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View Full Version : Poll: can you be a "true" fan if you never went to GU?



thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 10:39 AM
This came up in the Perkins thread. GoZags made the following comment:


It's interesting to note that these two vocal critics have zero ties to Gonzaga .... other than their televisions, computers and message boards. Sad.

And, truthfully, it was very hurtful, and having been on these boards, for over 15 years, and knowing Kens passive aggressive nature, I'm sure it was intended to be hurtful (he may say "truthful" but, it was meant to hurt Jazz and I) but we're big boys, so, whatever. I posted a rebuttal, but the thread was locked already, but here was my retort:

I've invested $1000's of my own money traveling all over the country following my beloved Zags for almost 20 years, sorry that I do not meet your qualifications as a fan. I'm sure there are dozens of posters here that never went to GU, are they "less of a fan" too?

And it got me thinking, if you never went to Gonzaga, can you ever really be as much of a fan as someone who attended GU? Or are you a "little less of a fan" and have to watch your comments accordingly. I'd like to hear from fellow posters. Thanks and Go Zags!

gonstu
02-27-2017, 10:42 AM
Absolutely you can be a "true" fan!

gonzagafan62
02-27-2017, 10:46 AM
Uh yeah. Been diehard since 2007... don't care what anyone says. GU basketball is my #1 priority after the real things in life. It's basically all I care about

Mantua
02-27-2017, 10:47 AM
I'm sorry that you were hurt by such a foolish comment.

Indeed, you are a true Zags fan if that is what you feel.

TexasZagFan
02-27-2017, 10:47 AM
This came up in the Perkins thread. GoZags made the following comment:


It's interesting to note that these two vocal critics have zero ties to Gonzaga .... other than their televisions, computers and message boards. Sad.

And, truthfully, it was very hurtful, and having been on these boards, for over 15 years, and knowing Kens passive aggressive nature, I'm sure it was intended to be hurtful (he may say "truthful" but, it was meant to hurt Jazz and I) but we're big boys, so, whatever. I posted a rebuttal, but the thread was locked already, but here was my retort:

I've invested $1000's of my own money traveling all over the country following my beloved Zags for almost 20 years, sorry that I do not meet your qualifications as a fan. I'm sure there are dozens of posters here that never went to GU, are they "less of a fan" too?

And it got me thinking, if you never went to Gonzaga, can you ever really be as much of a fan as someone who attended GU? Or are you a "little less of a fan" and have to watch your comments accordingly. I'd like to hear from fellow posters. Thanks and Go Zags!

Nice cheap shot...one comment out of thousands, and he gets the Kim Mulkey treatment.

gozagswoohoo
02-27-2017, 10:48 AM
Gonzaga is one of the most important things in my life. I sure hope I'm allowed to be a true fan even though I have no ties! :pray:

gozagswoohoo
02-27-2017, 10:48 AM
PS- I've met GoZags. Super cool and awesome person.

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 10:49 AM
I'm sorry that you were hurt by such a foolish comment.

Indeed, you are a true Zags fan if that is what you feel.

Thanks. I get where GoZags is coming from, I was a little harsh on Josh, but I also am a total homer for our team and was even accused of "gloating" in the "will we lose thread" although I don't know how one can "gloat" to your own fellow fans. I do think however, that there are some that believe you're not a "true" fan if you never went to GU and I hope some of them are honest enough to post about it.

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 10:52 AM
Gonzaga is one of the most important things in my life. I sure hope I'm allowed to be a true fan even though I have no ties! :pray:

You are loved here, me and Jazz....not so much, lol. I don't think you've ever posted anything remotely critical in all of your years here, you're all good. On a side note, I love our Zags so much that I would put some Gonzaga material in most of my videos for years. Look here, in the opening shot, next to the alarm clock:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnww5BSmN0k

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 10:52 AM
PS- I've met GoZags. Super cool and awesome person.

I know, he's been quite good to me.

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 10:56 AM
One person opted for B. and I can say that I appreciate their honesty.

ProVeeZag
02-27-2017, 10:58 AM
Diehard fan of GU basketball since John Stockton's career, long before it was "cool". Grew up and educated in Midwest, first heard of Gonzaga when I moved out here with a job transfer in 1975. Love the Zag program. No direct ties to GU. Had my degree before I came to Spokane. Have attended probably 40 Zag games in person, the bulk of those in the Old Kennel.

Also a diehard Green Bay Packer fan, though have never set foot in Lambeau (on my bucket list).

Willing to take blood test and fill out any necessary paperwork or exams to continue to be a ZagFan in good standing.

Would hate to see a separate "GUBoards Lite" for non-GU grads.

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 10:58 AM
Nice cheap shot...one comment out of thousands, and he gets the Kim Mulkey treatment.

Thanks man, I appreciate you sticking up for me. GoZags is very loyal and a "bigwig" here, if not the biggest. I see where he's coming from.

GoZags
02-27-2017, 11:01 AM
I know, he's been quite good to me.

Yeah ... I was a "bit" surly (frosty?) this morning .... and probably should have counted to 10 before making my post. No real excuse

Sure a great thing you've not lost your flair for drama ....

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 11:03 AM
Yeah ... I was a "bit" surly (frosty?) this morning .... and probably should have counted to 10 before making my post. No real excuse although lack of sleep "may" have been a contributing factor .... as of this weekend can no longer take pain meds for the torn shoulder as they had an adverse effect on the ticker.

Sure a great thing you've not lost your flair for drama ....

