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jazzdelmar
09-02-2015, 04:52 AM
We’re still a few weeks away from the arrival of many of the preseason college basketball magazines.

Here is Top 10 from Lindy's:

1. Maryland
2. North Carolina
3. Kentucky
4. Indiana
5. Virginia
6. Kansas
7. Wichita State
8. Villanova
9. Duke
10. Iowa State


Also in the snub category, Blue Ribbon Yearbook has announced its five-player preseason All-America first team. Players are: Kentucky freshman Skal Labissiere, LSU freshman Ben Simmons, Virginia senior Malcolm Brogdon, Iowa State senior Georges Niang and Providence junior Kris Dunn.


Finally, Kansas University senior forward Perry Ellis is featured on the regional cover of Athlon’s College Basketball 2015-16 Preview Magazine.

Some other regional covers picture Kentucky’s Tyler Ulis and Alex Poythress; Arizona’s Kaleb Tarczewski; Indiana’s Yogi Ferrell; LSU’s Ben Simmons; Maryland’s Melo Trimble and Virginia’s Malcolm Brogdon; Michigan State’s Denzel Valentine and Michigan’s Caris Levert; North Carolina’s Marcus Paige; Syracuse’s Trevor Cooney; UCLA’s Bryce Alford and Wisconsin’s Nigel Hayes.

The magazine’s preseason rankings have yet to be revealed. The magazine hits stores on Sept. 8.

DixieZag
09-02-2015, 05:17 AM
Well aware that these things mean less than nothing....

Still p^^^^^ses me off.

jazzdelmar
09-02-2015, 05:23 AM
Well aware that these things mean less than nothing....

Still p^^^^^ses me off.

Me, too. Hard to be diplomatic when the slights are so blatant. Still, count on some brave pub or pundit to do the right thing, well at least the better thing, for the Zags and for KW.

gonzagafan62
09-02-2015, 05:42 AM
Makes me mad too Jazz

BUT we all should know Lindy's is usually the worst basketball magazine in town.

Still makes me mad though. UGH!

gonzagafan62
09-02-2015, 05:43 AM
Oh, and Wichita State @ #7 when the Zags could easily dismantle them is a complete joke.

DixieZag
09-02-2015, 05:56 AM
Oh, and Wichita State @ #7 when the Zags could easily dismantle them is a complete joke.

Shoulda put that thing out of its misery when we had the chance.

zagsfanforlife
09-02-2015, 06:12 AM
Oh, and Wichita State @ #7 when the Zags could easily dismantle them is a complete joke.

Usually agree with you bud, and i think GU would probably win, but do not discount senior tandem of Van Fleet, Baker.... two of the best in nation. Frankamp from KU will be very good for them, so will Grady a big man transfer from cleveland state. This team has final four potential, and who i consider the best coach in CBB (even though i dont like him personally).

TheGonzagaFactor
09-02-2015, 06:57 AM
Makes me mad too Jazz

BUT we all should know Lindy's is usually the worst basketball magazine in town.

Still makes me mad though. UGH!

Yeah but we were all pretty quick to slurp up the Zag kool-aid they mixed up for us last preseason lol

LongIslandZagFan
09-02-2015, 07:07 AM
Iowa State is the one that really bugs me.

willandi
09-02-2015, 07:08 AM
Who is Lindy's and why should we care what they say?

Maybe a forum member here, one who can write and stays at home, could start the National Collegiate Basketball Magazine, and just put the GU program inside!

LongIslandZagFan
09-02-2015, 07:18 AM
Who is Lindy's and why should we care what they say?

Maybe a forum member here, one who can write and stays at home, could start the National Collegiate Basketball Magazine, and just put the GU program inside!

To be fair Lindy's has been around for a long long time.

willandi
09-02-2015, 07:20 AM
To be fair Lindy's has been around for a long long time.

My Dad talked about doing the Lindy when he was young!

gonzagafan62
09-02-2015, 07:22 AM
Yeah but we were all pretty quick to slurp up the Zag kool-aid they mixed up for us last preseason lol

DOUBLE EDIT: HAHA true. Ill take anything we can get.

LongIslandZagFan
09-02-2015, 07:23 AM
My Dad talked about doing the Lindy when he was young!

Now that doesn't mean they haven't gone downhill in recent years.... they have. I am not saying that from a Zag perspective, but rather from a fact based side. They had several factual errors last year with the Zags... stuff that was widely known. So, not sure what happened, but they are slipping.

gonzagafan62
09-02-2015, 07:27 AM
Usually agree with you bud, and i think GU would probably win, but do not discount senior tandem of Van Fleet, Baker.... two of the best in nation. Frankamp from KU will be very good for them, so will Grady a big man transfer from cleveland state. This team has final four potential, and who i consider the best coach in CBB (even though i dont like him personally).

