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Thread: GU PGs in JR year: Analytics thread

  1. #1
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    Default GU PGs in JR year: Analytics thread

    Going off the Bigs thread... I decided to look at PGs in their junior year. I will take a look at PGs in their senior years (inclusive of grad transfers) sometime after the tourney.

    Quick note... While all are during the run... I couldn't include Santangelo as the per 40 data just isn't there.

    But here it goes:

    FG FGA FG% 2P 2PA 2P% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
    5.1 11.9 0.43 2.4 5.4 0.452 2.7 6.6 0.412 3.8 4.3 0.873 3.8 4.1 1.2 0 1.9 2.3 16.8
    4 10.4 0.388 1.7 3.9 0.439 2.3 6.5 0.358 3.3 3.6 0.912 2.8 3.5 1.9 0.1 1.8 2.8 13.7
    5.1 11.7 0.439 2.4 4.7 0.507 2.7 6.9 0.393 2 2.7 0.753 3.8 6.4 1.4 0.1 2.5 3.1 15
    6.6 13.5 0.485 3.1 6.2 0.492 3.5 7.3 0.48 5.7 6.6 0.866 3.9 7.4 1 0.1 4.4 2.6 22.4
    6 13.9 0.431 2.6 5.6 0.472 3.3 8.3 0.403 4.9 5.9 0.833 4.2 6.8 1.8 0.1 3.8 2.3 20.2
    2.9 7.2 0.407 2 4 0.5 0.9 3.2 0.288 1 1.9 0.548 3.7 7.3 3.2 0.1 2.6 2.9 7.8
    5.8 11.8 0.491 3.7 7 0.537 2 4.8 0.423 3.6 4.8 0.744 5.2 4.3 1.9 0.2 2.2 2 17.2


    Who is who, and who do you want as your PG in their junior year.

    ** Matt Bouldin did a bit of double duty at PG/SG so he is in this list.
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

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    Curious on the second to last one. I’d guess Meech, but Meech didn’t distribute the ball well. Maybe Stockton?

    I’d say Pangos is 4 and Bouldin is 5. Pargo is 6.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZagsObserver View Post
    Curious on the second to last one. I’d guess Meech, but Meech didn’t distribute the ball well. Maybe Stockton?

    I’d say Pangos is 4 and Bouldin is 5. Pargo is 6.
    48% from 3, I don’t think so.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzdelmar View Post
    48% from 3, I don’t think so.
    You don’t think Pangos shot at a 48 percent clip? Maybe not - but when he was “on,” he was “on.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZagsObserver View Post
    You don’t think Pangos shot at a 48 percent clip? Maybe not - but when he was “on,” he was “on.”
    And conversely......Number D can only be DDD. My Rushmore guard, sorry Nigel. Other three are Ammo, KO and you know who.

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    I'll take Dickau for my team. High TOs, but he had the ball a lot.

    My guesses:

    A:Pangos
    B:Raivio (freethrow %)
    C:Perkins
    D: DD
    E:
    F:Goodson (or someone lightning fast who lacked shooting ability)
    G: Bouldin (or someone who took a lot of 2pt shots)

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    Quote Originally Posted by LTownZag View Post
    I'll take Dickau for my team. High TOs, but he had the ball a lot.

    My guesses:

    A:Pangos
    B:Raivio (freethrow %)
    C:Perkins
    D: DD
    E:
    F:Goodson (or someone lightning fast who lacked shooting ability)
    G: Bouldin (or someone who took a lot of 2pt shots)
    Blake gotta be E

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    Quote Originally Posted by LTownZag View Post
    I'll take Dickau for my team. High TOs, but he had the ball a lot.

    My guesses:

    A:Pangos
    B:Raivio (freethrow %)
    C:Perkins
    D: DD
    E:
    F:Goodson (or someone lightning fast who lacked shooting ability)
    G: Bouldin (or someone who took a lot of 2pt shots)
    F has got to be stockton. Meech’s assist totals were not good - also, wasn’t Stockton responsible for an inordinate number of steals?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZagsObserver View Post
    Curious on the second to last one. I’d guess Meech, but Meech didn’t distribute the ball well. Maybe Stockton?

    I’d say Pangos is 4 and Bouldin is 5. Pargo is 6.
    For the record... I treated and will continue to treat Pargo as a SG as that is what he played a majority of his career.

