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Thread: 2019- Derryck Thornton Grad Transfer

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by thespywhozaggedme View Post
    Because heís not very good. His stats have been posted in this thread several times. Itís really that simple
    Check out Dan Dickauís sophomore season stats at UW.

    https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb...-dickau-1.html


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  2. #102
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    Spy, I asked you earlier to explain Thornton's stats and explain what you would want them to be for Thornton to be an acceptable player for GU.

    I showed an example of how 7 more made shots total over a year would have raised his FG% into the 40's, and suggested that stats don't tell the whole story for other reasons.

    I also showed how Duke incoming PG recruit Jeremy Roach had lackluster numbers in the U17 tournament but his team won the championship.

    Your response has to been to make an erroneous excuse for Roach, ignored an argument for how stats don't tell the whole story, and ignored a chance to clarify what you think would make Thornton a valuable player. Instead, you have just repeated how bad you think he is, and found other opinions to support your claims. This vendetta of yours is getting uncomfortable

  3. #103
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    I will say it again but we probably shouldn't hate on a player who will probably be in a Gonzaga uniform next year.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by caldwellzag View Post
    People that only look at statistics only see part of this story. Spy you should know that. There's a lot more that goes into a kid then stats run a program he used to be a part of, USC, that honestly wasn't very good. The kid was a former five-star recruit for a reason.
    Some kids never advance or develop past their AAU mix tape days. He is one of those kids.

    Watched 3 highlight videos from above and on YouTube from last season.

    Useless dribbling, over dribbles, shows wiggle with handles but not body, pointless crossovers going nowhere, horrible shot selection unless wide open because no one is actually defending him in the lane, avoids all physical contact if taken near the hoop, wastes time dribbling and one on one, flashy but not effective, occasionally makes the highlight reel, no look pass to better shooting guards. Spends so much time dribbling he rarely sees his post players fighting for position or even look at the post at all. Assist numbers inflated due to USC best players were off guards and wings taking the ball to hoop or making a shot after first and only pass.

    Here's the deal. IF we had a chance to really coach this kid up over a Red Shirt year I'd say yes, no question.

    He has ball skills and talent, yet his bad traits/habits are alarming. It's like trying to mold a And 1 player to organized basketball. He hasn't shown any development or change in his game, and in many ways regressed since he had premium coaching and talent around him at Duke.

    I feel his game, style, and inability to conform to strict sets and plays would lead to frustration by both parties.

    He is not the kind of established kid you risk as a grad transfer. Again, if a RS, then absolutely, let's develop him, otherwise let's spend time developing Brock instead, unless a legit talent becomes available.

    I rarely say pass, but this is one example.

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chicken Ball View Post
    Check out Dan Dickau’s sophomore season stats at UW.

    https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb...-dickau-1.html


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    5ppg, 2.6apg, 44% from the field, 36% from 3 in 22 mpg. And for apples to apples, here was Thornton's sophomore stats: 3.8ppg, 1.2apg, 36% from field, 32% from 3 in 14 mpg. Now let's compare their junior seasons:


    Dickau: 19ppg, 6.3apg, 49% from the field, 48% from 3 in 35mpg. Thornton: 7.7ppg, 4.3apg, 38% from the field, 29% from 3 in 28mpg.


    Thornton is not a high major player in any way, shape or form.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by caldwellzag View Post
    I will say it again but we probably shouldn't hate on a player who will probably be in a Gonzaga uniform next year.
    I love ya buddy, but you really gotta stop with the "hate" mantra, it's lazy and stifles debate. I don't want him on this team, I don't think I can make it any clearer. I have zero say in the matter obviously, but I will warn everyone that I can from the mountaintops. He's not good and fans of his two previous teams have openly said so.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by caldwellzag View Post
    People that only look at statistics only see part of this story. Spy you should know that. There's a lot more that goes into a kid then stats run a program he used to be a part of, USC, that honestly wasn't very good. The kid was a former five-star recruit for a reason.
    The reason is that he was overrated in the first place. There are tons of players routinely over ranked by scouts. I find it odd that we bend over backwards trying to justify his stats, instead of just seeing them for what they are.

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by caldwellzag View Post
    Contact has been made and the feeling is mutual interest. Still early though
    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPtheBeasta View Post
    Spy, I asked you earlier to explain Thornton's stats and explain what you would want them to be for Thornton to be an acceptable player for GU.

