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Thread: Don't be surprised if

  1. #26
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    Default Above the rim

    Need more players that play above the rim instead of lay-ins to be in the best Zag team ever discussion. That said, it'd possible to match 2 wins in the tourney.

  2. #27
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    I predict an undefeated season and a national championship.

  3. #28
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    I'd need to see a lot more from the starting back court before I'd begin to worry about how deep this team will go. I feel rather strongly that Pangos has been overhyped due to his being an improvement over the previous starting point. I haven't seen much to suggest he'd be much more than a top 50 point guard in the country. When he's hitting, he's amazing; however, he doesn't add much when his shot isn't falling.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGonzagaFactor View Post
    Wow, that is bad.
    You think that is bad? Harris got 5 and Hart 0 against Southern I see now GU got 11 pts off their bench to 19 for Southern. GU scored 64 pts against Southern.

    You want toughness? You think the loss of Mike Hart will be the end of the toughness that the Zags have had in the past? Wait until you see Coleman play. IMO, he will end up being a better rebounder then Mike Hart, and will prove to be tougher too. And when it comes to scoring there will be no comparison at all. And Kelly Olynyk was not tougher last year then PK will be this year, and PK will be a better rebounder.

    I don't think you can say Gary Bell and Kevin Pangos are not tough. I wouldn't. And David Stockton is as tough as they come.
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

  5. #30
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    I agree with a lot of what you're saying Reborn. My outlook on next years team is this; more explosive than last year, but I expect them to be way less consistent.

    Although quite a talented duo in their own right, a front court of Dower and Karnowski is a far cry from Olynyk and Harris last year. Potential aside, I don't expect their production to come close to what Olynyk and Harris did. That being said, our guards and bench really should pack some serious fire power and pick up a bunch of that slack. I see us losing 1 or 2 that we shouldn't, but also have some eye popping offensive displays and big wins.

  6. #31
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    My concern last year was KO/Dower/Harris being soft in the paint. KO had never shown the ability to bang down low and Elias was not much of a rebounder. The D in Dower never stood for "D"fense either. Plus, we appeared to be wingless to a fair degree. All this, and we did surprisingly well.

    This season I bet Karno steps up huge and Dower finishes his career in impressive fashion. My only concern is with depth down low. Wings galore, and a very experienced back court...with a softer schedule and the team we put on the floor, I see us better overall than last year.

    Not saying we roll up a better record, and probably won't hit #1 in the polls, just have this feeling we go deeper in March.

    Cant wait to see Coleman and Nunoz in action, Draino step up, and a more experienced Karno.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reborn View Post
    You think that is bad? Harris got 5 and Hart 0 against Southern I see now GU got 11 pts off their bench to 19 for Southern. GU scored 64 pts against Southern.

    You want toughness? You think the loss of Mike Hart will be the end of the toughness that the Zags have had in the past? Wait until you see Coleman play. IMO, he will end up being a better rebounder then Mike Hart, and will prove to be tougher too. And when it comes to scoring there will be no comparison at all. And Kelly Olynyk was not tougher last year then PK will be this year, and PK will be a better rebounder.

    I don't think you can say Gary Bell and Kevin Pangos are not tough. I wouldn't. And David Stockton is as tough as they come.
    Please don't misunderstand me, I think our guys are tough. That's not what I'm saying. And I agree that Coleman is an improvement at the 3. Mike Hart, as tough as he was, was a liability on offense. He's that 6th man that comes in and can be a game changer with his toughness. That's what I'm talking about. Other than the starters, which I think are great and compliment each other well, I still want to see the lunch pail guy who can come in and change the tone of a game by being a force. He won't need to score because that's not what he's there for, though put backs from offensive boards are often a result of the kind of play I'm talking about.

    I think if we had Coleman at the three and Mike Hart coming off the bench last year that game against Witchita goes our way, even with GBJs injury. We were one perimeter player short (no pun intended). Hart still plays his game, but it's more of a supportive role...just as valuable tho.

