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Kong-Kool-Aid
03-29-2015, 04:33 PM
Sabonis, Karnowski, Wiltjer, Edwards, McLellen, Perkins, Melson, Drags.... One of if not the best front court in the nation.

Who knows what kind of transfers Few is looking to bring in to play the 3.

We will be back!

zagsfanforlife
03-29-2015, 04:36 PM
Sabonis, Karnowski, Wiltjer, Edwards, McLellen, Perkins, Melson, Drags.... One of if not the best front court in the nation.

Who knows what kind of transfers Few is looking to bring in to play the 3.

We will be back!

Fingers crossed that Wiltjer and Karnowski come back. If this happens we got a chance to be back. If not, i think a solid but not great team.

Either Melson or Mcclelan need to step up. I am certain Perkins will get the job done. Gotta keep the chemistry up like last year.

Need a transfer to come in and play immediately. Wesley will be tough to replace.

Excited to see what Edwards has become. If he is a beast, our frontcourt is dynamite.

Add Mussini, a transfer and another wing. Bring back Wiltjer and Karno and ill put another $400 on the Zags again next year and enjoy the ride.

Birddog
03-29-2015, 04:37 PM
I feel like a fatso after eating a major thanksgiving feast and asking when we feast again. That said, lets analyze next years squad.
I don't see any of our big 3 departing. I think we only lose Wesley, Bell, Pangos and maybe Nunez.

I think we have Karno, Sabonis and Wiltjer returning with additional returnees Perkins, Melson, McClellan, Edwards, Alberts, Dranginis, and maybe Nunez. That's the core for a damn good team if the guards can develop over the season. I'm with Jazz, I don't think there will be that much drop off by the time season ends next year. The Zag front court will be one of the best in the country.

Dranginis will be a minor star, he really improved his game down the stretch, Sabonis, Karno, Wiltjer will be phenomenol. Perkins, McClellan and Melson showed lots of promise. I'm very upbeat for the future. Toss in a transfer and we could be "elite" again or hopefully better.
Go Zags.

Kong-Kool-Aid
03-29-2015, 04:37 PM
They aren't first round locks to be drafted, I can't see why either of them would leave early.

Birddog
03-29-2015, 04:39 PM
Looks like a thread merge is in order.

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 04:55 PM
Wiltjer is not coming back guys. It hasn't been explicitly stated, but it has been stated as implicitly as can be without being explicit. That being said, Jenks and Melson will be a better back court than the one that just departed and that's saying a lot. If Shem and Don'tmiss return along with Edwards, that's one of the best front courts in America. We have some open schollies, let's see what rabbits Few and Tommy pull out of their respective hats.

zag67
03-29-2015, 04:56 PM
Also do forget Alberts who has been redshirting. I think he will give us another 6'4" guard that can play the 3.

WallaWallaZag
03-29-2015, 04:58 PM
I feel like a fatso after eating a major thanksgiving feast and asking when we feast again. That said, lets analyze next years squad.
I don't see any of our big 3 departing. I think we only lose Wesley, Bell, Pangos and maybe Nunez.

I think we have Karno, Sabonis and Wiltjer returning with additional returnees Perkins, Melson, McClellan, Edwards, Alberts, Dranginis, and maybe Nunez. That's the core for a damn good team if the guards can develop over the season. I'm with Jazz, I don't think there will be that much drop off by the time season ends next year. The Zag front court will be one of the best in the country.

Dranginis will be a minor star, he really improved his game down the stretch, Sabonis, Karno, Wiltjer will be phenomenol. Perkins, McClellan and Melson showed lots of promise. I'm very upbeat for the future. Toss in a transfer and we could be "elite" again or hopefully better.
Go Zags.

front court will be fine even without wiltjer...more worried about a lack of perimeter shooting, especially if wiltjer is gone. perkins & emac aren't shooters and melson needs to improve a lot...alberts might be the best shooter of the bunch.

bartruff1
03-29-2015, 05:01 PM
It is not easy to replace character........ leadership necessary to create the chemistry to build a team.....Gary and Kevin had that from day one...the next backcourt may have those skills, but it is not a given.

GrizZAG
03-29-2015, 05:03 PM
Dranginis is already a star in my book. He's the disruptive force like Hart was but has some offense too. Love his game.


I feel like a fatso after eating a major thanksgiving feast and asking when we feast again. That said, lets analyze next years squad.
I don't see any of our big 3 departing. I think we only lose Wesley, Bell, Pangos and maybe Nunez.

I think we have Karno, Sabonis and Wiltjer returning with additional returnees Perkins, Melson, McClellan, Edwards, Alberts, Dranginis, and maybe Nunez. That's the core for a damn good team if the guards can develop over the season. I'm with Jazz, I don't think there will be that much drop off by the time season ends next year. The Zag front court will be one of the best in the country.

Dranginis will be a minor star, he really improved his game down the stretch, Sabonis, Karno, Wiltjer will be phenomenol. Perkins, McClellan and Melson showed lots of promise. I'm very upbeat for the future. Toss in a transfer and we could be "elite" again or hopefully better.
Go Zags.

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 05:03 PM
It is not easy to replace character........ leadership necessary to create the chemistry to build a team.....Gary and Kevin had that from day one...the next backcourt may have those skills, but it is not a given.

I agree, but from a purely athletic and talent perspective, the young ones are better than Gary and Kevin. Should be exciting to watch the growth.

WallaWallaZag
03-29-2015, 05:04 PM
It is not easy to replace character........ leadership necessary to create the chemistry to build a team.....Gary and Kevin had that from day one...the next backcourt may have those skills, but it is not a given.

hopefully the year spent with those two rubbed off enough to carry over...i think perkins has the makeup to continue the tradition.

KStyles
03-29-2015, 05:09 PM
Wiltjer is not coming back guys. It hasn't been explicitly stated, but it has been stated as implicitly as can be without being explicit. That being said, Jenks and Melson will be a better back court than the one that just departed and that's saying a lot. If Shem and Don'tmiss return along with Edwards, that's one of the best front courts in America. We have some open schollies, let's see what rabbits Few and Tommy pull out of their respective hats.

Obviously things change, but this can't be a bad sign:

http://i.imgur.com/CLahJd2.png (https://twitter.com/SRJimm/status/582347109724086273)

GU69
03-29-2015, 05:10 PM
It is not easy to replace character........ leadership necessary to create the chemistry to build a team.....Gary and Kevin had that from day one...the next backcourt may have those skills, but it is not a given.

This could be the toughest part. Lots of good bigs next year but we'll need a good point guard to get the ball to them.

Birddog
03-29-2015, 05:10 PM
Wiltjer is not coming back guys. It hasn't been explicitly stated, but it has been stated as implicitly as can be without being explicit. That being said, Jenks and Melson will be a better back court than the one that just departed and that's saying a lot. If Shem and Don'tmiss return along with Edwards, that's one of the best front courts in America. We have some open schollies, let's see what rabbits Few and Tommy pull out of their respective hats.

I'm pretty sure it was stated that he would check his options. Personally i don't see him on an NBA roster unless it's on a crappy team and then he'll languish on the bench or play in the D league. He could play in Europe, but the money will not be that good. It'll beat an entry level job at Enterprise Rent a Car though.

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 05:12 PM
Honest question: What would you expect him to say immediately after the loss? P.S. The "right now" was a dead give away.
Jim Meehan @SRJimm
Wiltjer: "I got another year of eligibility so that’s my plan right now (to return)."

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 05:14 PM
I'm pretty sure it was stated that he would check his options. Personally i don't see him\ on an NBA roster unless it's on a crappy team and then he'll languish on the bench or play in the D league. He could play in Europe, but the money will not be that good. It'll beat an entry level job at Enterprise Rent a Car though. Nope, it's been said, more than once that he's not returning. Apparently Europe is an option for him. Plus, one of the mods who runs this board, essentially alluded to it, without directly coming out and saying it and he, to the best of my knowledge is almost never wrong.

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 05:16 PM
This could be the toughest part. Lots of good bigs next year but we'll need a good point guard to get the ball to them.

Perkins was ridiculous before he got hurt. Granted it was a small sample size, but his vision, court awareness and leadership skills are flat out amazing. He's the best passer not named John Stockton that has ever donned a GU jersey.

KStyles
03-29-2015, 05:16 PM
Honest question: What would you expect him to say immediately after the loss? P.S. The "right now" was a dead give away.

I wouldn't say a dead giveaway, but it does leave it up in the air. You may very well be correct (50/50 shot), but at this point I don't think its certain. If it was, I'd expect him to say so.

