View Poll Results: Which team wins the head to head?

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  • 2012-13 Team

    4 23.53%
  • 2019-20 Team

    13 76.47%
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Thread: 2012-13 Team vs. 2019-20 Team

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    Default 2012-13 Team vs. 2019-20 Team

    I was watching a GU game on Youtube from the 2012-13 season and couldn't help, but compare this year's version of the team with that legendary, Kelly Olynyk led squad that was the first to achieve a number 1 ranking in school history.

    In my mind these are two top 5 Zag teams of all time that are very evenly matched in a lot of ways.

    Starters:

    PG - Kevin Pangos vs. Ryan Woolridge. You have to give the edge to Pangos, but Woolridge has the defensive ability to make things difficult for him. Woolridge was a steady hand all season, but lacks the ability to catch fire and completely take over a game like Pangos had.

    SG - Gary Bell vs. Joel Ayayi. Bell is an all time great, but Ayayi simply has him beat in the talent department. Bell was a marksman, but Ayayi does more on the court with his all around game.

    SF - Mike Hart vs. Corey Kispert. The biggest positional discrepancy is at small forward. Hart's hustle and nose for the ball were special, but he was largely a non-threat on the offensive end. Corey brings so much more to the table as a scorer with his elite three point shooting and ability to create for himself/others.

    PF - Elias Harris vs. Killian Tillie. This one took some more thought and it's almost hard to believe that Tillie is the choice considering where Elias stands in the all-time records books. It's a tough comparison because Elias is a picture of consistency over his GU career, whereas Tillie was constantly plagued by injuries. If we're talking healthy Elias Harris vs. healthy Killian Tillie then I've got to go with Tillie. Elias was bouncy and hard nosed as heck, but the edge goes to Tillie in shooting, defense, passing, and basketball IQ IMO. This is a match-up that I would really like to watch.

    C - Kelly Olynyk vs. Filip Petrusev. The conference POY's collide and I believe Olynyk emerges as the decisive victor. Filip is a fabulous low post scorer, but Kelly had more tools at his disposal. I think Kelly is simply stronger and better at this stage in his development (no offense to Filip who had an amazing season).

    Bench:

    The 2012-13 team seemingly has the deeper team on paper, with familiar names filling out the roster such as; Sam Dower, David Stockton, Drew Barham, Kyle Dranginis, Przemek Karnowski, and Guy Landry Edi. However, in post season play the rotation was trimmed to basically just 7 with only Stockton and Dower playing meaningful minutes off the bench. The rest of the bench can't be discounted entirely though as they did provide valuable spot minutes at different points throughout the season.

    Bench - Sam Dower vs. Drew Timme. Dower showed his stuff the following season when thrust into a bigger role, but comparing his stats from this season with Timme's, it's hard to argue that Timme wasn't the more effective player. There were big games this year where Timme carried the team. Ultimately, I'd rather have him because of the toughness he brings.

    Bench - David Stockton vs. Admon Gilder. This one is a bit closer than most would think, as Stockton actually led the 2012-13 team in assists and steals in only 18 minutes a game. But while Stockton was very effective in his role, it's hard to imagine passing on an all Big 12 guard and fifth year senior when gearing up for tournament time. Gilder's strength, defensive versatility, and ability to get to the rim give him the edge.

    Bench - Karnowski/Barham/Dranginis/Edi vs. Arlauskas/Zakharov. Clearly the deep bench depth is in favor of the 2012-13 squad. Even if only relied on for spot minutes, there's a definite advantage gained here.

    Summary:

    Just running through the match-ups, I have to give the edge to the 2019-20 team. That Olynyk is the best player in this game and the strength of the Olynyk/Harris/Pangos trio is what gives me some pause. However, while those three would be hard to stop, 2019-20 has the guys to make things just difficult to gain the edge. In the end, the biggest deciding factor is the back court size, athleticism, and overall talent advantage.

    This was actually a difficult conclusion for me to reach as I hold that 2012-13 in such high regard. It's still very hard for me to believe that we're producing teams of this calibre on a regular basis now (knock on wood).

    Thoughts/disagreements?

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Default

    I think Watson should be listed for this years team...he probably played to many games to get the MedRS.

  3. #3
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    This is a tough choice bit thinking this current team is just too powerful offensively
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

  4. #4
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    Default

    Excellent post with vibrant and informative descriptions. I think the defense on the '12-'13 team would have held them back. Other than Bell, that lineup lacks defenders. (though the '19-'20 team wasn't elite defensively either)

    I bet the '19-'20 team wins 60% of the time.

  5. #5
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    Best parameter, does this year’s team beat those pro-laden Shockers?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzdelmar View Post
    Best parameter, does this year’s team beat those pro-laden Shockers?
    I think the 2020 team's 3pt defence might be better and then Bell got hurt so don't know how he would have made a difference...IMO Woolridge is by far a better defender than Pangos and a fantastic PG on the fast break, which is what the 2020 teams does better than any, again IMO...I think we beat WSU and advance to our second EE and 1st FF...

  7. #7
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    I take the 2020 team. Kenpom has us ranked 2nd and the 2013 team is ranked 5th. Two really good teams, and it would be a very, very close game. In the end the 2020 Zags win. I believe the 2020 team is just too deep, and it's one reason that it's been so good. When you have 6 players averaging in double figures and the 7th averaging 9.7, it's just too good. This team is so hard to prepare for because you just don't know who is going to "go off." It's like you can't prepare for them all, and eventually during the game the one guy you didn't prepare to stop is the one who emerges and score 20 points. I'm sure that the two teams we played in the Conference Tournament believed that Ayayi was the one player who couldn't hurt them, and so ends up the MVP of the tournament. I know some teams don't think Woolridge could hurt them and then he scores 17. AND to have two guys on the bench like Timme AND Gilder is just too much. Both of them could have been starters, and both scored in double figures often.

    I also want to say something about Tillie because the '13 team didn't have a player like him. Although not usually the main scorer, he was the glue guy with lots of experience and lots of talent. I believe he was the most talented player on the team, and yet, he sacrifices scoring on most nights in order to fit into the what Few wanted for that particular game. But when scoring was needed, he came through. But what I really want to say about him is that he is such a fantastic passer. Gonzaga has never had a power forward play the point like Killian did. I loved his passing. AND because he was such a fantastic outside shooter his defender had to go out and guard him, thus opening up lanes for our guards to penetrate.

    AND could our guards ever penetrate. The '13 team had really good guards too, but they could not attack the basket the way the '20 team could, and this also would be the difference in the game. And the '20 team could really run thanks to having a guy like Woolridge. It's one thing that I loved about the team this year, and the passing off of the break was really really good. I think the '20 team was a better passing team.

    I would never want to see any two Zag teams play each other because I love them all.

    Go Zags!!!
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

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