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Reborn
08-29-2016, 06:48 AM
Seniors have always been the leaders on Gonzaga's basketball team. And this year there is only one senior who has played four years at Gonzaga. More than anyone, Przemek represents everything that Zag basketball is all about. The Zags will really need his leadership this year. A LOT! This team has a lot of players who have transfered to Gonzaga from other schools, and they are very talented players. I think there could be a tendency for these players to play one on one basketball, which is NOT Zag basketball, and Przemek Karnowski will be there to rein these guys in and encourage them to give up the ego in favor of the team.

Karnowski has gotten better and better every year, and this trend will continue this year. Yes. He had the injury, but I believe it's not going to be a problem for him. I totally believe that Karnowski returned to play at Gonzaga this year because he believes it's the best route for him to the NBA. I think that if he felt his back was going to be a problem that he would not have returned to play. I believe his rehabilitation plan was perfect for him, and he followed it to perfection. He will be ready to play.

Przemek Karnowski will be a force in the middle, and imo, a greater force on defense than Sabonis was, and Gonzaga will need that. He is a rim protector in a way that Sabonis was not. He is a better passer than Sabonis, and I feel knows the offense better. Przemek is a good rebounder, but Sabonis may be the one of the very best rebounders that Gonzaga ever had. But still, PK is no slouch. He's a rock. He's a mountain in the middle, and thus is often called Mt PK. He was once a gentle giant. But as he has matured, he has learned to play the game with more passion and force, and I believe we will see a lot of that this year.

We all will miss Sabonis a lot. He was special. But thank God we have Przemek Karnowski to fill up that empty spot. PK is special too and he can have the kind of season that Sabonis had last year. I look to PK to be the emotional leader of Zags this year. There are a lot of star players on this team, and yet, imo the brightest one will be Przemek Karnowski.

bigblahla
08-29-2016, 07:06 AM
Seniors have always been the leaders on Gonzaga's basketball team. And this year there is only one senior who has played four years at Gonzaga. More than anyone, Przemek represents everything that Zag basketball is all about. The Zags will really need his leadership this year. A LOT! This team has a lot of players who have transfered to Gonzaga from other schools, and they are very talented players. I think there could be a tendency for these players to play one on one basketball, which is NOT Zag basketball, and Przemek Karnowski will be there to rein these guys in and encourage them to give up the ego in favor of the team.

Karnowski has gotten better and better every year, and this trend will continue this year. Yes. He had the injury, but I believe it's not going to be a problem for him. I totally believe that Karnowski returned to play at Gonzaga this year because he believes it's the best route for him to the NBA. I think that if he felt his back was going to be a problem that he would not have returned to play. I believe his rehabilitation plan was perfect for him, and he followed it to perfection. He will be ready to play.

Przemek Karnowski will be a force in the middle, and imo, a greater force on defense than Sabonis was, and Gonzaga will need that. He is a rim protector in a way that Sabonis was not. He is a better passer than Sabonis, and I feel knows the offense better. Przemek is a good rebounder, but Sabonis may be the one of the very best rebounders that Gonzaga ever had. But still, PK is no slouch. He's a rock. He's a mountain in the middle, and thus is often called Mt PK. He was once a gentle giant. But as he has matured, he has learned to play the game with more passion and force, and I believe we will see a lot of that this year.

We all will miss Sabonis a lot. He was special. But thank God we have Przemek Karnowski to fill up that empty spot. PK is special too and he can have the kind of season that Sabonis had last year. I look to PK to be the emotional leader of Zags this year. There are a lot of star players on this team, and yet, imo the brightest one will be Przemek Karnowski.

Nice bornie....gonna be A fun year...

Go!! Zags!!!

tyra
08-29-2016, 08:25 AM
Good stuff Reborn BUT (there's always a but) I don't agree that "seniors have always been the leaders" on GU's teams. Arguably, Gonzaga was Pangos' team when he was a sophomore but certainly during his junior campaign.

amaronizag
08-29-2016, 08:43 AM
Few is certainly loyal to his seniors, and appreciates and rewards those who stick with the program. Demonstrating loyalty is an important part of the formula for signing and keeping good players. BUT, players also have to earn their spot and play hard to defend their starting role. Nothing is given. I'm sure strong encouragements, inducements and suggestions about what role an individual will play on the team are made in the recruiting process but there are no guarantees. There are going to be a lot of players trying to prove their value this year to earn minutes. The is no substitute for experience that comes with age and playing time so upper class men are the natural leaders, but you never know when someone is going to step up with a breakout year and take over a team. Lots of possible candidates this year, but I look to Karno as the glue guy, healthy or not, but I also see a huge amount of talent at every position so we may get some pleasant surprises. For sure there will be lots of important contributors, no weak links at any position, and I expect to be dazzled as the new guys learn the system and play their way into the mix. I see a lot of blowouts this year because there should be little drop of in play with substitutions and end of game situation. We could average 85 points per game and finish in the top 15 for offensive and defensive efficiency......the formula for a Final Four.