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 05:18 PM
Hey, I hope I'm dead wrong. But too many "big wigs" here have intimated as much.
I wouldn't say a dead giveaway, but it does leave it up in the air. You may very well be correct (50/50 shot), but at this point I don't think its certain.

Kong-Kool-Aid
03-29-2015, 05:18 PM
Nope, it's been said, more than once that he's not returning. Apparently Europe is an option for him. Plus, one of the mods who runs this board, essentially alluded to it, without directly coming out and saying it and he, to the best of my knowledge is almost never wrong.

He has a great season next year he could turn into a first round pick.

RenoZag
03-29-2015, 05:20 PM
Re: Next Year, this blurb from ESPN Insider

To return to the NCAA tournament, a team needs contributions from both returning players and incoming recruits. Here's a look at Gonzaga and its chances of dancing again in 2016.

Quick references:

2014-15 roster

2015 recruiting

Possible 2015-16 starting five

G Josh Perkins

G Silas Melson

F Kyle Wiltjer

F Domantas Sabonis

C Przemek Karnowski

Who is lost: Coach Mark Few will finally part ways with the heart and soul of Gonzaga's program over the past few years, Kevin Pangos. Pangos will not only take his points and assists with him, but his leadership will be missed, as well. In addition, though the Zags will be able to replace multiyear starter Gary Bell Jr.'s scoring, his on-ball defense will be missed. Finally, Byron Wesley, the rugged wing-type with scoring pop, will have to be replaced, as well, and it will not be easy considering there is no one in the program with his combination of strength and skill at the wing position.

Who is added: The Zags signed one recruit thus far, and he's a good one in the ultra-scoring point guard Jesse Wade. However, he will not be able to suit up until the 2017-18 season because of a Mormon mission. One thing to keep in mind is the Zags utilize the international recruiting landscape (Poland, Canada, Germany, etc.) as well as any school in the country.

What it means for next season: If Wiltjer decides to come back for his senior campaign, the Zags will have one of the most talented frontcourts in the country. Wiltjer has inside-out skills that have the NBA monitoring his each and every move. Sabonis, another possible early NBA entry, has size, skill and a relentless motor that have the professional ranks excited. The last frontcourt talent, Karnowski, a skilled 5-man with a mammoth frame, will give the Zags yet another gifted post threat for opposing teams to deal with. The key for the Zags heading into next season will be the development of their young backcourt of Perkins and Melson. While the Zags may not be as potent from 3-point range after the departure of Pangos, Perkins and Melson will bring more overall athleticism to the table.

Trending: Level. Although the Zags must replace a terrific senior trio (Pangos, Bell, Wesley), they have recruited very well. The frontcourt strength has been well-documented, but it is the backcourt that has the Zags coaches and fans optimistic and intrigued. Perkins is one of the more dynamic passers in the country and Melson has that potentially lethal combination of athleticism and skill at the 2-guard spot.

willandi
03-29-2015, 05:41 PM
Hey, I hope I'm dead wrong. But too many "big wigs" here have intimated as much.

I certainly haven't seen such intimations! I know that I only drop by 3-4 times a day, so could have missed it. You could be right, but I hope not.

flytiezag
03-29-2015, 05:53 PM
We will be well represented on the floor next year other wise we would of had more incoming players.The coaches do not over recruit so it seems is if most every ones coming back.Next year will be special.

CDC84
03-29-2015, 05:55 PM
I would be surprised if a graduate transfer and possibly another transfer (or high schooler/Euro) aren't brought in. The roster is by no means set. There are plenty of schoolies to spare.

seacatfan
03-29-2015, 06:16 PM
I'm really curious to see what role McClellan will have next year. With mid season eligibility, then hitting the court delayed another week or two due to injury, plus limited amount of minutes he could practice/play while rehabbing said injury, it was hard for him to find a groove this year. Will he become more of a scorer next season? He could score at Tulsa and Vanderbilt but we didn't see much of it from him in a Zags uniform. He could possibly be a starter alongside Perkins if Few decides he wants 2 ball handlers on the floor together, or he could be the first guard off the bench that can spell either the 1 or the 2. We know he's a solid on ball defender and he can push the ball up the floor in a hurry. Will be interesting to see what happens in his only full season for GU.

Will also be interesting to watch Perkins and Melson develop. We've seen flashes of brilliance from both. I have no idea what to expect out of Alberts, I have no info to base an opinion on. I'm expecting to see a lot more minutes for Dranginis next year, whether he starts at the 3 or is a key cog off the bench that can play multiple positions.

Frontcourt should be strong again, even if one leaves early. If two leave early (seems unlikely) that could hurt depth. I feel for Nunez. Seems like he could be a decent player but where are his minutes going to come from?

zagsfanforlife
03-29-2015, 06:40 PM
Wiltjer is not coming back guys. It hasn't been explicitly stated, but it has been stated as implicitly as can be without being explicit. That being said, Jenks and Melson will be a better back court than the one that just departed and that's saying a lot. If Shem and Don'tmiss return along with Edwards, that's one of the best front courts in America. We have some open schollies, let's see what rabbits Few and Tommy pull out of their respective hats.

Im just curious... where exactly is he going? A second round draft pick this year? Leaving for Europe early? Not many people do that and there is no reason to leave early for Europe when you can do the exact same next year, while also improving your chances at being a first round pick. Combined with the chance that he has a chance to be a 1st team all american and the team has to make a deep run in the tournament, I am not saying I dont buy it, but just what exactly would his other plan be? Leaving for Europe doesnt make sense. And from my two eyes, granted I am no GM, but I have worked with many NBA players, i dont see a first rounder right now. Not an NBA body, defensive liability, and not very athletic. While this wont change A TON, neither will his opportunity to make money in Europe. Might as well enjoy another season in college. I dont see it as a sure thing at all, despite what your sources say.

john montana
03-29-2015, 06:41 PM
i just want KW to come back. I want to see what we could do playing KW, PK, and Sabonis all at the same time. This is my dream. Play a zone on D, high low with a shooter and a banger/energy guy, plus the passing ability of Perkins and shooting of Melson. eMac and KD playing heavy minutes and causing havoc by pressuring and forcing drives into our front line...and Edwards off the bench. Wow. This is my dream. Come back KW (and Sabonis)!

zagsfanforlife
03-29-2015, 06:43 PM
Plus, you dont say you are planning on coming back if you already have your mind made up otherwise.You asked what he would say instead after a game like this? Maybe what 99% of others who are thinking about leaving say, "Going to go back, talk to my coaches, really think about my decision, get feedback from the NBA people, and make a decision". Mostly everyone thinking about coming out says this. He instead said right now he is coming back. I would say 75/25 coming back. My guess.

SpudDawg
03-29-2015, 06:46 PM
Yes, looking for more additions. And I certainly hope Wiltjer stays. I would think that anyone who played his last game at GU and left with that bitter taste in his mouth would have regrets later in life.

jazzdelmar
03-29-2015, 06:48 PM
i just want KW to come back. I want to see what we could do playing KW, PK, and Sabonis all at the same time. This is my dream. Play a zone on D, high low with a shooter and a banger/energy guy, plus the passing ability of Perkins and shooting of Melson. eMac and KD playing heavy minutes and causing havoc by pressuring and forcing drives into our front line...and Edwards off the bench. Wow. This is my dream. Come back KW (and Sabonis)!


U and me JM but will never happen. I suspect u know that. But those 3 with Jenks and Mac, wow. Today I thought I actually saw all three on floor same time but they were subbing for ea other. Keep dreaming, my friend. But three years from now Jenks and Melson will be better than KP and GB.

zagsfanforlife
03-29-2015, 06:49 PM
U and me JM but will never happen. I suspect u know that. But those 3 with Jenks and Mac, wow. Today I thought I actually saw all three on floor same time but they were subbing for ea other. Keep dreaming, my friend. But three years from now Jenks and Melson will be better than KP and GB.

So you are 100% convinced he is gone too?

MDABE80
03-29-2015, 06:52 PM
EMAC and Dranginis should go to the front of the line. Their defense is just too good. Offense for both will be welcomed as well. I'd be guessing Jenks (Josh.......a compromise on my part) and SIlas will be the first 4 guards. Alberts will be in this as well. Big team again. Bigs are all 6 10 and up. 4 of em. New faces will come as well.
It'll be a fun year next season. Big strong, experience and faster. Defense MUST get better and you all saw why today.

john montana
03-29-2015, 06:56 PM
U and me JM but will never happen. I suspect u know that. But those 3 with Jenks and Mac, wow. Today I thought I actually saw all three on floor same time but they were subbing for ea other. Keep dreaming, my friend. But three years from now Jenks and Melson will be better than KP and GB.

