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Angelo Roncalli
03-27-2013, 05:53 AM
I have read a number of posts on this board and on the boards of other WCC schools that suggest that the WCC should develop a "scheduling arrangement" with the new Big East conference.

I'd like for someone to explain to me what the motivation in this proposed arrangement is for Big East schools? Charity? Why in the world would Georgetown want a home and home with USF or Depaul covet a home and home with Portland?

I just don't see it ever happening.

TexasZagFan
03-27-2013, 06:08 AM
I have read a number of posts on this board and on the boards of other WCC schools that suggest that the WCC should develop a "scheduling arrangement" with the new Big East conference.

I'd like for someone to explain to me what the motivation in this proposed arrangement is for Big East schools? Charity? Why in the world would Georgetown want a home and home with USF or Depaul covet a home with Portland?

I just don't see it ever happening.

Would it have to be a home and home? UTEP agreed to two games in DC with Georgetown to get them to play one game in El Paso, but that was 30 years ago.

With the exception of the Zags, and possibly BYU, the WCC does not hold the cards. St. Mary's is going to struggle with finding a replacement for Dellavedova, so their OOC is not going to improve.

bartruff1
03-27-2013, 06:09 AM
It is up to ESPN or Fox Sports to pay the bills...it would be fun.. I believe in the separation of church and sports but others may find that compelling and there is the east vs west aspect...I bet the kids from " back there" would be excited to go to California in the cold dark winter..and who wouldn't want to play in those historic courts in the East .

Birddog
03-27-2013, 06:15 AM
It would be difficult for any network broadcasting these theoretical games to hype up most of the WCC to the level of the Big East.

Angelo Roncalli
03-27-2013, 06:27 AM
With the exception of the Zags, and possibly BYU, the WCC does not hold the cards. St. Mary's is going to struggle with finding a replacement for Dellavedova, so their OOC is not going to improve.

That's the point. If you, Hondo, Birddog, GoZags, 229 Sinto, Bart and I decided we were going to embark on a campaign to set up dates with this year's Sports Illustrated swimsuit models, the interest in such scheduling would be all one sided.

thespywhozaggedme
03-27-2013, 06:34 AM
I have read a number of posts on this board and on the boards of other WCC schools that suggest that the WCC should develop a "scheduling arrangement" with the new Big East conference.

I'd like for someone to explain to me what the motivation in this proposed arrangement is for Big East schools? Charity? Why in the world would Georgetown want a home and home with USF or Depaul covet a home and home with Portland?

I just don't see it ever happening.

They will need quality ooc opponents for rpi.

bartruff1
03-27-2013, 06:40 AM
That's the point. If you, Hondo, Birddog, GoZags, 229 Sinto, Bart and I decided we were going to embark on a campaign to set up dates with this year's Sports Illustrated swimsuit models, the interest in such scheduling would be all one sided.

As a patron of the arts, like Lorenzo de Medici, I would be willing to help a aspiring model with a apartment, a Porsche and a stipend .....

I can imagine there could be a " Battle in LA" of San Diego or San Francisco if some Lorenzo of Basketball was willing to put up the dough....it could happen. Not something like the ACC/Big...but playing the major media markets has some value...

Not holding my breath in either case...

willandi
03-27-2013, 06:57 AM
They will need quality ooc opponents for rpi.

This!
Top 4 teams from each side play a game on each coast...that's 2 OOC games for each team against a higher RPI school.
It also helps to preserve the reason for each conference, that faith based, non-football conferences, have a place at the NCAA table.
It keeps from having to pay yhe football schools money for those 2 games. It isn't much, but it's a start.

Since only the top 4 teams in each Conference get to play, it SHOULD cause the other schools to try and improve. As they do perhaps it expands to 6 schools and so on.

Good marketing should be able to sell a GU/GU game, a rematch of SMC/Creighton and so on. It is out of the box thinking. A way to try and make things work, to make the NCAA accept the relevance of non football conferences, and it beats the hell out of sitting back and taking the scraps offered.

Come up with ideas, ways to make it work, ways to make people WANT to see it happen! Please!

TexasZagFan
03-27-2013, 07:14 AM
That's the point. If you, Hondo, Birddog, GoZags, 229 Sinto, Bart and I decided we were going to embark on a campaign to set up dates with this year's Sports Illustrated swimsuit models, the interest in such scheduling would be all one sided.