Reborn
08-29-2016, 10:25 AM
Good stuff Reborn BUT (there's always a but) I don't agree that "seniors have always been the leaders" on GU's teams. Arguably, Gonzaga was Pangos' team when he was a sophomore but certainly during his junior campaign.

I was thinking that also. I hesitated when I wrote it because of Pangos. Kevin was definitely a great leader probably from the moment he stepped on a basketball court. I remember that game against WSU his freshman year. In fact I was there in K2, and it was maybe his first home game and wow, something like 33 points.

jazzdelmar
08-29-2016, 10:38 AM
Wonderful young man but end of the year not among the best 6 players on the team.

Reborn
08-29-2016, 10:50 AM
I must disagree with you Jazz. Go back to the year before last when Gonzaga reached the Elite 8. Do you remember how well he played? He is a force inside, and a wall that protects the basket on defense. I will always remember how he totally stopped Okafor (Duke's center). Dukes guards really stepped up in that game and really hurt us. They were too big for Pangons. Okafor was the MAN for Duke, and when I saw how Mt K was stopping him, I really thought we had a chance to win. I also remember us totally dominating UCLA inside in the Sweet 16 that year, and how UCLA killed us last year without PK in the middle.

jazzdelmar
08-29-2016, 11:02 AM
I must disagree with you Jazz. Go back to the year before last when Gonzaga reached the Elite 8. Do you remember how well he played? He is a force inside, and a wall that protects the basket on defense. I will always remember how he totally stopped Okafor (Duke's center). Dukes guards really stepped up in that game and really hurt us. They were too big for Pangons. Okafor was the MAN for Duke, and when I saw how Mt K was stopping him, I really thought we had a chance to win. I also remember us totally dominating UCLA inside in the Sweet 16 that year, and how UCLA killed us last year without PK in the middle.


No doubt Born. Vs Duke was the apex of Karnos GU career. I'm not so much suggesting he will have regressed as saying the newcomers are just so darn good. My feelings on Collins are known, that he's a far better prospect than Karno ever was. As well, when I say not in the top 6 it's also a reflection of the superior players arriving who are not so called bigs. I could be wrong, as ever.

zag67
08-29-2016, 11:36 AM
So Jaz, before I answer who do you think were the six that were better than him last year, or are you talking this year ( and who). THX.

jazzdelmar
08-29-2016, 11:39 AM
So Jaz, before I answer who do you think were the six that were better than him last year, or are you talking this year ( and who). THX.

This. Last year five were better performers. This year, Collins, Williams, Goss and Matthews easy. Hopefully Perks and maybe a dark horse. Karnos not that good, fellas. And the back? Where would you rate him?

MDABE80
08-29-2016, 12:35 PM
This upcoming team has a very different skill set. All good athletes . Karno just isn't a good athlete. He does have other skills that make him important.
Those 3 guards will run. Not a half court type group. Not sure Karno can keep up. I hope so but if this new team with new faces play like I think they will, expect WIlliams and Collins to get a lot of court time.

Karno has his place on this team but I doubt Few brought in these new athletes to slow the game down. Rui's a crazy athlete. Collins will surprise you. I think he's better than Josh H was at this stage except in one phase...( I still can't believe Josh H's skill on the tun. Like a guard who was 6 11).....and that's saying something. The guards speak for themselves. For half court sets are fine for the big man. A game designed to be more along the lines of half court play will too. Lots of options this year. I do not think Karno will be as important to this team as he was his last year of play.
Who knows though with Few. He may just play the more relaxed game . Last 10 games, EMac ran the team hard. I'm still shocked that team could ascend with a running game and only 6 players! Funn season coming up!

Reborn
08-29-2016, 12:40 PM
This upcoming team has a very different skill set. All good athletes . Karno just isn't a good athlete. He does have other skills that make him important.
Those 3 guards will run. Not a half court type group. Not sure Karno can keep up. I hope so but if this new team with new faces play like I think they will, expect WIlliams and Collins to get a lot of court time.

Karno has his place on this team but I doubt Few brought in these new athletes to slow the game down. Rui's a crazy athlete. Collins will surprise you. I think he's better than Josh H was at this stage except in one phase...( I still can't believe Josh H's skill on the tun. Like a guard who was 6 11).....and that's saying something. The guards speak for themselves. For half court sets are fine for the big man. A game designed to be more along the lines of half court play will too. Lots of options this year. I do not think Karno will be as important to this team as he was his last year of play.
Who knows though with Few. He may just play the more relaxed game . Last 10 games, EMac ran the team hard. I'm still shocked that team could ascend with a running game and only 6 players! Funn season coming up!

