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Mantua
04-30-2016, 12:41 PM
http://twitter.com/GoodmanESPN/status/726505055101276160

ZagNative
04-30-2016, 02:07 PM
Here's some more from SNY, including Sabonis: Link (https://www.sny.tv/college-recruiting/news/nba-draft-combine-invites-coming-out/175455224)

exclusivelee
04-30-2016, 02:21 PM
Sabonis also invited

Mantua
04-30-2016, 03:51 PM
Here's some more from SNY, including Sabonis: Link (https://www.sny.tv/college-recruiting/news/nba-draft-combine-invites-coming-out/175455224)

Thanks ZN. It's much better to see a list than to comb through Goodman's random tweets with no links.

Jstock12
04-30-2016, 10:19 PM
Congrats KW! I've been browsing some NBA team boards and noticed that there's some talk by fans about acquiring Wiltjer either through 2nd round or signing him if he goes undrafted. A player like him in this modern era where the 3pt shot is the king will be a valuable piece off the bench.

P.S. I found it funny that Wiltjer is listed as 6'1 on that invite list.

MDABE80
05-01-2016, 01:04 AM
I hope he makes it............really good guy with good skills. SO was Casey though..and he didn't..........I wonder what the NBA thinks at times.

basketballzag
05-01-2016, 07:22 AM
I hope he makes it............really good guy with good skills. SO was Casey though..and he didn't..........I wonder what the NBA thinks at times.

Barring an injury or sickness at the Combine Wiltjer will be picked in the late second round. He can contribute minutes immediately for a number of teams.

ZagNative
05-01-2016, 08:11 AM
More invites, per Jeff Goodman:

Jeff Goodman ‏@GoodmanESPN

Updated NBA combine invite list now up to 62. Still a working list. About 70 or so have been invited by NBA.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/feather-client-files-aviary-prod-us-east-1/2016-05-01/ffafc1736250414c94df3cb50ca1fae4.jpg

MDABE80
05-01-2016, 11:02 AM
A lot of really good kids on that list. Superior players. SO what makes the case for our guys? For me, Domas' engin is key. In WIltjer's case, it'll have to be more than simple shooting the lights out. Adam did that a few years ago and came up empty. Maybe it's age, personality or what ever. We lost some fine talent though. I hope they do well in the camps and make it in the league.Lotsa talnt lost on the home front though.

Jstock12
05-02-2016, 01:39 AM
A lot of really good kids on that list. Superior players. SO what makes the case for our guys? For me, Domas' engin is key. In WIltjer's case, it'll have to be more than simple shooting the lights out. Adam did that a few years ago and came up empty. Maybe it's age, personality or what ever. We lost some fine talent though. I hope they do well in the camps and make it in the league.Lotsa talnt lost on the home front though.

I think in this NBA era that's being dominated by 3PT shooting Wiltjer should definitely find a place on the court. He's not going to be a starter, but if he manages to become something close to an average defender, he should get minutes as a bench player. Although probably not on a contending team.

TheGonzagaFactor
05-02-2016, 06:37 AM
Barring an injury or sickness at the Combine Wiltjer will be picked in the late second round. He can contribute minutes immediately for a number of teams.

I nominate this for homer comment of the year 2016.

webspinnre
05-02-2016, 07:01 AM
Barring an injury or sickness at the Combine Wiltjer will be picked in the late second round. He can contribute minutes immediately for a number of teams.

Going in the 2nd round would not be the best situation for him. Better to sign as a FA and have his choice of teams to choose which is likely to be the best fit for him.

Birddog
05-02-2016, 07:14 AM
I nominate this for homer comment of the year 2016.

FYI, basketballzag usually has pretty good info. You might have to eat them words. I hope he is correct about this.

DixieZag
05-02-2016, 08:35 AM
FYI, basketballzag usually has pretty good info. You might have to eat them words. I hope he is correct about this.

Was just about to say the same thing. If anyone here can...

BULLDOG#1
05-02-2016, 09:53 AM
Plenty of room in the NBA for 6'10" forwards who can shoot as well as Wiltjer does -- even with him being a less than elite athlete and a defensive liability.

Coach Crazy
05-02-2016, 10:09 AM
Plenty of room in the NBA for 6'10" forwards who can shoot as well as Wiltjer does -- even with him being a less than elite athlete and a defensive liability.

In a league that doesn't commit to individual defense the way it used to...I think those who are slighting Wiltjer's defensive ability are overstating things a bit. Especially considering you just don't see a ton of enforcer-type big's in the paint, anymore. He'll be one of those guys that plays some post defense and then stretches on the opposite end. He'll be a nice addition wherever he goes. I agree with you.

Mojo13
05-02-2016, 12:23 PM
In a league that doesn't commit to individual defense the way it used to...I think those who are slighting Wiltjer's defensive ability are overstating things a bit. Especially considering you just don't see a ton of enforcer-type big's in the paint, anymore. He'll be one of those guys that plays some post defense and then stretches on the opposite end. He'll be a nice addition wherever he goes. I agree with you.


