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thespywhozaggedme
03-04-2017, 08:17 PM
Utterly atrocious and embarrassing first half. The worst first half of the season by far.
Offensively one of the best second halves of the season. Matthews was on fire, season-high in points. Nigel took over when he needed to and it was great to see Tillie back. this game truly was a tale of two halves.

Goshzagit
03-04-2017, 08:23 PM
No hesitant hops on Mathews shot in 2nd half.

Also, saw Tommy laying into Karno in 2nd half. Needed it.

Sleep walking in 1st half.

Jumping around & getting boards in 2nd half. Big effort jump in 2nd half.

Zagceo
03-04-2017, 08:31 PM
Long season? Injuries?

This team hit the wall in the first half.

Looked tired and frustrated.

GonzagasaurusFlex
03-04-2017, 08:32 PM
That 2nd half performance is just what Zags needed, especially Matthews having his highest scoring game of the season. NWG looked great, and I love how JWIII has become so aggressive looking to score. Tillie is becoming my favorite player. He is feisty and tough..broken finger doesn't stop him from sticking his mitts in and forcing a tie-up. His stroke on his free throws seemed smoothe as can be.

On the flip side: Karnowski looked out of sorts all game; he had some real sloppy turnovers. Has Melson lost his 3-pt. mojo? We need him to get his confidence back and knock down jumpers. Sure hope Perkins' ankle isn't too bad.

GonzaGAW
03-04-2017, 08:43 PM
- the positive take away from this game for me is Tillie is back on the court! he looked comfortable, made good passes, I really liked how he did not hesitate to reach in with his injured right hand when trying to tie up a rebound and rip it away from a pacific player.

- a couple of weeks ago coach called out Matthews and perkins, said team goals would not be reached if they did not up their game. Good to see Matthews respond tonight, but agree with coach, both need to up their game, not just one or the other.

MontanaCoyote
03-04-2017, 08:54 PM
That 2nd half performance is just what Zags needed, especially Matthews having his highest scoring game of the season. NWG looked great, and I love how JWIII has become so aggressive looking to score. Tillie is becoming my favorite player. He is feisty and tough..broken finger doesn't stop him from sticking his mitts in and forcing a tie-up. His stroke on his free throws seemed smoothe as can be.

On the flip side: Karnowski looked out of sorts all game; he had some real sloppy turnovers. Has Melson lost his 3-pt. mojo? We need him to get his confidence back and knock down jumpers. Sure hope Perkins' ankle isn't too bad.

I think Karno bounced back pretty well in the second half. Snatched down some rebounds with real authority, led the team in rebounds. A poster on another thread said that Tommy had words with Karno, thought that produced some spark. I don't know how you have words with Karno. Do you? Anyway, he did do quite a bit better in half the second. Poster also said that he may not have been feeling well.

CDC84
03-04-2017, 09:19 PM
Karno just looked like he was roughed up all game long. The refs think that just because he's big, it's not a foul.

ProVeeZag
03-04-2017, 09:24 PM
I think Karno bounced back pretty well in the second half. Snatched down some rebounds with real authority, led the team in rebounds. A poster on another thread said that Tommy had words with Karno, thought that produced some spark. I don't know how you have words with Karno. Do you? Anyway, he did do quite a bit better in half the second. Poster also said that he may not have been feeling well.

I noticed (as many of you no doubt did) a minute or so before the opening tip near the Zags bench area, Karno was blowing his nose into a kerchief. Possibly a head cold or allergy?

DixieZag
03-05-2017, 05:43 AM
The team needs its swag back, badly.

No matter how much better the second half was, the turnovers are highly concerning, Perkins now has a very questionable ankle to go with very questionable confidence and concentration.

Mathews catching fire covers up a lot of holes, and will continue to do so going forward.

But, still big reason for concern going forward until we see a team that once again has the look in their eyes and mental approach.

Goshzagit
03-05-2017, 06:17 AM
I noticed (as many of you no doubt did) a minute or so before the opening tip near the Zags bench area, Karno was blowing his nose into a kerchief. Possibly a head cold or allergy?

He was blowing his nose everytime he came out of the game.

Just hope not anything worse than a head cold...

Zigzag92
03-05-2017, 06:44 AM
only won by 30 something we're doomed guys

raise the zag
03-05-2017, 06:58 AM
gotta wonder if Josh's frustrations are still stemming from the BYU game, not just this minor injury?

He seemed really upset after -- visibly crying & swinging at things -- also didn't talk to anyone post game and left the arena abruptly…and by himself.

I'm sure his end game decisions were used in film sessions this week, but my only concern is Josh is feeling sorry for himself.

In sports, if that happens, you start trying not to turn it over, or trying to hit the shot, trying to play well, instead of just playing.

