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flytiezag
06-16-2015, 08:39 AM
Medcalf has us in final four time to dream. https://twitter.com/MedcalfByESPN

gonzagafan62
06-16-2015, 08:51 AM
Medcalf has us in final four time to dream. https://twitter.com/MedcalfByESPN

I am just going to be real here:

1. Our opportunity for a Final Four was last year. Can we get lucky and hit the jackpot and go this year? Sure its always possible, especially with the frontcourt and perkins like we have. Its not dissing this upcoming season, Wiltjer can always catch fire, and the development of Melson could be insane who knows. But I am not seeing it.

2. Perkins is the future of the Zags backcourt. I see a Final Four chance in 2017, we can be back in the Elite Eight or Sweet Sixteen next year possibly (which opens the door)

3. Opinions are welcomed, and I love dreaming about it. Hope I am wrong.

4. I don't see any of Medcalf's teams (Iowa State, Oklahoma, Cal or Gonzaga) in the Final Four next season.

sittingon50
06-16-2015, 09:18 AM
Iowa St. with a new Coach.

Cal with a 2nd year Coach.

GU & Cal in the West bracket?

JPtheBeasta
06-16-2015, 09:23 AM
We will be more athletic on the perimeter this year, and the lack thereof seemed to be our undoing in March. When the shots aren't falling, you at least need to answer with slashing and driving. We have the potential to be better defensively against more athletic teams, the loss of the defensive prowess of GBJ notwithstanding. Every year we seemingly lose an irreplaceable person, but yet the team keeps winning.

Poise and decision-making will be a big question mark for me. We might be pulling our hair out at times this year because of bone-headed plays more so than the last few years. I just hope the talent trumps that. I am guarded (no pun intended) about next year, but very optimistic. The batch of players we have is uncharted territory. In the past, Few and Co seem to have had to decide between very skilled players and very athletic players (this is not to denigrate the rare players like Matt Santangelo). We look to finally be in the place where he have multiple guards with both.

TheGonzagaFactor
06-16-2015, 09:28 AM
Next year's team has the potential to be the best we've had BY FAR. Key word there is potential. We will have a faster, taller perimeter defense but less perimeter shooting on offense. The pieces are there for another deep run, it just depends on how the team comes together.

DixieZag
06-16-2015, 09:29 AM
I am just going to be real here:

1. Our opportunity for a Final Four was last year. Can we get lucky and hit the jackpot and go this year? Sure its always possible, especially with the frontcourt and perkins like we have. Its not dissing this upcoming season, Wiltjer can always catch fire, and the development of Melson could be insane who knows. But I am not seeing it.

2. Perkins is the future of the Zags backcourt. I see a Final Four chance in 2017, we can be back in the Elite Eight or Sweet Sixteen next year possibly (which opens the door)

3. Opinions are welcomed, and I love dreaming about it. Hope I am wrong.

4. I don't see any of Medcalf's teams (Iowa State, Oklahoma, Cal or Gonzaga) in the Final Four next season.

I agree that his list makes no sense to me (Cal?)

But, I disagree that last year was our year. As big a deal as having the right team is, so is the fact that one must have at least some parity at the top. Kentucky-Wisconsin-Duke made it a year in which there would be no Butlers or VCUs - not that we're Butler or VCU, it's just 2-3 spots are not "locked" almost from the beginning.

And, I don't think we take a step back talent-wise. That sounds like sacrilege given we lost Kevin/Gary and that is a HUGE leadership loss. But, if we can still get the "team" thing going as strong, and I believe KW/PK will ensure that happens, I think we may have more pure athletic talent. JP will not shoot as well as KP, but he may run the offense as well or better. Since no one knows what's happening at the 2/3, I will not go there. But, Sabonis will be one of the best players in BB, Kyle will be a pre-season AA, and PK has improved every year.

I think we have at least as good a shot, maybe better In part b/c there will be one, maybe may spots attainable.

Zagceo
06-16-2015, 09:33 AM
I am just going to be real here:

1. Our opportunity for a Final Four was last year. Can we get lucky and hit the jackpot and go this year? Sure its always possible, especially with the frontcourt and perkins like we have. Its not dissing this upcoming season, Wiltjer can always catch fire, and the development of Melson could be insane who knows. But I am not seeing it.

2. Perkins is the future of the Zags backcourt. I see a Final Four chance in 2017, we can be back in the Elite Eight or Sweet Sixteen next year possibly (which opens the door)

3. Opinions are welcomed, and I love dreaming about it. Hope I am wrong.

4. I don't see any of Medcalf's teams (Iowa State, Oklahoma, Cal or Gonzaga) in the Final Four next season.

If we make a couple of shots at the end of the Arizona game or the Duke game we win. Just didn't have the horse power to dominate and finish top 5 teams.

Different team with different expectations next year by the young guns coming in handling the ball IMO. Driving passing shooting will be more noticeable because of the size and athleticism of our young players. Perk Mel Mcc Alberts playing off our bigs should be fun and hopefully a little bit more free form with fast breaks and running a few teams into the ground with our depth.

zagsfanforlife
06-16-2015, 09:47 AM
Those dissing Cal as a potential final four team must not follow the recruiting trail too well. They have two guys coming in who are touted as top 10 lottery picks in 2016 (Raab and Brown). Both super athletic, super scorers. They also have Jabari Bird, Jordan Matthews (Jonah's older brother) and Tyrone Wallace to round out the top 5. Wallace averaged 17 last year, Bird was a former Burger Boy who averaged 11 last year, and Matthews averaged 14. Also add tyson jolly, and this team has a very good chance to make a deep run.

Baseline
06-16-2015, 09:55 AM
I loved Pangos and Bell, but they were streak shooters that would disappear in games. With this years guards we might not get the big 3 point burst, but we will get more consistency ad probably a lot more drives to the basket, so it will be fine, if not better. Who knows, maybe we have a shooter that steps up.

zagsfanforlife
06-16-2015, 09:58 AM
You have to imagine the bigs (DS, KW, and Karno) will be better players, who now have experience in elite 8games. Add a 7'2 center to back them up,and a pg with athleticism we didnt have last year, and yes i do think this team will be better. I get it. We all loved GB and KP. But both weren't super stars, were very streaky and couldnt execute against the more athletic teams. Now we have guards who are better suited for that. Practicing against NWG and JW will only help as well. I like the Zags to at least make the elite 8, maybe final 4 depending on matchups.

flytiezag
06-16-2015, 10:01 AM
One advantage we have this year is more depth.Keven was worn out in many games coach Few was saying we need to get Keven some rest.More rested players at end of games and end of season seems like a advantage.4 good bigs 5 good guards the potential is there.We may be underestimating how well out outside shooting will be.

realtydog
06-16-2015, 10:08 AM
I am just going to be real here:

1. Our opportunity for a Final Four was last year. Can we get lucky and hit the jackpot and go this year? Sure its always possible, especially with the frontcourt and perkins like we have. Its not dissing this upcoming season, Wiltjer can always catch fire, and the development of Melson could be insane who knows. But I am not seeing it.