If he makes the NBA he probably will be be the worst defensive player in the league. He is too weak to guard NBA athletes inside and way to slow to guard anyone on the perimeter. People are predisposed to underestimate the gap between the NCAA and the NBA on college boards.

Not saying it won't happen, but someone is really, really going to need to like what he brings tot the table on offensive and see him in a role where the offensive strengths just outweigh his atrocious defense. And yes, not being drafted and able to pick the best fit as a FA is his best bet. I hope it makes it, but he is an underdog in this fight. My guess is he ends up in Europe - maybe even in the ACB with KP.

The DraftExpress scouting report on him seems pretty accurate to me.
http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Kyle-Wiltjer-Updated-NBA-Draft-Scouting-Report-5453/

Coach Crazy
05-02-2016, 01:36 PM
If he makes the NBA he probably will be be the worst defensive player in the league. He is too weak to guard NBA athletes inside and way to slow to guard anyone on the perimeter. People are predisposed to underestimate the gap between the NCAA and the NBA on college boards.

Not saying it won't happen, but someone is really, really going to need to like what he brings tot the table on offensive and see him in a role where the offensive strengths just outweigh his atrocious defense. And yes, not being drafted and able to pick the best fit as a FA is his best bet. I hope it makes it, but he is an underdog in this fight. My guess is he ends up in Europe - maybe even in the ACB with KP.

The DraftExpress scouting report on him seems pretty accurate to me.
http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Kyle-Wiltjer-Updated-NBA-Draft-Scouting-Report-5453/

Are you being serious? I would encourage you to look at what the league has become. "Worst defender in the league" is hyperbole. You're looking at things through the lens of the college game. There aren't very many "big boy pants" big men left in the game. He'll be alright, inside. Will he be able to guard on switches, or step out into space and try to pick up someone other than a 4 or 5? Goodness no, but he won't be asked to do that.

zagamatic
05-02-2016, 06:34 PM
Somewhere in the NBA there is a coach or GM that might just recognize that the reason why Wiltjer is easily burned on defense is that he watches the offensive players face instead of the torso, which is easily fixed. (A head fake is a lot easier than a full body fake). Don't get me wrong, Wiltjer is not an elite athlete. But with this minor tweak, he can become a good enough defender to justify having his offensive skillset on board. Just my two bits.

Reborn
05-02-2016, 08:32 PM
I haven't written for awhile but this post just compels me too. Everyone knows what a great shooter Kyle is. There's no debate about that. But few here, who have written on this thread, fail to recognize all the other things he does so well. The first is his passing. I don't know if you noticed it or not, but he was playing the point-four position A LOT. Few power forwards can do that. His passing and IQ of the game are ELITE. You may not call him athletic, but really how can you. An athlete is much more than a great leaper, and slam dunk artist, and I believe so many fail to recognize who and what a great athlete really is. And Kyle is certainly one. Second, you all seem to have forgotten that Kyle did not score most of his points from behind the 3 point line. He has improved his inside game by leaps and bounds. And finally, he improved as a rebounder too. Kyle has had a big part in leading Gonzaga to a Seet 16 and an Elite, and they came so close to going to two Elite 8's in a row. He is certainly one of the best Zags ever and my bet is that he'll be in the NBA. I don't bet, but if I did, this would be the bet that I'd put my money on. There are some very smart people in the NBA who DO know what a great athlete is.

Go Zags!!!

ZagaZags
05-02-2016, 09:03 PM
I nominate this for homer comment of the year 2016.

http://rlv.zcache.com/the_original_jackass_funny_donkey_mule_farm_animal _pillow-rc2705f94ce4f425990d3101af7f25ad9_2zbjl_8byvr_324. jpg

TheGonzagaFactor
05-03-2016, 07:11 AM
FYI, basketballzag usually has pretty good info. You might have to eat them words. I hope he is correct about this.

I'm not saying he can't make a team, I just thought "immediately" and "a number of teams" was extremely homerish.

Zagger
05-03-2016, 09:45 AM
Plenty of room in the NBA for 6'10" forwards who can shoot as well as Wiltjer does -- even with him being a less than elite athlete and a defensive liability.

Congrats, hopefully, for Kyle! And, I anticipate that Kyle will improve where his weaknesses are. I feel he improved on defense this past season more than any of his seasons yet. If he puts the effort into it he certainly has the skills to take advantage of being a better athlete. I see him getting better in the NBA each year (if he gets in).

Mojo13
05-03-2016, 09:59 AM
Are you being serious? I would encourage you to look at what the league has become. "Worst defender in the league" is hyperbole. You're looking at things through the lens of the college game. There aren't very many "big boy pants" big men left in the game. He'll be alright, inside. Will he be able to guard on switches, or step out into space and try to pick up someone other than a 4 or 5? Goodness no, but he won't be asked to do that.

