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RRZagFan
04-25-2013, 09:47 PM
Bleacher report is now the main sports section for CNN online, so on their list they have Kevin at number 16.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1618141-early-look-at-the-top-20-candidates-for-the-2014-wooden-award

hooter73
04-26-2013, 07:05 AM
WE HAVE RULES HERE YOU KNOW!





:p

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 08:05 AM
Please.

CaliforniaZaggin'
04-26-2013, 08:50 AM
Let's not be so quick to always hate on the Bleacher Report. They do employ some talented, well respected writers. For example, Jimmy Spencer, their lead NBA writer, does a great job.

BTW, Jimmy is a good follow on twitter.

https://twitter.com/JimmySpencerNBA

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 08:57 AM
Let's not be so quick to always hate on the Bleacher Report. They do employ some talented, well respected writers. For example, Jimmy Spencer, their lead NBA writer, does a great job.

BTW, Jimmy is a good follow on twitter.

https://twitter.com/JimmySpencerNBA

in this case not the messenger but the message. wooden award? pangos? c'mon. i know so called "watch lists" are merely p.r. contrivances to stir interest, but they should have the tiniest bit of reality to them.

gamagin
04-26-2013, 09:13 AM
a new code I've discovered to make a thread disappear . . .

Jordan Morgan

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 09:16 AM
a new code I've discovered to make a thread disappear . . .

Jordan Morgan

you're a very bad boy.......

SanDiegoZag
04-26-2013, 09:21 AM
in this case not the messenger but the message. wooden award? pangos? c'mon. i know so called "watch lists" are merely p.r. contrivances to stir interest, but they should have the tiniest bit of reality to them.

There is no question that Pangos would have to improve by leaps and bounds to even be in the conversation of being one of the top 20 players in the country.

His 3 pt % would have to improve to being in the top 3-5 in the country, as he at times can be a one trick pony. He would also have to develop more of a mid-range game, or even better, the ability to get around people and get to the hole.

More importantly, he needs to do a better job of getting everyone involved, and getting the ball to the people who need it. There were many possessions last year where Kelly and Elias didn't touch the ball despite being in the zone or scoring at will. You could almost see the defense's relief when Pangos would hoist up a 3 after dribbling away a possession. I felt there were a number of times where players hesitated giving the ball (back) to Pangos because they knew they wouldn't see it again that possession.

That being said, he was only a sophomore last year and he seems to have the strong work ethic to allow for major improvements to his game. I don't think anyone would be that surprised if he led the nation in 3 pt %. If he does, the Zags have the ability to ascent back into the top 5 in the nation.

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 09:30 AM
There is no question that Pangos would have to improve by leaps and bounds to even be in the conversation of being one of the top 20 players in the country.

His 3 pt % would have to improve to being in the top 3-5 in the country, as he at times can be a one trick pony. He would also have to develop more of a mid-range game, or even better, the ability to get around people and get to the hole.

More importantly, he needs to do a better job of getting everyone involved, and getting the ball to the people who need it. There were many possessions last year where Kelly and Elias didn't touch the ball despite being in the zone or scoring at will. You could almost see the defense's relief when Pangos would hoist up a 3 after dribbling away a possession. I felt there were a number of times where players hesitated giving the ball (back) to Pangos because they knew they wouldn't see it again that possession.

That being said, he was only a sophomore last year and he seems to have the strong work ethic to allow for major improvements to his game. I don't think anyone would be that surprised if he led the nation in 3 pt %. If he does, the Zags have the ability to ascent back into the top 5 in the nation.



Terrific post, very well reasoned until you swig the kool aid in the last para. You must be a Padres diehard as well 😜

cggonzaga
04-26-2013, 09:35 AM
a new code I've discovered to make a thread disappear . . .

Jordan Morgan


No kidding! I didn't even use his name in another thread and it got deleted. What's the big deal?

titopoet
04-26-2013, 09:38 AM
Think back to 2012:

in this case not the messenger but the message. wooden award? Olynyk? c'mon. i know so called "watch lists" are merely p.r. contrivances to stir interest, but they should have the tiniest bit of reality to them.

Heck, the Canadian big man did not even make the midseason watch. While it is too early to say Pangos belongs on the list, it is also too early to say he doesn't.

