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GorgeZag
10-18-2018, 10:02 AM
https://www.si.com/nba/2018/10/18/nba-g-league-offering-professional-contracts-high-school-stars-one-and-done-rule

Might make things interesting for some of our potential future opponents.

Zagdawg
10-18-2018, 10:04 AM
I think there are a number of colleges that already match or beat the $125K offer-- NBA may have to up the dollar amount.

CDC84
10-18-2018, 10:21 AM
Adrian Wojnarowski
✔ @wojespn
I have doubts about how many top players will go this route. Some, yes. But G-League is full of early connecting flights, long bus rides, small gyms. It isn't glamorous. Big-time NCAA ball still has the trappings of exposure, packed houses, private jets. You'll get paid there too.

I doubt you will see many take up on the offer unless there is extreme financial hardship in the family, or there are academic problems. NCAA basketball just provides more exposure (meaning more endorsement dollars.....where the real money is made) and more development through playing competitive games whose outcome truly matters to huge amounts of people. The goal of the G-League is to get out of it. The goal of NCAA basketball is to win a national title.

Mojo13
10-18-2018, 11:37 AM
I doubt you will see many take up on the offer unless there is extreme financial hardship in the family, or there are academic problems. NCAA basketball just provides more exposure (meaning more endorsement dollars.....where the real money is made) and more development through playing competitive games whose outcome truly matters to huge amounts of people. The goal of the G-League is to get out of it. The goal of NCAA basketball is to win a national title.

I'm not so sure - unlimited practice time, practice and game play against way better competition, learning NBA game style, structure, coaching. Players will also be free to hire agents, profit off their likeness and pursue marketing deals from sneaker companies. They can get much more than $125K and can do it in the light of day. I can see a good chunk of the top 5 or 10 prospects going this route instead of the NCAA - most of these guys don't care about a national title, the $$$ is the goal and this gets them there a year early and probably better prepares them for the NBA.

DeAndre Ayton signed a deal with Puma in June this year. The terms of Ayton's contract with Puma is unknown, but The Athletic reported that Ayton is expected to have the largest shoe deal since Kevin Durant's contract with Nike in 2014, which was listed between $265 million and $285 million. Whatever it is, I am guessing Ayton will be making way over $5MM a year on endorsements. Why not get that a year earlier? You'd think the top 5 prospects could all get at least $1MM-$2MM a year in endorsements even while in the G-League. Maybe way more..... and if so, you may see guys in the 10-20 range being able to get a few hundred thousand in endorsements, it would be a very serious draw.

Here is a Forbes article on the top players for endorsement is in the NBA. 12 guys are getting more than $12MM a year in endorsements. Yes these are the superstars but it trickles down. It is pretty easy to see people taking multiple hundred thousand dollar endorsement bets on potential lottery picks.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2018/02/17/the-2018-nba-all-stars-players-who-earn-the-most-from-endorsements/#293bed951755

webspinnre
10-18-2018, 11:40 AM
This will be really interesting to see what ends up happening. I definitely think there will be a few players a year who will do this who had zero interest in pretending to attend college, and is much better than heading overseas.

Radbooks
10-18-2018, 11:58 AM
I doubt some of these big time players would really want to play in a little town in the middle of nowhere and ride buses to games, etc. Being BMOC is much more of a draw.

ZagsObserver
10-18-2018, 12:16 PM
I think quite a few will choose this option. It’s not just the salary, but the ability to pick up contacts and endorsements. For those who don’t like school, it’s an added bonus.

This will make the top teams more beatable. I think it’ll be bad for the Dukes of cbb, neutral or marginally worse for today’s version of GU, and better for SMC on down.

As for cbb as a whole, I think some viewers will be lost. Those who are NBA first viewers might instead watch the g-league games (or not watch at all), assuming it catches on and it’s available to watch on some platform.

Zagdawg
10-18-2018, 12:32 PM
Here is a good read on endorsements......

