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Thread: Is Kispert the team's best player?

  1. #26
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    We have seven really good players this year but no absolutely great player (although Petro is on the top 10 list from KenPom). But we have six players who are really good two-way players.

    Defensively:
    Petro: 3.6 blk%, 23.4 DR%, 1.5 Stl%
    Timme: 4.8 blk%, 17.8 DR%, 1.7 Stl%
    Tillie: 3.9 blk%, 16.3 DR%, 2.4 Stl%
    Wooly: 0.6 blk%, 12.1 DR%, 2.4 Stl% (#5 in the nation on avoiding fouls)
    Ayayi: 0.8 blk%, 17.6 DR%, 2.5 Stl%
    Gilder: 0.9 blk%, 10.0 DR%, 2.7 Stl%

    Then:
    Kispert: 1.2 blk%, 9.5 DR%, 1.6 Stl%
    He gets steals like Petro, blocks like Gilder and is the worst defensive rebounder in the rotation (despite playing significant minutes at the 4).

    So if we ignore one entire side of the ball, he MIGHT be the best Zag this year. Because offensively he is super efficient, takes care of the ball, isn't a total ball hog, gets to the right places, has a great mix of spot up shooting with strength plays going toward the hoop. But compare him to Adam Morrison (1.0 blk%, 11.9 DR%, 1.7 Stl%) and if you aren't matching Morrison's output on defense you need to be a LOT better than guys on the offensive side. And I think those other guys are all pretty good offensively too.

    And I should say that even though he is our worst defender in this rotation, I don't think he is a "bad" defender at all. The other six are all just really solid this year (not Brandon Clarke guys, but all are pretty decent).

    My ranks, one for offense and one for defense:

    Offense:
    1. Kispert
    2. Tillie
    3. Petrusev
    4. Timme
    4. Ayayi
    4. Woolridge
    4. Gilder

    Defense:
    1. Tillie
    2. Timme
    3. Woolridge (maybe not the best stats, but he shuts guys down)
    4. Ayayi
    5. Petrusev
    6. Gilder
    Big Gap
    7. Kispert

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgadfly View Post
    We have seven really good players this year but no absolutely great player (although Petro is on the top 10 list from KenPom). But we have six players who are really good two-way players.

    Defensively:
    Petro: 3.6 blk%, 23.4 DR%, 1.5 Stl%
    Timme: 4.8 blk%, 17.8 DR%, 1.7 Stl%
    Tillie: 3.9 blk%, 16.3 DR%, 2.4 Stl%
    Wooly: 0.6 blk%, 12.1 DR%, 2.4 Stl% (#5 in the nation on avoiding fouls)
    Ayayi: 0.8 blk%, 17.6 DR%, 2.5 Stl%
    Gilder: 0.9 blk%, 10.0 DR%, 2.7 Stl%

    Then:
    Kispert: 1.2 blk%, 9.5 DR%, 1.6 Stl%
    He gets steals like Petro, blocks like Gilder and is the worst defensive rebounder in the rotation (despite playing significant minutes at the 4).

    So if we ignore one entire side of the ball, he MIGHT be the best Zag this year. Because offensively he is super efficient, takes care of the ball, isn't a total ball hog, gets to the right places, has a great mix of spot up shooting with strength plays going toward the hoop. But compare him to Adam Morrison (1.0 blk%, 11.9 DR%, 1.7 Stl%) and if you aren't matching Morrison's output on defense you need to be a LOT better than guys on the offensive side. And I think those other guys are all pretty good offensively too.

    And I should say that even though he is our worst defender in this rotation, I don't think he is a "bad" defender at all. The other six are all just really solid this year (not Brandon Clarke guys, but all are pretty decent).

