PDA

View Full Version : Duke gifted dubious Final Four berth by referee bias



willandi
03-30-2015, 05:35 PM
http://houston.culturemap.com/news/sports/03-29-15-duke-gifted-dubious-final-four-berth-by-referee-bias-gonzaga-choke-houston-denied-true-march-madness/

gonzagafan62
03-30-2015, 05:44 PM
It's true! But I'll make no excuses. We had a chance late still and missed it. Never give that team new life. We did. They were slightly better than us. I won't say they were much better but in that day they were. It was a good game. No shame here.

Birddog
03-30-2015, 06:03 PM
I don't think he cares much for Dook or K.

Ekrub
03-30-2015, 06:16 PM
Eh, I only saw one BAD call all game and that was from a ref who was out of position to see the ball go off the Duke player come running from the other side of the floor to give the ball to Duke. Just horrible and a momentum killer.

The other one I thought that was questionable was karnowski going straight up and getting a foul called on him

Birddog
03-30-2015, 06:20 PM
Karno's two fouls were for bad breath compared to the sh!t Okafor was getting away with. The most egregious non call of the game was early in the 1st after Bell was picked and the Dook guard reached out and held him with both hands to keep him from getting back.

willandi
03-30-2015, 06:41 PM
The Zags had their chances. They could have won, but we'll never know.

What I saw was Duke scratching and clawing, shoving and grabbing, and it being OK but the Zags, especially Karno, called for ticky-tack stuff.

Duke won the game. I accept that. The final score said so, but the outcome was affected by the officiating. You can never make me believe anything different. It would have been nice to see the game called evenly, that's all.

Rangerzag
03-30-2015, 07:03 PM
The way the day was going was shown early with the statue of liberty stroll through the lane with no call.

Plain and simple the Zags needed to be able to unleash an effective version of their three point game.
They just could not get it going. All the talk about the Houston arena being the problem noted, the Zags needed their long game to win. I do not know the solution, but that is what the problem was. Zags make three point shots and they win that game. Case closed. If Dukes cheerleaders could come on the floor to enhance the zebras the Zags win if they could get the game behind the arc on track.

GeorgiaZagFan
03-30-2015, 09:44 PM
The way the day was going was shown early with the statue of liberty stroll through the lane with no call.

Plain and simple the Zags needed to be able to unleash an effective version of their three point game.
They just could not get it going. All the talk about the Houston arena being the problem noted, the Zags needed their long game to win. I do not know the solution, but that is what the problem was. Zags make three point shots and they win that game. Case closed. If Dukes cheerleaders could come on the floor to enhance the zebras the Zags win if they could get the game behind the arc on track.

I feel the ONLY reason Duke won was they adjusted to that gym and the Zags did not. Zags just couldn't get it going from outside. I wonder if playing so many games in those little gyms of the WCC made it harder to make that adjustment

WallaWallaZag
03-30-2015, 10:18 PM
I feel the ONLY reason Duke won was they adjusted to that gym and the Zags did not. Zags just couldn't get it going from outside. I wonder if playing so many games in those little gyms of the WCC made it harder to make that adjustment

i think i posed the same question in another thread...duke's two primary guards actually didn't shoot well from deep either, but the difference is that pangos and bell are more one dimensional in that their game is dependent on the long ball...duke's guards can penetrate and score when the outside shot is off.

sittingon50
03-30-2015, 10:22 PM
Didn't care for the article. Zags don't need anyone without any skin in the game whining about the officiating. I do take umbrage with the author stating that GU choked. Don't see any of the 9 posts so far questioning that.

tyko
03-30-2015, 10:46 PM
Duke was better. They won.
This dude's obvious agenda against Duke and Coach K is a slap in the face to the Duke players who gave their all to beat a great GU team to make the Final Four. I don't think GU choked. I think Duke was the better team. That's pretty much my take on it.

DixieZag
03-30-2015, 11:05 PM
Duke was the better team on Sunday, maybe most days. We had chances to win, and it wasn't our day.

None of that means that the officiating didn't impact the game negatively against us.

Utah has an All-American, 3 fouls before half.

We have 2 potential NBA players, 2 and 3 fouls before half - some of them very gentle.

I noticed the announcers expressly state that 2 called fouls on us were "bad" and the out of bounds call from the furthest official - all the 'expressed bad calls" went against us.

