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ZagNative
07-02-2018, 07:32 PM
Johnathan's laker Game vs. Sacramento on now on NBA TV. Anybody got a box score?

cmtr91zag
07-02-2018, 07:52 PM
https://watch.nba.com/game/20180702/LALSAC

ZagNative
07-02-2018, 08:15 PM
Here's the box score: http://www.espn.com/nba-summer-league/boxscore?gameId=401036022&league=nba-summer-sacramento

MDABE80
07-02-2018, 08:57 PM
Here's the box score: http://www.espn.com/nba-summer-league/boxscore?gameId=401036022&league=nba-summer-sacramentoZN scores!!! Some very good 1st and 2nd yr players tonight. J3 3 for 3 ..6 pts , 8 rebs.
Looked
Good in his 20 minutes.

Bogozags
07-03-2018, 04:13 AM
Wow, I missed a post/posts somewhere saying that NBASL games are now being broadcast...

Heck, he got to play 20 minutes! They must have an interest in him...

Did anyone watch the game...I wonder against whom JWIII guarded...did he play against Bagley?

They play on ESPN on Saturday at 1130pm/830pm against the Sixers and ESPN2 on Sunday at the same time against the Bulls...

I know Jock is also playing but don't remember the team...are there any other WCC players in the NBASL?

hondo
07-03-2018, 07:01 AM
The Lakers could not find a better human being to have on the team than JW3. We were so lucky to have him at GU for 3 years.

hooter73
07-03-2018, 07:07 AM
If he can do that consistently, there may be a really opportunity to make a roster. Nice work J3!

thebigsmoove
07-03-2018, 07:09 AM
The fact that they may need to fill some roster spots with minimum $$$ now that they have LeBron could bode well for J3. I really hope he can stick, hes a remarkable young man.

GonzagasaurusFlex
07-03-2018, 07:39 AM
The fact that they may need to fill some roster spots with minimum $$$ now that they have LeBron could bode well for J3. I really hope he can stick, hes a remarkable young man.

+1 JWIII has the athleticism to defend & rebound in the league. Needs to show he can score vs NBA talent too. Draymond Green style player would be good one for him to strive for. Hope he earns a spot w the Lakers.

Bouldin4Prez
07-03-2018, 08:04 AM
+1 JWIII has the athleticism to defend & rebound in the league. Needs to show he can score vs NBA talent too. Draymond Green style player would be good one for him to strive for. Hope he earns a spot w the Lakers.

JW3 will never be Draymond because he's not the ball handler/play maker. But if he can defend and able to switch screens onto smaller players, he will stick around in the league. He's a capable rebounder and can finish lobs/easy ones around the rim. Like what was said earlier, the Lakers will have to fill a couple minimum slots this year so hopefully that means JW3 will get a real shot at a roster spot.

DixieZag
07-03-2018, 08:20 AM
The Lakers could not find a better human being to have on the team than JW3. We were so lucky to have him at GU for 3 years.

Wonderfully said and spot on.

Lakers seem to recognize that Zags are worth looking at bc no matter whether they can physically make NBA roster, they will always be low maintenance, high quality, mature beyond young years type of young men, and so they seem to be more willing to check out a GU player, at least they sure consistently do.

zag944
07-03-2018, 08:33 AM
With the Warriors signing Cousins now I don't know if LeBron and JWIII is going to be enough, but perhaps if they draft Rui and make a big 3 of their own it could happen next year.

Hopefully we see a few more Lakers go out the door soon in a trade for a big talent like Kawhi. Might just make the math work better for JWIII. By my count they've added LeBron, McGee, Stephenson, and Rondo while only losing Randle.

MDABE80
07-03-2018, 09:40 AM
The one thing about it is this: he played solidly and looked
like he belonged in the league. Not flashy but solid. Shot well, played good defense, rebounded very well, and his athleticism was , as usual, superior. If he keeps it up, a team will find him.

ZagaholicPodcast
07-03-2018, 10:35 AM
The one thing about it is this: he played solidly and looked
Like he belonged in the league. Not flashy. Shot well, played good defense, rebounded very well, and his athleticism was , as usual, superior. If he keeps it up, a team will find him.

With the way some teams are embracing undersized 5's, and moving away from significant post production, the only thing I can see having any negative effect is his shooting...but Capela isn't exactly a world beater from deep, either. Clint *IS* meeting with the Lakers, though. So, we'll see how that pans out. I think J3 would be a great fit for a team like Houston.

ZagNative
07-03-2018, 11:31 AM
Coming up at 6:00 on ESPN2, Lakers vs. Heat. Here's to a good outing for JW3!

ZagNative
07-03-2018, 05:07 PM
Box Score (http://www.espn.com/nba-summer-league/boxscore?gameId=401036023&league=nba-summer-sacramento)

raise the zag
07-03-2018, 07:18 PM
no one can say he isn't getting a fair shake and/or terrific opportunity.

