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Larrylegend
03-23-2013, 09:33 PM
Mark Few has only reached the Sweet 16 4 times in 14 years as Gonzaga head coach, and never made it further. Among active coaches, only Fran Dunphy of Temple has as many tournament appearances without an Elite 8 appearance, and most of his appearances were with an Ivy League team --Penn.

gonwick
03-23-2013, 09:38 PM
Like it or not, the overrated meme will continue to grow until there is a breakthrough. This will have tangible effects on seedings and rankings. If they couldn't do it this year, with a wide open path to the elite 8, when can they? If we fans can ask that, imagine what the objective journalists will say, let alone the haters. This program just dug itself a hole. They better pray another 1 goes down tomorrow.

DixieZag
03-23-2013, 09:39 PM
Do you have a point you are trying to make or did you just find a fact that you wanted to throw out here? You think that our coach is holding us back? How?

Did you know that some coaches have a monkey that prevents them from either getting into the tournament or winning a game? I know you are dying to say something, so just say it.

I'm going to say what I want.

I want a monkey!!!!

CaliforniaZaggin'
03-23-2013, 09:41 PM
Sounds like a good problem to have.

MJ777
03-23-2013, 09:41 PM
Mark Few has only reached the Sweet 16 4 times in 14 years as Gonzaga head coach, and never made it further. Among active coaches, only Fran Dunphy of Temple has as many tournament appearances without an Elite 8 appearance, and most of his appearances were with an Ivy League team --Penn.

...and Michigan is in it's first Sweet 16 since 1994.

ehk 21
03-23-2013, 09:41 PM
If you count all of the Anti-Few folks who are posting on GU Boards tonight.

MJ777
03-23-2013, 09:43 PM
If you count all of the Anti-Few folks who are posting on GU Boards tonight.

:roll:

HOOTER
03-23-2013, 09:44 PM
It's getting increasingly difficult to defend Few as the early tourney exits pile up. Many here will try to stick up for him, which I can sympathize with, but it's getting harder to do every year. Bottom line, this team is stagnant and has been for quite some time. This early exit is especially tough to justify with a #1 ranking and a 1 seed. It is amusing to listen to people try though.

MJ777
03-23-2013, 09:46 PM
It's getting harder to defend Few as the early tourney exits pile up. Many here will try to defend him, but it's getting harder to do every year. Bottom line, this team is stagnant and has been for quite some time. This early exit is especially tough to justify with a #1 ranking and a 1 seed. It is amusing to listen to people try though.

Well he is not going anywhere. Hopefully he will learn from his mistakes and soon.

NEC26
03-23-2013, 09:48 PM
It's getting increasingly difficult to defend Few as the early tourney exits pile up. Many here will try to defend him, but it's getting harder to do every year. Bottom line, this team is stagnant and has been for quite some time. This early exit is especially tough to justify with a #1 ranking and a 1 seed. It is amusing to listen to people try though.

This, I am a huge fan and I think Few is a great coach but this is an incredibly disappointing result. I suppose things might have been different had Bell not been injured but man what a wasted opportunity for us.
We needed to break through this year.

Oregonzagnut
03-23-2013, 09:51 PM
I don't think anyone is anti-Few, I think everyone is anti-"play not to lose".

Few CAN change how he prepares his teams for the post-season. IMO, if he is doing the exact same preparation as he did all year, right there is the problem. He needs to take all they have learned, stick with the strengths, absolutely forget about the word "weaknesses" and go all out and avoid micromanaging and tinkering. Just remove the reigns, let the horses go and let the team win it on the court.

This constant habit of putting a team out there that fears losing, is on him. Few needs to trust the teams skills and hoops IQ after 31 wins. He needs to work on becoming a motivator and inspirational leader in order to get our teams out of the tight and cautious mindset they get in. Every year, elements of the same mental self sabotage.

DixieZag
03-23-2013, 09:56 PM
This, I am a huge fan and I think Few is a great coach but this is an incredibly disappointing result. I suppose things might have been different had Bell not been injured but man what a wasted opportunity for us.
We needed to break through this year.

I think the "need" thing was a big part of the problem.

From the moment this team took the floor on Thurs it was obvious that they were tight. The kids feel the whole "culture" thing, which is sad since they were in 9th grade when Morrison and company built the foundation.

The ONE lesson that I think Few should look at coming away from this season is how to keep himself loose enough that he can coach the kids to play loose and aggressive.

IMHO, it was really bad this year b/c he wanted it so bad for these kids, he obviously loved them and wanted them to go out laughing. tough tough problem, but I like our "problem."

Zags11
03-23-2013, 09:57 PM
If you count all of the Anti-Few folks who are posting on GU Boards tonight.