When you see all the above put together, it's not a bug, it's a feature.

Still coulda' beaten them. But many here knew long before the game that Coach K would get the favorable calls.

TexasZagFan
03-31-2015, 04:28 AM
Duke was better. They won.
This dude's obvious agenda against Duke and Coach K is a slap in the face to the Duke players who gave their all to beat a great GU team to make the Final Four. I don't think GU choked. I think Duke was the better team. That's pretty much my take on it.

A corollary here is that the Zags get the calls during conference play, not because we have a better coach, players, and program.

SWZag
03-31-2015, 05:45 AM
I'm not sure why anyone would be surprised by this article. If you watch many Duke games, they're all the same.

TexasZag
03-31-2015, 05:55 AM
Duke was the better team on Sunday, maybe most days. We had chances to win, and it wasn't our day.

None of that means that the officiating didn't impact the game negatively against us.

Utah has an All-American, 3 fouls before half.

We have 2 potential NBA players, 2 and 3 fouls before half - some of them very gentle.

I noticed the announcers expressly state that 2 called fouls on us were "bad" and the out of bounds call from the furthest official - all the 'expressed bad calls" went against us.

When you see all the above put together, it's not a bug, it's a feature.

Still coulda' beaten them. But many here knew long before the game that Coach K would get the favorable calls.

+1

There were other bad calls as well, like the hand through the cylinder that should have been called.

I think it's just flat crazy to insist that those two quick fouls in the first half could not have changed the outcome of the game.

Birddog
03-31-2015, 06:09 AM
I wrote in a pre-game thread that my biggest fear was that the Zags, specifically Karno would get Turiafed ala Nevada. It wasn't quite as quick, but it happened. Thankfully, we had Sabonis.

gonzagafan62
03-31-2015, 06:19 AM
Didn't care for the article. Zags don't need anyone without any skin in the game whining about the officiating. I do take umbrage with the author stating that GU choked. Don't see any of the 9 posts so far questioning that.

Choked is the worst word in all of sports. Its really epitomizes the low IQ of most writers when they use that word. Nobody chokes. Ya miss a shot ya miss a shot. Big deal. I get frustrated when people use that word, mostly because not only is it an insult to the losing team, but you are also describing that the other team didn't earn the win either.

IN this case, Duke earned the victory (whether it is due to the officials, is not in my frame of mind) .... But they earned it. One missed bunny by Kyle Wiltjer in my mind doesn't change the whole game. IT could have yes, but in my opinion it doesn't. Sadly we will never know.

JJsJumpshot
03-31-2015, 06:21 AM
This thread is pretty embarrassing. Fortunately there are some sensible responses on here.

Birddog
03-31-2015, 06:38 AM
This thread is pretty embarrassing. Fortunately there are some sensible responses on here.

From your point of view?

SWZag
03-31-2015, 06:39 AM
This thread is pretty embarrassing. Fortunately there are some sensible responses on here.

Guessing your handle is regarding Reddick? Duke fan perhaps?

I wouldn't really call this thread embarrassing. I would like you to take a look at this thread (http://guboards.spokesmanreview.com/showthread.php?53637-Quite-possibly-the-most-condescending-elitist-anti-Zag-thread-ever), that's embarrassing. :)

willandi
03-31-2015, 06:47 AM
This thread is pretty embarrassing. Fortunately there are some sensible responses on here.

The article that was linked is one persons opinion. The responses are also individual opinions. If you think the 2 early fouls on Karnowski didn't affect the play of the game, that is YOUR opinion. If I think the officiating DID affect the flow, if not the outcome, of the game, that is MY opinion.

Why do you think these opinions are embarrassing? Is it because deep down you suspect they may be right?

john montana
03-31-2015, 06:54 AM
Duke was better. They won.
This dude's obvious agenda against Duke and Coach K is a slap in the face to the Duke players who gave their all to beat a great GU team to make the Final Four. I don't think GU choked. I think Duke was the better team. That's pretty much my take on it.

+1. Ridiculous article.

LongIslandZagFan
03-31-2015, 07:00 AM
While I agree with the senitment that they get the benefit of many many calls... The Zebras didn't miss the shots or turn the ball over.