20 & 24 mins of PT in your first 2 summer league games as an undrafted FA is unheard of.

they like him, see something in him, or giving him the best chance to succeed somewhere else.

he's lead the team in rebounding both games thus far. missed a lot of shots today, but 9 rebs, 3 blks, etc doesnt go unnoticed.

J3 could sneak onto a team and that gives me chills. Love the guy.

MDABE80
07-03-2018, 07:27 PM
I agree. 4/11 shooting must improve but 8 pts is good. Played good defense. They like him. He's getting a long look. Total shooting for both games is 7/14. I hope sticks somewhere.

West Side Lady
07-03-2018, 07:35 PM
20 & 24 mins of PT in your first 2 summer league games as an undrafted FA is unheard of.

they like him, see something in him, or giving him the best chance to succeed somewhere else.

he's lead the team in rebounding both games thus far. missed a lot of shots today, but 9 rebs, 3 blks, etc doesnt go unnoticed.

J3 could sneak onto a team and that gives me chills. Love the guy.

I love J3 too. Looks like he's been hard at work and it's paying off: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rm4ENMu2JmQ
How can you not want this guy on your team?

LTownZag
07-03-2018, 10:01 PM
He went 0/2 from the charity stripe and air-balled a three point attempt. He shot 1-7 on his first 8 field goals.

J3 is an all-time favorite zag and has tons of professional basketball ahead of him, but it won't be in the NBA (regular season).

Bogozags
07-04-2018, 05:13 AM
JWIII has played 44 minutes over two games...

He is 7 for 14 from the floor and has 17 rebounds over his two games...still can't shoot FT's but that's on him, his HS Coach, Staff at UM and GU...

I think he has a shot...he plays excellent defence and can score inside...

ZagaholicPodcast
07-04-2018, 07:03 AM
JWIII has played 44 minutes over two games...

He is 7 for 14 from the floor and has 17 rebounds over his two games...still can't shoot FT's but that's on him, his HS Coach, Staff at UM and GU...

I think he has a shot...he plays excellent defence and can score inside...

He doesn't need to be an exceptional shooter. Look at Clint Capela's line from last year. As was mentioned earlier, he has to be able to switch and stick on ball screens, where he might get matched up with the guard. As well, he needs to be able to crash on PnR's where a slip off the defending forward is possible. He's got the power moves in the lane to score, and he has the speed and athleticism on the aforementioned crash situation to finish.

He's definitely got a shot, even if it isn't with the Lakers. Donny Daniels strikes again.

raise the zag
07-04-2018, 07:04 AM
JWIII has played 44 minutes over two games...

He is 7 for 14 from the floor and has 17 rebounds over his two games...still can't shoot FT's but that's on him, his HS Coach, Staff at UM and GU...

I think he has a shot...he plays excellent defence and can score inside...

Crazy thing is...if he could shoot FT's at 70% and 3pt at even 30%, he'd be a shoe in.

His awkward and cringe worthy FT shot is what holds him back imo.

Ever notice scouts ALWAYS mention FT form?

Case in point: Rui Hachimura.

Several scouting reports mention his beautiful form on FT's and good %. They even equate his FT % as translating to a good 3pt shooter someday. Rui's FT shot, along with many other bigs, help their stock at the next level.

J3's FT form should have been scrapped years ago. The flick of the wrist at the top of the release, while shooting slowly has zero room for error. Flat, no arc, no flow, etc. The Coaching staff didn't want to tinker with it as it 'worked in practice'.

Ironically enough, I believe it's the one area that scouts don't trust or translate for him. Can't shoot 50% FT unless you are 7' tall...or Shaq.

Bogozags
07-04-2018, 07:34 AM
Crazy thing is...if he could shoot FT's at 70% and 3pt at even 30%, he'd be a shoe in.

His awkward and cringe worthy FT shot is what holds him back imo.

Ever notice scouts ALWAYS mention FT form?

Case in point: Rui Hachimura.

Several scouting reports mention his beautiful form on FT's and good %. They even equate his FT % as translating to a good 3pt shooter someday. Rui's FT shot, along with many other bigs, help their stock at the next level.

J3's FT form should have been scrapped years ago. The flick of the wrist at the top of the release, while shooting slowly has zero room for error. Flat, no arc, no flow, etc. The Coaching staff didn't want to tinker with it as it 'worked in practice'.

Ironically enough, I believe it's the one area that scouts don't trust or translate for him. Can't shoot 50% FT unless you are 7' tall...or Shaq.

For the life of me, I just don't understand why his coaches did get him to shoot properly...this could well cost him millions over his life time...I don't think it is too late to change his form but he will have to take "lessons" and then have "perfect practice" to develop a proper shooting stroke...he doesn't use legs in any of his non-layup shots...