    Still hoping to see the staff add that one player, or to have someone step into the role that I think we will rely on in tough situations.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malastein View Post
    I'd need to see a lot more from the starting back court before I'd begin to worry about how deep this team will go. I feel rather strongly that Pangos has been overhyped due to his being an improvement over the previous starting point. I haven't seen much to suggest he'd be much more than a top 50 point guard in the country. When he's hitting, he's amazing; however, he doesn't add much when his shot isn't falling.
    He averaged 17.5 in the NCAA tournament. I thought he really stepped up in the tournament big time. When he is off the opposing team still needs to guard him because he can get on at any time and hit the big shot.
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

  9. #34
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    Wasn't Barham channeling his inner 'Hart' there at the end of the year? Scrappy and willing to take the shot.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZaginLaw View Post
    Need more players that play above the rim instead of lay-ins to be in the best Zag team ever discussion. That said, it'd possible to match 2 wins in the tourney.
    I think that the two transfers, Coleman and Nunez, are great additions to the team. Tommy called Coleman the best slasher that GU has ever had, and he called Nunez one of the most athletic players that GU has ever had. These two guys will provide some entertainment for the younger fans who like to see dunks.

    What I think Gonzaga needs more of is 3 point shooting, especially off the bench. I'm hoping that Nunez will be able to provide that. I also thought that Barham began to find his shot the last part of the season so if he can continue to be confident from behind the arc that will be great. And let's hope that Dranginis finally becomes the confident player we are all hoping he is.
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

  11. #36
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    Gonzaga adjusted defensive efficiency last year: 89.7.

    Can next year's group approach that?

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by willandi View Post
    Wasn't Barham channeling his inner 'Hart' there at the end of the year? Scrappy and willing to take the shot.
    Yes, yes he was! I also wonder if having Ammo on the bench and in practices will have an effect on the "toughness".

  13. #38
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    My view is that they have the pieces to do damage. The biggest question is frontcourt depth. The starters are studs, PK and Dower, Who backs them up? More 4 guards and a big, we do have the big guards to get with for short stretches and then Ryan could provide minutes of spelling the bigs. If Few finds answers, this could be a special team like last seasons.
    ----
    Why not try Love Poems. They work to prime the pump.

  14. #39
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    Unhappy

    Quote Originally Posted by Malastein View Post
    I'd need to see a lot more from the starting back court before I'd begin to worry about how deep this team will go. I feel rather strongly that Pangos has been overhyped due to his being an improvement over the previous starting point. I haven't seen much to suggest he'd be much more than a top 50 point guard in the country. When he's hitting, he's amazing; however, he doesn't add much when his shot isn't falling.
    Pangos is the only reason we beat southern, he had a step back mid range jumper an a step back three on back to back possessions IIRC. If he didn't hit those we were in dangerous territory.

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZAGGED OUT View Post
    Pangos is the only reason we beat southern, he had a step back mid range jumper an a step back three on back to back possessions IIRC. If he didn't hit those we were in dangerous territory.
    And, he shot them back into the lead against Wichita State. Briefly.

  16. #41
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    People are down on this years team because they only compare it to last years.

    Look at the squad independent of last year and see that we'll be damn good.

    They absolutely could make a deep run in march. That doesn't mean they would be better than last year, they could just be playing well at the right time against teams that don't shoot 90% on 3 pointers.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyzaggy View Post
    Elias was not much of a rebounder.
    Interesting statement.

  18. #43
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    Front court depth. Til that is resolved, we aint what we used to be.

    My secret hope is that Lucas Milke has been, and will be, attached to Morrisons hip.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reborn View Post
    He averaged 17.5 in the NCAA tournament. I thought he really stepped up in the tournament big time. When he is off the opposing team still needs to guard him because he can get on at any time and hit the big shot.
    I'm hoping your prediction is right! Keep the positivity coming!

