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Zags11
03-03-2018, 07:57 PM
Zags win 83-69.



It was a ugly game for a long while. Tillie and JW3 really saved us tonight IMO. Zn and Silas chipped in. JP didn't have a good game.

The thing that worries me is the 3pt defense. Its always been a Achilles heal for us minus last yr. This year it seems even worse. The zags advance to Monday again and get their feet under them.


What games by jw3 and Tillie. Wow!

Ezag
03-03-2018, 08:02 PM
Tillie, JW3 played great. Norvell not bad. 3pt defense has always been our Achilles since I started watching GU ball in 1995

MontanaCoyote
03-03-2018, 08:05 PM
Like starting your car at 30 below it took a while. But the boys warmed up PDG!

Tighten up that 3 D though!

willandi
03-03-2018, 08:06 PM
Zags win 83-69.



It was a ugly game for a long while. Tillie and JW3 really saved us tonight IMO. Zn and Silas chipped in. JP didn't have a good game.

The thing that worries me is the 3pt defense. Its always been a Achilles heal for us minus last yr. This year it seems even worse. The zags advance to Monday again and get their feet under them.


What games by jw3 and Tillie. Wow!

JP with 4 boards, 6 assists and 1 TO...seems like a good game to me. And he scored.


STATS: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/boxscore?gameId=401020612

GU69
03-03-2018, 08:06 PM
Kind of amazing that we won by 14 after such a terrible first half. The second half went a little more the way it should have. Tillie and JW3 carried the team. Several other guys had an off game.

LouisianaZag
03-03-2018, 08:06 PM
What a 2nd half Maybe the best half since the 1st half against Iowa State early last season

Birddog
03-03-2018, 08:16 PM
Zags shot 61% from the floor including a dismal first half but only 50% from the charity stripe. That has to change.

All Weather Fan
03-03-2018, 08:21 PM
LMU free throw defense was tough !

TexasZagFan
03-03-2018, 08:22 PM
If this is how we start after a week off, I'm really worried about Dancing with two weeks off.

Reborn
03-03-2018, 08:26 PM
Gonzaga 83
LMU 69

Great second half as Zags score 55 in second half. They shot 61% for the game, and 60% from behind the 3 pt line. Zags shoot 12-20 from behind the 3. Norvell hit 4-6 and Tillie 5-5 from behind the arc. Zags take in 41 rebounds but commit 14 turnovers. (bad). Williams got a double-double again with ten boards and 20 points, and Tillie had 24 points and 5-5 from behind the arc.. Hachimura also gathers in 10 rebounds.

I Rui had a real good second half, especially guarding #5. Melson, once again played extremely lazy and casual defense. I really don't know what's gottin into him. Looks lazy as heck. However players like Williams and Tillie were beasts. They totally controlled the game. Williams is just too tough. I thought Perkins played a great game accept for his 0-3 from the free throw line. Actually the Zags shot poorly from there, only making 50%. Zach Norvell continues to impress me. IMO he's the most improved player on the team. He had a real solid game tonight with 17 points, making 6 out of 8 shots and 4 for 6 from the 3 pt line. He is always giving it 100% imo.

I wasn't too happy at half time as Gonzaga only scored 27 points, and looked very lethargic and playing mostly 1 on 1 selfish basketball. It appeared to me that Few had a lot to say at half time. They played Gonzaga basketball the second half scoring 54 points. They only led by one point at half-time. So WE ARE MOVING ON!

Go Zags!!!

willandi
03-03-2018, 08:32 PM
As much as I like Rui...his game isn't driving the length of the floor and shooting soft shots over the defense.

He has had some good full court drives, but the team is better when he dishes.

raise the zag
03-03-2018, 08:33 PM
Is Rui secretly becoming a shut down defender?

Seems like whenever Tillie or J3, or even our guards, are struggling with certain guys in the 1st half, we put Rui on them, & they disappear down the stretch.

Whatever he does, it works.

bballbeachbum
03-03-2018, 08:35 PM
Is Rui secretly becoming a shut down defender?

Seems like whenever Tillie or J3 are struggling with certain guys in the 1st half, we put Rui on them, & they disappear down the stretch.

Whatever he does, it works.

he's also become a go to closer late on O

TexasZagFan
03-03-2018, 08:53 PM
Is Rui secretly becoming a shut down defender?

Seems like whenever Tillie or J3, or even our guards, are struggling with certain guys in the 1st half, we put Rui on them, & they disappear down the stretch.

Whatever he does, it works.

