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Angelo Roncalli
04-19-2013, 11:31 PM
The first big AAU tournament of the season began tonight at Bellevue College. A member of the GU coaching staff was there to see Idaho Gatorade player of the year Isaiah Wright (Borah). Wright's Idaho team had an easy win over a squad from Portland in the game I watched tonight. Wright had a very nice game, I'd guess about 18 points and 10 assists. He is strong to the basket with either hand. Very good speed with instant acceleration. He only took 1 or 2 shots from beyond the arc, so not much ability to evaluate his 3 pt shooting. All of the GU coaching staff is currently out on the recruiting trail.

Zagger
04-20-2013, 03:52 AM
From now until November will be an interesting time for the Zags. Having reached a #1 ranking has got to influence recruiting. So to the elevation of KO's game while @ GU. I'm happy with the current mix and eager to see how SD and PK improve over the summer. Few is pretty darn good at getting results with whoever he has on the team and it isn't only those who'll not be around next year that got the team to #1. Sure, Kelly's game will be missed. But, I've got a darn good feeling about how well the Zags will do in 13-14. Adding some new talent will just help that along a bit further. Go Zags!

thespywhozaggedme
04-20-2013, 06:26 AM
The first big AAU tournament of the season began tonight at Bellevue College. A member of the GU coaching staff was there to see Idaho Gatorade player of the year Isaiah Wright (Borah). Wright's Idaho team had an easy win over a squad from Portland in the game I watched tonight. Wright had a very nice game, I'd guess about 18 points and 10 assists. He is strong to the basket with either hand. Very good speed with instant acceleration. He only took 1 or 2 shots from beyond the arc, so not much ability to evaluate his 3 pt shooting. All of the GU coaching staff is currently out on the recruiting trail.

His dad went to Boise and he is Leon's #1, #2 and #3 recruiting priority. It would be a nice coupe if he gets Wright.

BobZag
04-20-2013, 09:22 AM
If you click on this link...

http://idahosports.com/gamestreams/default.aspx

...and choose Boys Basketball and Borah, click, and set the calendar back to include February, click, you can watch Wright and his Borah team play three full games. Click on "View Webcast" for each game.

Kiddwell
04-20-2013, 10:32 AM
An ESPN 3-star recruit:

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/databaseresults?firstname=Isaiah&lastname=Wright&collegeid=&class=2014&position=&state=

Found Wright at Scout, but they've no rating for him (yet).

http://scouthoops.scout.com/a.z?s=75&p=8&c=1&nid=6820997

Couldn't find him at Rivals.

:]

DixieZag
04-20-2013, 10:35 AM
Question to the above: Is he someone we want no matter what or is he one that we want in cause Pope et. al. don't work out?

MDABE80
04-20-2013, 10:38 AM
We need big guards!! lol;)

CDC84
04-20-2013, 10:52 AM
Caught this little tidbit from TSSF:


Slipper Still Fits ‏@slipperstillfit 2h
Another interesting note is that Gonzaga is scheduled to have an in-home visit with Jordan McLaughlin next week.

http://scouthoops.scout.com/a.z?s=75&p=8&c=1&nid=5989704

McLaughlin is another Southern California product. He's currently ranked at #21 with scout.com. Both he and Josh Perkins are considered the best west coast PG prospects in the 2014 class.

I love how the GU staff is aggressively recruiting high level prospects in this very important class. As of right now, here are their top targets for guards:

*****Jordan McLaughlin, 6-0, PG, Etiwanda, CA, #21 scout.com
*****Josh Perkins, 6-3, PG, Aurora, CO, #26 scout.com
****Namon Wright, 6-4, SG, Los Angeles, CA, #30 scout.com
****Grayson Allen, 6-3, SG, Riverview, FLA, #39 scout.com

cggonzaga
04-20-2013, 11:27 AM
Wow CDC, great news! After he blew up last summer I didn't think we stood a chance. This guy has had Allen Iverson comparisons.

ZagNative
04-20-2013, 03:36 PM
Rivals reports Mark Few among many top coaches in Los Angeles at Nike's Elite Youth Basketball League Session#1 and the Double Pump Spring Hoop Fest in nearby Norwalk.

Teams playing (http://www.nikeeyb.com/Events/eybl-session1-losangeles2k13/):


Alabama Challenge (AL)
Albany City Rocks (NY)
All-Ohio Basketball (OH)
Arkansas Wings (AR)
Athletes First (OK)
BABC (MA)
Baltimore Elite (MD)
Bluff City Legends (TN)
Boo Williams (VA)
California Supreme (CA)
CIA Bounce (CAN)
CP3 All-Stars (NC)
Each 1 Teach 1 (FL)
Expressions Elite (MA)
Georgia Stars (GA)
Houston Hoops (TX)
Howard Pulley Panthers (MN)
ICP Elite (OR)
Jackson Tigers (MS)
Mac Irvin Fire (IL)
Mean Streets (IL)
Mokan Elite (KS)
New Jersey Playaz (NJ)
Nike Team Louisiana (LA)
NY Lightning (NY)
Oakland Soldiers (CA)
Seattle Rotary (WA)
Southern Stampede (GA)
Spiece Indy Heat (IN)
St. Louis Eagles (MO)
Team Final (PA)
Team Scan (NY)
Team Takeover (DC)
Team Texas Elite (TX)
Team United (NC)
Texas PRO (TX)
Texas Titans (TX)
The Family (MI)
Travelers Basketball (TN)
Wisconsin Playground Elite (WI)

A quick scan of box scores (http://www.nikeeyb.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/CA130405.pdf) shows ICP's Donovan Dorsey and Silas Melson, but I suspect there are many, many others who are top targets for the Zags.

BobZag
04-20-2013, 04:45 PM
A big one in Vegas, as well. Pangos Spring Spectacular

I think Josh Perkins looked outstanding today for Colorado Miners.

MDABE80
04-20-2013, 04:50 PM
What limited time I've seen Dorsey, he sure looks good. Good size, good hops and is still growing. Seems to have a good feel for the game. Hope we're still on him.

ZagNative
04-20-2013, 04:56 PM
A big one in Vegas, as well. Pangos Spring Spectacular

I think Josh Perkins looked outstanding today for Colorado Miners.Who do you suppose represented the staff in Vegas today? Got to think they'd have someone there.