That's the closest you've ever come to an apology, I'll take it. lol

Drama is my middle name.

But in all seriousness, it is an interesting thread topic.

jazzdelmar
02-27-2017, 11:03 AM
PS- I've met GoZags. Super cool and awesome person.

I've met him too and, up to this morning, I shared this opinion.......JUST KIDDING......

drvenkman05
02-27-2017, 11:04 AM
I have a bit of a different take. I think what some posters are commenting about are a shared set of values that graduates of Gonzaga have. I have no idea what your values are, but if you and jazz both didn't graduate from Gonzaga, that may be the most salient "point of distinction" relative to values. All in all, behavior is a function of many variables, and trying to identify a single cause is what is likely leading to the friction.


Thanks. I get where GoZags is coming from, I was a little harsh on Josh, but I also am a total homer for our team and was even accused of "gloating" in the "will we lose thread" although I don't know how one can "gloat" to your own fellow fans. I do think however, that there are some that believe you're not a "true" fan if you never went to GU and I hope some of them are honest enough to post about it.

ProVeeZag
02-27-2017, 11:07 AM
I have a bit of a different take. I think what some posters are commenting about are a shared set of values that graduates of Gonzaga have. I have no idea what your values are, but if you and jazz both didn't graduate from Gonzaga, that may be the most salient "point of distinction" relative to values. All in all, behavior is a function of many variables, and trying to identify a single cause is what is likely leading to the friction.
OK, send me the "Values" form to fill out. Will there be an interview before the "Values Board"? When/where, I'll be there. I'm a Christian, if that helps. These days, it might be held against me.

jazzdelmar
02-27-2017, 11:08 AM
I have a bit of a different take. I think what some posters are commenting about are a shared set of values that graduates of Gonzaga have. I have no idea what your values are, but if you and jazz both didn't graduate from Gonzaga, that may be the most salient "point of distinction" relative to values. All in all, behavior is a function of many variables, and trying to identify a single cause is what is likely leading to the friction.

Whoa, D-man, slippery slope.....FWIW, I went to a college that is the mirror image of GU (except for the spectacular MBB program) so my "values" coincide....Still, let's not make that sort of personal, ephemeral stuff a point of difference here.

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 11:08 AM
I have a bit of a different take. I think what some posters are commenting about are a shared set of values that graduates of Gonzaga have. I have no idea what your values are, but if you and jazz both didn't graduate from Gonzaga, that may be the most salient "point of distinction" relative to values. All in all, behavior is a function of many variables, and trying to identify a single cause is what is likely leading to the friction.

So were you the one poster who voted "B"? It's cool if you were, just curious. Can those of us that didn't attend GU share the same "values", or if not, isn't our love for the team enough to bind us together as fans? Thanks

gozagswoohoo
02-27-2017, 11:08 AM
Not even kidding here, but a few years ago I actually looked into taking 1 online course through GU...just to say I was 'alum'. :roll:

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 11:09 AM
Whoa, D-man, slippery slope.....FWIW, I went to a college that is the mirror image of GU (except for the spectacular MBB program) so my "values" coincide....Still, let's not make that sort of personal, ephemeral stuff a point of difference here.

Yeah, I'm a Furman guy, pretty similar to GU "values" as well.

TexasZagFan
02-27-2017, 11:09 AM
I'm sorry that you were hurt by such a foolish comment.

Indeed, you are a true Zags fan if that is what you feel.

As one who deals with a Duke fan at work, not to mention the Duke fans in Houston, we're chasing our tails here.

Allow me to put it in another way, and GoZags is part of this story. It's one of the few things in my life I have nearly total recall on. Though totally unexpected, GZ and I bumped into each other before the Tulsa BracketBuster game many moons ago. Although it was too brief, our conversation was noticed by several families nearby.

After he left, a few came up to me and asked if I went to GU. I said yes, and pointed out that GZ was the goalie on our hockey team when I was there. The questions came rapid fire, mostly about the "Gonzaga experience", and others regarding very simple questions, such as the location of GU. I was able to draw from them that they all came from outside OK, such as Arkansas, Kansas, and Missouri. They all had fallen in love with the Zags starting in '99, and this was their first chance to see them live, and we were the first two Zag alumni they had ever encountered.

I'm sure they are loyal Zag fans to this day, because Mark Few and his staff seem to bring young men of ability and character to the school every year. I feel the same way for those that post on the board, whether or not they're alumni.

GZ can stand up for himself, and IMO, this thread is counterproductive. I am in agreement with those who find it distasteful to continually criticize our players during an incredible season. First, it was Silas; then it was Jordan, and now JP is being savaged. In nearly 30 mpq, JP is averaging 2.3 TOs, just ahead of NWG who's averaging 2.1 TOs. Ok, he didn't finish the game well against BYU. Frankly, I can't think of any Zag that had much more than a mediocre game against BYU.

Reminds me of a field exercise with my first platoon that was hardly a thing of beauty. I was really steaming as we returned to our tactical park, so my Platoon Sergeant (he had a couple of tours in Nam) pulled me aside. In a very friendly way, he said, "yeah, LT...it was a clusterf--k out there, but we all came home alive." A few weeks later, we just about maxed our ARTEP, and they made this butterbar look really good.

I think our guys are going to make us really proud of them next month, and beyond...far beyond their athletic pursuits.

ProVeeZag
02-27-2017, 11:10 AM
Not even kidding here, but a few years ago I actually looked into taking 1 online course through GU...just to say I was 'alum'. :roll:

Hope you have some "documentation" of that; you may need it. Geez, this thread is veering in a bad direction.

willandi
02-27-2017, 11:10 AM
How about one step further.