JJsJumpshot
03-31-2015, 07:02 AM
The article that was linked is one persons opinion. The responses are also individual opinions. If you think the 2 early fouls on Karnowski didn't affect the play of the game, that is YOUR opinion. If I think the officiating DID affect the flow, if not the outcome, of the game, that is MY opinion.

Why do you think these opinions are embarrassing? Is it because deep down you suspect they may be right?

Nope.

LongIslandZagFan
03-31-2015, 07:04 AM
This thread is pretty embarrassing. Fortunately there are some sensible responses on here.

No... the real embarrassment is the condescension most get from Duke fans. To quote a Duke fan on another message board: "Gonzaga needs to learn there place".

Birddog
03-31-2015, 07:10 AM
The "Duke Effect' is not new in the sportwriting business. Here is an article that is around 10 years old that addresses pretty much the same things. It's not so much about missed calls as it is about how the calls are made against Duke and how they are made against the opponent. There is also frequently a large foul disparity in number of respective calls. I guess Duke just plays smarter and tighter than everybody else.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=shanoff/060207

I'm not pretending the reffing altered the outcome, but it definitely affected the play. Gonzaga lost because of TO's and missed shots.

PeninsulaDog
03-31-2015, 07:23 AM
I saw this article yesterday, and didn't think was worth linking -- ill-conceived premise(s). Duke was the better team. But . . . the one call that really left me baffled was the Bell breakaway,out-of-bounds call reversed by the official behind the play, and to the right. How could that official have a better vantage than the official under the basket? And why be so strident about it so as to reverse the call? Inexplicable. I though that call changed everything -- we had the momentum, a four-point lead, and should have had the ball. It was all downhill from there. For what its worth the official that reversed the call, Jeff Anderson, is a Big East and MAAC guy, but he did officiate three Duke games this year prior to Sunday.

Second most outrageous call was Karnowski getting body-slammed out of bounds, under the basket, with no call, and then getting the ball thrown off him as he lay on the ground for a Duke possession.

JJsJumpshot
03-31-2015, 07:28 AM
No... the real embarrassment is the condescension most get from Duke fans. To quote a Duke fan on another message board: "Gonzaga needs to learn there place".

Their* Whoops.

SWZag
03-31-2015, 07:31 AM
Their* Whoops.

Before you think you're cute, check out the Duke message board to get a sense of intelligence. The IQ over there isn't much higher than a plant.

PS: You need punctuation before "Whoops."

JJsJumpshot
03-31-2015, 07:46 AM
Before you think you're cute, check out the Duke message board to get a sense of intelligence. The IQ over there isn't much higher than a plant.

PS: You need punctuation before "Whoops."

Yes, I'm well aware that the bandwagon Duke fans that hang out on the free Scout boards struggle with basic syntax (*thanks the internet*). But the irony was too rich.. criticizing condescension while illustrating the point.

The reasons this article, and others like it, are so asinine are: (i) literally every team that's ever lost a game in sports, ever, complains about the refs. The banal platitude of "Duke gets all the calls" is so beat.. The foil-heads over at IC are legitimately convinced there's a conspiracy that runs from K to the NCAA committee to the conference official committees. And (ii), all you ever see is argument through implication, never through analysis. Duke fans feel like we never get the calls. It's called being a sports fan.

LongIslandZagFan
03-31-2015, 07:47 AM
Look, I don't blame the loss on the refs... but even an un-biased simple eye-test of ANY Duke game would lead many to believe there is deference made to Duke over any team they are facing. Why? I don't know. But IMHO, if the perception has been there more than a decade... it isn't people making stuff up.

The three refs:

Mike Stuart: Big 12/AAC ref but did 8 ACC games (3 of which were Duke)
Doug Simmons: Big 12/SEC ref did no ACC games this season
Jeffery Anderson: MAAC/Big East ref did 11 ACC games this season (4 of which were Duke)

http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/mike-stuart/conferences
http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/doug-sirmons/conferences
http://statsheet.com/mcb/referees/jeffrey-anderson/conferences

Interesting look.

gonzagafan62
03-31-2015, 07:50 AM
Yes, I'm well aware that the bandwagon Duke fans that hang out on the free Scout boards struggle with basic syntax (*thanks the internet*). But the irony was too rich.. criticizing condescension while illustrating the point.