    My ranks, one for offense and one for defense:

    Offense:
    1. Kispert
    2. Tillie
    3. Petrusev
    4. Timme
    4. Ayayi
    4. Woolridge
    4. Gilder

    Defense:
    1. Tillie
    2. Timme
    3. Woolridge (maybe not the best stats, but he shuts guys down)
    4. Ayayi
    5. Petrusev
    6. Gilder
    Big Gap
    7. Kispert
    I like your post, mgadfly, I agree with a lot, including the general point that even a balanced team still has better and worse players, more and less vital players. But a couple Qs:

    Do you really think Kispert is a worse defender than Petrusev?
    (as an aside, I realized that the NBC Sports College Basketball Podcast with Rob Dauster and Bobby Reagan was bloviating nonsense when on a team with Brandon Clarke, Tillie, Rui, and Perkins, those two hosts and college Bball voters described Kispert as Gonzaga's best defender in '18-'19)

    How the heck is Timme (and even Tillie) a better defender than Woolridge? Didn't Few call Woolridge the best defensive PG he's ever coached? (I might be flubbing the quote)

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by LTownZag View Post
    I like your post, mgadfly, I agree with a lot, including the general point that even a balanced team still has better and worse players, more and less vital players. But a couple Qs:

    Do you really think Kispert is a worse defender than Petrusev?
    (as an aside, I realized that the NBC Sports College Basketball Podcast with Rob Dauster and Bobby Reagan was bloviating nonsense when on a team with Brandon Clarke, Tillie, Rui, and Perkins, those two hosts and college Bball voters described Kispert as Gonzaga's best defender in '18-'19)

    How the heck is Timme (and even Tillie) a better defender than Woolridge? Didn't Few call Woolridge the best defensive PG he's ever coached? (I might be flubbing the quote)
    I have no problem with putting Woolridge in front of Timme. In fact, his ability to defend and shut guys down without fouling probably means he really should be ahead of him.

    But ... Timme's advanced numbers are really impressive. He has something Wooly doesn't, which is the ability to guard inside and out (though I've been impressed with how tough Woolridge has been when giving up 60 lbs and 6 inches after a switch). Timme's only limitation this season, as far as defensive numbers go (and probably offensive number for that matter) is minutes played (at just over 52% minutes played). When looking at the percentage numbers rather than the raw numbers, he is our best shot blocker, gets steals, rebounds, is able to switch and hold his own with almost anyone. He fouls too much though. So I'll just agree with you and say my first list was nonsense and Wooly should be #2. But Timme is a good defender.

    Ayayi also has a complaint. His numbers are really good. Statistically, he looks better than W on paper, but I just think Woolridge locks guys down even if it doesn't result in a steal.

  4. #29
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    And on Petrusev, I like his defense. He blocks a good amount of shots, he is strong in the post and holds his ground. He is nimble enough to play the pick and roll. And importantly, for defense, is ending the possession by securing an actual rebound, and Kispert is apparently allergic to defensive rebounds. So I'd take Petro 99 times out of 100 over Kispert on defense.

    And I'd have to see why they were calling Kispert our best defender in 18-19, he was, at best, our 9th best defender. Unless they just mean fundamentals or something, because I think he works hard to be in the right position, he just doesn't have that next level ability like Jonathan Williams or Rui did on that team. Though Rui would be an interesting comparison, would you rather have a guy that forgets he's playing defense but has the length and athleticism to make up for it more often than not, or someone who is in the right spot but gets beat because of a slight lack of length or athleticism? To me, I'd take Rui on that team even on defense. He'd be really frustrating to coach because if he had the defensive awareness of Kispert he'd be a ++ defender, but even without that awareness he makes an impact with his rebounding, blocks and steals due to his quickness etc...

  5. #30
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    I can honestly say that I have switched/swapped "best player" around multiple times this season and it isn't just between 2 or 3 guys.

