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  1. #451
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    Gotta say, I am a pretty technical guy... I get a lot of how technology works. Quantum physics make me go:

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  2. #452
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markburn1 View Post
    Yeah. Curious. Do you think nuclear science is a net plus or a net minus for humankind?
    I just saw this. According to Bohr, if I remember correctly, it just is. Humans trying to understand their environment have to unlock the nature of atoms. It is just the progression of knowledge.
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  3. #453
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markburn1 View Post
    Hey Dix. They started in on Q bits. I couldn’t get out of my head if Q bits were measurable by cubits. Then I remembered some of these things aren’t measurable at all because they can be in two places at once. Haha.

    Okay. I’m going to listen to this again. Will have to cross reference a lot of this. So much to unpack. Some of it is the language that they use. Different meanings of words that don’t translate to common usage. A lot of it just technical stuff out of the realm of my previous consciousness if you get my meaning.

    P.S. I would love for some other folks to jump in here. I need all the help I can get.
    You're going to need the smart people like LIZF, Kitz, Phish, Will, etc.
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  4. #454
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    Decent article on NASA's latest attempts in the search for life: https://www.space.com/nasa-alien-lif...idenstine.html


    About Mars:
    Appropriately enough given the occasion, the NASA chief singled out Mars as a particularly promising abode for life. He highlighted three intriguing finds: The Red Planet's surface hosts complex organic molecules, the carbon-based building blocks of life; in at least some locales, the potentially biogenic gas methane varies seasonally; and there's apparently a huge lake of liquid water beneath Mars' south pole. (The first two discoveries were made by NASA's Curiosity rover, and the third by Europe's Mars Express orbiter.) [The Search for Life on Mars: A Photo Timeline]
    Europa (My personal favorite candidate in our solar system).

    The agency is developing a mission to Jupiter's ocean-harboring moon Europa, which is widely regarded as one of the solar system's best bets to host alien life. This spacecraft, called Europa Clipper, will launch in the 2020s, and characterize the moon's subsurface ocean during dozens of flybys after it reaches the Jupiter system. Clipper will also scout out touchdown spots for a potential lander mission, which would hunt for signs of life on and just beneath Europa's icy surface.
    Bridenstine isn't the only NASA official to express optimism about the alien-life hunt recently. In 2015, Ellen Stofan, the agency's chief scientist at the time, predicted that NASA would find signs of E.T. by 2025 and definitive evidence within 20 to 30 years.

    I doubt it, not in our Solar System, anyway.


    I suspect our first "indication of life" from somewhere else will be through detection of oxygen in an atmosphere. Oxygen isn't a gas people would expect to find in abundance in an atmosphere without the presence of some kind of photosynthesis.


    Here is a great Nova Episode on the search for life:


    Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
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  5. #455
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    COOL (Because it misses) https://www.dailykos.com/stories/201...ght#view-story



    An asteroid big enough to have its own moon will pass Earth on Saturday night


    Don’t get out your nuclear missiles. All dinosaurs are safe this time, as the closest approach of asteroid 1999 KW4 will be about 3 million miles—about 12 times the distance from Earth to Moon. So on the list of scary encounters, this is low on the “buy canned food” scale. In fact, this same asteroid has swung past four times before since its discovery, and on one of those occasions it came closer still.


    However, it’s big on the interesting scale, because the asteroid sweeping by on Saturday isn’t one body, it’s two. The space rock first found by the Lincoln Near-Earth Asteroid Research (LINEAR) collaboration between NASA, the Air Force, and MIT back in 1994, was determined by JPL researchers in 2001 to actually be a “binary pair” where one asteroid acts as the moon of the other.

    Now THIS IS interesting:

    Even then, they’re not any kind of threat; unlike the kilometer-wide asteroid 99942 Apophis which is set to pass closer to the Earth than many satellites in 2029. On that one, people will definitely be double-checking their math, and maybe hoping that the planned Asteroid Redirect Mission produces good results. Apophis was named for the “uncreator” who was an enemy of Ra in Egyptian myths so someone seems to have been a little pessimistic when working out those orbital results.

    This is SLIGHTLY less threatening than it sounds, in that they're not talking about Sats in low-Earth orbit, they are talking the geo-synchronis satellites that are WAYY farther out.

    It is STILL disconcerting that an asteroid that big will be coming in 2029. Yes, 99.8% chance it misses.

    But that's not a ton of room for error in the future or just considering that by all rights it could've just as easily been on a collision course, and who knows what could really have been done about that if it were.