“A lot of endorsement deals are BS,” one agent said. “There are only a few guys in the NBA who get the monster endorsement deals. For everyone else, 99 percent of their income is going to come from their NBA contract. I’ve worked with All-Star players and even with those guys, they’d get a $150,000 endorsement deal from a company and get excited, but they were making over $20 million that season so it was a drop in the bucket! That goes for all of the star-level players. And for the players who aren’t stars, they’re getting much smaller deals, so it ends up being one percent of their NBA contract too. I worked with one player who’s made over $50 million in his career and he was excited over $2,000 from a brand. The deals aren’t great. The average NBA career lasts about four years. With that in mind, my focus has shifted to helping players buy a franchise for $100,000 because that will be a revenue stream for the rest of their life. The players who are pursuing equity have the right idea too.”

https://hoopshype.com/2018/09/19/the-endorsement-game-how-nba-players-make-money-off-the-court/

basketballzag
10-18-2018, 01:24 PM
Here is a good read on endorsements......

“A lot of endorsement deals are BS,” one agent said. “There are only a few guys in the NBA who get the monster endorsement deals. For everyone else, 99 percent of their income is going to come from their NBA contract. I’ve worked with All-Star players and even with those guys, they’d get a $150,000 endorsement deal from a company and get excited, but they were making over $20 million that season so it was a drop in the bucket! That goes for all of the star-level players. And for the players who aren’t stars, they’re getting much smaller deals, so it ends up being one percent of their NBA contract too. I worked with one player who’s made over $50 million in his career and he was excited over $2,000 from a brand. The deals aren’t great. The average NBA career lasts about four years. With that in mind, my focus has shifted to helping players buy a franchise for $100,000 because that will be a revenue stream for the rest of their life. The players who are pursuing equity have the right idea too.”

https://hoopshype.com/2018/09/19/the-endorsement-game-how-nba-players-make-money-off-the-court/

It will force the European leagues to increase their minimum salary offerings. The NCAA definitely provides more benefit long term than the G-league in terms of exposure. NBA teams are more likely to keep a player with name recognition than someone who just came up from the G-league because name recognition = seats in the arena. If they increase that amount to $250k then we are talking a wholesale change IMO. I had a former Los Angeles Laker pick me up in an Uber a year ago and he wasn't a household name but played for two seasons for the Lakers (young guy who took a year off from the Euro leagues to care for his grandmother who is in hospice). This would have made his decision easier to stay in the states to play instead of taking off a year overseas. I could see a player like that taking the G-league right out of high school (unknown guy from a SEC school). Gonzaga offers more basketball exposure from a PR standpoint than many other Big 5 conference schools so I don't see it impacting us much. $250k though could impact us.

Mojo13
10-18-2018, 01:25 PM
I doubt some of these big time players would really want to play in a little town in the middle of nowhere and ride buses to games, etc. Being BMOC is much more of a draw.

Meh....many of the teams are in major cites or suburbs of major cities. NBA teams have realized the value of having the G league affiliate close by so guys can quickly go up and down. If prospects could choice what team they go to they could live in places like:
South Bay (LA beach cities)
Ontario, CA (LA suburb)
Austin
Toronto
D.C.
Chicago subs
Salt lake city
OKC
Dallas subs
Santa Cruz, CA (close to San Jose)
Memphis subs
NYC subs

Lots of places on this list are far more interesting than Lexington, KY or Lawrence, KS (or Spokane :)


The BMOC aspect will certainly draw certain types - not sure if the 1 and dones care that much about BMOC or crowd size when it is just one year. Again - not saying this pulls away all the top 10 or 20 prospects...but I think it will grab a good chunk of them.

bartruff1
10-18-2018, 01:57 PM
Boy when I was 17/18 and I had the opportunity and ability...... and someone would give me $125,000 to do something that I loved to do and would likely be paid for doing for the next 10 years ….I would jump at the chance....no contest.