2. Perkins is the future of the Zags backcourt. I see a Final Four chance in 2017, we can be back in the Elite Eight or Sweet Sixteen next year possibly (which opens the door)

3. Opinions are welcomed, and I love dreaming about it. Hope I am wrong.

4. I don't see any of Medcalf's teams (Iowa State, Oklahoma, Cal or Gonzaga) in the Final Four next season.

Let's "be real"

#1---we have heard the "our time was last year" thing several times before-----we have no clue what this backcourt will be---my hunch is better---so in my eyes our odds are not less than last year
#2---2017??? what's wrong with this year----good guard play doesn't always mean upper classmen----I don't see your point here
#3----I too hope you're wrong----truth is it takes the luck of a few good bounces no matter what team or year
#4---M.M. gets paid to get people to look at his crap and discuss it----no way he puts the deed to the house on this FF---it's just chatter and beats the standard Kentucky, Duke, Kansas, Arizona FF talk

Reborn
06-16-2015, 10:16 AM
I am just going to be real here:

1. Our opportunity for a Final Four was last year. Can we get lucky and hit the jackpot and go this year? Sure its always possible, especially with the frontcourt and perkins like we have. Its not dissing this upcoming season, Wiltjer can always catch fire, and the development of Melson could be insane who knows. But I am not seeing it.

2. Perkins is the future of the Zags backcourt. I see a Final Four chance in 2017, we can be back in the Elite Eight or Sweet Sixteen next year possibly (which opens the door)

3. Opinions are welcomed, and I love dreaming about it. Hope I am wrong.

4. I don't see any of Medcalf's teams (Iowa State, Oklahoma, Cal or Gonzaga) in the Final Four next season.

I think by mid-season you will change your opinion, Gonzagafan62. Yes, there are new players coming in, in the backcourt. So what? Every team has that. Let go of the past, brother and get ready for next year. Perkins is going to surprise you I think. Dranginis could really surprise us all too, and maybe Melson. Give these guys some time. They need to find their roles and chemistry. This will take some time. But Few et al will make sure it happens, and these guys are soul brothers.

gonzagafan62
06-16-2015, 11:13 AM
Let's "be real"

#1---we have heard the "our time was last year" thing several times before-----we have no clue what this backcourt will be---my hunch is better---so in my eyes our odds are not less than last year
#2---2017??? what's wrong with this year----good guard play doesn't always mean upper classmen----I don't see your point here
#3----I too hope you're wrong----truth is it takes the luck of a few good bounces no matter what team or year
#4---M.M. gets paid to get people to look at his crap and discuss it----no way he puts the deed to the house on this FF---it's just chatter and beats the standard Kentucky, Duke, Kansas, Arizona FF talk

I understand. I wasn't trying to get your panties in a bunch. I was trying to be real to why my thoughts were. In 2017 march madness we will have third year guys Melson NWG, JWIII, Zach Collins, Sabonis (if he would like to get his third year like he's said and josh Perkins who would be going through his third year in the program also. I like it a bit better... And we would have solo role players. I'm not again trying to beat on next season it's how I feel. I also didn't think we'd make the tournament in 2011 ... We won a game in te dang thing. I've been wrong, as I'll admit. I hope I'm as wrong as anyone has been. I'll be clinging toward every shot next season just like the rest of you are.

gonzagafan62
06-16-2015, 11:18 AM
I think by mid-season you will change your opinion, Gonzagafan62. Yes, there are new players coming in, in the backcourt. So what? Every team has that. Let go of the past, brother and get ready for next year. Perkins is going to surprise you I think. Dranginis could really surprise us all too, and maybe Melson. Give these guys some time. They need to find their roles and chemistry. This will take some time. But Few et al will make sure it happens, and these guys are soul brothers.

Yes, Draino could be one of those guys that surprises me. Some people on here are high on Dranginis. I think I have a hard time shedding the "role player" label. Hopefully I am wrong about that too. But shoot we were number one seed with Mike Hart (and Draino is a much better shooter than Hart) so, yeah we definitely have a chance for sure.

Like I have stated in previous posts:

Mark Few will get the players to make the baskets to win the game.

Go !!! Zags !!!!

SunDevilGolfZag
06-16-2015, 11:56 AM
I just cannot even imagine not thinking Final Four or national title next year. Sure it may not happen but I would bet everyone on the coaching staff and every player in the program views it as a realistic goal to strive for. Why not us?!

bartruff1
06-16-2015, 12:02 PM
When I read people talking about better athletes and more talent it always reminds me of what Huggins said after Few had beaten him for the umpteen time....

When he was asked why......... he said (to the effect) Mark recruits kids who know how to play basketball as a team....the rest of us, all to often, recruit great talent, big athletes that can run and jump and shoot and don't know a damn thing about how to play basketball.

I have seen plenty of big and athletic players at Gonzaga that couldn't get in the game.

jazzdelmar
06-16-2015, 12:18 PM
Take the light from under the bushel. Common sense tells you next years team will be marginally better at least than last years. If just the three amigos improve 20 percent each, that's compelling. KP and GB have had their time and they were talented, if limited guards. On paper, the gaggle of Perks, SM, Alberts and EM can be better, marginally if not more. OTOH, when you talk FF we can all agree so much of it is the draw and luck. But GU is a top ten next year, and perhaps the year after, and thus is FF ready for the foreseeable future.

titopoet
06-16-2015, 12:27 PM
I am just going to be real here:

1. Our opportunity for a Final Four was last year. Can we get lucky and hit the jackpot and go this year? Sure its always possible, especially with the frontcourt and perkins like we have. Its not dissing this upcoming season, Wiltjer can always catch fire, and the development of Melson could be insane who knows. But I am not seeing it.