I remember Wilt trying anything to improve his FT shooting and think his best success came under-handed ala Calvin Murphy and Rich Barry...He has to try something...IMO


One more thought...Rui has to find a stroke with the proper arc in shooting his jump shoots...One of my college professors wrote he thesis on the proper angle for shooting jump shoots...39-54 degrees...I hope he also finds the stroke...

MDABE80
07-04-2018, 09:48 AM
Bogo, my friend, if millions of dollars were hanging in the balance, I'd get someone to show me how to shoot free throws and spend 8 hrs per day in the gym till I was shooting 70-80%. Something went wrong!!! J3 can learn and he should focus.
Rui, on the other hand practices everything till he's a master. FT's included.

Zagceo
07-04-2018, 10:27 AM
For the life of me, I just don't understand why his coaches did get him to shoot properly...this could well cost him millions over his life time...I don't think it is too late to change his form but he will have to take "lessons" and then have "perfect practice" to develop a proper shooting stroke...he doesn't use legs in any of his non-layup shots...

I remember Wilt trying anything to improve his FT shooting and think his best success came under-handed ala Calvin Murphy and Rich Barry...He has to try something...IMO


One more thought...Rui has to find a stroke with the proper arc in shooting his jump shoots...One of my college professors wrote he thesis on the proper angle for shooting jump shoots...39-54 degrees...I hope he also finds the stroke...

agree 100%

like it or not....Zags program takes a hit for allowing a 3 year player to exit the program with such a glaring deficiency for whatever reason/excuse IMO

Nevada Don
07-04-2018, 10:29 AM
I know Jock is also playing but don't remember the team...are there any other WCC players in the NBASL?

Jock is with the Hawks and Naar is with the Suns.

Bogozags
07-04-2018, 11:51 AM
Jock is with the Hawks and Naar is with the Suns.

Thanks!

Radbooks
07-05-2018, 11:06 AM
Jonathan with the start today!

ZagNative
07-05-2018, 11:07 AM
JW3 starting for the Lakers vs. Golden State. Good Luck, JW3!

Box Score (http://www.espn.com/nba-summer-league/boxscore?gameId=401036025&league=nba-summer-sacramento)

Ezag
07-08-2018, 11:44 AM
Not a great showing from Williams today. -10 with 7 rebounds, 1 block, 3 turnovers and 0 points

raise the zag
07-08-2018, 12:47 PM
Not a great showing from Williams today. -10 with 7 rebounds, 1 block, 3 turnovers and 0 points

Great prospect in many ways yet just not quite good enough of a shooter ...

Has a chance but likely not, will be great in Europe

If Brandon Davies can make 2 million per yr in Europe, why not J3?

Great person and player. Fight on J3!

West Side Lady
07-13-2018, 10:01 AM
Well he sure seems to be getting a lot of minutes for someone with a slim chance. 8 pts 8 rebounds against Clippers.

jazzdelmar
07-14-2018, 05:22 AM
Jordan Mathews was on the Clips bench....

Zagdawg
07-14-2018, 07:32 AM
NBA G League

Verified account

@nbagleague
Follow Follow @nbagleague
More
FINAL

@ATLHawks: 97
@LAClippers: 81

#GLeagueAlum @JordanMathews22 posted 18 points and 4 rebounds for the Clippers.

https://twitter.com/nbagleague/status/1017985929804435456

Markburn1
07-14-2018, 09:27 AM
Well he sure seems to be getting a lot of minutes for someone with a slim chance. 8 pts 8 rebounds against Clippers.

Have to be realistic. Somebody has to be on the floor. The Summer League math for players is daunting. Mostly it's an opportunity for draft picks and second year players to get their feet wet or work on certain aspects of their game. Those are the players in which clubs are invested. The other players on the rosters are trying to catch lightning in a bottle. Odds are very slim for getting signed to an NBA contract based on Summer League play. Hopefully Jonathan makes an impression and gets a shot via G League or he takes the European route. But, you never know. Right place, Right time, work your ass off has happened before.

West Side Lady
07-15-2018, 04:32 PM
Have to be realistic

Why? You are probably right, but it costs me nothing to be positive. I'm rooting for the guy!

57.1 FG% against Pistons today, 8 pts 5 reb 1 blk

https://twitter.com/NBA/status/1018596584144162816

Markburn1
07-15-2018, 05:00 PM
Why? You are probably right, but it costs me nothing to be positive. I'm rooting for the guy!

57.1 FG% against Pistons today, 8 pts 5 reb 1 blk

https://twitter.com/NBA/status/1018596584144162816

I get it. I'm rooting for him as well.

