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View Full Version : The beauty of being a negative Nelly.



kclubfounder
03-31-2013, 03:38 PM
The beauty of being a "glass half empty" guy who thinks Gonzaga basketball is lacking in whatever ways you think they are lacking is that you win when we lose, because you expected it and sort of predicted it. So you are therefore smart and the basketball results proved you right (in your mind).

The additional beauty of being a "glass half empty" guy is that if and when the day comes that we make it to the promised land you will simply abandon your "glass half empty" world and celebrate that the glass is now full.

What flipping ever.

You "glass half empty" folks are tiresome, annoying, and frequently obnoxious.

But you ARE Zag fans. So I still love you.

Kind of.

MDABE80
03-31-2013, 03:40 PM
KC...lol...don't forget "uniformed".

MickMick
03-31-2013, 04:52 PM
It might be another 5 years before GU fields a team like that.

The bigs on Wichita State remind me of Spangler.

I know I shouldn't bring him up, but GU sure could use a junkyard dog about now.

I can wait.

primal23
03-31-2013, 05:19 PM
So is this to only be a sunshine and happiness board? And those who might think otherwise, have differing opinions are ignorant and should just be quiet?

75Zag
03-31-2013, 05:27 PM
I assume I fall into the negative category.

I want GU BB to have objective goals, and I want to evaluate the team based on whether they DO or DO NOT reach those goals. We can discuss what those goals should be, and reasonable minds will certainly differ. But I don't care about "character building" or "GU spirit" or the rest of the stuff (notice I have become more politically sensitive and therefore did not say b**l sh&t) that reminds me of the whine that the Campus Ministry types were pitching when I was at GU.

If you disagree that objective standards are appropriate, then I guess you are a "half full" person and I am not. But I honestly do not see why we should not evaluate the team, coach and staff on whether they met objective goals. Anything else sounds more like Girl Scout Camp than Major College NCAA Division I BB.

Go Bulldogs!

americasteam
03-31-2013, 05:50 PM
I assume I fall into the negative category.

I want GU BB to have objective goals, and I want to evaluate the team based on whether they DO or DO NOT reach those goals. We can discuss what those goals should be, and reasonable minds will certainly differ. But I don't care about "character building" or "GU spirit" or the rest of the stuff (notice I have become more politically sensitive and therefore did not say b**l sh&t) that reminds me of the whine that the Campus Ministry types were pitching when I was at GU.

If you disagree that objective standards are appropriate, then I guess you are a "half full" person and I am not. But I honestly do not see why we should not evaluate the team, coach and staff on whether they met objective goals. Anything else sounds more like Girl Scout Camp than Major College NCAA Division I BB.

Go Bulldogs!

Nothing against Brian Michaelson, but that is why I think we need to bring in an elite recruiter and/or a defensive specialist. Can't just reward the next guy down the line, no matter how nice he is, or what great rapport he has with the team. Take it to the next level!

McZag
03-31-2013, 06:52 PM
I assume I fall into the negative category.

I want GU BB to have objective goals, and I want to evaluate the team based on whether they DO or DO NOT reach those goals. We can discuss what those goals should be, and reasonable minds will certainly differ. But I don't care about "character building" or "GU spirit" or the rest of the stuff (notice I have become more politically sensitive and therefore did not say b**l sh&t) that reminds me of the whine that the Campus Ministry types were pitching when I was at GU.

If you disagree that objective standards are appropriate, then I guess you are a "half full" person and I am not. But I honestly do not see why we should not evaluate the team, coach and staff on whether they met objective goals. Anything else sounds more like Girl Scout Camp than Major College NCAA Division I BB.

Go Bulldogs!

Understood. The underlining point that isn't discussed much here is the enormous investment of cash that's been made over the past 14 years by ticket holders, alums, students, fans etc. Expectations based on objective goals typically come after large investments of this sort not to mention the time invested following the sport and the competition.

Business' rely on objective goals to measure value. The question is, has an investment been made into Gonzaga Basketball by the community that warrants business-like objective goals? Prior to 1999, this would have been laughable. The investment in GU Hoops barely paid the electric bill. Season tickets were plentiful and cheap and the fans just wanted to see a competitive effort, objective goals were crazy talk.

But now I'm hearing about a $300M fund-raising campaign designed to reinvent the campus, again. If that type of jackpot is related in any way to the perceived succes of Gonzaga Basketball, are objective goals in order?

I see both sides.

The mission of Gonzaga University has never been to produce a contender for basketball national championships. The university has never promised such, planned for such or expected such. They built a 6000 seat arena on purpose and it wasn't to attract a larger more lucrative conference. It was designed to be the class of the WCC - nothing more or less. The only objective goals the program has set for itself are to win the league, win the league tournament and try to win in March. I have heard nothing else since the cash campaigns began.

