Norvell Declares Part II

[Bogozags]

Not even a 2nd rounder. Who is the hel* was advising Norvell? He'll be left out. He could be positioned sooo much better if he stick around and gets his shooting even out. Take work....here or somewhere. Here though, he'd be featured so everyone who determines his future would be seeing him. Not so elsewhere.....G League at best. I really like this kid. I hate his choices.

There are few on this board who would disagree with you...one more year for a lifetime...

[jazzdelmar]

There are few on this board who would disagree with you...one more year for a lifetime...

His decision befits his personality. Confident, if not daring; high risk, high reward. Good luck.

[MileHigh]

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa...g1a63lnmrppokk

The pundits all have opinions on this stuff (including me and every one else on this board) but I do know that the NBA folks have told Norvell two things that are important:

Number 1 is that this years draft, particularly at the guard position, is considered weaker than next years. Number 2 is that the knock against him ( athleticism) and the things they like (NBA range quick release shooter) will not change regardless of whether or not he goes back to Gonzaga. No one has told him that improving his college stats (shooting %, turnovers, ppg)would have any bearing on where he would be drafted. Bottom line is that most have told him he is likely a 2nd round pick or free agent, whether he comes out this year or next.
Also, maybe (and this is just an educated guess) ZN is simply done, both mentally and emotionally, with college ball and college life in general. While fans often think college basketball is all fun and excitement, it is often a repetitive grind to college players and they tire of the academic part, the same coaches in their ears year after year, little $$ in their pocket, and all the other trappings of being a college student/ athlete

Personally, I want to see where(if) he gets drafted, where he ends up playing(NBA/Gleague/overseas), and how well he does before I form my opinion on whether he would have increased his chances at pro $$ by playing another year of college basketball

[bartruff1]

None of us can read Zack's mind or know his motivation or circumstances ……

I am grateful that he played at Gonzaga when he could have played for a Power6 Team closer to home.....I think he is using good judgement and is taking the best path available to him to reach the NBA . For me, he was a joy to watch and I hope he doesn't regret his choice to play at Gonzaga ....

[TexasZagFan]

His decision befits his personality. Confident, if not daring; high risk, high reward. Good luck.

I'd include fearless in your list of adjectives.

Long range bombers like Zach are becoming more important to NBA teams. IIRC, during the first quarter of Thursday night's game, the Raptors shot over half of their attempts from beyond the arc.

[bartruff1]

I'd include fearless in your list of adjectives.

Long range bombers like Zach are becoming more important to NBA teams. IIRC, during the first quarter of Thursday night's game, the Raptors shot over half of their attempts from beyond the arc.

Tex I feel the same way. I am certainly no expert but Zack seems to have the NBA body and game and disposition....in addition he will probably play the same position that he played at Gonzaga.

In the end, I believe everyone in here wants to see him succeed.

[Mr Vulture]

While unlikely it happens, he did go to the combine so I believe he can technically come back if he isn’t drafted. Maybe I misunderstood the new rules though


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[ZagsObserver]

The pundits all have opinions on this stuff (including me and every one else on this board) but I do know that the NBA folks have told Norvell two things that are important:

Number 1 is that this years draft, particularly at the guard position, is considered weaker than next years. Number 2 is that the knock against him ( athleticism) and the things they like (NBA range quick release shooter) will not change regardless of whether or not he goes back to Gonzaga. No one has told him that improving his college stats (shooting %, turnovers, ppg)would have any bearing on where he would be drafted. Bottom line is that most have told him he is likely a 2nd round pick or free agent, whether he comes out this year or next.
Also, maybe (and this is just an educated guess) ZN is simply done, both mentally and emotionally, with college ball and college life in general. While fans often think college basketball is all fun and excitement, it is often a repetitive grind to college players and they tire of the academic part, the same coaches in their ears year after year, little $$ in their pocket, and all the other trappings of being a college student/ athlete

Personally, I want to see where(if) he gets drafted, where he ends up playing(NBA/Gleague/overseas), and how well he does before I form my opinion on whether he would have increased his chances at pro $$ by playing another year of college basketball

Fantastic synopsis

[Bogozags]

His decision befits his personality. Confident, if not daring; high risk, high reward. Good luck.

Jazz, I wish him the very best and after reading MileHigh's post I feel a little better about his chances...I didn't want him to come back so I/we would have him for another year...that would have been selfish and that isn't me! I hope he plays for 15 years and makes a ton of money and helps us recruit other players from the Chicago area...

[roxdoc]

Have always been a big fan of Zack and wish him nothing but the best - that said I think MileHigh is on to something with Zack being done with college. The last part of the season and certainly in the tourneys he was way of his game. Yes he had a couple of spurts but I'm talking overall - just not the Zack that we could count on as before.

