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Outraged
12-05-2015, 01:24 PM
I thought Sabonis played well Kyle played well. Turnovers killed us. It seems like we loose energy during every second half. Our defensive adjustments in the second half is oh there isn't any.

We have a top 5 first half team and 50ish team in the second half.

TacomaZAG
12-05-2015, 01:33 PM
Watch the first 5 minutes of the 2nd half and the last 5 or 6 minutes and you will get all the info you need. Once again, the first half lead evaporates in the first 5 minutes of the 2nd half, as the opposing coach makes adjustments and Few "keeps chopping wood". Fast forward to the final 5 or 6 minutes and the staff and players are so tight they can't do anything. Again this afternoon, 1 FG in the last 6:54.

Not going to beat anyone decent with those 2nd half facts..................Too bad.

Go ZAGS

Zagceo
12-05-2015, 01:49 PM
I watched the first half going….this is nice…….but gotta wait until second half to get excited.

One of those self fulfilling prophecies as teams make plays in second half we tend to answer with sloppy play because we're tired or nervous or something.

Players gonna feel this one for a while. I hope they wear this chip all year like one big nasty infected scar.

uZiGiZaG
12-05-2015, 01:51 PM
Watch the first 5 minutes of the 2nd half and the last 5 or 6 minutes and you will get all the info you need. Once again, the first half lead evaporates in the first 5 minutes of the 2nd half, as the opposing coach makes adjustments and Few "keeps chopping wood". Fast forward to the final 5 or 6 minutes and the staff and players are so tight they can't do anything. Again this afternoon, 1 FG in the last 6:54.

Not going to beat anyone decent with those 2nd half facts..................Too bad.

Go ZAGS

When a team is down at half, great coaches make adjustments to get their team back in the game.

Sean Miller did that.

Great coaches also make adjustments late in the 2nd half to counter the opposing Coaches adjustment

Mark Few didn't do that. He never has, and never will.

Birddog
12-05-2015, 01:53 PM
Even an adjustment like this would have been better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpLQ0wtQ0R0

SunDevilGolfZag
12-05-2015, 02:18 PM
When a team is down at half, great coaches make adjustments to get their team back in the game.

Sean Miller did that.

Great coaches also make adjustments late in the 2nd half to counter the opposing Coaches adjustment

Mark Few didn't do that. He never has, and never will.
Bogus post. Mark Few was not the sloppy ball handler

TacomaZAG
12-05-2015, 02:47 PM
Bogus post. Mark Few was not the sloppy ball handler

Technically true, but the fish rots from the head...............

The guys are so tight in the second half compared to the first, and get even tighter as the second half goes on. This comes directly from the guy calling the shots and not making any adjustments.

This same story line has played out for well over a decade against good teams with creative coaches. The only common denominator for Gonzaga is Few.

Sorry....................

Go ZAGS

uZiGiZaG
12-05-2015, 03:38 PM
Bogus post. Mark Few was not the sloppy ball handler

Whatever helps you sleep at night.


After all those turnovers.. What 4 straight.. We STILL had the lead. So yeah.

But to your point.. What about last year? And the year before? The year before that? And on and on it goes.

The players change, the coach has been the same.

It's every damn year guys. It's never going to f'n change. We are never going to win many of these games.

Being a Zags fan and losing these games year after year after year is heartbreaking

uZiGiZaG
12-05-2015, 03:39 PM
Technically true, but the fish rots from the head...............

The guys are so tight in the second half compared to the first, and get even tighter as the second half goes on. This comes directly from the guy calling the shots and not making any adjustments.

This same story line has played out for well over a decade against good teams with creative coaches. The only common denominator for Gonzaga is Few.

Sorry....................

Go ZAGS


Funny, I didn't even read your post and we made the exact same post basically ..

bballbeachbum
12-05-2015, 03:57 PM
When a team is down at half, great coaches make adjustments to get their team back in the game.

Sean Miller did that.