I am being serious. Please provide me some names in the NBA that would be worse defenders than Wiltjer (Jimmer is about it) If Ryan Anderson struggles so much on D, Kyle is only going to be worse.
NBA teams not playing defense is your own biased narrative. It is true the NBA has opened the game up a bit with rule changes, the game has gotten way faster and offenses much better but it has put even more emphasis on individual defensive ability and making it more difficult to cover-up weak defender with team defense. Speed, athleticism, tenacity, instinct is even more important now. True, the big lumbering center is losing his place in the game - replaced by quicker, more athletic (and more skilled) 4s and 5s. Again the game is way faster now than is was 10-20 years ago. That is not really a good thing for Kyle...as I think he can gain strength, but likely not speed/quickness.

Ah...I'll just leave it to DraftExpress:


Defensively, Wiltjer's physical profile raises all sorts of red flags. His lateral quickness is nonexistent, and while he's worked diligently to improve his core strength and balance, it's still a noticeable liability in his game, as he often looks like he's playing on stilts. He rarely contains penetration and doesn't show much ability to navigate around a screen, consistently setting up unfavorable mismatches. He's improved his defensive stance since his Kentucky days, but it still looks awkward and doesn't do much to aid his balance or lateral quickness. He tries to compensate with his lack of agility by cheating on defense through anticipating where drivers will attack, yet he can be shaken off balance fairly easily with a simple crossover combination. Although he's come a long way as an interior presence since his Kentucky days by increasing his intensity level and competitiveness, it will still likely be tough to find a position for him to guard.

Wiltjer's struggles on the defensive end translate as a rebounder. His rebounding actually regressed in his senior season from 8.7 rebounds per 40 minutes pace adjusted to just 7.4 per 40 minutes pace adjusted. His 10.3% rebound rate placed below guards such as Gary Payton II and Malik Beasley in our database, despite playing a big man position in a less competitive conference.

Again, Wiltjer's body type just doesn't allow him to compete with NBA-level athletes. His lack of lateral quickness and his struggles on the glass will only be exposed further as his competition level improves.

Wiltjer clearly has the offensive skill-set to carve out a niche as a stretch big man in the NBA, but there are major question marks about whether a team could afford to play him if he proves to be as much of a defensive liability as many project. Still, with a strong showing in workouts, he could gain opportunities to prove that his offense is special enough for teams to overlook his shortcomings.


Again, I am hoping Kyle makes it - his strengths are in high demand in the NBA right now - so he does have a shot. I just think y'all unsurprisingly underestimate his weaknesses and underestimate the massive gap between the NCAA and NBA talent wise. I'd say it is a coin toss at best right now for him as a 5th year senior to be drafted. I think he will certainly play Summer League and even attend a camp somewhere...but as for making an NBA roster this year, I wouldn't bet on it. But please prove me wrong Kyle!

BULLDOG#1
05-03-2016, 10:00 AM
If he makes the NBA he probably will be be the worst defensive player in the league. He is too weak to guard NBA athletes inside and way to slow to guard anyone on the perimeter. People are predisposed to underestimate the gap between the NCAA and the NBA on college boards.

Not saying it won't happen, but someone is really, really going to need to like what he brings tot the table on offensive and see him in a role where the offensive strengths just outweigh his atrocious defense. And yes, not being drafted and able to pick the best fit as a FA is his best bet. I hope it makes it, but he is an underdog in this fight. My guess is he ends up in Europe - maybe even in the ACB with KP.

The DraftExpress scouting report on him seems pretty accurate to me.
http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Kyle-Wiltjer-Updated-NBA-Draft-Scouting-Report-5453/

In a way it doesn't matter how bad his defense is... he won't make a roster because of defense. ANY defense from him would be a plus, but really GMs will probably look at him as a need-fill rotation guy who can stretch the floor and use his six fouls in a wise way on defense. With the dreadful FT shooting of so many bigs in the NBA, a guy like Wiltjer could shoot threes on one end and hack-a-'insert name' on the other end.

I still contend that there's room in the NBA for a 6'10" guy with unlimited range - regardless of his defense.

vandalzag
05-03-2016, 10:23 AM
In a way it doesn't matter how bad his defense is... he won't make a roster because of defense. ANY defense from him would be a plus, but really GMs will probably look at him as a need-fill rotation guy who can stretch the floor and use his six fouls in a wise way on defense. With the dreadful FT shooting of so many bigs in the NBA, a guy like Wiltjer could shoot threes on one end and hack-a-'insert name' on the other end.

I still contend that there's room in the NBA for a 6'10" guy with unlimited range - regardless of his defense.