    Meech isn't on the list.
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZagsObserver View Post
    F has got to be stockton. Meech’s assist totals were not good - also, wasn’t Stockton responsible for an inordinate number of steals?
    LOL... DRav's FT% was a dead giveaway. Damn that kid could hit his FTs
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

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    I'll post the list tomorrow.
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

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    Quote Originally Posted by LongIslandZagFan View Post
    LOL... DRav's FT% was a dead giveaway. Damn that kid could hit his FTs
    As was DD’s unparalleled 3 pt shooting percentage.

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    Why guess who's who? Listing the names would clarify things and save time. No reason for the guesswork. Their careers are long since gone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MDABE80 View Post
    Why guess who's who? Listing the names would clarify things and save time. No reason for the guesswork. Their careers are long since gone.
    To let people have some fun with and guess. JMHO... some have biases for and against some players... this takes that out initially.

    Going back to the one about the bigs... Corey V's numbers per 40 surprised me.
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

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    "To let people have some fun with and guess. JMHO... some have biases for and against some players... this takes that out initially."

    Just so.

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    A couple of you had this nailed:

    A - Pangos
    B - Raivio
    C - Perkins
    D - Dickau
    E - Stepp
    F - Stockton
    G - Bouldin
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

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    Quote Originally Posted by LongIslandZagFan View Post
    A couple of you had this nailed:

    A - Pangos
    B - Raivio
    C - Perkins
    D - Dickau
    E - Stepp
    F - Stockton
    G - Bouldin
    Here's my question. What did these numbers tell you about the players. Did they change anybody's mind about the value of said players? How would you rank the players before seeing the spreadsheet and after?

    The divide in opinion of how to quantify these numbers is real. There are some, especially in the professional ranks of the major sports, that give these numbers a heavy weight. There are some, like me, that think they can tell you who the better player is and what their value is to the team by watching them play.

    It's a fascinating discussion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Markburn1 View Post
    Here's my question. What did these numbers tell you about the players. Did they change anybody's mind about the value of said players? How would you rank the players before seeing the spreadsheet and after?

    The divide in opinion of how to quantify these numbers is real. There are some, especially in the professional ranks of the major sports, that give these numbers a heavy weight. There are some, like me, that think they can tell you who the better player is and what their value is to the team by watching them play.

    It's a fascinating discussion.

    For me, I was surprised Stockton's numbers were so low. I was also surprised to see how in some ways Bouldin's numbers were better than Pangos... In my head I would have put Pangos far ahead of Bouldin... but the numbers are quite comparable.

    DDD... well... he was just amazing.
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

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    Nigel was a junior the Final Four year, right? Would be interesting to see his numbers.

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    Dickau. Dickau all day.
    Love the zags for life

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    Quote Originally Posted by LongIslandZagFan View Post
    For me, I was surprised Stockton's numbers were so low. I was also surprised to see how in some ways Bouldin's numbers were better than Pangos... In my head I would have put Pangos far ahead of Bouldin... but the numbers are quite comparable.

    DDD... well... he was just amazing.
    Bouldin was always an enigma for me. He was perpetually on the verge of being a great player but seemed to settle for very good. His very good was hard to discount, but I always expected another jump that never materialized.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pallet View Post
    Nigel was a junior the Final Four year, right? Would be interesting to see his numbers.
    Going into a meeting, then a phone conference... I'll do that after I am out of those.
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

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    Sorry... last meeting ran way longer than expected.

    Here are NWG's numbers:

    FG FGA FG% 2P 2PA 2P% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
    7.1 14.5 0.486 5.7 10.8 0.527 1.4 3.8 0.368 5 5.8 0.867 7.3 5.7 2.1 0.1 2.6 1.9 20
    "And Morrison? He did what All-Americans do. He shot daggers in the daylight and stole a win." - Steve Kelley (Seattle Times)

    "Gonzaga is a special place, with special people!" - Dan Dickau #21

    Foo me once shame on you, Foo me twice shame on me.

    2012 Foostrodamus - Foothsayer of Death

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    Werkin' too hard LIZ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by LongIslandZagFan View Post
    Sorry... last meeting ran way longer than expected.

    Here are NWG's numbers:

    FG FGA FG% 2P 2PA 2P% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
    7.1 14.5 0.486 5.7 10.8 0.527 1.4 3.8 0.368 5 5.8 0.867 7.3 5.7 2.1 0.1 2.6 1.9 20
    Obviously stellar numbers. Kid was good.

    Nigel goes WAY past numbers. That guy is a leader with a will to win unparalleled in GU history. He may have been the smartest player on the court for the Zags that I've seen. His maturity off the court was impressive as heck. That's a young man that won't need basketball to define him. I'd love to have a sit down with him and pick his brain. We were blessed to have him for the short time he was a Zag.

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