Wouldn't you say from knowing Mark Few that he likes low post offense, and tough rim protectors like Karno? I would say he does. He's always liked low post players and could become frustrated when his post players would go outside and shoot the 3 like Josh H.

maynard g krebs
08-29-2016, 01:05 PM
I think there could be a tendency for these players to play one on one basketball, which is NOT Zag basketball, and Przemek Karnowski will be there to rein these guys in and encourage them to give up the ego in favor of the team.



Don't want to take a minor point out of context too much, because I liked your post about Karno. I love his game as well, and hope you are right about his health. I believe he's the anchor to this team as well.

But I disagree with the above. I have watched NWG (can we please stop calling him Goss?) play since his jr year at Findlay and have always been impressed with his heady, unselfish play. Let's keep in mind that this is an A student as well, who could have gone to Harvard. I believe he transferred to GU because he didn't like playing the UW style, watched the Zags on tv and wanted to be a part of it.

I think Matthews' role will be primarily as a catch and shoot guy, either off penetration or from kickouts when the post is doubled, and he'll pick his spots when there's an opening to get to the basket. These guys are veteran, high level players and they didn't come to GU to play stupid, selfish basketball. I expect them to fit in seamlessly.

Williams' role (haven't really seen him) sounds like it will be primarily defense/rebounding with all the offensive talent on this team.

maynard g krebs
08-29-2016, 01:13 PM
This upcoming team has a very different skill set. All good athletes . Karno just isn't a good athlete. He does have other skills that make him important.
Those 3 guards will run. Not a half court type group. Not sure Karno can keep up.

I don't think he needs to. Fast breaks usually don't involve more than 3 guys, and maybe the 4th as a trailer on the secondary break, North Carolina style (Collins will be great at this). While it's nice to have a big who can outrun his man down the floor for an easy bucket, it's not an essential. If a transition scoring opportunity isn't there, this team will have plenty of shooting and post scoring and penetrating ability to run a halfcourt offense, and the extra second or 2 it takes Karno to get down the floor and set up in the post isn't a deal breaker for the offense.

MontanaCoyote
08-29-2016, 01:25 PM
Seniors have always been the leaders on Gonzaga's basketball team. And this year there is only one senior who has played four years at Gonzaga. More than anyone, Przemek represents everything that Zag basketball is all about. The Zags will really need his leadership this year. A LOT! This team has a lot of players who have transfered to Gonzaga from other schools, and they are very talented players. I think there could be a tendency for these players to play one on one basketball, which is NOT Zag basketball, and Przemek Karnowski will be there to rein these guys in and encourage them to give up the ego in favor of the team.



Karnowski has gotten better and better every year, and this trend will continue this year. Yes. He had the injury, but I believe it's not going to be a problem for him. I totally believe that Karnowski returned to play at Gonzaga this year because he believes it's the best route for him to the NBA. I think that if he felt his back was going to be a problem that he would not have returned to play. I believe his rehabilitation plan was perfect for him, and he followed it to perfection. He will be ready to play.

Przemek Karnowski will be a force in the middle, and imo, a greater force on defense than Sabonis was, and Gonzaga will need that. He is a rim protector in a way that Sabonis was not. He is a better passer than Sabonis, and I feel knows the offense better. Przemek is a good rebounder, but Sabonis may be the one of the very best rebounders that Gonzaga ever had. But still, PK is no slouch. He's a rock. He's a mountain in the middle, and thus is often called Mt PK. He was once a gentle giant. But as he has matured, he has learned to play the game with more passion and force, and I believe we will see a lot of that this year.

We all will miss Sabonis a lot. He was special. But thank God we have Przemek Karnowski to fill up that empty spot. PK is special too and he can have the kind of season that Sabonis had last year. I look to PK to be the emotional leader of Zags this year. There are a lot of star players on this team, and yet, imo the brightest one will be Przemek Karnowski.

Yes and yes again. As I've said in a number of posts and for any number of reasons, KARNO IS THE KEY. I don't care about athleticism or stats. Because of everything he brings to the game (and most importantly the fact that he makes all his team
mates better) I don't think (all things considered) they'll be a more all around more valuable player to his team in all of D 1 basketball.
When asked why he climbed Mount Everest, Sir Edmund Hillary said "Because it is there." What makes Mt. Karno so special? Because HE is there. Period. Exclamation Point!