Great coaches also make adjustments late in the 2nd half to counter the opposing Coaches adjustment

Mark Few didn't do that. He never has, and never will.

in all seriousness, can you explain to us what those adjustments were please?

Zagceo
12-05-2015, 04:04 PM
in all seriousness, can you explain to us what those adjustments were please?

York hunt your shot especially 3 when possible………is one of the adjustments I'm guessing.

bballbeachbum
12-05-2015, 04:08 PM
York hunt your shot especially 3 when possible………is one of the adjustments I'm guessing.

agreed...ran him off screens

WallaWallaZag
12-05-2015, 04:17 PM
wiltjer was gassed towards the end...missing shots he normally makes...with him, i don't think it's because he's all of a sudden nervous in crunch time. zags lack of depth certainly hurts here, but few still needs to get his guys more rest. easily could have given edwards more run when zags had the bigger cushion.

Zagceo
12-05-2015, 04:19 PM
They played more under control on both offense and defense in the second half because Sean Miller told them at half…….."just wait till the second half the zags have a history of letting teams back in games and we will steal this game on their court and it will feel so good " ….wait no thats what I was thinking in the first half. sorry gallows humor

jim77
12-05-2015, 04:27 PM
in all seriousness, can you explain to us what those adjustments were please?

Ill explain to ya. Coach Miller saw in past games what happened in the second half. He simply told his guys to play tighter defense which was enough to get our guys to cough up the ball. He also told them that they don't need to wory about fouls cause we can't shoot free throws either.

This team should do nothing except ball handling /passing drills..and shoot freethrows until the next game. Watching Perkins try to maintain control of the ball was painful...and when the double showed up the guy got totally flustered. Emac is better under defensive pressure than Perks....and a better defender....I think Emac and Dranginis need more time at PG until Perkins learns to dribble AND scan the court at the same time.

bballbeachbum
12-05-2015, 04:29 PM
They played more under control on both offense and defense in the second half because Sean Miller told them at half…….."just wait till the second half the zags have a history of letting teams back in games and we will steal this game on their court and it will feel so good " ….wait no thats what I was thinking in the first half. sorry gallows humor

haha, but not what I saw

bballbeachbum
12-05-2015, 04:31 PM
Ill explain to ya. Coach Miller saw in past games what happened in the second half. He simply told his guys to play tighter defense which was enough to get our guys to cough up the ball. He also told them that they don't need to wory about fouls cause we can't shoot free throws either.

This team should do nothing except ball handling /passing drills..and shoot freethrows until the next game. Watching Perkins try to maintain control of the ball was painful...and when the double showed up the guy got totally flustered. Emac is better under defensive pressure than Perks....and a better defender....I think Emac and Dranginis need more time at PG until Perkins learns to dribble AND scan the court at the same time.

haha, thanks. I think he did get them fired up at half time, hats off too.

vandalzag
12-06-2015, 08:24 AM
Ill explain to ya. Coach Miller saw in past games what happened in the second half. He simply told his guys to play tighter defense which was enough to get our guys to cough up the ball. He also told them that they don't need to wory about fouls cause we can't shoot free throws either.

This team should do nothing except ball handling /passing drills..and shoot freethrows until the next game. Watching Perkins try to maintain control of the ball was painful...and when the double showed up the guy got totally flustered. Emac is better under defensive pressure than Perks....and a better defender....I think Emac and Dranginis need more time at PG until Perkins learns to dribble AND scan the court at the same time.