Well, apparently I am blaming the loss on KW, so I guess I should be hoping he doesn't come back. Hah.

I thought we should have done it today Jazz. But it would have been a huge adjustment on the fly offensively. I get that. No way to revamp our dribble hand off stuff that quickly, but i really think those three on the floor could cause some serious problems for teams. KW is just so skilled you can move him around, and as much as I love man to man defense, think of the LENGTH of that zone!

If he and Sabonis are here next year and Few can work that all preseason, with a fourth big (Edwards) and possibly Nunez on the bench I could see him running it.

Stache
03-29-2015, 06:57 PM
The NBA has moved to a spread/motion offensive set and the value of the true post is diminshed compared to the era of the low post center. PK should stay to improve the mobility that is so dramatically better over the last 3 years. DS will be a pro, but needs more seasoning to increase his strength if he is to play in the post exclusively, and he needs a more dependable 15 footer if he is to play the 4 in the Association. KW will suffer some of Adam M's problems in the pros if he goes now. The feet are still sluggish. The best possible outcome may come from working with Travis on quicknes and lift. Add 4-6 inches of vertical and quicker feet to defend, and his stock goes way, way up. Keep all three and we are going to be very, very tough. Perkins, McClellan, Melson and Drang. will get tested early with our OOC schedule....

TacomaZAG
03-29-2015, 07:01 PM
Re: Next Year, this blurb from ESPN Insider

To return to the NCAA tournament, a team needs contributions from both returning players and incoming recruits. Here's a look at Gonzaga and its chances of dancing again in 2016.

Quick references:

2014-15 roster

2015 recruiting

Possible 2015-16 starting five

G Josh Perkins

G Silas Melson

F Kyle Wiltjer

F Domantas Sabonis

C Przemek Karnowski

This...............

Two major points, 1) No way Sabonis comes off the bench next year, he is just too valuable to have him sit. Plus, with Ryan Edwards back and probably Nunez as well, the front line and reserves are set. 2) I say KW comes back, because his position in the NBA or Europe is a stretch 3, no way is he physical enough to be a 4 at the next level. With the lineup above, he is free to roam the perimeter and attack the basket, most of the time with serious mismatches. With this lineup, he averages 20+ a game and shows his true versatility to the scouts.

Wow, the future is bright, and this year was the next step in the progression of the program.

Go ZAGS

CDC84
03-29-2015, 07:06 PM
Karnowski and Sabonis really need to learn how to stay out of foul trouble if they wish to start at the same time.

Remember....Spokane Arena is a hosting a subregional next year. It's really important that the Bulldogs do everything possible to secure a high seed in the tourney so that they can take advantage of it.

MickMick
03-29-2015, 07:14 PM
Dranginis is going to be a big time player for GU next year. Some of you are going to be very surprised at the amount of playing time he gets.

Why?

His entry passes are a thing of beauty and entry passes are what Few desires.

Don't worry, between Perkins and KD, the bigs will get properly fed.

What we need now is another perimeter marksman and another slasher/penetrator that draws fouls and finishes. Bryan Alberts may be the key.

tampanjzag
03-29-2015, 07:22 PM
From the look of Wiltjer's Instagram and I quote

"Words can't describe how much I love these guys right here. Didn't end the way we wanted but had an awesome time doing it. Going to miss my szn pg next year @kpangos thanks for everything Kev."

It sure looks like he will be back.

zag67
03-29-2015, 07:28 PM
Don't forget Alberts. I think he is going to be a defensive player. Maybe not a lot of minutes, but starting to prepare for the following year.

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 07:28 PM
Just to be clear, I have zero sources. Let's put it this way......I've been on all 3 versions of this board for 17 years, I know who knows what and what they say, or don't say is very telling. At this point, I'd be shocked if KW returns; also ecstatic. Just look at his quote from tonight; it's pretty clear he isn't coming back.
Im just curious... where exactly is he going? A second round draft pick this year? Leaving for Europe early? Not many people do that and there is no reason to leave early for Europe when you can do the exact same next year, while also improving your chances at being a first round pick. Combined with the chance that he has a chance to be a 1st team all american and the team has to make a deep run in the tournament, I am not saying I dont buy it, but just what exactly would his other plan be? Leaving for Europe doesnt make sense. And from my two eyes, granted I am no GM, but I have worked with many NBA players, i dont see a first rounder right now. Not an NBA body, defensive liability, and not very athletic. While this wont change A TON, neither will his opportunity to make money in Europe. Might as well enjoy another season in college. I dont see it as a sure thing at all, despite what your sources say.

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 07:32 PM
Ha, it's the exact opposite. If you're coming back, you say, "I'm coming back", that's literally it. When you are not coming back, you leave little clue words such as "right now". Agvain, I hope that I'm dead wrong, but in every thread in the past month where this has come up, every person in the know has made zero attempt to refute it.
Plus, you dont say you are planning on coming back if you already have your mind made up otherwise.You asked what he would say instead after a game like this? Maybe what 99% of others who are thinking about leaving say, "Going to go back, talk to my coaches, really think about my decision, get feedback from the NBA people, and make a decision". Mostly everyone thinking about coming out says this. He instead said right now he is coming back. I would say 75/25 coming back. My guess.

CdAZagFan
03-29-2015, 07:39 PM
Agree with some on this post that say that if KW was leaving he wouldn't have said right now he is coming back (I think he would have said something along the lines of needing to take some time to think it over). Hopefully those in the know tapped into the wrong telephone line...

As for the team next year, super exciting - with Wiltjer would be one of the top front courts in the nation (if not THE top). The items that will be tough to replace will be leadership (although that may be coming from KW and Shem next year) and defense - I love KD's all-around game, but I don't see anyone that can lock down the D like Bell did. I do like the idea of a great zone with that front line...

TM27
03-29-2015, 07:41 PM
Ha, it's the exact opposite. If you're coming back, you say, "I'm coming back", that's literally it. When you are not coming back, you leave little clue words such as "right now". Agvain, I hope that I'm dead wrong, but in every thread in the past month where this has come up, every person in the know has made zero attempt to refute it.

• Wiltjer, a fourth-year junior, was asked if he was committed to returning to what should be another talented GU team. “Of course,” he said. “I’ve got one more year of eligibility.”



Hmm...

VinnyZag
03-29-2015, 07:52 PM
Lloyd made reference in one of the Seattle Times stories last week about the likelihood that all three bigs will play together next year. He said it wouldn't happen against Iowa, but it probably would next year. So those of you hoping for that will probably get your wish. I still think it's a recipe for defensive disaster, but we'll see, I guess.

zagsfanforlife
03-29-2015, 07:56 PM
Ha, it's the exact opposite. If you're coming back, you say, "I'm coming back", that's literally it. When you are not coming back, you leave little clue words such as "right now". Agvain, I hope that I'm dead wrong, but in every thread in the past month where this has come up, every person in the know has made zero attempt to refute it.

Okay. If you say so.

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 08:26 PM
That's not the full quote, it ends, "for now". Which is a tell tale sign that he's gone. Not sure why the quote has been misquoted, unless it's a different quote.
• Wiltjer, a fourth-year junior, was asked if he was committed to returning to what should be another talented GU team. “Of course,” he said. “I’ve got one more year of eligibility.”



Hmm...

thespywhozaggedme
03-29-2015, 08:27 PM
Okay. If you say so.

Just my opinion. Why would you add "for now" if you were 100% coming back? Those two words change the answer completely. But again, I hope that I am 100% wrong.

willandi
03-29-2015, 08:40 PM
• Wiltjer, a fourth-year junior, was asked if he was committed to returning to what should be another talented GU team. “Of course,” he said. “I’ve got one more year of eligibility.”

Taken from the Bud Withers notes thread.

TrekkerZag
03-29-2015, 08:57 PM
Nope, it's been said, more than once that he's not returning. Apparently Europe is an option for him. Plus, one of the mods who runs this board, essentially alluded to it, without directly coming out and saying it and he, to the best of my knowledge is almost never wrong.

Please inform some of us ignorant posters with quotes where it is stated that he is not coming back.

and please inform us who the mod is that is NEVER WRONG?
I hope that it is not Bobzag.

TexasZagFan
03-29-2015, 09:04 PM
Please inform some of us ignorant posters with quotes where it is stated that he is not coming back.

and please inform us who the mod is that is NEVER WRONG?
I hope that it is not Bobzag.