Josh seems like a smart kid, and will need someone (Coach or player) to pull him out of it. If he allows his personal frustrations to come to the forefront, it could hurt the team, chemistry, and locker room.

I am hopeful and confident he finds his way, mentally, and is able to refocus for Monday and in the post-season. We need him to stay "plugged in". Our backcourt depth takes a hit with him out….or 'out of it'.

VaBeachZAG
03-05-2017, 07:00 AM
only won by 30 something we're doomed guys

I think the overall point here is that, given the current level of overall play, the Zags will darn well be doomed against a high quality opponent in a single elimination tournament!

Zagger
03-05-2017, 07:12 AM
only won by 30 something we're doomed guys

True .... but, there's no way the Zags play a 1st half like that again and expect to win by 30.

I really liked what I saw in the 2nd half. That kind of play will get past the first week of the NCAAs. Anything less and .....

willandi
03-05-2017, 07:59 AM
gotta wonder if Josh's frustrations are still stemming from the BYU game, not just this minor injury?

He seemed really upset after -- visibly crying & swinging at things -- also didn't talk to anyone post game and left the arena abruptly…and by himself.

I'm sure his end game decisions were used in film sessions this week, but my only concern is Josh is feeling sorry for himself.

In sports, if that happens, you start trying not to turn it over, or trying to hit the shot, trying to play well, instead of just playing.

Josh seems like a smart kid, and will need someone (Coach or player) to pull him out of it. If he allows his personal frustrations to come to the forefront, it could hurt the team, chemistry, and locker room.

I am hopeful and confident he finds his way, mentally, and is able to refocus for Monday and in the post-season. We need him to stay "plugged in". Our backcourt depth takes a hit with him out….or 'out of it'.

Sounds like he needs a trip to Hawaii to get leied!

ScrapironJim
03-05-2017, 09:51 AM
Allow me to comment as a former college athlete. I was fortunate to have played in an organization with the same classy, ethical standards that Gonzaga has.
With the possible exception of St. Mary's, no WCC team believes it can beat the Zags in a fairly played game of basketball. Our top eight players have basketball and athletic skills which are clearly superior to all of those teams. The only hope they have is to level the field by dirty play, i.e. holding, pushing, shoving, etc. Players like BYU's Kafusi serve only one purpose, to intimidate the opponent. He can affect Karno's performance by cheating. He has five fouls which give him the potential to influence Karno's play 15 to 20 times, depending upon the ref’s tendency to call fouls. Now, most refs do not want to be part of a game with 50 to 60 fouls - there are exceptions. My experience has been that most refs will not call the dirty play if it is one sided. They want to be invisible. However, when both teams are playing dirty, the refs must intervene or the game will get out of control and possibly result in violence. Most refs will start calling the fouls until the play cleans up. So, my experience - even in high school - has been that coaches tell players to play clean, but to respond to dirty play when the refs don't protect the integrity of the game. I believe the Zags can ramp up their aggressiveness when appropriate. Let me clarify that there is a distinct difference between dirty play and aggressive play. The Zags - UConn women are the best example - endeavor to the play the game without fouling. When confronted by aggressive or dirty play it may be necessary to do little holding, shoving, pushing which is a bit over the line but only as a defensive response to the other teams play. Let the other team determine how the game will be played. Keep in mind that all refs have their own view of foul play. Sometimes you get a ref who won’t call anything. That is when the standard of “the refs determine what is a foul and so play according” comes into play. Let me close by saying that I would not be a BYU fan even if I were a graduate of the school. They are clearly coached to cheat – I counted six flops (cheating) in our last game with them. They have no ethics and their football team has the same reputation. I will always enjoy Zag basketball – win or lose – due to their high standards of sportsmanship.
One more thing . . . some of you need to back off with the criticism. The players are listening. Ask yourself one thing . . . are you helping or hurting the performance of the team with your criticism. The players should listen to their parents and their coaches for CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. The rest of us should adhere to the axiom that ‘if you have nothing positive to say, then say nothing’. Sorry, but I feel strongly about this issue and I am sick of the extreme negativism. It is destructive . . . period!!!!!!

