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View Full Version : What does the WCC need to do?



Outraged
03-25-2018, 01:19 PM
I will start:

1. Allowcate NCCA conference winnings based on RPI or a quadrant system. Reward what gets the conference bids. Reward performance penalize under achievement.

2. Only contribute for 200+ rpi Occ home opponents.

3. Add a school like SMU ask a school to leave if their Rpi falls below 300 for multiple years.


4. Allocate TV earnings based on ratings.

jazzdelmar
03-25-2018, 01:23 PM
I will start:

1. Allowcate NCCA conference winnings based on RPI or a quadrant system. Reward what gets the conference bids. Reward performance penalize under achievement.

2. Only contribute for 200+ rpi Occ home opponents.

3. Add a school like SMU ask a school to leave if their Rpi falls below 300 for multiple years.


4. Allocate TV earnings based on ratings.

Those are your starting points?

Outraged
03-25-2018, 01:27 PM
Yes, those are my starting points. I think the WCC could be a consistent three bid conference if it was managed better.

former1dog
03-25-2018, 02:00 PM
Outraged, I don't believe that there is anything the "WCC" can do to improve men's basketball in the conference.

I've pointed out in a couple of different threads and have provided proof that there is no lack of financial resources in any of the WCC schools with the possible exception of UP. In terms of endowment size, Gonzaga is 8th or 9th out of the 10 conference schools.

What it boils down to is the individual schools deciding that athletics or MBB are priorities and putting resources towards the improvement.

I have read that that is exactly what USF is doing. I have been told that SCU is doing the same. We have no worries with BYU and resources for athletics. I'm not sure on most of the rest although I have a suspicion that LMU and Pepperdine, 2 schools that are $$Loaded, have no interest in athletics.

75Zag
03-25-2018, 02:04 PM
ESPN is not going to renew its broadcast rights agreement with the WCC. There is nothing the WCC can do about that. Once ESPN goes away, and if GU stays in the WCC, they need to strengthen their relationships with Root Sports and KHQ to keep as many GU games on Spokane and Pacific NW regional television as possible. ESPN will sign a new comprehensive agreement with the MWC for basketball broadcasts IF GU joins MWC, but as others have noted the MWC is not perfect, so maybe GU sits tight in the WCC, goes with regional-only television coverage for a few years, and waits for some sort of link with a new division of an Eastern league in 4 or 5 years.

Go Bulldogs!

former1dog
03-25-2018, 02:20 PM
ESPN is not going to renew its broadcast rights agreement with the WCC.

Is this speculation on your part or did I miss a press release?

strikenowhere
03-25-2018, 02:25 PM
ESPN is not going to renew its broadcast rights agreement with the WCC. There is nothing the WCC can do about that. Once ESPN goes away, and if GU stays in the WCC, they need to strengthen their relationships with Root Sports and KHQ to keep as many GU games on Spokane and Pacific NW regional television as possible. ESPN will sign a new comprehensive agreement with the MWC for basketball broadcasts IF GU joins MWC, but as others have noted the MWC is not perfect, so maybe GU sits tight in the WCC, goes with regional-only television coverage for a few years, and waits for some sort of link with a new division of an Eastern league in 4 or 5 years.

Go Bulldogs!

Other than Few leaving this would be the worst possible thing to happen to the program.

MileHigh
03-25-2018, 02:39 PM
Try to replace Gonzaga and BYU with Grand Canyon and Denver. Two private schools without football that are looking to leave their current conferences

75Zag
03-25-2018, 02:40 PM
Is this speculation on your part or did I miss a press release?

No, and No.

Go Bulldogs!

former1dog
03-25-2018, 02:42 PM
No, and No.

Go Bulldogs!


Ok. Inside track. Good for you and thanks for sharing a tidbit.

Hoopaholic
03-25-2018, 04:14 PM
ESPN is not going to renew its broadcast rights agreement with the WCC. There is nothing the WCC can do about that. Once ESPN goes away, and if GU stays in the WCC, they need to strengthen their relationships with Root Sports and KHQ to keep as many GU games on Spokane and Pacific NW regional television as possible. ESPN will sign a new comprehensive agreement with the MWC for basketball broadcasts IF GU joins MWC, but as others have noted the MWC is not perfect, so maybe GU sits tight in the WCC, goes with regional-only television coverage for a few years, and waits for some sort of link with a new division of an Eastern league in 4 or 5 years.

Go Bulldogs!

Or create their own streaming broadcast tv?

bartruff1
03-25-2018, 04:46 PM
They have to go back to being the California League and forget any notion that they are ever going to be anything but a low mid major with a automatic bid....they need to get real and accept the fact that they cannot compete with the PAC and the Professional Teams for fan support....and I think they know that...

willandi
03-25-2018, 04:51 PM
They have to go back to being the California League and forget any notion that they are ever going to be anything but a low mid major with a automatic bid....they need to get real and accept the fact that they cannot compete with the PAC and the Professional Teams for fan support....and I think they know that...