SanDiegoZag
04-26-2013, 10:09 AM
Terrific post, very well reasoned until you swig the kool aid in the last para. You must be a Padres diehard as well 😜

I'm on this board every day, I just rarely post. I know how quickly you can get ridiculed for making any perceived negative comments based on a low post count if you don't chug a little kool-aid too.

I created that board name 8 or 9 years ago (previous board) when I lived in San Diego. I have been living up in Orange County now for the last 5 years though.

I was a big Padres and Chargers fan when I lived down there (still 2nd to the M's and Seahawks though)... Although, now that I have moved away, those teams are now a distant 2nd favorite to the Seattle clubs. Unfortunately, neither the Mariners or Padres have provided anything to cheer about recently.

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 10:18 AM
I'm on this board every day, I just rarely post. I know how quickly you can get ridiculed for making any perceived negative comments based on a low post count if you don't chug a little kool-aid too.

I created that board name 8 or 9 years ago (previous board) when I lived in San Diego. I have been living up in Orange County now for the last 5 years though.

I was a big Padres and Chargers fan when I lived down there (still 2nd to the M's and Seahawks though)... Although, now that I have moved away, those teams are now a distant 2nd favorite to the Seattle clubs. Unfortunately, neither the Mariners or Padres have provided anything to cheer about recently.


SD, be Unafraid to post your opinion.

john montana
04-26-2013, 10:18 AM
a new code I've discovered to make a thread disappear . . .

Jordan Morgan


Love this. I'm a little annoyed at all the "wink wink I'm in the club" bs and sudden deletion of threads that might interest the fans. It is a message board...we should be able to speculate and talk about what we want as long as we aren't bad mouthing kids.

And by the way...if you have information you can't share, don't act like a 10 year old and say "I have information I can't share." Just don't share it.

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 10:20 AM
Think back to 2012:

in this case not the messenger but the message. wooden award? Olynyk? c'mon. i know so called "watch lists" are merely p.r. contrivances to stir interest, but they should have the tiniest bit of reality to them.

Heck, the Canadian big man did not even make the midseason watch. While it is too early to say Pangos belongs on the list, it is also too early to say he doesn't.

Apples and tangerines. KO was an unknown quantity. Almost like a one and done five star kid. We have seem two years of KP, warts and all. A very nice college player. KO had pro potential when he was a frosh in my view and a few others here.

cggonzaga
04-26-2013, 10:33 AM
Love this. I'm a little annoyed at all the "wink wink I'm in the club" bs and sudden deletion of threads that might interest the fans. It is a message board...we should be able to speculate and talk about what we want as long as we aren't bad mouthing kids.

And by the way...if you have information you can't share, don't act like a 10 year old and say "I have information I can't share." Just don't share it.

+1.

gamagin
04-26-2013, 10:51 AM
Love this. I'm a little annoyed at all the "wink wink I'm in the club" bs and sudden deletion of threads that might interest the fans. It is a message board...we should be able to speculate and talk about what we want as long as we aren't bad mouthing kids.

And by the way...if you have information you can't share, don't act like a 10 year old and say "I have information I can't share." Just don't share it.

turns out to be the worst kept secret on the planet.

Check that, the worst kept secret on this board. It took me 5 minutes to figure out what all the fuss was about AFTER I posted a reasonable possibility, after thinking about who in college qualified, who I liked and on and on, piecing obvious known, public, quantities together, on a thread discussing reasonable possibilities.

This wasn't a crack in the structure, or even a leak. It was a flood, created & caused by the very folks you mention above MT. You have a good eye and a sense for things as they are, in this instance. Spot on.

Panic & shooting the messenger, wittingly or unwittingly, only draws a larger crowd. I assume adults were involved in this process. I think I was wrong there.

Time for a reMODel here, imo. The pope is missing one of his more zealous Swiss Guards.

SteelZag
04-26-2013, 10:57 AM
OT......but

As long as we are talking about Michigan, Nik Stauskas is warming up for a possible Maui game against Zags. In rhythm, with no defender within twenty feet Stauskas shows what happens when players get comfortable shooting the three.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAJl7Tgk97I

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 11:01 AM
go big blue! please, go....:)

ZAGGED OUT
04-26-2013, 11:17 AM
Apples and tangerines. KO was an unknown quantity. Almost like a one and done five star kid. We have seem two years of KP, warts and all. A very nice college player. KO had pro potential when he was a frosh in my view and a few others here.