Can you truly be a fan of GU basketball unless you played on the team?

I never played D1 sports, so I don't feel that I can ever REALLY understand what that honor means, just like I can't truly understand the pressure of trying to have an undefeated season, especially when ranked #1 in the country. But I can identify with both and commiserate with both.

gonzagafan62
02-27-2017, 11:10 AM
Not even kidding here, but a few years ago I actually looked into taking 1 online course through GU...just to say I was 'alum'. :roll:

LOL!!!!!!

LongIslandZagFan
02-27-2017, 11:11 AM
Poll might as well read: Do you still beat your wife Yes or No. But I digress.

No... you don't have to be an alum to be a fan. Simple as that. My kids are die hard Zag fans... they aren't going to/going to go to GU (unless my son gets a full ride, which I doubt so he'll be going to Binghamton).

jazzdelmar
02-27-2017, 11:12 AM
As one who deals with a Duke fan at work, not to mention the Duke fans in Houston, we're chasing our tails here.

Allow me to put it in another way, and GoZags is part of this story. It's one of the few things in my life I have nearly total recall on. Though totally unexpected, GZ and I bumped into each other before the Tulsa BracketBuster game many moons ago. Although it was too brief, our conversation was noticed by several families nearby.

After he left, a few came up to me and asked if I went to GU. I said yes, and pointed out that GZ was the goalie on our hockey team when I was there. The questions came rapid fire, mostly about the "Gonzaga experience", and others regarding very simple questions, such as the location of GU. I was able to draw from them that they all came from outside OK, such as Arkansas, Kansas, and Missouri. They all had fallen in love with the Zags starting in '99, and this was their first chance to see them live, and we were the first two Zag alumni they had ever encountered.

I'm sure they are loyal Zag fans to this day, because Mark Few and his staff seem to bring young men of ability and character to the school every year. I feel the same way for those that post on the board, whether or not they're alumni.

GZ can stand up for himself, and IMO, this thread is counterproductive. I am in agreement with those who find it distasteful to continually criticize our players during an incredible season. First, it was Silas; then it was Jordan, and now JP is being savaged. In nearly 30 mpq, JP is averaging 2.3 TOs, just ahead of NWG who's averaging 2.1 TOs. Ok, he didn't finish the game well against BYU. Frankly, I can't think of any Zag that had much more than a mediocre game against BYU.

Reminds me of a field exercise with my first platoon that was hardly a thing of beauty. I was really steaming as we returned to our tactical park, so my Platoon Sergeant (he had a couple of tours in Nam) pulled me aside. In a very friendly way, he said, "yeah, LT...it was a clusterf--k out there, but we all came home alive." A few weeks later, we just about maxed our ARTEP, and they made this butterbar look really good.

I think our guys are going to make us really proud of them next month, and beyond...far beyond their athletic pursuits.

Carry on with scheduled training, Tex.

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 11:12 AM
Not even kidding here, but a few years ago I actually looked into taking 1 online course through GU...just to say I was 'alum'. :roll:

A couple of years ago I had a client walk into our showroom wearing a GU sweartshirt, and I was so excited, I started talking to her and it turns out that she got her GU MBA online and knew nothing about the team and even pronounced it GUN ZAHG AH. Even though she "went" there, I felt like I was way more of a fan then her.

bartruff1
02-27-2017, 11:13 AM
Complete nonsense to even imagine you would have to have attended Gonzaga to be a true fan....I suspect they have millions of fans that have never set foot on the campus ...I run into them all over the world...

jazzdelmar
02-27-2017, 11:13 AM
Poll might as well read: Do you still beat your wife Yes or No. But I digress.

No... you don't have to be an alum to be a fan. Simple as that. My kids are die hard Zag fans... they aren't going to/going to go to GU (unless my son gets a full ride, which I doubt so he'll be going to Binghamton).

Bingo is a better school, LIZF.......Peace

SWZag
02-27-2017, 11:14 AM
I didn't vote, but I don't think the question is correct. I think it should read: "Should people be able to give their own opinions and call out college (amateur) student athletes with extremely critical and often harsh, negative comments on a team you are claiming you support?"

That is a more pertinent question as that goes for both Alumni and Non-alumni.

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 11:14 AM
As one who deals with a Duke fan at work, not to mention the Duke fans in Houston, we're chasing our tails here.

Allow me to put it in another way, and GoZags is part of this story. It's one of the few things in my life I have nearly total recall on. Though totally unexpected, GZ and I bumped into each other before the Tulsa BracketBuster game many moons ago. Although it was too brief, our conversation was noticed by several families nearby.

After he left, a few came up to me and asked if I went to GU. I said yes, and pointed out that GZ was the goalie on our hockey team when I was there. The questions came rapid fire, mostly about the "Gonzaga experience", and others regarding very simple questions, such as the location of GU. I was able to draw from them that they all came from outside OK, such as Arkansas, Kansas, and Missouri. They all had fallen in love with the Zags starting in '99, and this was their first chance to see them live, and we were the first two Zag alumni they had ever encountered.

I'm sure they are loyal Zag fans to this day, because Mark Few and his staff seem to bring young men of ability and character to the school every year. I feel the same way for those that post on the board, whether or not they're alumni.