He will have to fill a roll as a spot shooter. His lack of athleticism will hinder (prevent) not only his D but also his ability to get his shot off against bigger/stronger/faster players as well as having any chance at rebounding. The draft express breakdown was pretty spot on regarding his limitations. He is a great shooter and a good scorer at the college level. In the current incarnation of the NBA, where the 3pt shot is valued so heavily there is a place for him, but that would be in a very limited role as the new version of a Kyle Korver type shooter. KW will not be posting up players or trying to back them down like he did in college. His best bet is go the free agent route so he can find the team that is the best bet to offer him a chance as a role

TexasZagFan
05-04-2016, 09:30 AM
I think in this NBA era that's being dominated by 3PT shooting Wiltjer should definitely find a place on the court. He's not going to be a starter, but if he manages to become something close to an average defender, he should get minutes as a bench player. Although probably not on a contending team.

I think he'd be a perfect fit for the Warriors, as a backup 3 or 4.

I'd love to see him in Dallas, and be Dirk's understudy for a couple of years.

The trend in the NBA is beyond the 3 point line, perfect for Wilt.

ZagNative
05-04-2016, 02:25 PM
I found this interesting. Wiltjer one of only 22 seniors to get a combine invite.

Chad Ford ‏@chadfordinsider

22 college seniors have been invited to the NBA Draft Combine. One international player. Other 40 are underclassmen.

Zagdawg
05-12-2016, 02:36 PM
1st game-----Kyle with 17 pts on 6 of 12 shooting -- 2/2 FT 3/8 3pt and 6 boards


Interview

http://campusinsiders.com/videos/gonzagas_kyle_wiltjer_on_proving_himself_2016_05_1 2_22_28_39

basketballzag
05-12-2016, 03:58 PM
1st game-----Kyle with 17 pts on 6 of 12 shooting -- 2/2 FT 3/8 3pt and 6 boards


Interview

http://campusinsiders.com/videos/gonzagas_kyle_wiltjer_on_proving_himself_2016_05_1 2_22_28_39

Kyle Wiltjer shut down Joel Bolomboy today at the Combine. Wiltjer absolutely dominated the Big Sky Player of the Year and projected 2nd round draft pick by many. How did Wiltjer dominate the 6'10 center? Kyle shut him down with his physical strength on the defensive end. Still standing by my projections on Wiltjer.

Wiltjer also recorded a 35 inch vertical jump today at the combine while showing off his impressive 15.2% body fat frame (highest of all the players at the Combine). How much higher can Wiltjer jump if he dropped down to 9% body fat = 2nd round lock!

Wiltjer to work out of the 76ers in 2 weeks and Pelicans shortly thereafter

zagfan94
05-12-2016, 05:50 PM
Kyle Wiltjer shut down Joel Bolomboy today at the Combine. Wiltjer absolutely dominated the Big Sky Player of the Year and projected 2nd round draft pick by many. How did Wiltjer dominate the 6'10 center? Kyle shut him down with his physical strength on the defensive end. Still standing by my projections on Wiltjer.

Wiltjer also recorded a 35 inch vertical jump today at the combine while showing off his impressive 15.2% body fat frame (highest of all the players at the Combine). How much higher can Wiltjer jump if he dropped down to 9% body fat = 2nd round lock!

Wiltjer to work out of the 76ers in 2 weeks and Pelicans shortly thereafter

Theres been a trend lately where players don't fully extend their arms to get a shorter standing reach to boost their max vertical number. If you do some comparisons here alot of the numbers don't really make sense:

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/ (choose year 2016 and source nba draft combine)

For example Wiltjer has 1.75 inches in height, 2 inches in wingspan and .25 inches in hand length on Perry Ellis but only .5 inch advantage in standing reach.

Reborn
05-12-2016, 06:15 PM
Kyle Wiltjer shut down Joel Bolomboy today at the Combine. Wiltjer absolutely dominated the Big Sky Player of the Year and projected 2nd round draft pick by many. How did Wiltjer dominate the 6'10 center? Kyle shut him down with his physical strength on the defensive end. Still standing by my projections on Wiltjer.

Wiltjer also recorded a 35 inch vertical jump today at the combine while showing off his impressive 15.2% body fat frame (highest of all the players at the Combine). How much higher can Wiltjer jump if he dropped down to 9% body fat = 2nd round lock!

Wiltjer to work out of the 76ers in 2 weeks and Pelicans shortly thereafter


I'm not surprised at all. I'm one of the few people who believe's Wiltjer will play in the NBA. I was the lone wolf saying he can play D. Oh Well....

Bogozags
05-12-2016, 07:02 PM
Kyle Wiltjer shut down Joel Bolomboy today at the Combine. Wiltjer absolutely dominated the Big Sky Player of the Year and projected 2nd round draft pick by many. How did Wiltjer dominate the 6'10 center? Kyle shut him down with his physical strength on the defensive end. Still standing by my projections on Wiltjer.

Wiltjer also recorded a 35 inch vertical jump today at the combine while showing off his impressive 15.2% body fat frame (highest of all the players at the Combine). How much higher can Wiltjer jump if he dropped down to 9% body fat = 2nd round lock!