What makes Rui so dangerous coming off the bench, particularly in the second half, is that he's not fatigued, has fresh legs to put to work on defense. On offense, I haven't seen anyone in the WCC able to consistently defend him one on one. He was a deserving first team all conference.

MontanaCoyote
03-03-2018, 08:59 PM
If this is how we start after a week off, I'm really worried about Dancing with two weeks off.

Is it really 2 weeks? Knew it was a while, but that's just soooooo toooooo loooong! Will have me worried too! First
Dance opponent WILL be tougher than LMU, too.

ZagsGoZags
03-03-2018, 09:05 PM
first half there was not the ball movement and passing I expect to see from a zag team, also lots of guys went for solo attempts to score early in the clock, also did not look like zag ball.
second half we looked like ourselves
final score does not reflect what the game was like for the first 30 minutes of PT.

TexasZagFan
03-03-2018, 09:07 PM
Is it really 2 weeks? Knew it was a while, but that's just soooooo toooooo loooong! Will have me worried too! First
Dance opponent WILL be tougher than LMU, too.

Let me revise and extend my remarks. If we play in the championship game on Monday, it will be at worst ten days between games. The good news is our opponent will not have played 3 games against us in the last two months.

Plainsman
03-03-2018, 09:11 PM
Watching their two guards penetrate rings around us makes me long to see some of those moves from Josh. But not to be at this stage of his career, I fear.

allnet59
03-03-2018, 09:13 PM
JP with 4 boards, 6 assists and 1 TO...seems like a good game to me. And he scored.


STATS: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/boxscore?gameId=401020612

Perkins played ok on the offensive end but his defense is very porous at best. Can't defend the three and gets beat to often on the dribble drive.

Zags11
03-03-2018, 09:54 PM
JP with 4 boards, 6 assists and 1 TO...seems like a good game to me. And he scored.


STATS: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/boxscore?gameId=401020612

Yea u are right.

sheps001
03-03-2018, 10:19 PM
Never tried to start my car at -30. The coldest it ever got in Chicago (where I'm from) was -27 (in 1985) and mine didn't start. My (future) wife's Honda Accord did but the clutch froze up! The wind was 25 to 35 MPH and the wind chill was something like -70 or so. Oh yes it was humid because of the lake and no one in their right mind went out except to keep the cars running. We don't get weather like that anymore here because of global warming and I'm glad of that (to that extent). We are moving to South Florida in three weeks and can't wait. Throwing the snow brush away for good! GO ZAGS! PS Went to the Law School in the early '70's and remember the real old Spokane. I remember them tearing down the old train trestles and that was another time and place.

RenoZag
03-04-2018, 05:57 AM
John Blanchette column:

http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2018/mar/03/john-blanchette-gonzaga-coaches-sweat-through-quar/#/0


“You look back at our history in these things, and it’s always been a struggle,” Few said. “But they’re tough on everybody. I watched Michigan State barely get by Wisconsin the other day.

“You get a heavy favorite who already knows they’re playing in the NCAA Tournament and a team with not just nothing to lose, but a lot to gain. And you can talk ’til you’re blue in the face to your guys about it, but it’s hard to get the message across.”

mgadfly
03-04-2018, 06:05 AM
Let me revise and extend my remarks. If we play in the championship game on Monday, it will be at worst ten days between games. The good news is our opponent will not have played 3 games against us in the last two months.

Isnít the champion game on Tuesday?

Zagger
03-04-2018, 06:34 AM
Isn’t the champion game on Tuesday?

Si! Due to BYU no games on Sunday :)

Coach Crazy
03-04-2018, 06:46 AM
John Blanchette column:

http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2018/mar/03/john-blanchette-gonzaga-coaches-sweat-through-quar/#/0

Great quote. Goes to what I've said before: these guys don't care to a certain degree, and neither would I. I would have a hard time as a coach, on some level, trying to get these guys to get up for a game like this. Yes, you want to always be ready, and yes it can come back to bite you if you can't turn things on with the flip of a switch. But I also get how boring it would be to walk out on the court just about every night, and have to play garbage teams.

The kind of motivation you need there is not the kind that most on this board would find palatable.

TexasZagFan
03-04-2018, 08:00 AM
Isn’t the champion game on Tuesday?

You are correct, my apologies. If the Zags played on the second day next week (Friday), the gap between games is ten days, so at least I got that right.

mgadfly
03-04-2018, 08:06 AM
You are correct, my apologies. If the Zags played on the second day next week (Friday), the gap between games is ten days, so at least I got that right.

