PDA

View Full Version : If You Were The Parent of a Student Athlete Considering Gonzaga......



Virginia Zags Fan
02-10-2014, 11:24 AM
What would you think of the state of GU Basketball by reading this forum?

Would you be more or less likely to send your kiddo to GU?

If you were a poster and knew potential recruits were reading this board, would it change how you post?

Would you be willing to put down your board name and tell the coaches, players, and other board members what you think face to face?

Food for thought and I welcome your responses.
VZF

gonzagafan62
02-10-2014, 11:28 AM
Nope, Nope, and Nope.

Wouldn't change a thing. Gonzaga loves you. You gotta love who loves you.

bartruff1
02-10-2014, 11:35 AM
Easy Peasy....IMHO, the Forum does not reflect the real world of Gonzaga basketball......I would hate to send a kid to Gonzaga just to be a fan, but love to have him or her play and be coached there .....don't care for the school, highly respect the athletic programs...all of them.

No, I wouldn't change my posts because I don't post things I wouldn't say to a person's face.... absolutely and anyone who wouldn't is a coward.

I have heard that there are a lot of smart people in Virginia...at least Northern Virginia...I believe it...

Zagceo
02-10-2014, 12:01 PM
If you're considering GU as a student athlete and can't take criticism I say please reconsider and go for a more low profile program like EWU or Spokane Falls.

Gonzaga is a great environment and the basketball program has been built with a solid foundation from the days of Fitz. I don't think some message board is going to influence an athlete that is confidante in themselves. Please spare the drama like we are scaring the young stars of the future away because we moan over Zag basketball.

cbbfanatic
02-10-2014, 12:06 PM
re: recruits, their parents, etc... f they're reading this board they're probably doing the same for a few other suitor schools, and i'm guessing they will see much of the same anywhere.

madness
02-10-2014, 12:18 PM
I would offer any coach, player, or potential recruit my direct contact info. Any criticism is only offered constructively.

Hoopaholic
02-10-2014, 12:24 PM
What would you think of the state of GU Basketball by reading this forum?

Would you be more or less likely to send your kiddo to GU?

If you were a poster and knew potential recruits were reading this board, would it change how you post?

Would you be willing to put down your board name and tell the coaches, players, and other board members what you think face to face?

Food for thought and I welcome your responses.
VZF

State of Gonzaga Basketball is exceptional. A family oreinted program that has excelled in all areas be it on the hardwood or in the classroom. They have built a program that is exceptional in all areas. reading the board reflects that level of expectance and demonstrates that the willingness to keep moving the program forward in apositive direction, considering ALL aspects of a student athletes life and impacts they will have during the course of their career.

Question 2: Depends. Depends on my kiddo's personalities, what he or she desires , what he or she long term aspirations or goals are.....and to be honest it is or was my childrens decisions it was my job to provide pro and cons about their exploration and decision, but in the end support them as they make the decision in life

Question3; no I try to be detailed and anlyze and not be destructive I believe you can do both....some may agree with my positions other may disagree withmy positions but I hope that we keep it civil, constructive and in the end if we agree to disagree treat that decision as adults

Question 4: I do all the time, I am not afraid of my opinions, comments or reflections on what I see onthe court and what I view as excellent jobs or areas that I dont understand or think need improving......again it boils down to egnagement in a civil, adult like fashion versus name calling, low blows and outright attacks

Ed Casey

Zag 77
02-10-2014, 12:24 PM
Everybody knows that these message boards are just for fun; fans pontificate and speculate and pass along rumors.........right?

webspinnre
02-10-2014, 12:26 PM
re: recruits, their parents, etc... f they're reading this board they're probably doing the same for a few other suitor schools, and i'm guessing they will see much of the same anywhere.

This. This is what happens whenever you have an online community of essentially anonymous people that all feel passionately about a topic, for better or for worse (and often both). While some of us think it might be nice to have the board be a bit kinder and gentler, that's not particularly likely to happen. If it's any consolation, we're no worse than other similar communities, and probably better than some.