The reasons this article, and others like it, are so asinine are: (i) literally every team that's ever lost a game in sports, ever, complains about the refs. The banal platitude of "Duke gets all the calls" is so beat.. The foil-heads over at IC are legitimately convinced there's a conspiracy that runs from K to the NCAA committee to the conference official committees. And (ii), all you ever see is argument through implication, never through analysis. Duke fans feel like we never get the calls. It's called being a sports fan.

I had the pleasure of rewatching the game, because I have DVR. If you have the game still, you should rewatch it. Look at the no calls on Duke, and especially the defense of duke compared to the defense of Gonzaga. I watched it without heart and soul in it, and no bias as I was doing this as an exercise. If you feel like you didn't get the calls, I don't know what to tell you.

As we go through the emblems of time, I never blame the refs anymore. Its pointless. Nobody will ever remember it except diehard fans like me anyway. Everyone does remember the winner of the game and who plays in the final four.

JJsJumpshot
03-31-2015, 07:51 AM
Look, I don't blame the loss on the refs... but even an un-biased simple eye-test of ANY Duke game would lead many to believe there is deference made to Duke over any team they are facing. Why? I don't know. But IMHO, if the perception has been there more than a decade... it isn't people making stuff up.

It's not an un-biased simple eye test. It's a biased eye test from all the teams we beat.

PeninsulaDog
03-31-2015, 07:55 AM
It's not an un-biased simple eye test. It's a biased eye test from all the teams we beat.

Why not be a gracious winner, rather than an antagonist?

gonzagafan62
03-31-2015, 07:56 AM
It's not an un-biased simple eye test. It's a biased eye test from all the teams we beat.

Look at it objectively. If you have the game still rewatch it without bias. It's all right there. What calls are you wanting? You get them all anyway lol ... I'm not complaining... I already knew it would happen.

Zagceo
03-31-2015, 08:04 AM
Why not be a gracious winner, rather than an antagonist?

Why ask why?

It only takes pleasure in your discomfort.

Stop feeding the beast.

LongIslandZagFan
03-31-2015, 08:12 AM
Yes, I'm well aware that the bandwagon Duke fans that hang out on the free Scout boards struggle with basic syntax (*thanks the internet*). But the irony was too rich.. criticizing condescension while illustrating the point.

The reasons this article, and others like it, are so asinine are: (i) literally every team that's ever lost a game in sports, ever, complains about the refs. The banal platitude of "Duke gets all the calls" is so beat.. The foil-heads over at IC are legitimately convinced there's a conspiracy that runs from K to the NCAA committee to the conference official committees. And (ii), all you ever see is argument through implication, never through analysis. Duke fans feel like we never get the calls. It's called being a sports fan.

Irony??? I made a typo. I think you need to look up what irony is. On that note, should I make a correction to your mistake in your post? Or are you human just like me and occasionally while typing make a mistake.

BTW... correcting grammar in the manner that you did, is called condescension. You proved my point.

I know many people who dislike Duke... mostly because when they watch a Duke game, it seems blatantly obvious that they get the calls. These people aren't Zag fans or fans of anyone in the ACC for that matter. These are people who just like to watch college hoops and call it how they see it. They know in most Duke games it will be a one-sided affair.

LongIslandZagFan
03-31-2015, 08:14 AM
Why not be a gracious winner, rather than an antagonist?

Because it is what Duke fans do. Condescension is the name of their game.

Zags11
03-31-2015, 08:28 AM
I thought karno would get in foul trouble early.....why? We know why. He kept okafor in check. This didnt make us lose the game however.

DixieZag
03-31-2015, 08:28 AM
Yes, I'm well aware that the bandwagon Duke fans that hang out on the free Scout boards struggle with basic syntax (*thanks the internet*). But the irony was too rich.. criticizing condescension while illustrating the point.

The reasons this article, and others like it, are so asinine are: (i) literally every team that's ever lost a game in sports, ever, complains about the refs. The banal platitude of "Duke gets all the calls" is so beat.. The foil-heads over at IC are legitimately convinced there's a conspiracy that runs from K to the NCAA committee to the conference official committees. And (ii), all you ever see is argument through implication, never through analysis. Duke fans feel like we never get the calls. It's called being a sports fan.

We get beat all the time without nary a mention of the refs and bias. See Arizona (We did not like the non-call at the end, but no one acted as if there was some sort of game long bias. We got beat by BYU, no one said a thing about the refs.