Wiltjer to work out of the 76ers in 2 weeks and Pelicans shortly thereafter

I think it's great for him to be experiencing this success and let's hope it continues for him. As stated by many, he has a tremendous offensive skill set that equates to the NBA. It just requires the right fit and the Warriors would be an excellent place for him to learn and build on to his skill set. If Reddick can make it in the NBA then Kyle should be able to find a spot too.

One more thing, in order for Kyle to lower his body fat to 9%, he would most probably weigh more than he does now as muscle weighs much more than fat. Dropping his body fat from 15.2% to 9% is a change of 40%, which is a big change for the body in a short period of time. The lower % of body fat would probably add to his strength but at the same time, could have a negative effect on his flexibility. Stronger doesn't necessarily translate to better...

Let's hope one of the teams sees what we see and know about him!

MDABE80
05-12-2016, 08:22 PM
Ranked no. 93 as of 2 days ago. I wish him the best success. Great kid.

titopoet
05-13-2016, 04:30 AM
I'm not surprised at all. I'm one of the few people who believe's Wiltjer will play in the NBA. I was the lone wolf saying he can play D. Oh Well....

Add me to that list. In today's NBA a stretch 4 with range will find a spot.

Robzagnut
05-13-2016, 04:43 AM
I nominate this for homer comment of the year 2016.

+1

The guy won't get drafted, but he's going to make a lot of money in Europe.

cjm720
05-13-2016, 06:32 AM
35" vert? Where'd that come from?!

LongIslandZagFan
05-13-2016, 06:37 AM
May not get drafted... but he may end up on an NBA team as a free agent. Worst case he'll make mad dollars in Europe.

jazzdelmar
05-13-2016, 06:59 AM
KW is a winner. He will be fine.....

LongIslandZagFan
05-13-2016, 07:19 AM
KW is a winner. He will be fine.....

I agree... he's a smart kid too. Doubt he will waste his time in D-league... I'd suspect if he doesn't make the NBA... he'll go for the cash in Europe instead.

I really do think he may find a spot in the NBA but my gut says as a FA instead of being drafted.

thespywhozaggedme
05-13-2016, 09:27 AM
Kyle Wiltjer shut down Joel Bolomboy today at the Combine. Wiltjer absolutely dominated the Big Sky Player of the Year and projected 2nd round draft pick by many. How did Wiltjer dominate the 6'10 center? Kyle shut him down with his physical strength on the defensive end. Still standing by my projections on Wiltjer.

Wiltjer also recorded a 35 inch vertical jump today at the combine while showing off his impressive 15.2% body fat frame (highest of all the players at the Combine). How much higher can Wiltjer jump if he dropped down to 9% body fat = 2nd round lock!

Wiltjer to work out of the 76ers in 2 weeks and Pelicans shortly thereafter

Still has that doughy body, lol. If this kid made any attempt whatsoever to walk into a gym and utilize it, it would help in so much. I just don't get his aversion to lifting weights.

Martin Centre Mad Man
05-13-2016, 11:00 AM
I'm not surprised at all. I'm one of the few people who believe's Wiltjer will play in the NBA. I was the lone wolf saying he can play D. Oh Well....

I found a new avatar for ya, Reborn.


https://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mb5am1CYUj1r8d7pc.gif

FWIW, I would not be surprised to see him have a productive NBA career as a stretch-four. There aren't a lot of 6'10" guys who can shoot as well as he does. There are worse things for an NBA team to have available on the bench.

LongIslandZagFan
05-13-2016, 11:21 AM
Still has that doughy body, lol. If this kid made any attempt whatsoever to walk into a gym and utilize it, it would help in so much. I just don't get his aversion to lifting weights.

You seem quite convinced he doesn't go into a gym. Do you have this as first-hand knowledge or is it a WAG?

vandalzag
05-13-2016, 12:36 PM
Still has that doughy body, lol. If this kid made any attempt whatsoever to walk into a gym and utilize it, it would help in so much. I just don't get his aversion to lifting weights.

Were your inside connections too busy with your recruiting tips to monitor Kyle's training?

Jstock12
05-13-2016, 01:39 PM
Still has that doughy body, lol. If this kid made any attempt whatsoever to walk into a gym and utilize it, it would help in so much. I just don't get his aversion to lifting weights.

I don't know if this is true, but even if it is, perhaps there's a reason to it? Maybe he wouldn't be such an exceptional shooter if he was stronger?

thespywhozaggedme
05-13-2016, 01:40 PM
You seem quite convinced he doesn't go into a gym. Do you have this as first-hand knowledge or is it a WAG?

I utilize this new fangled tool called eyes, lol. On a related note it's odd how some of you get so defensive when something is pointed out. I am an avid weight lifter, in fact I'm on the toilet right now in my gym posting this before I go lift. KW is not a fitness geek, that should have been evident by the fact that he has the highest percentage of body fat of any player at the combine; that doesn't make him a bad person or a bad basketball player, it just is what it is, nothing more, nothing less.

thespywhozaggedme
05-13-2016, 01:42 PM
I don't know if this is true, but even if it is, perhaps there's a reason to it? Maybe he wouldn't be such an exceptional shooter if he was stronger?

