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75Zag
05-18-2016, 09:52 AM
Curious as to the lack of rumors regarding Karno's status. Seems like there is usually someone (or several someones) here who claims to have the inside story about the team, players, practices, etc. Has the GU organization finally managed to erect a firewall that is able to maintain absolute secrecy about this stuff? Hard to believe somebody can't figure out whether Karno is going to rehab at GU next year or go to Europe or where ever.

Inquiring minds want to know.

Go Bulldogs!

ZagnetitForce
05-18-2016, 10:13 AM
Rumors is a Fleetwood Mac album....or a song by Cameo ...... I think Adele as well. :adored:

GoZags
05-18-2016, 10:18 AM
Curious as to the lack of rumors regarding Karno's status. Seems like there is usually someone (or several someones) here who claims to have the inside story about the team, players, practices, etc. Has the GU organization finally managed to erect a firewall that is able to maintain absolute secrecy about this stuff? Hard to believe somebody can't figure out whether Karno is going to rehab at GU next year or go to Europe or where ever.

Inquiring minds want to know.

Go Bulldogs!

It's been mentioned multiple times that there won't be any inkling of what's going on until after Shem's next Dr. appointment. That's 4-5 weeks from now. Until there is a determination of HOW he's healing (and recovering) ... there's nothing to talk about.

TheGonzagaFactor
05-18-2016, 10:35 AM
Having heard NOTHING to this point, I assume the concern is over whether he will be able to actually play basketball at all in the next year. You have to think that if he plays anywhere it will be GU, but all I'm worried about pertaining to Karno is him getting back to being able to play basketball, period.

If he hasn't been given the go-ahead to play or even been given a definitive timeline/plan going forward, playing in any pro league this coming season is out of the question.

Then again, maybe he's been running/playing/practicing more and more and they have kept everything under wraps as to take pressure off him during his rehab.

#GoKarno

MDABE80
05-18-2016, 10:52 AM
It's still early. Maybe Karno hasn't made up his mind yet. Denial is a prolonged process as well.
All we know for sure is that the AD hasn't announce that he'll play. In some ways, it's a private matter as it winds its way through the system.
Let's wish him the best no matter the outcome of his situation.

As for now ( this is just my opinion) I think we should plan on going with what we have in the house right now. Edwards, Collins, WilliamsIII, Tillie..
BUT it's just May. Things can change. I do think we still need an accomplished JC or transfer Big.

GoZags
05-18-2016, 11:02 AM
It's still early. Maybe Karno hasn't made up his mind yet. Denial is a prolonged process as well.
All we know for sure is that the AD hasn't announce that he'll play. In some ways, it's a private matter as it winds its way through the system.
Let's wish him the best no matter the outcome of his situation.

As for now ( this is just my opinion) I think we should plan on going with what we have in the house right now. Edwards, Collins, WilliamsIII, Tillie..
BUT it's just May. Things can change. I do think we still need an accomplished JC or transfer Big.

Abe ... there's nothing for him to deny until he knows the status from his surgery. However, there are some facts that we DO know. We do KNOW he's moving better than he once was. We do KNOW that he graduated and received his degree (he actually "walked" during Graduation). We also KNOW that he chose not to participate in Senior Night activities. We also know that if he chooses to stay at Gonzaga, he doesn't have to worry about his medical bill for the year he's in school.

You may be jonesing for an accomplished JC or transfer Big.

I'm not alone in my thinking (and neither are some key members of the staff) in thinking there's a good chance Shem is a Zag next season.

But again ... we won't know ANYTHING concrete until after his next exam with his surgeon.

strikenowhere
05-18-2016, 11:37 AM
So was there ever a definitive explanation as to what happened with his back? Did it already exist prior to the flight to Japan? Did that trip exacerbate the injury? There was some sort of infection at the surgical site too, correct?

GoZags
05-18-2016, 11:51 AM
So was there ever a definitive explanation as to what happened with his back? Did it already exist prior to the flight to Japan? Did that trip exacerbate the injury? There was some sort of infection at the surgical site too, correct?

HIPPA privacy laws prohibit comments/disclosure on anything you've speculated on.

JAGzag
05-18-2016, 12:01 PM
HIPPA privacy laws prohibit comments/disclosure on anything you've speculated on.

Unless he's a covered entity under HIPPA, no they dont.

cjm720
05-18-2016, 12:07 PM
HIPPA privacy laws prohibit comments/disclosure on anything you've speculated on.

