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bigjeep
11-21-2007, 12:20 PM
A question I`ve been meaning to ask you guys. Is it a struggle for Gonzaga to get bcs teams to play you at home? We have Nebraska this yr; was supposed to have Georgia but they opted out till next. The only reason we have Georgia at all is our AD put a clause on Felton`s contract that if he left WKU for a BCS team they had to play us 4 home and home in 5 yrs; but back to the question; I think I read where you guys have to play some teams away from your home arena as we do...Our home away from home is the Summit in Nashville; 60 miles away from Diddle Arena. That`s where we have to play Tenn this yr. I think our arena`s are about the same capasity? Diddle is 7,500; 8 if the fire marshall isn`t looking...

My home boys on the haven mostly agree when asked who we`d love to start a home and home with...the Zags, Butler, Xavier are some that tops the list. pee on the bcs primadonna`s...think there would ever be the possibility of a home and home; true home and home between the Zags and Tops?

Anyway, best of luck to you guys in the Alaska Shootout. For you guys looking for a bar to watch the game...please drive home safely...third place is nothing to be ashamed of...:p

MickMick
11-21-2007, 12:32 PM
People call home different things. Season ticket holders might complain that Zags can't get "name" teams to travel. The real complaint is that they can't get them on campus. If you can get the likes of UConn, Tennessee, Virginia, Georgia, Oklahoma State, etc. to travel across the country (many times 3000 miles +) to play in a Washington State venue ("supposed nuetral site"), then your team has some scheduling clout.

Butler Guy
11-21-2007, 12:47 PM
that Butler would do a home-and-home series with the Zags, and just schedule another odd game out there as well. (Washington St, Washington, etc) I said this last summer, but if someone in the athletic department reads this, they should call Butler's AD Barry Collier. I am sure he'd like a series with Gonzaga, it only makes sense the schools/teams are so similar.

You'd get to play here:

http://vmedia.rivals.com/UserMedia/FanPagesPhoto/Gallery/808/O96534.jpg

drnoe
11-21-2007, 01:14 PM
Butler would do a home-and-home series with the Zags

I'd love to see that happen...Bulldog Mania!

former1dog
11-21-2007, 01:15 PM
I'd love to see that happen...Bulldog Mania!

Ditto.

I have a feeling that after this year there is going to be some media interest in this match up as well. Of course, it could be the office party wine talking. :D

bigjeep
11-21-2007, 01:17 PM
that Butler would do a home-and-home series with the Zags, and just schedule another odd game out there as well. (Washington St, Washington, etc) I said this last summer, but if someone in the athletic department reads this, they should call Butler's AD Barry Collier. I am sure he'd like a series with Gonzaga, it only makes sense the schools/teams are so similar.

You'd get to play here:

http://vmedia.rivals.com/UserMedia/FanPagesPhoto/Gallery/808/O96534.jpg

Man, I love that place...

Symi81
11-21-2007, 01:18 PM
Beautiful basketball facility!!!

bigjeep
11-21-2007, 01:22 PM
People call home different things. Season ticket holders might complain that Zags can't get "name" teams to travel. The real complaint is that they can't get them on campus. If you can get the likes of UConn, Tennessee, Virginia, Georgia, Oklahoma State, etc. to travel across the country (many times 3000 miles +) to play in a Washington State venue ("supposed nuetral site"), then your team has some scheduling clout.


The bcs bunch won`t play you at your place because, God forbid, they stand a better chance of looseing. Write your AD and force more games with the likes of Butler and WKU...Our AD, and our President, actually listens to their contributers...

Zag By the Bay
11-21-2007, 01:39 PM
I don't think GU has a burning desire to schedule the Butlers, Xaiver, Western Kentucky etc. Why would we if we can get a Duke, North Carolina, Virgina, Maryland, Oklahoma, Georgia, Tennessee etc...Like it or not, money and tv contracts pay a factor in the schedule. Having a Butler or Western Kentucky on the schedule is not very appealing to the bottom line. Let's face it, right now the Zags will sell out the MAC no matter who the opponent is. But if we travel to Indiana to play Butler how does that help GU's bottom line? Butler is not going to split the gate with us. Besides that is what the "Bracket Busters" tourney is for no?