MDABE80
04-20-2013, 05:11 PM
Watching the Nike Hoops Summit.....so many of these kids on their way to Cal and UK. But no matter the World team is crushing the US component. World kids seem fundmentally more sound. Us has the flashy kids but they're getting beat by kids trained in fundmentals/
ALL these kids will be playing college. I hope our No 1 AP ranking does us some good. The foreign kids simply won't be ignored. I'd like a couple of em with us. So strong in the basics....something build on.

Unbiased
04-20-2013, 06:52 PM
What limited time I've seen Dorsey, he sure looks good. Good size, good hops and is still growing. Seems to have a good feel for the game. Hope we're still on him.

Agreed.

I've seen him play three times. He has good handles and might end up being a six-foot-seven guard. From all the guard prospects on the west coast, he'd be my first choice by a mile. I gotta feeling Romar is thinking the same thing.

Worthington
04-20-2013, 07:15 PM
Watching the Nike Hoops Summit.....so many of these kids on their way to Cal and UK. But no matter the World team is crushing the US component. World kids seem fundmentally more sound. Us has the flashy kids but they're getting beat by kids trained in fundmentals/
ALL these kids will be playing college. I hope our No 1 AP ranking does us some good. The foreign kids simply won't be ignored. I'd like a couple of em with us. So strong in the basics....something build on.

We had Mam Jaiteh on campus last summer, I believe. Started for the World team and considered a potential first rounder this year. Think there has been some chatter about Jean Livio Charles on the board before too, but I'm not sure if we were ever officially linked to him. Hope we continue to recruit overseas hard, as the talent level seems to be rising globally.

ZagNative
04-20-2013, 07:23 PM
And for some news about sure-thing future Zags, Lucas Meikle was selected for the Washington squad for the Northwest Shootout, held at Chilles Center in Portland tonight at 6:00 pm. Haven't been able to find a box score yet.

Roster:

Washington Boys

Nalin Sood, head coach
Joe Harris,Assistant coach
Marquis Armstead, Mountlake Terrace High School
Brett Bailey, University High School
Will Dorsey, Rainier Beach High School
DJ Fenner, Seattle Prep High School
Tre' shaun Fletcher, Lincoln High School
Tucker Haymond, Garfield High School
Lucas Meikle, Bellermine Prep High School
Issac Reimer, Lynden Christian High School
Dominic Robinson, Curtis High School
Dezmyn Trent, Foss High School

I'd imagine stats for the game should be available at OregonLive (http://www.oregonlive.com/sports/) soon.

thespywhozaggedme
04-20-2013, 08:06 PM
We had Mam Jaiteh on campus last summer, I believe. Started for the World team and considered a potential first rounder this year. Think there has been some chatter about Jean Livio Charles on the board before too, but I'm not sure if we were ever officially linked to him. Hope we continue to recruit overseas hard, as the talent level seems to be rising globally.

Didn't Jaiteh commit to Kansas or was that Joel Embieb? Livio Charles was amazing, awesome motor and very skilled. On a side note Dante Exum has Boise listed as one of his finalists; if he was American he would be a 5* top 15 recruit.

Zagdawg
04-20-2013, 08:09 PM
Oregon wins 113-111-- Calvin Hermanson is player of the game with 26 pts and 11 boards.

Don't see a box score to see how Lucas did.


http://highschoolsports.oregonlive.com/news/article/4896383734254560476/northwest-shootout-lake-oswegos-calvin-hermanson-is-mvp-as-oregon-boys-end-losing-streak-to-washington/#comments

ZagNative
04-20-2013, 08:24 PM
According to the News Tribune (http://blog.thenewstribune.com/preps/2013/04/20/washington-boys-bid-for-last-second-win-thwarted-at-the-18th-northwest-shootout/), Lucas played but did not score.

webspinnre
04-20-2013, 08:44 PM
Oregon wins 113-111-- Calvin Hermanson is player of the game with 26 pts and 11 boards.

Don't see a box score to see how Lucas did.


http://highschoolsports.oregonlive.com/news/article/4896383734254560476/northwest-shootout-lake-oswegos-calvin-hermanson-is-mvp-as-oregon-boys-end-losing-streak-to-washington/#comments

Gaels got a good one there.

thespywhozaggedme
04-20-2013, 08:59 PM
Gaels got a good one there.

And by all accounts he really wanted to be a Zag. Joe Harris v 2.0?

ZagNative
04-20-2013, 09:03 PM
Gaels got a good one there.So did San Diego, as BobZag has regertfully posted (University’s Brett Bailey).
Led by Haymond, out of Garfield High, and University’s Brett Bailey, who added 25 points, started the second half on a 16-3 run over the first 3 minutes, 48 seconds to get back into it.

MDABE80
04-20-2013, 10:01 PM
I never understood why we didn't go after Harmanson like wildfire.
Excellent tough kid. Same with Bailey. Right from beneath our noses.

ZagaZags
04-21-2013, 02:26 AM
Kentucky has 8 recruits coming in 2013. So 5 players from last seasons will be on the team in 2013.

bigblahla
04-21-2013, 06:09 AM
Why after reading this thread am I depressed first thing on a Sunday morning?

Hmmmmmn?

SMC recurit - Calvin Hermanson is player of the game with 26 pts and 11 boards.

USD recruit -University’s Brett Bailey, who added 25 points,

Gonzaga recruit -According to the News Tribune, Lucas played but did not score.

Whats wrong with this picture?

Go!! Zags!!!

GoZags
04-21-2013, 06:25 AM
Why after reading this thread am I depressed first thing on a Sunday morning?

Hmmmmmn?

SMC recurit - Calvin Hermanson is player of the game with 26 pts and 11 boards.

USD recruit -University’s Brett Bailey, who added 25 points,

Gonzaga recruit -According to the News Tribune, Lucas played but did not score.

Whats wrong with this picture?

Go!! Zags!!!

Yep.

Depressed.

That's the first thing I think of when I think of Gonzaga Basketball. It's obvious -- nobody involved with the program knows what the heck they are doing. It seems to be blunder after blunder after blunder. Oh, what has happened to our once proud program? Why doesn't the staff know how to do their jobs?

