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Thread: Recruiting Scandal List Schools to Jurors

  1. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Vulture View Post
    I would disagree with your statement that Gonzaga and even the bigger schools are "exploiting" these kids. My reasoning is this, the majority of athletic programs are not making "millions" in the end and often are working in the red without major donations from boosters. The major revenue sports are what fund the remainder of the athletic department at most schools and whether we choose to acknowledge it or not, the degree is a big deal if the athlete takes advantage of it.

    If you want to say the NCAA, which is netting billions is exploiting them, I would say that is much more accurate.
    The NCAA does not net billions, or even gross billions. The NCAA gets about 760 million a year for the basketball tourney contract. 96 percent of that goes back to the 350+ D1 schools and a little to the D2 schools in a variety of ways. The NCAA keeps about 4 percent, around 30 million, for administrative expenses and salaries. One tourney basically funds all other college athletics and 90 NCAA championships.

  2. #152
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    A big reason the NCAA has trouble monitoring and disciplining schools is they lack the funds and the authoritative power. The only way they can hurt schools is withholding money if they can prove wrong doing.

  3. #153
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    Roger Goodell makes more money than the entire NCAA.

  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdmiller7 View Post
    Roger Goodell makes more money than the entire NCAA.
    I don't think so. "It's not clear how much Goodell was paid in 2016 and 2017. His salary was cut continually between 2012, when he made $44.2 million, and 2015. That is when the NFL dropped its federal tax exemption. As a result, Goodell's salary is no longer public. Goodell took the job in 2006. Between 2008 and 2015, he was paid more than $205 million."

    https://money.cnn.com/2017/11/13/new...ort/index.html
    SLOZag
    "Kids come here to better their own lives, not ours. If you take a player’s failures as a personal affront…. check yourself." - Chick-Stratino'sUrDaddy

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Centre Mad Man View Post
    Agreed. I don’t believe for a moment that Duke cares about the welfare of programs in mid-major leagues.

    Graduate transfers are not harming college basketball. If a kid from the Summit League is disciplined enough to earn a degree with eligibility remaining and then chooses to go play for a bigger program, let him have that reward for his hard work.
    I agree. It rewards the late bloomers or players who put in the hard work to be a better player at a better program, or allows a person who is languishing in a system that is not a good fit to move to a better situation for his future. Of course, Coach K’s comments come from a coach-centric (and fan-base centric, to be fair) position. If a coach can quit on his team and move on to greener pastures, a player should have some freedom, as well.

  6. #156
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    I have said this several times before...

    This ESPN headline says it all!

    Duke and UNC lead the title hunt, and other futures to like Duke was the odds on favorite and GU was second with UNC third...so maybe ESPN just forgot that GU was second, ya think!

    Duke, UNC, UK, KU, UCLA, AZ, IU are the main "Blue Bloods" and the ones that the NATION follows and wants to hear about all the time...These schools make money for ESPN via advertising...GU just isn't at that level and they do not want to give them the same status...

    Look at UCF...they didn't move in the recent football polls...they are discounted because they are not a P-5 school...

    It is all about money and the NCAA really doesn't want to get involved in this pay-to-play situation because if they did and put AZ, KU, NCST and Miami on probation, then all those kids playing at those schools could leave and find another school and play immediately...

    "IF" by chance the NCAA has to get involved, it won't be until after the trial and not effect these schools this season...then the schools will be give an chance to rebut the accusations and while doing so, decided to self-impose a tournament ban and reduce allowable scholarships and then the NCAA will say, "Your self-imposed penalty is sufficient!"

    Money is POWER, POWER corrupts and that is where we are today...

    If any of us think the playing table is level, then I know a ski resort in the Florida Keys that is selling ownership shares for only $100 each...



    Maybe all scholarships should go by the way side and actually do away with the need to have an NCAA altogether and just have "Club Teams!" No that wouldn't work either as the shoe companies would find a way to get Club Teams to wear their gear and of course slip a few grand under the table so those teams play in their uni's and shoes...IT IS JUST TO LATE to fix this problem...JUST TOO MUCH MONEY!

