GU vs. SMC game in Spokane Arena

[ZagAddict]

Not really, but it wouldn't surprise me either. It seems like a growing trend that GU backs down and agrees to play just about any team in the Spokane Arena. I just hope I can count on N. Colorado and more Cal St. teams to visit the hostile confines of K2.

[sanfranzagsguy20]

why would we play a conference opponent in the arena?

you are talking about st. mary's right?

sorry but that my friend would never happen

[zagco]

Zagco has no issues playing Eastern and one other big nonconference game in the Arena. He likes it because it gives more fans a chance to see them play. Playing a conference game there instead of at K2, however, would be wrong on all levels, regardless of the national and local appeal of the game.

[ZagAddict]

Just kidding guys...

[GoZags22]

Not really, but it wouldn't surprise me either. It seems like a growing trend that GU backs down and agrees to play just about any team in the Spokane Arena. I just hope I can count on N. Colorado and more Cal St. teams to visit the hostile confines of K2.

Backs down? Do you really think any quality opponent will agree to come to Spokane and play in the MAC? If not for the Spokane Arena option, GU could never schedule a Memphis or Georgia. Those teams refuse to play at the MAC...do I really have to explain why?
People who complain about the GU home schedule have no clue about the business of Athletics. Good teams don't schedule games they are almost sure to lose (so give up the dream of Duke ever coming to the MAC). That is why the best GU can do is get the N. Colorado's and Northridge's (and even then they have to pay close to six figures in guarantee money), and hope for an occassional Utah (thanks to the personal relationship with Ray).

[GoZags]

It was a coup to get Virginia of the ACC and Stanford of the Pac 10 to come to K2 for a game.

There ARE more "coups" out there. It just takes time (the Zags were very, very close to one for this season that didn't pan out).

That being said -- the Arena is a great option for high level programs who WILL travel to play the Zags -- just not on campus.

[GoZags22]

It was a coup to get Virginia of the ACC and Stanford of the Pac 10 to come to K2 for a game.

There ARE more "coups" out there. It just takes time (the Zags were very, very close to one for this season that didn't pan out).

That being said -- the Arena is a great option for high level programs who WILL travel to play the Zags -- just not on campus.

What's team that GU was very, very close to getting this season?
Stanford was 100% because of College Gameday...

[GoZags]

Bama for one, and a couple of others that never made the board (think high profile Jesuit).

[CDC84]

Charity

Keep in mind that the Memphis game last year, the UGA game this year, and the Oklahoma game next year are charity games. More people in the seats means more money for Ronald McDonald House Charities.

I don't have issues with games being played in Spokane Arena so long as the return game is played at an off campus site as well. It must be an equal exchange. What I would get upset by is if Gonzaga agreed to play at some on campus site in return for a game at Spokane Arena. But GU's schedulers will not agree to such a thing. I am sure the folks at Tennessee would've liked for the Battle In Seattle game to be returned in Knoxville next year, but GU said Nashville only.

BTW....it looks like Gonzaga is going to get Illinois at K2 at some point in the future. The earliest would be 2009/10. If Gonzaga returns everyone next season, I am pretty optimistic about GU's chances of landing another ESPN college gameday.

[229SintoZag]

The arena is fine but...

Gonzaga has an obligation to its season ticket holders who donated to the ABPF and got the arena built. Part of that obligation is to bring in one or two quality OOC opponents a year for games. This season, Gonzaga failed to meet this obligation.

This year we have WSU and that is it--and WSU is not really a "get" so much as a "luck into" since we've been running that series since long before WSU was any good. Kind of one of those "a broken watch is right twice a day" type of things. If it wasn't for the job Tony Bennett ended up doing with his squad, we would have had no decent teams in K2 this year on our OOC.

Other than WSU, we have zero quality home games in K2 this year. For the fans who did nut up and put down money to build K2, this is disappointing.

Our schedule this year on paper is not bad with UConn, Texas Tech, Virginia Tech, Oklahoma, Tennessee, Memphis, Georgia, St. Joseph's and WSU.

The problem is that only WSU is played at K2. That's wrong.

The fact Virginia and Stanford came to K2 shows it can be done. I just think we need to make it more of a priority. It seems to me that it is always easy to just accept games like UConn this year on short notice at a neutral site to boost our RPI. I think a stronger push to get home and home series set up with quality programs long in advance is necessary. It appears we are headed that way with Illinois, and it sounds like we were close with Georgetown and with LSU.

There are teams who will play us and risk the loss, knowing that if nothing else it is a "good loss" if they lose and a very nice win if they win. We have moved beyond our WCC brethren. We are no longer eligible for the "mid major" top 10 for a reason. We have achieved a seat at the table of the perennial powers of college hoops. We need to start acting like it and start giving the fans a couple of good, high quality games every year (i.e., top 25 or top 10 caliber).