    I showed an example of how 7 more made shots total over a year would have raised his FG% into the 40's, and suggested that stats don't tell the whole story for other reasons.

    I also showed how Duke incoming PG recruit Jeremy Roach had lackluster numbers in the U17 tournament but his team won the championship.

    Your response has to been to make an erroneous excuse for Roach, ignored an argument for how stats don't tell the whole story, and ignored a chance to clarify what you think would make Thornton a valuable player. Instead, you have just repeated how bad you think he is, and found other opinions to support your claims. This vendetta of yours is getting uncomfortable
    What does Roach have to do with DT? We have 3 years of empirical evidence of what kind of player he is, you literally want to ignore that.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by caldwellzag View Post
    And there's more to this recruitment then just DT. There's a reason we got out of the Jenkins recruiting. DT is what we need for next year as we need a point guard to run the point and distribute the basketball both things he could do
    If DT is why we cooled on Jenkins that's a flippin joke.

  11. #111
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    Spy, for real, can you just stop? We all know your opinion on the matter. You’re just coming across as very egotistical at this point. I’m not hating on you rather giving you some constructive criticism.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by thespywhozaggedme View Post
    If DT is why we cooled on Jenkins that's a flippin joke.
    I never said that you're reading too far between the lines there.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by thespywhozaggedme View Post
    I love ya buddy, but you really gotta stop with the "hate" mantra, it's lazy and stifles debate. I don't want him on this team, I don't think I can make it any clearer. I have zero say in the matter obviously, but I will warn everyone that I can from the mountaintops. He's not good and fans of his two previous teams have openly said so.
    I'm just trying to keep things positive and not at personal attacks on a recruit. That's kind of my job as moderator. Share your side but the stats out there put your reasons out there but don't take it too far.

  14. #114
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    OK, please let me explain myself. Like all of you, I love this team and want what’s best for it. In my opinion which I have backed up with stats and not just emotion, Thorton is not what is best for this team. He can’t shoot to save his life and he can’t drive to the hoop. I have however acknowledged what he does well, pass the ball and play defense. But if he is coming in to be our starting point guard, I just don’t get it because his statistics are worse than Genos were across the board. It makes no sense to bring him in if it’s going to block Brocks development. Not only did I post his extremely underwhelming statistics but I also linked posts and threads on Duke and USC’s boards and neither one had pretty much anything good to say about his on the court performance. But I have said all that I need to say and this will be my last post about him. I do not want him on this team, I do not think he’s good enough to play for Gonzaga. If he does join the team I hope it is for bench depth.

  15. #115
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    Jenkins is not a playmaker and he is also not going to be eligible to play next season unless he returns to South Dakota State.

    An immeditely eligible point guard/combo guard would be awesome for Gonzaga to add next season, pBest one available appears to be Jaevin Cumberland, but we're not getting a visit from him

    Perhaps the right guy hasnt announced his intention to transfer yet. If a guy like Harald Frey (Montana State), Jermaine Marrow (Hampton), Mike Smith (Columbia), Darius Roy (Milwaukee), Josh Sharkey (Samford), or Tarkus Ferguson (Illinois Chicago) were immediately eligible...

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by thespywhozaggedme View Post
    But I have said all that I need to say and this will be my last post about him.
    Weíll believe it when we see it, after ripping off 6 straight posts in this thread.

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by thespywhozaggedme View Post
    Like who, serious question? What other grad transfer that we're considering put up more underwhelming #'s than Thornton did? This guy isn't a high major level player.
    I was referring to our current roster of players but regardless, it is still your opinion that Thornton is bad. In other opinions he is a player that can help. I will trust the staff


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  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by thespywhozaggedme View Post
    If DT is why we cooled on Jenkins that's a flippin joke.
    I like Jenkins and would welcome him but his defense is as bad as Thornton's offense. Plus it is unlikely he will be immediately eligible and he kind of muddies the recruiting waters for 20 & 21 where there are bigger fish to fry.

    Thornton can facilitate and he can defend. While I'd love a Bowman/Ponds/Cumberland, the team doesn't necessarily need another scorer. If he can come and add depth to the backcourt while doing those two things and not mess up future recruiting, I don't see the problem.