When I was 17...... I knew how to accumulate capital and grow it....and it took ten years for me to accumulate that much and most of it was in home equity..... and another 30 years of work to grow enough to be able to retire....

You can always go to college...I am still going to college....

Martin Centre Mad Man
10-18-2018, 02:25 PM
Will kids who test these waters be allowed to play college ball if they go undrafted?

How will the players know if they are good enough to win one of these G-League invitations?

TexasZagFan
10-18-2018, 02:39 PM
I think there are a number of colleges that already match or beat the $125K offer-- NBA may have to up the dollar amount.

How much will the baby sitters be making?

I can't see more than two dozen of these players signing one of these contracts every year. IMO, impact on Gonzaga hoops will be negligible. Zach Collins is our only one and done, and it took exposure during the Dance to put him in lottery status.

Seems to me that the direction we're heading is the 2 and 3 year players that need to further develop their games, and availing themselves of a Gonzaga education while doing it.

Zagdawg
10-18-2018, 03:13 PM
NBA G League Introduces Professional Path For Elite Basketball Prospects

https://gleague.nba.com/news/nba-g-league-introduces-professional-path-select-contracts-elite-basketball-prospects/

Radbooks
10-18-2018, 04:03 PM
Mike Decourcy at the Sporting News has a great take on this:

NBA put itself first — not basketball — in decision to compete against colleges for talent
(https://www.sportingnews.com/us/amp/ncaab/news/nba-compete-colleges-elite-talent-contract-offer-one-and-done-consequences/1swecxccnl96l13ohxdsoyrp2u?__twitter_impression=tr ue)


The notion that elite players under the current age limit rules for the NBA's draft are "forced to go to college" always has been a lie. The G League has been an option for those players who wish to become professional immediately, but the money never has been great. This move will give those actively disinterested in taking the college route — or those not qualified academically — a more attractive option.

Let’s not kid ourselves, though. This isn’t about that. This is about the NBA, through its developmental league, actively challenging college basketball as a proving ground for prospects.

The NBA is believing in its own omnipotence. And, hey, it got some people to watch summer league games, so it might be right.

At the moment, there is a vast difference between performing in the G League and competing in NCAA Division I basketball. Average G League attendance last season was roughly 2,500 fans per game. The top six college conferences averaged more than 10,600.

Television exposure is meager for G League teams. Cable networks ESPNU and NBA TV showed 41 games during the 2017-18 season. Big Ten Network will more than triple that alone. ESPN will show 850 college games this coming season. There will be games, as well, on Fox Sports 1, NBCSN, the Pac-12 Networks and the CBS Sports Network. Oh, and CBS, of course. And all that is in advance of the NCAA Tournament.

kitzbuel
10-18-2018, 04:36 PM
Here is a good read on endorsements......

“A lot of endorsement deals are BS,” one agent said. “There are only a few guys in the NBA who get the monster endorsement deals. For everyone else, 99 percent of their income is going to come from their NBA contract. I’ve worked with All-Star players and even with those guys, they’d get a $150,000 endorsement deal from a company and get excited, but they were making over $20 million that season so it was a drop in the bucket! That goes for all of the star-level players. And for the players who aren’t stars, they’re getting much smaller deals, so it ends up being one percent of their NBA contract too. I worked with one player who’s made over $50 million in his career and he was excited over $2,000 from a brand. The deals aren’t great. The average NBA career lasts about four years. With that in mind, my focus has shifted to helping players buy a franchise for $100,000 because that will be a revenue stream for the rest of their life. The players who are pursuing equity have the right idea too.”

https://hoopshype.com/2018/09/19/the-endorsement-game-how-nba-players-make-money-off-the-court/All the payments that the FBI is investigating now would be fully legal under this model. No scholarships or schools involved.

Sent from my XT1710-02 using Tapatalk

bartruff1
10-18-2018, 04:53 PM
Decourcy ...pure sophistry....