So Miller told them to play loose defense and let GU build a lead in the first half? Pretty risky strategy. You would think he would have said play tough defense in the first half and they would win going away. So you think FT's had a bearing on this game? GU shot 6 of 8 I guess they could practice to make the other two

Zagceo
12-06-2015, 08:41 AM
wiltjer was gassed towards the end...missing shots he normally makes...with him, i don't think it's because he's all of a sudden nervous in crunch time. zags lack of depth certainly hurts here, but few still needs to get his guys more rest. easily could have given edwards more run when zags had the bigger cushion.

agree LINK (http://guboards.spokesmanreview.com/showthread.php?55356-Post-game-radio-GU-UA&p=1152148#post1152148)

Outraged
12-06-2015, 09:14 AM
Fews style is a tight rotation. Stick to the plan and ride out the droughts. This style has served him well over the years However this team is not that typical zag team. It is very different and he needs to find the solution that makes all these pieces fit together. He will have to do a little more micro managing during the learning stage

Currently, their does not appear to be a floor leader. Someone needs to step up.

Reborn
12-06-2015, 09:54 AM
The Wildcats played harder and fought harder than the Zags in the second half. It was clear to me that they had the fire and they had the energy that the fire produces. The Zags played tight, and it even got tighter at the end. In this game no one was able to step up and hit a shot at the end. Perkins and Sabonis certainly had their chances. Sabonis misses a bunny on a tip in and Perkins misses a wide open 3 from the corner. Hopefully, next time someone will make a shot.

The darkest hour is just before dawn. This was certainly our darkest hour.

devotedZAG
12-07-2015, 11:59 AM
I was at the game and the officiating sucked... I haven't read anything else on the boards about that, but DANG I don't usually blame a game on the teeny tiny oldie striped seniors, but it definitely played a part (at least from my spot!!) Anyone else see this???

REGARDLESS WE are ​tied for 298/346​ TOTAL NCAA teams for the MOST turn overs per game!!!! that's an F however you look at it. F's don't graduate. Zona was superior when it mattered and that's why we lost.

Our conference and OOC schedule will never prep us to be a final 4 team. We choke. We get out coached. We are heartbreakers. WAAAHHH I am one of the ones who stays devoted year in and year out but part of me knows that big ole disappointment is March is lurking! Even went to Final Four twice because I was hoping there was a chance... haha how quickly to forget the facts, we aren't that good! We don't have players prepped for real competition. We don't have a coach who is capable of winning in that environment.

GU, you are a bracket buster for me every year, but I love you (even though it hurts) and I am committed, just not optimistic, and getting sick and tired of defending the "told you so's" from the fact driven, Gonzaga naysayers.

Few, why not take a tip from someone/anyone better than you (ahhem, Sean Miller) and make a gosh darn ADJUSTMENT! What do you even do at half time!?!?!?! Play hangman on the whiteboard?? Tally up your win/loss record for ranked teams and decide it's a lost cause and go get a quick Starbucks??

Zona didn't even sink that many threes (another proven weakness we have NEVER adapted to), although they did ADJUST during their halftime that wasn't a waste of time....so loss we had could have been worse. We missed Chem and we missed FIGHT and we missed a coach at half time to get a plan in place. Next Starbucks run at half time, I'll take a grande non-fat peppermint mocha... I am assuming this will be on Saturday when we face another actual opponent!

##### fit over.

Zagdawg
12-07-2015, 12:16 PM
I was at the game also and saw the refs swallow the whistles on multiple occasions --for both teams.

Sean Miller has not taken the stable of top 100 talent beyond an elite 8 appearance in the dance--- same distance Few has taken his team with less top 100 talent---maybe think about a different coach to have Few watch because if you want Few to be as good as Miller --he already has the same results with less top 100 players on the roster.

LongIslandZagFan
12-07-2015, 12:23 PM
I understand that he took them to the Elite 8 last year and you have more than a few Sweet 16s but...

http://i1335.photobucket.com/albums/w674/stscho1906/offwithhishead2-killtext_zpse334b8b8.gif

devotedZAG
12-07-2015, 12:25 PM
He has way more Elite 8's than Few. I wasn't saying he is the coach to aspire to be, I am saying he was the better coach Saturday, who made adjustments that won the game.

Zagdawg
12-07-2015, 12:35 PM
So Few did not adjust to make the bunnies and layins and Sean did---ok --now I understand.