Now it is reasonable to assume that many donors do and will expect greater results for their money. As time marches on and more checks are written, talk of objective goals will become louder and louder. Granted no one twists arms to entice folks to write checks, but if the message is "we are a nationally competitive basketball program", investors will expect that to eventually translate into success in March. Therefore I can see a need for objective goals if the program raises expectations on their own through the solicitation of funding. That's the fine line that will need to balanced in the coming years if the program truly wants to grow, as the messaging has been.

Until, then I will focus on the program goals as they are communicated and make my contributions proportionately.

thegloriousgoateeofKP
03-31-2013, 07:43 PM
In many cases, the "glass half empty" approach is a defense mechanism. It softens the blow--just a little--of a tough loss.

GoZags
03-31-2013, 07:52 PM
Nothing against Brian Michaelson, but that is why I think we need to bring in an elite recruiter and/or a defensive specialist. Can't just reward the next guy down the line, no matter how nice he is, or what great rapport he has with the team. Take it to the next level!

You mean like they did when they hired Coach Daniels? Something like that? How about when they hired Ray? Something like that?

What about the hires before that? Tommy and Leon.

GU has hired 4 coaches since this "cute little run" began. All have come from the outside.

btzag
03-31-2013, 08:17 PM
I assume I fall into the negative category.

I want GU BB to have objective goals, and I want to evaluate the team based on whether they DO or DO NOT reach those goals. We can discuss what those goals should be, and reasonable minds will certainly differ. But I don't care about "character building" or "GU spirit" or the rest of the stuff (notice I have become more politically sensitive and therefore did not say b**l sh&t) that reminds me of the whine that the Campus Ministry types were pitching when I was at GU.

If you disagree that objective standards are appropriate, then I guess you are a "half full" person and I am not. But I honestly do not see why we should not evaluate the team, coach and staff on whether they met objective goals. Anything else sounds more like Girl Scout Camp than Major College NCAA Division I BB.

Go Bulldogs!

So 75 what are the objective goals? Final Four or bust? Nat Champ or bust? Finish 3rd in league, sneak into tourney and pull some upsets to make Elite Eight? This is a crazy one but at the start of the year set a totally unreasonable goal to finish the season #1 overall and land a 1 seed after losing our vocal leader and top inside player to the pros? No that one might just be too crazy...

The fact is that some of the STANDARDS set by this program are unmatched anywhere in the country! Yes we all know that we want a final four or maybe an appearance in the championship game but consider a top level program like Syracuse....it has been 10 years since Syracuse last made the final four. This is a program that gets five star kids all the time, is being investigated for major recruiting violations, is coached by a sure fire HOF'er, plays in the largest arena in all of CBB and in the Big East! Our LONG run is 15 years and I don't think we are landing a Carmelo type any time soon nor will we build a comparable arena or play in a major conference and hopefully will not stoop to major recruiting violations.

It's ok to wish for more but maybe the glass half full posters are just looking at things in the proper perspective?

willandi
03-31-2013, 08:25 PM
Nothing against Brian Michaelson, but that is why I think we need to bring in an elite recruiter and/or a defensive specialist. Can't just reward the next guy down the line, no matter how nice he is, or what great rapport he has with the team. Take it to the next level!

Don't know how elite a recruiter I am, tried east on Sprague, but I am awfully defensive, AND I will give it a real go...for enough money!

caduceus
03-31-2013, 09:23 PM
http://i.imgur.com/9xifyhZ.png

americasteam
03-31-2013, 10:47 PM
You mean like they did when they hired Coach Daniels? Something like that? How about when they hired Ray? Something like that?

What about the hires before that? Tommy and Leon.

GU has hired 4 coaches since this "cute little run" began. All have come from the outside.

Which is my point exactly. Keep bringing in those kind of guys. Not a guy whose never really coached before, and never recruited before, ie Michaelson

Oregonzagnut
03-31-2013, 10:59 PM
All of us are in the same boat at this point, so I guess a superiority complex and lashing out at others always makes some feel better?

I like to think I am a "glass is 3/4's full" kinda guy, enough to relax and enjoy, but always room for more!

TexasZagFan
04-01-2013, 05:09 AM
All of us are in the same boat at this point, so I guess a superiority complex and lashing out at others always makes some feel better?

I like to think I am a "glass is 3/4's full" kinda guy, enough to relax and enjoy, but always room for more!