Perhaps the WCC could contract and cut off those schools that have the wherewithal but not the desire to invest in athletics. If the cut LMU and Pepperdine, it would be a statement.

bartruff1
03-25-2018, 05:00 PM
It makes no financial sense for the teams in WCC to invest in a top 30 program...none....a waste of money...... they cannot compete with the Warriors....the Clippers....the Lakers....or even Stanford, UCLA, Cal, SC.....

Ezag
03-25-2018, 07:49 PM
if the WCC dropped the bottom 6 teams, it would improve dramatically!

former1dog
03-25-2018, 07:55 PM
It makes no financial sense for the teams in WCC to invest in a top 30 program...none....a waste of money...... they cannot compete with the Warriors....the Clippers....the Lakers....or even Stanford, UCLA, Cal, SC.....

I think on a short term projected balance sheet, you're 100% correct. But, I don't believe the folks at USF and SCU who are going forward with investments in athletics are stupid so they must see some light at the end of the tunnel.

bartruff1
03-25-2018, 09:12 PM
I am positive they are not stupid....they see the opportunities and limitations of their circumstances and will invest appropriately....it is just my judgement that won't reach the level of a top 30 program....they are not in a tunnel...they are basking is the winter sun in the Bay Area ........and as Mr.Few has said......will do what is right for their programs.......

Nevada Don
03-25-2018, 09:41 PM
1) I think the WCC ESPN contract goes through 2018/2019. It was an 8 or 10 year extension.
2) I thought ESPN liked the WCC because they need a) Thursday and Saturday games and b) because the West Coast times gives them a late night East Coast fill-in ?
3) Some here are saying emphatically that If GU leaves, ESPN won't want the WCC contract. That may be 100% correct. It seems though like I see even lower RPI rated conferences with ESPN contracts. I may be wrong.

webspinnre
03-25-2018, 10:21 PM
The biggest issue with ESPN is that they've been struggling financially, and cutting back on spending, including things like contracts for lower level slots, which I imagine the WCC would count as. Now, they might pay just to keep Gonzaga, but due to changes in the market in the last 5-10 years, I wouldn't be shocked to see them drop the WCC, which would be terrible for us.

Birddog
03-26-2018, 03:48 AM
A short read about ESPN with some facts that everyone should know. Remember, ESPN still needs content. Not mentioned in the article is how much bleeding is the result of ESPN's NFL Football contract. Did you know that if you have an ESPN bundled service that you are paying over $21 a year for NFL Football whether you watch it or not?

http://www.businessinsider.com/espn-is-making-more-money-than-ever-off-of-subscribers-2017-12


As Dan Le Batard recently noted, "ESPN is not losing money... The difference between making a grotesque amount of money and then making a slightly less grotesque amount of money is not the same as failing."

Birddog
03-26-2018, 05:05 AM
Something else to chew on.
From 2016 (most recent I could google) here are the college basketball value rankings.

"The valuations of 176 major college basketball programs based on what each would be worth on the open market, based on revenues, expenses and other factors."

39) Gonzaga 57.962M

61 SDSU 37.871M
75 UNM 31.249M
83 UNLV 26.947M
84 *BYU 26.135M*
89 Nev 24.281M
94 BSU 19.805M
96 CSU 18.370M
97 Wyo 17.530M
100 USU 16.951M
107 Fres 14.592M
148 SJSU 8.171M

Neither Air Force nor any other WCC team made the list of the top 176. 8 of the 10 MWC teams fall in between 75 and 100. I was surprised at BYU's rank.

Interestingly, only 4 private schools rank ahead of GU, (Syracuse, Duke, Xavier, and Marquette)
I'm not sure what any of this means, just found it a way to compare.
source: https://graphics.wsj.com/table/COUNT_0330

thebigsmoove
03-26-2018, 05:27 AM
As 75 said, I dont beleive the WCC (even with Gonzaga) will be getting a new ESPN deal. I think there are other potential suitors like CBS sports, Facebook/Stadium, Fox Sports, etc.

The move to the MWC is a formality at this point, as Mike Roth and Mark Few have said, "We will do whats best for Gonzaga". Staying in the WCC without access to ESPN is not whats best for Gonzaga. Staying in the WCC without the chance to continue to grow revenue to fulfill our Universities mission statement is not whats best for Gonzaga. The MWC, while not the golden goose, stands to be our best bet at staying relevant going forward. I dont believe moving to the MWC would stop us from continuing to reach out to larger conferences in the event that one day those opportunities will present themselves.