Jazz, I don't understand you. You're going to say Pangos has no shot, when he's already been declared a possible break out star by some ESPN columnists, yet you thought KO had pro potential his freshman year? Congrats on getting lucky I guess, but all you were doing was guessing that KO would get there. He had no signs of being a guaranteed NBA prospect, he was only a skinny shooter.

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 11:27 AM
Jazz, I don't understand you. You're going to say Pangos has no shot, when he's already been declared a possible break out star by some ESPN columnists, yet you thought KO had pro potential his freshman year? Congrats on getting lucky I guess, but all you were doing was guessing that KO would get there. He had no signs of being a guaranteed NBA prospect, he was only a skinny shooter.

i never said KO was a guarantee, im not that prescient. but there was a convo on the board 3-4 years ago about which current zag had the most potential for the NBA and I and a few others said KO. just a guess, but the rare combo of size, intelligence and pt guard skills was enticing even back then. he was way more than a skinny shooter, fact is he wasnt even such a great shooter.

pangos is a very nice college player. were he to improve as much over the next two years as much as he has over the past two he wd still not rise to a wooden awardee, imo. breakout star? possibly. u cd say same for bell, i suppose. i stand to be corrected tho.

maynard g krebs
04-26-2013, 11:36 AM
More importantly, he needs to do a better job of getting everyone involved, and getting the ball to the people who need it. There were many possessions last year where Kelly and Elias didn't touch the ball despite being in the zone or scoring at will. You could almost see the defense's relief when Pangos would hoist up a 3 after dribbling away a possession. I felt there were a number of times where players hesitated giving the ball (back) to Pangos because they knew they wouldn't see it again that possession.



Shot attempts per minute for the Zags' 4 main guys:

KO .40
EH .36
KP .28
GB .26

That translates to 43% more shot attempts per minute by KO than KP, and 29% more per min by EH than KP, who btw shot 9 times per game while playing 4-6 more min than anyone else.

And Bell shoots only a fraction less often than KP, and is the most common criticism of him (with which I agree) is that he's not aggressive enough offensively.

When I read this part of your post I went "huh?", as I saw great ball movement all year, and a concerted effort to get the ball inside (almost to a fault). I think my view is borne out both by the above numbers, and the fact that the team's shooting percentage was among the nat. leaders. That doesn't happen without consistently good shot opportunities, which are generally the result of good ball movement.

Reading the cited paragraph, it's hard to imagine that you're talking about the pg for a 3 loss team.

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 11:39 AM
When I read this part of your post I went "huh?", as I saw great ball movement all year, and a concerted effort to get the ball inside (almost to a fault). I think my view is borne out both by the above numbers, and the fact that the team's shooting percentage was among the nat. leaders. That doesn't happen without consistently good shot opportunities, which are generally the result of good ball movement.[/QUOTE]



so this makes him a wooden watchee?

maynard g krebs
04-26-2013, 11:40 AM
[I]




so this makes him a wooden watchee?[/QUOTE]

No, it doesn't, imo. Just a very good college pg. I was only contradicting a particular statement.

jazzdelmar
04-26-2013, 11:41 AM
[/I]


so this makes him a wooden watchee?

No, it doesn't, imo. Just a very good college pg. I was only contradicting a particular statement.[/QUOTE]

thank you, MGK, we agree.

U Zig, I Zag
04-26-2013, 11:44 AM
When I read this part of your post I went "huh?", as I saw great ball movement all year, and a concerted effort to get the ball inside (almost to a fault). I think my view is borne out both by the above numbers, and the fact that the team's shooting percentage was among the nat. leaders. That doesn't happen without consistently good shot opportunities, which are generally the result of good ball movement.



so this makes him a wooden watchee?[/QUOTE]

Wooden watch because in the age of one and done's and kids leaving early a (soon to be) 3 year starter at PG for one of the top programs in the country (ranked #1 for some time) is a possible impact player on the national stage.

Zags played from the inside out last year - that will flip this year I suspect. KP will be required to do more and score more. They will be talking about him nationally I believe.

SanDiegoZag
04-26-2013, 12:12 PM
Shot attempts per minute for the Zags' 4 main guys:

KO .40
EH .36
KP .28
GB .26

That translates to 43% more shot attempts per minute by KO than KP, and 29% more per min by EH than KP, who btw shot 9 times per game while playing 4-6 more min than anyone else.