2. Perkins is the future of the Zags backcourt. I see a Final Four chance in 2017, we can be back in the Elite Eight or Sweet Sixteen next year possibly (which opens the door)

3. Opinions are welcomed, and I love dreaming about it. Hope I am wrong.

4. I don't see any of Medcalf's teams (Iowa State, Oklahoma, Cal or Gonzaga) in the Final Four next season.

1. Last season as different as Wisconsin, Kentucky and Duke and the other elite teams were special. The teams that are projected as the top 3 or four are not like any of last year's teams. In other words, it more open than last years season. NC, Kansas, and Maryland are not exactly murders row.

2. Perkins is a past first PG being handed the best most versatile front court in the nation. PK still present a huge challenge as a big man that can pass as well as he can. While Gu lost two super shooters, the perimeter players coming back are all better than average shooters. The D and match up problems remain.

4. Who then. It is a different season than last years. If last years team was playing this year, they would be the favorite as none of the front runners are all that scary and certainly not a 40-0 threat in the bunch.

bartruff1
06-16-2015, 12:44 PM
Take the light from under the bushel. Common sense tells you next years team will be marginally better at least than last years. If just the three amigos improve 20 percent each, that's compelling. KP and GB have had their time and they were talented, if limited guards. On paper, the gaggle of Perks, SM, Alberts and EM can be better, marginally if not more. OTOH, when you talk FF we can all agree so much of it is the draw and luck. But GU is a top ten next year, and perhaps the year after, and thus is FF ready for the foreseeable future.

It is always 5 somewhere, but it is too early to be drinking on the west coast. Common sense tells me that next years team won't be anywhere near as good as this years team. I will be surprised if the three amigos all return and amazed if they improve by 20% each. I think Gonzaga will be in the top 15 next year and whatever happens in the NCAA...happens.....after all, Ucon won it....

It will be fun to see how it all turns out....

jazzdelmar
06-16-2015, 01:15 PM
It is always 5 somewhere, but it is too early to be drinking on the west coast. Common sense tells me that next years team won't be anywhere near as good as this years team. I will be surprised if the three amigos all return and amazed if they improve by 20% each. I think Gonzaga will be in the top 15 next year and whatever happens in the NCAA...happens.....after all, Ucon won it....

It will be fun to see how it all turns out....


So you believe one of the three bigs will bail? News to us, please share. And ditch the snark.

thegloriousgoateeofKP
06-16-2015, 01:20 PM
It is always 5 somewhere, but it is too early to be drinking on the west coast. Common sense tells me that next years team won't be anywhere near as good as this years team. I will be surprised if the three amigos all return and amazed if they improve by 20% each. I think Gonzaga will be in the top 15 next year and whatever happens in the NCAA...happens.....after all, Ucon won it....

It will be fun to see how it all turns out....

The formula for reaching the Final Four/winning a championship:

1/Make the Tournament a bunch.
2. Hope to get a great draw and really good luck.

It's that simple. The Tourney is a 40-minute sample size, susceptible to crazy luck. GU is doing it right...keep spinning the roulette wheel, eventually our number will come up.

cjm720
06-16-2015, 01:20 PM
Take the light from under the bushel. Common sense tells you next years team will be marginally better at least than last years. If just the three amigos improve 20 percent each, that's compelling. KP and GB have had their time and they were talented, if limited guards. On paper, the gaggle of Perks, SM, Alberts and EM can be better, marginally if not more. OTOH, when you talk FF we can all agree so much of it is the draw and luck. But GU is a top ten next year, and perhaps the year after, and thus is FF ready for the foreseeable future.

yup and made me think that the youngins might have an advantage in that there is less scout film on them for teams to take away strengths, etc.

The next few years is going to be a blast....#trendingup #gozags

bartruff1
06-16-2015, 01:28 PM
So you believe one of the three bigs will bail? News to us, please share.

I will be surprised if both the euros return....I am surprised that KW did.....or at least said he intended to come back.

Yes, I know they have all said they will return...but....people change their minds and especially young men do....Of course I am repeating myself...old people do that you know.

Life is all about projecting.

MDABE80
06-16-2015, 01:35 PM
" Medcalf's teams (Iowa State, Oklahoma, Cal or Gonzaga) in the Final Four next season."<------------not!

cggonzaga
06-16-2015, 01:52 PM
It makes me laugh how much people have fallen off the Silas Melson bandwagon. Just because a freshman doesn't dominate his freshman year he must not be that good right? As great as KP and GB were, we've never had as talented guards as Josh Perkins and Silas Melson. Unlike many GU guards of the past, these two have size, athleticism, smarts and desire. They're really almost the total package for 1-2 guards. I'm in the camp that the potential is there to be even better next year. I'm a homer but I don't care, Kyle Wiltjer will be the national player of the year next year. A big reason I believe this is Josh Perkins. Kyle will have to do less work because Josh can create and open things up. I (many of us) say it every year but I can't wait until next season!

DukeSilver
06-16-2015, 02:34 PM
I'm sure this has been pointed out elsewhere, but it bears repeating ... Even if you don't believe that this year's squad is as talented, overall, as the '14-'15 Zags, that isn't the operative question when attempting to predict tournament success. The important question is where this year's Zags will sit among the CBB field THIS YEAR - and if there's one thing that most CBB analysts agree on, it's that 14'-15' > 15'-16' in terms of the overall quality of teams in competition.

So, even if the Zags take a slight step back (on an absolute scale) they may still be primed for a FF run against a weaker field.

Zagdawg
06-16-2015, 03:07 PM
Really like the opportunity for our guys to get two early round dance games at home (in Spokane) --it can work wonders with getting the first tourney jitters taken care of for some of our younger guards.

thegloriousgoateeofKP
06-16-2015, 03:39 PM
Really like the opportunity for our guys to get two early round dance games at home (in Spokane) --it can work wonders with getting the first tourney jitters taken care of for some of our younger guards.

Agreed. It can be hard to get up for the mid-January game against USF or SCU or whoever when only the difference between a 1 and a 2, or a 7 and an 8 seed is at stake. But this year, we absolutely need to lock up a spot in Spokane. No bad losses.

Gonzdb8
06-16-2015, 03:46 PM
I will be surprised if both the euros return....I am surprised that KW did.....or at least said he intended to come back.

Yes, I know they have all said they will return...but....people change their minds and especially young men do....Of course I am repeating myself...old people do that you know.