O/T, but I think Okafor comes back for another year. He had a very pedestrian game today, often manhandled by Shem and Domas. He doesn't yet have the upper body strength to go against NBA caliber power forwards.

scott257
03-29-2015, 09:13 PM
Wiltjer is not coming back guys. It hasn't been explicitly stated, but it has been stated as implicitly as can be without being explicit. That being said, Jenks and Melson will be a better back court than the one that just departed and that's saying a lot. If Shem and Don'tmiss return along with Edwards, that's one of the best front courts in America. We have some open schollies, let's see what rabbits Few and Tommy pull out of their respective hats.

Wrong. Wiltjer already said he was coming back. When asked he answered pretty clearly and that was tonight.

CDC84
03-29-2015, 09:50 PM
O/T, but I think Okafor comes back for another year. He had a very pedestrian game today, often manhandled by Shem and Domas. He doesn't yet have the upper body strength to go against NBA caliber power forwards.

I seriously doubt it. Regardless of how he has performed in this tournament - and he may play better at the final 4 - he's projected by everyone to be the 1st or 2nd pick in the draft. It's just too much money (endorsements and salary) to pass up.

Zags11
03-29-2015, 09:54 PM
Shem was rated 4th best defender in post. He was best remaining in tourny.

CDC84
03-29-2015, 09:54 PM
Wiltjer isn't listed anywhere on the 2015 draft list at draftexpress.com, which has the most reliable mock around:

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-mock-draft/2015/

He's listed as a back end 2nd rounder in 2016:

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-mock-draft/2016/

If he goes now, he risks going undrafted.

jchocolate99
03-29-2015, 09:54 PM
thespywhozaggedme you're talking way to confidently for someone who's getting his info from another third party source. If wiltjer comes back we're even better if not we'll still be a good team. Based off what he's said today that tells me he's coming back cause like someone else said if you were contemplating leaving you would say that you were going to give it some time to think and speak with family about. The last part you keep hanging on just means he's gonna give it thought before officially coming back. Might not mean much of anything but I was in a twitter convo with another zag fan about Wiltjer possibly leaving about a month ago. The other fan said he'd do good with another year in the program and Wilter favorited that tweet. Can't really confer much from that but to me someone who doesn't plan on returning wouldn't of even bothered to go out his way to favorite a tweet from a random fan... that's just my opinion

http://s1.postimg.org/myxqt0v0b/Screenshot_2015_03_29_22_45_59.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/myxqt0v0b/)

http://s2.postimg.org/b9ja6jg2t/Screenshot_2015_03_29_22_57_09.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/b9ja6jg2t/)

sittingon50
03-29-2015, 10:17 PM
"Show me the tacos!"

DixieZag
03-29-2015, 10:21 PM
Regardless of who comes back (and I dearly hope that KW does, and right now, I think he will, no matter how strong what someone in his camp might have said earlier this year) - but regardless, the single biggest thing we will need replaced is the leadership who will demand the "team" approach, no egos, no "me," and all that. With Gary and Kevin, that just was not going to happen this year, no way. It was their team and that was not the way they played - ergo no one else would either.

It will be surreal seeing that team go out next year and not feel it is in the loving protection of KP and GBJ. However, risk sometimes is rewarded. Gary and Kevin were the best guard tandom ever at GU (IMO) but they clearly got out-athleted today by one of the perhaps 3 or 4 teams that could do it. It is conceivable that Perk, EMac, Melson, KD and Alberts will not be so easy to guard and provide sufficient defense.

Someone will need to step up from 3 land, even if KW does return. I thought I saw EMac knock a couple of big shots this year, but he wasn't called on to shoot much. Jenks/Perk shot better than I expected before he was hurt.

If KW does come back, this team might be better, physically. Whether it can get the job done mentally, with the leadership and team approach is yet to be seen. KW/KD/PK all seniors, they'll have to step up.

MDABE80
03-29-2015, 10:31 PM
Wiltjer, a fourth-year junior, was asked if he was committed to returning to what should be another talented GU team. “Of course,” he said. “I’ve got one more year of eligibility.”
I think we'll have 4 good bigs and surely 4-5 good guards and wings. Emac on defense with Dranginis is formidable. Perks dishing.........
If all this holds, we'll be a top 10 to begin the year.
Duke outscored us 13-1 . We didn't D and we didn't O much. It's how ya get beat.

Honestly neither our two 3 point threats ( KP and Gary) didn't sink 3's dependably even though each added much more in other categories. We need some very very good 3 pt shooters next year. Lots of work in the offseason to be done.

Let it be!

WallaWallaZag
03-29-2015, 11:19 PM
Honestly neither our two 3 point threats ( KP and Gary) didn't sink 3's dependably even though ach added much more in other categories. We need some very very good 3 pt shooters next year. Lots of work in the offseason to be done.

i honestly think the dome effect was in their heads a little bit after the ucla game...and i'm guessing they struggled to shoot during practices as well. they were taking and making the same shots pretty much the entire season. pangos struggled on d, but normally he can even it out on the other end, and zags played more than enough defense to win the game holding duke to 66.

based on practice reports, alberts is the best shooter of the bunch so he may get more run than some are expecting...not sure about the rest of his game, but he's no slouch from an athlete standpoint and he's got good size.

Birddog
03-30-2015, 04:07 AM
Just to be clear, I have zero sources. Let's put it this way......I've been on all 3 versions of this board for 17 years, I know who knows what and what they say, or don't say is very telling. At this point, I'd be shocked if KW returns; also ecstatic. Just look at his quote from tonight; it's pretty clear he isn't coming back.

And in those 17 years you have taken on many untenable positions.

thespywhozaggedme
03-30-2015, 05:31 AM
Whoever called any posters "ignorant" in this thread? Like I said, I've been here for around 17 years, after a while, you know who knows what. From all that I've heard, Kyle will not be returning next season. To repeat, I hope that I am 100% wrong and will be ecstatic if I am.
Please inform some of us ignorant posters with quotes where it is stated that he is not coming back.

and please inform us who the mod is that is NEVER WRONG?
I hope that it is not Bobzag.

thespywhozaggedme
03-30-2015, 05:33 AM
And in those 17 years you have taken on many untenable positions.More than many.

thespywhozaggedme
03-30-2015, 05:34 AM
He's a lock to go top 5, but I agree with you, I don't think he'll be dominant in the NBA.
O/T, but I think Okafor comes back for another year. He had a very pedestrian game today, often manhandled by Shem and Domas. He doesn't yet have the upper body strength to go against NBA caliber power forwards.

Birddog
03-30-2015, 05:43 AM
More than many.

Got me. I hate that!

LongIslandZagFan
03-30-2015, 06:00 AM
Hey, I hope I'm dead wrong. But too many "big wigs" here have intimated as much.

Who????

Could he go... perhaps. IMHO... you don't leave early to go play in Europe and you don't leave early to go second round or un-drafted. So, unless someone is telling him he is going 1st round... I don't see the point in leaving.

gonzagafan62
03-30-2015, 06:11 AM
I am not going to call your posts, ignorant. I have no third party sources, I don't live in Spokane, I've never met Kyle Wiltjer nor do I know his personality.

I will say this though. He is nowhere on any draft scouts boards to go to the NBA. He's not even close.

I wasn't happy with decisions made by Kelly Olynyk, or Austin Daye to leave early, because I knew what they meant to the program going forward. But I was happy for them because they made the decision that they thought best suited them and their families. Go make the money while you can, and avoid injuries in college playing another year. Elias Harris was on draft boards after his freshman season, didn't go, and now isn't even in the NBA .... its been 2 years since he played a second of college basketball, but that kid was a "phenom" after only a few dunks. They needed to go. They got lots of money, and heck both are still earning paychecks (maybe Austin is having a lot of trouble earning playing time.... but he's doing better than us, right spy?)

The more I think about it, this would frustrate me. This would frustrate me if Kyle Wiltjer left for more than a couple reasons. Look at Sim Bhullar of New Mexico State. He left after his sophomore or junior season ..... He's what 7-5, and has lost 40 pounds, scouts say his game is "on the rise" but he clearly needed to be in college longer. He's not even sniffing more than workouts with the Sacramento Kings. And the NBA D-League. Kyle Wiltjer would be the same, if not worse. Kyle is not going to be a "superstar" or anything if he does eventually go to the NBA. His best bet is to enjoy the fun another year in Spokane, become a guy whose team is in the hunt for a Top 10 finish in the polls and gain all the glory once again on route to becoming a lottery pick. He really really needs another year.

Lets just say we have seen it all here at Gonzaga: We have seen:

Adam Morrison leave early
Austin Daye leave early

Ronny Turiaf come back for his senior year so that his good buddy wasn't the only one on senior night
Kelly Olynyk become a monster out of nowhere.