Bogozags
07-16-2018, 05:30 AM
Have to be realistic. Somebody has to be on the floor. The Summer League math for players is daunting. Mostly it's an opportunity for draft picks and second year players to get their feet wet or work on certain aspects of their game. Those are the players in which clubs are invested. The other players on the rosters are trying to catch lightning in a bottle. Odds are very slim for getting signed to an NBA contract based on Summer League play. Hopefully Jonathan makes an impression and gets a shot via G League or he takes the European route. But, you never know. Right place, Right time, work your ass off has happened before.

We all want him to be successful in everything he does in life but as you state, it is summer league and they need bodies on the court to play...He is getting a lot of time and individual coaching in the Summer League and maybe someone will teach him how to correct his shooting form. I believe his inability to shoot jump shots and FT's has limited his marketability and could cost him $$$! His strengths imo are his ability to defend the SF, PF and C positions; work ethic; and being a team player.

If one could combine KW and JWIII into one player, then that player would be All-World. KW has difficulty defending and JWIII cannot shoot consistently...strange how talent is distributed...

One more thought...maybe the Lakers and Trailblazers will play for the Summer League Championship...JWIII vs ZC!!!

thebigsmoove
07-16-2018, 06:30 AM
We all want him to be successful in everything he does in life but as you state, it is summer league and they need bodies on the court to play...He is getting a lot of time and individual coaching in the Summer League and maybe someone will teach him how to correct his shooting form. I believe his inability to shoot jump shots and FT's has limited his marketability and could cost him $$$! His strengths imo are his ability to defend the SF, PF and C positions; work ethic; and being a team player.

If one could combine KW and JWIII into one player, then that player would be All-World. KW has difficulty defending and JWIII cannot shoot consistently...strange how talent is distributed...

One more thought...maybe the Lakers and Trailblazers will play for the Summer League Championship...JWIII vs ZC!!!

So basically LeBron James? lol

IowaSERE
07-16-2018, 12:21 PM
So basically LeBron James? lol

KD

maynard g krebs
07-16-2018, 01:08 PM
I don't think JW3 has a realistic shot at the NBA; his jumper just doesn't look fixable imo. But so what? He's good enough to make a great income playing almost wherever he wants in the rest of the world (enough to be financially secure if he's sensible w/ his money), travel and experience different cultures, and have opportunities for a post-playing career in the game if he wants it.

Sounds like a great life to me.

jazzdelmar
07-16-2018, 01:56 PM
I don't think JW3 has a realistic shot at the NBA; his jumper just doesn't look fixable imo. But so what? He's good enough to make a great income playing almost wherever he wants in the rest of the world (enough to be financially secure if he's sensible w/ his money), travel and experience different cultures, and have opportunities for a post-playing career in the game if he wants it.

Sounds like a great life to me.

Agree completely

zag buddy
07-16-2018, 03:00 PM
dennis Rodman didn't do bad and couldn't shoot worth a lick.

MDABE80
07-16-2018, 03:05 PM
I've watch J3s games with this league. Not consistent enough to get a job with the bigs right now
But he'll develop nicely in the Gleague. Soon he'll be brought up if he corrects deficiencies. If not he'll be a good one in the euro leagues . Hoping for the best.

willandi
07-16-2018, 04:41 PM
J3 may well not make the team or the G league. If the Lakers are looking for an absolute minimum cost, hard working individual, he has shown that he can score, and especially rebound, against the summer league players. They aren't main stream NBA, but some will be.

Zagdawg
07-16-2018, 08:33 PM
https://twitter.com/NBA/status/1018596584144162816

MDABE80
07-16-2018, 08:38 PM
Lotsa minutes but poor shooting. Seems to be the flaw in our guys game. Might be the turning point for J3.
Championship tomorrow at 7 pm.

thebigsmoove
07-17-2018, 05:09 AM
KD

KD doesnt play defense, LBJ does.

thespywhozaggedme
07-17-2018, 05:27 AM
dennis Rodman didn't do bad and couldn't shoot worth a lick.

Completely different era. In the modern NBA if your power forward can't stretch the floor by hitting the three consistently he's completely worthless and will not even be on the roster. It's crazy to think that a first ballot Hall of Famer would not even make a current NBA roster but those are the times we live in.

ZagaholicPodcast
07-17-2018, 06:21 AM
Completely different era. In the modern NBA if your power forward can't stretch the floor by hitting the three consistently he's completely worthless and will not even be on the roster. It's crazy to think that a first ballot Hall of Famer would not even make a current NBA roster but those are the times we live in.

Clint Capela. Possibility it becomes a trend.

thespywhozaggedme
07-17-2018, 07:22 AM
He's their center.

ZagaholicPodcast
07-17-2018, 08:44 AM
He's their center.