Life is all about projecting.

i had to check the dates on these posts to make sure these weren't from april/may. why would you be surprised if all three returned? they've all come out and ended speculation earlier this summer by saying they'd be back. at this point i think we'd all be much more surprised to hear that any of them were NOT returning . if this is just a hunch you have because in your life experience "people change their minds" then i think you're going to be a very surprised because they're coming back. unless of course you've got some amazing sources that you're just not sharing, but somehow i'm doubting thats the case.

Reborn
06-16-2015, 04:17 PM
I think that to make the final 4 a team must have a potential first team All-American-Player of the Year guy on their team. Gonzaga has that in Kyle Wiltjer. With Kevin gone the team really will look to Kyle to finish games, and I believe he will be better at it then Kevin. Kyle was outstanding against Duke on offense. This guy can score in many ways. I think Gonzaga could be much like Kentucky was last year with two players above 7'0" and two 6' 10" players. PK is going to also be a force next year as will Sabonis. And now we add Edwards to the mix. And we have NO idea how good he's going to be. Come on fans. You GOT TO BE excited about this team.

Coach Crazy
06-16-2015, 04:31 PM
1. I would have a hard time believing that any number or our 3 returning big's would have a flat season.

2. I'm not quite sure on the approach to assessing KD? First, BW was a role player. Being a "role player" doesn't mean that you can't and/or won't have a huge impact. The question is: Can KD continue to be an efficient role player with more minutes. If he can, he'll be either at BW's production or better.

3. With the way that college basketball tends to run, these days, the amount of experience you have is not as important as it used to be. The biggest reasons for needed time are physical maturity and/or you just aren't good enough, yet. Freshman are winning titles.

As has already been pointed out, we don't really have a Duke or Kentucky from last season, in the field (At least not that we know of). I can totally see an EE, again. FF will come down to how Silas and Bryan contribute. More than anything, they just need to avoid being replacement level.

bartruff1
06-16-2015, 04:38 PM
i had to check the dates on these posts to make sure these weren't from april/may. why would you be surprised if all three returned? they've all come out and ended speculation earlier this summer by saying they'd be back. at this point i think we'd all be much more surprised to hear that any of them were NOT returning . if this is just a hunch you have because in your life experience "people change their minds" then i think you're going to be a very surprised because they're coming back. unless of course you've got some amazing sources that you're just not sharing, but somehow i'm doubting thats the case.

I have no inside information ...like I said, I am just projecting....I have been to Malaga in the winter and to Spokane in the winter....if it was me, I would play in Europe for big bucks rather than play in Spokane for meal tickets ... I don't know what he is going to do...not at all...


That's all.

zagsfanforlife
06-16-2015, 05:27 PM
I have no inside information ...like I said, I am just projecting....I have been to Malaga in the winter and to Spokane in the winter....if it was me, I would play in Europe for big bucks rather than play in Spokane for meal tickets ... I don't know what he is going to do...not at all...


That's all.

What are you even talking about? lol.

All three have already stated they are coming back...

MDABE80
06-16-2015, 05:30 PM
Well yes. There's that................;) lolol

zag67
06-16-2015, 06:21 PM
I also think that we will make a run to the final four this year and next year.

Reasons for this year:

1. Guard play 1/2/3: We have Melson, Perkins, and Dranginis. With a great set of minutes for McClellan and Alberts. This team "looks" a lot better at defense than last year. We have speed, quick hands, and height. We also have depth. After Perkins, I do not think that it matters who the other two starters are. They all have potential to carry this team in different ways. Fouls should not hurt us as much as last year.

2.Front line: We have the fearsome threesome. Karnowski, Sabonis and Wiltjer. Then we have Edwards that gives us another solid 7'1" center with good hands and footwork. This means that we should not have any games where we are in foul trouble with our frontline.

Not too many (if any) top 10 teams have as much experience at every position as we do. They do not have the potential depth that we have at all positions. Now we need to grow our experience with our young guards. But we do have McClellan who has started for two teams and Dranginis that have major minutes in many games during the last three years. Their job is to be leaders, give us solid minutes at both ends of the court, and show the younger guards how to control the game.

On the frontline, we have Wiltjer who has played on a national championship team, was 6th man of the year in the SEC and won national honors last year. We have Karnowski who has been a beast and has improved in each year so far. I have to believe that he will be even better next year. Then we have Sabonis that led the nation in shooting percentage for most of the year, is a great rebounder, and also a super passer. This year I think that we will see the 10 to 15 foot shot added to his shooting. Also I think that the coaches will be working to improve his defense and not get many of his weak fouls. To back Karnowski, we have Edwards and we therefore get to see another big after a year as a redshirt in the GU system.

I will wait and do next year at a later time. But we will lose a few (Dranginis, Wiltjer, and McClellan)but we gain Collins, Nigel and Williams plus whoever we get between now and next year.

See ya all in Vegas.

jazzdelmar
06-16-2015, 06:25 PM
I think that to make the final 4 a team must have a potential first team All-American-Player of the Year guy on their team. Gonzaga has that in Kyle Wiltjer. With Kevin gone the team really will look to Kyle to finish games, and I believe he will be better at it then Kevin. Kyle was outstanding against Duke on offense. This guy can score in many ways. I think Gonzaga could be much like Kentucky was last year with two players above 7'0" and two 6' 10" players. PK is going to also be a force next year as will Sabonis. And now we add Edwards to the mix. And we have NO idea how good he's going to be. Come on fans. You GOT TO BE excited about this team.


Well said, Bornie. And in a relatively small number of words. :)

jazzdelmar
06-16-2015, 06:26 PM
Well yes. There's that................;) lolol

Malaga-envy?

CdAZagFan
06-16-2015, 08:09 PM
I am just going to be real here:

1. Our opportunity for a Final Four was last year. Can we get lucky and hit the jackpot and go this year? Sure its always possible, especially with the frontcourt and perkins like we have. Its not dissing this upcoming season, Wiltjer can always catch fire, and the development of Melson could be insane who knows. But I am not seeing it.

2. Perkins is the future of the Zags backcourt. I see a Final Four chance in 2017, we can be back in the Elite Eight or Sweet Sixteen next year possibly (which opens the door)

3. Opinions are welcomed, and I love dreaming about it. Hope I am wrong.

4. I don't see any of Medcalf's teams (Iowa State, Oklahoma, Cal or Gonzaga) in the Final Four next season.

Agree with everything here. That being said, there's always a possibility. I will just be enjoying next season one game at a time...

bigblahla
06-16-2015, 10:38 PM
I will be surprised if both the euros return....I am surprised that KW did.....or at least said he intended to come back.

