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Thread: Good Programs Make Mistakes Too

  1. #1
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    Default Good Programs Make Mistakes Too

    Let me preempt this by saying that I love Gonzaga and Gonzaga basketball and my commitment to the school and the program is unwavering. I believe that most of our players play their hearts out when they step out on the court, and do a fine job of reprsenting the University.

    However, this blind Gonzaga holier than thou posting neeeds to stop. I cannot tolerate people saying that the Josh and Theo incident was isolated and shocking to the program. It was not that long ago we saw Tony Skinner fall into some legal trouble shortly after graduating. Before that we had a fake ID/urine sample incident which was followed by three players transferring out of the school. This does not even take into account the speculations of many incidents that happen around campus.

    Does this mean all the players are thugs or illegitimate students? No. Does it mean that the players are worse than the rest of the student body? Again, No. But we cannot simply ignore every incident and continue to call Gonzaga a model program that others should follow.

    This sort of behavior happens everywhere. Like many people said we are dealing with 18-22 year olds that in some cases possess an immortal larger than life attitude. Sometimes these students are shaped into great young men by their programs, but sometimes people fall through the cracks. We have seen it happen at big institutions like Colorado, Oklahoma, and UConn but we have also seen it happen at private schools like Baylor and Duke.

    As important as it is to recognize our accomplishments on and off the basketball floor. It is also important to recognize our mistakes and do our best to remedy them in the future.

    Irish

  2. #2
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    Default

    What's the purpose of this thread?


    And by the way, you know, when you're telling these little stories? Here's a good idea - have a POINT. It makes it SO much more interesting for the listener!
    If you can't handle the confusion, stay out of the Foo!

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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by UberZagFan View Post
    What's the purpose of this thread?
    Why try to hijack his thread on just the first reply? I think the purpose is..
    Quote Originally Posted by IrishZag View Post
    As important as it is to recognize our accomplishments on and off the basketball floor. It is also important to recognize our mistakes and do our best to remedy them in the future.
    Sometimes I get the feeling like some of the fans, and by clarification I'm not referring to Uber but back to the original "holier than thou" topic IrishZag mentioned, think GU is some magical place that is above the rest of the world. I would hate for the Gonzaga fan base to be perceived as arrogant or fans that 'think their **** don't stink'.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZagMania View Post
    Why try to hijack his thread on just the first reply? I think the purpose is..


    Sometimes I get the feeling like some of the fans, and by clarification I'm not referring to Uber but back to the original "holier than thou" topic IrishZag mentioned, think GU is some magical place that is above the rest of the world. I would hate for the Gonzaga fan base to be perceived as arrogant or fans that 'think their **** don't stink'.
    Okay then. First, my response was not an attempt to hijack this thread. The question is: Why post this now? And please point out to me all the threads in the last week or so where posters acted like GU is "holier than thou" or that GU has never made mistakes. Sure that may have been a topic two weeks ago, but what's the point of bringing it up now?

    More specifically, show me where "people [are] saying that the Josh and Theo incident was isolated and shocking to the program" on this board recently. Are we rehashing what was discussed two weeks ago? If so, for what purpose? With that said, I don't think IrishZag's post is a flame, but I do question its purpose considering any comments about the Josh/Theo incident have found there way to pages 9-10 of this board and beyond.

    Where's the "beat a dead horse" emoticon when I need it?

    *

    By the way, even after the Josh/Theo incident, if and when another GU player gets into a similar situation, I will still be shocked. Just like when someday my kid does something stupid I'll be shocked. And if it happens twice, I'll be shocked. Call me naive, if you like. I prefer to keep my expectations high.
    Last edited by UberZagFan; 03-02-2007 at 01:47 PM. Reason: To add the beat a dead horse icon--Thanks JL
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  5. #5

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    What I liked about GU (and convinced me to attend) was that it was "blue-collar" down-to-earth and casual; so I'm not sure how many actual real-life GU grads would have the attitude that it's a happy little wonderland... maybe fans who never went there may think that though.

  6. #6
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    Here ya go Uber.

    Use it liberally. I think I originally stole it from LIZF.



  7. #7
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    Alot of programs have alot of secrets most fans dont know about and will not beleive anyways. This is common knowledge.

    Gonzaga has been one the cleanest programs around.

    But things have changed slightly in the last 2 yrs....

    However I agree that this is not the ebst time to discuss this.

    Its WCCtourney time.

    go zags.

  8. #8
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    Sometimes I have trouble following the logic in the posts on this board. And here is an example:

    Alot of programs have alot of secrets most fans dont know about and will not beleive anyways. This is common knowledge.
    It is just going to take me a while to figure this out.

    It is commonly known that most people don't know secrets.
    Um . . . I guess this means that most people know that there are things they don't know.
    Maybe that makes sense, but then it doesn't tell us anything (other than to remind us that there are things we don't know - but we already know that because it is commonly known).

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by GU69 View Post
    Sometimes I have trouble following the logic in the posts on this board. And here is an example:



    It is just going to take me a while to figure this out.

    It is commonly known that most people don't know secrets.
    Um . . . I guess this means that most people know that there are things they don't know.
    Maybe that makes sense, but then it doesn't tell us anything (other than to remind us that there are things we don't know - but we already know that because it is commonly known).
    Best post of the week!

  10. #10
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    no further questions Your honour.

  11. #11

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    May!

    More unsubstantiated hints, allegations and rumors.

    Whee!

    Post some facts on how the "program has changed" or leave it alone.

    Seriously. If you're going to pretend to have the cojones to call someone out, call 'em out - by name, with the details. Don't be an "internet tough guy."

    Pathetic waste of bandwidth otherwise.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by You Reach I Teach View Post
    Gonzaga has been one the cleanest programs around.

    But things have changed slightly in the last 2 yrs....
    Really? What changed? Please explain - w/ names, dates, events, etc.

    (And the JH/TD Cheney thing can't be one of your examples. Otherwise I'l have to come back w/ my secret insider knowledge that Pendo has red hair. )

    Quote Originally Posted by You Reach I Teach View Post
    However I agree that this is not the ebst time to discuss this.

    Its WCCtourney time.

    go zags.
    Then why bring any of this up in the first place?
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by GU69 View Post
    Sometimes I have trouble following the logic in the posts on this board. And here is an example:



    It is just going to take me a while to figure this out.

    It is commonly known that most people don't know secrets.
    Um . . . I guess this means that most people know that there are things they don't know.
    Maybe that makes sense, but then it doesn't tell us anything (other than to remind us that there are things we don't know - but we already know that because it is commonly known).
    Spoken like a true member of 69.

  14. #14
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    Some Zag fans display a sanctomonious, holier than thou attitude; but It seems to be more a case of unrealistic expectations. Felony or not the crime was small and non violent. No women were raped, beaten, drug down the stairs by their hair or locked outside naked. No regular sized citizens were beaten up in or outside a bar. No one received any money from boosters.
    No one was even packing heat.
    Do you own a radar detector? You're probably a bigger menace than Josh.
    Would you welcome an audit from the IRS? We're at war. What kind of American are you? Everyone can be a sanctimonious jerk about something.
    Coach Few and the Zags may have taken some risk with a party guy but it has not yet proven to be a mistake. There has been some embarassment but no great fall from on high.

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