PDA

View Full Version : WCC Parity and Multiple Bids to "Dance"



BurgessEraZag
01-04-2019, 04:18 AM
Going into conference play we all praised the "up and comers", LMU, USF, USD and maybe UOP. WCC rated #8 conference in NCAA, that's good.

Opening night three up and comers are defeated by "also rans" Santa Clara, Pepperdine and BYU (not bad team but terrible record). But the obvious conclusion is
the conference may be a little bit better than we gave credit. Sort of follows the cliché, any team can beat any team on any given night. (Except for GU and us kool aid drinkers.)

Opening night conclusions. USF is probably the class of the league after the Zags. But St. Mary's didn't embarrass themselves last night @USF, so Randy may be working.
BYU showed they are better than their record reflects but not sure about Pacific. We believe USD is good but maybe Santa Clara isn't an "also ran."

Any road game in WCC this year could be maybe a trap game, or at least one that no team should take for granted.

Interesting results and slightly revealing so what say you all. OOC records may not for others outside of GU reflect true strength or not.

Watched the USF/SMC game and while fun to watch, not impressed that either team can compete with Zags. Both USF and SMC had post players which need to be "handled", but otherwise, GU skill players much better and should not have difficulty with the league. The "equalizer" can be the referees' calls on the road and especially at USF Hilltop War Memorial.
We all remember those curses.

Wonder if everyone except Portland ends up beating up on each other and no other team besides GU rises to the top or second place to warrant an at large bid to the dance.

JPtheBeasta
01-04-2019, 04:57 AM
Watching SMC/USF made me appreciate just how far GU has gotten on the recruiting front. Few has talked about hype and teams that look great getting off the plane, and I understand that mid-majors are capable of, but it will be an noteworthy upset in my mind if the Zags lose any game the rest of the year-- even on the road--in the WCC. Other years I have expected a loss or two, but this year? Not so much...

strikenowhere
01-04-2019, 05:07 AM
This is a one bid league barring a Zag loss in the conference tournament. No way USF makes it through the conference schedule without picking up a couple of dud losses besides being swept by the Zags.

TexasZagFan
01-04-2019, 05:14 AM
Any road game in WCC this year could be maybe a trap game, or at least one that no team should take for granted.

Money quote, IMO. Zags can handle it, though. I can't imagine any arena being more hostile than Creighton, particularly the first ten minutes of the game. Creighton fed off the energy, and were nearly perfect from the field.

DixieZag
01-04-2019, 06:05 AM
This is a one bid league barring a Zag loss in the conference tournament. No way USF makes it through the conference schedule without picking up a couple of dud losses besides being swept by the Zags.

I hate to say it, but I agree.

I am somewhat dispirited by the fact that USD and LMU lost last night to teams we didn't think were all that good.

I would love to think that SMC is simply better than what we thought and thus near beat USF, but I suspect it is more that USF is exposed for having played near nobody (they needed that Buffalo game, they had their chances, there).

The league mean seems much improved, we may not go through undefeated, but this is a one bid league unless we lose the conference title. We may get 4 NIT bids, but it's one NCAA bid, unless USF beats us once.

Really kind of depressing. We STILL won't get credit for league victories, even when the overall RPI is much improved, and we won't even have the 2 top 25 games we used to have when SMC was really good.

LongIslandZagFan
01-04-2019, 06:09 AM
USF's chance at getting an at large died with the loss to UC Santa Barbara. Only way there is two bids is with a tourney upset.

strikenowhere
01-04-2019, 06:36 AM
USF's chance at getting an at large died with the loss to UC Santa Barbara. Only way there is two bids is with a tourney upset.

+1

TravelinZag
01-04-2019, 07:20 AM
USF can win a bid with a run to at least second in th conference and an appearance in the WCC championship. Where will that bid come from? The Pac12, which will be fortunate to receive two bids after a dreadful preseason, may be as bad as the WCC this year.

bartruff1
01-04-2019, 07:26 AM
Gonzaga likely the only team that could get a at large...from the WCC

hooter73
01-04-2019, 07:36 AM
How many teams will the Mountain West get in?https://www.ar15.com/images/smilies/anim_peep.gif

bdmiller7
01-04-2019, 08:03 AM
How many teams will the Mountain West get in?https://www.ar15.com/images/smilies/anim_peep.gif

There might not be a conference in the west with 2 teams in the NCAA (PAC 12, MW, WCC, Big Sky, Big West, WAC).

BurgessEraZag
01-04-2019, 08:15 AM
Agree. Looks like we have a consensus. Go Zags. Here we come March and April.

bartruff1
01-04-2019, 09:15 AM
There might not be...but I think the Mountain West and the Pac will get a couple bids each....

thespywhozaggedme
01-04-2019, 09:21 AM
Going into conference play we all praised the "up and comers", LMU, USF, USD and maybe UOP. WCC rated #8 conference in NCAA, that's good.

Opening night three up and comers are defeated by "also rans" Santa Clara, Pepperdine and BYU (not bad team but terrible record). But the obvious conclusion is
the conference may be a little bit better than we gave credit. Sort of follows the cliché, any team can beat any team on any given night. (Except for GU and us kool aid drinkers.)

