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View Full Version : POLL: IST ROUND EXIT IN NCAA'S OR FINAL GAME OF NIT?



thespywhozaggedme
02-23-2014, 11:14 AM
Title says it all, if you had to choose one, which would you choose; a non descript first round exit with 32 other teams in the NCAA tourney, or the championship game of the NIT in MSG on ESPN. Answer honestly and not politically correct.

jim77
02-23-2014, 11:17 AM
I'll take a first round loss in the dance any day. Going to the NIT is like going to the prom....with you're sister!

gonwick
02-23-2014, 11:25 AM
Awesome question, and that is not just because I wondered the same thing in another thread. I vote NCAA tournament. This is principally because it seems to be a major asset in recruiting, that players can expect to make the tournament.
Arguments I can see for the nit:
Maybe it jolts few out of his comfort zone and in the years to come gu is better for it. Unfortunately, I'm not sure he will get that message and the potential for learning could be lost.
They will hopefully play more than one game. Of course, the only thing worse than bowing out in the first game of the ncaas and reinforcing the gonzaga can't hack it narrative would be to do the same in the nit.

GoZags
02-23-2014, 11:33 AM
My vote would be to win 3 games or so in the NCAA tourney .... but since that isn't an option I'd take the NCAA berth. One can't underestimate the historic nature of Gonzaga's current NCAA tourney streak. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Men%27s_Division_I_Basketball_Tournament_cons ecutive_appearances

If this season ends up being GU's 4th "one and done" during a 16 year consecutive tourney streak, then so be it.

Edited to add: There is NOTHING (my opinion) "non descript" about earning an NCAA tournament berth. I continue to take nothing for granted and appreciate each time the Zags get their name called on Selection Sunday.

TacomaZAG
02-23-2014, 11:36 AM
NCAA berth for sure, not even close.........

Keep the streak alive.

Go ZAGS

coolhandzag
02-23-2014, 11:47 AM
Title says it all, if you had to choose one, which would you choose; a non descript first round exit with 32 other teams in the NCAA tourney, or the championship game of the NIT in MSG on ESPN. Answer honestly and not politically correct.

Who says this team can make the NIT championship?

I'd take the NC2A anyday.

thespywhozaggedme
02-23-2014, 01:08 PM
My vote would be to win 3 games or so in the NCAA tourney .... but since that isn't an option I'd take the NCAA berth. One can't underestimate the historic nature of Gonzaga's current NCAA tourney streak. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Men%27s_Division_I_Basketball_Tournament_cons ecutive_appearances

If this season ends up being GU's 4th "one and done" during a 16 year consecutive tourney streak, then so be it.

Edited to add: There is NOTHING (my opinion) "non descript" about earning an NCAA tournament berth. I continue to take nothing for granted and appreciate each time the Zags get their name called on Selection Sunday.

You make excellent points, the only thing I might disagree with is being 1 of 32 teams to lose in the first round; no one remembers them, but no one remembers who plays in the NIT finals either; only thing is, the later is in MSG and on ESPN. I dunno how I feel, it's a great question.

thespywhozaggedme
02-23-2014, 01:09 PM
I'm at the point where; if we keep never going past the round of 32, who cares about the streak?
NCAA berth for sure, not even close.........

Keep the streak alive.

Go ZAGS

Zagceo
02-23-2014, 01:12 PM
I'm at the point where; if we keep never going past the round of 32, who cares about the streak?

I agree................ except there is big money for making tourney so there's that!

zag944
02-23-2014, 01:12 PM
NCAA. Even if we lost a play in game by 40 points.

DixieZag
02-23-2014, 01:15 PM
NCAA tournament - - not only is it like being in the lottery, but the streak is extremely important right now.

I don't want any of our current seniors being the ones that are the class that broke the streak - we saw how hard the one that broke the steak about conference wins and how hard that hit them.

GoZags
02-23-2014, 02:32 PM
I'm at the point where; if we keep never going past the round of 32, who cares about the streak?

5 times (out of the 15) the Zags have gone past the round of 32.

At present (i.e. as of today) only two schools .... Kansas and Gonzaga have won at least one game in each of the last 5 dances.

Feel free to make comments like "who cares about the streak" or pat yourself on the back for starting this poll/thread.

I'm still of the belief that the best days for Gonzaga Basketball (i.e. deep runs and Final Four(s)) continue to lie ahead.

That being said, the most important thing right now is a win at Pacific.

vandalzag
02-23-2014, 02:49 PM
I'm at the point where; if we keep never going past the round of 32, who cares about the streak?

I think you should be realistic and put in the CBI. Because playing extended games in the CBI have helped other programs and mean much more than winning a game in the NCAA tourney. Now if we could figure out a way to play in the NJCAA tourney we would really be cooking with gas.