The memphis series is a good start. Hopefully we can work something out with Duke. I think we need to find another west coast team to get a series going with to replace UW. Stanford should be a top priority for this. If not them, UCLA or Cal or Arizona or even USC. Perhaps Arizona State now that Sendek is there. Who knows. The point is the Pac 10 has about 8 or 9 schools who should finish better than UW this year and my guess is we could set up something with one or two of them to get us some quality Pac 10 competition beyond WSU. A home and home would be much easier on one of these schools in terms of travel and scheduling than a home and home with a team from the east coast or the midwest. And we should push for more than just a two year deal, perhaps four or six. If we get that many hard dates on the calendar with a quality opponent, the greater the chance it develops into a sort of unofficial sem-rivalry, kind of like what happened with UW before their coach took his ball and went home. We were close with Stanford and I think we may have been more likely to keep on track with them if Trent Johnson had not taken over for Montgomery. But who knows. The point is: it can be done.

Coach Krause and whoever else is in charge: make it a priority and get it done. We didn't build K2 to host the Northern Colorados and Cal State Northridge's on our schedule.

[GoZags22]

Bama for one, and a couple of others that never made the board (think high profile Jesuit).

'Bama was a Battle in Seattle opponent, not a game in Spokane

[GoZags22]

Gonzaga has an obligation to its season ticket holders who donated to the ABPF and got the arena built. Part of that obligation is to bring in one or two quality OOC opponents a year for games. This season, Gonzaga failed to meet this obligation.

This year we have WSU and that is it--and WSU is not really a "get" so much as a "luck into" since we've been running that series since long before WSU was any good. Kind of one of those "a broken watch is right twice a day" type of things. If it wasn't for the job Tony Bennett ended up doing with his squad, we would have had no decent teams in K2 this year on our OOC.

Other than WSU, we have zero quality home games in K2 this year. For the fans who did nut up and put down money to build K2, this is disappointing.

Our schedule this year on paper is not bad with UConn, Texas Tech, Virginia Tech, Oklahoma, Tennessee, Memphis, Georgia, St. Joseph's and WSU.

The problem is that only WSU is played at K2. That's wrong.

The fact Virginia and Stanford came to K2 shows it can be done. I just think we need to make it more of a priority. It seems to me that it is always easy to just accept games like UConn this year on short notice at a neutral site to boost our RPI. I think a stronger push to get home and home series set up with quality programs long in advance is necessary. It appears we are headed that way with Illinois, and it sounds like we were close with Georgetown and with LSU.

There are teams who will play us and risk the loss, knowing that if nothing else it is a "good loss" if they lose and a very nice win if they win. We have moved beyond our WCC brethren. We are no longer eligible for the "mid major" top 10 for a reason. We have achieved a seat at the table of the perennial powers of college hoops. We need to start acting like it and start giving the fans a couple of good, high quality games every year (i.e., top 25 or top 10 caliber).

The memphis series is a good start. Hopefully we can work something out with Duke. I think we need to find another west coast team to get a series going with to replace UW. Stanford should be a top priority for this. If not them, UCLA or Cal or Arizona or even USC. Perhaps Arizona State now that Sendek is there. Who knows. The point is the Pac 10 has about 8 or 9 schools who should finish better than UW this year and my guess is we could set up something with one or two of them to get us some quality Pac 10 competition beyond WSU. A home and home would be much easier on one of these schools in terms of travel and scheduling than a home and home with a team from the east coast or the midwest. And we should push for more than just a two year deal, perhaps four or six. If we get that many hard dates on the calendar with a quality opponent, the greater the chance it develops into a sort of unofficial sem-rivalry, kind of like what happened with UW before their coach took his ball and went home. We were close with Stanford and I think we may have been more likely to keep on track with them if Trent Johnson had not taken over for Montgomery. But who knows. The point is: it can be done.

Coach Krause and whoever else is in charge: make it a priority and get it done. We didn't build K2 to host the Northern Colorados and Cal State Northridge's on our schedule.

Well, I don't remember being promised any obligations by Gonzaga when I bought my season tickets. Sounds more like you feel entitled to me.
I said it before, and I'll say it again: there is NO incentive for a good team to come here. No top-tier coach schedules with the words "bad loss" on his mind. You schedule the best you can based on who will play you, and what are your best chances of winning.
Look at Jerry Krause's and Mark Few's scheduling philosophy. Do you really think they aren't trying every possible trick to get a quality team to play them in the MAC? There is no incentive to come here when the odds are high that you will lose. Your rant makes Mark Few sound like Jim Boeheim or Lorenzo Romar...