GorgeZag
10-18-2018, 06:56 PM
More from SI:

https://www.si.com/nba/2018/10/18/new-select-contracts-g-league-prospects-abandon-college-basketball-ncaa

asoc
10-18-2018, 07:52 PM
I am gonna throw a tangential piece of information in here.
Seattle Sounders just signed another 15 year old to a professional contract.
https://www.sounderatheart.com/2018/10/16/17984388/s2-signs-daniel-leyva

Leyva joins Marlon Vargas, Ray Serrano, Azriel Gonzalez, Alfonso Ocampo-Chavez, Alec Diaz and Danny Robles as players from that U17 championship squad to sign pro deals with S2 for the 2019 season. With Shandon Hopeau’s recent announcement that he has re-signed for 2019, there are currently 11 Sounders Academy products on professional contracts with S2.
S2 is the Seattle Sounders fully professional "farm" team. They are building a clear path from u12 all the way up to the first team. Ray Serrano came to the Sounders by way of Moses Lake and playing with the Spokane Shadow.
Along with signing these kids at a young age, they give them high level educational resources. https://www.soundersfc.com/post/2018/01/05/seattle-sounders-academy-continues-investment-its-players-through-enhanced

“We want to ensure that a player gets his education and at the same time provide them with an opportunity to develop and potentially become a successful professional player,” said Sounders FC Director of Player Development Marc Nicholls. “Rather than a one-size-fits-all model, we understand that players have different ages, goals, expectations and ambitions and that we need to tailor and cater to the needs of those individuals.”

I know the culture of the two sports is very different. But when I see what the Seattle Sounders are doing for the kids in their program and the attention they give to their education as well, I wonder why can't this work elsewhere.

If you are at all curious about another way of doing things, read these articles. You don't have to like soccer at all to be interested in different ways to develop youth athletes.
Part 1 https://www.soundersfc.com/post/2018/09/17/how-seattle-sounders-academy-became-one-best-youth-systems-united-states-scouting
Part 2 https://www.soundersfc.com/post/2018/09/21/how-seattle-sounders-academy-became-one-best-youth-systems-united-states-development
Part 3 https://www.soundersfc.com/post/2018/10/02/how-seattle-sounders-academy-became-one-best-youth-systems-united-states-programming
Part 4 is coming soon.

Editor's Note: In just three short years, the Seattle Sounders’ investment in the Academy has led to three Youdan Trophy titles, over two dozen players receiving U.S. youth national team call-ups, a wave of teenagers signing pro contracts and a national championship.

webspinnre
10-18-2018, 08:23 PM
That's the way soccer works all across Europe as well. I like the model.

Bogozags
10-19-2018, 10:54 AM
Boy when I was 17/18 and I had the opportunity and ability...... and someone would give me $125,000 to do something that I loved to do and would likely be paid for doing for the next 10 years ….I would jump at the chance....no contest.

When I was 17...... I knew how to accumulate capital and grow it....and it took ten years for me to accumulate that much and most of it was in home equity..... and another 30 years of work to grow enough to be able to retire....

You can always go to college...I am still going to college....

Agree!

These kids are motivated and they want to improve their skills, then this program might well be the path to take instead of going to college for a semester. OJT can be far better for many of these kids than working a couple-three hours a day practicing as opposed on working 4-6 hour days, working on strengthening and improving skills.

This program will not curtail the UK/Duke/KU/UNC schools from getting the remaining five star and upper four star recruits...just means that other players will rise to the top.


One more thing...the G-League is a job and attendance isn't any where near as high as most colleges but they will be paid to play in smaller facilities, in front of small crowds but at the same time they are "interviewing" each night for future promotions...as long as the league pays them appropriately, then playing for free in front of large crowds is a non issue...IMO

gu03alum
10-19-2018, 11:41 AM
This seems like a slap in the face to these guys. The NBA creates an artificial barrier to enter the league forcing them to go to college for one year. They then say, hey you can play for us professionally, but you won't get your fair market salary. How much money would RJ Barrett or Zion Williamson get if they were free agents after high school? I can answer that. A whole hell of a lot more than $125,000.