Opening night conclusions. USF is probably the class of the league after the Zags. But St. Mary's didn't embarrass themselves last night @USF, so Randy may be working.
BYU showed they are better than their record reflects but not sure about Pacific. We believe USD is good but maybe Santa Clara isn't an "also ran."

Any road game in WCC this year could be maybe a trap game, or at least one that no team should take for granted.

Interesting results and slightly revealing so what say you all. OOC records may not for others outside of GU reflect true strength or not.

Watched the USF/SMC game and while fun to watch, not impressed that either team can compete with Zags. Both USF and SMC had post players which need to be "handled", but otherwise, GU skill players much better and should not have difficulty with the league. The "equalizer" can be the referees' calls on the road and especially at USF Hilltop War Memorial.
We all remember those curses.

Wonder if everyone except Portland ends up beating up on each other and no other team besides GU rises to the top or second place to warrant an at large bid to the dance.

Or maybe they're all just equally mediocre at best

gueastcoast
01-04-2019, 09:42 AM
Unless someone ends up looking totally different in league than they did in the OOC I have a really hard time seeing two teams from the PAC making the tourney.

raise the zag
01-04-2019, 09:49 AM
USF is legit.

I don't think SMC could have played any better, Gaels were balanced, hustled, moved the ball, hit shots...and still lost.

The Dons had no business losing to UCSB in OT. UCSB is 11-3, but USF still much better. Their lack of size along perimeter holds them back vs bigger more athletic backcourt.

USF moves the ball beautifully, lead by unatheltic but quick and decisive guards. They hit open 3's, opportunistic, smart, and tough to defend all 5 positions.

Not sure how any team can slow these Zags down but I think we will struggle stopping USF. Their offense is simply smarter than this year's defense.

We should out score, and out run them, but USF is capable of beating us. They are more methodical and their lead guards are brilliant with the ball. An offensive identity with good flow, tempo, and execution.

bartruff1
01-04-2019, 09:51 AM
Based upon what I saw last night....Gonzaga will simply outscore the WCC teams...no problem at all....

HillZag
01-04-2019, 10:07 AM
San Francisco is solidly in on ESPN's bracketology, which usually gets nearly every team correct.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/bracketology

HillZag
01-04-2019, 10:08 AM
There might not be...but I think the Mountain West and the Pac will get a couple bids each....

The MWC is in no position to get anyone in other than Nevada. A quick glance at Kenpom shows the WCC to be considerably stronger. Also, the WCC has 3 teams in the Top 50.

bdmiller7
01-04-2019, 12:39 PM
San Francisco is solidly in on ESPN's bracketology, which usually gets nearly every team correct.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/bracketology

They are pretty accurate the day of selection, less accurate three months out. I think USF will lose ground with any losses in conference, especially if to anyone other than GU. Major conference teams will also gain traction after playing each other and boosting their SOS. I would love to see 2 WCC teams in, but we're a long way from season being over.

jazzdelmar
01-04-2019, 01:02 PM
More for the ACC, which has never felt any of its teams weren’t worthy.


There might not be a conference in the west with 2 teams in the NCAA (PAC 12, MW, WCC, Big Sky, Big West, WAC).

DixieZag
01-04-2019, 04:07 PM
More for the ACC, which has never felt any of its teams weren’t worthy.

As mediocre as the Pac is, and despite the fact that the WCC will likely cannabilize much of itself, I still believe rather adamantly that if a team cannot go above .500 in their own conference, no matter what conference it is, they don't deserve to go.

It will increase competitiveness in the ACC, Big 12 type conferences, and will let in the odd mid-major.

Which means it will never happen.

But I think it should.

WallaWallaZag
01-05-2019, 01:08 AM
More for the ACC, which has never felt any of its teams weren’t worthy.

somehow syracuse will get in with a sub .500 conference mark and then make the elite eight again...

WallaWallaZag
01-05-2019, 01:24 AM
Going into conference play we all praised the "up and comers", LMU, USF, USD and maybe UOP. WCC rated #8 conference in NCAA, that's good.

Opening night three up and comers are defeated by "also rans" Santa Clara, Pepperdine and BYU (not bad team but terrible record). But the obvious conclusion is
the conference may be a little bit better than we gave credit. Sort of follows the cliché, any team can beat any team on any given night. (Except for GU and us kool aid drinkers.)

Opening night conclusions. USF is probably the class of the league after the Zags. But St. Mary's didn't embarrass themselves last night @USF, so Randy may be working.
BYU showed they are better than their record reflects but not sure about Pacific. We believe USD is good but maybe Santa Clara isn't an "also ran."

Any road game in WCC this year could be maybe a trap game, or at least one that no team should take for granted.

Interesting results and slightly revealing so what say you all. OOC records may not for others outside of GU reflect true strength or not.

Watched the USF/SMC game and while fun to watch, not impressed that either team can compete with Zags. Both USF and SMC had post players which need to be "handled", but otherwise, GU skill players much better and should not have difficulty with the league. The "equalizer" can be the referees' calls on the road and especially at USF Hilltop War Memorial.
We all remember those curses.