Zaga
08-29-2016, 01:45 PM
These guys are veteran, high level players and they didn't come to GU to play stupid, selfish basketball. I expect them to fit in seamlessly.


I could not agree more Maynard! Can't wait to see them play fast under control, something prior teams struggled to consistently do. Go Zag's!

Reborn
08-29-2016, 03:47 PM
Don't want to take a minor point out of context too much, because I liked your post about Karno. I love his game as well, and hope you are right about his health. I believe he's the anchor to this team as well.

But I disagree with the above. I have watched NWG (can we please stop calling him Goss?) play since his jr year at Findlay and have always been impressed with his heady, unselfish play. Let's keep in mind that this is an A student as well, who could have gone to Harvard. I believe he transferred to GU because he didn't like playing the UW style, watched the Zags on tv and wanted to be a part of it.

I think Matthews' role will be primarily as a catch and shoot guy, either off penetration or from kickouts when the post is doubled, and he'll pick his spots when there's an opening to get to the basket. These guys are veteran, high level players and they didn't come to GU to play stupid, selfish basketball. I expect them to fit in seamlessly.

Williams' role (haven't really seen him) sounds like it will be primarily defense/rebounding with all the offensive talent on this team.

Thanks for a great explanation Maynard. Thanks for helping clarify some points. I'm glad to hear what you said about NWG, and especially because you've seen him play so much. I am hoping that Mathews will play the same role Byron Wesley did. That guy really helped the Zags. I had a big question mark about him prior to that season two years ago, and he certainly answered the call. Loved that guy.

Reborn
08-29-2016, 03:49 PM
I don't think he needs to. Fast breaks usually don't involve more than 3 guys, and maybe the 4th as a trailer on the secondary break, North Carolina style (Collins will be great at this). While it's nice to have a big who can outrun his man down the floor for an easy bucket, it's not an essential. If a transition scoring opportunity isn't there, this team will have plenty of shooting and post scoring and penetrating ability to run a halfcourt offense, and the extra second or 2 it takes Karno to get down the floor and set up in the post isn't a deal breaker for the offense.

I'm pretty sure Shem lost a lot of weight, at least prior to last year. Remember how great he looked? Maybe he'll be faster.

OZZY
08-29-2016, 07:45 PM
In Karno I trust...


:)

bballbeachbum
08-29-2016, 08:38 PM
we'll have to see how Karno is with his back and his health. IF those are fine, he's the perfect guy to protect the rim to start the break for all the guys everyone is drooling over who haven't played a minute in the Zag uni. but there's no break if there's no D, and Karno is the man for that inside. He's also proven to be an excellent option in the post; if there is no double he scores, if there is he's a great passer out of the double team to make everyone else's job easier. if he's healthy, he's key to whatever happens next year seems to me. we'll see

MDABE80
08-29-2016, 08:39 PM
Wouldn't you say from knowing Mark Few that he likes low post offense, and tough rim protectors like Karno? I would say he does. He's always liked low post players and could become frustrated when his post players would go outside and shoot the 3 like Josh H.


Normally yes BUT we've not had this caliber of athlete(s) in the past years. I'm not sure we know how good and talented this group is just yet. Once they click ( if they click) they'll be a secure top ten team who can run with anyone/everyone. Depends on how Few wants to use them and who the opponent is I guess. I think we blend the skill ets this year. But, if Few wants a tall, fast group, he'll have the option.
Karno's a fav here. No doubt. But we did amazingly well without him last year. That outcome might occur this upcoming year even though, he's definitely got a spot. Point being is that we've got way better guard core this season and next. Hard to outdoe WIltjer and DOmas. But the new guys have other skills. As a team, we'll be better. thus my prediction of E 8 or FF.

Reborn
08-29-2016, 08:50 PM
Normally yes BUT we've not had this caliber of athlete(s) in the past years. I'm not sure we know how good and talented this group is just yet. Once they click ( if they click) they'll be a secure top ten team who can run with anyone/everyone. Depends on how Few wants to use them and who the opponent is I guess. I think we blend the skill ets this year. But, if Few wants a tall, fast group, he'll have the option.
Karno's a fav here. No doubt. But we did amazingly well without him last year. That outcome might occur this upcoming year even though, he's definitely got a spot. Point being is that we've got way better guard core this season and next. Hard to outdoe WIltjer and DOmas. But the new guys have other skills. As a team, we'll be better. thus my prediction of E 8 or FF.