It is certainly my hope that there is nothing on here that I say that I wouldn't be comfortable saying to another poster or a player or coach in person. How much I live up to that is sometimes hard to say.

zagfan24
02-10-2014, 12:27 PM
Before I started teaching my first college class, my grad advisor gave me the following advice (paraphrased): "Whatever you do, don't go to ratemyprofessors.com. If you do, keep in mind that people posting on a website typically are those with extreme opinions and are not at all a representative sample. Either way, you'll come away feeling either too good or too bad about yourself."

I think the issue with most sports message boards is the same. The majority of the posters here are passionate fans (which is good), but that can lead to excessively negative or positive perspectives compared to the overall "GU family."

Hoopaholic
02-10-2014, 12:30 PM
the board is a high tech, interactive system that pushes forward the "water cooler" discussions .....

Zagceo
02-10-2014, 12:42 PM
Easy Peasy....IMHO, the Forum does not reflect the real world of Gonzaga basketball......I would hate to send a kid to Gonzaga just to be a fan, but love to have him or her play and be coached there .....don't care for the school, highly respect the athletic programs...all of them.

No, I wouldn't change my posts because I don't post things I wouldn't say to a person's face.... absolutely and anyone who wouldn't is a coward.

I have heard that there are a lot of smart people in Virginia...at least Northern Virginia...I believe it...

What do you have against the school bart?

DixieZag
02-10-2014, 01:18 PM
If a parent was reading the board to get some indication on whatever, I would presume they would read the other boards the kid was looking at. Provided it was a program with enough notoriety that there was a significant following, the parent would compare the two and tell their son/daughter - "go to Gonzaga, they have passionate fans who love the school, love the players and are committed to the program through thick and thin, as for extremes, it's great! There's a fraction of them compared to most.

Reborn
02-10-2014, 01:29 PM
If I were a parent or a friend of a parent who had a student athlete (girl or boy) who was interested in attending Gonzaga and playing basketball there I would not base my opinion of GU solely by what is written on GUBoards. But if you are interested in what I think of GUBoards and how it might affect my opinion of GU, my answer to you is that I like GUBoards, and there seems to be some "real" people there, and that GU fans are very, very knowledgeable of both basketball and basketball at GU. And mostly, I would see fans who love Gonzaga basketball and Gonzaga University, and that what they love most about Gonzaga is that it is like being in a family. A family away from home. And I like that, and would send my son or daughter there because of that. I would also have learned that how athletes perform in the classroom is of utmost important to the coaches, and that would be another reason for sending him or her there. There are many opinions of Mark Few on GUBoards, and the ones that have stuck with me is that Mark Few is simple and loves to fish, and loves the outdoors. I also see he is a family man, and has a great relationship with his kids (I see them on TV all the time). And mostly, I have learning from reading GUBoards that Mark Few is committed to and loyal to his players. Some fans see that as a flaw, however I would want that kind of man to coach my son. I feel the same about Coach Graves.

Also from reading what Gonzaga fans write on GUBoards, I would see that the expectations of the fans of GU are very high, and I like that, and I would want my son or daughter to play for a university that did have the highest expectations for their team and players. And honestly, I have never read anything on GUBoards that would hurt my son or daughter. I have raised my kids not to fear the opinions of others, and especially of some fans who are mean spirited. I have not seen mean people on GUBoards, and I think GUBoards kind of reflects reality. There are some people who are protective, some overprotective and others who want their kids to be brave, strong, unafraid, and mostly confident in themselves because they know who they are. I taught my kids to be open minded about criticism, and be a good listener, but also I taught them to be aware of who is sending the criticisms. There are people that they should listen to a lot more then others.

I would talk to anyone in person about what I write on GUBoards, and if I knew that someone who was reading GUBoards had a son or daughter interested in playing at GU I would not change what I wrote, Most likely they would already know who I am. I would love to have the opportunity to talk to Mark Few face to face, or his players or the parents of players at GU. It would be a great honor if any of those people really cared about my opinions. Unfortunately, that is never going to happen. I may drink Kool-Aid, but not enough of it to make me crazy. My head may be in the clouds, but my feet are planted firmly on the ground.

coolhandzag
02-10-2014, 01:53 PM
What would you think of the state of GU Basketball by reading this forum?

Would you be more or less likely to send your kiddo to GU?

If you were a poster and knew potential recruits were reading this board, would it change how you post?

Would you be willing to put down your board name and tell the coaches, players, and other board members what you think face to face?

