Results 1 to 24 of 24

Thread: Depth

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    1,503

    Default Depth

    Lots of talk about a good Purdue team and their strength because of depth. Zags are good too. Despite coach's penchant for small rotations would people say one of our strengths is good depth?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Lacrosse, Washington
    Posts
    8,141

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by roxdoc View Post
    Lots of talk about a good Purdue team and their strength because of depth. Zags are good too. Despite coach's penchant for small rotations would people say one of our strengths is good depth?
    Potential for development of depth but strong 7 deep, fairly strong 8 deep. How deep does one need to go?

    And one of the guards is out with injury
    Basketball...The Toy Department of Life

    Don't mess wth happy...Coach Few

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    1,813

    Default

    I think we're clearly strong 8 deep. If you give a half-credit each to Perry and Gregg -- works in progress, but each with flashes already very early in the season -- I think we are (or can be) a legit 9+ deep.

    I know Coach tightens his rotations as the season advances, but he's got a lot of talent to choose from.
    Your children have been placed in the custody of...Carl's Jr.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    1,665

    Default

    Good discussion, but history is definitely working against anything more than a 7-man rotation. Coach has NEVER gone more than 7 deep at any time in his career, if memory serves. Now, a lot of the time in the early years the talent to go deeper than 7 just wasn't there, but in the last 5+ years it has been.

    I hope I'm wrong, but I just don't see it happening. Even this year, going more than 8 deep (starters, Watson, Hickman, Sallis) results in a big drop off, especially against the ranked teams in the OOC and anyone after the first weekend in the Dance. Gregg and Perry simply aren't ready for any meaningful minutes against elite teams. They may be in future years, but not this year.

    Go ZAGS

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Posts
    52

    Default

    Getting in the rotation, ie meaningful minutes, comes from hard work in practice and then taking advantage of the opportunities in games. I don’t think we will see 7 man rotation, Sallis has earned meaningful minutes with his energy, and defense.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    2,931

    Default

    I would say that the depth is there. We have 3 strong front court players and if real foul trouble occurred depending on whether you needed defense or offense you have Greg or Perry. And we have a strong set of guards, with at least 2 or 3 point guards for passing and all of them can defend and do pick and rolls. We might be a little weak at the three, but we can do it by committee. Just finding the right set will be the difficulty.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Spokane, WA
    Posts
    1,670

    Default

    We have depth but as games get tighter Few will shorten the bench regardless. I would really like to see more Gregg and Perry. I am hoping we can find one more big that can provide some more offense balance.
    America's Team!

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,327

    Default

    When the big games are played, the rotation will stick at eight guys with a few minutes if needed from Gregg or Perry.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Savannah, GA
    Posts
    3,833

    Default

    Depth, where is thy sting?
    Even though I care a lot about my basketball opinions, they are like comparing a bicycle to a championship motorcycle who is our coach. . ZagsGoZags

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    seattle, spokane
    Posts
    3,851

    Default

    last time we started:
    Bolton, Andrew, Julian, Timme and Chet.
    That leaves
    6 anton as the 3 and was a 4 star recruit
    7 hickman as the 1 and was a 5 star recruit
    8 sallis as the 2 and was a 5 star recruit
    9 gregg as the 4 and was a 4 star recruit
    10 perry as the 5 and was a 4 star recruit

    what fun, a whole team - I dont think any WCC team has this much star power in their 5 starters!
    One of the biggest impediments to gregg and kaden breaking into the rotation,
    IMHO, is that Strawther and Watson are big enough to do some of the work Perry and Gregg could have potentially provided backing up Timme and Chet.
    Its hard for me to imagine us having a better recruiting year again, but I love to think we will.