LongIslandZagFan
12-07-2015, 12:43 PM
So Few did not adjust to make the bunnies and layins and Sean did---ok --now I understand.

What? You didn't realize Mark told them to go out and shoot 31.3% from the field (14.3% from behind the arc). I mean that was one daring plan on his part.

11 shots inside the arc missed (3 from 4 ft or less) in the second half.

Bold bold strategy.

vandalzag
12-07-2015, 12:43 PM
So Few did not adjust to make the bunnies and layins and Sean did---ok --now I understand.

No you don't get it. Miller told his players to score more points than the Zags. Few forgot to tell his kids that strategy.

devotedZAG
12-07-2015, 12:50 PM
Miller adjusted his 2nd half... double teams, 3 point attempts, full court pressure, which triggered our turn overs... most importantly, he motivated his team

Few made no changes to line up, offense (despite the double team) and defense stayed the same. We had no set plays when it was clutch time for them! Our defense got lazy, I.E the moving screen which cost us 4 points and when it came time for those clutch possessions, we had NO game plan! Which is why we went 5 possessions without a basket and everyone in White looked like they were terrified playing a game of hot potato. No leadership.

LongIslandZagFan
12-07-2015, 12:55 PM
Miller adjusted his 2nd half... double teams, 3 point attempts, full court pressure, which triggered our turn overs... most importantly, he motivated his team

Few made no changes to line up, offense (despite the double team) and defense stayed the same. We had no set plays when it was clutch time for them! Our defense got lazy, I.E the moving screen which cost us 4 points and when it came time for those clutch possessions, we had NO game plan! Which is why we went 5 possessions without a basket and everyone in White looked like they were terrified playing a game of hot potato. No leadership.


:lmao:

Oh... wait... you were serious.

zagfan24
12-07-2015, 01:27 PM
This was certainly our darkest hour.

If losing a close game to a ranked team is our darkest hour we are even luckier as fans than I thought. That's the crazy thing about all of this wailing and gnashing of teeth. People are acting like GU lost to Whitworth by 30.

Zagdawg
12-07-2015, 01:28 PM
There is a reason we have never been enlightened by the new guy on the board-- his basketball knowledge is so amazing that most of us cannot comprehend what he is saying.

I really wish Miller would not have told York to start making his 3 point shots-- it would have been a totally different game. I hope that Few picks up on this brilliant adjustment and tells our guards to start making threes......it can be the difference maker.

jazzdelmar
12-07-2015, 01:30 PM
If losing a close game to a ranked team is our darkest hour we are even luckier as fans than I thought. That's the crazy thing about all of this wailing and gnashing of teeth. People are acting like GU lost to Whitworth by 30.

I believe he was referring to Pearl Harbor day

vandalzag
12-07-2015, 01:35 PM
If losing a close game to a ranked team is our darkest hour we are even luckier as fans than I thought. That's the crazy thing about all of this wailing and gnashing of teeth. People are acting like GU lost to Whitworth by 30.

Well lets see Pearl Harbor, 9/11, the Apple Cup (for Coug Fans), and a home loss to a ranked team. Yep I think Reborn has the perspective nailed on this one.

devotedZAG
12-07-2015, 01:41 PM
There is a reason we have never been enlightened by the new guy on the board-- his basketball knowledge is so amazing that most of us cannot comprehend what he is saying.

I really wish Miller would not have told York to start making his 3 point shots-- it would have been a totally different game. I hope that Few picks up on this brilliant adjustment and tells our guards to start making threes......it can be the difference maker.

I am a She! ;)

Zagceo
12-07-2015, 01:54 PM
:clap:

Welcome devoted

devotedZAG
12-07-2015, 02:03 PM
:clap:

Welcome devoted

Thanks! :)

Zagdawg
12-07-2015, 02:27 PM
No excuses.

;)

devotedZAG
12-07-2015, 02:32 PM
No excuses.

;)

I have none, just correcting you! Have a feeling it will be the second time of many!