No one said we got "beat b/c Duke gets all the calls" - the thread is on perceived biases in calls throughout the game. No one has said (except the columnist) that we lost b/c of the refs.

Want to talk about banal? Pointing out mistakes with "there/their" or "Your/you're" or whatever stupid mistakes one makes during a conversation flying across a keyboard, something Updike could have done if he posted on fan boards.

No one thinks there is a conspiracy from K to the committee to whomever. The only concern anyone has is the power of money and which plays best on TV. Things need not even be said out loud in order to create subtle biases. CBS has billions of dollars riding on the tournament. Have you ever seen a situation where a billion dollars was at stake and the parties didn't do everything they possibly could to maximize their take? If you are the executive of CBS Sports, do you want Kentucky versus Gonzaga as your title game, or do you want Kentucky versus Duke? (Just if you got to pick, which would you 'pick'?) - Everyone knows the answer, including the officials, who all want to work more games, and more important games. Nothing even need be said to them in the matter.

TexasZagFan
03-31-2015, 08:55 AM
All I know is that 90+ percent of the Duke fans I saw in Houston majored in their Custodial Arts program.

ZagDaddy
03-31-2015, 09:21 AM
I predicted on this board before the game that we could easily be playing 5 on 8 so I certainly wasn't surprised. Quick fouls hurt our chances but poor outside shooting and turnovers is what really did us in. We shoot anywhere near our usual percentage from outside and the Zags win. You have to play well enough in spite of the officiating. We didn't do that. Period.

Still it was a great season and this team brought me a lot of joy. Time to move on and enjoy the baseball season. Play ball!

MEZAG
03-31-2015, 10:05 AM
Yes but Karno being out of the game, resulted in Dukes defense not needing to clog the paint and be out on shooters. 2 quick fouls on Karno created the poor outside shooting, or I should say zero outside shooting.


I predicted on this board before the game that we could easily be playing 5 on 8 so I certainly wasn't surprised. Quick fouls hurt our chances but poor outside shooting and turnovers is what really did us in. We shoot anywhere near our usual percentage from outside and the Zags win. You have to play well enough in spite of the officiating. We didn't do that. Period.

Still it was a great season and this team brought me a lot of joy. Time to move on and enjoy the baseball season. Play ball!

ZagDaddy
03-31-2015, 10:30 AM
Yes but Karno being out of the game, resulted in Dukes defense not needing to clog the paint and be out on shooters. 2 quick fouls on Karno created the poor outside shooting, or I should say zero outside shooting.

I respectfully disagree. I don't think the fouls on Karno created the poor shooting. Karnowski was not in foul trouble vs UCLA and we still shot under our average. We also were successful in the regular season with him picking up early fouls. I'd be more willing to accept the cavernous arena played a part in below average shooting that than the early fouls. Nonetheless, his foul trouble didn't help our cause. On that we can agree.

Whatever the cause, you have to play your best to advance and on Sunday we did not. It happens.

bballbeachbum
03-31-2015, 11:59 AM
Duke fans feel like we never get the calls.

seems like just about everyone else disagrees but then again we aren't privy to the premium analysis so what can we know?

Bogozags
03-31-2015, 12:44 PM
Karno's two fouls were for bad breath compared to the sh!t Okafor was getting away with. The most egregious non call of the game was early in the 1st after Bell was picked and the Dook guard reached out and held him with both hands to keep him from getting back.

That should of been an Intentional Foul...two shots and the ball...and more than likely a Technical on Coach Few for arguing the call...it could of been a six point play!

Duke had the better team that night...we should of tied the game at 53 all BUT it wasn't meant to be!

So now we just get ready for next year and hope and pray that KW comes back for his final year...my guess is he is leaving for the money...

Bogozags
03-31-2015, 12:54 PM
We get beat all the time without nary a mention of the refs and bias. See Arizona (We did not like the non-call at the end, but no one acted as if there was some sort of game long bias. We got beat by BYU, no one said a thing about the refs.

No one said we got "beat b/c Duke gets all the calls" - the thread is on perceived biases in calls throughout the game. No one has said (except the columnist) that we lost b/c of the refs.

Want to talk about banal? Pointing out mistakes with "there/their" or "Your/you're" or whatever stupid mistakes one makes during a conversation flying across a keyboard, something Updike could have done if he posted on fan boards.