What if we get an 11 seed and play in the First Four on Tuesday?

Just saying there is a path to only a week off. lol

bballbeachbum
03-04-2018, 10:26 AM
Great quote. Goes to what I've said before: these guys don't care to a certain degree, and neither would I. I would have a hard time as a coach, on some level, trying to get these guys to get up for a game like this. Yes, you want to always be ready, and yes it can come back to bite you if you can't turn things on with the flip of a switch. But I also get how boring it would be to walk out on the court just about every night, and have to play garbage teams.

The kind of motivation you need there is not the kind that most on this board would find palatable.

I think we all get it Coach and have discussed it a lot over the many years. Most Zag teams would get RIPPED here for not being able to be ready for all these games labelled boring, and the players have worn collars for those games eternally here...well, some of the players ;)

anyway, in truth, isn't it just a different test, one that a team like Barcelona has to pass just about every week too? It's not just the Zags in this type of situation (I know, the La Liga example isn't exactly the same, but it makes a point hopefully).

I'm not disagreeing from a fan stand point so much, but as a player, being bored isn't such a good look whether excused away or not.

I don't think that's what happened though, I think it's the empowerment of the players with nothing to lose and everything to gain which is the added dynamic that can mix the tournaments up like what Few said

Zagceo
03-04-2018, 10:32 AM
didn't watch game live...watching reply now..nobody has given Loyola any credit on this thread..I will..

Loyola didn't look or play like 11-20 team last night. Athletic disciplined and played clean

lost big Markusson down 6 w/ 7 min remaining

yes Zags played loose and bit outta control at times...but gonna give Loyola little credit for that to

JPtheBeasta
03-04-2018, 10:47 AM
I don't like the characterization of teams like LMU as "garbage teams." I'm sure that many fans of P5 schools thought of the Zags as a garbage team for several years into their run. We looked like a "garbage team" in the first half last night.These are all still D-1 athletes that the Zags play against, and they have to grind it out every year to get better and are still more physical and skilled than most. LMU put out a good effort last night, and I think they contributed to the Zags' poor shooting in the first half before they got gassed in the second. Typically, each one of these WCC teams has at least one guy who can flat our score. The Zag key to success has been having more of those types of guys than the rest, as well as a good coaching staff and players who were willing to put personal ambition aside for the needs of the team.

This Zag team this year has experienced having to put out a concerted effort to put away some of these so-called garbage teams. (the recent game against Pepperdine comes to mind.) I think it's not likely that they overlook anyone- not with the respect that the coaching staff show for their opponents in interviews. This staff has been trying to convince the rest of the country for 10+ years that these games can be hard to win against hungry teams who are playing for their only chance to be in the tournament, and in front of opposing crowds that make it a basketball Superbowl every year. You cannot underestimate heart, and these WCC teams reaffirm that every year.

I personally think the real issue is that they don't show that toughness and determination enough against teams that don't have Gonzaga on their jerseys, but that's probably a post for another day.

former1dog
03-04-2018, 11:05 AM
didn't watch game live...watching reply now..nobody has given Loyola any credit on this thread..I will..

Loyola didn't look or play like 11-20 team last night. Athletic disciplined and played clean

lost big Markusson down 6 w/ 7 min remaining

yes Zags played loose and bit outta control at times...but gonna give Loyola little credit for that to


LMU has been on the upswing, recently beating BYU. They really athletic players and a 7'3" big bodied center who isn't a stiff, IMO.

LMU's defense deserves equal credit with Gonzaga's carelessness for the first half turnovers and score.

If if folks were expecting a total blow out in a third game I would have advised against that expectation.

Coach Crazy
03-04-2018, 04:29 PM
I think we all get it Coach and have discussed it a lot over the many years. Most Zag teams would get RIPPED here for not being able to be ready for all these games labelled boring, and the players have worn collars for those games eternally here...well, some of the players ;)

anyway, in truth, isn't it just a different test, one that a team like Barcelona has to pass just about every week too? It's not just the Zags in this type of situation (I know, the La Liga example isn't exactly the same, but it makes a point hopefully).

I'm not disagreeing from a fan stand point so much, but as a player, being bored isn't such a good look whether excused away or not.

I don't think that's what happened though, I think it's the empowerment of the players with nothing to lose and everything to gain which is the added dynamic that can mix the tournaments up like what Few said

I understand that. And I agree that that you have to get up for even the games in which there is really nothing to get up for. And yes, if you don't, the lack of execution can creep up on you in a game that actually matters.