He can talk all he wants

GrizZAG
05-18-2016, 12:25 PM
FWIW...

I blew a disc out in my lower back at age 21, had I believe it is called a hemi-lamenectomy which involved removal of the disc. & fusion. The doc told me that because this is deep invasive surgery it would form a lot of deep scar tissue which over time becomes rigid and at times I would stretch it and start a nasty muscle spasm cycle causing leg pain. That is exactly how it played out when I did activities that stressed that part of the back area. I had been a competitive water skier, tennis player and BB Player prior to that and was finished for the above reasons. I did those things anyway but usually paid the price.

For me, the Doc called it spot on and I now am 66 and it cost me huge in flexibility.
I am not implying that Karno had the same thing, but back surgery is a game changer for many. I've compared notes with many who have been through it and it is indeed serious.

sittingon50
05-18-2016, 12:37 PM
So was there ever a definitive explanation as to what happened with his back? Did it already exist prior to the flight to Japan? Did that trip exacerbate the injury? There was some sort of infection at the surgical site too, correct?

IIRC, he fell in practice the day before WSU @ Pullman (12-2-15), almost 4 weeks after Japan trip. He had played up until then.

MDABE80
05-18-2016, 12:44 PM
GZ... with the "denial" comment, I meant it might be a long slow process for him to go through. I know it took me long time to cope with not playing for the Dodgers. I was through medical school at age 24 yrs and still thought I could play. I planned to as soon as my internship was completed.

I hope he's back. HIPPA means nobody can talk about Shem's back problem. In it's purest form, if we were a hospital, we couldn't even acknowledge his name or whther he was even here on campus. Things are tight these days.

GoZags
05-18-2016, 01:57 PM
He can talk all he wants

Feel free to report any quotes from things he's said publicly.

MTZag03
05-18-2016, 02:56 PM
FWIW...

I blew a disc out in my lower back at age 21, had I believe it is called a hemi-lamenectomy which involved removal of the disc. & fusion. The doc told me that because this is deep invasive surgery it would form a lot of deep scar tissue which over time becomes rigid and at times I would stretch it and start a nasty muscle spasm cycle causing leg pain. That is exactly how it played out when I did activities that stressed that part of the back area. I had been a competitive water skier, tennis player and BB Player prior to that and was finished for the above reasons. I did those things anyway but usually paid the price.

For me, the Doc called it spot on and I now am 66 and it cost me huge in flexibility.
I am not implying that Karno had the same thing, but back surgery is a game changer for many. I've compared notes with many who have been through it and it is indeed serious.

Yeah. PT here. There isn't really much rehab per se after a lumbar fusion. Not like a shoulder or knee surgery. It's more waiting for the site to be really solid and stabilized medically speaking. Rehab is basic back and abdominal strength and hip stretching. You don't really stretch the back as that can cause problems above or below the surgical site. He will have permanently lost some lumbar range of motion.

I don't think the hang up is rehab so much as getting clearance from the surgeon that he's truly solid.

BurgessEraZag
05-18-2016, 03:16 PM
Not very perceptive comment. Why would one think "he's a covered or not entity?" HIIPA applies to medical treatment in U.S. and would apply to even immigrants or visiting college students.
Shem "has the privilege" and could disclose or not if he wished. My opinion, he has no need to disclose his medical treatment or condition until he decides on his future.

jazzdelmar
05-18-2016, 03:42 PM
GZ... with the "denial" comment, I meant it might be a long slow process for him to go through. I know it took me long time to cope with not playing for the Dodgers. I was through medical school at age 24 yrs and still thought I could play. I planned to as soon as my internship was completed.

I hope he's back. HIPPA means nobody can talk about Shem's back problem. In it's purest form, if we were a hospital, we couldn't even acknowledge his name or whther he was even here on campus. Things are tight these days.


What, Pee Wee Reese was gonna retire early?

MDABE80
05-18-2016, 04:00 PM
What, Pee Wee Reese was gonna retire early?

Could be. BTW Jazz, I emptied the box. Try it again.

Goshzagit
05-18-2016, 05:25 PM
Not even Karno knows about Karno.

'nuff said.

No timetable, prognosis, or rumors are even possible at this point.

He may or may not even play bball again, let alone return to the Zags and/or pursue professional play.

Too many unknowns.