Could be, I dunno. He's an exceptional shooter and crafty scorer

GoZags
05-13-2016, 02:14 PM
..... If this kid made any attempt whatsoever to walk into a gym and utilize it, it would help in so much. I just don't get his aversion to lifting weights.

It is a pity that you don't avail yourself of things that have been made readily available (like the HBO series, or the detail of the work Wiltjer has done with Travis). If you HAVE in fact done these things and STILL believe that Wiltjer hasn't "made any attempt whatsoever to walk into a gym" then there's something missing somewhere ... and it's not with Kyle Wiltjer.

jazzdelmar
05-13-2016, 03:37 PM
KW was an exceptional person and player in every way and this Monday morning backbiting with respect to his work ethic is at least unseemly and at most simply rude and ignorant.

ZagNative
05-13-2016, 03:43 PM
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CiXi1qgW0AAHlID.jpg:large

GoZags
05-13-2016, 03:47 PM
KW was an exceptional person and player in every way and this Monday morning backbiting with respect to his work ethic is at least unseemly and at most simply rude and ignorant.

Bingo.

vandalzag
05-13-2016, 03:59 PM
KW was an exceptional person and player in every way and this Monday morning backbiting with respect to his work ethic is at least unseemly and at most simply rude and ignorant.

Agreed

VaBeachZAG
05-13-2016, 04:40 PM
KW was an exceptional person and player in every way and this Monday morning backbiting with respect to his work ethic is at least unseemly and at most simply rude and ignorant.

Totally agree, with one small caveat regarding his "exceptional" character: there is some question about the veracity of his claim that Morrison has a survivalist bunker :)

Reborn
05-13-2016, 07:03 PM
KW was an exceptional person and player in every way and this Monday morning backbiting with respect to his work ethic is at least unseemly and at most simply rude and ignorant.

I love this post, Jazz. I know I'm not the only "lone wolf." There are certainly others, and I have so much respect for them. Although we don't think a lot alike on some issues, we do on others. I will certainly say, with a lot of confidence, that I read ALL your posts carefully, and think about them clearly before I post a disagreement with you. And this last one, you certainly show how classy YOU are.

bartruff1
05-13-2016, 08:20 PM
KW was an exceptional person and player in every way and this Monday morning backbiting with respect to his work ethic is at least unseemly and at most simply rude and ignorant.

Who are you ....and what have you done with Jazz ???

thespywhozaggedme
05-13-2016, 08:22 PM
KW was an exceptional person and player in every way and this Monday morning backbiting with respect to his work ethic is at least unseemly and at most simply rude and ignorant.

There's no correlation between working out and "work ethic". He just doesn't like to lift, that doesn't mean he has a poor work ethic and you shouldn't imply that.

Birddog
05-14-2016, 03:22 AM
Who are you ....and what have you done with Jazz ???

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-2qtDvxT5GPI/VR696HAUieI/AAAAAAAAAnM/3jbZGueHRNo/s1600/One-Flew-Over-the-Cuckoo-s-Nest-one-flew-over-the-cuckoo-E2-80-99s-nest-22764702-408-235.jpg

jazzdelmar
05-14-2016, 03:29 AM
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-2qtDvxT5GPI/VR696HAUieI/AAAAAAAAAnM/3jbZGueHRNo/s1600/One-Flew-Over-the-Cuckoo-s-Nest-one-flew-over-the-cuckoo-E2-80-99s-nest-22764702-408-235.jpg

Wish I had his money.

jazzdelmar
05-14-2016, 03:33 AM
Still has that doughy body, lol. If this kid made any attempt whatsoever to walk into a gym and utilize it, it would help in so much. I just don't get his aversion to lifting weights.

C'mon Spy, at least own your criticism of the player. "If this kid made ANY attempt...I just don't get," sound very much like knocks from you on his work ethic.

thespywhozaggedme
05-14-2016, 06:07 AM
C'mon Spy, at least own your criticism of the player. "If this kid made ANY attempt...I just don't get," sound very much like knocks from you on his work ethic.

Nope, he just doesn't like to lift. He has the highest percentage of body fat at the combine, lol. Again, not wanting to lift has no correlation to work ethic, look at Kevin Durant, he looks like he'd have a hard time bench pressing two olives on a toothpick but by all accounts, he's a very hard worker.

GoZags
05-14-2016, 06:35 AM
Nope, he just doesn't like to lift. He has the highest percentage of body fat at the combine, lol. Again, not wanting to lift has no correlation to work ethic, look at Kevin Durant, he looks like he'd have a hard time bench pressing two olives on a toothpick but by all accounts, he's a very hard worker.