Style and roster makeup matters more. Given the size of 5's these days, there is the possibility of those positions being interchangeable to some degree. As well, if you play for the Warriors, for instance...or even the Rockets, it's not as important for you to be able to knock down three's, because the overwhelming bulk of the touches are going elsewhere. It's a bonus, but you aren't being brought in to shoot, and it's probably not an ideal situation if you're the guy that ends up taking the shot. You also need 4's and 5's that can handle switches on high ball screens.

thespywhozaggedme
07-17-2018, 09:13 AM
Style and roster makeup matters more. Given the size of 5's these days, there is the possibility of those positions being interchangeable to some degree. As well, if you play for the Warriors, for instance...or even the Rockets, it's not as important for you to be able to knock down three's, because the overwhelming bulk of the touches are going elsewhere. It's a bonus, but you aren't being brought in to shoot, and it's probably not an ideal situation if you're the guy that ends up taking the shot. You also need 4's and 5's that can handle switches on high ball screens.

What?!?! Draymond Green is so effective because he's a pf that handles the ball like a guard and can stretch the floor with the 3 ball. Same with Ryan Anderson and PJ Tucker for the Rockets. There is no place in the modern NBA for a JWIII unless he dramatically improves his shooting
The
And c

maynard g krebs
07-17-2018, 02:23 PM
dennis Rodman didn't do bad and couldn't shoot worth a lick.

Rodman averaged 25.7 ppg and 15.7 rebounds over a 3 year college career. JW3 doesn't really compare to Rodman.

mgadfly
07-17-2018, 03:14 PM
Completely different era. In the modern NBA if your power forward can't stretch the floor by hitting the three consistently he's completely worthless and will not even be on the roster. It's crazy to think that a first ballot Hall of Famer would not even make a current NBA roster but those are the times we live in.

While I completely agree with the point you are making about the modern NBA, I think Rodman would be the exception. If Kenneth Faried can make a living without being able to stretch a defense at all, I think Rodman would get a lot of opportunities to prove his worth, even in this era. His ability to cover anybody except super quick PGs made him a huge asset defensively.

JPtheBeasta
07-17-2018, 03:44 PM
There are plenty of big men in the NBA who don’t shoot well.

Javale McGee came in for the Warriors during the playoffs last season and was some sort of revelation to the announcers because of his rebounding and hustle. I think they must be playing better ball in Europe if this is the current state of the NBA.

thespywhozaggedme
07-17-2018, 03:45 PM
While I completely agree with the point you are making about the modern NBA, I think Rodman would be the exception. If Kenneth Faried can make a living without being able to stretch a defense at all, I think Rodman would get a lot of opportunities to prove his worth, even in this era. His ability to cover anybody except super quick PGs made him a huge asset defensively.

Faried has been nailed to Denvers bench for the past 2 years and was just traded to Brooklyn in a salary dump. Brooklyn also has zero interest in resigning Jahlil Okafor, the # 3 pick in the 2015 draft, who may very well be playing in China this upcoming season because he too is a big that can not stretch defenses, plus he sucks at defense too.

thespywhozaggedme
07-17-2018, 03:46 PM
There are plenty of big men in the NBA who don’t shoot well.

Javale McGee came in for the Warriors during the playoffs last season and was some sort of revelation to the announcers because of his rebounding and hustle. I think they must be playing better ball in Europe if this is the current state of the NBA.
Well, I did specify pf's.

ZagaholicPodcast
07-17-2018, 08:35 PM
What?!?! Draymond Green is so effective because he's a pf that handles the ball like a guard and can stretch the floor with the 3 ball. Same with Ryan Anderson and PJ Tucker for the Rockets. There is no place in the modern NBA for a JWIII unless he dramatically improves his shooting
The
And c

He's shot just over 30% from 3 over the past two seasons at just 3.6 attempts per game.

Of the Top 100 in 3PA, just 17 of those were 4's (Draymond was not in that), and of those 17, only 7 were at or above 37% from the floor. As much as exec's want to preach a certain mantra and act like they are changing the game significantly, not many 4's are actually that instrumental in the 3-point game. Most don't get a ton of plays run for them to shoot it.

This is one of those moments where people have to realize that regardless of the cultural dogma within the league, and while 3-point shooting has improved among big's, I don't see there being a time where things balance out among positions, at that category. If the perception that creates that dogma keeps him from getting a gig, that's understandable, but the modern game is nowhere near what we hear about from talking heads, with regard to 4's. And there is a place for him if we're talking lesser roles.

thespywhozaggedme
07-17-2018, 09:34 PM
He's shot just over 30% from 3 over the past two seasons at just 3.6 attempts per game.

Of the Top 100 in 3PA, just 17 of those were 4's (Draymond was not in that), and of those 17, only 7 were at or above 37% from the floor. As much as exec's want to preach a certain mantra and act like they are changing the game significantly, not many 4's are actually that instrumental in the 3-point game. Most don't get a ton of plays run for them to shoot it.