Yeah, Van Vleet and Baker have been around awhile. We would have beat them last year, we would this year too. I just don't think they could matchup with our big 4, without Early. With Early they could be a bit scarier. The only reason we lost in 13 was cuz of Bell. They started raining after that. It would have been another Iowa game or something had he not gotten hurt. That doesn't mean I don't take away their credit either. They went to the Final Four and did a terrific job maintaining their program. I respect what Marshall does, and they will have another great team this year.

But I don't see them as a better team than Gonzaga, and certainly not Top 7.

gonzagafan62
09-02-2015, 07:28 AM
Now that doesn't mean they haven't gone downhill in recent years.... they have. I am not saying that from a Zag perspective, but rather from a fact based side. They had several factual errors last year with the Zags... stuff that was widely known. So, not sure what happened, but they are slipping.

Yeah, actually about 10 years ago they were pretty dang good actually. The last ten though have been awful.

DixieZag
09-02-2015, 07:29 AM
and who i consider the best coach in CBB.

Go outside, turn around 3 times and spit.

Not saying ours is, but you don't say things like that out loud....

:)

hooter73
09-02-2015, 08:11 AM
I agree that we should be in that top 7-9 range, but hey, if our guards are such unknowns that we are ranked 11-13, whatever. I honestly wont be surprised if KW gets snubbed as a preseason though. Just my opinion.

zagsfanforlife
09-02-2015, 09:26 AM
Go outside, turn around 3 times and spit.

Not saying ours is, but you don't say things like that out loud....

:)

I get why people dont like his antics, his personality or anything like that... but if you dont think Greg Marshall is a top coach in college basketball, then I am afraid you are mistaken. And most everyone i know in the college basketball industry would agree with that.

seacatfan
09-02-2015, 09:30 AM
Indiana at #4?! Does anyone else think that is grossly overrated? They were fairly mediocre last year, I'm absolutely not seeing where the hype is coming from.

jazzdelmar
09-02-2015, 09:31 AM
I get why people dont like his antics, his personality or anything like that... but if you dont think Greg Marshall is a top coach in college basketball, then I am afraid you are mistaken. And most everyone i know in the college basketball industry would agree with that.

I think posters here are quite able to separate his obvious coaching prowess from his despicable, arrogant, dismissive personality.

zagsfanforlife
09-02-2015, 09:35 AM
I think posters here are quite able to separate his obvious coaching prowess from his despicable, arrogant, dismissive personality.

Obviously not.

And yes as above poster said, Indiana is overrated. Good talent, and a good freshman big, but unproven.

jazzdelmar
09-02-2015, 09:41 AM
Obviously not.

And yes as above poster said, Indiana is overrated. Good talent, and a good freshman big, but unproven.


Moreover, Slappy Crean gives Gregggg a run for the distasteful coach crown. He, too, does well with not much. And is clearly a survivor.

gonzagafan62
09-02-2015, 09:41 AM
Indiana at #4?! Does anyone else think that is grossly overrated? They were fairly mediocre last year, I'm absolutely not seeing where the hype is coming from.

They will be out of the Top 25 come January ... Book it.

seacatfan
09-02-2015, 10:38 AM
Moreover, Slappy Crean gives Gregggg a run for the distasteful coach crown. He, too, does well with not much. And is clearly a survivor.

I disagree strongly. Crean has recruited quite well at Indiana and has underachieved for the most part. Marshall hasn't had even a fraction of the same talent at his disposal.

CDC84
09-02-2015, 11:21 AM
Kyle Wiltjer has to be on that first team AA list.

jazzdelmar
09-02-2015, 11:31 AM
I disagree strongly. Crean has recruited quite well at Indiana and has underachieved for the most part. Marshall hasn't had even a fraction of the same talent at his disposal.

Crean has had better talent, it is the Small 10 after all. But many of the kids, see Yogi, were way overrated coming in. No doubt Gregggg gets a whole lot further with Clappy's players.

jazzdelmar
09-02-2015, 11:32 AM
Kyle Wiltjer has to be on that first team AA list.

Ya think? :)

seacatfan
09-02-2015, 11:36 AM
That's better jazz. I don't think Marshall has ever had anything close to a one and done or two and done player, Crean's at least had several (Zeller, Vonleh, others?). The 2012-13 season Indiana was the trendy pre-season pick to win it all and still one of the odds on favorites going into the Tourney. Veteran and talented team with Zeller, Oladipo, Watford, etc. Made it to the Sweet 16 and then got absolutely stymied by what wasn't even remotely close to one of Boeheim's better teams at Syracuse. That was a hugely disappointing season for the Hoosiers.

CDC84
09-02-2015, 11:48 AM
Is Indiana going to have any experienced size in the middle this year? They were starting 6-6 centers last year. You need more than just a bunch of 3 point gunners to be a top 5 team.

