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Thread: Zags vs Michigan Post game thoughts

  1. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzdelmar View Post
    15th-18th is where they should sit.
    Jazz I think Michigan shold be ranked higher than that.

  2. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zags11 View Post
    Few called them soft. Lol. Go cry elsewhere vandal. If Few was only half as tough as he sounded zaga would never lose. Lmaoooo.

    Few said they were soft and lacked toughness. Plus im sure im tougher then 5'6 Few since you brought me into it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zags11 View Post
    at nasuesm
    Please just stop posting. It hurts to read.

  3. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Birddog View Post
    For those of you questioning the number of Kisperts shots taken, I ask, when was he open? He was guarded like a shadow all night. BTW, LIZF asked, I believe he logged 42 mins vs Oregon, he might have been a little worn down/ To describe Teske as lumbering is not accurate IMO. He was very agile for a guy his size and deadly accurate too. IIRC, he averages 5 blocks a game. Zags were beaten by a better, less weary, more healthy team.
    This one. Birdmeister has it!

  4. #129
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    Petrusev is a good player, a good learner, and it was good for him and the whole team to be played close again, play from behind, and get the experience of playing close games. Our wins except Oregon have not been very close, and under pressure our free throw shooting fell down, signs of pressure.
    Petrusev for the first time this year did not look at the ref everytime he thought he got fouled or got beat by another big. He is getting experience playing with other bigs as good as him, and taught him the moves that often work against lesser bigs, do not work as well against bigs like OR and Michigan have.
    I also think it is terrific that Cory drove more today, but he has to stop trying to finish the way he would successfully finish against weaker teams. He got close then swatted down, you could anticipate it as he approached the paint. You see Michigan players shooting high or wide shots, to avoid the shot blocks they knew could come from Petro and Killian.
    Michigan had as much reason to be tired as us, the problem was we are injured, and not use to playing close games. I hope we win 2 of 3 big game coming up, but fear we will win only one of them. How long before Watson can come back, I wonder?

  5. #130
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    First of all, I like the Zags as much as anyone on this forum, and over the years I'd say I've been more positive about the Zags than most fans have been. I have been accused of being a "kool-aid" drinker more than most people who write here. I have never believed that I am a "kool-aid" drinker. Proof of that is that when I see things that just don't look right, and don't resemble Gonzaga basketball, I do have a tendency to speak my mind. I've done that a lot over the years. Most GU fans who have been on this basketball forum for a long time, like I have been, know that about me. I have at times criticized players and Few maybe too much. So please, don't infer that I am a "kool-Aid" drinker.

    AND when I might come down too hard on a player please don't infer that I hate that player. Hate is a pretty strong word, and to use it in a reference to a Gonzaga fan who loves the Zagsl makes me wonder what that person who posted that blog about me sees when he looks in the mirror. Please, whoever you are, don't put your crap on me.

    I think that Woolridge is not a good point guard at all. Yes, he's a warrior. Yes, he's tough, and he is not playing at 100% ability because of a nagging injury. BUT! This is basketball, not football. AND a point-guard needs to run an offense. That's his job. Most all of the point-guards who have played for Gonzaga since I've been watching them, could score. Some of them have been really good scorers, and as far as I know, accept for Meech, they could all shoot pretty darn well. I guess I have kind of gotten used to seeing that in Gonzaga point-guards. Even a fantastic guard like Perkins, who really knew how to quarterback a team, was an excellent outside shooter. If I believe that Woodridge is the worst Point guard I've seen at GU it is just my opinion. Some fans really liked Meech too because they loved his speed. Yet, at some point Few realized that this is basketball and not track or football. Meech was tough too, and eventually left Gonzaga to go and play college football, and he did quite well.

    Gonzaga has also had some pretty darn good 2's who also guards and at times are called combo-guards. I can't think of a 2 guard who could not shoot and score. They are often one of the best scorers on the team. And most of them can also run an offense, which is why they're called combo-guards,as they at times take on the duties of a point guard. For what ever reason, Gilder, to me, is not like any combo guard, or just a 2 guard, that I have seen at Gonzaga. I've watched Gonzaga play for a lot of years, and have seen some great teams. We all have. AND we've seen some great shooting guards. So far I have not seen that out of the two players I've just mentioned.