GZ can stand up for himself, and IMO, this thread is counterproductive. I am in agreement with those who find it distasteful to continually criticize our players during an incredible season. First, it was Silas; then it was Jordan, and now JP is being savaged. In nearly 30 mpq, JP is averaging 2.3 TOs, just ahead of NWG who's averaging 2.1 TOs. Ok, he didn't finish the game well against BYU. Frankly, I can't think of any Zag that had much more than a mediocre game against BYU.

Reminds me of a field exercise with my first platoon that was hardly a thing of beauty. I was really steaming as we returned to our tactical park, so my Platoon Sergeant (he had a couple of tours in Nam) pulled me aside. In a very friendly way, he said, "yeah, LT...it was a clusterf--k out there, but we all came home alive." A few weeks later, we just about maxed our ARTEP, and they made this butterbar look really good.

I think our guys are going to make us really proud of them next month, and beyond...far beyond their athletic pursuits.

May I ask why? I think it's really interesting as long as we can be respectful of each others opinions. GZ expressed how he felt and it is a completely valid opinion.

TexasZagFan
02-27-2017, 11:21 AM
Not even kidding here, but a few years ago I actually looked into taking 1 online course through GU...just to say I was 'alum'. :roll:

What's stopping you? Not only am I an "alum" of GU and Webster University (though I never set foot on campus, all my classes were at Fort Bliss), I suppose I'm an alum of El Centro CC in Dallas, where I took a Wine & Viticulture course a few years ago. The $150 I spent was a bargain.

You never stop learning, woohoo. I'm pondering taking a few online courses through Hillsdale College, as well as additional wine classes.

LongIslandZagFan
02-27-2017, 11:22 AM
Bingo is a better school, LIZF.......Peace

Yes it is... and a 7 hour plane trip is a negative for GU (although his Grandparents like in Spokane). We just went up to visit the school friday and saturday and he really really liked it. Town itself ain't much to write home about, but campus itself is beautiful. Kind of did the whole thing opposite. Couldn't fit the visit in last fall, so he applied and we decided that we'd visit if he got in. Binghamton was a slight reach school for him... NYU was his real reach school, still waiting to hear from them. Binghamton is something like the 97th hardest schools to get into in the country and have a top 100 math department... so he's pretty happy he got in.

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 11:23 AM
What's stopping you? Not only am I an "alum" of GU and Webster University (though I never set foot on campus, all my classes were at Fort Bliss), I suppose I'm an alum of El Centro CC in Dallas, where I took a Wine & Viticulture course a few years ago. The $150 I spent was a bargain.

You never stop learning, woohoo. I'm pondering taking a few online courses through Hillsdale College, as well as additional wine classes.

Another reason that I like you so much!

TexasZagFan
02-27-2017, 11:23 AM
May I ask why? I think it's really interesting as long as we can be respectful of each others opinions. GZ expressed how he felt and it is a completely valid opinion.

Give it a few pages, by then it could very well be a urination contest. :jk:

I just don't want it to turn into a knockdown-drag out fight, that's all.

LongIslandZagFan
02-27-2017, 11:27 AM
A couple of years ago I had a client walk into our showroom wearing a GU sweartshirt, and I was so excited, I started talking to her and it turns out that she got her GU MBA online and knew nothing about the team and even pronounced it GUN ZAHG AH. Even though she "went" there, I felt like I was way more of a fan then her.

:roll:

If she can't pronounce her own school... yeah... you definitely are.

GoZags
02-27-2017, 11:28 AM
As one who deals with a Duke fan at work, not to mention the Duke fans in Houston, we're chasing our tails here.

Allow me to put it in another way, and GoZags is part of this story. It's one of the few things in my life I have nearly total recall on. Though totally unexpected, GZ and I bumped into each other before the Tulsa BracketBuster game many moons ago. Although it was too brief, our conversation was noticed by several families nearby.

After he left, a few came up to me and asked if I went to GU. I said yes, and pointed out that GZ was the goalie on our hockey team when I was there. The questions came rapid fire, mostly about the "Gonzaga experience", and others regarding very simple questions, such as the location of GU. I was able to draw from them that they all came from outside OK, such as Arkansas, Kansas, and Missouri. They all had fallen in love with the Zags starting in '99, and this was their first chance to see them live, and we were the first two Zag alumni they had ever encountered.

I'm sure they are loyal Zag fans to this day, because Mark Few and his staff seem to bring young men of ability and character to the school every year. I feel the same way for those that post on the board, whether or not they're alumni.

GZ can stand up for himself, and IMO, this thread is counterproductive. I am in agreement with those who find it distasteful to continually criticize our players during an incredible season. First, it was Silas; then it was Jordan, and now JP is being savaged. In nearly 30 mpq, JP is averaging 2.3 TOs, just ahead of NWG who's averaging 2.1 TOs. Ok, he didn't finish the game well against BYU. Frankly, I can't think of any Zag that had much more than a mediocre game against BYU.

Reminds me of a field exercise with my first platoon that was hardly a thing of beauty. I was really steaming as we returned to our tactical park, so my Platoon Sergeant (he had a couple of tours in Nam) pulled me aside. In a very friendly way, he said, "yeah, LT...it was a clusterf--k out there, but we all came home alive." A few weeks later, we just about maxed our ARTEP, and they made this butterbar look really good.

I think our guys are going to make us really proud of them next month, and beyond...far beyond their athletic pursuits.

Thanks TZF,

I'm wondering how a "poll" that asks the following would play ....

Should a "true" fan rip kids they don't know (other than on their televisions/computers and message boards)?

