PDA

View Full Version : I dont want to jump the gun but.....



pbriz
12-10-2007, 11:13 AM
With Heytvelt's injury and Pargo's lack of another big "jump," perhaps we will only lose Kuso and Pendo next year.

Can you imagine Sacre w/ a complete skill package, Heytvelt, Daye, Downs, Bouldin, and Pargo back for another year.....

That team would be scary good.... alot like teams that are stacked such as Memphis this year, Florida last year, UNC in 2005 and the Michigan Fab 5. (Yes, that good!)

I am not gonna count this year out by any means because I think that final four is still in our grasp but if those guys stayed...... watch out.

zagsballer
12-10-2007, 11:28 AM
Yep. At the beginning of the year with the strong starts (all be it against weaker teams) I was concerned about Pargo and Daye's futures. I thought with a good year Pargo would be gone, and with a great year Daye would be gone.

Its not to late to rule out good and great years for these two, but it seemed much more realistic at first. Pargo will still be thinking about it at year's end, hopefully big bro can help aid in that decision. Daye hopefully realizes that he needs the offseason and next year to work on his size and strength. Could you imagine Daye in the pros with his current body? Teshaun Prince is one of only a few that succesfully do it.

JAGzag
12-10-2007, 11:43 AM
I was thinking the same thing. Pargo is a ways off from making that jump and Josh isn't going anywhere next year. If Sacre and Daye continue to develop ... wow. But back to this year!!!

UberZagFan
12-10-2007, 11:45 AM
One reason why it would be smart for Pargo to return for his senior year is that this year's draft will be filled with several top-level PGs.

pbriz
12-10-2007, 11:51 AM
One reason why it would be smart for Pargo to return for his senior year is that this year's draft will be filled with several top-level PGs.

didnt even think of that but very good point.

Zagnailler
12-10-2007, 11:53 AM
I'm afraid that is jumping the gun 'cause what happens if the Zags win it all this year?

pbriz
12-10-2007, 12:01 PM
I'm afraid that is jumping the gun 'cause what happens if the Zags win it all this year?

I recall a team last year that won it two years in a row....

:D

cggonzaga
12-10-2007, 12:11 PM
Not to put a damper on things but with the players we have coming in next year (3 more scholarships) some people are going to have to leave.

Zagnailler
12-10-2007, 12:16 PM
Thats what I'm talkin' about pbriz!:D

zagfan07
12-10-2007, 12:21 PM
Not to put a damper on things but with the players we have coming in next year (3 more scholarships) some people are going to have to leave.

Pendo, Kuso and Sorenson. Pontarolo-Maag will be done with his redshirt and will take Sorenson's spot and I would guess the three new-comers will fight for 2 roster spots with the loser red-shirting a year.

UberZagFan
12-10-2007, 12:29 PM
Pendo, Kuso and Sorenson. Pontarolo-Maag will be done with his redshirt and will take Sorenson's spot and I would guess the three new-comers will fight for 2 roster spots with the loser red-shirting a year.

That's not exactly the way it works.

FlyZag
12-10-2007, 12:35 PM
Pendo, Kuso and Sorenson. Pontarolo-Maag will be done with his redshirt and will take Sorenson's spot and I would guess the three new-comers will fight for 2 roster spots with the loser red-shirting a year.

I could be wrong... but I believe that red-shirting or not, you use a scholarship. By redshirting, the player doesn't lose a year of eligibility but the school loses (uses) one of it's allotted scholarships.

I know this was the case back in the day when I was on scholarship. Our team only had so many scholarships to give out... and I know when I redshirted, the team didn't get an "extra" to replace me.

zagfan07
12-10-2007, 12:44 PM
I was just thinking about numbers, not scholarships. I would assume Ponatrolo and Sorenson aren't on scholarship. But that leaves one extra player on scholarship. Foster might be the next big man that couldn't make it, or who knows, maybe Theo won't be back. I would love to see someone give up their scholarship if it comes to it. Like Rochestie did for WSU.

zag944
12-10-2007, 01:05 PM
The thing about college basketball is that a team is measured by their performance in a single elimination tournament at the end. Usually about a third of the field has a realistic shot at winning the title (in my mind), and I typically think we are among that field. I think that we are good enough to be at that level THIS year, and I think we will be next year.

I try not to put too much on paper. There is a lot more dependence on seeding, hot hands, and perhaps luck then there is on experience in my eyes. The '03 team that lost to Arizona looked much better in the March Madness tourney than the more experienced teams before and after it, for example.

Personally, Im just glad that we have a good chance to be in the mix this year, and that our program can say that more often then not (and more often then almost every other team!).

cjm720
12-10-2007, 01:25 PM
With Theo in limbo, there may be another scholarship available soon.