    I have criticized them both for the way they continuously dribble into heavy traffic and put up shots from 5-6 feet and in. Most fans would think that a pretty significant number of these close in shots would go in; so when that fan keeps seeing them miss he begins to wonder how good that player really is. Gilder loves to dribble into the middle of the key and shoot a runner. AND 90% if the time he misses. Now I have seen some guards at GU who could really shoot a runner, and it's a beautiful shot for sure. Maybe it's Gilder's injury, but his runner is really not like a runner at all. I am sure his injury keeps him from leaping with beautiful athleticism.

    If you know me you know I love to see guards who can shoot from the outside. I've seen so many outstanding shooters at Gonzaga that I have come to recognize what a good shot looks like. And I have been fortunate (because I was a high school coach) to attend a number of seminars put on by coaches and players from Gonzaga. They illustrated what a good shot looks like very clearly. When I see Woolridge and Gilder shoot, I do not recognize either of their shots as what I'd call a shot with good form and good mechanics. AND because the mechanics are not good, their outside shooting is not that good, and even worse, their foul shooting is really bad too. Imo, it's not a matter of the ball not bouncing someone's way. It's a matter of mechanics. Every shooter would like every shot to go in, and when they don't, of course we wish the ball could take a good bounce our way more often. But the truth is when someone is missing at the rate these two guards are it's not a matter of the ball taking good bounces, Sorry!

    Now because I point these things out, or have opinions about these two players that are negative, does that make me a Zag Hater, or a hater of any player? If I were too ignor these facts, in my opinion, that would make me a person who drinks the Kool-aid because to ignor these things is to ignor facts.

    Fortunately, the season is young, and change can occur. I hope in terms of what I am seeing, change will occur. I am not in the know of how injured these two players are, but if they are unable to learn to play the Zag way because of injuries, that I think we're in for a long season. I don't think Few has a lot of options at the guard position. And Im sure Few is not very happy about the guard play. And has been pointed out, Ayayi is getting plenty of playing time, and for the most part he really helps the team ALOT.

    I also agree with everyone, that the Zags most likely were really worn out. Some more than others. Some are injured. But I'm also aware that Mark Few was not happy with the effort or toughness of the team today. And this is not the first time that he has said that about a Gonzaga team in the past. At times he has had to express that idea to get their attention, and I'm sure he and his staff will be addressing that in the practices this next week. From what I have seen in the past, our coaches know how to get a team to play tougher. I'm not sure how they do that. But I do believe that this team will get tougher. It may take awhile, but eventually they will.

    I will never stop believing in the greatness of Gonzaga basketball. And I will never stop believing in Mark Few and his coaches. Today was a setback, but they will recover.

    Go Zags!!!
    Last edited by Reborn; 11-29-2019 at 07:01 PM.
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

  6. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by kitzbuel View Post
    After what UM did to UNC, I have a hard time seeing this as being embarrassed. They are a top 10 team, we had an OT late game and got hit with the injury bug.

    We have a ton of room room for improvement, especially by our young bigs. But I don't see this as an embarrassment.

    I think we beat UNC and I didn't have that confidence going into this tournament.

    Sent from my XT1710-02 using Tapatalk
    Agreed. This was one regular season game, against a very good opponent, with Gonzaga having a lot of guys banged up. Right now Michigan is absolutely the superior team, but there's a lot of things Gonzaga can learn from this game and I expect that they will. Definitely not nearly as bad of a loss as some people are suggesting. I hope GU has the chance to play Michigan again this year.

  7. #132
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    Always enjoy your insightful posts, Reborn. And I know you are a true blue, Zag lover, through and through. Keep up the great posts.

  8. #133
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    Woolridge is the best press breaker I've ever seen at GU. He's clearly not a typical PG and more useful bringing the ball up the court and getting it to a primary distributor. I have to imagine that these were the roles that Few envisioned for Gilder and Woolridge, to break pressure.

    I'm withholding judgment on Gilder until he is healthy. He was a completely different player the first few games. I know what Woolridge brings, it's a specific skillset, but useful in a lot of big situations against quality opponents. I'd much rather have Ryan bring the ball up the floor than Josh Perkins, and I love Josh.

  9. #134
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    Few loves to go inside. Always has.

    Michigan was more than a match for the GU big men. Rarely is a Few coached team consistently beaten inside. Once that staple breaks down, everything else begins to crumble.