After all, if they've spent thousands following their team, shouldn't that mean they have the "right" to anonymously brutalize student athletes? (or be "harsh"?)

The fact of the matter (as I see it) is "fandom" doesn't equate to having carte blanche to be a jerk (my opinion) when the Zags lose a game (or ... as what happens too often .... win ... and in this case win 29 in a row).

My apologies for making the comment that spurred this poll on "fandom".

Edited to add I'd missed this post from SWZag ....

I didn't vote, but I don't think the question is correct. I think it should read: "Should people be able to give their own opinions and call out college (amateur) student athletes with extremely critical and often harsh, negative comments on a team you are claiming you support?"

That is a more pertinent question as that goes for both Alumni and Non-alumni.

LongIslandZagFan
02-27-2017, 11:28 AM
Give it a few pages, by then it could very well be a urination contest. :jk:

I just don't want it to turn into a knockdown-drag out fight, that's all.


For the records... while I don't know spy... Jazz and I get along OK contrary to our sparring on this board.

U Zig, I Zag
02-27-2017, 11:28 AM
It's a good question, but a silly one at the same time. There is, of course, only one right answer...

jazzdelmar
02-27-2017, 11:35 AM
Yes it is... and a 7 hour plane trip is a negative for GU (although his Grandparents like in Spokane). We just went up to visit the school friday and saturday and he really really liked it. Town itself ain't much to write home about, but campus itself is beautiful. Kind of did the whole thing opposite. Couldn't fit the visit in last fall, so he applied and we decided that we'd visit if he got in. Binghamton was a slight reach school for him... NYU was his real reach school, still waiting to hear from them. Binghamton is something like the 97th hardest schools to get into in the country and have a top 100 math department... so he's pretty happy he got in.

Well, congrats to him and his parents. Exciting times. I would not be surprised if he does get into NYU, although conventional wisdom may say it's tougher than Bingo. Then you have what $70 k a year to ponder? You're ahead of the game, burn any envelopes in purple ink from Washington Square.

jazzdelmar
02-27-2017, 11:37 AM
Thanks TZF,

I'm wondering how a "poll" that asks the following would play ....

Should a "true" fan rip kids they don't know (other than on their televisions/computers and message boards)?

After all, if they've spent thousands following their team, shouldn't that mean they have the "right" to anonymously brutalize student athletes? (or be "harsh"?)

The fact of the matter (as I see it) is "fandom" doesn't equate to having carte blanche to be a jerk (my opinion) when the Zags lose a game (or ... as what happens too often .... win ... and in this case win 29 in a row).

My apologies for making the comment that spurred this poll on "fandom".

Edited to add I'd missed this post from SWZag ....

Apology accepted. Maybe you should take the rest of the afternoon off. ;)

LongIslandZagFan
02-27-2017, 11:39 AM
Well, congrats to him and his parents. Exciting times. I would not be surprised if he does get into NYU, although conventional wisdom may say it's tougher than Bingo. Then you have what $70 k a year to ponder? You're ahead of the game, burn any envelopes in purple ink from Washington Square.

Short of full ride with NYU... going to be more of a feather in the cap than anything else. I love the NYU neighborhood. Worked down there in the 90s... kind of my old stomping grounds in NYC. Wife and I are pretty proud of him... that is for sure.

TexasZag
02-27-2017, 11:44 AM
I'm guessing that my experience was different than most of the other alums in here. I was a fan of the basketball team by extension, of sorts. My son played high school ball and brought The Zags to my attention. We followed the Zags to the extent we could here in Fort Worth back then. It was a result of my interest in the basketball team that I eventually wound up looking into and selecting GU for my MA. So now I'm a fan of an incredibly successful college basketball program and have an advanced degree from a great Jesuit university. Life doesn't get much better than that!

jazzdelmar
02-27-2017, 11:46 AM
As you know it's changed considerably since the 90s. NYU has become quite the aggregator of properties. More Euro boutiques and overpriced cupcake stores every day. He's better off upstate. Spend the money on a good parka.



QUOTE=LongIslandZagFan;1292470]Short of full ride with NYU... going to be more of a feather in the cap than anything else. I love the NYU neighborhood. Worked down there in the 90s... kind of my old stomping grounds in NYC. Wife and I are pretty proud of him... that is for sure.[/QUOTE]

drvenkman05
02-27-2017, 11:52 AM
I don't think you got what I was saying. I was pointing-out that some people may assume that all graduates of Gonzaga have certain values that are similar. So, if you didn't graduate from Gonzaga, some may assume you don't share those similar values and may consider this the reason you are saying what you're say. As I said, I have no idea what your values are and was merely suggesting an alternative reason as to why people are responding in the way they are. Presenting an alternative idea on the causes of behavior isn't a slippery slope and who you root for certainly is a value (like many others).


OK, send me the "Values" form to fill out. Will there be an interview before the "Values Board"? When/where, I'll be there. I'm a Christian, if that helps. These days, it might be held against me.


Whoa, D-man, slippery slope.....FWIW, I went to a college that is the mirror image of GU (except for the spectacular MBB program) so my "values" coincide....Still, let's not make that sort of personal, ephemeral stuff a point of difference here.


So were you the one poster who voted "B"? It's cool if you were, just curious. Can those of us that didn't attend GU share the same "values", or if not, isn't our love for the team enough to bind us together as fans? Thanks

jazzdelmar
02-27-2017, 11:53 AM
Another reason that I like you so much!

Easy, guys. No politics.