Ekrub
10-20-2018, 05:32 AM
This seems like a slap in the face to these guys. The NBA creates an artificial barrier to enter the league forcing them to go to college for one year. They then say, hey you can play for us professionally, but you won't get your fair market salary. How much money would RJ Barrett or Zion Williamson get if they were free agents after high school? I can answer that. A whole hell of a lot more than $125,000.

Believe this is a bridge/work around until the 22 when they can get rid of the one and done rule, unless the league or players don't agree

zaguarxj
10-20-2018, 08:44 AM
They could make things a lot more interesting if they relegated the bottom 3 or 4 teams in the NBA to the G league and promoted the top 3 or 4 G league teams to the NBA after every season. You sure won't get as many teams tanking it at the end of the season to try to get a lottery pick.

gu03alum
10-20-2018, 10:55 AM
Believe this is a bridge/work around until the 22 when they can get rid of the one and done rule, unless the league or players don't agree

It should be way more money, something like $3-$5 million

Zagceo
10-20-2018, 11:17 AM
It should be way more money, something like $3-$5 million

you should get agents license. D

gu03alum
10-20-2018, 01:18 PM
you should get agents license. D

That’s how much these guys would get in Free market, probably more

CDC84
10-20-2018, 02:28 PM
I'm not so sure - unlimited practice time, practice and game play against way better competition, learning NBA game style, structure, coaching. Players will also be free to hire agents, profit off their likeness and pursue marketing deals from sneaker companies. They can get much more than $125K and can do it in the light of day. I can see a good chunk of the top 5 or 10 prospects going this route instead of the NCAA - most of these guys don't care about a national title, the $$$ is the goal and this gets them there a year early and probably better prepares them for the NBA.

DeAndre Ayton signed a deal with Puma in June this year. The terms of Ayton's contract with Puma is unknown, but The Athletic reported that Ayton is expected to have the largest shoe deal since Kevin Durant's contract with Nike in 2014, which was listed between $265 million and $285 million. Whatever it is, I am guessing Ayton will be making way over $5MM a year on endorsements. Why not get that a year earlier? You'd think the top 5 prospects could all get at least $1MM-$2MM a year in endorsements even while in the G-League. Maybe way more..... and if so, you may see guys in the 10-20 range being able to get a few hundred thousand in endorsements, it would be a very serious draw.

Here is a Forbes article on the top players for endorsement is in the NBA. 12 guys are getting more than $12MM a year in endorsements. Yes these are the superstars but it trickles down. It is pretty easy to see people taking multiple hundred thousand dollar endorsement bets on potential lottery picks.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2018/02/17/the-2018-nba-all-stars-players-who-earn-the-most-from-endorsements/#293bed951755


1. Ayton heightened his endorsement value greatly by being the most talked about talent in college basketball last season. He was NOT just a number on a recruiting chart which he would have been as a G League player last season. No one cares about that league. The G League is not watched, and this new offer isn't going to make the G-League that much more interesting for basketball fans. Most serious fans would rather watch high level college ball. Fans like me got to see Ayton in person and on TV screens. Millions of people got to see him who might not have otherwise. If anything, it made NBA fans more excited about what his future in the NBA would be and could be because they saw him in action. This level of exposure matters to most top flight prep talents.

2. I do not believe that unlimited practice makes a basketball player better, much in the same way that my high school baseball coach told me that swinging the bat one thousand times a day wouldn’t make me better. It would lead to me being more lazy about technique through tiredness and so on. The players need time for recovery and having a life. As discussed in many articles, the traveling conditions (planes, hotels, food) are much better at high level college programs than with many of these G-League teams. Having better creature comforts will also dissuade most top prep guys from going G-League.