Food for thought and I welcome your responses.
VZF

1. This website does not reflect the state of the GU program.
2. The board would not direct that decision at all. I would tell them to do what their heart told them. They already know what GU did for me.
3. It wouldn't.
4. I've told more than one GU basketball player and two GU head coaches (one good, one not so good) exactly what I thought of them.

Zagceo
02-10-2014, 02:29 PM
What I do find disturbing about this board is that they tolerant name calling. I belong to a few other boards and thats one thing they ban you for.

I find it very juvenile when some have to resort to name calling especially when this is a board that has a connection to Gonzaga University.

Reborn
02-10-2014, 02:30 PM
1. This website does not reflect the state of the GU program.
2. The board would not direct that decision at all. I would tell them to do what their heart told them. They already know what GU did for me.
3. It wouldn't.
4. I've told more than one GU basketball player and two GU head coaches (one good, one not so good) exactly what I thought of them.

Your #4 made me lmao: :lmao::lmao:

coolhandzag
02-10-2014, 02:44 PM
Your #4 made me lmao: :lmao::lmao:

Thanks. Funny or not it happens to be true.

Reborn
02-10-2014, 02:48 PM
Thanks. Funny or not it happens to be true.

Yes. I believe you, Cool Hand Zag! That's what makes it funny. Sometimes when I picture someone like you telling Few what you think looks so cool that I can't help but laughing. I would not be laughing to make fun of the situation or you, but because I think it's so "cool." Sometimes things that appear so awesome and true, make me laugh in a very joyful way. There is such a thing as good, healthy laughter.

wnczagfan
02-10-2014, 03:17 PM
1)That we fans are very "into" GU basketball and love it, but sometimes we seem pretty spoiled by GU's success and have a hard time losing any games at all. Myself included.

2) If my kid were the sensitive type, I would recommend he not play college basketball at a Division 1 school period; it is too public a stage if you cannot accept being criticized. If he were not sensitive, I would say go to GU. Great program, great teammates, etc.

BUT

I will say I would tell him not to read this or any other fan board unless he had a really thick skin. Just like any other internet board, there can be trolls and/or a few not very nice at times, yet vocal people. Some of the criticisms, and the constancy of criticism directed toward certain players over time has caused me to feel bad for some of our players, and they are not even my children, although I would be happy if any of them were.

3) No

4) I haven't said anything I wouldn't say to anyone's face; any comments I have about improvements are a) discussion points and b) constructive criticisms, which I seriously doubt the coaches read (although they should).

ZAGLAWQB
02-10-2014, 03:33 PM
See yesterday's thread "Words to Consider" originating from Zag woman's BB player's tweet for related topic comment.

maynard g krebs
02-10-2014, 03:48 PM
Based on the basketball boards I have looked at, I would say this one is, much like Garrison Keillor's children of Lake Wobegon, above average. Lots of smart, knowledgeable, passionate fans; imo enough to offset the usual internet garbage found on virtually every site.

Even with the recent spate of negativity this board seems like a net positive just in the fact that it reflects a large, knowledgeable, and passionate fan base.

ZagaZags
02-10-2014, 08:32 PM
They should send their kids to Gonzaga because of GU Boards. :000tens:

75Zag
02-11-2014, 06:56 AM
If I was the parent of a men's BB player I would encourage him to decide based on his own priorities, but if he was a 5 star McDonalds Big Boy with Knight/Nike gently kissing him on the hind-end I would probably not recommend GU. On the other hand, if he was a 3 or 4 star player who would benefit from GU's unique combination of small-school academics and big time D 1 basketball, I would encourage him to carefully consider GU.

Perspective is the key.

Go Bulldogs!

23dpg
02-11-2014, 07:36 AM
Tom Izzo's take on social media.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/eye-on-college-basketball/24438747/izzo-defends-marcus-smart-says-twitter-has-brought-players-to-tears

If somebody's writing stuff about your daughter when she's in high school, I'll bet you look at it a little differently. I've had grown men (my players) in my office in tears because of what's being written. That's what brings the frustration level.

I think it's safe to assume that the players do read forums like this along with their twitter accounts. My biggest issues are the assumed group think of a very vocal minority that certain players are not good players and that the coaches are too dumb/loyal to notice.