B Wayne
02-27-2017, 11:54 AM
Yes it's a rhetorical and straw man question meant to make a point rather than sincerely gather information. Of course all are welcome to be Zag fans.

The posts that put down Coach Few and Perkins that are mean spirited do show a lack of perspective about the history of the school and program. Some rationalized their mean spirited posts as saying they just wanted to win. This sounds like they don't have an appreciation, love or knowledge of the history of the school and program. Even more amazing is that this mean spiritedness comes out after one loss following 29 wins!

Those that attended GU may have a better appreciation of from where we come. But so could fans who have been with the program a while, or recent fans who bothered to learn the history. And the poster who came here from the midwest but has lived in Spokane has a perspective of the program as to appreciate where we are. But there may be others who don't know the history of the school, for whatever reason, that may not appreciate where the program is now which results in these over the top unrealistic and angry messages.

Gonzaga's fan base has an interesting dynamic that is fairly unique to major college basketball programs. Unlike Duke Michigan State Kentucky etc, many of our fans aren't in families or with friends who have been Zag fans for generations. So unlike North Carolina etc, the history of the program hasn't been passed down through generations and families. Rather, we have a lot of recent (past decade or so) fans that jumped the GU bandwagon only from what they saw on TV and the computer. My WSU friends call them the Mom's jeans fans. There's nothing wrong with that, but some may not have had the inter generational legends and stories of the school and program passed on to them.

So many current Gonzaga basketball fans don't know the history that is the fabric of the Zag prorgam like Fitzgerald, Spitzer, Burgess,Mc Phees, Stockton, Santangelo etc. And this lack of historical awareness can shape the difference in the outlook on the school by our fans versus fans of other basketball programs. As a result their are people like Heister who name keeps obsessing on the best Zags ever but can't go any farther back than Blake Steepe in his knowledge of Gonzaga basketball. The most unique and impressive part of Gonzaga's program is where they came from..Big Sky to mid of the conference in the WCC to national powerhouse. Without that perspective you'll whine about 29-1 and say mean spirited things about players and coaches.

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 12:09 PM
Thanks TZF,

I'm wondering how a "poll" that asks the following would play ....

Should a "true" fan rip kids they don't know (other than on their televisions/computers and message boards)?

After all, if they've spent thousands following their team, shouldn't that mean they have the "right" to anonymously brutalize student athletes? (or be "harsh"?)

The fact of the matter (as I see it) is "fandom" doesn't equate to having carte blanche to be a jerk (my opinion) when the Zags lose a game (or ... as what happens too often .... win ... and in this case win 29 in a row).

My apologies for making the comment that spurred this poll on "fandom".

Edited to add I'd missed this post from SWZag ....

I do agree with this, but I think some have different opinions on what constitutes being a "jerk" or being "savage" is. Someone mentioned that there were "fans" at the game that were screaming at Josh and even dropping "F" bombs at him. I don't know anyone here that would condone that and do not equate that to saying that he makes stupid decisions on the court sometimes. We have to keep in mind that those of us that post on message boards are more opinionated than the average fan and thus say things at times that may be hyperbolic or in the "heat of the moment" but that doesn't mean that we would ever curse out our own players. Re: your apology.; if it wasn't for you, we wouldn't even get to post here, so you wil always be appreciated even if you give me a hard time. :-)

thespywhozaggedme
02-27-2017, 12:13 PM
Yes it's a silly rhetorical and straw man question meant to make a point rather than sincerely gather information. Of course all are welcome to be Zag fans.

The posts that put down Coach Few and Perkins that are mean spirited do show a lack of perspective about the history of the school and program. I did see some over the top posts about wanting to the Zags to be so superior as to justify these mean spirited posts. They did make me think those posters don't have an appreciation or knowledge of the history of the school and program. Those that attended GU may have a better appreciation of from where we come. But also could fans who have been with the program a while, or recent fans who bothered to learn the history. And the poster who came here from the midwest but has lived in Spokane, he has a perspective of the program as to appreciate where we are. But there may be others who don't know the history of the school, for whatever reason, that may not appreciate where the program is now which results in these over the top unrealistic and angry messages.

So following for years or knowing the history pre success era from friends or family or research, or attending the school, can inform ones decisions. As I said several times, our fan base has an interesting dynamic that no other big basketball program has. Unlike Duke Michigan State Kentucky etc, most of our fans aren't in families or with friends who have been Zag fans for generations. So unlike North Carolina etc, the history of the program hasn't be passed down through generations and families. Rather, we have a lot of recent (past decade or so) fans that jumped the GU bandwagon only from what they saw on TV and the computer. There's nothing wrong with that, but some then may not have had the inter generational legends and stories of the school and program told to them. So they don't know the history that makes this school and program like Fitzgerald, Spitzer, Burgess etc. And you can really tell the difference in the outlook on the school by our fans versus fans of other basketball programs. As a result you get guys like Heister name Blake Steppe as the best Zag ever. No historical perspective.

Not at all. Besides one brave poster dared to be the contrarian. I respect him/her for that.

Zagceo
02-27-2017, 12:22 PM
Short of full ride with NYU... going to be more of a feather in the cap than anything else. I love the NYU neighborhood. Worked down there in the 90s... kind of my old stomping grounds in NYC. Wife and I are pretty proud of him... that is for sure.

As you should be....Congrats.

gonzagafan62
02-27-2017, 12:24 PM
Congrats LIZF... really cool!

bartruff1
02-27-2017, 12:30 PM
I can recall drinking a Historical (or is it hysterical) beer with Bob Turner at DeSmet after a typical 12-15 season....