I still don't think Wich St is going to be as good as they were last year. They aren't as good in the frontcourt, although those guards are brilliant. They will win a lot of games.

Crean should've never left Marquette. He was a great fit there. I actually don't think he's a bad coach.

jazzdelmar
09-02-2015, 12:28 PM
Is Indiana going to have any experienced size in the middle this year? They were starting 6-6 centers last year. You need more than just a bunch of 3 point gunners to be a top 5 team.

I still don't think Wich St is going to be as good as they were last year. They aren't as good in the frontcourt, although those guards are brilliant. They will win a lot of games.

Crean should've never left Marquette. He was a great fit there. I actually don't think he's a bad coach.



Kinda lucked into D Wade with the Warriors and parlayed that run into a bigger time job.

seacatfan
09-02-2015, 12:29 PM
Thomas Bryant was a highly regarded recruit, I think a true center with size, will be a freshman at IU. Can't remember if he was in the McD's AA game but he was in some of those all star exhibitions. He's currently suspended, but I have a feeling the suspension will be lifted before the season starts. Call me cynical.

jazzdelmar
09-02-2015, 12:30 PM
That's better jazz. I don't think Marshall has ever had anything close to a one and done or two and done player, Crean's at least had several (Zeller, Vonleh, others?). The 2012-13 season Indiana was the trendy pre-season pick to win it all and still one of the odds on favorites going into the Tourney. Veteran and talented team with Zeller, Oladipo, Watford, etc. Made it to the Sweet 16 and then got absolutely stymied by what wasn't even remotely close to one of Boeheim's better teams at Syracuse. That was a hugely disappointing season for the Hoosiers.



Always eager to please you, SC. Btw, ran into Stevie Kerr on the beach and he responded more enthusiastically to my son's ratty Zona tee shirt than my proffered congrats on the title.

TheZagPhish
09-02-2015, 12:32 PM
Ironically, Phish's "Rating the Rankings" doesn't have Lindy's in its top ten this year either.

seacatfan
09-02-2015, 12:33 PM
Kinda lucked into D Wade with the Warriors and parlayed that run into a bigger time job.

Buzz Williams was at least as good at Marquette (other than no Final 4 run), yet parlayed that into...Virginia Tech? That still makes no sense more than a year later.

hooter73
09-02-2015, 12:36 PM
Kyle Wiltjer has to be on that first team AA list.

Nope, he might on the post season list. Might.

l dont necessarily agree, but I can see where the list makers would feel like he had his AA chance already. Now as a 5th year senior, plus he has the (inaccurate) Gonzaga factor of big fish in small pond working against him too. Really unless he stays in the top 3 scorers nationally for the whole year, I can really see everyone snubbing him. The only reason I pick that list is because in the scheme of things, that is his only stat to look for. its never going to be rebounds, blocks or assists...

seacatfan
09-02-2015, 12:37 PM
Always eager to please you, SC. Btw, ran into Stevie Kerr on the beach and he responded more enthusiastically to my son's ratty Zona tee shirt than my proffered congrats on the title.

That's cool you ran into Kerr. I was really happy to see him have so much success in his first year of coaching. You let your son wear Zona gear?

I appreciate your sarcasm too. I'm quite sure you aren't motivated by gaining my approval.

jazzdelmar
09-02-2015, 12:41 PM
That's cool you ran into Kerr. I was really happy to see him have so much success in his first year of coaching. You let your son wear Zona gear?

I appreciate your sarcasm too. I'm quite sure you aren't motivated by gaining my approval.

C'mon SC, it's a new great season. Let's start fresh. Stevie is NBA commish quality, IMO. Tremendously bright and articulate and accessible. But clearly he would never move to NYC even for that job.

seacatfan
09-02-2015, 12:54 PM
C'mon SC, it's a new great season. Let's start fresh. Stevie is NBA commish quality, IMO. Tremendously bright and articulate and accessible. But clearly he would never move to NYC even for that job.

I wasn't try to pick a fight. I don't have emoticons, otherwise I could've thrown a smile or winky face or something in my last post. You and I often have different opinions but I recognize you're a passionate fan and you follow bball closely, I can appreciate that.

Zags_Fanatic
09-02-2015, 12:55 PM
They did imply that GU would have been #11 in the article that I read on ESPN the other day. Personally I think Oklahoma at #8 is worse than Iowa State or Wichita State.

CDC84
09-02-2015, 01:39 PM
More on IU's frontcourt woes:

http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-basketball/story/2015-08-31/indiana-hoosiers-frontcourt-substance-issues-citations-dismissals-ncaa-college-basketball


With the luminous exception of forward Troy Williams, here is what the Indiana Hoosiers got from their frontcourt during the 2014-15 college basketball season: no one worthy of as many as 20 minutes of playing time per game; no one skilled enough to average even 7 points per game and only 27 blocked shots, placing them very near the bottom of the Big Ten Conference in that category.