This is one of those moments where people have to realize that regardless of the cultural dogma within the league, and while 3-point shooting has improved among big's, I don't see there being a time where things balance out among positions, at that category. If the perception that creates that dogma keeps him from getting a gig, that's understandable, but the modern game is nowhere near what we hear about from talking heads, with regard to 4's. And there is a place for him if we're talking lesser roles.

OK than name me a starting power forward in the NBA or even a key back up that doesn't at least poses a threat of the three ball. Off the top of my head I can't think of any.

zagfan24
07-18-2018, 05:51 AM
Traditional positions in the NBA are increasingly obsolete. Mostly, guys are slotted as ball handlers (can be a traditional point guard or point forward like LBJ and Giannis), 3 & D wings, slashers, catch and shoot wings, rim runners/protectors, and stretch bigs.

JWIII probably could have a role as a backup rim runner/protector if he had a bit more height and vertical explosiveness. As it is, I doubt he ends up finding a spot, but it was sure fun to watch him in summer league. He really ascended my list of all time favorite Zags with his effort and passion. It's a pretty short list of players who played with the intensity and commitment that he did.

willandi
07-18-2018, 05:58 AM
Traditional positions in the NBA are increasingly obsolete. Mostly, guys are slotted as ball handlers (can be a traditional point guard or point forward like LBJ and Giannis), 3 & D wings, slashers, catch and shoot wings, rim runners/protectors, and stretch bigs.

JWIII probably could have a role as a backup rim runner/protector if he had a bit more height and vertical explosiveness. As it is, I doubt he ends up finding a spot, but it was sure fun to watch him in summer league. He really ascended my list of all time favorite Zags with his effort and passion. It's a pretty short list of players who played with the intensity and commitment that he did.

I watched several games online including last night.

It looked to me that he was not going to the rim with many of his shots, but trying little layups rather than dunking. He also seemed to be rushing some shots.

He did a really good job at the pick, but when he rolled the guards didn't pass him the ball. I think that because of that he took shots out of his comfort zone, realizing that the summer league wasn't always about team play but was a lot of individuals on the same side.

He still got his boards and last night he guarded and outplayed Collins.

WyoZag
07-18-2018, 06:53 AM
OK than name me a starting power forward in the NBA or even a key back up that doesn't at least poses a threat of the three ball. Off the top of my head I can't think of any.


LaMarcus Aldridge, Derrick Favors, Julius Randle, Taj Gibson, and Larry Nance Jr. all shoot below 30%.

http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/scoring-per-game/sort/threePointFieldGoalPct/qualified/false/position/power-forwards/count/41/order/false

TexasZagFan
07-18-2018, 07:17 AM
LaMarcus Aldridge, Derrick Favors, Julius Randle, Taj Gibson, and Larry Nance Jr. all shoot below 30%.

http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/scoring-per-game/sort/threePointFieldGoalPct/qualified/false/position/power-forwards/count/41/order/false

Judging by the box score, Zach was unproductive before fouling out in less than 20 minutes.

Bogozags
07-18-2018, 07:31 AM
Judging by the box score, Zach was unproductive before fouling out in less than 20 minutes.

Besides becoming a millionaire, I wonder if he was better served leaving early or should have stayed one more year...

Zagdawg
07-18-2018, 07:42 AM
He is living his dream and getting paid for it-- as long as he continues to develop and save some of his earnings - he can be set for life with his next contract.

https://hoopshype.com/player/zach-collins/salary/

Kong-Kool-Aid
07-18-2018, 07:51 AM
Here's a fun clip for Zags fans... Williams posterizing Zach Collins.

http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=24125501

thespywhozaggedme
07-18-2018, 08:09 AM
LaMarcus Aldridge, Derrick Favors, Julius Randle, Taj Gibson, and Larry Nance Jr. all shoot below 30%.

http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/scoring-per-game/sort/threePointFieldGoalPct/qualified/false/position/power-forwards/count/41/order/false

I never mentioned a specific %, my exact words were "at least poses a threat of the three ball", Favors, Gibson and Nance, I'l give you, but Aldridge and Randle at least posed the threat. So one starter and 2 backup pf's outta 60+ are zero threat of hitting the 3. Thank you for proving my point.

Markburn1
07-18-2018, 08:18 AM
I never mentioned a specific %, my exact words were "at least poses a threat of the three ball", Favors, Gibson and Nance, I'l give you, but Aldridge and Randle at least posed the threat. So one starter and 2 backup pf's outta 60+ are zero threat of hitting the 3. Thank you for proving my point.

You said name one. He named five. Yet, you say he proved your point. Weird math and logic.

Zagdawg
07-18-2018, 08:28 AM
I am just glad he got the opportunity to play in the NBA summer league.