    Odds are nothing hits in the next 5 generations, but when talking about either civilization ending stuff or even civilization "real pain in the ass" stuff, is it not kind of bad that we're not currently doing TONS to experiment on how to move them?

    Why not get every self-respecting government out there to chip-in, and be doing one mission a year to asteroids and practice moving them? Kind of a bad thing to get "wrong" on your first shot.

    The downside seems awfully high, even if it were discovered that somewhere out there a rock that could end civilization in 2080 or whatever, wouldn't it be "prudent" to begin practicing now in moving ones that are not going to hit?
    Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
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  6. #456
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    Why not get every self-respecting government out there to chip-in, and be doing one mission a year to asteroids and practice moving them? Kind of a bad thing to get "wrong" on your first shot.

    The downside seems awfully high, even if it were discovered that somewhere out there a rock that could end civilization in 2080 or whatever, wouldn't it be "prudent" to begin practicing now in moving ones that are not going to hit?
    I don't know how many self-respecting governments we have left with the moolah for the boolah.

    Practice is a good thing.

  7. #457
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    Anyone watching the "Chernobyl" mini-series on HBO ?

  8. #458
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    Quote Originally Posted by RenoZag View Post
    Anyone watching the "Chernobyl" mini-series on HBO ?
    Is it a new one or a rerun? Because I have watched several great documentaries on the web and TV on the place over the last 5 years.


    Nuclear power is another maddening thing bc with our ability to do it - "create our own little suns in an engineered container" - there is no excuse to burn any coal anywhere ever forever, or have dams or anything else (with a huge exception for wind/solar) bc it is just so so so so much more efficient and relatively easy.

    BUT - of course, we've seen that it is another thing that there is just absolutely no room for error period end of story. Just the 2 major major breaches: Chernobyl and Fukushima are still causing massive headaches and rendered areas uninhabitable until …. we don't really know.

    And storing the waste is a problem, but it sure seems to me that with global warming, storing it either inside a mountain or put in a container and dropped to the bottom of the Arctic ocean SEEMS to me like not all that bad a solution.

    The consequences of global warming are so severe already and going to get much much worse over 50 years even if we stopped all carbon output today, that I still think that they might have figured out how to make them even safer and not located right on top of a major fault line on the ocean shore for godsake, it just is so much more efficient than anything else out there right now. I don't get it.





    But I have watched many fascinating programs on Chernobyl. We don't get HBO. It is kind of an expensive package on Dish (only thing we can get). I still watch our budget closely.
    Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
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  9. #459
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    It's new, Dixie. Started airing 3 weeks ago; new episodes air on Mondays.

    Yucca Mountain was built for the waste. Politics and politicians have prevented its utilization. Billions spent for nothing.

  10. #460
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    Quote Originally Posted by RenoZag View Post
    It's new, Dixie. Started airing 3 weeks ago; new episodes air on Mondays.

    Yucca Mountain was built for the waste. Politics and politicians have prevented its utilization. Billions spent for nothing.

    Yeah, and I get why people don't want it near them.


    But at some point some people need to take one for the team and maybe have fund set up for any cleaning or expenses for people near it.


    But, until they really figure out how to idiot proof reactors and keep them in stable areas w/o earthquakes, hurricanes, etc. the waste is a secondary concern, at least with future stuff.


    I am not sure what they do with stuff they have right now. Store on site?


    I'd love to see that HBO series. Someone will put it on YouTube eventually.
    Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
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  11. #461
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    I was looking for an answer to my question about black holes dissolving, i.e. Hawking radiation, that wasn't highly technical and I found this.
    https://www.sciencenews.org/article/...nic-black-hole


    "After Hawking proposed his theory, this predicted thermal property of the radiation led to a conundrum known as the black hole information paradox. In quantum mechanics, information can never be destroyed. But particles escaping black holes would slowly sap the behemoth’s mass, and over a long period of time, the black hole would shrink into nothingness.
    That means that the information that fell into the black hole (in the form of particles, encyclopedias or otherwise) would no longer be contained within it. And if Hawking radiation is thermal, the information couldn’t have been carried away by the fleeing particles. That’s because the emitted particles are indistinguishable from those radiated by a commonplace object with a given temperature, or even by a different black hole of the same mass. That suggests that information can be lost as a black hole evaporates away, a violation of quantum mechanics."

    The question becomes, "Where did the information go?"

    "Hawking radiation comes from pairs of quantum particles that constantly pop up everywhere, even in empty space. Normally, those particles immediately annihilate one another. But at a black hole’s edge, if one particle falls in, the other could escape, resulting in Hawking radiation."


    Fascinating.

