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3XaZag
02-09-2014, 11:16 PM
5 shots....five shots in 33 minutes....early in the game Bell missed a 3 pointer, then had 2 shots blocked. I was immediately concerned. Many of us have noticed that Gary has the tendancy, if he misses one or two early, to lose his aggressiveness in the game. So I looked for it.

We had a stretch, at least five posession, where we went late in the clock. On two the clock expired, another time Karnowski had to chuck a three, I think Coleman's 3 point attempt was late in the clock and I think it was Kyle or Kevin who recovered a slapped ball late and chucked one up barely beating the clock. On most of these possessions Bell had opportunities for a shot (most of the time a three). I counted at least 5 times where he could have shot and didn't. Bell passing up a three in order for Karnowski to shoot a three is not a formula that is going to win a lot of games. Compare Coleman....11 shots in 15 minutes.

This is not a rant against Bell. Gary isn't 'the' reason we lost'. There were lots of those. Rather it is observing a tendancy that was clear in this particular game. Few has recognized he has a coaching point to make with Bell hence his interview comments about Bell and Pangos hunting shots. I have a feeling Few had Bell more in mind than Pangos but pluralizing coaching suggestions is a great way to make it less personal. Of course I have no idea what the full scope of the situation is, or what is the character of the coaching staffs discussion with Bell. However this seems fixable. Few, if he isn't, needs to be clear and direct with Gary. We need Gary's offense....it can't disappear in games. All players are going to hit a point in a season (or career) where chnage needs to happen. Just my opinion...but Gary is at one of those. Pangos' mantra of 'shoot to get hot' should be on Bell's mirror.

ZagsGoZags
02-10-2014, 12:18 AM
when I turned off the TV and walked away
I kept thinking about Bell ....
all game when he got the ball he would pass, it seemed
God knows how much I respect and like the character of the guy, its off the charts
I just couldn't figure out how he disappeared in this game and let the other players force the action ...
I chalked it up to his hand still hurt ...

bartruff1
02-10-2014, 04:27 AM
He probably needs some sleep.

northsidezagfan
02-10-2014, 04:37 AM
He probably needs some sleep.

+1. School+basketball+baby doesn't leave too many hours in the day.

Zagger
02-10-2014, 05:26 AM
I have full confidence that Bell will be a game changer on the up side before this season is out. This season's team is unique - sort of a building year w/ a diverse group of players. Last season was fairly dominated by Kelly & Elias. Now others must step up. With Kevin not at 100% that leaves others who just plain have to exercise more aggressiveness with the ball and/or being in position (on court) to assist or open to shoot. When plays work the Zags make things look easy. When they don't it seems like plan B isn't there or not there in time. Does there need to be more practice? Easy to say from my couch.
Go Zags! Go Bell!

BMAN
02-10-2014, 05:43 AM
in the poortland game before this one Bell had 2 points. He only shot 4 times.

hooter73
02-10-2014, 07:27 AM
I made peace with Bell being what he was, which most people thought of as under performing, I understood that he is just not a first line of attack player, he is a background guy... then he put sup 20 points making it look easy, then he turns around and puts up 4. Hard for me to be at peace with that but as long as he is, then I guess we should be.

23zagmd
02-10-2014, 07:41 AM
let's just cut to the chase with this one.....GBJ just does not have the cold blooded scorers instinct. He is passing up lots of shots that he should be taking. There is only 2 reasons he is doing this and we continually hear Few talk about him hunting shots. He's not making it happen.

Some guys, despite how good of players they really are just aren't going to do it due to their nature. That is Gary Bell. The nights that he is shooting it and dropping 20 is what he should be doing EVERY night whether the ball is going in or not. On this team, he needs to be taking 12 shots MINIMUM!!!

Zags11
02-10-2014, 07:53 AM
Bell isn't a kobe, mj, birr, morrison or pangos type of player. He won't fire shots and for a star it isn't acceptable imo. If he isn't a star, then we need to accept that. However with him and stockton its 3 on 5 on o alot. We can't have that.

