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View Full Version : Debating Few's "greatness" as a coach with KJR radio in Seattle ...



FuManShoes
02-03-2017, 10:11 AM
.. is a fool's errand, but I was feeling like a fool today, so here goes ...

https://twitter.com/kjrmitch/status/827548396051263488

I will try to dig up the on-air discussion later as it was actually pretty good and had most of the hosts conceding that what Few's done is remarkable, with or without a Final Four, and that other coaches aren't held to that standard.

allbusiness_zag
02-03-2017, 10:29 AM
KJR sucks. Those guys are the ultimate trolls of Seattle. A lower tier radio station to go along with their beloved lower tier UW men's basketball program.

DixieZag
02-03-2017, 10:32 AM
Maybe this will be the year he finally gets some national respect. Then he can work on having the Seattle side think he's not bad.

sittingon50
02-03-2017, 10:45 AM
Does the media have a place where they go to get their talking points?

This guy hasn't done 5 minutes worth of research.

Malastein
02-03-2017, 11:08 AM
Mark Few just finished his 600th game as coach, winning 489 of them for a winning percentage of 81.5%. If this team can get out of Moraga unscathed then they are likely to win out before the NCAA tournament. He's well on his way to a HOF resume, and has won against some impressive teams.

BayAreaZagFan
02-03-2017, 11:25 AM
If winning 500 games in the WCC is so easy, why hasn't every coach in the league done it?

zag944
02-03-2017, 11:40 AM
They set up a straw man where all of us dumb GU fans think we are on par with Duke and Kansas then argue why we aren't. Then they proceed to talk about our easy games ignoring the realities that it is much more difficult to build a tourney resume or recruit players in a small conference. It's all very silly.

TexasZagFan
02-03-2017, 12:13 PM
They set up a straw man where all of us dumb GU fans think we are on par with Duke and Kansas then argue why we aren't. Then they proceed to talk about our easy games ignoring the realities that it is much more difficult to build a tourney resume or recruit players in a small conference. It's all very silly.

Our SOS would be far better if we didn't play the Fuskies.

FuManShoes
02-03-2017, 12:25 PM
Far more interesting to me than the argument over how the Dawgs would do in the WCC or the Zags in the Pac 12 is whether a coach can be "great" if they haven't taken a team to the finals. Mitch seemed to be alone in arguing only championship coaches can be considered great. I'll argue till I'm blue in the face that consistency, winning percentage, player development, running a clean program, and maxing out talent and resources are all part of the "greatness" formula. By any of those measures Few is great. But doesn't matter what I think. Ask any coach in DI if they consider Few a great coach and I bet 90% or more say yes. Because they know the game and the landscape. No one, or few anyway, are arguing that Few is a legendary coach at this point. But FFS, he's by definition a great coach based on a resume that 99% of coaches would kill for.

Zags11
02-03-2017, 12:32 PM
Few is a great coach. His players are only getting better. However, I'd like to see a cpl final 4s before I say sure fire HOF.

maynard g krebs
02-03-2017, 12:35 PM
Mitch Levy is the creepy perv that tried to make a bet with Sue Bird on air that he could give her a spanking if she got less than a certain assist/turnover ratio some years ago.

He also does that thing where they put 64 "hot" actresses, singers, models etc in brackets and have callers vote on which is the hottest, until they crown a champion.

The fact that he hates Few and disses him on a regular basis should be considered a badge of honor.

gonzagafan62
02-03-2017, 12:45 PM
Our SOS would be far better if we didn't play the Fuskies.

I don't blame the Fuskies. I enjoy whooping their sasses.

Stop playing Mississippi Valley State (#347!!!)

seacatfan
02-03-2017, 01:03 PM
Our SOS would be far better if we didn't play the Fuskies.

Yeah, but avoiding teams like Quinnipiac and Bryant would help SOS a lot more than not playing UW.

zag944
02-03-2017, 01:03 PM
Far more interesting to me than the argument over how the Dawgs would do in the WCC or the Zags in the Pac 12

By all means, come to the WCC. Oh, but leave all those prized recruits you've underachieved with...no way they come to our conference in this hypothetical. Let us know how easy it is.

sittingon50
02-03-2017, 01:34 PM
Yeah, but avoiding teams like Quinnipiac and Bryant would help SOS a lot more than not playing UW.

Know what you're saying cat but FWIW, Quinnipiac was dictated by the Orlando Tourney.

And if the huskies were in the WCC they would find themselves in the same boat as BYU; they wouldn't have won a league title.

CDC84
02-03-2017, 01:53 PM
The Zags can't just play all heavy hitters in non-conference play. They have to play the occasional Bryant for revenue purposes and so that the team can work on things without having to worry about losing. Also, a lot of BCS teams have scheduling policies about playing heavy hitter games near finals week, close to Christmas, etc. They can afford to adopt such policies because they know conference play gives them a chance to boost their resume. So trying to find a quality opponent can sometimes be challenging.