[raise the zag]

Norvell played with much more bounce and explosion than we saw towards the end of February through Vegas and NCAA Tournament play.

I suspect he had a minor/nagging issue which needed a good week or two of rest and healing.

He looked so much quicker, and light on his feet at Combine. I felt Zach looked really sluggish in post-season play, and it seemed physical to me.

Its a great sign going forward for him in workouts and auditions.

[GonzagasaurusFlex]

Tex I feel the same way. I am certainly no expert but Zack seems to have the NBA body and game and disposition....in addition he will probably play the same position that he played at Gonzaga.

In the end, I believe everyone in here wants to see him succeed.

Good article in The Athletic about Jerry Stackhouse and his coaching Raptors’ D League team to 2017 championship. Points out that Pascal Siakam and Fred Van Vleet both played for him on that team; Norman Powell also spent time in D League. Here’s hoping Zach Norvell keeps ballin, believing in and betting on himself and enjoys similar success as these three Raptors, all of whom are playing key roles in the NBA Finals right now.

Loved MileHigh’s post about feedback ZN got and why he actually made a great, well reasoned decision to stay in draft.

[bartruff1]

Flex.....Good point on opportunities in the G League....but whenever I hear the name of Van Vleet , Baker or Early I hear the music from Jaws....

I believe both Van Vleet and Baker were undrafted.....now Fred is making 9 million a year....Ron nearly 5 million...

[jazzdelmar]

Flex.....Good point on opportunities in the G League....but whenever I hear the name of Van Vleet , Baker or Early I hear the music from Jaws....

I believe both Van Vleet and Baker were undrafted.....now Fred is making 9 million a year....

Yes, the Shockers had their 15 minutes of CBB fame and, unfortunately, we played a small role.

[webspinnre]

The pundits all have opinions on this stuff (including me and every one else on this board) but I do know that the NBA folks have told Norvell two things that are important:

Number 1 is that this years draft, particularly at the guard position, is considered weaker than next years. Number 2 is that the knock against him ( athleticism) and the things they like (NBA range quick release shooter) will not change regardless of whether or not he goes back to Gonzaga. No one has told him that improving his college stats (shooting %, turnovers, ppg)would have any bearing on where he would be drafted. Bottom line is that most have told him he is likely a 2nd round pick or free agent, whether he comes out this year or next.
Also, maybe (and this is just an educated guess) ZN is simply done, both mentally and emotionally, with college ball and college life in general. While fans often think college basketball is all fun and excitement, it is often a repetitive grind to college players and they tire of the academic part, the same coaches in their ears year after year, little $$ in their pocket, and all the other trappings of being a college student/ athlete

Personally, I want to see where(if) he gets drafted, where he ends up playing(NBA/Gleague/overseas), and how well he does before I form my opinion on whether he would have increased his chances at pro $$ by playing another year of college basketball

Excellent information, thank you.

[MDABE80]

" No one has told him that improving his college stats (shooting %, turnovers, ppg)would have any bearing on where he would be drafted. Bottom line is that most have told him he is likely a 2nd round pick or free agent, whether he comes out this year or next. " Seriously?? SO if he goes from 37% to say 40-42%? That wouldn't help? Or if he improved something else..like ballhandling skills or some such....that wouldn't help him secure a better position next year? Didn't we hear his athleticism was near the bottom? Additional training can't help him with agility, speed or get another 3-4 in on vertical??

If he's beyond improvement, it sounds quite dismal....

[Fonebone]

The pundits all have opinions on this stuff (including me and every one else on this board) but I do know that the NBA folks have told Norvell two things that are important:

Number 1 is that this years draft, particularly at the guard position, is considered weaker than next years. Number 2 is that the knock against him ( athleticism) and the things they like (NBA range quick release shooter) will not change regardless of whether or not he goes back to Gonzaga. No one has told him that improving his college stats (shooting %, turnovers, ppg)would have any bearing on where he would be drafted. Bottom line is that most have told him he is likely a 2nd round pick or free agent, whether he comes out this year or next.
Also, maybe (and this is just an educated guess) ZN is simply done, both mentally and emotionally, with college ball and college life in general. While fans often think college basketball is all fun and excitement, it is often a repetitive grind to college players and they tire of the academic part, the same coaches in their ears year after year, little $$ in their pocket, and all the other trappings of being a college student/ athlete

Personally, I want to see where(if) he gets drafted, where he ends up playing(NBA/Gleague/overseas), and how well he does before I form my opinion on whether he would have increased his chances at pro $$ by playing another year of college basketball

Mile, posts like yours are by far the best thing about this board for me. Especially the first part of your post. 99% of posts are mostly speculation and opinion, which is fine, that’s what most of us have to offer. But I read your post and my reaction is, “ok, I get it now. It makes total sense finally.” Thanks to you and a handful of others who do that on occasion.