Might not be as one-sided as you think. Unfortunately, my wife would put the kibosh on my participation in the "campaign." :eek:

cjm720
03-27-2013, 07:32 AM
It's a Zag thing not a WCC one. And in either case, it makes no sense purely from a travel perspective. That boat's gone...

Should have tried to work something out with Creighton...then St. Louis, others.

cbbfanatic
03-27-2013, 07:48 AM
I'd like for someone to explain to me what the motivation in this proposed arrangement is for Big East schools? Charity? Why in the world would Georgetown want a home and home with USF or Depaul covet a home and home with Portland?



one of the things the new big east will certainly play to is that it is a basketball-centric league that will appeal to basketball purists. no football influence, no back seat, just basketball. big markets, strong coaching names/personalities (like they did in establishing the big east 30 some years ago)

a west coast partner makes sense for them, as they will want to expand their influence and exposure with like-minded partners. problem is, there isnt as much interest in most of the wcc programs, it isnt certain that they are truly like-minded, and they dont move the needle like the big east schools do, so the deal would have to start out favoring the big east financially, and on whatever other terms they decide (location, format, etc).

hopefully in time, some real rivalries could develop, and the partnership would be something that some kids from around the country want to be part of (one day you might hear a decent prospect say he chose san diego over sd state because he wanted to play in the big east/wcc classic). i think you can start at having each team play 2 OOC games vs someone from the other conference (and it might be 75% road for the WCC at first, that arrangement would likely work out better financially for everyone). maybe get really aggressive and do an exempt pre-season (or even mid-season, get creative) tournament where you take the previous year's top 4 from each league and do a 3 game tourney (8-4-2-1).

i think the WCC should do whatever it can to make something work with this conference. it would benefit both sides.

also, add seattle u immediately

ZagLawGrad
03-27-2013, 08:15 AM
I'd like for someone to explain to me what the motivation in this proposed arrangement is for Big East schools? Charity? Why in the world would Georgetown want a home and home with USF or Depaul covet a home and home with Portland?

I just don't see it ever happening.

I don't see it happening either.

If for no other reason than it's the WCC.

bartruff1
03-27-2013, 08:36 AM
I could swear I saw a Gameday and a Bracketbuster...BYU could be headed to the Garden...I saw Georgetown play in Pulman ....

I cannot believe the WCC was not in Seattle years ago...

TheGonzagaFactor
03-27-2013, 03:37 PM
Some people (possibly just a couple) around here like to pretend the WCC isn't a complete joke. If I were the new BE commish I would laugh at the idea.

bartruff1
03-27-2013, 05:48 PM
Some people (possibly just a couple) around here like to pretend the WCC isn't a complete joke. If I were the new BE commish I would laugh at the idea.

Some people are not pretending...they don't think the WCC is a complete joke.

I am one of those people.

NJZag
03-27-2013, 06:48 PM
I have read a number of posts on this board and on the boards of other WCC schools that suggest that the WCC should develop a "scheduling arrangement" with the new Big East conference.

I'd like for someone to explain to me what the motivation in this proposed arrangement is for Big East schools? Charity? Why in the world would Georgetown want a home and home with USF or Depaul covet a home and home with Portland?

I just don't see it ever happening.

I suggested a challenge series --

PAC-10 had one with the Big-12 -- the mismatch of numbers meant that two PAC-10 schools had to play two games, instead of one, with members of the Big-12. The series got dropped in 2010 and it might have been the PAC-10 that didn't want to renew it.

There was a Big East-SEC challenge series (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEC%E2%80%93Big_East_Challenge#2011.E2.80.9312_For mat_Change)which has now played itself out with the BE's split into two different conferences.

The granddaddy of the challenge series is the ACC-Big 10. Like all of the challenge series, it was dreamt up by sports broadcasting industry. They're going to have fun figuring out how to get those games to match up since ACC grows to 15 members this coming year, and Big 10 will have 12.

The RPIs of our bottom-dwellers are worse than those of the Big East's, but take a look at the C7 members of the New Big East, which run from the 2nd ranked school in the Old Big East down to that league's 15th ranked school. DePaul, which had an overall RPI ranking of 202 with its 11-21 win-loss record.