Here is what the Hoosiers have gotten from their frontcourt players since the season ended: three dismissals for substance-related issues.


IU has failed on three levels here: to either evaluate or attract a plurality of frontcourt players capable of performing at the Big Ten level; to either evaluate or attract a plurality of frontcourt players with the character and commitment to pursue excellence for themselves and the Hoosiers, and to convince three such players the opportunity they’ve been presented is worth preserving.

There was no quote from Indiana coach Tom Crean in the news release announcing Holt’s dismissal.

Then again, what more is there to say, really?

CDC84
09-02-2015, 01:53 PM
2014/2015:

Wiltjer: 27.6 MPG, 16.8 PPG, 6.2 RPG, 54% FG, 47% 3PT

Niang: 30.7 MPG, 15.3 PPG, 5.4 RPG, 46% FG, 40% 3PT

Brogdon: 32.5 MPG, 14 PPG, 3.9 RPG, 42% FG, 34% 3PT

gonstu
09-02-2015, 02:26 PM
2014/2015:

Wiltjer: 27.6 MPG, 16.8 PPG, 6.2 RPG, 54% FG, 47% 3PT

Niang: 30.7 MPG, 15.3 PPG, 5.4 RPG, 46% FG, 40% 3PT

Brogdon: 32.5 MPG, 14 PPG, 3.9 RPG, 42% FG, 34% 3PT

yes, but you are forgetting he put up those numbers in the lowly WCC :p

hooter73
09-02-2015, 02:34 PM
yes, but you are forgetting he put up those numbers in the lowly WCC :p

exactly...sigh.

MDABE80
09-02-2015, 02:53 PM
The services will not trust our back court till our kids show em. That's the only reason we're not top 10. I still think it's a bit silly we're not in the top ten with our bigs and with Emac and Jenks(!!)...........Kyle too. But we'll show em and they'll write it up. And then we' move into the top ten. We win that tournament at Atlantis, we'll be top ten easily.
For now though, until the guards show up and show they're they'll adequate to replace Kevin and Gary, the writers/voters will hold their water.

hooter73
09-02-2015, 03:09 PM
Really though its not like Kyle, Emac, JP, or Melson have stats behind them that say top ten team, so as far as the numbers show, I kind of get it.

GonzaGAW
09-02-2015, 03:28 PM
yes, but you are forgetting he put up those numbers in the lowly WCC :p

with regards to the stats posted by CDC84.
roughly speaking Wiltjer was on the court 10% less than niang and bogdon, yet and again roughly speaking he out rebounds each by around 25%, out scores and out shoots them both by around 10%. a 10% shooting difference is huge. I have a hard time saying that is all due to wcc play vs. big 12 or acc competition. plus lets recall only around 2/3 of our games are against wcc competition. you may actually agree with me, your point if not taken to heart by you, it certainly is taken by many, including some of the magazine pundits and editors.

back to pre season a.a. candidates. i could see wiltjer missing some and making others, if not a first team pre season candidate I certainly think he should be on anyone's top 10 (i.e. second team honors)

zagamatic
09-02-2015, 07:45 PM
Without teams like Indiana being ranked highly early in the season for other teams to get a win over a "highly ranked team" and over inflate their RPI, then how else do the big boy conferences end the season ranked highly? Just saying

ZagMan in Philly
09-03-2015, 07:46 AM
Zags should be ranked between 8-12, no less.
KW not mentioned as a Preseason All American is a complete snub, he can carry any college team, in any conference, and put up good numbers, imo.
I think Wichita State is going to be real good, they have a similar makeup as the St.Joe's team with Nelson and West that went to Final 4.
Beat Pittsburgh!!!

Reborn
09-03-2015, 08:19 AM
What difference does it really make? It's a preseason ranking. Honestly, I believe it's best for GU to not be in the top ten. It's will motivate them even more. Same for Kyle. Right now I truly doubt the team is worried about the polls. And Kyle is not focused on his preseason polls. They have a job to do, and they're all about getting ready for that right now.

LongIslandZagFan
09-03-2015, 08:22 AM
Without teams like Indiana being ranked highly early in the season for other teams to get a win over a "highly ranked team" and over inflate their RPI, then how else do the big boy conferences end the season ranked highly? Just saying

Rankings mean nothing with RPI. RPI is all about Ws and Ls

maynard g krebs
09-03-2015, 10:27 AM
Zags should be ranked between 8-12, no less.
KW not mentioned as a Preseason All American is a complete snub, he can carry any college team, in any conference, and put up good numbers, imo.
I think Wichita State is going to be real good, they have a similar makeup as the St.Joe's team with Nelson and West that went to Final 4.
Beat Pittsburgh!!!

Baker and Van Vleet aren't close to Nelson and West imo.