Yes, I know they have all said they will return...but....people change their minds and especially young men do....Of course I am repeating myself...old people do that you know.

Life is all about projecting.

Get ready for a big surprise bart cause they'll all be back....would be silly not to....IMO by March this Gonzaga TEAM will be very formidable....everyone across the country knows the strength is the front court. What no one knows is how will the new back court produce except for maybe Coach and staff.....Gonzaga wins the WCC & WCC Tournament......and by "Dance" time a very well oiled athletic basketball machine is going to impose its will on every team placed in front of them.....How can I believe anything different?

Go!! Zags!!!

bartruff1
06-17-2015, 04:58 AM
That wouldn't be a big surprise to me...it would be a pleasant surprise....just like Metcalf,you can believe whatever you want...

I would expect the Final Four to be Kentucky, Duke, Arizona and (as usual) Michigan State.

IMHO the teams that often underachieve are Kansas and North Carolina. With the "talent" and " athletes" he has, Roy Williams should cut off a finger every year he fails to make the FF.

amaronizag
06-17-2015, 05:23 AM
We all know what talented bigs we have...best in the Country and plenty of depth. Josh Perkins is the real deal for all of those who forgot what he looked like on tape in his HS days. He's an incredible passer and play maker. He will bounce passes off of peoples chest because they aren't quick enough to catch them (already has), and he will throw a lot of passes away, but he will tighten up his handles as he matures. The playing experience and BENCH experience he got last year was valuable. BUT I watched him on TV in the HS summer leagues also and saw Mudiay blow right by him. Josh played with the best talent in his age group and hung with them in many respects. His defense isn't top tier like Duke's guards last year, but he will improve and be just fine guarding that position. He has incredible potential and his offense will really be fun to watch. Draino is Mr Hustle on defense, gets more deflections than any Zag, and can really shoot as well. All he lacks is confidence and the green light. I don't think he can slash or create as well as BW did last year, but given the confidence and green light, who knows. Few may ask him to play that role. We haven't seen McClellan be called upon to play that slashing role either. Unsure of his ability in that respect. Alberts has played with the team and worked on his game for a full year. He knows the system and is ready to jump into the lineup and go, go , go. Melson can get it done on offense and defense given the floor time. He has all of Bell's skill set with more athleticism. Fans may be a little nervous about the back court, but I doubt Few is worried at all, I know I'm not.

Baldwinzag
06-17-2015, 06:07 AM
We all know what talented bigs we have...best in the Country and plenty of depth. Josh Perkins is the real deal for all of those who forgot what he looked like on tape in his HS days. He's an incredible passer and play maker. He will bounce passes off of peoples chest because they aren't quick enough to catch them (already has), and he will throw a lot of passes away, but he will tighten up his handles as he matures. The playing experience and BENCH experience he got last year was valuable. BUT I watched him on TV in the HS summer leagues also and saw Mudiay blow right by him. Josh played with the best talent in his age group and hung with them in many respects. His defense isn't top tier like Duke's guards last year, but he will improve and be just fine guarding that position. He has incredible potential and his offense will really be fun to watch. Draino is Mr Hustle on defense, gets more deflections than any Zag, and can really shoot as well. All he lacks is confidence and the green light. I don't think he can slash or create as well as BW did last year, but given the confidence and green light, who knows. Few may ask him to play that role. We haven't seen McClellan be called upon to play that slashing role either. Unsure of his ability in that respect. Alberts has played with the team and worked on his game for a full year. He knows the system and is ready to jump into the lineup and go, go , go. Melson can get it done on offense and defense given the floor time. He has all of Bell's skill set with more athleticism. Fans may be a little nervous about the back court, but I doubt Few is worried at all, I know I'm not.

a honest, straight-forward, encompassing post. thanks.

Reborn
06-17-2015, 06:28 AM
We all know what talented bigs we have...best in the Country and plenty of depth. Josh Perkins is the real deal for all of those who forgot what he looked like on tape in his HS days. He's an incredible passer and play maker. He will bounce passes off of peoples chest because they aren't quick enough to catch them (already has), and he will throw a lot of passes away, but he will tighten up his handles as he matures. The playing experience and BENCH experience he got last year was valuable. BUT I watched him on TV in the HS summer leagues also and saw Mudiay blow right by him. Josh played with the best talent in his age group and hung with them in many respects. His defense isn't top tier like Duke's guards last year, but he will improve and be just fine guarding that position. He has incredible potential and his offense will really be fun to watch. Draino is Mr Hustle on defense, gets more deflections than any Zag, and can really shoot as well. All he lacks is confidence and the green light. I don't think he can slash or create as well as BW did last year, but given the confidence and green light, who knows. Few may ask him to play that role. We haven't seen McClellan be called upon to play that slashing role either. Unsure of his ability in that respect. Alberts has played with the team and worked on his game for a full year. He knows the system and is ready to jump into the lineup and go, go , go. Melson can get it done on offense and defense given the floor time. He has all of Bell's skill set with more athleticism. Fans may be a little nervous about the back court, but I doubt Few is worried at all, I know I'm not.

I agree. I great post. Thanks!

Alum08
06-17-2015, 08:33 AM
I have no inside information ...like I said, I am just projecting....I have been to Malaga in the winter and to Spokane in the winter....if it was me, I would play in Europe for big bucks rather than play in Spokane for meal tickets ... I don't know what he is going to do...not at all...


That's all.

I don't mean to be disrespectful, but put down the keyboard grandpa. It's you saying "I don't know what he is going to do" versus the actual player saying "I am playing for the Zags."

We should be discussing the prospects of next season and not reminiscing about discussions that were relevant 2 or 3 months ago.

Your opinions on weather and salary implications are nice but completely irrelevant. I would expect you've learned that the "grass is always greener" at your age.

sittingon50
06-17-2015, 09:52 AM
I don't mean to be disrespectful, but put down the keyboard grandpa. It's you saying "I don't know what he is going to do" versus the actual player saying "I am playing for the Zags."

We should be discussing the prospects of next season and not reminiscing about discussions that were relevant 2 or 3 months ago.

Your opinions on weather and salary implications are nice but completely irrelevant. I would expect you've learned that the "grass is always greener" at your age.