bballbeachbum
03-05-2017, 09:57 AM
Allow me to comment as a former college athlete. I was fortunate to have played in an organization with the same classy, ethical standards that Gonzaga has.
With the possible exception of St. Mary's, no WCC team believes it can beat the Zags in a fairly played game of basketball. Our top eight players have basketball and athletic skills which are clearly superior to all of those teams. The only hope they have is to level the field by dirty play, i.e. holding, pushing, shoving, etc. Players like BYU's Kafusi serve only one purpose, to intimidate the opponent. He can affect Karno's performance by cheating. He has five fouls which give him the potential to influence Karno's play 15 to 20 times, depending upon the ref’s tendency to call fouls. Now, most refs do not want to be part of a game with 50 to 60 fouls - there are exceptions. My experience has been that most refs will not call the dirty play if it is one sided. They want to be invisible. However, when both teams are playing dirty, the refs must intervene or the game will get out of control and possibly result in violence. Most refs will start calling the fouls until the play cleans up. So, my experience - even in high school - has been that coaches tell players to play clean, but to respond to dirty play when the refs don't protect the integrity of the game. I believe the Zags can ramp up their aggressiveness when appropriate. Let me clarify that there is a distinct difference between dirty play and aggressive play. The Zags - UConn women are the best example - endeavor to the play the game without fouling. When confronted by aggressive or dirty play it may be necessary to do little holding, shoving, pushing which is a bit over the line but only as a defensive response to the other teams play. Let the other team determine how the game will be played. Keep in mind that all refs have their own view of foul play. Sometimes you get a ref who won’t call anything. That is when the standard of “the refs determine what is a foul and so play according” comes into play. Let me close by saying that I would not be a BYU fan even if I were a graduate of the school. They are clearly coached to cheat – I counted six flops (cheating) in our last game with them. They have no ethics and their football team has the same reputation. I will always enjoy Zag basketball – win or lose – due to their high standards of sportsmanship.
One more thing . . . some of you need to back off with the criticism. The players are listening. Ask yourself one thing . . . are you helping or hurting the performance of the team with your criticism. The players should listen to their parents and their coaches for CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. The rest of us should adhere to the axiom that ‘if you have nothing positive to say, then say nothing’. Sorry, but I feel strongly about this issue and I am sick of the extreme negativism. It is destructive . . . period!!!!!!

great post

2wiceright
03-05-2017, 10:36 AM
Scrapironjim
"One more thing . . . some of you need to back off with the criticism. The players are listening. Ask yourself one thing . . . are you helping or hurting the performance of the team with your criticism. The players should listen to their parents and their coaches for CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. The rest of us should adhere to the axiom that ‘if you have nothing positive to say, then say nothing’. Sorry, but I feel strongly about this issue and I am sick of the extreme negativism. It is destructive . . . period!!!!!![/QUOTE]

+100

zagfan1
03-05-2017, 11:56 AM
[QUOTE=2wiceright;1294295]Scrapironjim
"One more thing . . . some of you need to back off with the criticism. The players are listening. Ask yourself one thing . . . are you helping or hurting the performance of the team with your criticism. The players should listen to their parents and their coaches for CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. The rest of us should adhere to the axiom that ‘if you have nothing positive to say, then say nothing’. Sorry, but I feel strongly about this issue and I am sick of the extreme negativism. It is destructive . . . period.

I don't believe it is right for someone to tell people how to write or not write. There is nothing wrong with criticism if it is warranted and is surrounded by facts and not rude. If it hurts someone's feelings then you are not mentally strong enough to handle life. Our players can handle whatever is said. No more drama please!

GonzagasaurusFlex
03-05-2017, 12:01 PM
I don't believe it is right for someone to tell people how to write or not write. There is nothing wrong with criticism if it is warranted and is surrounded by facts and not rude. If it hurts someone's feelings then you are not mentally strong enough to handle life. Our players can handle whatever is said. No more drama please!

With you zagfan1.

jazzdelmar
03-05-2017, 12:19 PM
With you zagfan1.

Superb.

TexasZagFan
03-05-2017, 12:53 PM
[QUOTE=2wiceright;1294295]Scrapironjim
"One more thing . . . some of you need to back off with the criticism. The players are listening. Ask yourself one thing . . . are you helping or hurting the performance of the team with your criticism. The players should listen to their parents and their coaches for CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. The rest of us should adhere to the axiom that ‘if you have nothing positive to say, then say nothing’. Sorry, but I feel strongly about this issue and I am sick of the extreme negativism. It is destructive . . . period.

I don't believe it is right for someone to tell people how to write or not write. There is nothing wrong with criticism if it is warranted and is surrounded by facts and not rude. If it hurts someone's feelings then you are not mentally strong enough to handle life. Our players can handle whatever is said. No more drama please!

I'm with you, too. Here's my take: for the past 20 years, I've been a catechist to the sixth graders in my parish. A good number of them play on select teams in the community, even at the ripe old age of 11 and 12.

A couple of years ago, the subject of trash talk came up, and a young lady spoke up in class like she never had before. It was quite a moment. I asked her, "when you're out there on the field, do you hear what the other side is saying?" She said, "I hear all of it! Every word."

My next question was "how do you respond to the criticism?" She replied, "it just makes me play harder."