I agree that this will be a team whose primary scorers will be perimeter players, including Collins (stretch 4 like Wiltjer). But I will not buy the idea that Karno will not start. And I do believe he will be a leader and significant player on this team. His passing out of the post is far better than Sabonis'. He is not the scorer Sabonis is or Wiltjer. But we don't need Karno to be a huge scorer. But, and it's a pretty big BUT, if he is not double teamed he can and will score. Neither Sabonis or Wiltjer could pass very well out of the low post, and to some degree it hurt the team. It wasn't until the guards began to score, and began to hit the 3's, that the Zags really jelled. The run at the end of the year was not due to Sabonis or Wiltjer. Those two played great most of the year. Our guards had problems for most of the year, but we will not see that this year, and in fact we'll see the opposite. We have a whole host of great perimeter players this year. But let's not downplay the importance of PK to this team. This team will be better than last years, and imo part of the reason will be PK. He's not Sabonis nor Wiltjer, but THEY ARE NOT HIM EITHER. Neither of them have the skills PK has, and believe me that they are important to the success of the team.

bballbeachbum
08-29-2016, 08:52 PM
Karno is a proven player, and will be a senior, and was highly missed last year. that the team evolved without him once he went down is not testament to his lack of impact...wow, can't believe that needs to be said. whatever.

that he's a favorite or not is irrelevant. is he healthy? that's the ONLY relevant question regarding his importance this season. if he is, all the new guys, all the amazingness that's coming, will be that much more amazing because of how he demands the double team and can exploit it, how he protects the rim so the others can defend the perimeter and force the dribble drive without having to send help from off the ball which leaves wide open 3 point shots. not many players like that in the world at 7 foot whatever he is, let alone college basketball.

I just hope he's healthy.

MDABE80
08-29-2016, 09:16 PM
It's not a bout Karno being good or bad. It's about a feeling I have that this new team isn't like the teams before. With that , comes change.
If I'm reading this right, the new team will be substantially different in terms of what skills it has. We have 2 scoring guards with speed from the Pac 12. Also, the two new bigs are far more athletic than we've seen in a while. Good to have a big guy that takes up space and can pass.
Will our big guy fit with the new guys and probable new style of play? I dunno.

An yes he's a fn favorite and around here, that matters. I don't think a different opinion regarding Karno's skills and his futre should generate a big disagreemnt. SOme have their views. I just don't ascribe to the general opinion that Karno's ALL that or will lead this team to a 16 or beyond. He might be contributory but all eyes won't be on him.

TexasZag
08-30-2016, 06:04 AM
So...are we talking skill, or leadership? The first sentence in this this thread seems to suggest this is about leadership, so naturally I thought that this is what the discussion was about. But... Anyway, to the point of the initial statement in the OP's post, leadership has little to do with skill. It's about getting others around them to buy into a system and to adopt the team's objectives as their own. You don't need to be the most skilled on the floor to have that kind of impact, but you do need the respect of your teammates. PK seems to fill the bill, especially having been part of the last two runs in the NCAA's and having fought back like he appears to have from his back injury. I think that if he's willing to lead, others will follow. And you can certainly have more than one guy step up and take on a leadership role.

willandi
08-30-2016, 06:17 AM
Much like what people are saying about Matthews...Do you think Karno came back just to sit on the bench?

He's a grad student and could have transferred anywher, could have gone to Europe. He has something to prove, Few likes to reward his seniors, and It's Karno's job to lose. He will start, if healthy enough, until it is shown that the Zags are better without him in the middle.

TheGonzagaFactor
08-30-2016, 06:39 AM
I haven't seen any proof that he's not easily our best big.

Collins looks awesome, but so did Heytvelt before playing NCAA ball- and even early in his career. Next thing you know, he was refusing to go near the basket. A bust.

Heytvelt recovered to have an OK career, but the point is the same. A guy can look good in HS or early in college, nothing else is given.

Collins hasn't played a minute of D1 ball. He's also a freshman and could hit the wall at any time. We made the mistake with Perkins of seeing recruiting rankings and HS highlights and assuming that he'd step in and be another John Stockton from the instant he stepped on the floor. It rarely happens like that. Even really good freshmen (better than ZC in terms of rankings) can have a low-output season before hitting the ground running in year 2.


I just think it's ridiculous that so many are assuming Collins and JW3 are already better than Karno. Karno played so well in his last full season, especially in the tourney, and that point is refuted by saying the new guys will be better. They may end up being better (I see zero proof of this as a likelihood with JW3, however) but right now Karno has the skill and experience to be this team's anchor. We don't know about anyone else.