Woe is me.

Woe is me.

bigblahla
04-21-2013, 06:32 AM
Yep.

Depressed.

That's the first thing I think of when I think of Gonzaga Basketball. It's obvious -- nobody involved with the program knows what the heck they are doing. It seems to be blunder after blunder after blunder. Oh, what has happened to our once proud program? Why doesn't the staff know how to do their jobs?

Woe is me.

Woe is me.

Really? Just expressing my honest opinion after reading the thread.

I drink way more koolaid than you GZ.

Did reading it make you feel good?

Don't put words in my mouth the sentiments you expressed are yours and yours alone and regardless of what you say it's tough reading that one of our two 2013 recruits went scoreless in a game against his high school peers.

Enough said.

Go!! Zags!!!

Zagdawg
04-21-2013, 06:48 AM
Fans will have a wide variety of reactions with this thread-- some will take it in stride..some will overreact... I am thinking that GoZags is just providing a bit of sarcasm summarizing what the overreactors have and will continue to say until we start playing ball next season or get a new recruit or two into the fold.

With some development Lucas will be fine.

The world is not over....step back from the edge.

No Prozac is required..... just a little time.

And yes....Go Zags!

hooter73
04-21-2013, 08:06 AM
Lucas played but did not score.

Sigh?




2013/14 pure recruits are what they are. We got in some good guard and wing transfers and are targeting some major guards for 14/15 but boy does it look worrying under the basket for the next few years.

GU will still be fine, just go back to a guard oriented game is all. We got spoiled having four guys on the floor that could all score and two of those being bigs. Trending backwards maybe.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 09:22 AM
Look, we all LOVE the Zags, or we wouldn't be here, but if we're evaluating the program objectively, one could argue that if Few does have a flaw, it's that he's not necessarily great at either recruiting, or evaluating talent; not sure which it is. As Bob likes to say, he rather go for an exotic kid from France (Kieta) whom, I liked btw, than a scrappy, "under the radar" scorer from the PNW that really wanted to be a Zag; i.e Joe Harris, Hermanson, Baily, etc.

If I had the time, I think I could literally list a dozen players that Few recruited over the past few years that are no longer with the program and/or not doing as well as other players that wanted to be a Zag. He's human and like all of us has his strengths and weaknesses, you take the good with the bad and the god far outweighs the bad.

23dpg
04-21-2013, 10:32 AM
Oregon won by 2. The guy I was hoping Gonzaga would offer was MVP.

Calvin Hermanson, a 6-foot-6 guard from Lake Oswego High School who is headed to Saint Mary’s College, shared game-high scoring honors with Washington’s Tucker Haymond with 26 points. He tallied seven of his team’s final eight points, and was named the game’s most valuable player.

The guy who is coming to GU played but didn't score. Is he still injured?

Bellarmine Prep’s Lucas Meikle played but did not score.

Does anyone have any insight?

sittingon50
04-21-2013, 10:34 AM
Thanks hooter.

:lmao:

maynard g krebs
04-21-2013, 10:37 AM
I have been to the Oregon-Washington game a couple of times. It's played like a McDonalds game or NBA allstar game; little defense, a lot of 3's and showboat plays, as the 113-111 score attests.

Meikle going scoreless means little in this context. If you are a big, somebody has to pass you the ball before you can score, unless you get a putback. I'll be surprised if he becomes a significant player for the Zags based on what I saw when he was a jr, but these games are meaningless and not something to worry about or get excited about.

Scoring 25 in these games doesn't mean much either. I've seen Tucker Haymond a number of times, and he's a mid major talent. He did as well as the guys being moaned about in this thread. Saw Bailey as a jr at state, and he was nothing special then. Hermanson looked better than those 2 on tape, and Bennett signing him says a lot, of course. But you can't sign everybody.

Some pointless handwringing here imo.

jazzdelmar
04-21-2013, 10:42 AM
Oregon won by 2. The guy I was hoping Gonzaga would offer was MVP.

Calvin Hermanson, a 6-foot-6 guard from Lake Oswego High School who is headed to Saint Mary’s College, shared game-high scoring honors with Washington’s Tucker Haymond with 26 points. He tallied seven of his team’s final eight points, and was named the game’s most valuable player.

The guy who is coming to GU played but didn't score. Is he still injured?

Bellarmine Prep’s Lucas Meikle played but did not score.

Does anyone have any insight?



I suspect he's not as talented as Hermanson.

maynard g krebs
04-21-2013, 10:49 AM
one could argue that if Few does have a flaw, it's that he's not necessarily great at either recruiting, or evaluating talent; not sure which it is.



I would argue that the exact opposite is true. Nobody hits on every recruit. Few every year signs guys Fitz would have told him not to even waste his time talking to.

As to evaluating talent, I'd point to the 3 star guys who made the NBA, or will.

If Monson and Few hadn't elevated the program in terms of the players they got, the only people even talking about it on this board would be the alums.

maynard g krebs
04-21-2013, 10:55 AM
Check Angelo's recruiting thread; discussion there.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 11:20 AM
I would argue that the exact opposite is true. Nobody hits on every recruit. Few every year signs guys Fitz would have told him not to even waste his time talking to.

As to evaluating talent, I'd point to the 3 star guys who made the NBA, or will.

If Monson and Few hadn't elevated the program in terms of the players they got, the only people even talking about it on this board would be the alums.

Let's take this year for example. We gave schollies to a long term project big from Montana that put up mediocre numbers in high school in, did I mention, Montana. Our second recruit is a combo 3/4 guy, who to his credit played pretty well his senior year, but has to bulk up a lot and will most likely red shirt. In his last game, yesterday, he was held scoreless, meanwhile the two top scorers, both desperately wanted to be Zags and went to our two rivals. Few is human, he makes mistakes, but his good sure outweighs his bad.

BroncoZAG615
04-21-2013, 11:23 AM
Just to let you know, 5-star guard Josh Perkins is visiting in early May but, yeah, keep complaining about Hermanson and Bailey.

jazzdelmar
04-21-2013, 11:25 AM
Just to let you know, 5-star guard Josh Perkins is visiting in early May but, yeah, keep complaining about Hermanson and Bailey.

Signifying what? They passed on two great local kids for a Hail Mary at a top kid? No way to fun a candy store.