I repeat, that’s not a criticism of the “normal” post, it’s just that that kind of post is in a different league.


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[kitzbuel]

" No one has told him that improving his college stats (shooting %, turnovers, ppg)would have any bearing on where he would be drafted. Bottom line is that most have told him he is likely a 2nd round pick or free agent, whether he comes out this year or next. " Seriously?? SO if he goes from 37% to say 40-42%? That wouldn't help? Or if he improved something else..like ballhandling skills or some such....that wouldn't help him secure a better position next year? Didn't we hear his athleticism was near the bottom? Additional training can't help him with agility, speed or get another 3-4 in on vertical??

If he's beyond improvement, it sounds quite dismal....

I think it might be the contrary, Abe. The facets of his game that he can improve can be improved better through full time professional training than through college ball. If a team believes he has the potential to improve enough to be attractive, they will take that deal. Zach is going to have to leverage that potential. He obviously thinks he can do that.

[MDABE80]

I have my doubts but we'll see. Now that the G-league is paying $80 K or so, and if he just has school burnout, it may be best to move along. Honestly, outside of Coach's loyalty to returning players, we do have some very good guys who want to be here and get to a FF. Young kids just have different priorities these days. So much talent to fill his spot. I do think most on the board will be curious to see how ZN's career unfolds. OR if he gets better with stiffer competition. Right now, most of this is conjecture. He sure has a pretty LD shot. Summer leagues await.

[B Wayne]

Flex.....Good point on opportunities in the G League....but whenever I hear the name of Van Vleet , Baker or Early I hear the music from Jaws....

I believe both Van Vleet and Baker were undrafted.....now Fred is making 9 million a year....Ron nearly 5 million...

And I hear people on this board after the 2013 Wichita State loss who argued that Gonzaga was clearly the better team and had better players than Wichita State and scoffed when I said Wichita State had players and a team every bit as good as the Zags.

I can't tell you how many times I hear fans of any team say "Yeah we lost, but we had the better team" and just can't accept maybe the other team was better. Also casual fans get blinded by a name like Wichita State and just figure their players aren't as good as a more recognized school like Gonzaga. But Wichita State had players that could just flat out play.

And it turns out...after 6 years the results are in...that Wichita State had 3 future NBA players including Van Vleet who is starting in the NBA finals tonight.

[jazzdelmar]

Ok, but none as successful as KO has been. Two scrubs and a backup pg.

And I hear people on this board after the 2013 Wichita State loss who argued that Gonzaga was clearly the better team and had better players than Wichita State and scoffed when I said Wichita State had players and a team every bit as good as the Zags.

I can't tell you how many times I hear fans of any team say "Yeah we lost, but we had the better team" and just can't accept maybe the other team was better. Also casual fans get blinded by a name like Wichita State and just figure their players aren't as good as a more recognized school like Gonzaga. But Wichita State had players that could just flat out play.

And it turns out...after 6 years the results are in...that Wichita State had 3 future NBA players including Van Vleet who is starting in the NBA finals tonight.

[maynard g krebs]

And I hear people on this board after the 2013 Wichita State loss who argued that Gonzaga was clearly the better team and had better players than Wichita State and scoffed when I said Wichita State had players and a team every bit as good as the Zags.

I can't tell you how many times I hear fans of any team say "Yeah we lost, but we had the better team" and just can't accept maybe the other team was better. Also casual fans get blinded by a name like Wichita State and just figure their players aren't as good as a more recognized school like Gonzaga. But Wichita State had players that could just flat out play.

And it turns out...after 6 years the results are in...that Wichita State had 3 future NBA players including Van Vleet who is starting in the NBA finals tonight.

One game doesn't necessarily determine who's the better team. That Wichita team was a terrible 3 pt shooting team; 2/20 in their opening game v Pitt, and around 30% overall. They got red hot v the Zags, esp after Bell went down. There are generally reasons why one team is a 1 seed and another is an 8/9. And occasionally, upsets happen.

[B Wayne]

Ok, but none as successful as KO has been. Two scrubs and a backup pg.

Yes good point. But let's wait to see how Van Vleet's carrer goes.

[B Wayne]

One game doesn't necessarily determine who's the better team. That Wichita team was a terrible 3 pt shooting team; 2/20 in their opening game v Pitt, and around 30% overall. They got red hot v the Zags, esp after Bell went down. There are generally reasons why one team is a 1 seed and another is an 8/9. And occasionally, upsets happen.

Also good points.

[zagfan1]

Professional ball is pretty grueling. For a professional athlete there is no rest. If you are not working out or playing your studying the plays, the opponents, and analyzing your own metrics.