Unless he told you personally that he doesn't "like" to lift ... then I'm going with what I SAW on the HBO series, and what I read vis a vis Wiltjer's workouts with Travis. Somehow, I think KW has spent his 3 years at Gonzaga preparing for the next level with an actual program (for HIS body/skillset/makeup) based on advice from "real" experts ... not self proclaimed internet gurus. It's great that you are an "avid" lifter. I'm an "avid" golfer ... yet I'm not going to be critical and "lol" at something I know nothing about vis a vis the practice habits of young men trying to make it on the PGA Tour.

vandalzag
05-14-2016, 06:58 AM
Nope, he just doesn't like to lift. He has the highest percentage of body fat at the combine, lol. Again, not wanting to lift has no correlation to work ethic, look at Kevin Durant, he looks like he'd have a hard time bench pressing two olives on a toothpick but by all accounts, he's a very hard worker.

So how do you know he does not like to lift? This is not the case of people being up in arms because you are being critical of a player. The reaction your are getting is because your comments are moronic and based on zero first, second, or third hand knowledge. You have no idea of his program, nor do you know about his like or dislike of the weight room. Yet you chime in as though you were his personal trainer stating you baseless opinion as fact. Stick to your fantasy of being the internet recruiting guru who leads the staff to unknown gems around the world.

thespywhozaggedme
05-14-2016, 07:54 AM
Unless he told you personally that he doesn't "like" to lift ... then I'm going with what I SAW on the HBO series, and what I read vis a vis Wiltjer's workouts with Travis. Somehow, I think KW has spent his 3 years at Gonzaga preparing for the next level with an actual program (for HIS body/skillset/makeup) based on advice from "real" experts ... not self proclaimed internet gurus. It's great that you are an "avid" lifter. I'm an "avid" golfer ... yet I'm not going to be critical and "lol" at something I know nothing about vis a vis the practice habits of young men trying to make it on the PGA Tour.

ok, cool. :000tens:

maynard g krebs
05-14-2016, 12:15 PM
Nope, he just doesn't like to lift. He has the highest percentage of body fat at the combine, lol. Again, not wanting to lift has no correlation to work ethic, look at Kevin Durant, he looks like he'd have a hard time bench pressing two olives on a toothpick but by all accounts, he's a very hard worker.

You know, there's such a thing as body type. The summer I was 20, I was driving a truck loaded with 8 tons of 100 lb cattle feed sacks, loading the truck, driving to about 10 stops, then carrying each of those 160 sacks an average of 50-100 ft on my back before dumping them in the farmer or stable owner's bin. After a 9.5 hour day of that, I was playing in a soccer league mon and wed nites and a basketball league tues and thurs. I'm just under 5'10 and dropped from my hs weight of 165 to 140 that summer. And I still looked "fleshy"; I attribute it to my scandinavian genes, evolved over millenia by my ancestors to store fat for those brutal winters.

My hs had an all league linebacker who almost never lifted. Built like an ox. He's a friend of a friend of mine; my friend told me when all the other fb players were lifting all winter, he'd come in every once in a while and double what everybody else did.

Penn center and one-time GU prospect Darien Nelson-Henry went to Lake Washington hs, a few miles from me and came to the 24 Hour Fitness in Redmond where I go the last few summers. He was lifting regularly and didn't look nearly as strong/fit as a bunch of the guys playing pickup.

Genetics. You just can't tell by looking at somebody what their routine is.

MDABE80
05-14-2016, 12:24 PM
Olive Oil lifted weights daily and look how she blossomed:) WIltjer won't even look the part but he's killer shooter. I think they hire for his shooting.

thespywhozaggedme
05-14-2016, 12:40 PM
Olive Oil lifted weights daily and look how she blossomed:) WIltjer won't even look the part but he's killer shooter. I think they hire for his shooting.

Agree 100%

vandalzag
05-14-2016, 02:41 PM
I would have bet anything the Kyle would not have tested well at the combine. Reading Chad Ford's ESPN Insider article, he did much better then expected.

http://espn.go.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/15536408/chad-ford-2016-nba-draft-combine-stock-watch

A quote from Ford. Not exactly singing his praises but interesting:
"There weren't a lot of other surprises. Gonzaga's Kyle Wiltjer, who is widely considered by scouts to be a terrible athlete, actually tested surprisingly well across the board. He's still not a great athlete, but his test suggest he's not quite as bad as he looks on the court."

Vanzagger
05-14-2016, 04:52 PM
now let's all go teach that curl bar a lesson

webspinnre
05-14-2016, 06:31 PM
I would have bet anything the Kyle would not have tested well at the combine. Reading Chad Ford's ESPN Insider article, he did much better then expected.

http://espn.go.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/15536408/chad-ford-2016-nba-draft-combine-stock-watch

A quote from Ford. Not exactly singing his praises but interesting:
"There weren't a lot of other surprises. Gonzaga's Kyle Wiltjer, who is widely considered by scouts to be a terrible athlete, actually tested surprisingly well across the board. He's still not a great athlete, but his test suggest he's not quite as bad as he looks on the court."

Good for him. Questioning his work ethic is insane. Just take a look at his game at Kentucky compared to his game here. Look at the transformations he's made. Hope he gets a shot at the NBA. If not, he should certainly make plenty of money overseas if that's what he wants to do.

Bogozags
05-15-2016, 04:56 AM
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CiXi1qgW0AAHlID.jpg:large

ZN THANKS for the stat's sheet...Interesting he was only 1 for 5 from inside the arc...40% from behind the arc is respectful don't you think?

Radbooks
05-16-2016, 08:27 PM
This seems like a good sign:


Darnay Tripp ‏@DarnayTripp 3m3 minutes ago

Spoke to @kwiltj: Has 10 workouts lined up including Nets, Bos, 76es, Mavs, Hou, Spurs, and Lakers. Hear from him on @krem2 at 10/11.

ZagNative
05-16-2016, 08:31 PM
Very cool! Fingers crossed....

Mr Vulture
05-16-2016, 08:48 PM
Wilt might be drafted but, if not, not worried. He will land on a team that needs a shooter..

Mojo13
05-23-2016, 01:29 PM
This is for the few here that thought KWs 35 vertical was suspect:

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/NBA-League-Office-Draft-Combine-Measurements-Under-Review-5499/

There were a more than a few laughable results from the measurement/athletic testing at the combine ...now the NBA has them "Under Review".

I do admit Witjer's 35 inch vert was pretty amusing.

ZagaZags
05-23-2016, 09:50 PM
This is for the few here that thought KWs 35 vertical was suspect:

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/NBA-League-Office-Draft-Combine-Measurements-Under-Review-5499/

There were a more than a few laughable results from the measurement/athletic testing at the combine ...now the NBA has them "Under Review".

I do admit Witjer's 35 inch vert was pretty amusing.

I think Brian Williams was reporting the results.

http://media.giphy.com/media/5Ht62eO28ydgY/giphy.gif

titopoet
05-24-2016, 04:23 AM
Nope, he just doesn't like to lift. He has the highest percentage of body fat at the combine, lol. Again, not wanting to lift has no correlation to work ethic, look at Kevin Durant, he looks like he'd have a hard time bench pressing two olives on a toothpick but by all accounts, he's a very hard worker.

actually, if you followed his story you know he did try to lift. So much so, that when he came to GU he had to recover for 3 months from all of the stress and strain that lifting put on his body. Travis Knight, a professional by the way, took him off weights he was doing at Kentucky as all it was doing was tearing up his body. The movie Rocky is a cool movie, but as I tell my son, fiction is fiction. Not everyone was meant to lift or lift in the traditional way. By the way, everyone from coach Cal to Coach Few have never ever question Kyle's work ethic. http://grantland.com/features/ncaa-college-basketball-gonzaga-bulldogs-mark-few-kyle-wiltjer-kevin-pangos-kelly-olynyk-kentucky-wildcats-john-calipari-anthony-davis-michael-kidd-gilchrist-2012-national-championship/

basketballzag
05-24-2016, 08:28 AM
If all you go by is physical attributes then you will have a ton of misses. Wiltjer is someone that a Dr Paul Davis would classify as a high target pick for success because mental physiology is more important than physical when evaluating players. See former WSU alumni Steve Gleason

Coach Crazy
05-24-2016, 09:43 AM
actually, if you followed his story you know he did try to lift. So much so, that when he came to GU he had to recover for 3 months from all of the stress and strain that lifting put on his body. Travis Knight, a professional by the way, took him off weights he was doing at Kentucky as all it was doing was tearing up his body. The movie Rocky is a cool movie, but as I tell my son, fiction is fiction. Not everyone was meant to lift or lift in the traditional way. By the way, everyone from coach Cal to Coach Few have never ever question Kyle's work ethic. http://grantland.com/features/ncaa-college-basketball-gonzaga-bulldogs-mark-few-kyle-wiltjer-kevin-pangos-kelly-olynyk-kentucky-wildcats-john-calipari-anthony-davis-michael-kidd-gilchrist-2012-national-championship/

I'll agree that there is, at least, not necessarily a "traditional way" of lifting. But lifting should be done. It should be custom; built according to the individual. I can personally get nice results lifting for periods around 45 minutes, or so. Some people need more time, per session, than that. There is also some thought that the result of cortisol into the blood, due to extended lifting periods, can have a negative effect on results. Plus, there is that whole thing about joints and not wanting to wear them out (here's looking at you, Crossfit.).

I don't know that I would question Kyle's work ethic. To become what he is takes work. And then we have to get into the kind of twitch muscle fibers he is developing. There are different levels to this discussion.

ZagNative
05-26-2016, 09:30 AM
Draft Express Workout and Interview Video. (http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Kyle-Wiltjer-2016-NBA-Pre-Draft-Workout-Video-and-Interview-5515)