Nothing like a disappointing end to the season to morph the basketball board into the OCC. :starwars:

titopoet
04-01-2013, 07:08 AM
What happened? The Zags lost a game. Being in anger and negativity about what this means will be bad for your health. (http://www.inc.com/minda-zetlin/listening-to-complainers-is-bad-for-your-brain.html)

There is always next year to dream. The Zags will tear down the wall and if they continue to grow.
Behaviorist have found that the last of any experience will but the largest weight on the whole experience. This Zag team did somethings that others haven't. 1 ranking and 1 seed. That is a major accomplishment, especially since the entire budget is less that what Coach Cal spends on his new dorms.

What I find interesting is how many people denigrated WSU. Well they were clearly the better team on Sat against the mighty OSU. Maybe WSU was underrated as a Midmajor. I hope the Zags learn from this and move on, that is really the only choice. Brooding on the past will lead to collapse and bad health.

I still believe. After all all that happen was the Zags lost. Nothing more, nothing less. Ask Louisville about what is important, Ware or winning?

TacomaZAG
04-01-2013, 09:46 AM
Good luck to all you guys wanting a Jesuit Institution to run their basketball team like a business, complete with objective goals. The entire notion of a Jesuit education, and of sports teams at pretty much any level, is the definition of a subjective endeavor. It's the square peg/round hole argument. Can't have it both ways.

The NY Yankees have a World Series Championship as their "objective goal" every year. They've reached that goal fewer than 30 times in over 100 years. Doesn't sound like a "company" I'd be interested in, less than 30% success rate, unacceptable.............

The subjective nature of sports and a liberal arts education is what make them worthwhile......

Go ZAGS

BobZag
04-01-2013, 10:27 AM
So is this to only be a sunshine and happiness board? And those who might think otherwise, have differing opinions are ignorant and should just be quiet?

Don't forget the lollipops!

kclubfounder
04-02-2013, 04:22 PM
So is this to only be a sunshine and happiness board? And those who might think otherwise, have differing opinions are ignorant and should just be quiet?

Opposing views are always welcome, but if you are ignorant then you should indeed be quiet.

And most of the time those whose views oppose mine do come from a position of ignorance.

:D

jbslicer
04-02-2013, 04:46 PM
Bob Zag must be pretty old to remember Lesley Gore.

gonzagabasketball
04-02-2013, 05:22 PM
The beauty of being a "glass half empty" guy who thinks Gonzaga basketball is lacking in whatever ways you think they are lacking is that you win when we lose, because you expected it and sort of predicted it. So you are therefore smart and the basketball results proved you right (in your mind).

The additional beauty of being a "glass half empty" guy is that if and when the day comes that we make it to the promised land you will simply abandon your "glass half empty" world and celebrate that the glass is now full.

What flipping ever.

You "glass half empty" folks are tiresome, annoying, and frequently obnoxious.

But you ARE Zag fans. So I still love you.



Kind of.
Don't be a Self-Righteous Richard.

kclubfounder
04-02-2013, 05:25 PM
Don't be a Self-Righteous Richard.

OK, as long as you agree not to be a jerk face.

vandalzag
04-02-2013, 05:44 PM
Don't be a Self-Righteous Richard.

And did I hear a niner in there? Were you calling from a walkie-talkie?

caduceus
04-02-2013, 06:42 PM
http://i.imgur.com/PlB2FYU.gif

CaliforniaZaggin'
04-02-2013, 07:02 PM
Delta bravo.

bigblahla
04-02-2013, 08:06 PM
The beauty of being a "glass half empty" guy who thinks Gonzaga basketball is lacking in whatever ways you think they are lacking is that you win when we lose, because you expected it and sort of predicted it. So you are therefore smart and the basketball results proved you right (in your mind).

The additional beauty of being a "glass half empty" guy is that if and when the day comes that we make it to the promised land you will simply abandon your "glass half empty" world and celebrate that the glass is now full.

What flipping ever.

You "glass half empty" folks are tiresome, annoying, and frequently obnoxious.

But you ARE Zag fans. So I still love you.

Kind of.

I applaud your political correctness. You have much more patience than I. I'm amazed how some choose to chase a dream team while denigrating our coach, staff and team, those that actually represent Gonzaga.

They echo their disappointment with opinions seeming to lack an appreciation of any successes achieved. They voice their negativity as if it's a positive and act like they deserve better than the truth of each games experience which we are all witness to. Rarely do they credit our opponents for their ability or hard work.

I'm a homer and proud to admit it. I erase more than I post out of civility to my fellow board members and there are times I wish some here could exhibit the same restraint. A sign of maturity is knowing when to be silent.

Just my opinion.

Go!! Zags!!!