And Bell shoots only a fraction less often than KP, and is the most common criticism of him (with which I agree) is that he's not aggressive enough offensively.

When I read this part of your post I went "huh?", as I saw great ball movement all year, and a concerted effort to get the ball inside (almost to a fault). I think my view is borne out both by the above numbers, and the fact that the team's shooting percentage was among the nat. leaders. That doesn't happen without consistently good shot opportunities, which are generally the result of good ball movement.

Reading the cited paragraph, it's hard to imagine that you're talking about the pg for a 3 loss team.


The number of minutes Pangos played (much more than anyone else) was questionable too...but that is on Few. C'mon though...Kelly made nearly twice as many shots as Pangos did, with fewer minutes.

Despite the high number of minutes as a "POINT GUARD", Pangos still did not lead the team in assists either. Stockton had more assists and steals (albeit by small margins) than Pangos, with fewer turnovers than Kevin. And, according to many people on this board, Stockton shouldn't even be playing Division 1 basketball. Overall, I would not even CONSIDER putting Pangos in the top 20-25 returning college hoops players in the country.

Also, national sportswriters and analysts are lazy. If they are talking a lot about Pangos next year...it is possible it is just the only name they even know.

sittingon50
04-26-2013, 12:50 PM
Jordan Morgan likes








































tacos.

ZAGGED OUT
04-26-2013, 12:51 PM
The number of minutes Pangos played (much more than anyone else) was questionable too...but that is on Few. C'mon though...Kelly made nearly twice as many shots as Pangos did, with fewer minutes.

Despite the high number of minutes as a "POINT GUARD", Pangos still did not lead the team in assists either. Stockton had more assists and steals (albeit by small margins) than Pangos, with fewer turnovers than Kevin. And, according to many people on this board, Stockton shouldn't even be playing Division 1 basketball. Overall, I would not even CONSIDER putting Pangos in the top 20-25 returning college hoops players in the country.

Also, national sportswriters and analysts are lazy. If they are talking a lot about Pangos next year...it is possible it is just the only name they even know.

Pangos an Stockton each averaged 1.5 steals last year. His minutes were also more or less required due to lack outside shooting

maynard g krebs
04-26-2013, 02:44 PM
The number of minutes Pangos played (much more than anyone else) was questionable too...but that is on Few. C'mon though...Kelly made nearly twice as many shots as Pangos did, with fewer minutes.

Despite the high number of minutes as a "POINT GUARD", Pangos still did not lead the team in assists either. Stockton had more assists and steals (albeit by small margins) than Pangos, with fewer turnovers than Kevin. And, according to many people on this board, Stockton shouldn't even be playing Division 1 basketball. Overall, I would not even CONSIDER putting Pangos in the top 20-25 returning college hoops players in the country.



Agree KP isn't top 25 player overall now. Beyond that, it's easy to take numbers out of context to support a bias, rather than look at them objectively. Some context for KP's assist numbers:

PG's with big assist numbers generally have the ball in their hands a lot, running the pick and roll (Delly), or spread the floor, drive and dish (USD's Anderson). Team assist numbers and team assist/to ratio are more relevant to me, and a better predictor of team success. Per statsheet.com, it's interesting to note that 5 Zags were in the top 23 in the WCC in assists; DS 8, KP 10, GBJ 15, KO 21, EH 23.

That's an offense that shares the ball as well as any team in CBB. The assists come from a bunch of players, and whenever DS and KP were playing together KP was at the 2. And Stocton's role is almost exclusively as a passer; KP was the #3 scoring option. So that's apples and oranges.

28th in team assists at 15.2 per game, and 10th in team a/to ratio at 1.36, 50% team fg%, and the win/loss record tell the real story about the job the team's lead guard did imo.

Hoopaholic
04-26-2013, 06:49 PM
I find this thread a little humorous...time and time again the professional coaches almost every game stated they created game plans to limit pangos


THAT is why he is a wooden candidate he makes the zags go. Stop him stop the zags

SteelZag
04-26-2013, 08:42 PM
I find this thread a little humorous...time and time again the professional coaches almost every game stated they created game plans to limit pangos


THAT is why he is a wooden candidate he makes the zags go. Stop him stop the zags

I agree. Other candidates such as Aaron Craft are a rule change away from being irrelevant.