Cheers!

dan71w
12-07-2015, 02:34 PM
I have none, just correcting you! Have a feeling it will be the second time of many!

Cheers!


LMAO,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, my wife says that all the time o.0

jim77
12-07-2015, 05:42 PM
So Miller told them to play loose defense and let GU build a lead in the first half? Pretty risky strategy. You would think he would have said play tough defense in the first half and they would win going away. So you think FT's had a bearing on this game? GU shot 6 of 8 I guess they could practice to make the other two

Teams start out respecting our bigs as they should. What they usually figure out is once the zags get the ball inside...it's to late to do anything. They (other team) goes in at halftime and figures they have to disrupt our offense at the point of attack...the inside pass never comes cause we're to busy losing the ball.

6 out of 8 don't make a trend...I'd still foul us and especially PK near the end of games...we may want to put in Edwards at times or we will see the Hack a shack fouls against pk.

willandi
12-07-2015, 06:09 PM
I have none, just correcting you! Have a feeling it will be the second time of many!

Cheers!

Not sure how my wife will feel, having another woman correct me! It's kind of her perk for putting up with me.

ValencyLovesZagsInAtlanta
12-07-2015, 06:25 PM
I was at the game and the officiating sucked... I haven't read anything else on the boards about that, but DANG I don't usually blame a game on the teeny tiny oldie striped seniors, but it definitely played a part (at least from my spot!!) Anyone else see this???

REGARDLESS WE are ​tied for 298/346​ TOTAL NCAA teams for the MOST turn overs per game!!!! that's an F however you look at it. F's don't graduate. Zona was superior when it mattered and that's why we lost.

Our conference and OOC schedule will never prep us to be a final 4 team. We choke. We get out coached. We are heartbreakers. WAAAHHH I am one of the ones who stays devoted year in and year out but part of me knows that big ole disappointment is March is lurking! Even went to Final Four twice because I was hoping there was a chance... haha how quickly to forget the facts, we aren't that good! We don't have players prepped for real competition. We don't have a coach who is capable of winning in that environment.

GU, you are a bracket buster for me every year, but I love you (even though it hurts) and I am committed, just not optimistic, and getting sick and tired of defending the "told you so's" from the fact driven, Gonzaga naysayers.

Few, why not take a tip from someone/anyone better than you (ahhem, Sean Miller) and make a gosh darn ADJUSTMENT! What do you even do at half time!?!?!?! Play hangman on the whiteboard?? Tally up your win/loss record for ranked teams and decide it's a lost cause and go get a quick Starbucks??

Zona didn't even sink that many threes (another proven weakness we have NEVER adapted to), although they did ADJUST during their halftime that wasn't a waste of time....so loss we had could have been worse. We missed Chem and we missed FIGHT and we missed a coach at half time to get a plan in place. Next Starbucks run at half time, I'll take a grande non-fat peppermint mocha... I am assuming this will be on Saturday when we face another actual opponent!

##### fit over.

No disrespect but I think you are certainly selling Coach Few short on his halftime coffee runs. Starbucks? No way! Coach Few crosses all the T's and dots all the I's when formulating proper strategy for these important runs. It is ALWAYS a special asst that runs to INDABA Coffee Bar to get Mark the Lemon Vanilla Latte. lol

I just want to SCREAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR RRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We blow out UCLA by 20.

Reborn
12-07-2015, 08:54 PM
If losing a close game to a ranked team is our darkest hour we are even luckier as fans than I thought. That's the crazy thing about all of this wailing and gnashing of teeth. People are acting like GU lost to Whitworth by 30.