Someone mentioned 6-8 wks and that is accurate. Shem isn't allowed to run or workout fully until July, so we'll know more in the next 2 months, but no sense in worrying one way or the other 'til mid-Summer.

CDC84
05-18-2016, 08:37 PM
We are all going to need to be patient with this. It's going to take time. Possibly months before we know anything.

Baseline
05-18-2016, 09:14 PM
Karno had a bit of a tendency to fall on rebounds, a bit more than normal. IMHO
If this is true I wonder if there might be some efforts by Travis to help the ballance and falling. His weight hitting the floor from 7 foot is a ppretty big strain, way more than normal.

jazzdelmar
05-19-2016, 03:32 AM
Let's just pray for a happy and healthy life for this fine young man.

Rangerzag
05-19-2016, 05:02 AM
Let's just pray for a happy and healthy life for this fine young man.



+1

zagfan24
05-19-2016, 05:24 AM
Just hoping for a fruitful life and career -- spot on Jazz. Karno has been a blessing for the Zags and the GU community already, anything else is just gravy.

--

FWIW, and for those interested. PK can certainly release whatever info he wants, when he wants, if he wants to. Or not. He doesn't owe us an ounce of information. I doubt anybody disagrees.

But, the "covered entity" comment wasn't about PK, it was about who is prohibited from disclosing information. It's silly and misguided, but not a HIPAA violation, for people without access to speculate.
http://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-professionals/covered-entities/
For example, in the Jason Pierre Paul situation - the medical personnel who disclosed the photos was violating HIPAA. Adam Schefter wasn't. Posting the photos may have been unethical and inappropriate for a variety of reasons, but not a HIPAA violation on his part.

BULLDOG#1
05-19-2016, 07:16 AM
FWIW...

I blew a disc out in my lower back at age 21, had I believe it is called a hemi-lamenectomy which involved removal of the disc. & fusion. The doc told me that because this is deep invasive surgery it would form a lot of deep scar tissue which over time becomes rigid and at times I would stretch it and start a nasty muscle spasm cycle causing leg pain. That is exactly how it played out when I did activities that stressed that part of the back area. I had been a competitive water skier, tennis player and BB Player prior to that and was finished for the above reasons. I did those things anyway but usually paid the price.

For me, the Doc called it spot on and I now am 66 and it cost me huge in flexibility.
I am not implying that Karno had the same thing, but back surgery is a game changer for many. I've compared notes with many who have been through it and it is indeed serious.

Things have changed a lot with back surgery. I would be shocked if they had to fuse anything at all. I herniated L4-L5 five years ago and had it operated on with a scope. Five months later I was competing in triathlons and now five years later, I have no ill effects and am able to work out hard every day (I'm in my late 40s). Shem's size alone puts a lot of stress on any body part, but he is still a very young man and an athlete. I do not know the extent of his injury but from what I've heard and read, it wasn't something so serious that he couldn't make a near complete recovery. Unless I'm missing something, I'd be surprised if Shem doesn't have a decent pro career. Seems like foot problems take down big guys more than back problems.

Ezag
05-19-2016, 07:31 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEWA3xQ7pOA

sylean
05-19-2016, 08:27 AM
the improvements in back surgery in the past 40yrs has been dramatic...there is no reason Karno wouldn't be back to playing...but its his choice of course...any injury or surgery is eventually going to cause some arthritic changes, but we all face that...

vandalzag
05-19-2016, 08:47 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEWA3xQ7pOA

Nice

zagdontzig
05-19-2016, 08:56 AM
HIPPA privacy laws prohibit comments/disclosure on anything you've speculated on.


Unless he's a covered entity under HIPPA, no they dont.

first, it's HIPAA. Next, HIPAA regulates healthcare providers, making the providers and their agents "covered entities," not the patients.

Murphy outgo lifer
05-19-2016, 09:15 AM
From what I remember hearing, Karno's decision hindered on whether this injury would shorten his playing years and if it did, he was off to make as much money as he could before his career ends. I have a hard time believing any doctor would say that this would not have an impact on how long he could possibly play. I could be wrong as I am not a medical expert, however, given the characteristics of these things such as limited range of motion, arthritic issues from injuries, further degradation of structural integrity, not to mention the greater possibility of another injury, I just don't see how he could come back if this was his criteria. I also wish him the best of luck and health in the future.