BroncoZAG615
04-21-2013, 11:34 AM
Signifying what? They passed on two great local kids for a Hail Mary at a top kid? No way to fun a candy store.

If you think Gonzaga has a Hail Mary chance with Perkins, Jazz, then you obviously have zero context on the situation which doesn't surprise me in the least bit. I will step back, however, and allow you to get everyone in a tizzy. I know it's your offseason hobby.

The staff admitted they whiffed on Joe Harris. Let's not make every local recruit a cult hero before they hit a college campus.

jazzdelmar
04-21-2013, 11:37 AM
If you think Gonzaga has a Hail Mary chance with Perkins, Jazz, then you obviously have zero context on the situation which doesn't surprise me in the least bit. I will step back, however, and allow you to get everyone in a tizzy. I know it's your offseason hobby.

The staff admitted they whiffed on Joe Harris. Let's not make every local recruit a cult hero before they hit a college campus.

How can anyone be as smart as you?

BroncoZAG615
04-21-2013, 11:44 AM
How can anyone be as smart as you?

I have no doubt you are a very bright and successful guy. I never questioned that, just don't think it's fair to overdramatize a situation like this while ignoring other things such as the promise of the 2014 class. I guess I would classify as a blind, Polly as you've called me in the past.

I'm excited for the developments of Meikle, Edwards and the possible addition of Moser. The Zags are in great shape.

ZagNative
04-21-2013, 11:51 AM
Jazz is off his meds, Bronco. It's going to be a long offseason ...

I'm really grateful for the hard work the guys at Slipper Still Fits have done following prospects throughout the year. Thanks!

maynard g krebs
04-21-2013, 11:52 AM
Let's take this year for example. We gave schollies to a long term project big from Montana that put up mediocre numbers in high school in, did I mention, Montana. Our second recruit is a combo 3/4 guy, who to his credit played pretty well his senior year, but has to bulk up a lot and will most likely red shirt. In his last game, yesterday, he was held scoreless, meanwhile the two top scorers, both desperately wanted to be Zags and went to our two rivals. Few is human, he makes mistakes, but his good sure outweighs his bad.

This year's recruiting is an anomaly imo. If Ray G says the Montana kid has the tools of Todd MacCulloch of Saskatchewan, though, he's worth a shot.

Did you read what I said about this game? Washington's Andrew Andrews scored in the 30s in this game a couple years ago. And the guards don't necessarily give the bigs the ball.

And Haymond scored a point more than Bailey. Equal players, more or less. Why isn't anyone complaining about not signing Haymond? Bailey is from Spokane and BZ likes him, so everybody is on board. Joe Harris he ain't, unless he made an Adam like jump his last yr. I'll worry about Bailey when he leads a win over the Zags.

jazzdelmar
04-21-2013, 11:52 AM
I have no doubt you are a very bright and successful guy. I never questioned that, just don't think it's fair to overdramatize a situation like this while ignoring other things such as the promise of the 2014 class. I guess I would classify as a blind, Polly as you've called me in the past.

I'm excited for the developments of Meikle, Edwards and the possible addition of Moser. The Zags are in great shape.

Fair enough. In the spirit of detente I'm not going to touch the "great shape" comment. I did, however research Perkins in order to approximate your level of insider info on the subject. It appears Duke, Kansas and Zona are also after the young man, Self having already offered. Gonzaga is listed, yes, as also having offered but I'm still thinking, forgive me, that vs those blue bloods the intercession of our lady would be necessary for the Zags to land Perkins. That's just me. No drama about it.

jazzdelmar
04-21-2013, 11:55 AM
Jazz is off his meds, Bronco. It's going to be a long offseason ...

I'm really grateful for the hard work the guys at Slipper Still Fits have done following prospects throughout the year. Thanks!

Why don't u just harass Doc? I have no beef with you.

Zagdawg
04-21-2013, 11:56 AM
I'm thinking that trusting the coaching staff that brought GU the first #1 college basketball ranking in the history of the program makes a bit more sense than trying to tear them down every chance some of our fans get is a better use of ones time-- but not all fans are alike -- and some like to play the negativity card more than others.

I'll trust that the Gonzaga coaching staff is doing what they need to do to continue to build a successful program-- and may have a pretty solid idea what our program needs to be successful.

Go Zags!

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 11:59 AM
Just to let you know, 5-star guard Josh Perkins is visiting in early May but, yeah, keep complaining about Hermanson and Bailey.

One has nothing to do with the other. Perkins would be a great get and we would all be ecstatic. What does landing Perkins in 2014 have to do with giving a shollie to the Montana kid over Hermansen or Bailey in 2013? :confused:

BroncoZAG615
04-21-2013, 12:00 PM
Fair enough. In the spirit of detente I'm not going to touch the "great shape" comment. I did, however research Perkins in order to approximate your level of insider info on the subject. It appears Duke, Kansas and Zona are also after the young man, Self having already offered. Gonzaga is listed, yes, as also having offered but I'm still thinking, forgive me, that vs those blue bloods the intercession of our lady would be necessary for the Zags to land Perkins. That's just me. No drama about it.

Haha, I actually think it will come down to CU and Gonzaga. Kansas has gotten a couple recent commits and I don't think they'll wind up being a big player for Josh. I will be curious to see if Alford continues to pursue him at UCLA. They are the one wild card in my eyes.

ZagNative
04-21-2013, 12:01 PM
Jazz, you've been unusually negative lately, even for you. Your cynicism peppers every post you make in recent days.

Oh, well. There's always the "Ignore" button, though I really hate to use it for you, because of the off-chance you'll say something really witty, rather than the recent snarky trend.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 12:02 PM
This year's recruiting is an anomaly imo. If Ray G says the Montana kid has the tools of Todd MacCulloch of Saskatchewan, though, he's worth a shot.

Did you read what I said about this game? Washington's Andrew Andrews scored in the 30s in this game a couple years ago. And the guards don't necessarily give the bigs the ball.

And Haymond scored a point more than Bailey. Equal players, more or less. Why isn't anyone complaining about not signing Haymond? Bailey is from Spokane and BZ likes him, so everybody is on board. Joe Harris he ain't, unless he made an Adam like jump his last yr. I'll worry about Bailey when he leads a win over the Zags.