Kyle Wiltjer is a hell of a player. Don't get me wrong. I don't need to be in Spokane, or be close to Wiltjer.... I would be absolutely SHOCKED if he left. SHOCKED! There is no reason to leave without being on draft boards, unless it really is just about the money. And if its about the money, then improve your case for one more year, and get a guaranteed shot (If you play well enough next year) to be a lottery pick and stay on a team for awhile.

Kyle is a great kid, and very smart too. I don't think he's stupid. He's coming back.

Birddog
03-30-2015, 07:27 AM
I don't think anybody has yet mentioned that the Zags have 3 "Wooden Bench" Finalists returning next year! I'm pretty sure no other team can even come close to matching that.

mgadfly
03-30-2015, 07:51 AM
I will say this though. He is nowhere on any draft scouts boards to go to the NBA. He's not even close.


The more I think about it, this would frustrate me. This would frustrate me if Kyle Wiltjer left for more than a couple reasons. Look at Sim Bhullar of New Mexico State. He left after his sophomore or junior season ..... He's what 7-5, and has lost 40 pounds, scouts say his game is "on the rise" but he clearly needed to be in college longer. He's not even sniffing more than workouts with the Sacramento Kings. And the NBA D-League. Kyle Wiltjer would be the same, if not worse. Kyle is not going to be a "superstar" or anything if he does eventually go to the NBA. His best bet is to enjoy the fun another year in Spokane, become a guy whose team is in the hunt for a Top 10 finish in the polls and gain all the glory once again on route to becoming a lottery pick. He really really needs another year.

Lets just say we have seen it all here at Gonzaga: We have seen:

Adam Morrison leave early
Austin Daye leave early

Ronny Turiaf come back for his senior year so that his good buddy wasn't the only one on senior night
Kelly Olynyk become a monster out of nowhere.

And if its about the money, then improve your case for one more year, and get a guaranteed shot (If you play well enough next year) to be a lottery pick and stay on a team for awhile.

Kyle is a great kid, and very smart too. I don't think he's stupid. He's coming back.

I think he's coming back based on his recent comments but any time someone says "guaranteed" and follows it with "if" that isn't a guarantee.

The case for Kyle to leave: He doesn't believe another year in college will address his inadequacies that currently drive down his draft stock. He has already graduated and isn't interested in starting/finishing a masters. He is ready to make some money playing in Europe (which is a fine career choice) or go the undrafted free agent route and try to pick the team that most needs a shooting specialist in the League.

The case for Kyle to stay: He likes being in college and being the star and knows this may be his last chance to be the MAN on a team. He believes he could raise his NBA stock with another summer of hard work and coming back and proving he is a capable wing or post defender (one or the other will work but right now he is stuck in between). He has always dreamed of being drafted into the NBA and he knows it isn't happening this season and his odds may be better next year. He may get time at the "Three" next season (if the comments by coaches are true). He really likes college, the team, coaches, and other players and wants to spend another year with them.

I'm not sure what is the smart decision. If you've graduated and want to move on into the real world and you are satisfied with playing professional basketball and making good money for a team in Europe (maybe with a Mediterranean Beach nearby) then that is a fine option. If you think you have a little more in the tank and want to chase the dream a little more, an All-American senior season isn't a bad choice either (Europe will wait).


And Morrison and Ronny both made the right decisions. If Morrison had waited he wouldn't have made the money he made because the next year's draft was loaded.

TheGonzagaFactor
03-30-2015, 07:54 AM
thespywhozaggedme you're talking way to confidently for someone who's getting his info from another third party source. If wiltjer comes back we're even better if not we'll still be a good team. Based off what he's said today that tells me he's coming back cause like someone else said if you were contemplating leaving you would say that you were going to give it some time to think and speak with family about. The last part you keep hanging on just means he's gonna give it thought before officially coming back. Might not mean much of anything but I was in a twitter convo with another zag fan about Wiltjer possibly leaving about a month ago. The other fan said he'd do good with another year in the program and Wilter favorited that tweet. Can't really confer much from that but to me someone who doesn't plan on returning wouldn't of even bothered to go out his way to favorite a tweet from a random fan... that's just my opinion

http://s1.postimg.org/myxqt0v0b/Screenshot_2015_03_29_22_45_59.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/myxqt0v0b/)

http://s2.postimg.org/b9ja6jg2t/Screenshot_2015_03_29_22_57_09.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/b9ja6jg2t/)

I think Wilt is coming back 100%, but he pretty much favorites all his mentions. Literally every time I've mentioned him (5-10x) he's favorited it and I always see screen captures of fans like "OMG he faved my tweet!"

I'd be willing to guess he just goes through his mentions and faves them all so long as they are positive, assuming he reads them.

U Zig, I Zag
03-30-2015, 08:18 AM
I am not going to say better record-wise ( tougher games next year ), but I think two things:

THIS YEAR we would have been a better team with a full season of a fast, confident dynamic guard in Perkins - but that wasn't to be (FU Georgia dude).

NEXT YEAR we may be an even better team. We really suffered at times, not being able to create. We have a massive, massive front line that will be talked about as as the best in the nation from day one. We need some razzle dazzle ballsy guards that can feed them the ball make some strong moves when needed. We are good with Mc, KD, Melson and the key, Perkins. It's all good in a Zagville. Our young ones are more like the guards of Duke, Mich St, etc then they are like the Bell and Pangos, imho. Not necessarily better, but certainly different.

Great season this year.

BULLDOG#1
03-30-2015, 08:31 AM
I am not going to call your posts, ignorant. I have no third party sources, I don't live in Spokane, I've never met Kyle Wiltjer nor do I know his personality.

I will say this though. He is nowhere on any draft scouts boards to go to the NBA. He's not even close.

I wasn't happy with decisions made by Kelly Olynyk, or Austin Daye to leave early, because I knew what they meant to the program going forward. But I was happy for them because they made the decision that they thought best suited them and their families. Go make the money while you can, and avoid injuries in college playing another year. Elias Harris was on draft boards after his freshman season, didn't go, and now isn't even in the NBA .... its been 2 years since he played a second of college basketball, but that kid was a "phenom" after only a few dunks. They needed to go. They got lots of money, and heck both are still earning paychecks (maybe Austin is having a lot of trouble earning playing time.... but he's doing better than us, right spy?)

The more I think about it, this would frustrate me. This would frustrate me if Kyle Wiltjer left for more than a couple reasons. Look at Sim Bhullar of New Mexico State. He left after his sophomore or junior season ..... He's what 7-5, and has lost 40 pounds, scouts say his game is "on the rise" but he clearly needed to be in college longer. He's not even sniffing more than workouts with the Sacramento Kings. And the NBA D-League. Kyle Wiltjer would be the same, if not worse. Kyle is not going to be a "superstar" or anything if he does eventually go to the NBA. His best bet is to enjoy the fun another year in Spokane, become a guy whose team is in the hunt for a Top 10 finish in the polls and gain all the glory once again on route to becoming a lottery pick. He really really needs another year.

Lets just say we have seen it all here at Gonzaga: We have seen:

Adam Morrison leave early
Austin Daye leave early

Ronny Turiaf come back for his senior year so that his good buddy wasn't the only one on senior night
Kelly Olynyk become a monster out of nowhere.

Kyle Wiltjer is a hell of a player. Don't get me wrong. I don't need to be in Spokane, or be close to Wiltjer.... I would be absolutely SHOCKED if he left. SHOCKED! There is no reason to leave without being on draft boards, unless it really is just about the money. And if its about the money, then improve your case for one more year, and get a guaranteed shot (If you play well enough next year) to be a lottery pick and stay on a team for awhile.

Kyle is a great kid, and very smart too. I don't think he's stupid. He's coming back.

Agree with this 100%. Wiltjer is not ready for the pros like Kelly was... Olynik was pretty much guaranteed a first round and possible lottery -- his decision was pretty easy.
If Wiltjer, Karno, and Sabonis all come back (which is what I expect), then the team will be getting a lot of national pub (gotta be one of if not the best frontcourt in CBB) and be poised for another tournament run. That exposure will surely help Wiltjer's NBA chances.

As far as the team being better next year...

First -- I cannot believe the posters on this board wanting that magic transfer again this year. Wesley was GREAT and the zags wouldn't have had the season they did without him. But next year is Kyle Dranginis' time! He sucked up and took the redshirt when Pangos and Bell came it, then he graciously gave up minutes for Wesley to come in and start. GU would be hard pressed to find a player as skilled and knowledgeable of the system than Dranginis. Remember too, more often than not the transfers don't jive with the system or team.

Nobody can replace Pangos and Bell. Great leaders and great players. That said, the core coming back are ready, talented, and hungry. Perkins, McClellan, and Melson all saw limited minutes this year, but I suspect enough to know what it takes to be successful.

