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Angelo Roncalli
11-07-2007, 05:35 AM
Interesting take, but this guy has a few facts wrong. The WCC has sent multiple teams to the NCAA a few times. GU and Pepperdine, St. Mary's and San Diego in the past 8 years. USD fans "devout?" Being in church must be the reason why they don't attend games. And Gonzaqa's full time equivalent enrollment is more than 6,700; if he meant undergrads, he should have said so. And if Dick Davey is so concerned about academics in the WCC, he ought to comment on WCC schools that don't seem to be able to keep their basketball players in class. A little bitterness from the Gonzaga factor, hmm?

http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports/college_basketball/20071107-9999-lz1s7hoops.html

wazZag
11-07-2007, 05:44 AM
spend more money. USD's men's basketball expenses, including scholarship costs, have increased from $881,000 in 2001 to $1.64 million last year, according to filings with the federal government. Portland's have jumped from $720,000 to $1.68 million. Gonzaga's burst from $834,000 in 2001 to a league-most $1.94 million last year.

By comparison, Pac-10 men's hoops expenses have increased “only” by an average of 41 percent over that period, to an average of $3.53 million, according to the filings.


Interesting article. Although I'm not surprised that the program isn't spending as much as pac-10 hoops teams, it makes the job done by few and co. all the more impressive.

PeninsulaDog
11-07-2007, 09:41 AM
I don't want to speak for Angelo, but there are many GU alumni, including me, who are weary of the consistent cheap shots emanating from other WCC schools relative to GU's admission standards for athletes. Santa Clara seems to be the main culprit here -- a season never passes without someone from Santa Clara (usually unnamed) opining to the media that GU plays fast and loose with admissions standards. These allegations are insidious, based largely on unsubstantiated, anecdotal "information", and appear to be designed purely to damage Gonzaga. It's always easier to blame someone else for your problems, isn't it? But at the end of the day when you lose to Cal-State Stanislaus, and your arena is half-empty every night because you consistently put a lousy product on the floor, maybe your problems have nothing to do with another school that's located a thousand miles away.

Angelo Roncalli
11-07-2007, 10:21 AM
No enmity Davy, with one very minor exception. I am a huge of fan of the WCC and want the conference and its members to do well; a rising tide floats all boats. But if you think the feeling for Gonzaga by conference members, many of their fans, and officials in the WCC offices is sweetness and light, warm and fuzzy, you're mistaken. It is the WCC and the presidents of other conference schools that have put GU in the position of having the biggest college basketball game played in the Inland Empire in the last 25 years (GU v. WSU) relegated to an afterthought ESPN channel. Dick Davey attributing any part of his firing/resignation/forced resignation to the admission of any student athlete to Gonzaga is ludicrous and smacks of sour grapes. His beef shouldn't be with whom Gonzaga has admitted as a student athlete, it should be with the long knives who did him in.

MickMick
11-07-2007, 10:41 AM
Bravo Angelo, but I am a little more hard line than you.

After enduring sour grapes year after year, I find it difficult to hope for other WCC teams to gain in stature (as you do). The problem is that regardless of how well and for how long the WCC can perform well, the conference will never gain national respect.

So why wish for it?

Look at Conference USA. There are some fine teams in that conference and as a whole, it is decidedly better (at basketball) than the WCC. Yet the Memphis faithful are constantly on the defensive with respect to the legitimacy of their lofty status due to their "weak" conference (ie "padded record").

Does anyone think that the WCC will ever be thought of as comparable to Conference USA or Missouri Valley? Not a chance!

The best Gonzaga can hope for is to do exactly what they have been doing for years. Schedule a tough OOC, win the automatic bid, and advance (typically) a round or two into the tournament. Odds are they will get to a final four by virtue of how many shots they are getting.

As for the rest of the WCC, they are reaping directly from what they sow.

former1dog
11-07-2007, 10:46 AM
I agree with P-Dog. Many of our conference foes have taken to taking potshots at GU rather than addressing the shortcomings of their own programs. Suggestions about low academic standards have become mythological and have gotten enough legs that the very same publication that wrote the article above had a column in the spring about GU's poor academic record.

After many an email from this community correcting the author, he wrote a nice article explaining how Gonzaga has done things the right way!

I acknowledge that Gonzaga has caught lightning in a bottle and it is very difficult for other schools with similar circumstances to attempt duplication of Gonzaga's success. That fact aside, though, it is cheap and petty for these "jealousies" to manifest in statements amounting to bold face lies about our program and the people in it.

Davy, you know we all love Gonzaga with a passion and to have our beloved institution falsely smeared by its opponents is bound to create anger on our end. Not sure why this would surprise you?

Angelo Roncalli
11-07-2007, 11:56 AM
DavyZag is no Zag, despite what he's written in his profile. He's a former leader of the University of Portland student group, a blogger for the Oregonian, and a former employee of the University of Portland athletic department.

wavesfan
11-07-2007, 12:10 PM
In an effort to make you feel a little bit better about the article, I would point out that he did make reference to "undergrad" students earlier in the article when he mentioned enrollments and that he says that the WCC has never sent more than two teams to the NCAA tournament in a single year.

Personally, I don't believe this is an anti-Zag article. But I know it's all a matter of perspective.

Angelo Roncalli
11-07-2007, 12:14 PM
Are you going to write him and demand that he reinstate Pepperdine's victory over Indiana and Bobby Knight in NCAA tournament?

And I'm not sure you can justify a preface from about 10 paragraphs earlier in the article when the exact words he wrote were: "Gonzaga's overall enrollment has increased from 2,900 to 4,300."

I agree with MJGG..."crappy writing."

DixieZag
11-07-2007, 12:19 PM
I found the point about other schools and fans not feeling warm and fuzzy about GU to be right on point. I have some experience here, in my family three of us went to GU and one to SCU. Horse boy, as I call him, was standing and as excited as I was when GU beat Standford in "the game". He no longer feels that way at all. 6 years after our Elite 8 run, we were standing outside the arena at San Diego during the conf. tourney and he turned to me and said "you guys have the most smug fans" and I looked around and really couldn't help but agree with him. At which point I told him that I was a student and sat through the 8-20 season which gave us all the right to be as smug as we can be, forever.

Symi81
11-07-2007, 02:38 PM
The article was mediocre from the start, but at least tolerable. However, that last paragraph is 100% unsubstantiated BS. It really grinds my gears to hear crap like that when in reality Gonzaga's standards are SECOND TO NOBODY in the WCC.

Id take a degree from GU over LMU or USD any day. SCU is a fantastic school (like GU) and I dont want to take anything away from that, but seeing comments like that from Dick Davey is a bit surprising to me, I always though he had more class than that...