ZagnetitForce
11-21-2007, 01:46 PM
I don't think GU has a burning desire to schedule the Butlers, Xaiver, Western Kentucky etc. Why would we if we can get a Duke, North Carolina, Virgina, Maryland, Oklahoma, Georgia, Tennessee etc...Like it or not, money and tv contracts pay a factor in the schedule. Having a Butler or Western Kentucky on the schedule is not very appealing to the bottom line. Let's face it, right now the Zags will sell out the MAC no matter who the opponent is. But if we travel to Indiana to play Butler how does that help GU's bottom line? Butler is not going to split the gate with us. Besides that is what the "Bracket Busters" tourney is for no?

I don't know why but I just SO disagree with your take on who the Zags want and should play. They absolutely should be playing the Butlers and the sort. The BCS guys will come around here and there as well but seems like having games like those they would get against Butler would be great for years to come.

Zag By the Bay
11-21-2007, 02:11 PM
I don't know why but I just SO disagree with your take on who the Zags want and should play. They absolutely should be playing the Butlers and the sort. The BCS guys will come around here and there as well but seems like having games like those they would get against Butler would be great for years to come.

How does it help the Zags' bottom line to play Butler, Western Kentucky etc in a home and home schedule?
How does playing Butler, Western Kentucky etc on a yearly basis help our recruiting?
Teams like Butler, Western Kentucky need us more than we need them. I know that sounds arrogant, but it not like we have BCS type teams knocking down our door to play us.
The entire Gonzaga program starting with the administration and ending with the players has had to work very hard to get recognition we now have. Playing the likes of a Butler, Western Kentucky Xaiver etc every year is not going improve the bottom line or our recruiting.
Like I said before, the MAC will sell out no matter who we play right now, there is no gain for GU to travel to Indiana to play Butler every other year.

lothar98zag
11-21-2007, 02:16 PM
You'd get to play here:

http://vmedia.rivals.com/UserMedia/FanPagesPhoto/Gallery/808/O96534.jpg






Hoosiers!





http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8d/Hoosiers_movie_poster_copyright_fairuse.jpg

ZagFanatic
11-21-2007, 02:23 PM
There's a lot more to consider than just the bottom line (i.e. fiscal income). That's only one piece of the equation. If that was all there was to consider, there would be no point in having an out-of-conference home (i.e. GU campus) schedule at all; but rather only go to Seattle, Oklahoma City, NY, etc. to play bigger programs and split gate receipts. That message says "screw the fans, recruits' perceptions, national media/programs perceptions, etc. - we're just after the dollars".

Zag By the Bay
11-21-2007, 02:55 PM
That message says "screw the fans, recruits' perceptions, national media/programs perceptions, etc. - we're just after the dollars".

I am not sure that is the message at all, but to dismiss that money is not a big factor in our decision to play big time programs like Duke, North Carolina Tenessee etc. What part are you not understanding....The Zags will continue to sell out the MAC, the Battle in Seattle, the Spokane Areana if we continue to have winning seasons and year after year play in the NCAA tourney.
What is the major benefit of playing the likes of Butler, Western Kentucky in a home and home series?
It actually may hurt us more than it helps to be honest.
A close loss to a Duke is much better for our program than a possible 10-point win over a Butler.

lothar98zag
11-21-2007, 03:04 PM
I don't think GU has a burning desire to schedule the Butlers, Xaiver, Western Kentucky etc. Why would we if we can get a Duke, North Carolina, Virgina, Maryland, Oklahoma, Georgia, Tennessee etc...Like it or not, money and tv contracts pay a factor in the schedule. Having a Butler or Western Kentucky on the schedule is not very appealing to the bottom line. Let's face it, right now the Zags will sell out the MAC no matter who the opponent is. But if we travel to Indiana to play Butler how does that help GU's bottom line? Butler is not going to split the gate with us. Besides that is what the "Bracket Busters" tourney is for no?
Like it or not this is basically where GU is @ regarding their OCC scheduling.