Zagceo
02-10-2014, 07:54 AM
let's just cut to the chase with this one.....GBJ just does not have the cold blooded scorers instinct. He is passing up lots of shots that he should be taking. There is only 2 reasons he is doing this and we continually hear Few talk about him hunting shots. He's not making it happen.

Some guys, despite how good of players they really are just aren't going to do it due to their nature. That is Gary Bell. The nights that he is shooting it and dropping 20 is what he should be doing EVERY night whether the ball is going in or not. On this team, he needs to be taking 12 shots MINIMUM!!!

I was made fun of when I made the statement that Bell should come off the bench when his wrist healed. It looks like people are coming around to the true enigma of Bell.

What I found most disturbing in the Memphis game was the uncontested layin late in the game. I've heard alot about this lock down defender well thats not what I expect from a lock down defender.

If he does not listen to his coach.........hunt for your shot more....Bell should be not start. This is more than 1 game its a trend.

gueastcoast
02-10-2014, 08:12 AM
However with him and stockton its 3 on 5 on o alot. We can't have that.

This.

The young man is so obviously talented and contributes in so many ways...we have seen him shine many times in the last three years. But the reality is that with THIS TEAM, RIGHT NOW, we're in a position where KP isn't where we'd like him to be due to injury, and Sam, while highly productive, is not the type of player who can create his own shots. Where GBJ has traditionally been most successful offensively is in a game flow where the game comes to him (vs. coach's comment about "hunting his shot").

So, someone else needs to step up if GBJ is not that type of player. Coleman? KD? We don't lack for talent (or depth) and this is the time of year where one of a handful of guys could really step up, provided coach gives them the opportunity.

bballbeachbum
02-10-2014, 08:30 AM
Gary has been back for 6 games.

USD—without him on Dee the last 5 minutes USD probably wins as Dee lit up all others who tried to check him

@ BYU—14 points, 4 rebs, 3 assists, 1 steal (11 points in the last 10+ minutes of game) and D on Haws (Gary was the 2nd leading second half scorer behind KP’s 14)

@ SCU—15 points, 13 in the 2nd half including 3 3s in a row, 2 late FTs in 2 point win (led team in 2nd half scoring)

@USF—13 points, 9 in the 2nd half (2nd leading second half scorer behind Sam’s 12)

Then the 2 last games, with the new 1st half assertive Gary, vs. Portland and Memphis in which people are asking ‘who is that in Gary’s uniform’. He’s the guy forcing the action, turning the ball over, getting totally out of synch trying to force himself into the game and not even doing what he does well very well.

Be careful what you wish for. I want the old Gary back, the second half assertive star, not this guy trying to be something he's not.

drvenkman05
02-10-2014, 08:33 AM
This.

The young man is so obviously talented and contributes in so many ways...we have seen him shine many times in the last three years. But the reality is that with THIS TEAM, RIGHT NOW, we're in a position where KP isn't where we'd like him to be due to injury, and Sam, while highly productive, is not the type of player who can create his own shots. Where GBJ has traditionally been most successful offensively is in a game flow where the game comes to him (vs. coach's comment about "hunting his shot").

So, someone else needs to step up if GBJ is not that type of player. Coleman? KD? We don't lack for talent (or depth) and this is the time of year where one of a handful of guys could really step up, provided coach gives them the opportunity.

You're spot on. The unfortunate thing is many of the other guys aren't reliably given the chance to play significant minutes (cue the "it's all the players fault" chorus).

gamagin
02-10-2014, 08:49 AM
+1


Gary has been back for 6 games.