If Collins and JW3 are the unstoppable studs on both ends of the floor that some assume they are, then we will have the most amazing big man rotation in NCAA with Karno, JW3 and Collins. I think they will all play similar minutes when all is said and done, and the debate over who is best or worst of the 3 will be a tough one. They are all good enough to run with this team, IMO.

amaronizag
08-30-2016, 07:20 AM
All anyone has to do is look back at our record last year. The year began full of excitement and promise. We were were winning big and even Mark Few was suggesting great things were in store for that special team. Then Karno went down and there was shell shock. Team performance dropped off dramatically as did our expectations. We were still a good team (sweet 16 good in the end) but it took months to pull the team together without Karno. It was a HUGE hole to fill. It was a vastly different team without Karno. As someone else pointed out earlier, he is an automatic score deep in the paint so he is always double or triple teamed opening up our excellent perimeter game or the 4. And he is a giant defensive wall few opposing guards dare to challenge. His value and mere presence on the floor is, and always has been, greatly under estimated in my opinion. He is the center of our system around which everything else rotates. I am confident Collins will learn to excel at that role in substitution for Karno and playing together with Karno. But there is only one Karno, in the whole country there is only one Karno.

MontanaCoyote
08-30-2016, 10:59 AM
All anyone has to do is look back at our record last year. The year began full of excitement and promise. We were were winning big and even Mark Few was suggesting great things were in store for that special team. Then Karno went down and there was shell shock. Team performance dropped off dramatically as did our expectations. We were still a good team (sweet 16 good in the end) but it took months to pull the team together without Karno. It was a HUGE hole to fill. It was a vastly different team without Karno. As someone else pointed out earlier, he is an automatic score deep in the paint so he is always double or triple teamed opening up our excellent perimeter game or the 4. And he is a giant defensive wall few opposing guards dare to challenge. His value and mere presence on the floor is, and always has been, greatly under estimated in my opinion. He is the center of our system around which everything else rotates. I am confident Collins will learn to excel at that role in substitution for Karno and playing together with Karno. But there is only one Karno, in the whole country there is only one Karno.

Right on! As I've been posting adinfinitum KARNO IS THE KEY. See my post yesterday on ONE big bold prediction if
you like. Others having anything to do with The Mountain. Single most underrated but most valuable player to his team in
all of D1 basketball.

seacatfan
08-30-2016, 11:21 AM
Thanks for a great explanation Maynard. Thanks for helping clarify some points. I'm glad to hear what you said about NWG, and especially because you've seen him play so much. I am hoping that Mathews will play the same role Byron Wesley did. That guy really helped the Zags. I had a big question mark about him prior to that season two years ago, and he certainly answered the call. Loved that guy.

I can't see Matthews playing the same role at GU as Wesley did, because Wesley was a fairly poor 3 point shooter and it's primarily what Matthews is known for.

titopoet
08-30-2016, 11:51 AM
I can't see Matthews playing the same role at GU as Wesley did, because Wesley was a fairly poor 3 point shooter and it's primarily what Matthews is known for.

When the offense runs through Karno, he finds the open. Rather than Wesley cutting to the basket, Karno will find Matthews rolling to a 3 pt spot. (NGW will be cutting to the basket.) A healthy Karno is one of the best Centers in America.

Reborn
08-30-2016, 12:04 PM
I can't see Matthews playing the same role at GU as Wesley did, because Wesley was a fairly poor 3 point shooter and it's primarily what Matthews is known for.

The same role in terms of being the 3rd scorer. In terms of being about 6'5", 6' 6" tall. In terms of being a guy who filled in the 3 or small forward position when we had a hole there. I think Wesley averaged about the same as Mathews did before going to GU, and averaged double figures at GU. PLaying a role is different than being the same kind of player. Of course they are different kind of players.

DixieZag
08-30-2016, 12:06 PM
I worry that the back will dictate his year more than his shooting or assists or blocks. I've said before, I'm skeptical of back surgery getting someone back 100%, never mind improving.

Hope you're all right.

MDABE80
08-30-2016, 12:08 PM
When Karno went down, It was a huge jolt to the system Remeber too though, all scribs .ALL/NONE liked out immature guards. That was true too. Replacing Karno AND the guards wwas the reason we lost momentum so quickly. Few not only had to change his game in terms of a stalwart in the middle but had to develop inexperienced guards at the same time. Tough work.
Now, we have very good guards. Karno has to fit in a new system. If he does, we're world beaters. If he doesn't, we have superior replacements. I do understand the issue with Josh H though. I suppose it could happen with Zack but I doubt it. Possible though.

Zagdawg
08-30-2016, 12:25 PM
Karnowski in the corner-- looks like Sporting News agrees with most of us about his importance to the Zags.


http://i1251.photobucket.com/albums/hh559/zagdawg/CrH6_ypWIAQuKsX.jpg (http://s1251.photobucket.com/user/zagdawg/media/CrH6_ypWIAQuKsX.jpg.html)

seacatfan
08-30-2016, 01:35 PM
Okay, I can agree with everybody about Matthews being a 3rd scorer similar to Wesley. BW averaged almost 18 ppg his Jr. year at USC (but under double digits the previous 2 years), JM averaged about 13 1/2 soph and jr. year at Cal. The big difference is BW was about the only player at USC worth a damn and Matthews had a number of talented teammates.