"Anyone, Any Time, Anywhere" doesn't apply literally anymore.

ZagnetitForce
11-21-2007, 03:05 PM
I guess I don't think those games "hurt" the Zags. Teams like Butler should have pretty strong teams every year so a lose here and there won't kill the RPI. PLus, there may actually be years when the Zags may hurt their RPI's. Also, thinking not too far back when the Zags couldn't get anybody to come. Perhaps it's keeping the any body any time any place moto alive. Those games would also provide some nice challanging away games to help prepare for the tourney as well as provide home fans a good game to see. I think a home and home with Butler would still be better than a home only with a UC Riverside right?

bigjeep
11-21-2007, 03:14 PM
hum, I`m disappointed...looks like the Zags are bcs pimps too...

Psychozag
11-21-2007, 04:22 PM
A ten point win over Butler...seems to me that they beat us by about ten last year. How quickly we forget.

Zag By the Bay
11-21-2007, 05:44 PM
I guess I don't think those games "hurt" the Zags. Teams like Butler should have pretty strong teams every year so a lose here and there won't kill the RPI. PLus, there may actually be years when the Zags may hurt their RPI's. Also, thinking not too far back when the Zags couldn't get anybody to come. Perhaps it's keeping the any body any time any place moto alive. Those games would also provide some nice challanging away games to help prepare for the tourney as well as provide home fans a good game to see. I think a home and home with Butler would still be better than a home only with a UC Riverside right?

You are entitled to your opinion about how it would affect the Zags...I am cool with that, but I respectively disagree with you and believe that the home and home series would benefit a Butler or Western Kentucky much more than it would GU. I do agree that playing Butler at home instead of UC Riverside is a far more entertaining game for the fans...





A ten point win over Butler...seems to me that they beat us by about ten last year. How quickly we forget.

No one forgot the Butler loss....what is the point of the post? I guess you also think that we should also try to schedule the Butlers, Western Kentuckys
Xaivers every year instead of going after big boys. IMO it is far more fun to be the giant slayer in non-conference games than be the giant being slayed.

CDC84
11-21-2007, 06:03 PM
As for me, I have always been in favor of GU scheduling a yearly game between another good team outside of the BCS leagues besides just Memphis. It would be beneficial for Gonzaga because:

1) The non-BCS schools generally maintain rosters and aren't gutted with NBA departures. It's easier to project how teams will be a couple of years from now.

2) It guarantees that Gonzaga would host a quality team at K2 every other year.

3) While non-BCS teams like Butler and WKU are certainly good on their own, they would still generally give Gonzaga a different "look" than what they would get if they only played UConn/UNC type teams. The more different types of good teams that GU plays, the better it is for them in the long haul.

It's just one game on the non-league sked. I think there is a way of working this out without Gonzaga having to sacrifice all of the usual BCS heavy hitters they face. Also, I would have to believe if Gonzaga played at Southern Illinois this December, for example, one of the ESPN channels would pick the game up in a heartbeat.

Nevtelen
11-21-2007, 06:46 PM
I wonder after the St Joe's home-and-home contract is done after this season if GU will pick up another tough mid-major. I think the St Joe's games have been really great and, while I don't specifically care if we continue to play St Joe's, another home-and-home with a quality mid-major team would be great - especially because a lot of the OOC sched is supposed to prepare us for March. How many tough, league champion, cohesive mid-major squads are there in the dance? The chances are decent that GU will see one, especially if we continue to be seeded well. The Butlers and WKUs and Xaviers of the world help prepare for that type of game.

Plus, the actual home-and-home instead of neutral-neutral is nice. I'd be all for it. I would really like to see Gu schedule either Xavier or Butler, actually (sorry bigjeep et al). Heck, we could combine the Indiana swing with a game against DePaul or Ill-Chicago and give Pargo a home game next year if he's still around.