What has hurt Gonzaga scheduling is WCC league expansion. BYU and Pacific have taken away 4 non-league games. The killer are the two games vs. Pacific.

SWZag
02-03-2017, 02:16 PM
The Zags can't just play all heavy hitters in non-conference play. They have to play the occasional Bryant for revenue purposes and so that the team can work on things without having to worry about losing. Also, a lot of BCS teams have scheduling policies about playing heavy hitter games near finals week, close to Christmas, etc. They can afford to adopt such policies because they know conference play gives them a chance to boost their resume. So trying to find a quality opponent can sometimes be challenging.

What has hurt Gonzaga scheduling is WCC league expansion. BYU and Pacific have taken away 4 non-league games. The killer are the two games vs. Pacific.

Has it really hurt us? I'm not entirely convinced. Even if those Pacific games were victories against UCLA and Oregon, I'm not sure we'd be in a much different place today. Maybe a few more "first-place votes" in the polls, but that's it. It's hard to be greater than #1. And come tourney time, if we're a #1 seed, is there really any detriment of playing Pacific vs. two "higher profile" schools? I'm not entirely convinced that it has hurt us.

rennis
02-03-2017, 02:26 PM
Mitch should stick to what he knows, UW Football. He'll never change. Even if the Zags make a FF or Don James-willing, a national championship, Mitch will find a way to discount it. Or most likely show a little temporary respect and turn back into himself as soon as GU isn't in the national spotlight again. It's just his personality.

CDC84
02-03-2017, 02:55 PM
Has it really hurt us? I'm not entirely convinced. Even if those Pacific games were victories against UCLA and Oregon, I'm not sure we'd be in a much different place today. Maybe a few more "first-place votes" in the polls, but that's it. It's hard to be greater than #1. And come tourney time, if we're a #1 seed, is there really any detriment of playing Pacific vs. two "higher profile" schools? I'm not entirely convinced that it has hurt us.

It has nothing to do with the polls. It has to do with getting the team better, and yes, maybe adding a resume building win as well. I'd do anything to play at Villanova or at Kansas two weeks from now. It would be great to have the opportunity to play a true, elite team. For the guys to have that experience before March. It would be invaluable. But they can't do it anymore because they don't have weeks during league play where they only play one game. It's one of the reasons why Coach Few has proposed the idea of playing an unbalanced league schedule in order to allow teams to play more non-league games. Even if you choose to not play a game during one of the two "bye" weeks, it allows your team a chance to rest up or get some more practice time in.

seacatfan
02-03-2017, 03:13 PM
Know what your saying cat but FWIW, Quinnipiac was dictated by the Orlando Tourney.

And if the huskies were in the WCC they would find themselves in the same boat as BYU; they wouldn't have won a league title.

True, Quinnipiac got dictated to them. Bryant and MVSU that someone else mentioned though are just bad teams that do absolutely nothing for GU. You can't necessarily predict in advance who will be 300+ RPI teams, but plenty of schedulers are savy enough to more often get teams in the 100-150 range than 300+.

Agreed, UW would not be winning WCC titles.

rennis
02-03-2017, 03:32 PM
It has nothing to do with the polls. It has to do with getting the team better, and yes, maybe adding a resume building win as well. I'd do anything to play at Villanova or at Kansas two weeks from now. It would be great to have the opportunity to play a true, elite team. For the guys to have that experience before March. It would be invaluable.

I see what you're saying and I mostly agree with you but BYU and SMC have been putting GU through plenty of adversity the last few years, IMO. As always the WCC is a double-edged sword. Certainly the cupcake wins do nothing to prepare GU for March but there are always a handful of games down the stretch that help build character. The Senior Night loss to BYU in 2015 ignited that team and helped send them all the way to the E8.

BayAreaZagFan
02-03-2017, 05:15 PM
From the Washington Post article earlier today:

“People don’t realize just how hard it is to be that good all the time at Gonzaga,” said former Maryland coach Gary Williams, who heard the whispers about his lack of a Final Four appearance until he broke through in his 12th season with the Terrapins. “They aren’t in a power conference; they play on the West Coast where most of their games are on too late at night in the East for people to watch. Plus, they aren’t Kentucky or Kansas or Duke or North Carolina. And yet, every year, they’re good. Mark’s not a good coach, he’s a great coach. Period.”

But what does a former National Championship-winning head coach know compared to some Seattle morning dj?

zag67
02-03-2017, 06:35 PM
I know that the WCC is not a great conference. But they are improving and if they improve next year as much as this year and do the same for a few seasons, it will be even greater.
As example RPI ratings:
top 3 teams: 2017 2016
Gonzaga .......11 46
Saint Mary... 21 40
BYU .......... 97 76

Rest of the league:
Year: .....2017 ............ 2016
Average: 172 ........... 236
worst: ...232 ......... 302

Our worst this year is lower than our average last year of our bottom 7. that is a super good jump.