Oregonzagnut
02-23-2014, 02:50 PM
There is no way that we would be NIT champs if we can't defend against average teams like USD, Portland.

Few needs to have the team sit and watch Hoosiers again. Then watch Rudy. Then watch Rocky. It can't hurt, and the guys need to regroup mentally and if Few can't inspire heart passion and fire, then give that job to Adam Morrison ASAP and let the kids have some fun for a change.

Id rather see that and lose, then see the kids with blank stares looking at the sidelines for inspiration and something new and still lose.

TheGonzagaFactor
02-23-2014, 07:44 PM
I'll take the NCAA appearance each and every time.

TheGonzagaFactor
02-23-2014, 07:46 PM
NCAA. Even if we lost a play in game by 40 points.

Exactly.

ZagLawGrad
02-23-2014, 07:51 PM
Record isn't bad. Probably will make the Dance, but likely out the first round.

Least favorite Zags team for me since the run started. Some players on this team have had major minutes in their careers, yet many of the mistakes being made are ridiculous.

Who is the leader on this team? Doesn't seem to be anyone taking the lead.

CdAZagFan
02-23-2014, 07:57 PM
Definitely the Big Dance… I was crushed when the streak of consecutive league championships came to an end. If the March dance comes to an end, it will be very disappointing.

Ezag
02-23-2014, 08:34 PM
I'll take a first round loss in the dance any day. Going to the NIT is like going to the prom....with you're sister!

Kinda of weird how NIT went from being the original "big dance" to irrelevant

ZagaZags
02-23-2014, 08:46 PM
Is it selfish of me to want to see the Zags play 5 more games in the NIT vs 1 game in March Madness? This could be 4 extra games to develop this roster for next season.( Lord knows they need it. ) It would also allow GU to play a few more home games. I would take an NIT championship over 1 and done.

I want to see Dower play as many games as he can to end his career at GU. ( I'm gonna miss that player. )

ZagSports
02-23-2014, 09:20 PM
No disrespect to OP or any who feel the NIT would be okay for this year. It has nothing to do with the "streak", it has to do with potential recruits. Players come to Gonzaga to play on a top 25 team, play on espn, and play in the dance. This years team exceeded expectations early where in reality we are exactly where a lot of us thought we would be. Yes it sucks that we are in a slump right now, stick with the team they will be fine! I will still give them my 100% biased minimum of 1 win in my bracket regardless of time, location, and opponent.

TexasZag
02-24-2014, 07:14 AM
I look at some of the schools that have played the NIT recently and don't see where playing in the NIT hurt them with recruits. If I'm not mistaken, Kentucky played in the NIT last year (even losing early) and still landed what some consider the best recruiting class (2013) of all time. Here are some of the schools that played the 2013 post season NIT, with their 247 Sports 2014 class rankings (all ranked ahead of GU):
Kentucky #2
Maryland #10
Stanford #14
Providence #21
Alabama #23
BYU #24

For a top-tier program the, "NIT loses you recruits" argument appears to be a strawman.

Playing and having success in the NIT a) gets you national exposure, and b) teaches you how to win. You should never underestimate the long-term value of experiencing success, such as would be the case in their hypothetical advancing to the championship of the NIT.

On the other hand, repeated early-outs at the NCAA tournament may be subconsciously teaching the team that it does not belong at that level. Lord knows we see enough press arguing that, because of their inability to advance, Gonzaga is overrated and that their string of appearances in the NCAA Tournament is more a function of them playing in a cupcake conference than them being worthy of the opportunities they've had (and failed to capitalize on).

ZagSports
02-24-2014, 07:44 AM
Gonzaga when it comes to recruiting is not a top-tier program. While Gonzaga is starting to get decent recruits numbers wise, they have always been known for finding the diamond in the rough. All the program you listed above are from major conferences that at least somewhat care about their MBB program. I would also argue teams get way more national exposure in March Madness than they do in the NIT (whether or not you go 1 and done).

On that harsh at the end I would say there are probably just off the top of my head no more than 2, possibly 3 years where the only reason Gonzaga got in during this run was because of the WCC. Really the only year that I can truly think of off the top of my head was the Heytvelt incident year.