And agree with the post several spots up that Karno can find Matthews in position to score when the double team comes, just like he did with Wesley.

krii
08-30-2016, 01:59 PM
We don't know how Shem will look like after this back injury but if his recovery went well and he is able to play AT LEAST at the same level at before the injury, than it's easily one of the most dominant center in the entire NCAA.

There is this bold prediction topic but I would also like to do a bold prediction for Karno separately. He will not only be the best defender in the team but also - unlike other seasons - the Stats King.

Look ... He was always playing with someone who was considerably better or who was perceived the center (the axiom) of the team (Olynyk, Wiltjer). If he is healthy and he can play like before and his general athleticism improves, which I believe will happen, than we have a college monster on both ends. Listen. We are talking about 7-1 guy who can play basketball, not just be there. He will never be the star in the NBA but in college he is just too big, too skilled and too strong to not be successful. This year the team is focused on newcomers but not at single name in particular. That is why he will have more opportunities to actually be the center piece of the team.

So booooold prediction for Karno. Let's start with usage - I say it will be around 29%(!), higher than his first year (27.8%). In terms of other advanced stats it will be something like ORtg 119 / DRtg 92.5. He will average about 25 minutes per game with 14ppg/2.8apg/7.5rpg/1spg/1.9bpg/1.8tpg/1.9fpg with shooting ca .610 FG% and .650 FT%.

2nd Team All-America, DPOY - nominee, WCC Player of the Year, 28th pick (SAS!) ;-)

I'd be soooo sad if I'm wrong ;-)

Coach Crazy
08-30-2016, 02:34 PM
We don't know how Shem will look like after this back injury but if his recovery went well and he is able to play AT LEAST at the same level at before the injury, than it's easily one of the most dominant center in the entire NCAA.

There is this bold prediction topic but I would also like to do a bold prediction for Karno separately. He will not only be the best defender in the team but also - unlike other seasons - the Stats King.

Look ... He was always playing with someone who was considerably better or who was perceived the center (the axiom) of the team (Olynyk, Wiltjer). If he is healthy and he can play like before and his general athleticism improves, which I believe will happen, than we have a college monster on both ends. Listen. We are talking about 7-1 guy who can play basketball, not just be there. He will never be the star in the NBA but in college he is just too big, too skilled and too strong to not be successful. This year the team is focused on newcomers but not at single name in particular. That is why he will have more opportunities to actually be the center piece of the team.

So booooold prediction for Karno. Let's start with usage - I say it will be around 29%(!), higher than his first year (27.8%). In terms of other advanced stats it will be something like ORtg 119 / DRtg 92.5. He will average about 25 minutes per game with 14ppg/2.8apg/7.5rpg/1spg/1.9bpg/1.8tpg/1.9fpg with shooting ca .610 FG% and .650 FT%.

2nd Team All-America, DPOY - nominee, WCC Player of the Year, 28th pick (SAS!) ;-)

I'd be soooo sad if I'm wrong ;-)

Nice to see someone else using advanced stats . And I will take that bolded section, in a heart beat.

Bogozags
08-30-2016, 03:14 PM
Okay, I can agree with everybody about Matthews being a 3rd scorer similar to Wesley. BW averaged almost 18 ppg his Jr. year at USC (but under double digits the previous 2 years), JM averaged about 13 1/2 soph and jr. year at Cal. The big difference is BW was about the only player at USC worth a damn and Matthews had a number of talented teammates.

And agree with the post several spots up that Karno can find Matthews in position to score when the double team comes, just like he did with Wesley.

With one very important difference - Matthews is a shooter...we lose the slasher but gain an excellent 3pt shooter, which IMO is a plus...

Reborn
08-30-2016, 03:21 PM
When Karno went down, It was a huge jolt to the system Remeber too though, all scribs .ALL/NONE liked out immature guards. That was true too. Replacing Karno AND the guards wwas the reason we lost momentum so quickly. Few not only had to change his game in terms of a stalwart in the middle but had to develop inexperienced guards at the same time. Tough work.
Now, we have very good guards. Karno has to fit in a new system. If he does, we're world beaters. If he doesn't, we have superior replacements. I do understand the issue with Josh H though. I suppose it could happen with Zack but I doubt it. Possible though.

What is this new system you keep referring too, MDABE? Could you explain to me how you see it working?