USD—without him on Dee the last 5 minutes USD probably wins as Dee lit up all others who tried to check him

@ BYU—14 points, 4 rebs, 3 assists, 1 steal (11 points in the last 10+ minutes of game) and D on Haws (2nd leading second half scorer behind KP’s 14)

@ SCU—15 points, 13 in the 2nd half including 3 3s in a row, 2 late FTs in 2 point win (led team in 2nd half scoring)

@USF—13 points, 9 in the 2nd half (2nd leading second half scorer behind Sam’s 12)

Then the 2 last games, with the new 1st half assertive Gary, vs. Portland and Memphis in which people are asking ‘who is that in Gary’s uniform’. He’s the guy forcing the action, turning the ball over, getting totally out of synch trying to force himself into the game and not even doing what he does well very well.

Be careful what you wish for. I want the old Gary back, the second half assertive star, not this guy trying to be something he's not.

+1

I don't think GBj has ever been THAT good at driving to the rim, fwiw. He can win a race now and then, but otherwise . . . Just too short (FINALLY, height matters in this particular instance) to drive the way he has tried. KP, with the toe has also been swatted. As has DS. Whether they should try or not is irrelevant. Because it all depends on the split second they have to decide. Sometimes it works.

But generally, they have all been well scouted and it's not difficult to discourage their drives. Especially when it's crowded underneath against us anyway. Our guys have been around a fairly long time. Their moves are predictable. They are easier to figure out.

So, GBj & KP, go back to hunting and shooting on the perimeter. that's where they are needed. it's getting desparate they are needed as shooters so much. DS needs to take more risks than the rest in order to find the open man and get the ball distributed. The shooters, otoh, need to hunt and shoot more. It's back to basics.

Anyone notice how many short guys get shots off on our bigs ? A. seems like every team we've met.

Well, I posit that is because they prepared to shoot that way. Our guys just drive and tend not to change their ways so as to at least draw a foul. It hasn't worked. All the more reason to get back to what we have historically done best. I.e., Look for and head for the open spots and when the ball arrives, if they can see the basket, shoot it. While the Bigs, knowing what's coming, can be ready for the board and the put back, if necessary. With confidence.

Finally, after the game, the Mem coach said the only thing he wanted to prevent, and that he preached to his team, was to stop our three. Little did he know he didn't have to stop it because we stopped it for them.

raise the zag
02-10-2014, 09:43 AM
When this team needs a score, I'd much, MUCH prefer Kyle Dranginis in the game. Our "teams" offense is more balanced & at least Kyle can put the ball on the floor & not look to pass as soon as he touches it. KD isn't in the same league as GBJr as a spot up shooter, yet Gary is as good as Pangos' drives. How many times, earlier this season, was Gary just waiting, wide-open when the defense collapsed on Kevin. Since Pangos isn't much of a threat to penetrate these days, Gary is only able.to convert wide-open, catch-n-shoot 3's, as he did vs BYU's terrible defense.

I don't like to be the one to admit it, yet I guarantee we when that game vs Memphis if Dranginis took some of GBJ's shot-less mins. Preach his defense all you want, and I admit its damn solid, yet he's so one-dimnesional since Kevin's injury. His defense wasn't all that stellar vs Memphis at times either. I actually felt our team defense improved, with KD in the game, at least vs Memphis. Our zone is better as well. His man-2-man is a strength, yet at what expense. If ur going to play him, then STOP pairing him w/2 flippin' PG's! Play him alongside a Dranginia or a Coleman, yet Few rarely does this...Gary has become a one-trick pony. And putting him w/Stocks & Pangos makes literally zero sense for team offense or defense.

This dumb, ineffective, inefficient concept cost us down the stretch vs Memphis and nearly cost us vs Portland.

Few clearly sees something we don't see in regards to his 'feel-good' lineup, yet he still thinks this is Frosh yr GBJr, who had some swagger & aggression to his game & recipient of Pangos' attn. Its not completely his fault, he could become more aggressive yet put him AND the team in a position to excel or succeed, not what you're hoping will happen or worked well vs our own scout in team in practice.

Mantua
02-10-2014, 11:25 AM
Maybe Coach is more comfortable with three ball handlers who theoretically can get the the ball inside or shoot from distance. That lineup gives up the wing for driving and rebounding and in my opinion weakens the defense putting more of a burden on Gary Bell.