The big dance is about magic, making a deep run that no one expected. All it takes is a team to click at the right time and have some favorable matchups and you never know what can happen. But you don't give that a chance to happen unless you play in the tournament

cbbfanatic
02-24-2014, 07:51 AM
For a top-tier program the, "NIT loses you recruits" argument appears to be a strawman.



agree wholeheartedly. i sometimes wonder why there seems to be such fear of or disdain for the NIT around here. everyone that's anyone has had their NIT years. there's no shame in it. at all.

the streak is nice, but its more of a talking point than anything else at this point, in my opinion. given that the ncaa results are lacking recently. an NIT run COULD be galvanizing, could make the program hungrier, could be positive in a lot of ways. i still have a hard time opting for it over a one and done ncaa, but there shouldnt be such a sense of fear or shame in ending up in the nit, because guess what, its coming. maybe not this year, maybe not next, but there will be years where gonzaga will be HAPPY with an NIT appearance.

i hope this same attitude towards the NIT isnt coloring GU's scheduling efforts, and their apparent recent-ish divergence from the "anyone anywhere anytime" thing.

cjm720
02-24-2014, 08:10 AM
As much as I'd watch a few more games, we've got to be in it to win it....

TexasZag
02-24-2014, 09:13 AM
Gonzaga when it comes to recruiting is not a top-tier program. While Gonzaga is starting to get decent recruits numbers wise, they have always been known for finding the diamond in the rough. All the program you listed above are from major conferences that at least somewhat care about their MBB program. I would also argue teams get way more national exposure in March Madness than they do in the NIT (whether or not you go 1 and done).

On that harsh at the end I would say there are probably just off the top of my head no more than 2, possibly 3 years where the only reason Gonzaga got in during this run was because of the WCC. Really the only year that I can truly think of off the top of my head was the Heytvelt incident year.

The big dance is about magic, making a deep run that no one expected. All it takes is a team to click at the right time and have some favorable matchups and you never know what can happen. But you don't give that a chance to happen unless you play in the tournament

I don't have much disagreement with what you've said. With that, however, I will add:

On the issue of GU not being a top tier program in the recruiting game - Then, "Oh well! What's an NIT appearance going to hurt, anyway, if we aren't even really in the discussion with these top recruits."

On whether or not the perception is that GU gets in because of their automatic bid - Since 1995 and our first appearance, we have four appearances in the NCAA tourney without the auto bid, and only two appearances when not ranked in the AP Top 25. I'd have to say that the jury is still out on whether or not we are punished for the conference in which we play, but given the press over recent years especially, it's not hard to see that with some the perception is that we are overrated. Whether you and/or I believe otherwise.

I agree whole-heartedly with your setiment on the magic of the tournament. With that said, human nature is for self-doubt to creep in with a string of disappointments. While a deep run can be magical, the consequences of repeately falling short can be devastating. Ever heard of the yips?

Ajay
02-24-2014, 11:02 AM
My nightmare at this stage is a trip to the NIT with the honor of traveling to Seattle - bigger market and arena and playing a very quick and athletic UW team. I think we can agree on the result. And the traffic will suck too.

Mantua
02-24-2014, 11:55 AM
I agree whole-heartedly with your setiment on the magic of the tournament. With that said, human nature is for self-doubt to creep in with a string of disappointments. While a deep run can be magical, the consequences of repeately falling short can be devastating. Ever heard of the yips?

Speaking of yips, is the NIT guaranteed?

ZagMan in Philly
02-24-2014, 12:07 PM
I think we will rally and win the WCC tourney, get the 8th/9th seed and a rematch with Wichita State in the round of 32 games.

To answer your question, NCAA or bust.

Go Zags!

Zags11
02-24-2014, 12:10 PM
Ncaa by far.

seacatfan
02-24-2014, 12:59 PM
It makes sense the streak is going to end eventually. Of course I don't want that to happen and I don't want this to be the year. I've also gotten tired of not getting past the first weekend of the Big Dance. March Madness "magic" has been missing from the GU program for a long time. Hope they get it back, but no guarantees.

Of course going to the NIT isn't as prestigious as the Big Dance. It's better than the CBI or College Insiders or whatever else there is. It's actually not easy getting in the NIT. Only 32 bids and a handful of those go to regular season champs of 1 bid leagues that didn't win their conference tourney. Then all the bubble teams from BCS conferences that didn't make the cut and near misses from the next tier of conferences like the Mountain West and A-10 and there aren't many spots left. I would be surprised if UW made the NIT this year for example.

As much as it would sting to miss the NCAA Tourney, it might be interesting if it got Few to re-evaluate his approach to coaching in recent years. I'm not as optimistic as some Zags fans, I think the program has definitely plateaued and I'm not hopeful the best days are ahead and Final 4 is just around the corner. I just don't see it. Yeah there are some talented players coming in next year, but there have been some really talented GU teams that didn't even get close to a Final 4. Seeing teams like George Mason, VCU and Butler (x2) do it has not set well with me while GU can't get close. None of those teams had more talent than the best GU teams, so it's not a matter of talent.