MDABE80
08-30-2016, 05:12 PM
4 new faces including Karno. I think there will be a different style of play. Josh is the only returnee. I do think things will be different.

GonzagasaurusFlex
08-30-2016, 06:18 PM
4 new faces including Karno. I think there will be a different style of play. Josh is the only returnee. I do think things will be different.

Insightful

Zagceo
08-30-2016, 10:03 PM
can we please stop calling him Goss?

Why?

DixieZag
08-30-2016, 10:26 PM
Why?

Because it's not his name?

It's obviously important enough to him personally that he's chosen to hyphenate the names and thus - to be respectful - we ought to make an effort to do as he has. His last name is "Williams-Goss."

And we have a built in, perfectly understandable shorthand in NWG that is both "short" and acknowledges the two linked names.

But, that's just my guess. Maynard will have to speak to his own reasoning.

MDABE80
08-31-2016, 12:09 AM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Williams-Goss

Take the PC stuff back to Crosby lads. Oh! That's right. lolol Not enough to fuss over.

DixieZag
08-31-2016, 05:24 AM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Williams-Goss

Take the PC stuff back to Crosby lads. Oh! That's right. lolol Not enough to fuss over.

"It's not his name" is somehow political? Or is respecting that "it's important to him" the political part? I don't see it, so you're really going to have to get specific for this idiot, and remember, the question isn't what hot and flaming place should I go next. if you're appointing yourself in charge, you ought to be able to calmly answer that easily.

Regardless, that was very inclusive of you to respectfully acknowledge that others see it differently by citing an encyclopedia article that uses "Williams-Goss" throughout the entire thing.

Bing
08-31-2016, 05:43 AM
"It's not his name" is somehow political? Or is respecting that "it's important to him" the political part? I don't see it, so you're really going to have to get specific for this idiot, and remember, the question isn't what hot and flaming place should I go next. if you're appointing yourself in charge, you ought to be able to calmly answer that easily.

Regardless, that was very inclusive of you to respectfully acknowledge that others see it differently by citing an encyclopedia article that uses "Williams-Goss" throughout the entire thing.





If your point is


His name is Nigel Williams-Goss.

His name is not Goss.

Anyone too lazy to type his name can simply use NWG. Actually saves typing a stroke.

His name is Nigel Williams-Goss.

Bogozags
08-31-2016, 06:01 AM
His name is Nigel Williams-Goss.

His name is not Goss.

Anyone too lazy to type his name can simply use NWG. Actually saves typing a stroke.

His name is Nigel Williams-Goss.


Look, the season is just around the corner...why can't we all just get along and enjoy our up coming season...

I have three rules...

1. Always wait in the shade whenever possible (Hilton Head, SC)
2. Make sure your first putt is one foot past the hole
3. Be respectfully at all times (even though you can get so mad that you can't breathe and want to dual your opponent) as Aretha said R-E-S-P-E-C-T!

By the way, I have turned a new leaf...I just started going back to Mass after 16 years...just stopped not-going cold turkey...

DixieZag
08-31-2016, 06:01 AM
His name is Nigel Williams-Goss.

His name is not Goss.

Anyone too lazy to type his name can simply use NWG. Actually saves typing a stroke.

His name is Nigel Williams-Goss.

Exactly. Because that's what I said just prior to being told that using his real name is political.


Because it's not his name?

It's obviously important enough to him personally that he's chosen to hyphenate the names and thus - to be respectful - we ought to make an effort to do as he has. His last name is "Williams-Goss."

And we have a built in, perfectly understandable shorthand in NWG that is both "short" and acknowledges the two linked names.

But, that's just my guess. Maynard will have to speak to his own reasoning.

Gonzdb8
08-31-2016, 06:09 AM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Williams-Goss

Take the PC stuff back to Crosby lads. Oh! That's right. lolol Not enough to fuss over.

how is this an issue of PC? i realize PC has become code for "i should be able to say whatever i want regardless who it might demean, belittle or offend" but how is it even remotely applicable to the concern raised here?

Zagceo
08-31-2016, 06:18 AM
We had the potential of being the McKenna-Thomas Camera-Smith household. Which sounded too much like a law firm, really.

link (http://www.npr.org/2012/07/19/156923573/when-hyphen-boy-meets-hyphen-girl-names-pile-up)

Nigel to Przemek

willandi
08-31-2016, 06:20 AM
Can we just call him Jenks and be done with it?

Zagdawg
08-31-2016, 06:40 AM
Is it time to bring out the tacos as this thread has been "enlightened" to the point of obscurity once again.

LongIslandZagFan
08-31-2016, 07:12 AM
https://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/61093914.jpg