Also, this likely deserves another thread but all this Final 4 talk is a bit premature. With a healthy (body and mind) Heytvelt, perhaps a deep run is possible. The Final 4 is very unlikely with all the talented teams out there (NC, Memphis, UCLA, GEORGETOWN, etc.) NEXT YEAR is very very possible, assuming we only lose Pendo and Kuso. We will have 3 senior starters and serious depth and talent. This year's a bit of stretch but I'll still be hoping!!!! GO ZAGS.

rennis
12-10-2007, 01:34 PM
With Theo in limbo, there may be another scholarship available soon.

Also, this likely deserves another thread but all this Final 4 talk is a bit premature. With a healthy (body and mind) Heytvelt, perhaps a deep run is possible. The Final 4 is very unlikely with all the talented teams out there (NC, Memphis, UCLA, GEORGETOWN, etc.) NEXT YEAR is very very possible, assuming we only lose Pendo and Kuso. We will have 3 senior starters and serious depth and talent. This year's a bit of stretch but I'll still be hoping!!!! GO ZAGS.


agreed. It's still too early to tell this year, but if everyone returned next year I'd have to say that based on talent we'd have our best shot at the Final Four since 2004...when we blew it. Still probably my favorite team since 1999 even with the flame-out against Nevada though.

Either way, I love the team this year and will love it next year even if someone jumps early. I really do hope they all stay though.

FrosTbear
12-10-2007, 01:38 PM
Here is another view-Josh has missed many games last year and nothing but practice this year and he isn't due back until the Battle in Seattle and only for limited duty(maybe 6 minutes). It will take at least 2-3 weeks to get his basketball legs back so he is now in league play (weaker teams except SM#24) and Memphis so the NBA will not be that excited unless JOSH has 14+ games that are GIANT and that doesn't seem fair so it might not be in Josh's best interest to think about moving on this year.

thickman1
12-10-2007, 02:50 PM
I think it'd be a huge mistake for Austin to turn pro. He needs at least one more season if not two. He is clearly lacking a physical presence and he tends to let his emotions get the best of him - at least that is what comes through my TV.

CDC84
12-10-2007, 05:43 PM
It is in the best interest of every player on this team to return next season and not bolt for the draft. Heytvelt, Daye, Pargo, everyone. The 2008 draft is going to be stacked, and GU's players have nothing to lose and everything to gain by sticking around.

The Zags would likely be a preseason top 5 team and a major threat to win the whole ball of wax next year if everyone returned.

MedZag
12-10-2007, 06:48 PM
It is in the best interest of every player on this team to return next season and not bolt for the draft. Heytvelt, Daye, Pargo, everyone. The 2008 draft is going to be stacked, and GU's players have nothing to lose and everything to gain by sticking around.

The Zags would likely be a preseason top 5 team and a major threat to win the whole ball of wax next year if everyone returned.

I completely echo these sentiments.

I think of all of them Pargo was the biggest threat to leave after this year, and I'm sure he knows the year he's having so far won't land him in the first round (or probably even second). His brother will make sure he realizes that. A lot of players leave to early or make mistakes in the decision making process due to a lack of experience and familiarity with the professional game. Jeremy has seen Jannero do it all the hard way battling his way up from NBDL.

Daye won't be leaving unless he blows up in the tourney and his stock skyrockets (and considering the tourney often exhibits more physical play that works to his disadvantage I'm not so sure that will happen).

No way Heytvelt leaves after this year if there's a sane brain cell in his head. Missing the more important half of the season (to NBA scouts) doesn't help his draft stock. He'd be drafted solely on upside, and in a loaded draft like this year that won't help him much if at all.

Then again, I may be biased because I'd love to see that roster next year.

zagco
12-10-2007, 07:25 PM
Zagco has not seen Heytvelt actually PLAY enough in his career to get a good feeling as to whether he is NBA caliber. He's HEARD a lot about him being a sure Lottery pick and NBA superstar, but he just hasn't seen the dude actually play the game enough to get a good feeling.

Dickau43
12-10-2007, 08:17 PM
I think we'll miss Pendo next year A LOT more than people are anticipating. He's so incredibly valuable to this team in every way.

rawkmandale
12-10-2007, 08:29 PM
Finally an insightful post. "Only losing Pendo" practically guarantees 3 losses all by itself, due to loss of consistency and stability. The athletic returnees will be very capable of winning by 20 points 4 games out of 5, and unexpectedly losing the next game by 5 points when the rhythm wheels fall off. That is what "athletic" teams do. Consistent winners have consistent players. So far this year, that is Pendo and Micah. Micah still gets upset on occasion, so stable old Pendo is going to be missed far more than most of you realize.

cbbfanatic
12-10-2007, 08:58 PM
so if all these guys come back (as they should), who leaves/is shown the door?

its an important issue, and one that shouldnt be overlooked. dangerous territory, promising more scholarships than one has...

tyra
12-10-2007, 09:21 PM
We were in the same position last year when we had more schollies that slots. It eventually meant that Burgess and PMac were leaving. I suspect the coaches have a plan in mind.