    This team is the perfect example of the sum being greater than the individual parts. I would take the two best players off of any Zag team of the past decade over anyone on this squad. Having said that, I don't think there has been a more complete and complementary lineup in the past decade either. In other words, I probably wouldn't take the 6th and 7th best players off of those same teams over anyone this year either (except Mike Hart ). They just play really, really well together. This might be the best one through seven rotational lineup in team history. Just think what this team would be like with a Brandon Clarke, Rui Hachimura, or Kelley Olynyk on it.
    Last edited by MickMick; 02-14-2020 at 06:50 PM.
    I miss Mike Hart

  6. #31
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    This team has 6 1b players and one 1a player who is Tillie! He does everything at a high level and some things exceptionally high level. Granted he seems to find himself always trying to get into game shape because of injury.
    The funny thing is that I think Wooly is the most valuable piece of this team. Tillie the best and Wooly the most valuable, not sure if that makes total sense but that is how it looks to me

  7. #32

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    defensive analytics in bball is an imperfect science...can't quantify missing assignments, wrong rotations, not blocking out, not closing out, going with the roll man when you should have switched, not hedging properly, etc. etc.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by FloridaZagFan View Post
    This team has 6 1b players and one 1a player who is Tillie! He does everything at a high level and some things exceptionally high level. Granted he seems to find himself always trying to get into game shape because of injury.
    The funny thing is that I think Wooly is the most valuable piece of this team. Tillie the best and Wooly the most valuable, not sure if that makes total sense but that is how it looks to me
    Makes sense to me. The most valuable might simply be the more irreplaceable.

  9. #34
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    In regards to who has the best individual talent, I think great points have been made by many here that there are a number that could qualify.
    However, I see Kispert as the epitome of what it means to be a Zag. I feel that he is the heart and soul of the team and has taken his leadership role seriously this year as one of the veteran players. He leads from the rear in an effort to help his teammates succeed, and is more about the win than individual accolades.
    He is one of those players, like so many before him, that set the example and the tone for those that are here now, and those that will follow, and will then be proud to call themselves "Zags".

  10. #35
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    WEll Said.

  11. #36
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    After another game struggling without Tillie can we put this one to bed? Tillie is by far our best player.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marconi View Post
    In regards to who has the best individual talent, I think great points have been made by many here that there are a number that could qualify.
    However, I see Kispert as the epitome of what it means to be a Zag. I feel that he is the heart and soul of the team and has taken his leadership role seriously this year as one of the veteran players. He leads from the rear in an effort to help his teammates succeed, and is more about the win than individual accolades.
    He is one of those players, like so many before him, that set the example and the tone for those that are here now, and those that will follow, and will then be proud to call themselves "Zags".
    Agreed! He delivered huge last night.

  13. #38
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    I also agree with Marconi.

  14. #39
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    Killian Tillie, not close, wooly one of the most important
    Qualified for 22 Straight Big Dances

    11 Straight Round of 32s

    10 Sweet Sixteens (5 Straight)

    4 Elite Eights

    2017 FINAL FOUR

    2 Winningest Players in college basketball history (Karnowski 137, Perkins 134)

    The Best Point Guard to ever play the game: John Stockton, most assists, most steals.

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zagricultural View Post
    After another game struggling without Tillie can we put this one to bed? Tillie is by far our best player.
    So the team actually beat Pepperdine in Pepperdine by 12 points without Tillie.....basically with a 6 man rotation.

    But with Tillie at home they only beat them by 5...(Tillie played 32 minutes)

    The difference between the value of each player is not as much as some on this board make out.

    Either way Pepperdine is not as good a matchup for the Zags as other WCC teams are.

  16. #41
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    So, to date this season;

    6 different players have top scored in a game
    5 different players have led the team in rebounds in a game
    7 different players have led the team in assists in a game.

    7 players average more than 10 ppg.

    That is the definition of a balanced team

  17. #42
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    Thanks OZZY, that is a super set of stats. This is one of the most balanced teams I think I have seen at GU and maybe for any team that was ranked high in Div 1.

  18. #43
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    A healthy Tillie is the team's best player. He brings it on both ends of the floor. Highly versatile defender. Can score from deep and around the hoop. Athletic on the break and around the basket. High b-ball IQ.

    Kispert is still too streaky for me. He's a mediocre wing defender. He is incredibly slow on the fast break. Gets too many shots blocked, even though he has really good hops around the rim in the halfcourt. Collects charges on offense as he isn't nimble in the lane. Wish he was a more vocal leader, but having guys who are quiet leaders is important. I love his ability to make clutch shots in clutch situations and to nail free throws when it counts. Plays hard. Good Zag.

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