Coach Crazy
03-26-2018, 06:02 AM
I'll give what I would find acceptable for the WCC, in order for me to want to say:

1. Cut all revenue sharing. If there are several schools that are higher on the wealth totem pole, they don't need our revenue from winning. Especially when they are not committed to winning.
2. Cut the bottom 4 or 5 teams from the conference, and have teams that are either higher in RPI, or are spending like that kind of program.
3. Go to a pod scheduling system that allows for more OOC games.
4. Make it mandatory that all schools will compete in season tournament prior to conference play, and must schedule to a certain level of Quadrant/RPI/Kenpom/Sagarin etc..
5. All schools must commit a certain level of funding to basketball or pay a fine.

Pretty straight forward. Otherwise, Reece's Pieces, kids. Time for the MWC. Which needs new branding.

rennis
03-26-2018, 06:20 AM
if the WCC dropped the bottom 6 teams, it would improve dramatically!

Which bottom 6? It's a different 6 every year.

bartruff1
03-26-2018, 06:21 AM
I think Gonzaga has worn out it's welcome in the WCC and only has one choice..... the Mountain West..... and has lost all leverage with them as they have no alternative...

The worse case is that they will lose millions in earned units and have to play a lame duck season in the WCC...

The whole thing has been a disaster from the start..... from hiring a consultant with questionable character and objectivity.... to negotiating in the media.

thebigsmoove
03-26-2018, 06:28 AM
if the WCC dropped the bottom 6 teams, it would improve dramatically!

Or the Bottom 7 while we are at it. Maybe we should join up with Saint Mary's and BYU to form a 3 team mini conference. :roll:

thebigsmoove
03-26-2018, 06:30 AM
I think Gonzaga has worn out it's welcome in the WCC and only has one choice..... the Mountain West..... and has lost all leverage with them as they have no alternative...

The worse case is that they will lose millions in earned units and have to play a lame duck season in the WCC...

The whole thing has been a disaster from the start..... from hiring a consultant with questionable character and objectivity.... to negotiating in the media.

Jeez Man, you been taking your anti-depressants?

gonstu
03-26-2018, 06:36 AM
Or the Bottom 7 while we are at it. Maybe we should join up with Saint Mary's and BYU to form a 3 team mini conference. :roll:

Sounds good. Each team plays each other 8 times during conference. 1-seed gets automatic BYE to the conference tourney championship game.

Birddog
03-26-2018, 06:43 AM
to negotiating in the media.
Bart, I think Craig Thompson can be blamed for that. He let the cat out of the bag and I sense that Roth and Few weren't too happy about it either. Thompson's revelation certainly wasn't choreographed with GU.

bartruff1
03-26-2018, 06:49 AM
Bart, I think Craig Thompson can be blamed for that. He let the cat out of the bag and I sense that Roth and Few weren't too happy about it either. Thompson's revelation certainly wasn't choreographed with GU.

No doubt, Thompson is a moron....seems to me....BYU's Holmoe has played his cards close to his vest....and with class....they will be welcome in both leagues...

thebigsmoove
03-26-2018, 06:50 AM
Bart, I think Craig Thompson can be blamed for that. He let the cat out of the bag and I sense that Roth and Few weren't too happy about it either. Thompson's revelation certainly wasn't choreographed with GU.

Which was probably the point. Craig Thompson or "Hair" as a lot of the MWC board folks call him, was using that as leverage to force GUs hand. This was very much an attempt by him to force the negotiation to take place.

Zagceo
03-26-2018, 06:51 AM
I think Gonzaga has worn out it's welcome in the WCC and only has one choice..... the Mountain West..... and has lost all leverage with them as they have no alternative...

The worse case is that they will lose millions in earned units and have to play a lame duck season in the WCC...

The whole thing has been a disaster from the start..... from hiring a consultant with questionable character and objectivity.... to negotiating in the media.

You have no idea what your talking about.

Just bitter and angry believing you won’t get your way....when no decision has even been made.

Zagsker
03-26-2018, 06:57 AM
You have no idea what your talking about.

Just bitter and angry believing you won’t get your way....when no decision has even been made.

Oh, it has been made...going to be announced on Easter Sunday by posters local pastors while handing out communion...each host is going to have a "MWC" logo pressed in it

Coach Crazy
03-26-2018, 07:11 AM
You have no idea what your talking about.

Just bitter and angry believing you won’t get your way....when no decision has even been made.

This. It's funny to watch the crowd that was playing things cool and talking up the "Mike is a great AD, he takes the time to listen to us, I trust him" line turn to "Oh my gosh, no! My legs are on fire! The house is burning down! I can't move!".

People usually show their true colors, at some point. I trust the person I speak with in private about things I would like to know concerning GU hoops. I won't be surprised if Gonzaga stays in the WCC. I will be overjoyed if they leave.