    I don't see how Few will give tiny minutes to Sallis this year, esp when Hickman's skill set resembles Nembhard and Bolton so well.
    Hunter's skill set doesn't resemble anybody.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    8,631

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TacomaZAG View Post
    Good discussion, but history is definitely working against anything more than a 7-man rotation. Coach has NEVER gone more than 7 deep at any time in his career, if memory serves. Now, a lot of the time in the early years the talent to go deeper than 7 just wasn't there, but in the last 5+ years it has been.

    I hope I'm wrong, but I just don't see it happening. Even this year, going more than 8 deep (starters, Watson, Hickman, Sallis) results in a big drop off, especially against the ranked teams in the OOC and anyone after the first weekend in the Dance. Gregg and Perry simply aren't ready for any meaningful minutes against elite teams. They may be in future years, but not this year.

    Go ZAGS
    Wasn't it more with the Karno/Sabonis Collins/JW3 front line shifts, plus the normal 4-5 guard rotation?
    Last edited by willandi; 11-22-2021 at 07:41 AM.
    I'm laughing. Why aren't you?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Spokane / Surprise, AZ
    Posts
    2,151

    Default

    Chet had great hands, quicker than one would expect. I loved that snatch on the inbound.
    One of the greatest stories in basketball history...Gonzaga!

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    cave-in-rock,il
    Posts
    739

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoopaholic View Post
    Potential for development of depth but strong 7 deep, fairly strong 8 deep. How deep does one need to go?

    And one of the guards is out with injury
    You need to give good players playing time if you want good players to keep coming to your school. Good players are not going to keep coming to your school if they are not going to play. If you got 10 good players, play them.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    1,665

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by willandi View Post
    Wasn't it more with the Karno/Sabonis Collins/JW3 front line shifts, plus the normal 4-5 guard rotation?
    Not to my recollection. Even with those really good front lines, meaningful minutes went to 3 bigs and 4 guards. If memory serves, Coach has never gone 5 guards deep with meaningful minutes, nor has he gone meaningful minutes with 4 bigs. WRT the guard rotation this year, Coach could go 5 deep with Hickman & Sallis both getting meaningful minutes off the bench, will have to wait and see.

    Go ZAGS

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    5,702

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ZagsGoZags View Post
    last time we started:
    Bolton, Andrew, Julian, Timme and Chet.
    That leaves
    6 anton as the 3 and was a 4 star recruit
    7 hickman as the 1 and was a 5 star recruit
    8 sallis as the 2 and was a 5 star recruit
    9 gregg as the 4 and was a 4 star recruit
    10 perry as the 5 and was a 4 star recruit

    what fun, a whole team - I dont think any WCC team has this much star power in their 5 starters!
    One of the biggest impediments to gregg and kaden breaking into the rotation,
    IMHO, is that Strawther and Watson are big enough to do some of the work Perry and Gregg could have potentially provided backing up Timme and Chet.
    Its hard for me to imagine us having a better recruiting year again, but I love to think we will.

    I don't see how Few will give tiny minutes to Sallis this year, esp when Hickman's skill set resembles Nembhard and Bolton so well.
    Hunter's skill set doesn't resemble anybody.
    I wouldn't have any qualms about any of that bench 5 starting any games this year. Perry is the most raw but he would also be the most fun to watch (assuming he doesn't foul out in 5 minutes).

    To another one of your points, it has me wondering if there is another high-impact one-and-done type that the staff is going to grab for next year? Having one of these on the roster a year is my favorite way of doing things. If you have too many you lose the players with experience and all of the benefit that provides. But having at least one provides that little bit of an edge with the wow plays that nobody else can do, while not sacrificing too much on the mistakes/growing pains side of things.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Northridge, Ca
    Posts
    176

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GonzagasaurusFlex View Post
    Depth, where is thy sting?
    I see what you did there

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Posts
    79

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOtherGreatOne View Post
    You need to give good players playing time if you want good players to keep coming to your school. Good players are not going to keep coming to your school if they are not going to play. If you got 10 good players, play them.
    This doesn't seem very well evidenced.