Zag By the Bay
11-21-2007, 07:37 PM
All I am saying that we should set the bar higher and try to play the ACC opponents like Virginia or Maryland in home and home series instead of the Butlers of the world.
Who cares if we play a big-time program on a neutral court?
The NCAA tourney is played at neutral sites for all the teams, so why should GU set their sites on a home and home series with a mid major team like St. Joes, Butler etc, when we should be trying to land a Big Ten, Big East or ACC team in a home and home series.
IMO the pros out weigh the cons in scheduling a mid-major program.
If we are fortunate to knock off one or two of the big time programs on a neutral court that would pay off huge dividends for our chances in to make the NCAA tourney if we have an "off" year in the WCC.
Can't say that a win over a mid major team would pay the same dividends for us if we have an "off" year in the WCC.
Happy Thanksgiving to all Zag fans it always fun to have spirited debates!

CDC84
11-21-2007, 09:56 PM
The game at St. Joe's this year is a return game for the one that was played at K2 a couple of years ago.

The GU/St. Joe's games have certainly been enjoyable and competitive. I expect that the one next Thursday night will provide some nice entertainment as well. That crackerbox gym will be packed to the max. It will serve as a good intro to GU's freshmen and Ira about how conference road games will feel like this season.

ZagsGoZags
11-21-2007, 11:46 PM
one of the problems in scheduling is that some of the commitments have to be made so far in advance that we cannot be sure that team will be ranked by the time we play them
who would have thought Connecticut would not be in the top 25, etc
I like the idea of spacing out a few Big opponents each year, rather than last year when we had too many in a row.
And I think our team will be better this year than last, and that last year's team was not as good as the year before
Maybe this year's team, next years, and Adam and JP Batista's teams could have handled the rough schedule last year with more wins
I am sure that getting schedule sorted out is a whole chess game in itself

GoZags
11-22-2007, 06:16 AM
GU typically plays home and home against "like minded" schools. In recent years, the Zags have had series with Tulsa, St. Louis, St. Joseph's (2x), Memphis (2x).

I do not see that ending.

Look for either a) a renewal of the St. Joe's home and home or b) a new -- top quality non BCS home and home involving a Western Kentucky type, Butler type, or Xavier type. Any of these opponents would be perfect for the Zags (perhaps X moreso due to the Jesuit affiliation) That's my opinion.

mgadfly
11-22-2007, 08:07 AM
hum, I`m disappointed...looks like the Zags are bcs pimps too...

The Zags have to schedule bcs teams, as will Western Kentucky if they ever want the ESPN exposure to get into every recruits living room or the RPI to drop the conference tourney final and still get an at-large bid. It'd be awesome if the good mid-majors could just play each other in the non-conference games but it would quickly become a formula that destroyed the programs. What makes mid-majors great and gets them exposure is going out on the road and beating up BCS Goliaths; not beating up other David's in fair fights (that isn't tv worthy half the time).

I'd love to see a mid-major pre-season or Christmas tournament like the NIT that started with 16 teams in regional locations and then had a final four in a specific location. The problem is that the other tournaments allow an opportunity to play the big schools on neutral courts. But it would be fun for the mid major fan.

Butler Guy
11-22-2007, 08:40 AM
.What is the major benefit of playing the likes of Butler, Western Kentucky in a home and home series?

Im not sure about Western Kentucky, but Butler is in midtown Indianapolis, which just so happens to be one of the best cities in the nation at developing college basketball talent...

2+2 = ???

bigjeep
11-22-2007, 08:59 AM
Im not sure about Western Kentucky, but Butler is in midtown Indianapolis, which just so happens to be one of the best cities in the nation at developing college basketball talent...

2+2 = ???


btw, thank you for Courtney Lee...

TheBunnieRancher
11-23-2007, 07:18 PM
I think we are operating under a misconception that scheduling schools from BCS conferences automatically equals good RPI. There have been more than a few wins over highly ranked BCS schools early in the season in recent years that have turned out to be mirages and have had questionable influence come tourney time. I think the likelyhood of home & home series with Butler and WKU depend GU's professional ties to the people running those programs. If we know them and they know us and there is mutual admiration and respect for what we're both doing, I think it can happen. There will always be room for both Butler and UNC. And I for one don't want to be laughed at on someone else's board for running away like we tag the Huskies... :lmao: