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Thread: How GU non-conference schedules are built

  1. #76
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    Explain how Gonzaga makes more money playing Arkansas Pine Bluffs than UNC? They have to pay Arkansas Pine Bluffs to come to the Kennel they don't have to pay UNC and the UNC game is on national television.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZagsGoZags View Post
    what does SMDH mean?
    speaking for a few other readers who also might not know, also
    Shaking My D@#M Head.

    It's an expression conveying disgust.

  3. #78
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    Oregon faced a similar off season like the Zags. Altman rebuilt his team with transfers, freshmen and bench players from last year. The only returnee of any significance was Pritchard.

    Their first three games were against Fresno State, Boise State and Memphis with Houston coming up. Memphis is the obvious standout but I think that game was scheduled before Penny showed up and started recruiting like Calipari. The point is, all of those teams were in the category of 80-110 at kenpom. They are all winnable games for the likes of Oregon or Gonzaga. And they all have a hint of danger. Altman knows loads more about his team than Few does at this point and the Zags are probably going to face them in the Bahamas.

    As for the revenue aspect, Gonzaga is going to sell out games in Spokane whether they play Fresno State or Texas-San Antonio. A return game in Fresno will likely sell out a 15,000 seat arena and be a road money maker.

    This year's schedule is what it is. Can't change it. I'm saying they can do better than that.

    One more thing and I'll shut up. Gonzaga forced the WCC to alter their schedule so the Zags wouldn't have to face conference bottom feeders twice. That was alledgedly to bolster schedule strength and avoid the Portland's of the world causing St.Mary's, Byu and the Zags to lose dance tickets and seeding. If those games are replaced by Arkansas Pine-Bluff and Detroit, what's the point?

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by gueastcoast View Post
    CDC I have a question -- and I have always been aware of the $ element -- how does that work exactly? Do some schools pay more than others? My biggest complaint (as noted earlier in the thread) is that I'd rather we dine on local cupcakes (fresher, as not shipped as far!) than no-name schools from hither and yon. I suspect the UTAs, et al pay us bigger $ than Eastern or other regional foes do/would. But how does it actually work? Is it a free market, or overseen/governed in some manner?
    UTA, Texas Southern, etc., are not the ones doing the paying. . .GU pays them. In Texas Southern's case, they play a slew of "pay for play" games as a revenue source to fund their MBB program.

    See this article for additional info on "guarantee games" ( which includes quotes from former GU Director of Basketball Ops, J. Krause )

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-dating-event/

    "Buy" Games impacted former GU head coach Dan Monson, as mentioned in this LAT story from 2015:

    https://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp...124-story.html
    Last edited by RenoZag; 11-16-2019 at 11:31 AM.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markburn1 View Post
    Oregon faced a similar off season like the Zags. Altman rebuilt his team with transfers, freshmen and bench players from last year. The only returnee of any significance was Pritchard.

    Their first three games were against Fresno State, Boise State and Memphis with Houston coming up. Memphis is the obvious standout but I think that game was scheduled before Penny showed up and started recruiting like Calipari. The point is, all of those teams were in the category of 80-110 at kenpom. They are all winnable games for the likes of Oregon or Gonzaga. And they all have a hint of danger. Altman knows loads more about his team than Few does at this point and the Zags are probably going to face them in the Bahamas.

    As for the revenue aspect, Gonzaga is going to sell out games in Spokane whether they play Fresno State or Texas-San Antonio. A return game in Fresno will likely sell out a 15,000 seat arena and be a road money maker.

    This year's schedule is what it is. Can't change it. I'm saying they can do better than that.

    One more thing and I'll shut up. Gonzaga forced the WCC to alter their schedule so the Zags wouldn't have to face conference bottom feeders twice. That was alledgedly to bolster schedule strength and avoid the Portland's of the world causing St.Mary's, Byu and the Zags to lose dance tickets and seeding. If those games are replaced by Arkansas Pine-Bluff and Detroit, what's the point?
    please don't shut up

    on the scheduling, Few navigates the out of conference scheduling conundrum GU faces with its WCC schedule pretty well seems to me over the years. Altman can get big wins later in the year in the Pac vs. Washington twice, Colorado twice, Arizona twice, then in the Pac12 tourney...GU gets SMC in the usual duel. So the risk of big losses early is greater for GU than for Oregon who can still recover their chips, my take on it. And on the development side, with a new backcourt and all that, the risk rises higher. Still makes total sense to me the way this season is scheduled because of this.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by RenoZag View Post
    UTA, Texas Southern, etc., are not the ones doing the paying. . .GU pays them. In Texas Southern's case, they play a slew of "pay for play" games as a revenue source to fund their MBB program.

    See this article for additional info on "guarantee games" ( which includes quotes from former GU Director of Basketball Ops, J. Krause )

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-dating-event/

    "Buy" Games impacted former GU head coach Dan Monson, as mentioned in this LAT story from 2015:

    https://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp...124-story.html
    Yes...I do recall that's why Texas Southern travels so extensively, for the cash...

    So how do WE benefit by playing a team like that vs. a comparably rated (200+) team of local interest? That is why I've never understood the approach.
    Your children have been placed in the custody of...Carl's Jr.

  7. #82
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    A lighter schedule makes sense this year. Confidence is important. Being able to slowly install new things without shaking the confidence of the team is more important this year than many in recent memory, it seems to me.

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    So with 8 cupcakes, based on the article's market rates, the Zags would have paid out between $400,000 to $800,000 for those games?

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    Quote Originally Posted by gueastcoast View Post
    Yes...I do recall that's why Texas Southern travels so extensively, for the cash...

    So how do WE benefit by playing a team like that vs. a comparably rated (200+) team of local interest? That is why I've never understood the approach.
    I am just guessing, but GU would receive ALL the money from concessions at games at McCarthy, plus the gate, while paying a fairly small amount to those teams.

    Most local schools, including Eastern, WSU and probably Montana et al, would want a home and home or home and home and arena, taking away the gate and concessions for one or two of those games.
    Hoping you have a sense of humor too!

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by CB4 View Post
    So with 8 cupcakes, based on the article's market rates, the Zags would have paid out between $400,000 to $800,000 for those games?
    6000 seats at an average of $100/seat is $600,000 per game, just for the tickets. Concessions add in more.

    Do the math, please.
    Hoping you have a sense of humor too!

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by willandi View Post
    6000 seats at an average of $100/seat is $600,000 per game, just for the tickets. Concessions add in more.

    Do the math, please.
    I did do the math on the cost. I made no mention of revenue. 2000 seats are student seats, so about 4000. Then the per seat revenue is hard to calculate due to gonzagas season ticket program/donation structure.

  12. #87
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    One other factor not mentioned is how strong the coach thinks his team is going to be. Last season, Few knew the squad had F4 potential and scheduled an even heavier slate than usual. This year with more question marks, perhaps he dialed it back a bit? Either way there are plenty of opportunities for signature wins here and the ability to grow as a team. Let's take a closer look....

    Starts out with a scrimmage vs #1 MSU followed by 3 low-level home games followed by a true P5 road game at TAMU followed by 2 more low-level home games then an appearance at the Battle for Atlantis (arguably the premier preseason tourney this year) then another cupcake followed by a brutal 3 game stretch vs UW (true road game), AZ (true road game) and NC finishing up with 2 low level teams at home during the holidays.

    Seems about perfect to me. Great pacing and mixing. Well done coach!

    ZZ

  13. #88
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    2 out of the last 3 years Texas Southern has been in the dance (and even won a game 2 years ago)-- they play for the cash --but they also get some great road experience in some challenging environments.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by CB4 View Post
    I did do the math on the cost. I made no mention of revenue. 2000 seats are student seats, so about 4000. Then the per seat revenue is hard to calculate due to gonzagas season ticket program/donation structure.
    OK, so about $400,000 per cupcake. A maximum of 2 of those pays for the 8 games, so over a $2.4M in added revenue with the current schedule. With no paying home and homes, the max is $1.6M, but with pay to play, more like $1M...and then concessions etc.
    Hoping you have a sense of humor too!

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagzilla View Post
    One other factor not mentioned is how strong the coach thinks his team is going to be. Last season, Few knew the squad had F4 potential and scheduled an even heavier slate than usual. This year with more question marks, perhaps he dialed it back a bit? Either way there are plenty of opportunities for signature wins here and the ability to grow as a team. Let's take a closer look....

    Starts out with a scrimmage vs #1 MSU followed by 3 low-level home games followed by a true P5 road game at TAMU followed by 2 more low-level home games then an appearance at the Battle for Atlantis (arguably the premier preseason tourney this year) then another cupcake followed by a brutal 3 game stretch vs UW (true road game), AZ (true road game) and NC finishing up with 2 low level teams at home during the holidays.

    Seems about perfect to me. Great pacing and mixing. Well done coach!

    ZZ
    I think the schedule is near perfect too. I like that it has two short stretches packed with highly competitive games: kinda like the tournament.

    Also, I think TSU's former coach is at Detroit Mercy now. His TSU squad was tough. I look forward to seeing how his new team looks.

  16. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by willandi View Post
    OK, so about $400,000 per cupcake. A maximum of 2 of those pays for the 8 games, so over a $2.4M in added revenue with the current schedule. With no paying home and homes, the max is $1.6M, but with pay to play, more like $1M...and then concessions etc.
    Good math... The only other big number we'd need to look at is what the per game revenue Gonzaga loses out of, if any, from national TV revenue for a big time national noncon matchup that they wouldn't earn if they opt instead for a buy game.

    As other posters mention there's a lot of factors, such as strategic scheduling based on historic tournament seeding analytics, but looking at it from the money side seems relevant too.

    There were a lot of question marks around this years team so the buy games make a lot of sense even tho I generally disagree with the approach. It seems like an easier decision to make if the money is way more significant for the school via buy games, as it seems to be. It'll be interesting to see what they do next year.

  17. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markburn1 View Post
    Shaking My D@#M Head.

    It's an expression conveying disgust.
    Thanks Markburn

  18. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by gueastcoast View Post
    Yes...I do recall that's why Texas Southern travels so extensively, for the cash...

    So how do WE benefit by playing a team like that vs. a comparably rated (200+) team of local interest? That is why I've never understood the approach.
    I don't think we benefit by playing the SWAC, Summit, C-USA, Horizon, and Sun Belt dreck either. . .my hunch is those kinds of teams give GU the maximum amount of control over the dates & difficulty.

  19. #94
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    Detroit Mercy ??? Really …why are they playing a hospital ???

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    Quote Originally Posted by bartruff1 View Post
    Detroit Mercy ??? Really …why are they playing a hospital ???
    lol
    Your children have been placed in the custody of...Carl's Jr.

  21. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartruff1 View Post
    Detroit Mercy ??? Really …why are they playing a hospital ???
    Yes we're paying them $100,000 in Medicare vouchers.

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