The weakness of the team will be 3-point shooting. This is where Melson and Perkins need to step up. With that front line, there's going to be a lot of open looks on the perimeter. The team's ability to knock down those shots will likely dictate how the season goes. Wiltjer will obviously be key.

Hard to imagine they'd be better than what we saw this year, but they will be STACKED, especially up front.

Should be another great year of Zag ball. Amazing the program Few and co. have built.

gueastcoast
03-30-2015, 09:09 AM
Occam's razor. He says/intimates he's coming back (qualifications notwithstanding), not showing on draft boards, clearly loves the program, and is a smart, centered kid who *should* to make the "logical" decision. Good enough for me.

basketballzag
03-30-2015, 09:42 AM
3 pages so far and not one mention of Rem Bakamus' bolting for the NBA next year? This entire thread is worthless based upon this omission alone.

U Zig, I Zag
03-30-2015, 09:47 AM
3 pages so far and not one mention of Rem Bakamus' bolting for the NBA next year? This entire thread is worthless based upon this omission alone.

He did do split-duty on a 45 point game. Should get some looks.

BobZag
03-30-2015, 09:55 AM
Sabonis, Karnowski, Wiltjer, Edwards, McLellen, Perkins, Melson, Drags.... One of if not the best front court in the nation.

Who knows what kind of transfers Few is looking to bring in to play the 3.

We will be back!

Oh, the Zags will be good, and likely the favorites to win the WCC again, but you can't lose Pangos, Bell and Wesley and not feel it. I think the team takes a half-step back as Perkins, Melson, etc., begin building up experience. Frontcourt will be solid. Fans really won't know about the Backcourt until Arizona and UCLA come to Spokane, or when the guys go to the Bahamas.

Birddog
03-30-2015, 10:00 AM
3 pages so far and not one mention of Rem Bakamus' bolting for the NBA next year? This entire thread is worthless based upon this omission alone.

Rem and Wiltjer both took a step backwards when they only combined for 16 and 5 yesterday.

PeninsulaDog
03-30-2015, 11:06 AM
Oh, the Zags will be good, and likely the favorites to win the WCC again, but you can't lose Pangos, Bell and Wesley and not feel it. I think the team takes a half-step back as Perkins, Melson, etc., begin building up experience. Frontcourt will be solid. Fans really won't know about the Backcourt until Arizona and UCLA come to Spokane, or when the guys go to the Bahamas.

I think a bigger role for Kyle D. next season (30 mins. +?) will somewhat soften the blow of losing Wesley. Different style of play, but also has ability to drive and get to the rim. I expect inconsistent, sometimes erratic, sometimes brilliant play from Perkins and Melson. If things trend more toward the brilliant, it might be a very, very good season.

bartruff1
03-30-2015, 11:26 AM
I don't think so...with a inexperienced backcourt.... I for one will be surprised if any of the 3 bigs comes back.... Yes....I know what they are saying now, but it is a long time from now till practice opens and Spokane is a long ways from home for some...this was a special team.....players were willing to sacrifice under the example set by senior leadership....

I expect next year to be a rebuilding year.

A record slightly below the average for the last 16 years....we might even experience the bubble phenomenon .......But very entertaining...

gonzagafan62
03-30-2015, 11:28 AM
we might even experience the bubble phenomenon .......But very entertaining...

Not again. We did that enough in 2011 to make me pull my hair out every night. Thank goodness we won the conference tournament.

sittingon50
03-30-2015, 12:01 PM
Rem and Wiltjer both took a step backwards when they only combined for 16 and 5 yesterday.

In Rem's defense, it was a pregame case of bad tacos.

seacatfan
03-30-2015, 12:10 PM
I don't think so...with a inexperienced backcourt.... I for one will be surprised if any of the 3 bigs comes back.... Yes....I know what they are saying now, but it is a long time from now till practice opens and Spokane is a long ways from home for some...this was a special team.....players were willing to sacrifice under the example set by senior leadership....

I expect next year to be a rebuilding year.

A record slightly below the average for the last 16 years....we might even experience the bubble phenomenon .......But very entertaining...

All 3 bigs leaving? That's a bold prediction.

Zagceo
03-30-2015, 12:17 PM
Experience does help but IMO experience was not the deciding factor against duke.

The Freshmen and Sophomore guards of duke sure didn't need more experience.

Look forward to seeing Perk, Mel, and Mac become IMO our most athletic back court ever next year!!!!!!

GUZag08
03-30-2015, 12:44 PM
Karnowski and Sabonis really need to learn how to stay out of foul trouble if they wish to start at the same time.

Remember....Spokane Arena is a hosting a subregional next year. It's really important that the Bulldogs do everything possible to secure a high seed in the tourney so that they can take advantage of it.

Would a 4 seed get us there?

sittingon50
03-30-2015, 12:45 PM
All 3 bigs leaving? That's a bold prediction.

So Nunez is now the starting 4.

gonzagafan62
03-30-2015, 12:46 PM
Would a 4 seed get us there?

I would think so. A Top 4 seed usually is protected. I would feel a lot safer with a 3. We really have to beat the same tams we did this season to have a shot at it. That's going to be tough.

DixieZag
03-30-2015, 01:00 PM
All 3 bigs leaving? That's a bold prediction.

It is also a near 0% possibility.

I think the odds way far more in likelihood of all 3 coming back than all three leaving. And, I think it more likely that 2 come back rather than one.

None of them are first round draft picks. The one that is mostly likely a first round pick, Sabonis, is the one we've heard the most about wanting a college experience and education.

gonzagafan62
03-30-2015, 01:04 PM
It is also a near 0% possibility.

I think the odds way far more in likelihood of all 3 coming back than all three leaving. And, I think it more likely that 2 come back rather than one.

None of them are first round draft picks. The one that is mostly likely a first round pick, Sabonis, is the one we've heard the most about wanting a college experience and education.

In the immortal words of the wise: "It would be cool if all three came back"

BULLDOG#1
03-30-2015, 01:12 PM
.... I for one will be surprised if any of the 3 bigs comes back.... ...

And each of the three sign contracts to pay in Europe?

I thought Wiltjer had his eye on the NBA... and he's not ready as of yet.

Karno will likely be a long-time Euro pro, but why wouldn't he stay? Euro contracts will be there in another year... A great senior year and he's got a shot at the NBA. Like Wiltjer, he's not quite there right now.

Sabonis would likely get some NBA looks this year, but another year or two would definitely help him -- I don't think he's a first rounder as of right now. If he was content on signing a Euro contract, why would he come over here in the first place?

I'm betting all three are back.

HillBillyZag
03-30-2015, 01:13 PM
All of the want2be Coaches shilling for their favorite players already and little praise or mention?, of mine. I might as well ask my question ? What of returning Junior Kyle Dranginis , who with GBJ's departure will be the best defender and arguably one of two or three best all around players on the Squad. I have no idea what Coach Few's plans for the young man are?, but I do know one Division One Coach in this area has stated Drano could start for him tomorrow.

ZagLawGrad
03-30-2015, 01:29 PM
I'm looking forward to Melson and Perkins being unleashed.

SteelZag
03-30-2015, 01:32 PM
All of the want2be Coaches shilling for their favorite players already and little praise or mention?, of mine. I might as well ask my question ? What of returning Junior Kyle Dranginis , who with GBJ's departure will be the best defender and arguably one of two or three best all around players on the Squad. I have no idea what Coach Few's plans for the young man are?, but I do know one Division One Coach in this area has stated Drano could start for him tomorrow.

Are we now going to have to worry about Draino graduating this spring?

Martin Centre Mad Man
03-30-2015, 01:40 PM
If three out of our four big men return, we'll be a Top 25 team and the favorite to win our league. We won't be a Top 10 team after losing those outstanding senior guards, but we will still be pretty good.

HillBillyZag
03-30-2015, 01:58 PM
The attitude you display is pretty common. What it says to me is that we have seen KD play for two years now. We know his passing is great, he can take it to the hole, shoot the short floater, and the three plus after GBJ's Graduation, he'll be the best one on one defender coming back. This season his scoring was not needed/encouraged, they wanted his hustle, along with his defense, passing, and boarding so he wasn't encouraged to shoot much. Overall the kid is a baller, with demonstrated skills, not an elite athlete, perhaps?, but at 6' 5", athletic enough to get the job done. Yet many equate him merely a decently skilled local kid, a good backup at the 2 & 3, who fits in well and hustles. IMHO Dranginis can be much more than that, given the opportunity?, in his Senior Year, he could be a Star.

JokerZag
03-30-2015, 02:51 PM
Are we now going to have to worry about Draino graduating this spring?