Zagceo
02-03-2017, 07:08 PM
looking for acceptance from uneducated sports hacks is a fools errand....

Birddog
02-03-2017, 07:49 PM
looking for acceptance from uneducated sports hacks is a fools errand....

Bingo, and my perception is that most local sports talking heads are fat, lazy and not all that well versed. They just read newspapers and crap on the internet like us. Oooops, that sounds like we are only as smart as the talk jocks, we're smarter than that.

jpn17
02-03-2017, 08:09 PM
The Zags can't just play all heavy hitters in non-conference play. They have to play the occasional Bryant for revenue purposes and so that the team can work on things without having to worry about losing. Also, a lot of BCS teams have scheduling policies about playing heavy hitter games near finals week, close to Christmas, etc. They can afford to adopt such policies because they know conference play gives them a chance to boost their resume. So trying to find a quality opponent can sometimes be challenging.

What has hurt Gonzaga scheduling is WCC league expansion. BYU and Pacific have taken away 4 non-league games. The killer are the two games vs. Pacific.


Exactly. But people dog on Gonzaga for playing some cupcakes in the OOC, while talking about the ACC and the Pac-12 and how tough they are, and they act like all 18 games they play are against the Duke's, UNC's, Arizona's etc. They fail to mention that there's plenty of Oregon States, Wake Forests and Boston Colleges in these conferences as well. In the ACC in particular there's so many teams that you likely have to play the Duke's and UNC's only once.

MickMick
02-03-2017, 08:37 PM
Few is a legend. I wouldn't swap him for anybody.

BorisZag
02-04-2017, 05:24 AM
I listened to KJR in the mornings for nine years or so when I was living in Seattle and I actually found Mitch to be fairly knowledgeable and entertaining . . . except when it came to Mark Few and Gonzaga basketball. For some reason he has a completely irrational lack of respect for Coach Few. But, on a side note, he is a Syracuse alumni and bleeds Orange, except he is not a fan of Boeheim, so I have to give him props there.

When Gonzaga played Syracuse back in the 2nd round of the NCAA tournament in 2010 I sent him a message about making a bet on the game . . . he didn't bother to responding back to me until after Syracuse beat us by 22 points . . . kind of a chickenS*%t move.

dhozagfan08
02-04-2017, 08:08 AM
Mitch is a petty man, who holds a grudge like no other. His two biggest grudges are against Phil Mickleson and Few. He calls Few the weasel because Few canceled an interview with him like 15 years ago. His assistant host is Dick Fain, who I really like. He is a UW fan, but he is a big Zags supporter. The best part of their show is from 5:30 to 6:00 am when Dick runs the show before Mitch comes in.

Virginia Zags Fan
02-04-2017, 08:40 AM
I know that the WCC is not a great conference. But they are improving and if they improve next year as much as this year and do the same for a few seasons, it will be even greater.
As example RPI ratings:
top 3 teams: 2017 2016
Gonzaga .......11 46
Saint Mary... 21 40
BYU .......... 97 76

Rest of the league:
Year: .....2017 ............ 2016
Average: 172 ........... 236
worst: ...232 ......... 302

Our worst this year is lower than our average last year of our bottom 7. that is a super good jump.

Thanks for the stats 67. That is a big improvement. Hope it continues. My wish for the league is for the WCC to be the premier non power conference.

Ballguy
02-04-2017, 09:11 AM
Mitch is a petty man, who holds a grudge like no other. His two biggest grudges are against Phil Mickleson and Few. He calls Few the weasel because Few canceled an interview with him like 15 years ago. His assistant host is Dick Fain, who I really like. He is a UW fan, but he is a big Zags supporter. The best part of their show is from 5:30 to 6:00 am when Dick runs the show before Mitch comes in.


This. Get over it Mitch!

zagzilla
02-04-2017, 09:16 AM
489 career wins means that Few could get #500 as soon as the Sweet 16 this year. If they drop one before the dance, he could get #500 by winning the E8 game that gets him to his first final four.

ZZ

coolhandzag
02-04-2017, 10:28 AM
This. Get over it Mitch!

A response on this question could go a lot of different ways. Mitch is a provocateur who realizes where his bread is buttered. The problem for him in particular and the UW Men's bball program in general is that the localized bball tide in attitude toward GU is beginning to shift a bit. It's what happens when NWG has such success.

Mitch is a big mouth.......so be it. It's why I don't listen anymore.

seacatfan
02-04-2017, 11:52 AM
But, on a side note, he is a Syracuse alumni and bleeds Orange, except he is not a fan of Boeheim, so I have to give him props there.


Hasn't Boeheim been the coach there for about 40 years? Kinda hard to be a Syracuse fan if you don't like Boeheim. Did they even exist before he was there? That's an interesting conundrum for this Mitch character.