I've tried to be supportive of all the players, and I have a soft spot for Silas, in particular. There is no doubt in my mind that these kids have tougher skins than a 30 YO buffalo, but I've got their backs...so should the rest of us.

As long as the criticism isn't personal, I don't see anything wrong.

bballbeachbum
03-05-2017, 12:55 PM
[QUOTE=2wiceright;1294295]Scrapironjim
"One more thing . . . some of you need to back off with the criticism. The players are listening. Ask yourself one thing . . . are you helping or hurting the performance of the team with your criticism. The players should listen to their parents and their coaches for CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. The rest of us should adhere to the axiom that ‘if you have nothing positive to say, then say nothing’. Sorry, but I feel strongly about this issue and I am sick of the extreme negativism. It is destructive . . . period.

I don't believe it is right for someone to tell people how to write or not write. There is nothing wrong with criticism if it is warranted and is surrounded by facts and not rude. If it hurts someone's feelings then you are not mentally strong enough to handle life. Our players can handle whatever is said. No more drama please!

agree about nothing wrong with criticism that's not rude zagfan1, I do it, just critiqued the BYU game for example.

but I certainly understand Scrapironjim's perspective even though I know it's impossible for it to happen; I took the part you quoted of his to mean the rude and offensive stuff when I read it originally from Scrapiron, but I see your distinction with your post.

I disagree all the players can handle whatever is said, especially the rude and offensive stuff, or else they are not mentally strong enough to handle life; isn't one of the key functions of the college experience to learn and develop the mental toughness to handle life? with the ball players, we just get to see it before our eyes because they're super exposed, and I guess we all have our own ways of expressing our feelings through the ups and downs they go through while we watch

and drama is all over the map here on the board seems to me! calls for reconstituting the lineup when the team was undefeated, for example, melodrama...it's dramatic here!

thespywhozaggedme
03-05-2017, 01:00 PM
Allow me to comment as a former college athlete. I was fortunate to have played in an organization with the same classy, ethical standards that Gonzaga has.
With the possible exception of St. Mary's, no WCC team believes it can beat the Zags in a fairly played game of basketball. Our top eight players have basketball and athletic skills which are clearly superior to all of those teams. The only hope they have is to level the field by dirty play, i.e. holding, pushing, shoving, etc. Players like BYU's Kafusi serve only one purpose, to intimidate the opponent. He can affect Karno's performance by cheating. He has five fouls which give him the potential to influence Karno's play 15 to 20 times, depending upon the ref’s tendency to call fouls. Now, most refs do not want to be part of a game with 50 to 60 fouls - there are exceptions. My experience has been that most refs will not call the dirty play if it is one sided. They want to be invisible. However, when both teams are playing dirty, the refs must intervene or the game will get out of control and possibly result in violence. Most refs will start calling the fouls until the play cleans up. So, my experience - even in high school - has been that coaches tell players to play clean, but to respond to dirty play when the refs don't protect the integrity of the game. I believe the Zags can ramp up their aggressiveness when appropriate. Let me clarify that there is a distinct difference between dirty play and aggressive play. The Zags - UConn women are the best example - endeavor to the play the game without fouling. When confronted by aggressive or dirty play it may be necessary to do little holding, shoving, pushing which is a bit over the line but only as a defensive response to the other teams play. Let the other team determine how the game will be played. Keep in mind that all refs have their own view of foul play. Sometimes you get a ref who won’t call anything. That is when the standard of “the refs determine what is a foul and so play according” comes into play. Let me close by saying that I would not be a BYU fan even if I were a graduate of the school. They are clearly coached to cheat – I counted six flops (cheating) in our last game with them. They have no ethics and their football team has the same reputation. I will always enjoy Zag basketball – win or lose – due to their high standards of sportsmanship.
One more thing . . . some of you need to back off with the criticism. The players are listening. Ask yourself one thing . . . are you helping or hurting the performance of the team with your criticism. The players should listen to their parents and their coaches for CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. The rest of us should adhere to the axiom that ‘if you have nothing positive to say, then say nothing’. Sorry, but I feel strongly about this issue and I am sick of the extreme negativism. It is destructive . . . period!!!!!!

If you think this is "extreme" negativism than you've never been to another message board in your life. This is by far one of the tamest message boards I've ever been to and I read a ton of them. And again it is a message board for fans which is short for fanatical so occasionally some posts will be a little over-the-top.

Reborn
03-06-2017, 11:40 AM
I Think it was a really good game. I certainly didn't expect them to play good in the first half. Not after losing to BYU. THAT LOSS HURT, BIG TIME. They played great the 2nd half, and I couldn't be happier going into the game tonight. Everyone played great in the 2nd half. Hope Josh is ok.

Go Zags!!!