There are 40 forwards in the league that shoot under 30% -- JW3 will not be a starter or an all star if he makes the league -- but a bench/energy guy who fills in at a minimum salary on a team loaded with big salaries-- so there is a chance (if not there are always overseas opportunities).

WyoZag
07-18-2018, 08:36 AM
I never mentioned a specific %, my exact words were "at least poses a threat of the three ball", Favors, Gibson and Nance, I'l give you, but Aldridge and Randle at least posed the threat. So one starter and 2 backup pf's outta 60+ are zero threat of hitting the 3. Thank you for proving my point.

I would take "threat" to mean a guy that would take/make 3pt. fgs, i.e. someone you have to guard out to the three point line.

Hence the reason I started with individual shooting percentage. There are plenty of power forwards in the NBA within your definition shooting better than 30%, but average less than one attempt per game. To me, taking less than one attempt per game isn't someone that's a "threat." I'm no basketball genius, but I'd let Aldridge shoot threes at 29% and opposed to letting him work from the elbow or baseline.

Anyhow, Markburn1 is right, the absoluteness of your request sought one guy. I gave you five and didn't try very hard.

thespywhozaggedme
07-18-2018, 08:54 AM
You said name one. He named five. Yet, you say he proved your point. Weird math and logic.

My point was that in todays modern NBA if a pf doesn't at least pose the threat of being able to keep defenses honest by being able to hit the 3 ball, he will not have a place in the NBA. There are over 60 pf's, starter and backups, and he came up with 3 that pose no threat of making a 3 pointer.

raise the zag
07-18-2018, 08:59 AM
I am just glad he got the opportunity to play in the NBA summer league.



Indeed. Top Euro scouts watch the Summer League like a hawk.

Many of their top signees are NBA journeyman, or Summer League players showing well. It will be up to J3 whether he wants to chance it in G League or overseas -- he is likely to earn way more money abroad.

WyoZag
07-18-2018, 09:11 AM
My point was that in todays modern NBA if a pf doesn't at least pose the threat of being able to keep defenses honest by being able to hit the 3 ball, he will not have a place in the NBA. There are over 60 pf's, starter and backups, and he came up with 3 that pose o threat of making a 3 pointer.

David West disagrees. He's a career 26.5% 3pt. shooter with $90MM is career earnings and two titles in thirteen years. There is absolutely a place for a guy who doesn't shoot it from beyond the arc. He's gotta be tough as nails and do other things for his team.

I acknowledge the majority of PFs shoot in today's NBA have the ability to shoot the three ball. But, can we stop talking in absolutes? Taking five minutes to look refutes what you're saying.

MDABE80
07-18-2018, 09:24 AM
Our guy is getting a lot of minutes so the Lakers are getting a long look. He may eek out a spot. Shooting is the only thing
holding him back. He needs to practice that till his hands fall off . If he does, he'll get a job in the NBA. Otherwise it's likely he'll be touring Europe.

bballbeachbum
07-18-2018, 09:31 AM
He really ascended my list of all time favorite Zags with his effort and passion. It's a pretty short list of players who played with the intensity and commitment that he did.



Zagdawg
I am just glad he got the opportunity to play in the NBA summer league.

There are 40 forwards in the league that shoot under 30% -- JW3 will not be a starter or an all star if he makes the league -- but a bench/energy guy who fills in at a minimum salary on a team loaded with big salaries-- so there is a chance (if not there are always overseas opportunities).

+1

and thanks for the link Kong-Kool-Aid, yowza

ZagaholicPodcast
07-18-2018, 09:47 AM
I would take "threat" to mean a guy that would take/make 3pt. fgs, i.e. someone you have to guard out to the three point line.

Hence the reason I started with individual shooting percentage. There are plenty of power forwards in the NBA within your definition shooting better than 30%, but average less than one attempt per game. To me, taking less than one attempt per game isn't someone that's a "threat." I'm no basketball genius, but I'd let Aldridge shoot threes at 29% and opposed to letting him work from the elbow or baseline.

Anyhow, Markburn1 is right, the absoluteness of your request sought one guy. I gave you five and didn't try very hard.

Attempts per game is an important statistic. If you are a threat, then I would assume some plays are going to get run for you, or you're going to not be passing up on shots when you get them at that distance. I would even say taking 3 a game might put you on the low end, depending on the team you are with. A true, definitive conversation needs far more variables than this....but at the very least we can get a good idea of things via- 3pt% and attempts per game. Also, I do not think a 30%-ish shooter is a "threat" level percentage. Would we consider this GU team a 3pt shooting threat if every single player shot 30% identically? I don't think we would.