Good question. Anyone?? With four years of classes and, I assume, some summer school under his belt, it would be difficult not to be graduating.

mgadfly
03-30-2015, 02:54 PM
The attitude you display is pretty common. What it says to me is that we have seen KD play for two years now. We know his passing is great, he can take it to the hole, shoot the short floater, and the three plus after GBJ's Graduation, he'll be the best one on one defender coming back. This season his scoring was not needed/encouraged, they wanted his hustle, along with his defense, passing, and boarding so he wasn't encouraged to shoot much. Overall the kid is a baller, with demonstrated skills, not an elite athlete, perhaps?, but at 6' 5", athletic enough to get the job done. Yet many equate him merely a decently skilled local kid, a good backup at the 2 & 3, who fits in well and hustles. IMHO Dranginis can be much more than that, given the opportunity?, in his Senior Year, he could be a Star.

I expect Dranginis to be given every opportunity to have a great senior season. And I'd wager he makes the most of it. I thought he did a great job coming into the Duke game and getting penetration when no one else was really getting it done. If you look at his efficiency statistics he pretty much did everything Wesley did but block more shots, shoot better from 2 pt, 3 pt, and free throw range. And I loved Wesley ... so I'm excited to see Dranginis' minutes/usage go from 45% to 65 to 70% next season.

CDC84
03-30-2015, 03:10 PM
Would a 4 seed get us there?

It isn't a guarantee. Georgetown and Louisville were 4's and had to play their first two games in Portland and Seattle. But I think that was also the result of there being so few quality teams out west. It's best to shoot for a 3 or better.

seacatfan
03-30-2015, 03:18 PM
Agree, I'm a Dranginis fan. Maybe wouldn't score quite as much as Wesley but I think he does everything else as well or better. And I think he can raise his scoring quite a bit. He is a better shooter than Wesley. Not as good driving and finishing but he's shown he can do that as well. I'd really like to see him starting at the 3 next year. Lesser players have been starters at GU in years past.

WallaWallaZag
03-30-2015, 07:45 PM
Agree, I'm a Dranginis fan. Maybe wouldn't score quite as much as Wesley but I think he does everything else as well or better. And I think he can raise his scoring quite a bit. He is a better shooter than Wesley. Not as good driving and finishing but he's shown he can do that as well. I'd really like to see him starting at the 3 next year. Lesser players have been starters at GU in years past.

what separates wesley is/was his ability to make moves while attacking the rim, spins, hesitations, changing directions...weaving through traffic and going all the way or pulling up for a floater. dranginis (and bell too) are straight line drivers who need a clear path to the basket. wesley was also like pargo/bouldin in that he could post up anyone close to his size...zags probably could have utilized this trait of his even more when they had the opportunity, especially against the likes of duke when struggling to score.

john montana
03-30-2015, 08:06 PM
KD is one of my favorites. He will have a great year next year. Really underrated player.

thespywhozaggedme
03-30-2015, 08:31 PM
:cheers::clap::000tens:

Oregonzagnut
03-30-2015, 08:36 PM
For Dranginis, the starting spot at the 2 or 3 is his to lose IMO. Perkins/Melson at the PG-SG, McClellan/Dranginis at the SG or Wing, Wiltjer/Sabonis at the Wing/PF and Karnowski/Edwards at the 5? WOW!

We know our front court will be better, but Pangos and Bell are irreplaceable. What frontcourt in the nation would be better than Karnowski/Sabonis/Wiltjer? Could Perkins and Melson be better than Pangos/Bell to feed them the ball? I think McClellan might start at PG or SG next year McClellan/Dranginis?

Imagine the guards available to Few with this front court we got coming next year, knock on wood.

The kids who will join us this off-season will be even better than we expected. Expect some transfers out o the program and transfers in again, as always, to be expected.

jchocolate99
03-30-2015, 09:05 PM
For Dranginis, the starting spot at the 2 or 3 is his to lose IMO. Perkins/Melson at the PG-SG, McClellan/Dranginis at the SG or Wing, Wiltjer/Sabonis at the Wing/PF and Karnowski/Edwards at the 5? WOW!

We know our front court will be better, but Pangos and Bell are irreplaceable. What frontcourt in the nation would be better than Karnowski/Sabonis/Wiltjer? Could Perkins and Melson be better than Pangos/Bell to feed them the ball? I think McClellan might start at PG or SG next year McClellan/Dranginis?

Imagine the guards available to Few with this front court we got coming next year, knock on wood.

The kids who will join us this off-season will be even better than we expected. Expect some transfers out o the program and transfers in again, as always, to be expected.

McClellan isn't sniffing the starting spot at PG... Now the SG that is another thing entirely that he could take from Melson. Perkins was already getting 20mins a game before he got hurt so already right there that shows the trust Few already has in Perkins.

Hoopaholic
03-30-2015, 09:21 PM
what separates wesley is/was his ability to make moves while attacking the rim, spins, hesitations, changing directions...weaving through traffic and going all the way or pulling up for a floater. dranginis (and bell too) are straight line drivers who need a clear path to the basket. wesley was also like pargo/bouldin in that he could post up anyone close to his size...zags probably could have utilized this trait of his even more when they had the opportunity, especially against the likes of duke when struggling to score.

like the play against Duke where Draino drove from the right wing baseline, under the basket, swung around to the left wing then across the free throw line and back to the hoop for the layup......disagree he is simply a straight line attacker

I see draino being able to attack the gaps AND shoot the three ball, while being as good a rebounder as Wesley brought to the table. His overall defense is better.

I cant wait to see him on the court for a consistent 25 minutes a game

WallaWallaZag
03-30-2015, 11:05 PM
like the play against Duke where Draino drove from the right wing baseline, under the basket, swung around to the left wing then across the free throw line and back to the hoop for the layup......disagree he is simply a straight line attacker.

that to me was still a "straight-line" drive (long strides)...it was circular but no shorter quicker changes in direction that led to a direct attack on the hoop...semantics :p. what made wesley special to me was his ability to attack with his back to the basket...off the dribble on drives or post ups...most guards don't have that ability. don't get me wrong, i'm a huge fan of dranginis and think he has a higher ceiling than wesley cuz of shooting ability, but wesley was someone you could iso with the shot clock winding down and i don't think kd is that kind of player. in fact, imo, few should have put the ball in wesley's hands for every end of half play...we all know how good the zags are at that.

Birddog
03-31-2015, 03:23 AM
like the play against Duke where Draino drove from the right wing baseline, under the basket, swung around to the left wing then across the free throw line and back to the hoop for the layup......disagree he is simply a straight line attacker

I see draino being able to attack the gaps AND shoot the three ball, while being as good a rebounder as Wesley brought to the table. His overall defense is better.

I cant wait to see him on the court for a consistent 25 minutes a game

Agree with that. KD has more to his game than he is credited for. I can see by the posts in the last few days that KD will likely be a polarizing topic up to and possibly through next season as the forum experts weigh in on why he should or should not be getting X minutes. Replay the Mike Hart debate. I thought KD's contributions to the team this year down the stretch were equal to Wesleys but in a different way. JMO

john montana
03-31-2015, 07:04 AM
Agree with that. KD has more to his game than he is credited for. I can see by the posts in the last few days that KD will likely be a polarizing topic up to and possibly through next season as the forum experts weigh in on why he should or should not be getting X minutes. Replay the Mike Hart debate. I thought KD's contributions to the team this year down the stretch were equal to Wesleys but in a different way. JMO

A lot of games down the stretch we were flat out better with KD on the floor. I don't think there is now or will be later a question...KD is going to get and deserve heavy minutes. He might not average 20 pts a game, but he will impact every game.

thegloriousgoateeofKP
03-31-2015, 09:00 AM
A lot of games down the stretch we were flat out better with KD on the floor. I don't think there is now or will be later a question...KD is going to get and deserve heavy minutes. He might not average 20 pts a game, but he will impact every game.

I liked us better with KD than with Wesley too. KD is gonna be a stat sheet stuffer. 12 pts, 8 boards, several assists, a steal here and there...75% from the line, 40% from 3...oh yeah, and a solid defender as well. He's a versatile, crafty, athletic, shooting guard.

IowaSERE
03-31-2015, 09:08 AM
I liked us better with KD than with Wesley too. KD is gonna be a stat sheet stuffer. 12 pts, 8 boards, several assists, a steal here and there...75% from the line, 40% from 3...oh yeah, and a solid defender as well. He's a versatile, crafty, athletic, shooting guard.