Wonder if everyone except Portland ends up beating up on each other and no other team besides GU rises to the top or second place to warrant an at large bid to the dance.

-- lmu was never as good as their record and they need batemon to play great to have a chance against decent teams; pepperdine also just got their 1a/1b most important player back in kameron edwards (flip a coin between him and colby ross).

-- was a little surprised at the usd loss, but it was on the road and santa clara has played much better lately winning 6 in a row including two against the pac-12 @ wsu and usc

-- byu has always been a better team than pacific...they've played a much more difficult schedule

OntZags
01-05-2019, 04:51 AM
San Francisco is solidly in on ESPN's bracketology, which usually gets nearly every team correct.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/bracketology

St.Mary's last season had essentially an identical resume to USF this season. (and greater pedigree as a known commodity who nearly made it to the sweet sixteen the year before) They too were solidly in at this point, around a 7/8 spot iirc.

USF margin of error is incredibly tiny, as we ultimately saw with St.Mary's last season.

GoZags
01-05-2019, 05:49 AM
Speaking of bids to the dance ... I see the Pac 12 Conference of Champions revised their basketball logo (to reflect the number of bids they'll be getting).

https://www.reddit.com/r/CollegeBasketball/comments/acj9h9/i_fixed_the_pac_12_logo_to_reflect_the_number_of/

gueastcoast
01-05-2019, 07:51 AM
Speaking of bids to the dance ... I see the Pac 12 Conference of Champions revised their basketball logo (to reflect the number of bids they'll be getting).

https://www.reddit.com/r/CollegeBasketball/comments/acj9h9/i_fixed_the_pac_12_logo_to_reflect_the_number_of/

Perfect!

HillZag
01-09-2019, 06:39 AM
St.Mary's last season had essentially an identical resume to USF this season. (and greater pedigree as a known commodity who nearly made it to the sweet sixteen the year before) They too were solidly in at this point, around a 7/8 spot iirc.

USF margin of error is incredibly tiny, as we ultimately saw with St.Mary's last season.

No doubt their margin is thin. However, the league is much better. USF has the chance to get wins over several other Kenpom Top 100 teams--something SMC didn't have.

Pleasant Peninsula
01-09-2019, 08:03 AM
USF can perhaps earn an at large bid if they can somehow navigate their non-GU conference games without a loss. 25-5 with three losses to GU including the championship game will probably get the job done, but of course that is somewhat unlikely that they don't drop a game or two or more during to non-Zags teams his year.

raise the zag
01-09-2019, 08:13 AM
USF can perhaps earn an at large bid if they can somehow navigate their non-GU conference games without a loss. 25-5 with three losses to GU including the championship game will probably get the job done, but of course that is somewhat unlikely that they don't drop a game or two or more during to non-Zags teams his year.

Speaking of USF...

In both our losses, our opponents had a least 7 days to prepare for us. UNC had 10 days, Tennessee 7 days, which is rare for any team, timing worked in their favor.

Interestingly, the only time USF has had 7 days off is prior to our game on Saturday.

The Dons have a full week yet again to prepare for us, while we have a game on Thursday. Sound familiar?

Hope this season's history doesn't repeat itself.

bartruff1
01-09-2019, 08:40 AM
Gonzaga is going to annihilate the Dons...the only chance they have to go to the Dance is to win the WCC Tournament …. IMHO of course...:)

raise the zag
01-09-2019, 09:04 AM
Gonzaga is going to annihilate the Dons...the only chance they have to go to the Dance is to win the WCC Tournament …. IMHO of course...:)

I dunno Bart.

I feel USF can hang.

I have a feeling we will have a tough time defending them. And they are pretty good team, who is capable of beating Top 25 ish teams at home.

Of course I feel we win pulling away by 15-20, but USF could surprise.

thespywhozaggedme
01-09-2019, 09:10 AM
I dunno Bart.

I feel USF can hang.

I have a feeling we will have a tough time defending them. And they are pretty good team, who is capable of beating Top 25 ish teams at home.

Of course I feel we win pulling away by 15-20, but USF could surprise.

You also thought that our previous game would be "closer than expected".

bartruff1
01-09-2019, 09:23 AM
The game with Pacific might be closer than the game with SF.....the talent gap is probably wider than it has ever been between Gonzaga and the others...

raise the zag
01-09-2019, 09:39 AM
You also thought that our previous game would be "closer than expected".

I did indeed, I predicted a 25 pt win, instead of a 40...

I didn't expect we'd integrate Tillie and Geno as well as we did. A pleasant surprise on both accounts.

USF would beat SCU by 20+

also, before cherry picking post game, I expect we pull away from USF by 20ish as well, but give us a game before they run outta steam.

Hoopaholic
01-09-2019, 11:00 AM
I dunno Bart.

I feel USF can hang.

I have a feeling we will have a tough time defending them. And they are pretty good team, who is capable of beating Top 25 ish teams at home.

Of course I feel we win pulling away by 15-20, but USF could surprise.

kind of like betting 20 dollars for a win and 20 dollars for a loss......going to be right 50% of the time