Zagfan. It's not that we lost. It's HOW we lost. This was't Whitworth...This WAS Arizona. Most of know the difference. And a loss to an Arizona team that we should have beaten by 15 points is worse than a loss to Whitworth by 30 or whatever. If you know anything about basketball, your point guard just doesn't get picked at half court two or three times in a row for layups for the other team. When I played I always guarded the point guard, and I was darn good at stealing the ball, at picking point-guards, and I can tell you that it IS devastating to a team. And to do it twice or three times, to me, is unheard of...THAT my friend is the embarrassment. As well as a real good player missing layups, or Bunny Tip ins. Or missed dunks. This, where I came from is called Bush League. And THAT is not Gonzaga basketball. It it DOES also have something to do with who we lost too. This IS one of the biggest if not the biggest non conference game every year.

That game had a chance to be a really, really great game because Arizona players fought with every thing they had, and dang our guys just fricken handed the game over to them, WITHOUT a FIGHT. I saw no fight in our guys. Few gave us the excuse that they're tired. If that is true, that in years to come stop traveling like that and get ready for games like the one with Arizona. Are we going to do this crap again against Montana? And then UCLA. Are we gonna make excuses for not fighting. If that's the case then the spirit of Gonzaga University, the Spirit of the Zags, is gone. There needs to be some soul searching taking place....IMO....

My guess about the difference between the first half and the 2nd was what was said by the coaches in the locker-room. I believe that what has been said by the coaches from the end of the Arizona game until the biginning of the game tomorrow will be the difference in how the team plays.

jim77
12-07-2015, 10:49 PM
Zagfan. It's not that we lost. It's HOW we lost. This was't Whitworth...This WAS Arizona. Most of know the difference. And a loss to an Arizona team that we should have beaten by 15 points is worse than a loss to Whitworth by 30 or whatever. If you know anything about basketball, your point guard just doesn't get picked at half court two or three times in a row for layups for the other team. When I played I always guarded the point guard, and I was darn good at stealing the ball, at picking point-guards, and I can tell you that it IS devastating to a team. And to do it twice or three times, to me, is unheard of...THAT my friend is the embarrassment. As well as a real good player missing layups, or Bunny Tip ins. Or missed dunks. This, where I came from is called Bush League. And THAT is not Gonzaga basketball. It it DOES also have something to do with who we lost too. This IS one of the biggest if not the biggest non conference game every year.

That game had a chance to be a really, really great game because Arizona players fought with every thing they had, and dang our guys just fricken handed the game over to them, WITHOUT a FIGHT. I saw no fight in our guys. Few gave us the excuse that they're tired. If that is true, that in years to come stop traveling like that and get ready for games like the one with Arizona. Are we going to do this crap again against Montana? And then UCLA. Are we gonna make excuses for not fighting. If that's the case then the spirit of Gonzaga University, the Spirit of the Zags, is gone. There needs to be some soul searching taking place....IMO....

My guess about the difference between the first half and the 2nd was what was said by the coaches in the locker-room. I believe that what has been said by the coaches from the end of the Arizona game until the biginning of the game tomorrow will be the difference in how the team plays.

Good post Reborn.

Did the coach really say the guys were tired? WOW. I think we'll be ok with Montana...its UCLA i'm worried about. You can also bet Alford knows the deal and Josh had better be ready for some close company....Correcting ball handling takes time to unlearn bad habits.

bballbeachbum
12-08-2015, 02:05 PM
Good post Reborn.

Did the coach really say the guys were tired? WOW. I think we'll be ok with Montana...its UCLA i'm worried about. You can also bet Alford knows the deal and Josh had better be ready for some close company....Correcting ball handling takes time to unlearn bad habits.

and bad habits tend to pop up when you're tired, or under pressure, or lacking confidence for whatever reason, different reasons, so agree they can be tough to unlearn and would add that they can rear their ugly head at some critical times. But it can also be learned to overcome the bad habits, to prepare for the moments of stress and know when you're in them so you can consciously respond and overcome (not crumble) instead of being overcome and falling back into bad habits (crumble). seems to me the young guys are going through this, witnessed by some positive moments followed by other less than positive moments, within the same games even

another thing is meeting the other team's intensity when it rises and not just being overwhelmed by it; have to at least meet the other team there if not beat them at it. Tough to win a game of anything otherwise