MDABE80
05-19-2016, 10:18 AM
http://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-professionals/privacy/laws-regulations/index.html

BUT actually both usages are correct as one is the legal term but, as is often the case these days, another form has crept in to the commmon parlance.

maynard g krebs
05-19-2016, 12:42 PM
If his playing career is shortened or ended, I think with his instincts, court awareness, positioning, passing abilities etc he would make a tremendous big man coach if that's what he wants to be.

JAGzag
05-19-2016, 12:49 PM
first, it's HIPAA. Next, HIPAA regulates healthcare providers, making the providers and their agents "covered entities," not the patients.

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I was referring to the poster, not Karno. We'll blame "HIPPA" on a small phone keyboard.

ZagnetitForce
05-19-2016, 01:38 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEWA3xQ7pOA

Oh I stand corrected....well done Ezag! Cameo did Word Up!

GoZags
05-19-2016, 02:31 PM
Sorry if I wasn't clear, I was referring to the poster, not Karno. We'll blame "HIPPA" on a small phone keyboard.

You were referring to my post .... which incorrectly misspelled "HIPAA" .... for which I will plead temporary coma (no excuse as I sign these forms almost every day). As for getting schooled on the merits of HIPAA .... nowhere did I say or imply that Shem couldn't talk. "Gonzaga" can't talk about Shem's health ... and even if members of the staff could , they've never really been "chatty" about rumors concerning potential scenarios.

MileHigh
05-20-2016, 05:14 AM
I have heard he has decided to stay at Gonzaga through next season.......only issue will be how much he will be able to contribute due to his back. Maybe a lot, maybe a little, maybe nothing at all. Back injuries and 280 pound footers can be tricky

GoZags
05-20-2016, 05:44 AM
I have heard he has decided to stay at Gonzaga through next season.......only issue will be how much he will be able to contribute due to his back. Maybe a lot, maybe a little, maybe nothing at all. Back injuries and 280 pound footers can be tricky

I'll go out on a limb and "guess" you've got a pretty good source. I've heard similar rumblings ... and this would make sense.

Here's hoping he gets good news re: the progress of his healing/recovery with his next Dr. appointment. That's huge on so many levels (most important being his quality of life),

sullyzag66
05-20-2016, 10:41 AM
I have heard he has decided to stay at Gonzaga through next season.......only issue will be how much he will be able to contribute due to his back. Maybe a lot, maybe a little, maybe nothing at all. Back injuries and 280 pound footers can be tricky
Finally. A rumor.

Zag_Dad
05-20-2016, 11:13 AM
so ... if we're gonna go with rumors. My middle daughter will be a senior next year and hangs out with a kid who is friends with Karno. The triple hearsay rumor is that initially Shem was leaning towards going home and play in Europe but is now thinking he'll stay for another year. His health and ability to play are still up in the air. Take this for what it's worth, triple hearsay from a college kid.

Hope he stays and that he's healthy enough to play for GU and eventually professionally.

GO ZAGS

sittingon50
05-20-2016, 11:13 AM
Finally. A rumor.

Made me laugh, sully.

kitzbuel
05-20-2016, 12:14 PM
So, we now know that he might stay and he might play.

Whew, that clears things up.

:p

Mr Vulture
05-20-2016, 12:20 PM
I've heard the same thing but what I had heard about Sabonis was way off so I'm not sure what to believe. What I have been told though is that Karno is moving very well and should be able to ramp things up next month if all goes good with his appointment. That doesn't mean he will be able to return to full basketball contact, running/jumping at a higher level mostly from what I was told.


I have heard he has decided to stay at Gonzaga through next season.......only issue will be how much he will be able to contribute due to his back. Maybe a lot, maybe a little, maybe nothing at all. Back injuries and 280 pound footers can be tricky

MDABE80
05-20-2016, 01:11 PM
Go with what we've got and look for another big. 4 new guys with 3-4 workable bigs IF Tillie's healthy.
Gonna be a tough slog. But the new bigs are so talented, I do think we'll be fine..

I would just plan to move on.

Coach Crazy
05-20-2016, 01:17 PM
I've heard the same thing but what I had heard about Sabonis was way off so I'm not sure what to believe. What I have been told though is that Karno is moving very well and should be able to ramp things up next month if all goes good with his appointment. That doesn't mean he will be able to return to full basketball contact, running/jumping at a higher level mostly from what I was told.