I did, and I appreciate your account, but correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Meikle and Hermanson similar in size and stature? I'm n ot expecting LM to score almost 20 in the game, but to be held scoreless is a little surprising, but again, one game does not a season make and he played very well his senior year.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 12:04 PM
I'm thinking that trusting the coaching staff that brought GU the first #1 college basketball ranking in the history of the program makes a bit more sense than trying to tear them down every chance some of our fans get is a better use of ones time-- but not all fans are alike -- and some like to play the negativity card more than others.

I'll trust that the Gonzaga coaching staff is doing what they need to do to continue to build a successful program-- and may have a pretty solid idea what our program needs to be successful.

Go Zags!

Who's doing this? Show me a link and I will loudly condemn them for doing so.

jazzdelmar
04-21-2013, 12:04 PM
Jazz, you've been unusually negative lately, even for you. Your cynicism peppers every post you make in recent days.

Oh, well. There's always the "Ignore" button, though I really hate to use it for you, because of the off-chance you'll say something really witty, rather than the recent snarky trend.

Flattery will get you everywhere. I will try to rehabilitate myself. Stay tuned. You're right and the truth is I haven't nearly gotten over the wretched end to this wonderful season.

CDC84
04-21-2013, 12:05 PM
Not all 13 guys on your roster can be high school all stars. Meikle and Edwards are local Pacific NW kids who want to be Zags and who will be Zags their entire careers. This program has been rocked by too much transferring in recent years. It needs some stable players who are willing to wait 2-3 years before they get their turn. You're more likely to find "program players" who are willing to stick it out at the local level. Where the GU staff screwed up recently was when they went to places like Maine and France to find such players. It was a mistake. When a kid is too far away from home and has no real emotional attachment to the program he's a part of, he's simply going to bail if the PT isn't there right away.

The 2013 class - which again, I think you have to include Coleman and Nunez in - was never a priority class for the Zags. The staff never thought Olynyk would develop to the point where he would bail for the NBA early. If KO had stayed, the roster would be pretty stacked. It wasn't a good class for bringing in top 50 players.

At the same time, you can see that the staff feels very differently about the 2014 class. They're recruiting like crazy. I am not aware of a single kid the staff is recruiting who isn't a top 100 kid at some recruiting site. In fact, they are currently pursuing three five star players (Pope, McLaughlin and Perkins). This program has never been involved with this many top level recruits before....and it's largely happening because after years and years of mediocrity, the west coast is brimming with talent in the 2014 and 2015 classes.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 12:05 PM
Haha, I actually think it will come down to CU and Gonzaga. Kansas has gotten a couple recent commits and I don't think they'll wind up being a big player for Josh. I will be curious to see if Alford continues to pursue him at UCLA. They are the one wild card in my eyes.

I think having Boldin in our camp helps tremendously with Perkins and Lavine at UCLA helps us as well. I like our chances with this kid a lot; really excited about him.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 12:07 PM
Not all 13 guys on your roster can be high school all stars. Meikle and Edwards are local Pacific NW kids who want to be Zags and who will be Zags their entire careers. This program has been rocked by too much transferring in recent years. It needs some stable players who are willing to wait 2-3 years before they get their turn. You're more likely to find "program players" who are willing to stick it out at the local level. Where the GU staff screwed up is for a few years they went to places like Maine and France to find such players. It was a mistake. When a kid is too far away from home and has no real emotional attachment to the program he's a part of, he's simply going to bail if the PT isn't there right away.

The 2013 class - which again, I think you have to include Coleman and Nunez in - was never a priority class for the Zags. The staff never thought Olynyk would develop to the point where he would bail for the NBA early. It wasn't a good class for bringing in top 50 players.

At the same time, you can see that the staff feels very different about 2014. They recruiting like crazy. I am not aware of a single kid the staff is recruiting who isn't a top 100 kid. In fact, they are currently pursuing three five star players (Pope, McLaughlin and Perkins). This program has never been involved with this many top level recruits before....and it's largely happening because after years and years of mediocrity, the west coast is brimming with talent.

That's a bold statement considering our recent attrition/transfer rate. Other than that, I agree with everything that you wrote. Good post.

CDC84
04-21-2013, 12:19 PM
Again, Spy, as I said in my post = most of the "Program Players" who have transferred out have been non-local kids. A kid is far, far less likely to exhibit patience and stick it out if he is playing far away from home. Keegan Hyland didn't have any emotional attachment to Gonzaga University and its hoops program due to the fact that he came from Maine. Whereas if you go with local kids to fulfill these roles, they're far more willing to exhibit patience. They are also much more committed to being good teammates, practicing hard to get better, etc. It's because Gonzaga really means something due to its proximity to where they grew up.

For me, the signings of Meikle and Edwards are an attempt to get back to the way things used to be done around here. Those kids are far more likely to be here all four years than some two star player from Palm Beach Gardens, Florida. I have zero problems giving 12th and 13th schoolies to those two kids.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 12:26 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Again, Spy, as I said in my post = most of the "Program Players" who have transferred out have been non-local kids. A kid is far, far less likely to exhibit patience and stick it out if he is playing far away from home. Keegan Hyland didn't have any emotional attachment to Gonzaga University and its hoops program due to the fact that he came from Maine. Whereas if you go with local kids to fulfill these roles, they're far more willing to exhibit patience. They are also much more committed to being good teammates, practicing hard to get better, etc. It's because Gonzaga really means something due to its proximity to where they grew up.

For me, the signings of Meikle and Edwards are an attempt to get back to the way things used to be done around here. Those kids are far more likely to be here all four years than some two star player from Palm Beach Gardens, Florida. I have zero problems giving 12th and 13th schoolies to those two kids.
.

The point is/was the same thing could have been done with Hermanson and Bailey. P.S. Who is the 2* from Palm Beach Gardens, Fl. that you're referring to? I can't think of him off the top of my head.

BroncoZAG615
04-21-2013, 12:36 PM
One has nothing to do with the other. Perkins would be a great get and we would all be ecstatic. What does landing Perkins in 2014 have to do with giving a shollie to the Montana kid over Hermansen or Bailey in 2013? :confused:

Given the current state of the roster, I see no need to get either Bailey or Hermanson if better guys are out there in 14. I think the risk/reward is better on Edwards who could turn into a solid player in a few years. Getting quality bigs is VERY tough nowadays.