ZagLawGrad
04-26-2013, 09:23 PM
...the Zags have the ability to ascent back into the top 5 in the nation.

Just a wild guess, but I don't think the Zags will be sniffing a top 5 anytime again in the near future after the #1 ranking and exit from round 32.

cggonzaga
04-27-2013, 01:43 AM
I'd be willing to wager if we get Moser/Davis we'll see the top 5 at some point next season. Pangos and Bell will be terrific next year as upperclassman. They've been in all the wars and have seen everything there is to see. Coleman is going to surprise many around here. He will be the best 3 this program has had since Richie Frahm and is as athletic as any we've had. Moser/Davis makes up for Harris loss as great a Zag that Harris was. Dower/Karno fill in for KO. I think they easily combine to average 17/7. With that said, hopefully Dranginis finally lives up to his immense potential, Stocks plays solidly, Barham and Nunez knock down some 3s. Next years team will be more balanced and more talented than this past year's team. Lets just hope the chemistry carries over.

gu03alum
04-27-2013, 02:25 AM
I'd be willing to wager if we get Moser/Davis we'll see the top 5 at some point next season. Pangos and Bell will be terrific next year as upperclassman. They've been in all the wars and have seen everything there is to see. Coleman is going to surprise many around here. He will be the best 3 this program has had since Richie Frahm and is as athletic as any we've had. Moser/Davis makes up for Harris loss as great a Zag that Harris was. Dower/Karno fill in for KO. I think they easily combine to average 17/7. With that said, hopefully Dranginis finally lives up to his immense potential, Stocks plays solidly, Barham and Nunez knock down some 3s. Next years team will be more balanced and more talented than this past year's team. Lets just hope the chemistry carries over.

I don't see it with Bell. I think he is a good defender who will hit an open shot. I just don't see him progressing to much more than that.

JAGzag
04-27-2013, 05:34 AM
Love this. I'm a little annoyed at all the "wink wink I'm in the club" bs and sudden deletion of threads that might interest the fans. It is a message board...we should be able to speculate and talk about what we want as long as we aren't bad mouthing kids.

And by the way...if you have information you can't share, don't act like a 10 year old and say "I have information I can't share." Just don't share it.

Especially when said posters have no ties to the program. Sure hope all this wink wink nonsense ... When it's clear who they are referring to ... Doesn't come back to bite the program.

jazzdelmar
04-27-2013, 08:25 AM
I don't see it with Bell. I think he is a good defender who will hit an open shot. I just don't see him progressing to much more than that.

agree, low ceiling, coleman could displace bell......moser, davis, karno, pangos, coleman not bad at all

cggonzaga
04-27-2013, 09:05 AM
I disagree respectfully. When Gary asserts himself he can be the best player on the floor. I will agree he doesn't always do that and that needs to be something he finds consistency with. I think Gary is ready to explode. I also believe our starting 5 averages double digit scoring next season.

jazzdelmar
04-27-2013, 09:26 AM
I disagree respectfully. When Gary asserts himself he can be the best player on the floor. I will agree he doesn't always do that and that needs to be something he finds consistency with. I think Gary is ready to explode. I also believe our starting 5 averages double digit scoring next season.

Maybe. Prob is we haven't seen that from Bell very often. Hope ur right, he sure has the tools.

maynard g krebs
04-27-2013, 11:04 AM
Bell has 2 problems.

1) He was injured this year

2) He has the exceedingly rare problem of being too much of a team guy; deferring to a fault. The Ohio State game his fr year should be the norm for him as an upperclassman if he asserts himself and is healthy. I hope the coaches can do what it takes to get him to a place mentally where he plays like he did in hs, when that is how he played consistently.

His first year I posted the stats of the top fr sg's in the country late in the season; overall his numbers were top 5 in his class. His fr and so scoring averages are almost identical to Stepp's; within a tenth or 2.

MDABE80
04-27-2013, 11:47 AM
Gary defaulted WHEN there were people to default to.. Those days are gone for a bit. If he can clean up his injuries, he'll be the GO TO guy. As juniors, both Kevin and Gary will be the go to guys now. Coleman is a big piece of frosting on this cake.