You were.

ProjectMKUltra5
06-17-2015, 10:16 AM
You were.

Sometimes that's all you can do when confronted with an asinine opinion

MDABE80
06-17-2015, 10:42 AM
Yes it's pretty disrespectful. Honor others' opinions. It own't hurt a valuable contributor's feelings and (as important) you won't look like an ahole.

BULLDOG#1
06-17-2015, 11:26 AM
we've never had as talented guards as Josh Perkins and Silas Melson.

Sorry, but that is just nonsense.

IowaSERE
06-17-2015, 11:37 AM
Sorry, but that is just nonsense.

Have we ever had more highly touted guards? Higher rated out of HS?

gonzagafan62
06-17-2015, 11:49 AM
Have we ever had more highly touted guards? Higher rated out of HS?

Perkins was a 5 star (4 after going to Huntington) so that's pretty awesome. Melson was only a three i think so... I'm not sure if that puts it in the best category of guards coming out of HS or not. I would have to say so

IowaSERE
06-17-2015, 11:59 AM
Melson comes in as highly touted as GBJ IMO. Depending on where you look, GBJ may have been slightly higher ranked. Melson was POY for Oregon, Bell POY for WA. Seeing as how Bell averaged 9.65 points over his career, I don't see much of a drop off with Melson. His overall value could be much higher in the long run.

Perkins is one of the highest rated recruits that we have signed out of HS, if not the highest. Its hard to say where Pangos would have been ranked if he played in the states, but I doubt it would have been higher than Perkins.

Alum08
06-17-2015, 12:01 PM
Yes it's pretty disrespectful. Honor others' opinions. It own't hurt a valuable contributor's feelings and (as important) you won't look like an ahole.

There was nothing about his post that could be deemed a valuable contribution. Not every opinion is worth considering, especially when it only served to derail a perfectly good thread about the upcoming season. He was basically insinuating that Gonzaga and Spokane are not worthy of keeping good players since they cannot compete with the allures of the Spanish seaboard. Ridiculous.

I feel as though a lot of older keyboard warriors would do well to consider what they type instead of feeling privileged by age. Visit any local news site around the country and read the comments by our nation's retirement-class. It's downright embarrassing and more reminiscent of the critical thinking skills of 3rd-graders than of the wise sages they believe themselves to be. This is one example.


Perkins was a 5 star (4 after going to Huntington) so that's pretty awesome. Melson was only a three i think so... I'm not sure if that puts it in the best category of guards coming out of HS or not. I would have to say so

IIRC, Perkins is only second to Daye in our recruiting history?

Shanachie
06-17-2015, 12:04 PM
A few observations.

First, I see people have quickly adjusted from "The tournament is a crapshoot" to the expectation that another Elite 8 or a Final 4 is a given next year. It's not that easy, even if the team is good.

Second, I think the group of guards could be really good, and I'm excited to watch them play. But I also think people are undervaluing KP, GBJ, and even BW to an extent. Those three had 279 starts among them entering last year. EM, KD, SM, and JP have 37. It's not every year that you lose 3 starters, let alone three 4-year starters. It seems a tad optimistic to me to think that the Zags won't miss a beat, despite the talent of the guards that remain.

Third, and this is directly related to the previous point, last year's team had amazing chemistry right from the beginning, despite the addition of BW, KW, and DS, none of whom had played for the Zags before. I'm not assuming that next year's team will be able to replicate that right from Day 1, since JP and SM have not had any game time together. (Though I love KD's game and think he will be a steadying influence along with the bigs.)

What all of this says to me is that the Zags will probably show flashes of brilliance, but also probably some stretches that frustrate us, especially early in the year. I think they will lose a few more than last year, and because of that, get a worse seed. That means tougher matchups in the tournament, and even if they have worked things out and are playing great by that time, nothing is a given.

Alum08
06-17-2015, 12:13 PM
What all of this says to me is that the Zags will probably show flashes of brilliance, but also probably some stretches that frustrate us, especially early in the year. I think they will lose a few more than last year, and because of that, get a worse seed. That means tougher matchups in the tournament, and even if they have worked things out and are playing great by that time, nothing is a given.

I agree completely. I might add that without the senior backcourt, Few will have much more freedom to bench underperforming guards. I feel that would have been very beneficial at times last year (and in previous years) in regards to certain players.

jazzdelmar
06-17-2015, 12:25 PM
Yes it's pretty disrespectful. Honor others' opinions. It own't hurt a valuable contributor's feelings and (as important) you won't look like an ahole.

I think we have a generation gap, perhaps gulch, on this here board, Dock.

jazzdelmar
06-17-2015, 12:25 PM
Sorry, but that is just nonsense.

Agree...I can think of at least two, perhaps three, earlier GU pairs they would be very hard pressed to match....

MDABE80
06-17-2015, 12:28 PM
There was nothing about his post that could be deemed a valuable contribution. Not every opinion is worth considering, especially when it only served to derail a perfectly good thread about the upcoming season. He was basically insinuating that Gonzaga and Spokane are not worthy of keeping good players since they cannot compete with the allures of the Spanish seaboard. Ridiculous.

I feel as though a lot of older keyboard warriors would do well to consider what they type instead of feeling privileged by age. Visit any local news site around the country and read the comments by our nation's retirement-class. It's downright embarrassing and more reminiscent of the critical thinking skills of 3rd-graders than of the wise sages they believe themselves to be. This is one example.



IIRC, Perkins is only second to Daye in our recruiting history?

Young fella, it's not your place to "deem" anything. You'll soon see that. Further though, playing the "age" card with guys who've been on this board since the 90's likely will not fly very well. BUT suit yourself........welcome to the board. Best wishes.

Zagdawg
06-17-2015, 12:45 PM
Here is a good opinion on the subject:

"Age and experience may walk hand in hand but wisdom holds its own according to how one applies lessons you have learned in life.
I know some old people whom I would never go for advice on anything. Yet there are some even younger than myself on whom I can rely on for good advice.
Wisdom does not flutter and sit on our shoulders as we grow older. Some of us just never learn to apply the lessons that we have learned in life. Some die young and wise and some die old and foolish. Older persons can be a bit rude in their assumptions that they know more than someone else because they are older. That in itself shows lack of wisdom.
I learn more and more everyday when I listen to my six year old nephew because as he learns the lessons this life has to offer and he passes on lessons to me that I just did not learn as a youngster the first time through. Furthermore to bash him and cause him to feel as if he knows nothing is a good way helping him to develop poor self esteem if that is my aim."