Meh. I don't think it needs to cast doubt on everything you hear. The Sabonis situation could have had more variables involved. If you are hearing something from a source that you trust, go with it till you have a reason not to. Plus, how does it hurt anything to simply rest on that bit of possibility until we or you hear otherwise? It's not like you're a news agency that is reporting on this. We're dudes on a message board...with very little news, at the moment.

raise the zag
05-20-2016, 01:22 PM
Go with what we've got and look for another big. 4 new guys with 3-4 workable bigs IF Tillie's healthy.


Larsen is a question mark along with Tillie. BOTH have had multitude of injuries -- neither serious -- but just nagging, small, consistent injuries. They've both required to sit for long stretches the past year or so.

Mr Vulture
05-20-2016, 01:27 PM
I would say I'm confindent that Karno is back and playing when the season rolls around, based on what I heard. However, I'm not going to go further than that ..LOL


Meh. I don't think it needs to cast doubt on everything you hear. The Sabonis situation could have had more variables involved. If you are hearing something from a source that you trust, go with it till you have a reason not to. Plus, how does it hurt anything to simply rest on that bit of possibility until we or you hear otherwise? It's not like you're a news agency that is reporting on this. We're dudes on a message board...with very little news, at the moment.

baitcast
05-20-2016, 02:31 PM
As it has been mentioned a number of times Karno falls all to often and when you have a bad back, 7'-280lbs is a real load to carry on your way down to a cold hard deck......I would hate to see the kid get really hurt.
He has balance issures they can be improved somewhat,the hips,legs and core, but the real villain is the gyro that keeps us upright can be lacking.
I'm sure Few an staff are well aware of the problem.............I guess we will just have to quit fretting and see what happens.
Rob

MontanaCoyote
05-21-2016, 08:17 AM
I have heard he has decided to stay at Gonzaga through next season.......only issue will be how much he will be able to contribute due to his back. Maybe a lot, maybe a little, maybe nothing at all. Back injuries and 280 pound footers can be tricky
If Karno is around in any way, shape or form he WILL contribute.

VaBeachZAG
05-21-2016, 11:36 AM
If Karno is around in any way, shape or form he WILL contribute.

Yup!

75Zag
05-21-2016, 01:14 PM
Thank you for the replies to my original post. I wish the best for Karno and even if there is a -0- chance he can play college BB ever again, I would welcome his decision to stay at GU and use the final year of his scholarship to take advantage of the medical care and rehabilitation facilities and (perhaps) get a masters in something interesting.
The rumor mill is an interesting thing. Prince dies and 30 minutes later his lifetime medical records are "accidentally" released to TMZ and his doctors are giving interviews. Fortunately - for Karno - the GU community and its medical providers and staff are not quite as transparent (or sleazy).

Go Bulldogs!

krii
05-23-2016, 03:14 AM
Wow so many grim visions. C'mon guys, he'll be back, his back will be back, Goznaga will be back- (-to-back WCC champions).

Karno will become the best big man in the NCAA and 1st rounder next year, Gonzaga will be in the final four and so on ;-)

titopoet
05-23-2016, 08:55 AM
Wow so many grim visions. C'mon guys, he'll be back, his back will be back, Goznaga will be back- (-to-back WCC champions).

Karno will become the best big man in the NCAA and 1st rounder next year, Gonzaga will be in the final four and so on ;-)

Hearing you and backing you. We got Karno's back on his comeback.

Coach Crazy
05-23-2016, 10:18 AM
Hearing you and backing you. We got Karno's back on his comeback.

You guys are being given a lot of "lat"itude with these back jokes.

exclusivelee
05-23-2016, 10:23 AM
Well, the good news at this juncture is that Karnowski is still in Spokane and has enrolled in summer courses

Some of the summer crew:
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160523/7631a1809842abd46c38304a5a8024fd.jpg

Zagger
05-23-2016, 10:53 AM
You guys are being given a lot of "lat"itude with these back jokes.

Verti-Bray :)

http://www.fowlplaces.com/zags/VertiBray.png

gonzagafan62
05-24-2016, 05:40 PM
Wow so many grim visions. C'mon guys, he'll be back, his back will be back, Goznaga will be back- (-to-back WCC champions).

Karno will become the best big man in the NCAA and 1st rounder next year, Gonzaga will be in the final four and so on ;-)
You missed three "backs" but I'll let it slide. Go Bulldogs!