challenging your comment but these two goal-tending calls were not about fouls being called or not but rather, that they were good blocks and the refs missed these two and others as well...just pointing out that calls did not just go towards Duke but rather were indiscriminate...

  19. #94
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    When it came to working the refs, it was golf claps vs Big Bertha.

  20. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zagceo View Post
    Duke 23 points off turnovers Zags 2.
    Game, Set, Match....................................

    Simply cannot have 17 TO's against an elite opponent. Seemed like Nemby and Timme got "sped up" in the first few minutes, settled down after that but the damage was done. Great learning game, rather lose to Dook or anyone else in November than in March/April.

    Pretty simple. Keep the TO's to 12 or fewer and the ZAGS win by 6+.

    Go ZAGS

  21. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzdelmar View Post
    When it came to working the refs, it was golf claps vs Big Bertha.
    Few has to work the refs more if he’s facing Duke. You know it’ll come from K and he’s naturally going to get a whistle. Few can’t be sitting back and hoping things take care of themself.

  22. #97
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    I've already moved on. CBB is not like the NFL, in which they only play once a week. We have a game tomorrow against Cupcake State. That's the game I'm focused on. You can't live in the past.
    WE ZIGGED, WE ZAGGED, AND WE STILL ENDED UP AT THE KENNEL !

  23. #98
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    For a variety of reasons, I do not attend many games now days....one of them is that I inevitably sat within earshot of a retired Hall of Fame Coach who was pontificating constantly about what the coach should do....or a retired official who disputed every call against his team...
    Last edited by bartruff1; 11-28-2021 at 04:02 PM.

  24. #99
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    Exactly what is "working the refs?"

    Is it the same as "framing a pitch" in baseball?

  25. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by daskim View Post
    Exactly what is "working the refs?"

    Is it the same as "framing a pitch" in baseball?
    Good analogy. Seeking extralegal advantage, outside the rules of the game. Tilting the playing field.

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