No one thinks there is a conspiracy from K to the committee to whomever. The only concern anyone has is the power of money and which plays best on TV. Things need not even be said out loud in order to create subtle biases. CBS has billions of dollars riding on the tournament. Have you ever seen a situation where a billion dollars was at stake and the parties didn't do everything they possibly could to maximize their take? If you are the executive of CBS Sports, do you want Kentucky versus Gonzaga as your title game, or do you want Kentucky versus Duke? (Just if you got to pick, which would you 'pick'?) - Everyone knows the answer, including the officials, who all want to work more games, and more important games. Nothing even need be said to them in the matter.

Dixie,
This is an excellent, well thought out post and speaks volumes about the tournament's make-up and no doubt, match-ups too! WSU vs KU...Butler vs ND...

Also, Duke has already beaten MSU on a neutral court and Wisconsin on the road...

LongIslandZagFan
03-31-2015, 01:18 PM
So now we just get ready for next year and hope and pray that KW comes back for his final year...my guess is he is leaving for the money...

He is projected to be picked in zero mock drafts this year. He is a second rounder in next year's draft. If he leaves for Europe, that is silly as he'd be able to play there anyhow after he leaves at the end of next year.

I think one more year of work could push him into the first round... he won't get a sniff this year.

TexasZagFan
03-31-2015, 01:32 PM
He is projected to be picked in zero mock drafts this year. He is a second rounder in next year's draft. If he leaves for Europe, that is silly as he'd be able to play there anyhow after he leaves at the end of next year.

I think one more year of work could push him into the first round... he won't get a sniff this year.

Yes...the Duke game proved to me that Kyle needs to improve his upper body strength.

As I stated earlier, a weapon he should add to his quiver is a Dirk-like fadeaway, an unstoppable shot. Perfect for when he's getting pushed out of the box.

That fadeaway has made Dirk millions.

maynard g krebs
03-31-2015, 04:08 PM
The only concern anyone has is the power of money and which plays best on TV. Things need not even be said out loud in order to create subtle biases. CBS has billions of dollars riding on the tournament. Have you ever seen a situation where a billion dollars was at stake and the parties didn't do everything they possibly could to maximize their take? If you are the executive of CBS Sports, do you want Kentucky versus Gonzaga as your title game, or do you want Kentucky versus Duke? (Just if you got to pick, which would you 'pick'?) - Everyone knows the answer, including the officials, who all want to work more games, and more important games. Nothing even need be said to them in the matter.

Thanks, Dix. Well said.

FWIW, I thought the linked article was spot on. It's nearly impossible to beat a good team with unequal officiating. And only someone in denial, or perhaps someone with a seeing-eye dog listening to the radio, could say this game, or Duke-Utah, was officiated fairly.

It happens all the time to the less marketable team. Disappointing how many people can't see this, or parse it with qualifiers; i.e., it didn't cause the loss, but.........

Barring a performance like the Iowa game, this one wasn't winnable. And now back to occasional lurking.

Zagceo
03-31-2015, 04:21 PM
I don't blame Refs.

The way to settle this issue is go to the monitor. Combination of NFL and tennis reply.

Coach gets 2 a half and if he's wrong loses TO for each. Wins review keeps review in bank.

willandi
03-31-2015, 06:02 PM
It's not an un-biased simple eye test. It's a biased eye test from all the teams we beat.

I am 66 and it has taken me a long time to learn that if everybody says I am wrong, I need to at least consider it.

If all the teams that Duke has beat for more than the last 10 years complain that the refs make the calls in Dukes favor, maybe you should consider it. Well... never mind.

Saxon_zag
03-31-2015, 06:24 PM
Is this JJ guy a troll or what? Lol...

The zags shot poorly and lost but the refs were definitely on dukes side... Always are.. PK's 2nd foul was a PHANTOM call.. Maybe he nudged him with the fabric of his jersey? Considering what they were letting go..That was a clear effort to take him out of the game..

Watch Duke vs Utah.. Clear as day effort to remove Wright from the game. You think Okafor is going to pick up his 2nd or 3rd on some cheapo or phantom call like the ones gonzaga and utah received? Come on...

MiamiZags
03-31-2015, 06:42 PM
It's not an un-biased simple eye test. It's a biased eye test from all the teams we beat.

or teams like Miami that beat you by 20 at home, despite the calls going Duke's way.