I'm as perplexed about Meikle as many here but I don't really think its worth getting too freaked out about considering how 2014 is lining up.

I actually think the prospects of the 2014 class had a huge bearing on the staff not doing much in 13. They've been on guys like Dorsey and Perkins for a long long time.

CDC84
04-21-2013, 12:37 PM
The point is/was the same thing could have been done with Hermanson and Bailey.

Do you understand what a program player is? It's not Hermanson, who will start from day one at St. Mary's and could frankly play big minutes for several Pac 12 schools. He's a highly underrated prospect. Gonzaga doesn't have a need for a player like him this year when they're already stacked along the perimeter. They're better off with the guys they have and then replacing them with top 50 level prospects in 2014 and 2015. More importantly, why would Hermanson want to play for a program that is so stacked along the perimeter when he has so many other choices?

Hermanson is not a 12th or 13th scholarship player. Again, I have zero problems giving 12th and 13th schoolies to Meikle and Edwards. Especially Edwards, because you can't teach someone to be a 7 footer.

MDABE80
04-21-2013, 12:56 PM
Back to the boards I guess. Both Hermanson and Bailey are goners elsewhere.
I do wonder though who is realistically (key word) in the pipeline. Even though we had a no1 ranking and a no 1 seed.......... those high rankings aren't the same for us as they would be with UNC, Duke, KU, etc. For them it's expected. FOr us..well it was the rarest of the rare. In many quarters, you're only as good as your last game....a loss in our case. A hard fought loss to a good team..a loss nonetheless.
The media has nearly erased the wonderful season we just finished with their sh*tty comments about us......unfounded or not. What's done is done though.

We NEED some strong recruits. As it sits now, we don't have any.I'm not thinking of stars behind their names...we can make our own judgements as to the value of a kid for any given spot. I like the local kids too........but remember that referring to Joe harris, Bennett had him locked up early and young Joe followed his coach across the country to play for him.

Although we've done well in the past, one of these seasons, the cupboard will be way too thin to go far in that dreaded NCAA tourney. Right now, we need bigs.....really good athletic bigs. I don't have a vote in all this, but those bigs would be my focus. Sounds a bit distant but 6 months for now we'll be crazy nervous if we don't have two strong kids underneath. We just lost 32 pts and 15 rebounds per game....with little hope in sight to replace those two kids. Wings and guard we got......a solution to our immediate needs we don't have....not just yet anyway.

I'm sure Few and staff have noticed.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 01:13 PM
Do you understand what a program player is? It's not Hermanson, who will start from day one at St. Mary's and could frankly play big minutes for several Pac 12 schools. He's a highly underrated prospect. Gonzaga doesn't have a need for a player like him this year when they're already stacked along the perimeter. They're better off with the guys they have and then replacing them with top 50 level prospects in 2014 and 2015. More importantly, why would Hermanson want to play for a program that is so stacked along the perimeter when he has so many other choices?

Hermanson is not a 12th or 13th scholarship player. Again, I have zero problems giving 12th and 13th schoolies to Meikle and Edwards. Especially Edwards, because you can't teach someone to be a 7 footer.

You're making my point for me. He's a sf; Drew will be a senior, Nunez is an unknown and Coleman is 6'2 tops. One year of readshirtting and CH could have been our starting sf for the next several years. I don't see how on earth you would rather have an 11th or 12th man over potentially a starter at a position that we've had a really hard time trying to fill. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 01:15 PM
Back to the boards I guess. Both Hermanson and Bailey are goners elsewhere.
I do wonder though who is realistically (key word) in the pipeline. Even though we had a no1 ranking and a no 1 seed.......... those high rankings aren't the same for us as they would be with UNC, Duke, KU, etc. For them it's expected. FOr us..well it was the rarest of the rare. In many quarters, you're only as good as your last game....a loss in our case. A hard fought loss to a good team..a loss nonetheless.
The media has nearly erased the wonderful season we just finished with their sh*tty comments about us......unfounded or not. What's done is done though.

We NEED some strong recruits. As it sits now, we don't have any.I'm not thinking of stars behind their names...we can make our own judgements as to the value of a kid for any given spot. I like the local kids too........but remember that referring to Joe harris, Bennett had him locked up early and young Joe followed his coach across the country to play for him.

Although we've done well in the past, one of these seasons, the cupboard will be way too thin to go far in that dreaded NCAA tourney. Right now, we need bigs.....really good athletic bigs. I don't have a vote in all this, but those bigs would be my focus. Sounds a bit distant but 6 months for now we'll be crazy nervous if we don't have two strong kids underneath. We just lost 32 pts and 15 rebounds per game....with little hope in sight to replace those two kids. Wings and guard we got......a solution to our immediate needs we don't have....not just yet anyway.

I'm sure Few and staff have noticed.

If we're being objective, not making it past the round of 32; AGAIN, did as much damage to our rep as the media could have.

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 01:19 PM
Back to the boards I guess. Both Hermanson and Bailey are goners elsewhere.
I do wonder though who is realistically (key word) in the pipeline. Even though we had a no1 ranking and a no 1 seed.......... those high rankings aren't the same for us as they would be with UNC, Duke, KU, etc. For them it's expected. FOr us..well it was the rarest of the rare. In many quarters, you're only as good as your last game....a loss in our case. A hard fought loss to a good team..a loss nonetheless.
The media has nearly erased the wonderful season we just finished with their sh*tty comments about us......unfounded or not. What's done is done though.

We NEED some strong recruits. As it sits now, we don't have any.I'm not thinking of stars behind their names...we can make our own judgements as to the value of a kid for any given spot. I like the local kids too........but remember that referring to Joe harris, Bennett had him locked up early and young Joe followed his coach across the country to play for him.

Although we've done well in the past, one of these seasons, the cupboard will be way too thin to go far in that dreaded NCAA tourney. Right now, we need bigs.....really good athletic bigs. I don't have a vote in all this, but those bigs would be my focus. Sounds a bit distant but 6 months for now we'll be crazy nervous if we don't have two strong kids underneath. We just lost 32 pts and 15 rebounds per game....with little hope in sight to replace those two kids. Wings and guard we got......a solution to our immediate needs we don't have....not just yet anyway.