I've read very recently about player A being terrible. The quote stated that as an assumed fact. Here is the redacted quote: "Yes,(Player A) is terrible and everybody knows it." Yet the stats would prove otherwise. When Player A is on the court, the team does much better than when he isn't. (thanks to Caduceus' chart). It's a two-fold problem. One, some players are lightening rods for criticism that goes beyond critiquing. And two, it's usually statistically incorrect.

Zagceo
02-11-2014, 08:10 AM
Tom Izzo is a winner but I would not like to see my kid get publicly reprimanded on the sidelines like he seems to regular do to his players. I feel sorry for them.

I think Coach Izzo should look in the mirror as he tells others to do what I say and not what I do!

LongIslandZagFan
02-11-2014, 08:23 AM
Tom Izzo is a winner but I would not like to see my kid get publicly reprimanded on the sidelines like he seems to regular do to his players. I feel sorry for them.

I think Coach Izzo should look in the mirror as he tells others to do what I say and not what I do!

There is a fundamental difference between a coach reprimanding a player and what people say about players on a message board. Unless you are privy to what is being said when he is reprimanding and are attending practices and seeing what player X is doing you are in no place to judge Izzo. For all you know, the mistake he is reprimanding the player for is the same mistake he has been trying to get the player to stop making in practice after practice after practice. I know from my coaching experience that at times you get frustrated by repeating the same thing over and over again to a player. If a player makes that mistake in a game, I sub them out and at times I reprimand them... but guess what... the kids GET IT because they know what they did wrong and that it is on THEM. That is NOT the same as what 23dpg is pointing out with Izzo. That is kids taking what the idiots on the internet say to heart and... shocker... it bothers them.

Zags11
02-11-2014, 08:30 AM
Gotta have thicker skin. Myself included. We gotta remember these are young adults. I remember when I was 11 pitching in a baseball game. Iwas getting taunted by a adult. The umpire wouldnt stop it. I burst into tears. My dad confronted the man and he shut up. Moral? Thats 1 guy and sure I was a kid, but these are just kids removee from HS. Being ripped on personally by the masses. It hurts.

75Zag
02-11-2014, 08:37 AM
Tom Izzo is a winner but I would not like to see my kid get publicly reprimanded on the sidelines like he seems to regular do to his players. I feel sorry for them. I think Coach Izzo should look in the mirror as he tells others to do what I say and not what I do!

For better or worse, I suspect there are parents out there who would not care if Izzo beat their kid with a bullwhip if it led to a National Championship followed by a Nike shoe contract and a lottery pick into the NBA. Remember that Bob Knight was a very popular coach with both players and parents before he was fired.

I like GU / Few approach better, but I wouldn't feel too sorry for Izzo's players. It's not like they were forced to go there.

Go Bulldogs!

Zagceo
02-11-2014, 08:48 AM
There is a fundamental difference between a coach reprimanding a player and what people say about players on a message board. Unless you are privy to what is being said when he is reprimanding and are attending practices and seeing what player X is doing you are in no place to judge Izzo. For all you know, the mistake he is reprimanding the player for is the same mistake he has been trying to get the player to stop making in practice after practice after practice. I know from my coaching experience that at times you get frustrated by repeating the same thing over and over again to a player. If a player makes that mistake in a game, I sub them out and at times I reprimand them... but guess what... the kids GET IT because they know what they did wrong and that it is on THEM. That is NOT the same as what 23dpg is pointing out with Izzo. That is kids taking what the idiots on the internet say to heart and... shocker... it bothers them.

You could be right but I'm glad Coach Few has a much different demeanor on the bench.

I guess you wouldn't mind seeing Coach Few screaming in Gary Bells face on national TV after letting some player go uncontested to the rim late in a game? Because we shouldn't judge!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=7mNAhJwYcrg

LongIslandZagFan
02-11-2014, 09:09 AM
You could be right but I'm glad Coach Few has a much different demeanor on the bench.

I guess you wouldn't mind seeing Coach Few screaming in Gary Bells face on national TV after letting some player go uncontested to the rim late in a game? Because we shouldn't judge!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=7mNAhJwYcrg

Again, you don't know what was said, you don't know the background, you don't know anything more than what you visually saw. You don't hear too many people complain about Izzo or his coaching style. So I would try not to take that video for much of anything as you don't know the context of it.