Those are Collinsworth numbers. I hope that you are right.

jazzdelmar
03-31-2015, 09:48 AM
Wes showed a lot early, then drifted down with a few bright moments. KD came on strong. Two different players, neither a star. I was equally excited and anxious when they both had the ball on offense.

thegloriousgoateeofKP
03-31-2015, 09:57 AM
Wes showed a lot early, then drifted down with a few bright moments. KD came on strong. Two different players, neither a star. I was equally excited and anxious when they both had the ball on offense.

Just curious: what are your reservations about KD's game?

Maybe I look at him through Zags-colored glasses, but I can't help seeing potential all-around star

jazzdelmar
03-31-2015, 10:08 AM
Just curious: what are your reservations about KD's game?

Maybe I look at him through Zags-colored glasses, but I can't help seeing potential all-around star

Sure. Ball handling is shaky and his distance shooting isn't super. His hesitancy to shoot is also of concern. Just not athletic enough to be a Collinsworth, imo. But a solid GU type role player. Mike Hart like with a decent offensive game.

thegloriousgoateeofKP
03-31-2015, 10:31 AM
Sure. Ball handling is shaky and his distance shooting isn't super. His hesitancy to shoot is also of concern. Just not athletic enough to be a Collinsworth, imo. But a solid GU type role player. Mike Hart like with a decent offensive game.

I could sure as heck live with that outcome! I think he's been hesitant to shoot threes because we've had better options from behind the arc. Next year, we won't.

Bouldin4Prez
03-31-2015, 06:54 PM
The thing that KD has that many basketball players don't is that he just has a nose for the ball. This is an underrated talent that cannot be explained. The guy always seems to find himself around the action and that's a quality that I love. I think jazz said it best, a Mike Hart type with a better offensive game. As far as stat lines for next season, I'm seeing 12 PPG 6 REB 4 AST 2 STL 1 BLK.

On another note, I cannot contain my excitement for seeing Perkins slicing through the lane and dropping dimes to our front court next season. I don't think we have ever had a PG in the mold of Perkins, if Few cuts him loose, I wouldn't be surprised to see a couple 10 AST games sprinkled in next year from him. Any stats guys care to look up the last time we had a player dish out double digit assists in a game?

strikenowhere
03-31-2015, 07:28 PM
The thing that KD has that many basketball players don't is that he just has a nose for the ball. This is an underrated talent that cannot be explained. The guy always seems to find himself around the action and that's a quality that I love. I think jazz said it best, a Mike Hart type with a better offensive game. As far as stat lines for next season, I'm seeing 12 PPG 6 REB 4 AST 2 STL 1 BLK.

On another note, I cannot contain my excitement for seeing Perkins slicing through the lane and dropping dimes to our front court next season. I don't think we have ever had a PG in the mold of Perkins, if Few cuts him loose, I wouldn't be surprised to see a couple 10 AST games sprinkled in next year from him. Any stats guys care to look up the last time we had a player dish out double digit assists in a game?

This is no doubt in my mind that had Perkins not been injured this year, the Zags would have made it to the FF (not necessarily against Duke as the seeding would have been better). I think that out of all the years I've watched the Zags going back to the start of the run, Perkins has the potential to be the best point guard of the modern Zag era. We know he can drive to the hoop and also shoot the three, but its the passing and play creation that is what is so exciting. It was a huge blow to lose him so early in the season. Kevin did a great job running the point, but having him move to the off-guard as a spot-up three shooter would have added an extra dimension to the Zags overall game. I really cannot wait to see Perkins dumping off no-looks to the bigs next year!

Baseline
03-31-2015, 10:30 PM
With the addition of Edwards and KW's return we will have an improved inside game and if Sabonis takes a jump we could have the best in the nation.
Jenks will anchor the guards and we have a very good batch to draw from for the 2 and 3. if we get a surprise in these we will be better than this year.
FF Book it!

WallaWallaZag
04-01-2015, 02:22 AM
The thing that KD has that many basketball players don't is that he just has a nose for the ball. As far as stat lines for next season, I'm seeing 12 PPG 6 REB 4 AST 2 STL 1 BLK.

i hope you're right, but that's extremely optimistic imo...that would mean he scores more than pangos did this year, more assists than pangos in any of his first three years, and basically same/more rebounds than karnowski this year. you sure???

kd averaged 17.2 min/game this year...if we double his averages from this year it would play out as 8.2ppg / 5.2rpg / 3.4apg -- which seems more realistic to me, though it would be really really helpful to next year's team if his scoring trends towards your prediction...at least break double digits.

ZagaZags
04-01-2015, 02:39 AM
i hope you're right, but that's extremely optimistic imo...that would mean he scores more than pangos did this year, more assists than pangos in any of his first three years, and basically same/more rebounds than karnowski this year. you sure???

kd averaged 17.2 min/game this year...if we double his averages from this year it would play out as 8.2ppg / 5.2rpg / 3.4apg -- which seems more realistic to me, though it would be really really helpful to next year's team if his scoring trends towards your prediction or at least break double digits.

KD won't get 30+ mpg next season. I'm willing to bet another 12 pack on that. Time for me to collect from Zag67.

montanazag88
04-01-2015, 03:43 AM
that to me was still a "straight-line" drive (long strides)...it was circular but no shorter quicker changes in direction that led to a direct attack on the hoop...semantics :p. what made wesley special to me was his ability to attack with his back to the basket...off the dribble on drives or post ups...most guards don't have that ability. don't get me wrong, i'm a huge fan of dranginis and think he has a higher ceiling than wesley cuz of shooting ability, but wesley was someone you could iso with the shot clock winding down and i don't think kd is that kind of player. in fact, imo, few should have put the ball in wesley's hands for every end of half play...we all know how good the zags are at that.

No question. Best Bball assessment of Wesley and suggestions for his use. Would much rather have had him shooting at the end of periods than Pangos this year. Wesley would also have a significantly greater chance of getting to the line.

jazzdelmar
04-01-2015, 04:17 AM
Agree on Josh (henceforth my name for him whether he likes it or not), with him all year we are a better team. But the notion that as a result KP wd have had a better year if he played SG at times does not wash for me. Sliding him over never had its desired effect, when David took the point, or Josh, or Mac, or even GB. KP was just not that kind of player who cd get his own shot. Indeed he had a better chance of doing so with the ball. We saw glimpses in his soph year but nothing since. So scratch that advantage w a year of Josh but all the rest, such as getting into the lane and dishing, something KP did not do much of, for sure.

Birddog
04-01-2015, 04:39 AM
KP was just not that kind of player who cd get his own shot. Indeed he had a better chance of doing so with the ball. We saw glimpses in his soph year but nothing since
Did you forget that Pangos played while he was injured for almost his entire Jr year.

jazzdelmar
04-01-2015, 04:51 AM
Did you forget that Pangos played while he was injured for almost his entire Jr year.

No I have not. What does that have to do with the price of asparagus? Perhaps the injury hampered him, is that your point? Maybe, but KP is not a shake and bake player and my point was having Josh all year would not have materially aided KP as an off guard, though it would have been a major plus for the team.

WallaWallaZag
04-01-2015, 05:03 AM
No I have not. What does that have to do with the price of asparagus? Perhaps the injury hampered him, is that your point? Maybe, but KP is not a shake and bake player and my point was having Josh all year would not have materially aided KP as an off guard, though it would have been a major plus for the team.

partly disagree -- in that it would have allowed the zags to practice running him around screens all over the place like a haws or dee...

Birddog
04-01-2015, 05:09 AM
Perhaps the injury hampered him, is that your point?
Precisely. I get where you are going, but I think you are short selling "what might have been", based at least in part on what you saw from him as a Jr. Alas, we'll never know. it's all speculation but i have to believe the coaching staff saw something in that scenario.

WallaWallaZag
04-01-2015, 05:34 AM
Agree with that. KD has more to his game than he is credited for. I can see by the posts in the last few days that KD will likely be a polarizing topic up to and possibly through next season as the forum experts weigh in on why he should or should not be getting X minutes. Replay the Mike Hart debate. I thought KD's contributions to the team this year down the stretch were equal to Wesleys but in a different way. JMO

don't think the discussion surrounding kd will be anything like hart...hart was a non-factor on offense. every post on kd i've seen has the expectation of him being a starter, to start the season at least...the debate is on how much of a leap in his game can we realistically expect? i'm worried about next year's perimeter shooting because both kd and melson shot 34% from deep taking basically only wide open stress free 3's (well, melson pulled the trigger on some questionable attempts, also small sample size, but point remains).

Mantua
04-01-2015, 04:05 PM
Next year KW could show the scouts that he can play defense. When he's been fired up this year, he's been a good defender. I think he and Few need to work out those moments of indecision between playing on the ball down low and hovering on the arc.