I'm sure Few and staff have noticed.

I know you've been very tight lipped, but are you still as excited about the transfers as you were two weeks ago?

MDABE80
04-21-2013, 01:23 PM
Would you deny that the media took it upon themselves to amplify?
But keep in mind, the media was at us PRIOR to that loss in the round of 32? It began right away prior to season's end and they kept at it....it just got worse when we beat Southern. It was unfair to us. Following Wichita it continued.........no matter that WSU sailed into the finals....... I don't remember other teams treated like that ever....... do you?

And if you don't know, transfers are still being figured out but the season lasted longer for some of these kids. No announcements doesn't mean anyone was wrong. It simply means the season kept going for osme of those kids. Can't announce much for a full month and surely not until after some kids deciding for the draft. It would be damaging to some teams and to some kids. Following the end of the season and when kids can still declare for another full week, things are still being figured out. Not sure if you're being snarky or not......and it doesn't matter......some things are private...and they must remain so.

ZagNative
04-21-2013, 01:30 PM
Folks seem too quick to write off Lucas Meikle... Just reminder:

He averaged 15 points and nine rebounds per game.

AP State First Team From the Seattle-Times (http://blogs.seattletimes.com/highschoolsports/2013/04/01/associated-press-all-state-boys-and-girls-basketball-teams/):
CLASS 4A

Player of the year _ Zach LaVine, sr., Bothell.

First team
Zach LaVine, sr., Bothell;
Jason Todd, jr., Jackson;
Tucker Haymond, sr., Garfield;
Lucas Miekle, sr., Bellarmine Prep;
Dominic Robinson, sr., Curtis.
Narrows League 4A Boys MVP - From The News Tribune (http://blog.thenewstribune.com/preps/2013/02/12/quick-notes-from-all-narrows-4a-and-3a-basketball-selections/)

NARROWS 4A BOYS

MVP: Lucas Meikle, Bellarmine Prep.

1st team: Sefo Liufau, Bellarmine Prep;
Isaiah Flynn, Bellarmine Prep;
Ryley Callaghan, South Kitsap;
Eric Anderson-Connolly, Stadium;
Michael Thomas, Central Kitsap.
Coach of the year: Doug Cocke, Stadium.

So, tell me: What's not to like?

thespywhozaggedme
04-21-2013, 01:33 PM
Would you deny that the media took it upon themselves to amplify?
But keep in mind, the media was at us PRIOR to that loss in the round of 32? It began right away prior to season's end and they kept at it....it just got worse when we beat Southern. It was unfair to us. Following Wichita it continued.........no matter that WSU sailed into the finals....... I don't remember other teams treated like that ever....... do you?

And if you don't know, transfers are still being figured out but the season lasted longer for some of these kids. No announcements doesn't mean anyone was wrong. It simply means the season kept going for osme of those kids. Can't announce much for a full month and surely not until after some kids deciding for the draft. It would be damaging to some teams and to some kids. Following the end of the season and when kids can still declare for another full week, things are still being figured out. Not sure if you're being snarky or not......and it doesn't matter......some things are private...and they must remain so.

I'm a lot of things, but snarky isn't one of them. I was genuinely interested if you were still as excited about the transfers as you were a few weeks ago; there was no hidden agenda. Man, everyone's really edgy lately. :confused:

MDABE80
04-21-2013, 01:36 PM
ZN ...lots will settle down soon. Lucas is a very good player. He just won't be jumping over backboards to please the crowd. Good solid kid coming with skills that'll be developed by the staff. Nobody's perfect when they're HS seniors......Lucas didn't get those accolades for nuthin;)

Malastein
04-21-2013, 01:41 PM
I'm going to play wait and see with the two incoming guys. Olynyk certainly didn't impress me until this season(and I still rank somewhere in the middle of what he actually accomplished). I do agree with Spy that those guys do seem like they would have been good gets, but we shall see who is brought in. Perhaps the program is on the rise with recruiting more sure fire professionals. If the conference upgrade happens, then I don't know how the Zags don't hang with all the top west coast schools with recruiting.

hondo
04-21-2013, 01:46 PM
Folks it was an all star game, often the ball does not get past the guards is these game.

ZagNative
04-21-2013, 02:00 PM
Some pics of Lucas. Needs help with the hair first thing, and then some serious beefing up.

I like this pic of him celebrating a dunk:

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-_T7CnZQ-oI4/UQQPYdR-9RI/AAAAAAABYH8/dIA2ihE9Iv4/s450/2013-01-25%2520Lucas%2520Meikle%2520Lincoln-2.jpg

And what about those arms? Skinny, but so long!

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-lOyVB6rGxn8/UQHAb-EAiAI/AAAAAAABXxA/9GAfol2Y9kk/s512/2013-01-23%2520Lucas%2520Meikle%2520South%2520Kitsap.JPG

jazzdelmar
04-21-2013, 02:06 PM
Thanks for the pics, ZN, but somehow I find no comfort in them.

ZagNative
04-21-2013, 02:23 PM
Thanks for the pics, ZN, but somehow I find no comfort in them.And no comfort in his stats (15 pts. and 9 rebounds) or all-state nominations - One of the five best 4A players in the state?

So just disregard that? Man, that negativism's got its teeth into Jazz's hide deep ....

All is lost ... the inexorable slide to mediocrity and oblivion has begun ...

jazzdelmar
04-21-2013, 02:30 PM
And no comfort in his stats (15 pts. and 9 rebounds) or all-state nominations - One of the five best 4A players in the state?

So just disregard that? Man, that negativism's got its teeth into Jazz's hide deep ....

All is lost ... the inexorable slide to mediocrity and oblivion has begun ...

In other words, the Zags have jumped the shark, is that what you are saying? 😁

Unbiased
04-21-2013, 02:31 PM
.......but remember that referring to Joe harris, Bennett had him locked up early and young Joe followed his coach across the country to play for him.


This has been discussed before and ther are some links to all this. Bennet did not have Harris locked up early. Gonzaga wanted Harris to 'walk on.'

Big mistake - and Few admitted it.