    I love that GU has slasher/penetrator guards. They just need to finish a little better.
    I miss Mike Hart

  10. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zags11 View Post
    Fine. Im not upset over the loss at all. I feel our bigs need to be tougher through contact. Could i word it better? 100%. So i will say this.

    Its a learning experience for a very young front court. Go zags.
    Glad you swallowed your original words.

  11. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by MickMick View Post
    Few loves to go inside. Always has.

    Michigan was more than a match for the GU big men. Rarely is a Few coached team consistently beaten inside. Once that staple breaks down, everything else begins to crumble.

    I love that GU has slasher/penetrator guards. They just need to finish a little better.
    We changed our offense a couple yrs ago to accommodate the elite bigs, lottery picks rolling through Gonzaga, and the overall athleticism we've had in recent yrs. Much more hi lo, dribble drive, etc.

    We dont have the same type of elite bigs right now, esp with Tillie at 50% or so. Petrusev is skilled yet once fatigue set in, it was all over.

    Also, our guards arent running the pick n roll game compared to previous years.

    Again, outside Tillie, no personel to execute it at a high lvl.

    Teams that match our overall size we will struggle with, UNC matches us, Zona matches, etc.

    Less athletic and brute in the post this yr as well.

    Today's game was the type to run our classic flex, and half court execution, one on one along perimeter and in post was pretty pointless, again, besides Tillie on occasion.

    We needed hot potatoe ball movement and numerous cutters.

    We ran 1 or 2 plays the entire game, and even less once Kispert couldn't get open.

    Our ball screen offense, and one on one hi low was guarded.

    No back up plan, nor can these guards make shots off iso plays or breakdowns.

  12. #137
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    Dang. Just took twenty minutes to read this entire thread. Pretty sure the Gonzaga basketball program is toast. They can't possibly recover from this loss.

    And, "Mom!!! He's looking at me."

    "He started it!!!"

    "No, I didn't. He said I was stupid."

    "I'm gonna hit him, mom."

    "I'll break your Ipad if you do."

    "He's looking at me again, mom!!!

    That about covers it, I think.

  13. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bogozags View Post
    Didn’t Villanova tear our butt up within the last two tears? We went on to reach the S16 but lost to FSU when Tillie got hurt...
    I was at MSG for that 'nova game-we lost 88-72. 16 point diff. Ugly game where they rained 3's and turned us over a lot.

    Today we got hammered by 18

    ZZ

  14. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alum08 View Post
    Woolridge is the best press breaker I've ever seen at GU. He's clearly not a typical PG and more useful bringing the ball up the court and getting it to a primary distributor. I have to imagine that these were the roles that Few envisioned for Gilder and Woolridge, to break pressure.

    I'm withholding judgment on Gilder until he is healthy. He was a completely different player the first few games. I know what Woolridge brings, it's a specific skillset, but useful in a lot of big situations against quality opponents. I'd much rather have Ryan bring the ball up the floor than Josh Perkins, and I love Josh.
    true. Very true. He's a great press breaker. But what happens once he dribbles all the way down to the end of the court, then dribbles under the basket going left to right, and then turns and goes right to left and throws up an off-balanced shot praying it will go in. Or what happens when he breaks the press and dribbles around a little trying to run something. What's he going to do? Why would anyone ever guard him on the outside. Afterall, he didn't make a single 3 in the last three games. So you can bet that eventually he'll dribble inside at the hoop and throw up a shot and pray it'll go in. There's a heck of a lot more to this game than breaking a press. I totally doubt that Few recruited him to break a press. How often has Gonzaga been pressed this year? One game? Gilder apparently was a pretty good outside shooter at A&M. Hard for me to believe because his mechanics are so bad. He shot 3-10 from the 3 point line and against Oregon he was 0-5 from beyond the arc.

    We could also talk defense because I heard they were really good defensive players. What happened today?
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

  15. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by MickMick View Post
    I love that GU has slasher/penetrator guards. They just need to finish a little better.
    "A LITTLE BETTER?" Or a lot better? Perkins would slash to the basket some, and like these guards he rarely was able to put the ball in the hoop. Gilder has the right idea of shooting a floater. But maybe due to his injury he is not getting enough lift off the floor and his shot comes up short. The floater is a great shot for those who could shoot it, like Nigel Williams Goss. Gonzaga, honestly, has not had a lot of guards who can attack the basket AND SCORE.
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

  16. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagdontzig View Post
    Please just stop posting. It hurts to read.
    Good one. I wanna say a rude comment but i will be mature. I dont like reading peoples replies but we all are different. I feel like people think you have to be 100% positive.