3. I believe and will believe until I die that the top D-1 college coaches in this nation are the best teachers of the game of basketball, at any level, including the NBA. I would take Coach Few over any coach in the G-League because he is under big time pressure to win games at a high level with players who, for the most part, won’t be pros. If they can turn non-pros into guys who can compete for national titles, what they can do for a guy like Durant speaks for itself. I think most of the high level prep players, with all the connections they have, know this. They know that guys like Few, Roy Williams, Coach K are teachers. High school players often enter college not even knowing what a down screen is. I would rather learn it from Few. Also, many of the G-League coaches are failed NBA coaches, and I'm telling you, the NBA is not about instruction: it is about one thing and one thing only.....preparing for the next game. I've known former NBA players who've asked for help with their shooting and were told by NBA assistants: "Deal with it yourself, we have a game to prepare for. This isn't grade school." And these players had multi-million buck contracts.....including a former Gonzaga player. So they had to fly out their dad, fly out their high school coach. The NBA dudes are GREAT at scouting opponents and building game plans. Don't trust them as game teachers because they don't do it enough.

4. I feel that the single greatest development tool in the game of basketball at any level is first, the NCAA tournament, but also playing several road games in front of 17,000 people who hate you in games who outcome greatly matters to millions of people. More people watch the NCAA tournament than the NBA playoffs. Even in losing, the tournament is an uplifting experience. It teaches players how to be champions more than playing against more talented players. Trust me, a guy like Coach K can construct a defense to make things very, very hard on a future lottery pick from UNC. Even better, he can do it in front of the Cameron Crazies in games that really, really matter to many fans, including sports betters. The pressure is something you are not never exposed to in the G-League. The goal is to get out. I have been to G-League games, and the environments are awful. No one has any personal identification with the teams because the players are being constantly brought up and down in a sport that is far more team oriented than baseball which is basically an individual game between the pitcher and hitter (with a few team work plays like relays, etc.). The G-League encourages selfishness by its very set up. Basketball is a cooperative, team sport. The teams need to stay together for the players to get better. I just feel the majority of the top players would rather play in the Carolina/Duke rivalry or in an elite 8 game than anything that they do in a meaningless G-League game that yields them little to no exposure.

5. I am all in favor of the NBA offering this opportunity to players, and open to dumping the NBA age limit so long as they get rid of the rookie salary cap which is the worst decision any pro sports league has implemented in the past 25 years. The salary cap is 100x more anti-capitalistic than the age limit. It keeps the best, most prepared players from getting the vast majority of the salary money, and it forces NBA teams into paying guys millions who don't deserve it. But like Adrian and countless other writers have written, I would be shocked if we see many of the top 15 players take up on this G-League offer, and if they take up on it, I feel it will be because of financial hardship, NCAA eligibility issues, or grades like Brandon Jennings.

BTW – Kevin Durant loved college basketball. He has said many times that if it weren’t for financial considerations, he would have stayed at Texas. I believe him, because he continues to take classes there and has made donations to the school. He still feels Rick Barnes was the best teacher of the game he’s ever played under. That includes Steve Kerr and his assistants. That one year at Texas made that much of a difference. Especially on defense. Moreover, Texas' sports and conditioning program is considered to be better than most ones in professional athletics. It's certainly the best in college athletics.

DixieZag
10-20-2018, 03:05 PM
Seems to me that one way to alleviate the concerns while respecting the players' rights to individual freedom in their persons is to go with the small stipend for play (basically a work study job, albeit a good paying one) but also allow the players to earn whatever endorsement dollars they are offered.

If the coaches/schools gave up their right to endorsement dollars to keep the NCAA "amateur" then the players would have little argument as it is consistent. Given that the coaches/schools cash in, it is just plain greedy in my mind to prohibit a player who would otherwise be free to simply mirror the coaches' opportunities.

Course, open it to players means likely less to coaches, and that's the rub.

So much money passing hands, to leave the players out on purely private value is just so horribly one-sided it approaches shameful.