Overall everyone has an opinion --some you will agree with and some you may not.....let's not make the old/young folks feel bad just because you may not agree with them.

webspinnre
06-17-2015, 12:48 PM
I don't mean to be disrespectful, but put down the keyboard grandpa.

Your opinions on weather and salary implications are nice but completely irrelevant. I would expect you've learned that the "grass is always greener" at your age.

Gosh, I can't imagine why people would react to a post like this negatively /sarcasm

You're welcome to disagree with folks on this board, you aren't welcome to call them names/imply that because they're older their beliefs are entirely wrong.

zagsfanforlife
06-17-2015, 12:48 PM
Young fella, it's not your place to "deem" anything. You'll soon see that. Further though, playing the "age" card with guys who've been on this board since the 90's likely will not fly very well. BUT suit yourself........welcome to the board. Best wishes.

Regardless if you deem it disrespectful or not, valuable or not, it was a pretty silly opinion to state that not all three of the big men will be back, when all three have already announced they are coming. Thats the equivalent to me saying "so and so will probably transfer". A claim with zero basis whatsoever, that just adds unneeded speculation to the board.

ProjectMKUltra5
06-17-2015, 12:57 PM
I agree with the overall sentiment that this group of guards is the best we've ever brought in (I'm referring to Perkins, Melson, and Alberts) but I wouldn't say they're the most highly touted out of HS as a group. The 2011 class that brought in Bell, Pangos, and Dranginis was rated just as high as the 2014 class.

Per the 247 composite

2011
Gary Bell Jr: 4* rated 96
Kevin Pangos: 3* rated 87
Kyle Dranginis: 3* rated 87

2014
Josh Perkins: 4* rated 97
Silas Melson: 3* rated 86
Bryan Alberts: 3* rated 82

I will say, and I think this is a better indicator of player talent, the 2014 group all had offers from some big time programs whereas the 2011 group seemed to attract a lower caliber school. Perkins literally could have gone wherever he wanted and turned down the likes of Kansas, Arizona, UCONN, Syracuse, Stanford, Baylor, and a late push by UK. Alberts was drawing all sorts of attention but injuries forced some teams to back off and Melson could have gone anywhere in the NW. 2011 class can't match the kind of attention the 2014 has had despite being rated just as high imo.

seacatfan
06-17-2015, 01:02 PM
Regarding potential # of losses and seed in the Tourney, it looks like the OOC might be better this year than last year, so the Zags might have a little more wiggle room. If they do struggle a bit with chemistry early in the season, they have time to get in synch before WCC play starts so they can avoid any disastrous losses to bad conference foes. Of course it would be helpful if they come out of the gate firing on all cylinders and pick up some big wins against OOC opponents.


About Melson, I didn't come close to buying into the hype last year, but it seems like there's been maybe some backlash because expectations were too high? I certainly haven't written him off as a lost cause. He showed some flashes last year, had a few double figure scoring games. He obviously won't replace Bell's experience, may not be as good of a defender, but it shouldn't be hard to replace 8 points per game and extremely streaky shooting with long cold stretches. And it seemed like late in the year Few trusted Dranginis more than Wesley, I don't think BW graduating is going to be a serious hole to fill either.

I'm also really excited about Perkins' potential. He's not Pangos, he's a different type of player. It's his time now and I think we're going to enjoy the ride.

cjm720
06-17-2015, 01:03 PM
There was nothing about his post that could be deemed a valuable contribution. Not every opinion is worth considering, especially when it only served to derail a perfectly good thread about the upcoming season. He was basically insinuating that Gonzaga and Spokane are not worthy of keeping good players since they cannot compete with the allures of the Spanish seaboard. Ridiculous.

I feel as though a lot of older keyboard warriors would do well to consider what they type instead of feeling privileged by age. Visit any local news site around the country and read the comments by our nation's retirement-class. It's downright embarrassing and more reminiscent of the critical thinking skills of 3rd-graders than of the wise sages they believe themselves to be. This is one example.



IIRC, Perkins is only second to Daye in our recruiting history?

Easy hiding behind that key board isn't it? You don't get it so, I'm not going to bother.

Alum08
06-17-2015, 01:24 PM
Gosh, I can't imagine why people would react to a post like this negatively /sarcasm

You're welcome to disagree with folks on this board, you aren't welcome to call them names/imply that because they're older their beliefs are entirely wrong.

I never said that. I said that in this particular case his 'beliefs' (I hate that term) are wrong. I'm sure he has many other valid opinions that are more firmly rooted in reality.

The reason I was blunt is because these types of rumors are not good for the players, program, fans, or university. And then to insinuate that Spokane is somehow unappealing to our players is downright disrespectful. As if he knows what Sabonis, Karno, and Wiltjer are seeking in life. That's the type of 'I know better than you' attitude prevalent in the older generation that's been made more readily apparent by the adoption of internet forums as their soapboxes.

sittingon50
06-17-2015, 01:24 PM
There was nothing about his post that could be deemed a valuable contribution. Not every opinion is worth considering, especially when it only served to derail a perfectly good thread about the upcoming season. He was basically insinuating that Gonzaga and Spokane are not worthy of keeping good players since they cannot compete with the allures of the Spanish seaboard. Ridiculous.

I feel as though a lot of older keyboard warriors would do well to consider what they type instead of feeling privileged by age. Visit any local news site around the country and read the comments by our nation's retirement-class. It's downright embarrassing and more reminiscent of the critical thinking skills of 3rd-graders than of the wise sages they believe themselves to be. This is one example.



IIRC, Perkins is only second to Daye in our recruiting history?

Thanks for your input, Alum. As part of the keyboard warrior class I am a bit distressed to learn that my critical thinking skills have begun to disappear (along with my hair). I guess all that I have to look forward to now is when the "state" sends me that inevitable notice to report down to the soylent green plant.

In the interim I guess I'll just have to be comforted by the fact that at least my olfactory organ still outperforms a youngster such as you, as I can tell that my #### does indeed stink.

(I hope it goes without saying that no disrespect is intended)

Alum08
06-17-2015, 01:26 PM
Thanks for your input, Alum. As part of the keyboard warrior class I am a bit distressed to learn that my critical thinking skills have begun to disappear (along with my hair). I guess all that I have to look forward to now is when the "state" sends me that inevitable notice to report down to the soylent green plant.