ZagNative
04-21-2013, 02:41 PM
In other words, the Zags have jumped the shark, is that what you are saying? 😁Dammit! See now? I'd miss that kind of gem if I relegated the Jazzmeister to my ignore list.

MDABE80
04-21-2013, 02:42 PM
You know friends.......much of these delays are due to not knowing what Kelly was going to do. If he'd have stayed, some center/power forwards didn't want to sit for their last 1 or 2 years. Not the same with Elias' spot.

Now that Kelly's decided, I honestly think things will pick up. We'll soon see.

As for Joe, there are multiple versions of how he ended up in Virginia... HE wasn't offered a spot. Bennett had him convince he should go to Virginia. He did. I suppose someone, someday will ask Joe himself. As it sits years later though, we do know the above in this post. Lots of things unknown nearly always suffuse these types of things.

Birddog
04-21-2013, 03:28 PM
Can we just re-name this thread "And now back to pissing"?

cggonzaga
04-21-2013, 03:44 PM
Can we just re-name this thread "And now back to pissing"?


Wouldn't be a thread without BD adding the obligatory "everyone is so negative" comment.

ZN, have you seen Meikle play? If you have you would see that nothing stands out about him. Having seen both Meikle and Bailey play several times I'd take Brett 10 times out of 10. I have a feeling Meikle's accolades have more to do with being committed to Gonzaga than his actual play. Maybe he becomes a player down the road but as CDC stated he's a 12th or 13th rotation type player.

sittingon50
04-21-2013, 04:52 PM
Who would take Mark Spink & John Bryant type players on the Zags right now? I would, in half a heartbeat.

As CDC mentioned & I've been hollering on here for years, you can't use your 13 scholarships for all front line players. It's like a jigsaw puzzle; it takes all shapes & sizes (roles) to put a team together.

Lucas is a skinny 4, like Spink. Except Mark couldn't even sniff 4A 1st team all state. But he maxed his talent as a scrappy rebounder & the Defensive POY in the WCC. And he & Calvary have more NCAA wins (7) than any other Zags, if I am not mistaken. Lucas brings way more to the table. He must maximize it, however.

By all accounts, Ryan is way ahead of John coming into college, conditioning wise. John turned himself into WCC POY his Sr. year. Can Ryan do that? I doubt it just because his supporting cast will be much better, lowering his #'s. But if he can score around the basket & rebound in his area, hell yeah, bring him on.

I swear, some of you need to bring a lot more critical math skills to the equation. There is one basketball & 200 minutes to go around. And a minor in chemistry would serve you well too. 13 happy campers > 5 or 6 or 7.

GorgeZag
04-21-2013, 05:56 PM
Who would take Mark Spink & John Bryant type players on the Zags right now? I would, in half a heartbeat.

As CDC mentioned & I've been hollering on here for years, you can't use your 13 scholarships for all front line players. It's like a jigsaw puzzle; it takes all shapes & sizes (roles) to put a team together.

I swear, some of you need to bring a lot more critical math skills to the equation. There is one basketball & 200 minutes to go around. And a minor in chemistry would serve you well too. 13 happy campers > 5 or 6 or 7.


No doubt. They would be great 9-13 type players for the current team. As it stands right now we have no one to start/play next to Karno after next year, and that's assuming he develops into a starter. I'm sure the staff will do "just fine" and there does seem to be an emphasis on 2014 class. I'm glad the staff is aiming high but there is a very real possibility of striking out on the Top 50-75 types.

maynard g krebs
04-21-2013, 06:10 PM
Folks seem too quick to write off Lucas Meikle... Just reminder:

He averaged 15 points and nine rebounds per game.

AP State First Team From the Seattle-Times (http://blogs.seattletimes.com/highschoolsports/2013/04/01/associated-press-all-state-boys-and-girls-basketball-teams/):
Narrows League 4A Boys MVP - From The News Tribune (http://blog.thenewstribune.com/preps/2013/02/12/quick-notes-from-all-narrows-4a-and-3a-basketball-selections/)


So, tell me: What's not to like?

Fifteen/nine are pretty modest averages for a 6-8 kid on a so-so team.
Looking at the AP all state teams, most of the high major talent in Wa. is 3a this year. Dorsey is on 2nd team 3a, with Cal signee Rorie, and Lakeside's Tremaine Isabell
Second best 4a player on this list is Jason Todd, then Tucker Haymond (both mid major types, though I love Todd personally), then Meikle. Meikle is not in the same class as the 3a guys like those above, much less Shaqquan Aaron, Treshaun Fletcher, or DJ Fenner.

As CDC says, 12-13th man, hopefully a good bench guy; roster stability, maybe some backup minutes in his 4th-5th year. And that's ok. You only play 7-9 guys anyway when it counts.

UberZagFan
04-22-2013, 11:02 AM
Not all local "program players" stick around all four years either. See Andy Poling.

Angelo Roncalli
04-22-2013, 11:13 AM
This has been discussed before and ther are some links to all this. Bennet did not have Harris locked up early. Gonzaga wanted Harris to 'walk on.'

Big mistake - and Few admitted it.

And Joe also crapped on himself when he had an absolutely awful team camp.

CDC84
04-22-2013, 11:26 AM
Not all local "program players" stick around all four years either. See Andy Poling.

I don't know if you would call Andy Poling a program player, because when he committed to Gonzaga, he was a top 10 player with just about every national recruiting service. He was as high as #2 with hoopmasters.com.

Obviously, things changed after his commitment. But I wouldn't put Andy in the same category as Keegan Hyland, Mathis Keita, etc. The staff genuinely felt that if he ever got over that illness and regained strength that he could be a great player at GU.

cjm720
04-22-2013, 12:20 PM
Threads like this crack me up...yea, Hermason's good but maybe, just maybe he's where he wants to be...our #### stinks too...don't think we can land every recruit, in fact we never do.

willandi
04-22-2013, 01:52 PM
Why aren't we taking away recruits from Coach Cal?

Zippyzaggy
04-22-2013, 01:59 PM
Why aren't we taking away recruits from Coach Cal?

Doesn't Calipari have like 9 Micky D's already on his team? There ought to be a limit. Like in fishing.....you need to leave SOME lunkers for everyone else.

Make him throw some back. Like Wiltjer for example.