MDABE80
02-27-2017, 12:36 PM
Of course! to the original question!!

LongIslandZagFan
02-27-2017, 12:40 PM
As you know it's changed considerably since the 90s. NYU has become quite the aggregator of properties. More Euro boutiques and overpriced cupcake stores every day. He's better off upstate. Spend the money on a good parka.

Oh, yeah, but I've been down in the Union Sq. area quite a bit since.

Zagcity
02-27-2017, 12:46 PM
Easy, guys. No politics.

Just when I was beginning to think you really can't be human, you cause me to pause and reconsider :)

maynard g krebs
02-27-2017, 12:49 PM
My take is that true fans don't take cheap shots at players. A cheap shot, as I define it, is making a false claim, like the OP of this thread did, that JP commits "at least 3 stupid turnovers every game" (didn't look up exact quote, but that's functionally what he said).

In that context, and in the context of the "Perkins problem" thread title, I think the comment of a diehard alum is totally within bounds.

maynard g krebs
02-27-2017, 12:53 PM
Thanks. I get where GoZags is coming from, I was a little harsh on Josh, but I also am a total homer for our team and was even accused of "gloating" in the "will we lose thread" although I don't know how one can "gloat" to your own fellow fans. I do think however, that there are some that believe you're not a "true" fan if you never went to GU and I hope some of them are honest enough to post about it.

In assuming that the team was going undefeated, you said that it was "funny" to look back at some of the earlier comments in the thread about going undefeated. You appeared by that comment to be gloating about your superior insight in prediction of an undefeated season. Tell me why I'm wrong.

Zagceo
02-27-2017, 01:06 PM
My take is that true fans don't take cheap shots at players. A cheap shot, as I define it, is making a false claim, like the OP of this thread did, that JP commits "at least 3 stupid turnovers every game" (didn't look up exact quote, but that's functionally what he said).

In that context, and in the context of the "Perkins problem" thread title, I think the comment of a diehard alum is totally within bounds.


In assuming that the team was going undefeated, you said that it was "funny" to look back at some of the earlier comments in the thread about going undefeated. You appeared by that comment to be gloating about your superior insight in prediction of an undefeated season. Tell me why I'm wrong.

:horse:

gonna be a long week

maynard g krebs
02-27-2017, 01:28 PM
:horse:

gonna be a long week

Looks to me like that horse is still standing, judging by the existence of this thread. I didn't start it; just responding. So you might want to take your dead horse elsewhere.

TheGonzagaFactor
02-27-2017, 01:41 PM
The only correct answer to this is yes.

I fell in love with the Zags when I was 11 and have followed them closely ever since.

Say someone the same age as me doesn't care about basketball, they enroll at GU when they are 18. They start going to games...

I'm still a fan. Does where I ended up going to school really matter?

There is definitely a vibe given off by GU folk (predominantly current students in my experience) that only students are able to like the team. I bet this attitude is fading, because it shouldn't exist.


If only students at the school are fans of your college team, it means they suck and aren't relevant.

When you are relevant, a lot of other people will be "real" fans because there is something to care about.

team6
02-27-2017, 02:05 PM
The only correct answer to this is yes.

I fell in love with the Zags when I was 11 and have followed them closely ever since.

Say someone the same age as me doesn't care about basketball, they enroll at GU when they are 18. They start going to games...

I'm still a fan. Does where I ended up going to school really matter?

There is definitely a vibe given off by GU folk (predominantly current students in my experience) that only students are able to like the team. I bet this attitude is fading, because it shouldn't exist.


If only students at the school are fans of your college team, it means they suck and aren't relevant.

When you are relevant, a lot of other people will be "real" fans because there is something to care about.

The first time I ever watched a basketball game on tv had Gonzaga on and I fell in love after that, I don't remember my exact age but it was around 11 too. In the mid to late 90's.

However I played football with Erroll Knights cousin and if I wore any GU gear he threaten to burn it. Multiple times, the guy didn't like me very much anyway and he was no Gonzaga fan. I honestly think he was mad that Knight transferred to Gonzaga but I could be wrong. Anyway he abused me so much that I stopped wearing any of my stuff to school anymore. And this was a JC so it's not like this was happening at a 4 year university, although the university I ran track at after JC was a very small christian school and I wore my GU gear all the time, even to track meets for my school and no one bothered me about it. In fact strangers would come up and talk to me about how they thought it was a great program and what not. The only person ever to give me beef was Erroll Knights cousin, which is odd because he was one of my favorite players.

But yeah I don't really care how anyone treats me. I've rooted harder for Gonzaga then my own school and I'm proud to have cheered for them. Gonzaga is a great school and if they had a better track program for sprinters I might have gone there out of high school, I still tried to. But I love Few love the program and I love what it stands for. I'll always be a fan, if they go 30-0, 29-1, or 1-29. Even if alumni and current students say I can't be a die hard fan. (Not saying that any do)

I also don't like when people talk bad about players, we don't know what they're going through. Especially on a personal level, one of my best friends ran the 100m in 10.1 his junior year but he went through all sorts of personal problems his last year in college and his fastest time was 10.6. Thats a huge difference in track for those that don't know, so honestly I hate when people bad mouth any players we have no idea how hard they work and what they are going through. I really like Josh and I like what he brings, does he make bad plays yes he does, but it's obvious to me when he is on the court that kid is working his butt off. I see a lot of poster LOOKING for what certain players do to mess up instead of enjoying them as a whole. Sorry don't know why ranted about that and got off subject. Anyway i'll be a Gonzaga fan until the day I die.