    Of course this is just my opinion...

  7. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by primal23 View Post
    This strikes me as an attempt at a distraction.
    But like you said since it came from coach K it’s got to be gospel.


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  8. #158
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    If I remember correctly, the NCAA made a change in their rules that permits them to use information & documentation obtained by legal authorities in any judgements they may decide to pursue against member schools.

    I expect that the NCAA will do absolutely nothing until, at the earliest, the FBI is entirely done with their case if they choose to do anything at all. If it so happens that by the time everybody indicted by the FBI is tried and sentenced and the NCAA begins (??) their investigation into the allegations made in the FBI case, it is likely that this year's NCAA tournament will be over and another group of one-and-doners will be gone to the NBA.

    It does make sense for the NCAA to wait until the FBI has presented all of their evidence and the FBI trials concluded before they begin their investigation. Nothing says the NCAA will do anything, but if they do something, don't expect it until long after the FBI has concluded their business.

    ZagDad

  9. #159
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    Oh my.....Zion Williamson….Duke's superstar freshman may have been looking for a job, cash and housing from Kansas and Adidas .....

  10. #160

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    Quote Originally Posted by bartruff1 View Post
    Oh my.....Zion Williamson….Duke's superstar freshman may have been looking for a job, cash and housing from Kansas and Adidas .....
    I'm sure he went to Duke for free though, cause coach K says they are clean....

  11. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagssuperfan View Post
    I'm sure he went to Duke for free though, cause coach K says they are clean....
    No doubt...

  12. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagssuperfan View Post
    I'm sure he went to Duke for free though, cause coach K says they are clean....
    I AM sure they shower frequently. That must be what he meant.
    Hoping you have a sense of humor too!

  13. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Vulture View Post
    I would disagree with your statement that Gonzaga and even the bigger schools are "exploiting" these kids. My reasoning is this, the majority of athletic programs are not making "millions" in the end and often are working in the red without major donations from boosters. The major revenue sports are what fund the remainder of the athletic department at most schools and whether we choose to acknowledge it or not, the degree is a big deal if the athlete takes advantage of it.

    If you want to say the NCAA, which is netting billions is exploiting them, I would say that is much more accurate.
    I think there are at least two ways to think about the "NCAA." One way is to narrowly define it as the official non-profit organization charged with enforcing the athletic rules at member organizations (colleges and universities). However, I think "NCAA" is used by some to mean both the organization in its official capacity as well as member institutions (or at least those athletic directors, coaches, players that profit or are governed by the NCAA rules).

    Saying, "the NCAA is investigating UNC for ..." means something different than "the NCAA basketball season should be very competitive..." Maybe the NCAA organization has a three on three tournament at headquarters or something, but I'm pretty sure we all know that NCAA is meant to include all the schools.

    The NCAA that exploits players is the NCAA organization along with NCAA members, athletic directors and coaches. They've set up a system of amateur sports that prevents a free market supply and demand model on one side (those on the court) of the labor equation, while setting up a free market based on supply and demand on the other side of the labor equation (coaches, ADs, schools, and -to a lesser degree-the NCAA officials that draw salaries from NCAA revenues). By doing so, and continuing to support it, a bigger slice of the pie goes to the free market driven side of the equation making those who derive incomes from it much richer than if they had to share revenues with those on the other side of the equation.

    And I understand that many NCAA regulated sports, like water polo, are not generating revenues. But what does that have to do with anything? If we are going to use a business model then water polo shouldn't exist outside of club sports or players pay-to-play or something. If we are going to use an amateur athletics model, Coach K shouldn't be a millionaire (and neither should Mark Few). They should receive salary based on an amateur athletics model. So just the same way we say a scholarship is perfectly fine compensation for both the water polo player and the top basketball recruit in the world, we should be saying the $135,000 per year a water polo coach earns (I googled an article on it, that is decent compensation), is the same $135,000 per year that a basketball coach earns.