Zagceo
02-11-2014, 09:13 AM
Again, you don't know what was said, you don't know the background, you don't know anything more than what you visually saw. You don't hear too many people complain about Izzo or his coaching style. So I would try not to take that video for much of anything as you don't know the context of it.

If you listen to the audio the announcer fills you in on the context.

LongIslandZagFan
02-11-2014, 09:20 AM
If you listen to the audio the announcer fills you in on the context.

No... it gives you no context at all. The announcer is as much in the dark as you are. He didn't hear what was said to Dawson or Valentine... neither did you. He, like you, is going on the visual. He, like you, is taking it as only the current moment in time and don't know the broader context of the interaction. Perhaps Izzo went overboard... but my point is you DON'T KNOW THAT since you DON'T know what was said or any of the background context of the interaction. You just don't... neither do I... but I am not the one judging him on that one situation.

Not to mention... Valentine didn't think much of it.

http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2014/01/michigan_state_basketballs_den_6.html

SWZag
02-11-2014, 09:30 AM
Are people taught the Golden Rule or the Silver Rule anymore?

SWZag

Zagceo
02-11-2014, 09:43 AM
No... it gives you no context at all. The announcer is as much in the dark as you are. He didn't hear what was said to Dawson or Valentine... neither did you. He, like you, is going on the visual. He, like you, is taking it as only the current moment in time and don't know the broader context of the interaction. Perhaps Izzo went overboard... but my point is you DON'T KNOW THAT since you DON'T know what was said or any of the background context of the interaction. You just don't... neither do I... but I am not the one judging him on that one situation.

Not to mention... Valentine didn't think much of it.

http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2014/01/michigan_state_basketballs_den_6.html

Thank You.

Vanzagger
02-11-2014, 10:17 AM
I've read very recently about player A being terrible. The quote stated that as an assumed fact. Here is the redacted quote: "Yes,(Player A) is terrible and everybody knows it." Yet the stats would prove otherwise. When Player A is on the court, the team does much better than when he isn't. (thanks to Caduceus' chart). It's a two-fold problem. One, some players are lightening rods for criticism that goes beyond critiquing. And two, it's usually statistically incorrect.[/QUOTE]




Thanks for reminding us that some players are untouchable and others we can pile on as much as we want. The only sad thing is I don't have to ask who (Player A) is.

LongIslandZagFan
02-11-2014, 10:58 AM
Thank You.


Quote from the kid himself... but lets not let facts get in the way...


"All that jersey-grab talk was BS — Coach is a passionate guy, when he feels he's not getting through to me he tries to get inside me,'' Valentine said. "He really cares about me, he could have done the other thing and said 'sit him on the bench.' But he really cares about his players, and he's so passionate, and that's what I love about him.''

Zagceo
02-11-2014, 11:08 AM
No... it gives you no context at all. The announcer is as much in the dark as you are. He didn't hear what was said to Dawson or Valentine... neither did you. He, like you, is going on the visual. He, like you, is taking it as only the current moment in time and don't know the broader context of the interaction. Perhaps Izzo went overboard... but my point is you DON'T KNOW THAT since you DON'T know what was said or any of the background context of the interaction. You just don't... neither do I... but I am not the one judging him on that one situation.

Not to mention... Valentine didn't think much of it.

http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2014/01/michigan_state_basketballs_den_6.html

I understand your point and perhaps you understand mine. : )

23dpg
02-11-2014, 11:16 AM
It's too bad college Bball doesn't keep track of the +\- stat like the nba does. I think it's a good stat when measuring players within one team. Would love to see this groups


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Caduceus did track it and made a graph. It's on another thread here. I will look for it.

Edit to add. Here is a copied form of it. Not as nice as the original.

2013-2014 Zags Roland Ratings

Player RR Per Game Per 40 min

K. Pangos +285 12.4 14.3
D. Stockton +167 7.3 10.3
P. Karnowski +125 5.4 8.7
S. Dower +93 4.4 6.3
G. Bell +93 5.5 5.9
K. Dranginis +77 3.3 5.2
D. Barham +67 2.9 6.2
G. Coleman -128 -5 -17.5
A. Nunez -67 -5 -13.2