[Spike94]

I am really not trying to be negative at all with this, but GU does have some obligation to get good teams. Now my question is this? How many home and homes have we turned down. Are we going to Northern Colorado? Northridge? I doubt it. I flew back from Seattle a couple of years ago and was talking to the Pacific coach. He told me that they wanted a Home and Home with GU but GU wouldn't go for it. Pacific had been good (not now) when they tried to get the home and home. So I guess what I am trying to say here is that GU has to take some risk too. Whose small arena are we going into? Yes St. Joes, but what else? It cuts both ways guys.

[229SintoZag]

One second here. Hold on.

Well, I don't remember being promised any obligations by Gonzaga when I bought my season tickets. Sounds more like you feel entitled to me.

I guess we have to agree to disagree here. The point of an upgrade of facilities was manifold, but one of the chief motivations was to make games at our campus more palatable to decent competition and to broadcasters. I agree there was no "promise" of any caliber of opponent, but I do not believe there has to be a promise for there to be an obligation. My parents never promised me they'd house, feed, and educate me growing up, but I am certainly glad they felt and met their sense of obligation in this regard, any lack of formal promises notwithstanding.

The administration came to the fans hat in hand and asked that we chip in and make minimum five-year commitments. Depending on where you sit, that commitment is either for a substantial sum or for a lesser sum. But the commitment had to be made for K2 to get built. I do not believe we are out of line in asking that all efforts be made to bring in decent teams to K2.

I said it before, and I'll say it again: there is NO incentive for a good team to come here. No top-tier coach schedules with the words "bad loss" on his mind. You schedule the best you can based on who will play you, and what are your best chances of winning.

I disagree, and here is why: for every Romar and Boeheim out there, there is also a Lute Olson, Coach K, and Roy Williams.

Take a look at Carolina's schedule this year, as just one example. Carolina plays the following games in its OOC:


at Ohio State
at Kentucky
at Penn
at Rutgers

UNC has no reason to play any of these four teams on their turf. But they do. Apparently Roy Williams--the one coach in Division 1 with a better wining percentage than Mark Few--disagrees with your conclusions on scheduling tough OOC opponents and going on the road to play them. So who knows better in this area--you or Roy Williams?

This is just one example. Look at Lute Olson's historical approach. He always plays a tough OOC slate. Including road games.

Look at Jerry Krause's and Mark Few's scheduling philosophy. Do you really think they aren't trying every possible trick to get a quality team to play them in the MAC? There is no incentive to come here when the odds are high that you will lose. Your rant makes Mark Few sound like Jim Boeheim or Lorenzo Romar...

No, my rant does nothing of the sort. Romar and Boeheim never leave their campus until conference season starts. Few has booked enough miles by January 1 to fly between here and the moon.

Now, as an interesting aside, let's consider your contention that there is nothing to be gained by playing a Gonzaga on the road if you are a BCS team. And let's use just the four coaches in this thread as examples.

Boeheim and Romar are chickens, who schedule nobody and stay home, by and large.

Roy Williams and Lute Olson are not. They are the opposite, and always have been (including Williams's stint at Kansas).

Interestingly, both UW and Syracuse have missed the NCAA tournament recently in years when their OOC scheduling was atrocious. And both have also missed even making the NIT.

Meanwhile, please count up the number of times a Lute Olson or Roy Williams team missed the NCAA tournament in the past 25 years. (Hint: Arizona has made it 24 years and running, and I am Williams has very similar success). Could it be that playing tough teams, including games on the road, not only helps teams build a resume and an RPI, but it also helps make them tougher and better able to compete in their conference season?

This above all is why a lot of teams do and will want to play Gonzaga.

As for Krause and Few, My criticism is not that these guys aren't trying. I am sure they are. My criticism is that they were not successful this season. Before, they were. We had St. Joe's come to K1 back when they were a top team with Jameer Nelson leading them to a New Year's eve victory. We had Stanford here for Gameday. We had Virginia here on our campus. Those were successes.

But this year, for whatever reason, that didn't happen. It sounds like we were close. But it didn't happen.

My point is we need to be more proactive about setting up the marquee games longer in advance. And we need more than one or two year commitments. Memphis is about right (though their refusal to play on campus is not acceptable, especially since they need us as much as we need them). Stanford was a good run for four out of five years or so. We need to set up more of those types of home and homes and do it long in advance, not ad hoc year-by-year.

And one final thought: ESPN owes us after the ESPN360 debacle in Alaska and after the ESNPU debacle with WSU. We need to pressure Katz and the others there to make a Gameday push and more to make things happen in our OOC.