    Also, while I'm confident in Ravet's offense as a freshman, there is no question he will have serious growing pains defensively. Adding another guard who can defend at a high level to help offset Ravet's defensive woes is useful.

  19. #119

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    Quote Originally Posted by thespywhozaggedme View Post
    OK, please let me explain myself. Like all of you, I love this team and want what’s best for it. In my opinion which I have backed up with stats and not just emotion, Thorton is not what is best for this team. He can’t shoot to save his life and he can’t drive to the hoop. I have however acknowledged what he does well, pass the ball and play defense. But if he is coming in to be our starting point guard, I just don’t get it because his statistics are worse than Genos were across the board. It makes no sense to bring him in if it’s going to block Brocks development. Not only did I post his extremely underwhelming statistics but I also linked posts and threads on Duke and USC’s boards and neither one had pretty much anything good to say about his on the court performance. But I have said all that I need to say and this will be my last post about him. I do not want him on this team, I do not think he’s good enough to play for Gonzaga. If he does join the team I hope it is for bench depth.
    To any recruits who might read these forums, don't pay attention to this guy. I'm pretty sure he's a saboteur and is a st Mary's fan.

  20. #120
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    I trust the coaching staff. We seem to have luck with these kinds of players. If it doesn’t work out, it’s just one year.

  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by thespywhozaggedme View Post
    5ppg, 2.6apg, 44% from the field, 36% from 3 in 22 mpg. And for apples to apples, here was Thornton's sophomore stats: 3.8ppg, 1.2apg, 36% from field, 32% from 3 in 14 mpg. Now let's compare their junior seasons:


    Dickau: 19ppg, 6.3apg, 49% from the field, 48% from 3 in 35mpg. Thornton: 7.7ppg, 4.3apg, 38% from the field, 29% from 3 in 28mpg.


    Thornton is not a high major player in any way, shape or form.
    The purpose of he comparison is to show that a change in system can make a huge difference and that statsdony always tell the whole story.


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  22. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAGzag View Post
    I trust the coaching staff. We seem to have luck with these kinds of players. If it doesnít work out, itís just one year.
    Coaches have their reasons. Maybe they see a redemption story. Maybe they see a leader in the making. Maybe they see a veteran who would be happy bringing along the young guys with minimal floor time. Maybe they see a diamond in the rough, a lottery ticket of sorts. There is a hell of a lot more than stats that go into it. This isnít roto baseball. Iím pretty sure tommy and mark donít look at a stat sheet and decide based on stats alone. Stats are a good tool, but one of many. Maybe, just maybe, the coaches have a lot more faith in Ravet than most of this board and see him as a starter. Donít know, but I know this: No one on this board including myself is a lock for the college basketball hall of fame. I trust them completely.

  23. #123
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    Spy's act has grown past old. We're not here to debate him and this isn't his forum. The schtick doesn't add value, it subtracts. Players, recruits, player and recruit's families all have visited this board and if someone is bad mouthing said player or recruit it reflects badly on Gonzaga.

    I've had enough of this behavior and I have complained about it, just so there is no mistake as to where I stand.

    Knock it off dude.

  24. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by caldwellzag View Post
    I will say it again but we probably shouldn't hate on a player who will probably be in a Gonzaga uniform next year.
    If that is the case....What about Nix?

    Go!! Zags!!!
    "Learn from the past, Plan for the future, Live in the Now!"

  25. #125

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    Spy and the other nay sayers--- you sure as hell have a ton of confidence in Ravet to say you would rather him be the starting PG as a true freshman than a guy who is 22, has played significant minutes for DUKE as a freshman, averaged nearly 5 apg at USC with a lot less talent than he will have next year, and was rated by every recruiting site as a top 20 overall recruit 4 years ago.

    Me? I would rather have Nix, but am by no means unhappy with getting Thornton. A guy that can distribute, can play very good defense, next to Gilder gives us a very experienced, leadership laden back court who can straight up guard. Spy is a numbnuts looking just at the offensive scoring categories.. the starting lineup will have Gilder, Kispert, Timme, Petrusev-- all scorers, plus watson, ravet and other talented scorers off the bench. We dont need Thornton to score. If he can play good defense and average 8 ppg and 6 APG and play lock down defense, we would be a very hard beat.

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