I am sure we could even go back into posts about Clarke and see where it was felt that he needed to be at the mid-high 30's, at least to be a viable shooting prospect at the next level.

thespywhozaggedme
07-18-2018, 09:55 AM
David West disagrees. He's a career 26.5% 3pt. shooter with $90MM is career earnings and two titles in thirteen years. There is absolutely a place for a guy who doesn't shoot it from beyond the arc. He's gotta be tough as nails and do other things for his team.

I acknowledge the majority of PFs shoot in today's NBA have the ability to shoot the three ball. But, can we stop talking in absolutes? Taking five minutes to look refutes what you're saying.

David West is at the end of his career and barely even plays anymore. In his prime, yes, the type of player that he was could and did flourish. This is past his prime. Again, we have listed 3 pf's that are either starters or get major minutes out of over 60 that are not any threat whatsoever of stretching defenses with the 3 ball. You're correct, 3 outta 60+ isn't an "absolute" but it's pretty darn close. Anyway, you're arguing just to argue at this point, and I'm just repeating myself.

thespywhozaggedme
07-18-2018, 09:57 AM
Our guy is getting a lot of minutes so the Lakers are getting a long look. He may eek out a spot. Shooting is the only thing
holding him back. He needs to practice that till his hands fall off . If he does, he'll get a job in the NBA. Otherwise it's likely he'll be touring Europe.

They may offer him a spot on their G League team, but he can't shoot and that's gonna hurt him to ever make the big league team. Look who they drafted, Svi and Mo Wagner, a 6'8 wing and a 6'11 euro who played at Michigan that can shoot the three. Same with their pf pick last season, Kuzma. I don't know why some posters (not you Abe) are arguing with me about this NBA trend, it's a fact.

mgadfly
07-18-2018, 10:27 AM
Faried has been nailed to Denvers bench for the past 2 years and was just traded to Brooklyn in a salary dump. Brooklyn also has zero interest in resigning Jahlil Okafor, the # 3 pick in the 2015 draft, who may very well be playing in China this upcoming season because he too is a big that can not stretch defenses, plus he sucks at defense too.

To this and your name me even 1 PF that doesn't at least have the threat of a three ball...


First, I'm agreeing with you that the game has trended, to a severe degree, toward stretch PFs. If Heytvelt was coming out of college now his style would fit the league a lot better than it did even ten years ago. But that isn't the point I'm making. The idea that NO ONE can play in the league if they can't stretch the defense is just not true.

Taj Gibson took 35 three pointers, but no one can credibly call him a stretch 4. I'm certainly going to give him that shot as much as he wants it. He played in every game last season and averaged over 33 minutes.

Julius Randle made 10 three pointers. He played every game, nearly 29 minutes per game.

In today's NBA they have guys shoot three pointers when they can't hit better than about 20% of them. Rodman was never asked to take those bad shots, but the idea that he couldn't have gone 10-55 or something on a season if he played in the modern NBA is just speculation. For his career, he shot 23%. They'd probably have him heaving two or three a game and then chasing down his long rebounds.

I think Rodman would start in today's NBA. There are guys that shoot way worse than him starting as PFs (only a couple though) and his career percentage from threes probably means someone in the NBA would try to do what OKC did to Sabonis, turn him into a stretch 4.

Vanzagger
07-18-2018, 10:37 AM
Anyone have vid of Sabonis and JW3 battling. It’s a mans game

ZagaholicPodcast
07-18-2018, 06:51 PM
They may offer him a spot on their G League team, but he can't shoot and that's gonna hurt him to ever make the big league team. Look who they drafted, Svi and Mo Wagner, a 6'8 wing and a 6'11 euro who played at Michigan that can shoot the three. Same with their pf pick last season, Kuzma. I don't know why some posters (not you Abe) are arguing with me about this NBA trend, it's a fact.

Because it's not a fact, it's a flawed narrative.

raise the zag
07-19-2018, 03:18 AM
Anyone watch J3 posterize Zach Collins in transition?

Really great and quick dunk by him seen here:

https://youtu.be/ohtHcwwXhLQ

Bogozags
07-19-2018, 06:09 AM
As much as I think JWIII has a skill set for the next level (minus his ability to shoot) I believe his odds of making an NBA roster at this point in his career are pretty darn long. We all know his drive to succeed but I think there are several players in the G-League and overseas that have similar skills to JWIII. He needs to be able to stand out above those players so that NBA GM's/Coaches take notice of him. Salary is one thing in his favor, because he would be willing to accept the league minimum. If he could get invited to camp that would give him an opportunity to be "coached" into shooting correctly (not sure why the GU Staff didn't correct this flaw) and see his willingness to work hard to improve upon his present skills as well as strengthening those skill requiring immediate attention. Let's hope his time with the Lakers is extending to training camp!

willandi
07-20-2018, 07:42 PM
Lakers just signed Michael Beasley which has to reduce any long shot chance.

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/24152153/michael-beasley-los-angeles-lakers-agree-1-year-35m-contract