    It is the mixing of these two systems, amateur sports with free market enterprise, that incentivizes people to exploit others. Just saying their exploitation leads to good things (like women's sports or whatever) doesn't eliminate the hypocrisy and exploitation. If the major sports are going to be businesses, their labor should be treated like labor in a business environment.

  14. #164
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    Wow I can't believe this comment. Poor Universities!!!

    https://twitter.com/PeteBrush/status...09755791978497

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagssuperfan View Post
    I'm sure he went to Duke for free though, cause coach K says they are clean....
    Duke is Duke. They just might be able to get kids who are bright enough to wait a year for their fortune (and avoid any potential taint) and use that year at Duke to augment their brand. Which the tv exposure will do. Don't really know, but it seems logical.

    And no, I'm not a Duke fan. Just whining on their behalf. (Or, as I prefer to call it, using common sense logic.)

  16. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgadfly View Post
    I think there are at least two ways to think about the "NCAA." One way is to narrowly define it as the official non-profit organization charged with enforcing the athletic rules at member organizations (colleges and universities). However, I think "NCAA" is used by some to mean both the organization in its official capacity as well as member institutions (or at least those athletic directors, coaches, players that profit or are governed by the NCAA rules).

    Saying, "the NCAA is investigating UNC for ..." means something different than "the NCAA basketball season should be very competitive..." Maybe the NCAA organization has a three on three tournament at headquarters or something, but I'm pretty sure we all know that NCAA is meant to include all the schools.

    The NCAA that exploits players is the NCAA organization along with NCAA members, athletic directors and coaches. They've set up a system of amateur sports that prevents a free market supply and demand model on one side (those on the court) of the labor equation, while setting up a free market based on supply and demand on the other side of the labor equation (coaches, ADs, schools, and -to a lesser degree-the NCAA officials that draw salaries from NCAA revenues). By doing so, and continuing to support it, a bigger slice of the pie goes to the free market driven side of the equation making those who derive incomes from it much richer than if they had to share revenues with those on the other side of the equation.

    And I understand that many NCAA regulated sports, like water polo, are not generating revenues. But what does that have to do with anything? If we are going to use a business model then water polo shouldn't exist outside of club sports or players pay-to-play or something. If we are going to use an amateur athletics model, Coach K shouldn't be a millionaire (and neither should Mark Few). They should receive salary based on an amateur athletics model. So just the same way we say a scholarship is perfectly fine compensation for both the water polo player and the top basketball recruit in the world, we should be saying the $135,000 per year a water polo coach earns (I googled an article on it, that is decent compensation), is the same $135,000 per year that a basketball coach earns.

    It is the mixing of these two systems, amateur sports with free market enterprise, that incentivizes people to exploit others. Just saying their exploitation leads to good things (like women's sports or whatever) doesn't eliminate the hypocrisy and exploitation. If the major sports are going to be businesses, their labor should be treated like labor in a business environment.
    and the Olympics eliminated the amateur part years ago
    Dissent, insight and contextual discussion makes a website 'sticky' and engaging - not just predictable, safe position fanboyism. Monoculture is uninteresting and lacks intellectual depth.

  17. #167
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    Look at UCF...they didn't move in the recent football polls...they are discounted because they are not a P-5 school...
    Not related to the scandal........most people do not realize this, but UCF has the 2nd largest enrollment of any public university in the United States of America. 66,000+. Only Texas A&M is larger. The only reason why UCF doesn't belong to a power 5 conference is because the university didn't exist before 1963. Just like Gonzaga is an odd ball men's basketball program in that their program generates more revenue and profit than any Pac 12 school besides UCLA and Zona (look it up - it's true), UCF even being associated with schools like Utah State, Toledo, and Louisiana Tech in football is also odd ball and kind of unfair. Plus the state of Florida is a gold mine for prep football recruiting. Miami, FSU and Florida are not what they used to be......

    I still cannot believe that the past 2 seasons, UCF has had scheduled games vs. BCS teams cancelled. Talk about rotten luck. They are actually hosting Stanford next season. Watch.....that game will get wiped out due to a hurricane warning......

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