I am assuming you threw me as 1. Never been Anti Few. He has a ceiling.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 10:00 PM
Zags 3pt defense this tournament . 24-51

Zag 77
03-23-2013, 10:01 PM
At various points in their careers it was said that John Wooden, Dean Smith and Al McGuire had monkeys on their back.

They seem to have turned out OK.

HOOTER
03-23-2013, 10:03 PM
He has a ceiling.

And I now believe this ceiling is quite apparent. Few is a great mid-major coach. As long as he's around he will be able to lead teams to domination in the WCC and thus into the NCAA tourney. From there, things tend to fall apart. It's tough to argue against this point considering his track record.

gonwick
03-23-2013, 10:05 PM
I wonder what the implications of the continued early exits are? I mean, it is great to get in, so on the one hand it is a tremendous success that we have the chance for so much failure, but until gu busts out, the program is going to, fair or not,become an icon for underachievement. This will be the theme next season in the media and it will be impossible to argue until gu does something about it. Gu better pray wichita state makes a deep run. On the plus side, their next game should be a setup for the elite eight. Maybe we get really lucky and another 1 goes down tomorrow. That would be best case scenario for this miserable tournament showing.

MJ777
03-23-2013, 10:08 PM
I wonder what the implications of the continued early exits are? I mean, it is great to get in, so on the one hand it is a tremendous success that we have the chance for so much failure, but until gu busts out, the program is going to, fair or not,become an icon for underachievement. This will be the theme next season in the media and it will be impossible to argue until gu does something about it. Gu better pray wichita state makes a deep run. On the plus side, their next game should be a setup for the elite eight. Maybe we get really lucky and another 1 goes down tomorrow. That would be best case scenario for this miserable tournament showing.

I think Kansas might lose tomorrow to UNC. If not, I think Michigan takes them out in the SW 16. But it still sucks to lose tonight.

CDC84
03-23-2013, 10:08 PM
A coach who wins 80% of his games is going to make a final four at some point. I just don't see how it can't possibly happen. So this year wasn't the year. Few is still a young man in terms of the coaching profession. He's got plenty of chances ahead of him.

jazzdelmar
03-23-2013, 10:08 PM
And I now believe this ceiling is quite apparent. Few is a great mid-major coach. As long as he's around he will be able to lead teams to domination in the WCC and thus into the NCAA tourney. From there, things tend to fall apart. It's tough to argue against this point considering his track record.

amen, like bobby hurley and morgan wootten are great high school coaches w no taste for a higher job, mark few is a brilliant mid major coach. he's good for 26 wins a year and a classy program. if thats enough for you, you got your man.

DixieZag
03-23-2013, 10:09 PM
Zags 3pt defense this tournament . 24-51

Yes, yes, yes, b/c it HAD to be the Zags poor defense that forced those 3s into the net above our defenders - - b/c I saw Wichita miss far more 3s with NO defense from Pitt, wide open 3s clanking away.

Bocco
03-23-2013, 10:09 PM
Is the ceiling the coach, or is it Gonzaga and the location of Gonzaga?

If I'm 18 and if I'm a four our five star recruit (even if I was from Spokane) Where would I go? On the west coast perhaps Arizona, but most likely somewhere well to the east.

I find it remarkable that Mark Few has been able to attract players to Gonzaga that for fourteen years or so have allowed Gonzaga to keep hitting this ceiling.

No other program at a school the size of Gonzaga has accomplished anything near what GU has done. To get to the E8 and the final four you need either a whole lot of luck or a team with three, four and five star recruits, and I personally don't see a lot of those ever choosing to come to Spokane and GU.

jazzdelmar
03-23-2013, 10:12 PM
ohio state wd have undressed them anyway.

MJ777
03-23-2013, 10:14 PM
ohio state wd have undressed them anyway.

But at least it would have been in the E8.

jazzdelmar
03-23-2013, 10:17 PM
But at least it would have been in the E8.

so? we get to spend more quality time w family and friends and less w the bald basketball gurus. and it wd have hurt more when craft ran circles around our smurf guards....losing tonite was a good thing.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 10:17 PM
Yes, yes, yes, b/c it HAD to be the Zags poor defense that forced those 3s into the net above our defenders - - b/c I saw Wichita miss far more 3s with NO defense from Pitt, wide open 3s clanking away.

Yea you play with fire, you eventually get burned by the fire. Few has poorish 3 point defense strategy. 32% from 3 point land is the average in march madness tournament game.

caduceus
03-23-2013, 10:19 PM
I am assuming you threw me as 1. Never been Anti Few. He has a ceiling.

http://i.imgur.com/YmNtIsc.jpg

Tell me more about this ceiling. What proof do you have? Is his career finished now? If he makes a final four, does that mean he didn't have a ceiling, or that he broke through it? So Dan Monson didn't have a ceiling?