So, it comes down to how you motivate. And I would just tap into a different type of motivation. I wouldn't sell it the same as some coaches. And what I would sell would is less Pleasantville than some would hope for here.

I don't respect the majority of the programs in this conference. I don't look at them as actual basketball teams. Just useless fodder that we have trudge through out of technicality. You have to earn my respect. And all I have been shown is that the majority of these teams are just a waste of time, effort, and resources? Convince me otherwise.

TexasZagFan
03-04-2018, 06:43 PM
I understand that. And I agree that that you have to get up for even the games in which there is really nothing to get up for. And yes, if you don't, the lack of execution can creep up on you in a game that actually matters.

So, it comes down to how you motivate. And I would just tap into a different type of motivation. I wouldn't sell it the same as some coaches. And what I would sell would is less Pleasantville than some would hope for here.

I don't respect the majority of the programs in this conference. I don't look at them as actual basketball teams. Just useless fodder that we have trudge through out of technicality. You have to earn my respect. And all I have been shown is that the majority of these teams are just a waste of time, effort, and resources? Convince me otherwise.

Can't be done.

Current win streaks vs. conference foes:

BYU 2
LMU 19
Pacific 12
Pepp 35
Portland 10
SMC 1
USD 8
USF 13
SCU 17


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gonzaga_Bulldogs_men%27s_basketball#Record_vs._WCC _opponents (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gonzaga_Bulldogs_men%27s_basketball#Record_vs._WCC _opponents)

That wiki page is chock full of info.

bballbeachbum
03-04-2018, 06:43 PM
I understand that. And I agree that that you have to get up for even the games in which there is really nothing to get up for. And yes, if you don't, the lack of execution can creep up on you in a game that actually matters.

So, it comes down to how you motivate. And I would just tap into a different type of motivation. I wouldn't sell it the same as some coaches. And what I would sell would is less Pleasantville than some would hope for here.

I don't respect the majority of the programs in this conference. I don't look at them as actual basketball teams. Just useless fodder that we have trudge through out of technicality. You have to earn my respect. And all I have been shown is that the majority of these teams are just a waste of time, effort, and resources? Convince me otherwise.

Coach, you can respect or not respect whatever you'd like; as a fan, it doesn't matter in the equation like it does for the Zag players..agree?

so with regards to what we were talking about--the difference between a fan in this situation, like us, and the players and coaches--sticking to what I said originally, that being a bored Gonzaga basketball player is not a good look to be excused away, as you did (although I don't think that happened last night). But I get that the fans get bored sometimes.

and the other point, that the Zag equation is not totally unique but is indeed rare air shared by only the most dominant examples, with a motivation equation similar to other super dominant teams. perhaps that includes a Pleasantville-less approach, perhaps not, but you've said it twice in this thread so I get it'd be your way!

anyway, as you know, there's a 600 post thread with close to 30,000 views currently in which fans are trying to convince each other on these things if you're looking for that!!

Reborn
03-04-2018, 08:38 PM
I watched the second half over this evening. Great basketball by the Zags. It may have been the best basketball they played all year. Jonathan Williams is looking like the player he was last year when He won the MVP award of the Regional Tournament last year in the NCAA Tournament. He was a man among boys. He played much better than Landale did last night. I really believe that JW3 is the MVP of the Conference. I hope he wins the award for the WCC Conference Tournament.

I feel Perkins played a great game in 2nd half as well. He was really running the offense. In the first half the Zags didn't run the offense at all. It was all one on one selfish play, which at times they revert to. But Coach Few got them back on track at halftime. Norvell was also great. I love to watch him play. Too bad Coach Crazy can't enjoy our games, but that's his problem. He's always been pretty arrogant imo. I stopped listening to him a long time ago. I think he's the only one who has been criticizing the Zags for no reason. One thing I can suggest to Coach is that he stop watching the games or at least stop posting here when he feels the need to criticize other teams in our league. The teams in the WCC have played tough all year, and every team we've played gave us a tough game and gave 100% effort. I really have enjoyed most of the games, accept our first four or five conference game. I've really enjoyed watching this team develop and grow.

zag67
03-05-2018, 05:56 AM
Reborn, well stated. Most of the WCC teams have really come out and busted their b----- off against us. They are all Improved over the last few years. Better players and better coaches.

gueastcoast
03-05-2018, 06:57 AM
Reborn, well stated. Most of the WCC teams have really come out and busted their b----- off against us. They are all Improved over the last few years. Better players and better coaches.