    Except Few said "team was soft, team wasnt tough" so he would agree with people who thought that way more then opposite.

    Lastly people think they are so much better or their opinion is higher then others. Lol
    Love the zags for life

  17. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by johno View Post
    Glad you swallowed your original words.
    I said what few said. He agreed more with my comments then others. So talk to him about it then.
    Love the zags for life

  18. #143
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    Obviously a tough game losing by 18. We really looked gassed the whole game and missed a lot shots. I would say this is a good lesson for Timme and Petrosev (playing against physical bigs) . We don’t have a lot of great outside shooters who can consistently hit the three and free throws are also an issue. They will need to learn how to play really good defense to offset their weaknesses. If we can beat 2 of the next three teams (AZ, UW, and UNC) we will be ok.

  19. #144
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    This zag team is still going to win 27 plus games and imo make sw16. This poor game doesnt change that.
    Love the zags for life

  20. #145
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    When this season started I figured this team would be abwork in progress. I think they've played well all things considered...today they lost to a pretty good team. The Zag's matg8n of error wasnt very big today....I saw a lot of contested shots...which does affect those bunnies. Having only a 7 man rotation...and some of those hobbling...and a long big..and nice executing team doesnt help. Watch the film....rest up...go back to work...keep working hard. GO ZAGS.

  21. #146
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    Greetings from the east coast (South Carolina this morning, not NYC). The sun rose and I promise it will in the PST as well.

    Jim77 said it better than I could. We lost to a good team and at well less than 100% on our side due to injuries. I didn't enjoy watching it (none of us did) and purposefully stayed off the boards yesterday so as to not let it effect an otherwise nice holiday weekend.

    Other than last year's team and 2016-7, no GU team IMHO has had a realistic chance at going undefeated. I feel this is an S16/E8 quality of team with tons of potential, but coach will need the season to mold it given the components he's to work with. Have faith.
    Your children have been placed in the custody of...Carl's Jr.

  22. #147
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    Relax guys, it could be worse. We could have lost to SFA or Evansville.

  23. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonstu View Post
    Relax guys, it could be worse. We could have lost to SFA or Evansville.
    Hey, Stu, how about Aztecs at 8-0 over Iowa in Vegas. Top 25.

  24. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzdelmar View Post
    Hey, Stu, how about Aztecs at 8-0 over Iowa in Vegas. Top 25.
    Absolutely top 25 worthy. Not an overly impressive resume but dare I say better resume than zags right now if not for the Oregon win. Wins over Iowa, creighton, BYU, GCU. SDSU fans get very cocky when their team is winning though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gueastcoast View Post
    Greetings from the east coast (South Carolina this morning, not NYC). The sun rose and I promise it will in the PST as well.

    Jim77 said it better than I could. We lost to a good team and at well less than 100% on our side due to injuries. I didn't enjoy watching it (none of us did) and purposefully stayed off the boards yesterday so as to not let it effect an otherwise nice holiday weekend.

    Other than last year's team and 2016-7, no GU team IMHO has had a realistic chance at going undefeated. I feel this is an S16/E8 quality of team with tons of potential, but coach will need the season to mold it given the components he's to work with. Have faith.
    Yes the sun rose here in Florida as well! This is a very good team that didn't do the little things to win a game against a very good team.
    I'm not a good enough analyst to see everything in full speed but rewatching the 21min YouTube highlights it was easy to see the defensive mistakes leading to open 3's and as coach few said they made us pay for every mistake.
    A decent ft% and Fg% 47% from 2's rather than 40% this game could go either way.
    The numbers don't lie, half of the defensive mistakes on the perimeter( let's say give up only 3 wide open 3's instead of 7) GU shooting the 2's in the mid to
    high 40's% (5-7% better). The game would have been completely different.
    This was just a bad game simple as that.
    Michigan's game plan worked perfectly. Don't let Kispert do what he does best, catch and shoot and let the big kid control the paint on defence.
    Even with Michigan limiting our perimeter opportunitys, if we ran a slightly tighter ship (little things) this was a game that could have gone either way. It obviously didn't happen but there were multiple ways we could have won that game.
    THIS IS A VERY GOOD BASKETBALL TEAM with a high ceiling. Had a bad game, it happens!

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