  12. #462
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markburn1 View Post
    I was looking for an answer to my question about black holes dissolving, i.e. Hawking radiation, that wasn't highly technical and I found this.
    https://www.sciencenews.org/article/...nic-black-hole


    "After Hawking proposed his theory, this predicted thermal property of the radiation led to a conundrum known as the black hole information paradox. In quantum mechanics, information can never be destroyed. But particles escaping black holes would slowly sap the behemoth’s mass, and over a long period of time, the black hole would shrink into nothingness.
    That means that the information that fell into the black hole (in the form of particles, encyclopedias or otherwise) would no longer be contained within it. And if Hawking radiation is thermal, the information couldn’t have been carried away by the fleeing particles. That’s because the emitted particles are indistinguishable from those radiated by a commonplace object with a given temperature, or even by a different black hole of the same mass. That suggests that information can be lost as a black hole evaporates away, a violation of quantum mechanics."

    The question becomes, "Where did the information go?"

    "Hawking radiation comes from pairs of quantum particles that constantly pop up everywhere, even in empty space. Normally, those particles immediately annihilate one another. But at a black hole’s edge, if one particle falls in, the other could escape, resulting in Hawking radiation."


    Fascinating.
    My understanding is that because the particle pairs annihilate each other, one is calculated as positive, the other negative. The negative quantum particles will be attracted to the mass of the black hole, so they will form closer to the black hole than the positive particle, I think of it like electrical or magnetic attraction. Occasionally the negative particle forms inside the event horizon while the positive partner forms just outside the horizon. The positive particle escapes while the negative does not. At that point it becomes a math problem. If you keep adding negative mass of this negative particle capture, you eventually get to zero.

    Poof, the black hole is gone.
    'I found it is the small everyday deeds of ordinary folk that keep the darkness at bay… small acts of kindness and love.'
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  13. #463
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    Quote Originally Posted by kitzbuel View Post
    My understanding is that because the particle pairs annihilate each other, one is calculated as positive, the other negative. The negative quantum particles will be attracted to the mass of the black hole, so they will form closer to the black hole than the positive particle, I think of it like electrical or magnetic attraction. Occasionally the negative particle forms inside the event horizon while the positive partner forms just outside the horizon. The positive particle escapes while the negative does not. At that point it becomes a math problem. If you keep adding negative mass of this negative particle capture, you eventually get to zero.

    Poof, the black hole is gone.
    From the little I know trying to understand this stuff, you're both right. Yes, the particles annihilate each other, which leads to a loss of information, which physics says that even though no one could ever keep track of all the information, still, in theory, one ought to be able to examine every single "bit" - and I mean a quantum bit - should be found if you were abler to actually examine it.

    I think Hawking principle relates to it much the same. I think it's more about how once you have two entangled particles, one spin versus another, top bottom, left right, whatever, to a tiny slight degree, one will drop into the black hole, gone forever, and one stays out as representing Hawking radiation, which actually represents heat coming out from a black hole, where supposedly information is lost. but it can't be if you've one particle that you would know the spin, and one that went in, you'd know what went in.

    I don't know why I even pretend I understand this sht, maybe it makes me feel better, but as far as I know, that's at least part of it.


    Interestingly, the Hawking principle about all information being lost was actually wrong, but he is the one that asked the question, where did the information go?

    And sometimes it is the question that is brilliant, maybe not so much the answer.
    Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
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  14. #464
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    Quote Originally Posted by DixieZag View Post
    From the little I know trying to understand this stuff, you're both right. Yes, the particles annihilate each other, which leads to a loss of information, which physics says that even though no one could ever keep track of all the information, still, in theory, one ought to be able to examine every single "bit" - and I mean a quantum bit - should be found if you were abler to actually examine it.

    I think Hawking principle relates to it much the same. I think it's more about how once you have two entangled particles, one spin versus another, top bottom, left right, whatever, to a tiny slight degree, one will drop into the black hole, gone forever, and one stays out as representing Hawking radiation, which actually represents heat coming out from a black hole, where supposedly information is lost. but it can't be if you've one particle that you would know the spin, and one that went in, you'd know what went in.

    I don't know why I even pretend I understand this sht, maybe it makes me feel better, but as far as I know, that's at least part of it.


    Interestingly, the Hawking principle about all information being lost was actually wrong, but he is the one that asked the question, where did the information go?

    And sometimes it is the question that is brilliant, maybe not so much the answer.
    "I don't know why I even pretend I understand this sht..."

    Hahaha. It's much the same when I pretend to know God's purpose. You know the question. "What is the meaning of life?" No doubt why atheists and agnostics exist. Sometimes it just boils down to faith.

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