2 (10) Georgetown 0.6315 25-6
3 (12) Marquette 0.6258 23-8
9 (51) Villanova 0.5772 19-13
10 (89) Providence 0.5454 17-14
11 (93) St. John's 0.544 16-15
13 (130) Seton Hall 0.5195 15-18
15 (202) DePaul 0.4771 11-21

Take a look at the Old Big East schools who won't be around anymore, though I'm sure some coaches or AD's might try to continue some historic rivalries as part of their ooc planning.

1 (3) Louisville
4 (13) Syracuse
5 (36) Notre Dame
6 (43) Pittsburgh
7 (49) Connecticut
8 (50) Cincinnati
12 (109) Rutgers
14 (151) South Florida

Are you starting to see a problem? I sure do. Some significant strength that "was" a part of the Old Big East isn't going to be there anymore. Granted, there will be the two added teams from the A-10 and one from the MVC

Moving over from the A-10
2 (20) Butler .6133 (Butler was ranked behind St. Louis in the A-10)
9 (90) Xavier .5451

Moving over from the MVC
1 (25) Creighton .6046

The idea of a challenge series is to compete for overall conference bragging rights between two conferences over a period of years. TV execs arranging these things probably wouldn't want to match a Gonzaga to DePaul. Who's going to want to watch that? If the challenge series matched all teams in each annual event, the organizers would probably try to keep the matchups somewhat comparable, from top to bottom. But the series could also cherry pick the teams participating and their matchups. Here's what the WCC looks like:

1 (6) Gonzaga 0.6368
2 (30) Saint Mary's 0.6004
3 (65) Brigham Young 0.5573
4 (97) Santa Clara 0.5405
5 (160) San Diego 0.5074
6 (166) San Francisco 0.5034
7 (207) Pepperdine 0.4733
8 (208) Loyola Marymount 0.4726
9 (231) Portland 0.4629

NJZag
03-27-2013, 06:57 PM
At a lower tier from the BCS conferences, and something that our brethren at Creighton and our "good friends" the Shockers have played in ...

Mountain West v. Missouri Valley Conferences Challenge Series (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_West%E2%80%93Missouri_Valley_Challenge#Mi ssouri_Valley_Conference_.281-2-1.29)

Zag 77
03-27-2013, 07:10 PM
I cannot believe the WCC was not in Seattle years ago...

Bart, unfortunately SU stinks. They finished 8-22 and dead last in the mighty Western Athletic Conference. I do not see any sign of them being serious about the committment it takes to have a decent athletic program.

At this point I think that D-III Whitworth has a stronger program.

bartruff1
03-27-2013, 07:12 PM
Huge media market...shouldn't be ignored...Seattle had a national program when Gonzaga couldn't draw flies, the potential is there.

KStyles
03-27-2013, 07:14 PM
Big 12 & SEC are supposedly working on a Big 12/SEC Challenge (http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/67075/3-point-shot-challenge-for-big-12-sec) to begin next year.

cbbfanatic
03-28-2013, 07:49 AM
Bart, unfortunately SU stinks. They finished 8-22 and dead last in the mighty Western Athletic Conference. I do not see any sign of them being serious about the committment it takes to have a decent athletic program.

At this point I think that D-III Whitworth has a stronger program.

getting worked up over where that (or any) program is right now is extremely shortsighted.

here are the important things about seattle U:
- top 15 market (that likes basketball)
- NBA caliber arena that is about to get a nice remodel
- perfect institutional fit
- natural rival for Gonzaga instead of revolving door of whoever else is "kinda good" at the moment in the wcc

if they truly want to get better in basketball from top to bottom, the wcc should:

- do whatever it can to increase the value of the league by adding teams in good markets (go out and get denver too)
- play in bigger, better venues, preferably nba arenas (this helps make the league a better destination for recruits)
- renegotiate a better tv deal when it becomes available
- put in guidelines for financial commitment to basketball among conference members - force them to invest increased TV $ in their programs

that is how you rise the tide of the wcc. its not about 2013 rpi #s. its not about 2014 rpi #s. any comparison on those grounds is extremely short sighted - and suggests one is looking for a band-aid. fact of the matter is, there isnt a currently good program out there that the WCC would have any ability to add.

need to think potential.

willandi
03-28-2013, 08:03 AM
I think you are right CBB. And think how it would p*ss of the chicken to have west side players choosing a WCC school because of the better TV visibility and (dare I say it) better competition, at least at the top!