Nevtelen
12-10-2007, 09:36 PM
Depending on how Theo's situation works out, the issue is already solved. That is not to say that's how I would like it to work out - that is a horrible way for the team to have a free scholarship - but that would be one way the situation could unfold.

zagfan07
12-11-2007, 07:23 AM
I think we'll miss Pendo next year A LOT more than people are anticipating. He's so incredibly valuable to this team in every way.

I'm not bashing Pendo at all, I love the guy. But Downs has shown this year his willingness to take on that type of role. Although he may not be as gutsy as Pendo, he is our leading rebounder this year and is playing excellent defense as well. If he keeps improving the way he has I think he'll be able to fill that role nicely. Pendo will be missed for his leadership qualities, but next years team will have plenty of experienced leaders to fill that void as well.

MickMick
12-11-2007, 08:04 AM
.
The Zags would likely be a preseason top 5 team and a major threat to win the whole ball of wax next year if everyone returned.

On paper the team looks good. I have not seen the slightest hint of final four caliber play from the team. I don't know if I can anticipate they will improve to that level either. They have too many areas that need improvement before I think of them as top 5.

CDC84
12-11-2007, 08:51 AM
On paper the team looks good. I have not seen the slightest hint of final four caliber play from the team. I don't know if I can anticipate they will improve to that level either. They have too many areas that need improvement before I think of them as top 5.

That's why I am talking about next year, not this year. I still think we need to see how this year's team looks after Josh and Gray get on board, but I can understand the argument from those who say the team is possibly one year away from potential greatness.

Next season, if Sacre and Daye improve as I think they will (Sacre with his offensive skills, Daye with weight room work), and if everyone returns and the team manages to stay healthy (not a given), and if all of the guys leave for the 2008 draft from schools such as Kansas, UNC, UCLA, etc., that I think will leave, I honestly cannot think of many if any college teams that will have Gonzaga's combination of talent and experience next season. There will be teams that have one or the other, but the Zags will have both.

I said this when Daye signed on the dotted line awhile back.....by the time he hits WCC play next season, I feel he will start to become a dominant player at the college level against any competition he faces.

The 2008/09 team, if everyone returns and stays reasonably healthy, would be the kind of team that I would expect to make the final 4, and if they didn't, it would be a huge disappointment. They would be the first GU team I have ever had these feelings for. I am not sure if Gonzaga will ever field a team that's better than what next year's team could look like.....that is, unless they are able to do something big time in the NCAA's next season which might allow GU to upgrade their recruiting to an even higher level.

But 2008/09 is a long time from now, and all of the pieces need to fall in place (such as getting all of GU's players to return next season) before I can get too serious about next season's potential.

GonzagasaurusFlex
12-11-2007, 09:21 AM
WHAT IF: This team catches a tune and dances all the way to a Monday night championship game led by stellar performances from Pargo and Heytvelt. The madness leads both Jeremy and Josh to parlay this dance into a 1st round draft pick.

Would that scenario work for you guys?

BobZag
12-11-2007, 09:25 AM
If Rivals' Jerry Meyer is correct in his comparison of Grant Gibbs to Maryland's Eric Hayes, one can assume Gibbs will be a cog on next year's team. I watched the Terps barely lose to BC and I loved Hayes' game, he almost pulled it out. If Gibbs is similar to Hayes, he'll help next year.

pbriz
12-11-2007, 09:28 AM
If Rivals' Jerry Meyer is correct in his comparison of Grant Gibbs to Maryland's Eric Hayes, one can assume Gibbs will be a cog on next year's team. I watched the Terps barely lose to BC and I loved Hayes' game, he almost pulled it out. If Gibbs is similar to Hayes, he'll help next year.

Also on Gibbs, from all the youtube videos I have watched Gibbs really has a silent confidence about him that I think he will carry into the college game. That confidence is usually what holds back Freshmen their first year.

BobZag
12-11-2007, 10:42 AM
WHAT IF: This team catches a tune and dances all the way to a Monday night championship game led by stellar performances from Pargo and Heytvelt. The madness leads both Jeremy and Josh to parlay this dance into a 1st round draft pick.

Would that scenario work for you guys?

Well, we'd all just have to suffer with that scenario. :D

And Gibbs and Goodson help Bouldin and Gray take over for Pargo while Jeff Taylor helps our bigs and wings make up for Josh. Poling could redshirt.