  20. #45
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    Default Getting out Calvery'd

    Quote Originally Posted by Reborn View Post
    I think that the two transfers, Coleman and Nunez, are great additions to the team. Tommy called Coleman the best slasher that GU has ever had, and he called Nunez one of the most athletic players that GU has ever had. These two guys will provide some entertainment for the younger fans who like to see dunks.

    What I think Gonzaga needs more of is 3 point shooting, especially off the bench. I'm hoping that Nunez will be able to provide that. I also thought that Barham began to find his shot the last part of the season so if he can continue to be confident from behind the arc that will be great. And let's hope that Dranginis finally becomes the confident player we are all hoping he is.
    Reborn,

    It's certainly not about entertainment for the younger crowd. The difference between 1 or 2 and done or deep runs in the Big Dance is measured in inches, not feet, to quote famous ex-Portland radio "philosopher".

    Playing above the rim is the difference between a ref swallowing his whistle on a lay-in (KO vs. WSU) or placing a pass at a location where other's can't reach a quick dunk (WSU). The Zags have and had most pieces but lack people who can not only play above the rim, but do so while getting hit and muscled in the air.

    The NCAA's are ref'd in a manner that those who go for lay-ins will won't get calls and those who don't will get the calls.

    People forget how that '99 Zags team played above the rim when required and how physically and mentaly tough that team was. Certainly the younger crowd has.

    One may say that WSU out Calvary'd the Zags.

  21. #46
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    Default Don't be surprised if.....

    Sam Dower and Karnowski get in foul trouble.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by maynard g krebs View Post
    Interesting statement.
    Ah, sort of what I was thinking. Kinda like, water isn't wet.
    Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
    Mark Twain.

  23. #48
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    It really is interesting what we remember, and I am not young. I remember the '99 and 2000 teams and really good shooting teams. I remember all three of those guards shooting lights out behind the 3 pt line. I remember little ol Dan Dickau shooting lights out and earning 1st team All-American. I remember Adam Morrison doing the same thing Dan did. Derek Raivio was a pretty good 3 pt shooter too, and he put the team on his back and led the Zags to win one more conference championship the year Heytvelt was put on probation. I remember the '09 team had really good outside shooters with Downs, Bouldin, Gray and even Josh Heytvelt.

    And yes I do remember Casey Calvary, and I do remember him playing above the rim. Josh could play above the rim. You know, I think you are right, ZagaZags. I do think we need a player or two who can play above the rim. Let's hope we get Reid Travis and Boubacar Moungora. I think Jordon McLaughton would be a good get for someone who plays physically.
    Go Zags!!! The Best Is Yet To Come!!!

  24. #49
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    Default Reborn....

    Good thread. Nothing will surprise me, except NOT going to our 16th straight tournament!

    Overall we have a very good team again. Our team will be veteran and smarter. Mental mistakes, and finishing around the rim were the biggest problems last year, IMO. Having Adam Morrison nhelps our offense in a big way. Morrison's passion and emotion are the opposite of what the staff tends to project from the sidelines. Morrison knows exactly what happened against UCLA and he can help prevent such collapse from happening again.

    Look for Dranginis, Coleman and Nunez to benefit immediately from Ammo's tutelage. Not to mention Wiltjer. Imagine Wiltjer in 14-15 after spending his RS year in the weight room and with the same development plan Olynyk got from Few and Co. With Morrison offensively mentoring the team, I think we will be a scoring machine next year and for years to come.

    Now if we could just infuse the defensive genius of Stockton in each player, we would be a complete team at both ends of the court.

    Again, nothing will surprise me.
    “People can talk. People can speculate. These guys are hungry and they're ready to go." Mark Few

  25. #50
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    I feel VERRY good about this coming year. There is one heck of a lot of talent + experience on the Zag roster. The rest of the WCC will have its hands full! The one worry I have is GB's physical condition. I felt he kept getting better last year only to be hampered by not being on the floor due to injuries. If he's in top shape by game time - I see the Zags in the top 10 nationally.

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