[GoZags22]

I guess we have to agree to disagree here. The point of an upgrade of facilities was manifold, but one of the chief motivations was to make games at our campus more palatable to decent competition and to broadcasters. I agree there was no "promise" of any caliber of opponent, but I do not believe there has to be a promise for there to be an obligation. My parents never promised me they'd house, feed, and educate me growing up, but I am certainly glad they felt and met their sense of obligation in this regard, any lack of formal promises notwithstanding.

The administration came to the fans hat in hand and asked that we chip in and make minimum five-year commitments. Depending on where you sit, that commitment is either for a substantial sum or for a lesser sum. But the commitment had to be made for K2 to get built. I do not believe we are out of line in asking that all efforts be made to bring in decent teams to K2.



I disagree, and here is why: for every Romar and Boeheim out there, there is also a Lute Olson, Coach K, and Roy Williams.

Take a look at Carolina's schedule this year, as just one example. Carolina plays the following games in its OOC:


at Ohio State
at Kentucky
at Penn
at Rutgers

UNC has no reason to play any of these four teams on their turf. But they do. Apparently Roy Williams--the one coach in Division 1 with a better wining percentage than Mark Few--disagrees with your conclusions on scheduling tough OOC opponents and going on the road to play them. So who knows better in this area--you or Roy Williams?

This is just one example. Look at Lute Olson's historical approach. He always plays a tough OOC slate. Including road games.





No, my rant does nothing of the sort. Romar and Boeheim never leave their campus until conference season starts. Few has booked enough miles by January 1 to fly between here and the moon.

Now, as an interesting aside, let's consider your contention that there is nothing to be gained by playing a Gonzaga on the road if you are a BCS team. And let's use just the four coaches in this thread as examples.

Boeheim and Romar are chickens, who schedule nobody and stay home, by and large.

Roy Williams and Lute Olson are not. They are the opposite, and always have been (including Williams's stint at Kansas).

Interestingly, both UW and Syracuse have missed the NCAA tournament recently in years when their OOC scheduling was atrocious. And both have also missed even making the NIT.

Meanwhile, please count up the number of times a Lute Olson or Roy Williams team missed the NCAA tournament in the past 25 years. (Hint: Arizona has made it 24 years and running, and I am Williams has very similar success). Could it be that playing tough teams, including games on the road, not only helps teams build a resume and an RPI, but it also helps make them tougher and better able to compete in their conference season?

This above all is why a lot of teams do and will want to play Gonzaga.

As for Krause and Few, My criticism is not that these guys aren't trying. I am sure they are. My criticism is that they were not successful this season. Before, they were. We had St. Joe's come to K1 back when they were a top team with Jameer Nelson leading them to a New Year's eve victory. We had Stanford here for Gameday. We had Virginia here on our campus. Those were successes.

But this year, for whatever reason, that didn't happen. It sounds like we were close. But it didn't happen.

My point is we need to be more proactive about setting up the marquee games longer in advance. And we need more than one or two year commitments. Memphis is about right (though their refusal to play on campus is not acceptable, especially since they need us as much as we need them). Stanford was a good run for four out of five years or so. We need to set up more of those types of home and homes and do it long in advance, not ad hoc year-by-year.

And one final thought: ESPN owes us after the ESPN360 debacle in Alaska and after the ESNPU debacle with WSU. We need to pressure Katz and the others there to make a Gameday push and more to make things happen in our OOC.

Good, long retort. We will agree to disagree. I believe Gonzaga is obligated to advance Gonzaga and it's mission by all means necessary, including Men's Basketball. Why is it that everyone feels so entitled and owed so much by Gonzaga? Because we chose to buy season tickets? Let's not pretend like we all gave out of the goodness of our hearts. They call them "donations", but they are required donations that we pay because we have to to get our season tickets. I donote well beyond the requirements, and perhaps so do you, but I do not do it with strings attached.
We disagree, because you feel Gonzaga owes you something because you're a fan, or because YOU chose to buy season tickets and be a part of GU.
I am thankful Gonzaga does things the right way, and that I am able to be a part of it. All Gonzaga owes me is a committment to keep trying to be the best it can be. And they're doing it year in and year out. And I, for one, am not complaining.

As for the scheduling, we will definitely continue to disagree. You lost me with all the info, but it sounds to me that you think it's this simple thing. Just get teams to come play us in the MAC...
Coaches are getting fired at an unprecedented pace. You don't go to the NCAA Tournament and keep your job by traveling to (almost) definite losses. I never said it's noble to schedule like this and have no guts (your insinuation that this is "my" conclusion, Roy Williams knows more than me, etc...is silly). I don't like it, and am glad the Zags DO NOT schedule that way. BUT it is the state of the sport. And the few coaches that will play anyone, anywhere (like Mark)....they are few (no pun intended) and far between. And I will be excited when GU can make the stars align and work something out with these teams. But in the meantime, I am not going to complain and act as though I am not receiving what I am entitled to.