Does it mean anything that most great coaches took over a decade to win a national championship, and many, many great ones never have? Does it mean anything when the average coach that makes the elite eight has nearly 30 NCAA tourney wins beforehand? Does it mean anything that there have been 56 teams to the final four, and only 6 came from a smaller conference, and only 2 to a national championship in nearly 30 years?

You can keep saying that, but it doesn't make it true.

80% of teams don't even make the tournament. 99.7% of the teams in Division 1 won't be champions. 67 teams will lose in the tournament this year (98.5%). You're delusional.

Zagmother
03-23-2013, 10:19 PM
I'd rather have a coach who develops kids with integrity and character than coaches that win a national championship with kids lacking those qualities. That's what makes Gonzaga a special place.

Oregonzagnut
03-23-2013, 10:20 PM
Is the ceiling the coach, or is it Gonzaga and the location of Gonzaga?

If I'm 18 and if I'm a four our five star recruit (even if I was from Spokane) Where would I go? On the west coast perhaps Arizona, but most likely somewhere well to the east.

I find it remarkable that Mark Few has been able to attract players to Gonzaga that for fourteen years or so have allowed Gonzaga to keep hitting this ceiling.

No other program at a school the size of Gonzaga has accomplished anything near what GU has done. To get to the E8 and the final four you need either a whole lot of luck or a team with three, four and five star recruits, and I personally don't see a lot of those ever choosing to come to Spokane and GU.

If it is the location of Gonzaga and our conference, then we would still lose games in the OOC.

No, Few has to change his post season preparation philosophy. This "play not to lose" and conservative philosophy is the problem. Few tried to break out of that by trying to promote "nastiness" and "killer instinct".

Then he just forgot about it this year, reverted to his old conservative self and coached the same way he did in the regular season. Old habits die hard.

thespywhozaggedme
03-23-2013, 10:20 PM
I'd rather have a coach who develops kids with integrity and character than coaches that win a national championship with kids lacking those qualities. That's what makes Gonzaga a special place.

Ideally we'd like to have both. The two thoughts are not mutually exclusive.

gonwick
03-23-2013, 10:21 PM
I agree, CDC, odds suggest that the team should break through at some point based on gu's win percentage. I worry, though, that there is much grade inflation in Few's win percentages as a mid major. Out of conference, we schedule at least three cupcakes and mid to high single digits of good to very good teams. In conference, we have 2 to 4 good games and the others (while often tough and the best shots those teams can offer) are against teams that other conferences would schedule as cupcakes. This will be even worse with pacific, which is better than some of our cellar dwellers but below the standards of most real conferences. (Insert Depaul reference here, naysayers. ) The endless debate that played out this year about how the zags would finish in other conferences seems to have been answered for the time being, and not in a way we would like. And for the immediate future, the committee will look at this year, look at the end result, and say that no, we do not belong in the upper tier no matter how gaudy our record.

DixieZag
03-23-2013, 10:48 PM
I think the team that beat Oklahoma State and nearly beat Butler was one of the top 10 teams in the country and deserved a one or two seed. At that time, there were not 8 other teams that could do what we did.

The problem seems to be that b/c a conference loss is tournament/seed "death" we play one half our year against RPI 75-250 teams in a "play not to lose" mentality.

I doubt that the coaches or players are aware of it happening, it is subconcious. When playing at USD or USF in a hostile atmosphere, the obvious thing to do (from an odds standpoint) is to simplyfy the game, get conservative, b/c we have more talent-depth so it will almost always work out.

But, a team doesn't "get better" doing the simple thing, it gets better doing the "hard" thing and meanwhile a whole attitude of playing "not to lose" sets in and becomes very apparent during the real tournament against teams that had to scrape and claw just to get there.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 10:54 PM
Knight won his 1st title 12 yrs in at age 36. Knight was 44-24 in the tournament.

Coach K won his 1st title 15 yrs in. By his 10th yr he lost in title gm. The next 4yrs produced two final 4s, a sw16, and another 2nd place runner up. He is 80-24 in tournament.

Jim calhoun won his 26th yr. He is 50-19 in tournament. He won 3 titles. He tu

Jim boehiem won his 26th yr. He is 46-27 in tournament . Jm 1st 13 yrs include 4 sw16, elite 8 and 2nd place.

Tom izzo won his 1st title gm 5yrs in. In 1st 13 yrs Izzo had 2 sw16s, 4 final 4s, 1 runner up. 37-14 in march.

Mark Few in his 13 seasons has 4 sw16s. Few 14-13 in ncaa tournament games.