+1

RPI notwithstanding, why is that the cupcakes in our conference seem to be able to give us a run, even if only for a half of one of our two (or three) games against them every year? Enjoy the moment.

TexasZagFan
03-05-2018, 07:01 AM
+1

RPI notwithstanding, why is that the cupcakes in our conference seem to be able to give us a run, even if only for a half of one of our two (or three) games against them every year? Enjoy the moment.

It's their version of an NCAA game. Beat the Zags at home, have the students rush the court...good feelings for a couple of days, and a sure contract extender for the coach. During the last five years, only two teams have beaten the Zags: SMC & BYU, though I think we were beaten by USD (and Billy Grier) in 2012 or 2013. Put another way, the other seven teams are 1-69 (+/-) against the Zags. Only the Washington Generals can claim a worse record.

SwainZag
03-05-2018, 09:37 AM
As much as I like Rui...his game isn't driving the length of the floor and shooting soft shots over the defense.

He has had some good full court drives, but the team is better when he dishes.

This a thousand times over. The kid has so much potential, but he has to pump the breaks more often. There are just times you know when he pulls down a defensive rebound that he is going to try and go coast to coast and put up a shot, no matter the defense in front of him. I love the agressiveness, but most of the time the best option would be to dish to an open guy.

SwainZag
03-05-2018, 09:43 AM
I watched the second half over this evening. Great basketball by the Zags. It may have been the best basketball they played all year. Jonathan Williams is looking like the player he was last year when He won the MVP award of the Regional Tournament last year in the NCAA Tournament. He was a man among boys. He played much better than Landale did last night. I really believe that JW3 is the MVP of the Conference. I hope he wins the award for the WCC Conference Tournament.

I feel Perkins played a great game in 2nd half as well. He was really running the offense. In the first half the Zags didn't run the offense at all. It was all one on one selfish play, which at times they revert to. But Coach Few got them back on track at halftime. Norvell was also great. I love to watch him play. Too bad Coach Crazy can't enjoy our games, but that's his problem. He's always been pretty arrogant imo. I stopped listening to him a long time ago. I think he's the only one who has been criticizing the Zags for no reason. One thing I can suggest to Coach is that he stop watching the games or at least stop posting here when he feels the need to criticize other teams in our league. The teams in the WCC have played tough all year, and every team we've played gave us a tough game and gave 100% effort. I really have enjoyed most of the games, accept our first four or five conference game. I've really enjoyed watching this team develop and grow.

J-Will needs to play like this more. He didn't hesitate when he got the ball down low. None of the one-two dribble-pump-fake lay it in moments. He went up strong and threw a lot down. He has talent, strength and length to do this all the time! So many times over the past 2 years though, he hesitates, which against good defenders ends up in a steal, block or we have seen him shuffle the feet into a travel too many times. Get it and go up strong JWill! Loved his play in this game.

TexasZagFan
03-05-2018, 10:01 AM
This a thousand times over. The kid has so much potential, but he has to pump the breaks more often. There are just times you know when he pulls down a defensive rebound that he is going to try and go coast to coast and put up a shot, no matter the defense in front of him. I love the agressiveness, but most of the time the best option would be to dish to an open guy.

I simply get nervous whenever J3, Tillie, or Rui are bringing the ball up court. Better teams will see that on film, and respond accordingly.

Ezag
03-05-2018, 10:02 AM
This a thousand times over. The kid has so much potential, but he has to pump the breaks more often. There are just times you know when he pulls down a defensive rebound that he is going to try and go coast to coast and put up a shot, no matter the defense in front of him. I love the agressiveness, but most of the time the best option would be to dish to an open guy.

I wish Rui was more aggressive. Seems like much of the time he is too passive just waiting for things to happen. With his athleticism, he could basically impose his will if he wanted to.

Hoopaholic
03-05-2018, 10:56 AM
I simply get nervous whenever J3, Tillie, or Rui are bringing the ball up court. Better teams will see that on film, and respond accordingly.

You sound like my old man

Bringing it up without pressure creates unique defensive issues as it allows two shooters to go wide and spot up for good looks and stretching the defense at the same time giving open lanes and easier post up options after giving the ball up

SwainZag
03-05-2018, 11:42 AM
I wish Rui was more aggressive. Seems like much of the time he is too passive just waiting for things to happen. With his athleticism, he could basically impose his will if he wanted to.

I will agree I wish he was more aggressive at times, though he is getting better. The coast to coast taking on a double team to shoot a 8-12 foot fade-away just shouldn't be there though....especially when there is a wide open man somewhere on the court.