    GU has a long history of barely playing good or promising recruits for a year or two as they develop, yet attracting better recruits than ever.

    Rui played just spot minutes his Freshman year, came off the bench as a sophomore when he was the WCC player of the year.

    Zach Norvell took a (not really needed) redshirt year as a freshman, didn't play much the first half of his second year.

    Strawther barely played last year.

    Joel played just 5 minutes a game during his SECOND year in the program.

    etc.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Posts
    79

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TacomaZAG View Post
    If memory serves, Coach has never gone 5 guards deep with meaningful minutes, nor has he gone meaningful minutes with 4 bigs.
    Several recent years with 4 bigs averaging at least 11 minutes:

    2017 - Shem/Jw3/Collins/Tillie
    2019 - Rui/BC/Tillie/Petrusev
    2020 - Tillie/Petrusev/Timme/Watson

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    1,665

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by StatZag View Post
    Several recent years with 4 bigs averaging at least 11 minutes:

    2017 - Shem/Jw3/Collins/Tillie
    2019 - Rui/BC/Tillie/Petrusev
    2020 - Tillie/Petrusev/Timme/Watson
    Thanks, StatZag, appreciate the research. During those years, did the ZAGS have 4+ guards with meaningful minutes (10+ minutes per game)??

    I hate it when memory doesn't serve.................

    Go ZAGS

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Edmonds, WA
    Posts
    41

    Default

    Tillie, Melson and Collins all got 14 mins in the Championship game.

    IIRC, that 8 man rotation for existed for most of that year.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Posts
    79

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TacomaZAG View Post
    Thanks, StatZag, appreciate the research. During those years, did the ZAGS have 4+ guards with meaningful minutes (10+ minutes per game)??

    I hate it when memory doesn't serve.................

    Go ZAGS

    2017 - 4 guards and 4 bigs : https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb...zaga/2017.html

    2018 - 4 guards : CK/Norvell/Melson/Perk

    2019 - 4 Guards : Crandall Kispert Norvell Perk. (Kispert was absolutely a shooting guard not small forward his first couple years)

    2020 - 4 Guards

    2021 - 5 guards got at least 13 mins if you call CK still a "guard" or even consider him such for 1/2 his time.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    1,665

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by StatZag View Post
    2017 - 4 guards and 4 bigs : https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb...zaga/2017.html

    2018 - 4 guards : CK/Norvell/Melson/Perk

    2019 - 4 Guards : Crandall Kispert Norvell Perk. (Kispert was absolutely a shooting guard not small forward his first couple years)

    2020 - 4 Guards

    2021 - 5 guards got at least 13 mins if you call CK still a "guard" or even consider him such for 1/2 his time.
    Thanks again, StatZag. So, in 2017, 2019, and 2020, at least, the rotation was 8 guys with meaningful minutes. WOW, I just don't remember that...............

    So there is hope for a 8-man rotation. Me likey...........

    Go ZAGS

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Posts
    79

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TacomaZAG View Post
    Thanks again, StatZag. So, in 2017, 2019, and 2020, at least, the rotation was 8 guys with meaningful minutes. WOW, I just don't remember that...............

    So there is hope for a 8-man rotation. Me likey...........

    Go ZAGS
    Of course many of those rotations were shortened in "real" games and the conference and NCAA tourneys.

    18-19 (Rui and BC season) GU had 9 guys average at least 11 minutes a game - but that includes Tillie who only appeared in half of the games, and Crandall, who missed a few midseason as well.

    In the serious games later in the year, Petrusev saw no minutes at all and Crandall and Jones were down to 8-9 a game.

    I expect in "real" games especially in March, Few players the starters, then 10-15 for Watson, 10 for Hickman, 7-8 for Sallis.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    seattle, spokane
    Posts
    3,851

    Default

    stat zag
    you are absolutely not replaceable.
    i don't know what we would do without you ...
    suffer .....

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •