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Thread: Random thoughts on Culture. I know so very little.

  1. #1
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    Default Random thoughts on Culture. I know so very little.

    A lot of schools and team members talk about culture. We are a family and we love each other they say. I guess how to test that is during adversity and if the culture builds on itself over time. Culture is not to be taken lightly. I truly believe that culture is Gonzaga's biggest constant. If there was a top 20 for culture then the Zags would rank number every year. Even if the team falters a bit like in 2016 it was culture that prevailed. The post Morrison years were tough but again they prevailed. The team supported and bonded during Heytvelt debacle. Old Zags make a great emphasis of what zag culture was like.

    Having said that who and where did it come from. How much did Tommy Lloyd have to do with this? What is " zag material " when recruiting. What's the one constant.

    Can this continue and who will lead Gonzaga in creating culture? Is Travis Knight not being mentioned enough. A Guru of sorts maybe. Michaelson is not mentioned enough as well maybe.

    I am not alumni. Just a bandwagon fan from 99 onwards. Retired Air Force and I decided to stay here. I have analyzed and dug so deep in this run. This message board is read daily and a lot of characters have come and gone. I feel like I know a lot but in reality I know so little about what makes a group of people be successful year in and year out. Leadership, empathy, and honesty can make average people great.

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    Quote Originally Posted by YukonJack View Post
    A lot of schools and team members talk about culture. We are a family and we love each other they say. I guess how to test that is during adversity and if the culture builds on itself over time. Culture is not to be taken lightly. I truly believe that culture is Gonzaga's biggest constant. If there was a top 20 for culture then the Zags would rank number every year. Even if the team falters a bit like in 2016 it was culture that prevailed. The post Morrison years were tough but again they prevailed. The team supported and bonded during Heytvelt debacle. Old Zags make a great emphasis of what zag culture was like.

    Having said that who and where did it come from. How much did Tommy Lloyd have to do with this? What is " zag material " when recruiting. What's the one constant.

    Can this continue and who will lead Gonzaga in creating culture? Is Travis Knight not being mentioned enough. A Guru of sorts maybe. Michaelson is not mentioned enough as well maybe.

    I am not alumni. Just a bandwagon fan from 99 onwards. Retired Air Force and I decided to stay here. I have analyzed and dug so deep in this run. This message board is read daily and a lot of characters have come and gone. I feel like I know a lot but in reality I know so little about what makes a group of people be successful year in and year out. Leadership, empathy, and honesty can make average people great.
    Yukon, I suspect you know as much as anyone. Your steadfastness as a fan since '99 is a clear signal that you do get it. Call it the Era of Gonzaga. And the Zag zeitgeist, defined as the spirit of the age; the taste, outlook, and spirit characteristic of a period, is alive and well. The young men who come and go each year nurture it, and pass it on. The two constants are Few and the university. It would make sense to look at those two to determine the provenance of the ineffable spirit that is manifest each year.

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    Culture is a euphemism for winning.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by bartruff1 View Post
    Culture is a euphemism for winning.....
    We had family culture even before the current win cycle so I disagree

    It can help reinforce it and be a building block to even stronger culture but winning is not the first brick of culture
    Basketball...The Toy Department of Life

    Don't mess wth happy...Coach Few

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    Quote Originally Posted by bartruff1 View Post
    Culture is a euphemism for winning.....
    And I thought Al Davis was dead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzdelmar View Post
    And I thought Al Davis was dead.
    I had to admire Al...the only honest man in sports....or for that matter in business .....

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    Quote Originally Posted by bartruff1 View Post
    I had to admire Al...the only honest man in sports....or for that matter in business .....
    Brooklyn's own....

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    Well winning solves a lot of problems....as JFK said...." Victory has a thousand fathers and defeat is a orphan ".

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    Here's what I wrote about "family" (ie culture) back in '09. There were other things written about Ray G's comments and I'll try to find them.

    This past Monday at the Seattle kick-off luncheon, Ray Giacoletti was asked why the assistants have stayed at Gonzaga – Tommy, Leon, himself. He said that Gonzaga truly is a family – and then said that every school “talks” family and pays lip service to “family” – but the reality is, from his perspective in (25+ years with 9 different programs) only Duke and Gonzaga are true “families” – he said UNC comes close. And it’s true – Gonzaga is family. Anyone who saw the spaghetti dinners at the Few’s house (with the high doorways) on ESPN’s “The Season” could feel it – anyone who followed Ronny Turiaf’s heart surgery and recovery could feel it. Everyone who is a part of GU Basketball knows it, and feels it.
    http://guboards.spokesmanreview.com/...-pontification

    Edited to say it was the Pontiff (Angelo Roncalli) who contributed the following thoughts in the thread linked immediately above ...

    In the spirit of GZ's post...Coach Giacoletti expanded on the community aspect at Gonzaga when he spoke on Monday.

    He mentioned that there was a fusion of Fr. Spitzer's vision for GU and Mark Few's vision for GU basketball that has created the unique situation at GU.

    He also talked about the family atmosphere of the coaching staff and team. He said that every school's coaching staff will tell you that their program is a family. For the most part it's "BS" he observed. He said the only other situation he's seen like Gonzaga is Duke's. He mentioned a couple of major schools who represent themselves as "family," but said that under the surface they're pretty dysfunctional. Coach G said he's been part of 9 different college coaching staffs, and of them, GU is unique in its approach, its individuals and its continuity.

    ďTo be continued ÖĒ. Fr Tony Lehman, SJ
    óó-
    Some cherry picked stats

    Most NCAA TOURNAMENT wins since 2015
    Gonzaga 20, Nova 17, UNC 16, Duke 15, Kentucky 13, Michigan 13, Virginia 11, Baylor 9
    -----
    Most FINAL FOUR wins since 2017
    UNC 2, Nova 2, Virginia 2, Baylor 2, Gonzaga 2, Michigan 1, TexasTech 1, Kentucky 0, Duke 0, Kansas 0

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartruff1 View Post
    Well winning solves a lot of problems....as JFK said...." Victory has a thousand fathers and defeat is a orphan ".
    I believe it was Mussolini who first said that.

    Edit to add: It was his son in law.

    https://www.phrases.org.uk/bulletin_...sages/906.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by 23dpg View Post
    I believe it was Mussolini who first said that.

    Edit to add: It was his son in law.

    https://www.phrases.org.uk/bulletin_...sages/906.html
    Apparently the Best and the Brightest were not above filching a good line.

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    Nothing is less specific than the term "culture". The scope of the word is just too vast.

    Certainly folks can be proud of their own culture, but more often than not, it is routinely used as a means to categorize and divide. Depending on your world view, you can be respectful and appreciative of cultural diversity or you can use it as a measure to impose your own dogmatic cultural assimilation.

    Considering the amount of foreign talent from around the world that has played for GU, one could describe the GU basketball program as being culturally inclusive. In other words, it really isn't that hard to "fit" at Gonzaga (nor should it be) and this reality is quite the opposite of folks using the term "culture" as a measure to define player incompatibility. Unless ethics or morality are compromised as a reference, I have to believe that the term "culture" is not a valid way to define player inclusion at Gonzaga.
    I miss Mike Hart

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    Quote Originally Posted by MickMick View Post
    Nothing is less specific than the term "culture". The scope of the word is just too vast.

    Certainly folks can be proud of their own culture, but more often than not, it is routinely used as a means to categorize and divide. Depending on your world view, you can be respectful and appreciative of cultural diversity or you can use it as a measure to impose your own dogmatic cultural assimilation.

    Considering the amount of foreign talent from around the world that has played for GU, one could describe the GU basketball program as being very culturally inclusive. In other words, it really isn't that hard to "fit" at Gonzaga (nor should it be) and is quite the opposite of using the term "culture" as a measure of player compatibility. Unless ethics or morality are compromised, I have to believe that the term "culture" is not a valid way to define player inclusion at Gonzaga.
    In this case, culture has a relatively narrow definition.

    Itís seen most clearly when you see the long term affection for the University and the basketball program from former players. Nearly all of them bought into the concept of subjugating personal goals to achieve success for the family. They carry that with them after playing and all of them know their back is covered by a multitude of brothers whenever they need them.

    The first championship game provided proof of family ties when dozens of former players shared the success of that team. Nearly all of them showed in person or in spirit.

    Itís remarkable how these kids all buy in to the team aspect both on and off the court. Itís no accident. Few, to this point, has made very few errors recruiting talented kids to to the exclusion of character. Letís hope that continues. Itís a narrowly defined culture that doesnít exist in a lot of programs.

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    Not to take anything from the University but Mark Few's integrity and leadership is unsurpassed in sports and clearly comes into the equation.
    One of the greatest stories in basketball history...Gonzaga!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MickMick View Post
    Nothing is less specific than the term "culture". The scope of the word is just too vast.

    Certainly folks can be proud of their own culture, but more often than not, it is routinely used as a means to categorize and divide. Depending on your world view, you can be respectful and appreciative of cultural diversity or you can use it as a measure to impose your own dogmatic cultural assimilation.

    Considering the amount of foreign talent from around the world that has played for GU, one could describe the GU basketball program as being culturally inclusive. In other words, it really isn't that hard to "fit" at Gonzaga (nor should it be) and this reality is quite the opposite of folks using the term "culture" as a measure to define player incompatibility. Unless ethics or morality are compromised as a reference, I have to believe that the term "culture" is not a valid way to define player inclusion at Gonzaga.
    Mick I don't think the term is being used in a sociological sense. You seem to use it that way.
    A culture of winning and family type environment is what I've seen in this particular program. This "one for all and all for one" environment is somewhat outdated out in the world but it's sort of a throwback idea. Seems to work here at GU as the program thrives. How kids and administrators manage manage in this environment is one that insures success in this program. My opinion but I cannot explain this success in any other way.
    In my travels, I gave not seen another program like this one. Duke, UCLA, Creighton....none have this certain "thing". We've come to accept it. It's pretty rare though.

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    Just wanted to note that in what appears to be an otherwise respectful discussion with points of disagreement as to what constitutes "culture", and a related exchange about the culture of the university and that of Gonzaga mens' basketball, someone one-starred the thread.

    I really don't understand people sometimes. If someone posts something negative - about a player, the team, or anything - one-star away if that's your thing. But a polite exchange on a message board?

    Sorry to hijack the thread, as you were.
    Your children have been placed in the custody of...Carl's Jr.

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    You may not have much interest in the view of a lurker, but here is a comment on culture.

    Organizations in which I have worked have had culture, and quite distinct in some cases. It seems some define it as shared values and behaviors, or some such thing. I think some select individuals in the mix can have a lot of influence on the prevailing culture. Also, even positive and healthy cultures have had some quirks. But culture can be a great thing.

    I did not attend Gonzaga, but grew up in Spokane, and my view from a distance was that Gonzaga had a distinct culture (Catholic flavored, of course). I attended some other universities, and I donít think their cultures were in as strong, particularly the larger state schools. What Iíve seen following the GU basketball team for years tells me the program reflects what I think is the University culture, as well as the values the coaches have promoted. Attributes like team play and players engaging with the fans and their kids like they do are great to see in college players who get high-profile attention.

    Anyway, as an outside observer, Iím pleased that GU alum had such good experiences attending there, and am happy to see the pride in the Zags program. And itís been a fun team to watch and root for, partly because the culture there seems great.

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