TexasZagFan
02-27-2017, 02:05 PM
Not at all. Besides one brave poster dared to be the contrarian. I respect him/her for that.

It's a bit late, spy, but I apologize for the "cheap shot" remark. It was gratuitous, to say the least.

The reference to Hillsdale has zero zip nada with politics. It's a fine school, and they have free online courses. I know I won't have any time for that during the next six months, thanks to my son's election last week as his troop's senior patrol leader. It was the perfect response to my threats to ship him off to New Mexico Military Institute in the fall. He out Ninja-ed me this time around.

TexasZagFan
02-27-2017, 02:10 PM
Oh, yeah, but I've been down in the Union Sq. area quite a bit since.

Congrats to you and your son, LIZF.

Plan C is to get my son to matriculate at University of Dallas. We went to Mass there last night, first time there in a while. Brought back memories of GU.

Based on his current grades (B+'s), he's on the glide path to North Lake CC for his first two years of college. :argh:

TexasZagFan
02-27-2017, 02:12 PM
:horse:

gonna be a long week

Bring back the OCC!!!

:starwars:

:horse:

:jk:

DirtyDredZag
02-27-2017, 02:15 PM
a lot of the biggest financial supporters did not go to the school. The new athletic facility was named after a man that did not go to school there but was new to the area and wanted to join the club in a big way. This is the best thing we have going in the area and successful people want to support a successful program( look what happened to Boise state jr. college). I can tell u that not every student enjoys the basketball program.

webspinnre
02-27-2017, 02:19 PM
I think defining "true" fans is a tricky thing. I don't see any particular reason to require attendance at a school to be a fan of one or more of that school's sports teams. That being said, there might be something for the idea that people who attended GU are less likely to personally criticize or insult players than those who didn't. There's a difference between, "that was a dumb decision" or "that was the dumbest decision in the history of GU basketball" and "Player X is dumb" or "Player X is the dumbest player in the history of GU basketball." Required classes in logic, rhetoric and public speaking include important distinctions such as these.

realtydog
02-27-2017, 02:54 PM
The school wants as many fans as po$$ible.....the team loves the fan support from all over.......and if you're an alum and you look down at other fans who are not...... I pity you

Zag_Dad
02-27-2017, 03:10 PM
My mother went to GU law, I got my BA and JD from GU, my wife has her BA from GU, three of my wife's siblings went to GU (one of them married another Zag), my oldest has her BA and Masters from GU, my middle child will get her BA from GU this May... we are all FANS.

My youngest is in high school. She has been with us to the Kraziness in the Kennel game 5 times, she has attended every Battle in Seattle game, has seen several games in the Kennel and flew down to Dallas with me to watch the GU/SMU game. She has more GU apparel than she does any other clothes. She watches every game with me on TV and was on the Root Sport NW "Where I Root" spot wearing GU gear... however, she hasn't graduated form GU (yet). I'd hate to let her know that she can't actually join the rest of the family at the "reserved for GU fans" table.

I think the fact that we draw fans from all over the country is AWESOME. It is a sign of our success. The GU experience is unique and those fans who didn't actually go to Gonzaga will not share that aspect of being fans but they are welcome on my bandwagon nonetheless.

bballbeachbum
02-27-2017, 03:22 PM
I feel like a guest as a non GU alum or student, I try to be respectful of that distinction and feel the love back. when I see non-Cal alums rooting heartily for the Bears, I always loved those folks

Martin Centre Mad Man
02-27-2017, 03:33 PM
Gonzaga gave me some amazing scholarship incentives to attend the school. I got a great education while I was there. I want the university to have the resources and support necessary for other students to achieve that same experience.

Every person who buys a Gonzaga sweatshirt or baseball hat puts a small amount of money into the university treasury. Every eyeball that boosts ratings of Gonzaga television broadcasts helps the team earn future revenue off of future television contracts. The more fans the merrier I say.

former1dog
02-27-2017, 03:48 PM
Another ridiculous thread. C'mon folks, calm the hell down.

ZagMan in Philly
02-27-2017, 03:50 PM
Zagnation does not have borders!

Hoopaholic
02-27-2017, 03:54 PM
I think defining "true" fans is a tricky thing. I don't see any particular reason to require attendance at a school to be a fan of one or more of that school's sports teams. That being said, there might be something for the idea that people who attended GU are less likely to personally criticize or insult players than those who didn't. There's a difference between, "that was a dumb decision" or "that was the dumbest decision in the history of GU basketball" and "Player X is dumb" or "Player X is the dumbest player in the history of GU basketball." Required classes in logic, rhetoric and public speaking include important distinctions such as these.

Thank you for capturing my feelings on this alleged issue perfectly. I owe you a cold one

zagbeliever
02-27-2017, 04:25 PM
We went to Nevada but our daughter graduated from GU. While she loves Gonzaga she could care less about the watching ZAGS. (she does want them to win but doesn't like sports) I became a die hard Zag fan while she went to school and my husband believes in the old adage happy wife happy life lol so he joined the cause. I consider myself a ZAG 100% and have converted my brother in law (also Nevada) and my sister (again Nevada) as well as my hairdresser (Eastern) as well as a couple others. So imho Yes you can be a fan without having gone there! I live and breathe for basketball season.

RenoZag
02-27-2017, 06:17 PM
Zagnation does not have borders!

Indeed


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