In the interim I guess I'll just have to be comforted by the fact that at least my olfactory organ still outperforms a youngster such as you, as I can tell that my #### does indeed stink.

(I hope it goes without saying that no disrespect is intended)

Oh my #### stinks too, I just prefer to keep it to myself instead of starting needless rumors.

DukeSilver
06-17-2015, 02:47 PM
http://images.rapgenius.com/91fd1692f61dc246f35d92d64f056a8b.550x280x1.jpg


It was ridiculous and inappropriate to insinuate that, contrary to their previous statements, any of GU's current players would not be returning to Spokane next year. It was also ridiculous and inappropriate to insinuate that such a statement is somehow indicative of a poster's age.

There. Are we done now?

Birddog
06-17-2015, 02:49 PM
It must be mating season

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LobtqbavZck

DixieZag
06-17-2015, 02:59 PM
Oh my #### stinks too, I just prefer to keep it to myself instead of starting needless rumors.

I am not sure why I'm jumping in on this, but, chosoe to ignore if you want.

As one who has, pound for pound, said about as much ridiculous things here as anyone, let me say that one's opinion is taken far more seriously, to say nothing about appreciated, when it is expressed in terms such as "I don't agree, b/c _ _ _ _ _ , and we also have to consider _ _ _ _ " and then let others consider your point. You might be right, you might be wrong. The one and only thing that is certain is that age has nothing to do with anything, nor does one person's own self-assuredness.

You say "you prefer to keep it to [yourself]" and then let fly with a sweeping generalization regarding generation. That's the opposite of keeping it to yourself, it getting it out in one of the most irrelevant ways.

Disagree. That's good. You'll find lots of good disagreement. Ask me who I think should play the 3, 4, 5 this year - without disagreement, it becomes an echo chamber. But disagree based upon what is said, not who said it, and not based on an irrelevant categorization.

That is the way to contribute, which is what we all want. Welcome to the board. I hope you enjoy participating.

flytiezag
06-17-2015, 03:15 PM
Thank goodness we have players and coaches that respect each other and there feeling.We on this board should act like a team disagree with respect have opinions ideas thoughts and value every ones input.Treat others like you would want to be treated it is the Golden Rule.We can disagree with grace.

Zagceo
06-17-2015, 04:09 PM
Welcome Alum08……fresh blood always livens up a party!

TheZagPhish
06-17-2015, 04:16 PM
http://cl.ly/bf9N/jock-strap-kid.jpg

Seems like a fine place to leave this...

Reborn
06-17-2015, 06:25 PM
Welcome Alum08……fresh blood always livens up a party!

I'd like to welcome you too. There is always a place for anyone here. As a 67 year old, I'd have to say that what I hate being called the most is grand pa, by young people who say it to hurt you or disrespect you. Age is not important to me. But what comes out of your mouth is. I like different opinions, and do appreciate them being written with a little respect. I have made many enemies here because how I have said things at times, and yet I am still here and still trying to be accepted by this community of Gonzaga basketball lovers, including you Alum08. I also feel it's even more disrespectful for an older member of this board who is a doctor to call you an ahole. But once you are here you will learn who is who, and sometimes even doctors who are older make completed fools of themselves. I really enjoy dissent, and even a good fight at times. I was raised to be a fighter, so it's a part of me. I have called others names around here a few times too, but not the one doc used, so I'm no saint believe me. Just keep coming and keep trying, and keep believe you have the freedom of speech around here, and I will fight to keep the board that way. But watch out for name calling, it will really stir up emotions here....and we can all use a little more respect around here sometimes, including me (everyone knows that though). hahahahahahah OK? Take 'er easy and "tap 'er light."Alum08.

MDABE80
06-17-2015, 06:38 PM
I didn't call Alum an ahole. I said he might L@@K like one. :)

Birddog
06-17-2015, 06:57 PM
You guys keep callin' each other names and I'll sic the Freeze on ya'. They don't take crap from anybody.
http://a.abcnews.com/images/Lifestyle/ht_frozen_baseball_kb_150617_16x9_992.jpg

zag buddy
06-17-2015, 07:54 PM
If everyone would ignore dumb comments (some from me) the dumb comments would disappear.

MTZag03
06-17-2015, 07:54 PM
The cold never bothered me anyway!

My two cents on the recent hijack : it's just stupid to go after other posters. There are people like myself who post from their phone at work during slight downtimes for fun. For fun. We don't have to have crazy insight and connections. We just enjoy the community. So please, join the community and understand that not every post needs to be groundbreaking. None of my posts have ever been, but I do love talking to everyone here. It's entertainment with a few nuggets from some actually connected people.

Mantua
06-17-2015, 10:00 PM
The cold never bothered me anyway!

My two cents on the recent hijack : it's just stupid to go after other posters. There are people like myself who post from their phone at work during slight downtimes for fun. For fun. We don't have to have crazy insight and connections. We just enjoy the community. So please, join the community and understand that not every post needs to be groundbreaking. None of my posts have ever been, but I do love talking to everyone here. It's entertainment with a few nuggets from some actually connected people.

Nice, MT!

I don't feel the need to say much during the summer when there is so much sheer speculation, but I am excited to see every player play next season. It's fun to see how each of them has grown. There are always fun surprises. After watching the sad gladiators of Cleveland go down to the young and healthy glorious Warriors, I need to take a break from basketball fandom...at least until Draft Day.

23zagmd
06-18-2015, 07:26 AM
The voice of reason! I love the upgrade athletically we will be getting at the 1,2, and 3 and the depth there. Our lack of another ball handler/person to get us in our offense killed us in the Duke game and you could really see the toll that all the ball handling Kevin did caused on his shooting down the stretch.

We will have the best 4 front court players as a group in the country. Maybe the best lane stuffer and rim defender. The best 6th man, who may be an AA by the end of it. And the best stretch 4 in KW. Plus, no one is even talking about the progress he may make with another year with our strength trainer.

I still think the issue for this team is going to be 3 pt shooting. Outside of KW we have a bunch of unproven 3 pt shooters and the guys that we all think should be solid at that position just don't shoot enough of them.

In the end, my prediction is that this team is more talented, could be better, and could easily get to the FF. Will it? is the $$$$ question.

GrizZAG
06-18-2015, 09:14 AM
Hey "08", forget sales as a career :)