It's those BIGS we need. I wish the weather was better this weekend. grrrrrr

jazzdelmar
04-27-2013, 12:19 PM
Bell has 2 problems.

1) He was injured this year

2) He has the exceedingly rare problem of being too much of a team guy; deferring to a fault. The Ohio State game his fr year should be the norm for him as an upperclassman if he asserts himself and is healthy. I hope the coaches can do what it takes to get him to a place mentally where he plays like he did in hs, when that is how he played consistently.

His first year I posted the stats of the top fr sg's in the country late in the season; overall his numbers were top 5 in his class. His fr and so scoring averages are almost identical to Stepp's; within a tenth or 2.

agree. no doubt about his tools, but his over deference has been a problem....coleman there cd work both ways -- push him or shrink him....all up to GB.

GoZags
04-27-2013, 12:21 PM
agree. no doubt about his tools, but his over deference has been a problem....coleman there cd work both ways -- push him or shrink him....all up to GB.

The key to Gary is staying healthy. His abdominal strain (tear?) really impacted his play for much of this past season. Here's hoping the injury bug is behind him.

NotoriousZ
04-27-2013, 02:29 PM
Bell is our best player now. Prediction: If he's healthy next year, he will climb up the Wooden list just like Kelly did. And this is not a knock on Pangos, we should have one of the best backcourts in the country.

Oregonzagnut
04-27-2013, 02:40 PM
Just a wild guess, but I don't think the Zags will be sniffing a top 5 anytime again in the near future after the #1 ranking and exit from round 32.

You have the right to your opinion but even without Moser or Davis, I think we could sniff some top 5 rankings and we will again be relevant in the talk of the NCAA tournament for the entire season and we can sweep the WCC again as well.

If there is one thing that I learned this season is that anything is possible. People said "it is impossible for us to get a 1 seed" or "It is impossible for us to get the #1 ranking." Much crow was eaten this year.

Believe it or not, I really think we can reach greater heights next season.

jazzdelmar
04-27-2013, 02:42 PM
Bell is our best player now. Prediction: If he's healthy next year, he will climb up the Wooden list just like Kelly did. And this is not a knock on Pangos, we should have one of the best backcourts in the country.

I'm speechless.

NotoriousZ
04-27-2013, 03:33 PM
Yeah, yeah I'm a Zag fanatic, but I truely believe this, Jazz. We don't know exactly how much Gary was hurt this past year.

By some of your recent posts, it seems like you've lost some faith in Bell. Not to worry IMHO.

ZagLawGrad
04-27-2013, 06:12 PM
I'm speechless.

Me as well.

ZagLawGrad
04-27-2013, 06:15 PM
I disagree respectfully. When Gary asserts himself he can be the best player on the floor. I will agree he doesn't always do that and that needs to be something he finds consistency with. I think Gary is ready to explode. I also believe our starting 5 averages double digit scoring next season.

Bell will have to change two years of his MO for you to be right on that prediction.

Not likely.

maynard g krebs
04-27-2013, 06:52 PM
Bell is our best player now. Prediction: If he's healthy next year, he will climb up the Wooden list just like Kelly did. And this is not a knock on Pangos, we should have one of the best backcourts in the country.

Love your post. Wish I had the guts to make that prediction, and kudos for going out on a limb.

I agree that he has the ability to do that, but here's why I don't think he will:
In hs in the state playin games, regionals or whatever they call them now, in the first game v Arlington he scored 29 in the first half on 10 of 12 or 13 shots, and about 6 of 7 3's, including a couple of pullup 25 footers, the kind of shots he never takes for the Zags. With a 20 pt halftime lead, he scored 2 pts in the second half, didn't take more than a shot or 2 and just tried to help his teammates get some points.

Next day in the game to get to Tacoma v a good Auburn team with a couple 6'3-6'4 guys with D1 athleticism usually doubling him, he still went off for 19 in the first half and again hardly shot in the 2nd, finishing w/ about 27.

Maybe with Harris and KO gone, he'll get the green light and the coaches will tell him he needs to be a bigtime scorer. He can get his own shot one on one, and he has as much range as Stepp, Dickau, or Pangos.

There's a chance you could be right imo. He has that ability as a scorer. It's all about his mindset. If Raivio averaged what, 18 his sr yr, well, GB is a better scorer than DR. And it's not close. He just needs the green light, and not just from the coaches, but internally.