Caud you asked me about ceilings and top coaches. So you called me out. So gave u what u wanted. Few isnt close.

I didnt bring that up, you asked. Go crunch our 3pt defense stats up in march madness tournament. Bet its not the avg of 32%.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 10:58 PM
Great coaches win titles. IDC winning % if never equates to titles, E8, F4s. I dont expect this every yr, that is delusional.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 11:07 PM
If Few does win a title, imo he broke through. Great guy, good coach. He may end up like boehiem. Few just isn't dirty. Love that.

Pargo the Destroyer
03-23-2013, 11:14 PM
Great coaches win titles. IDC winning % if never equates to titles, E8, F4s. I dont expect this every yr, that is delusional.

40% of the coaches you listed are coaches that are or were involved some sort of scandal during their tenure. Boehiem's tenure won't end on his terms, Uconn.... Haha, Calipari is a rat and dirty as hell, Howland? The one that got fired? No thanks. My point is we have something to be proud of as fans. I'm not interested in having the soul of the university sold at the behest of a national championship. So zags11, go change your name to orange11 or husky11 or troll11 for all I care. Clearly this isn't the team you should be rooting for.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 11:18 PM
40% of the coaches you listed are coaches that are or were involved some sort of scandal during their tenure. Boehiem's tenure won't end on his terms, Uconn.... Haha, Calipari is a rat and dirty as hell, Howland? The one that got fired? No thanks. My point is we have something to be proud of as fans. I'm not interested in having the soul of the university sold at the behest of a national championship. So zags11, go change your name to orange11 or husky11 or troll11 for all I care. Clearly this isn't the team you should be rooting for.

Smart 1, Caud asked me for the top coaches who have won. I gave him that. I also said I love few isn't dirty. Read posts through.

TexasZagFan
03-23-2013, 11:20 PM
...and Michigan is in it's first Sweet 16 since 1994.

And the Fab 5 never won the championship.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 11:20 PM
Great coaches and great players win titles. I was asked to look up top coaches and I did. Few is a great guy. Troll cuz i dont just agree with masses.

Demetri Awesome
03-23-2013, 11:21 PM
we played soft tonight. Yes!!! few has a monkey on his back. wichita st. really!? i'm drunk and pissed, my apologizes. yes this program needs to perform. we don't compete with a football program and last I know I still have a tuition payment since my graduation date of 2001. Lets put this money to use!!!

caduceus
03-23-2013, 11:25 PM
Knight won his 1st title 12 yrs in at age 36. Knight was 44-24 in the tournament.

Coach K won his 1st title 15 yrs in. By his 10th yr he lost in title gm. The next 4yrs produced two final 4s, a sw16, and another 2nd place runner up. He is 80-24 in tournament.

Jim calhoun won his 26th yr. He is 50-19 in tournament. He won 3 titles. He tu

Jim boehiem won his 26th yr. He is 46-27 in tournament . Jm 1st 13 yrs include 4 sw16, elite 8 and 2nd place.

Tom izzo won his 1st title gm 5yrs in. In 1st 13 yrs Izzo had 2 sw16s, 4 final 4s, 1 runner up. 37-14 in march.

Mark Few in his 13 seasons has 4 sw16s. Few 14-13 in ncaa tournament games.

Caud you asked me about ceilings and top coaches. So you called me out. So gave u what u wanted. Few isnt close.

I didnt bring that up, you asked. Go crunch our 3pt defense stats up in march madness tournament. Bet its not the avg of 32%.

Seems to support my assertion in spades. Not sure what you're trying to prove, but it certainly doesn't disprove anything I said above, and it says nothing about this supposed 'ceiling' that you claim. You had to pick the absolute cream of the crop from major conferences with enormous recruiting budgets to make your claim? Please. If that's the case, I'd say Few is doing quite well considering the hill he's had to climb to bring this program to a national stage. There's isn't a school anywhere from the 27 non-major conferences that has come even close to doing what Few has done. And doing it with a conference that doesn't prepare you well for the tournament makes it even that much more remarkable.

P.S. Go crunch your own numbers. You seem to know all there is to know about this team. With all that time you spent researching coaches, maybe you could make a positive contribution to this board instead of only showing up after games to criticize. Many fans are heartbroken, and you have no sensitivity whatsoever.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 11:33 PM
Seems to support my assertion in spades. Not sure what you're trying to prove, but it certainly doesn't disprove anything I said above, and it says nothing about this supposed 'ceiling' that you claim. You had to pick the absolute cream of the crop from major conferences with enormous recruiting budgets to make your claim? Please. If that's the case, I'd say Few is doing quite well considering the hill he's had to climb to bring this program to a national stage. There's isn't a school anywhere from the 27 non-major conferences that has come even close to doing what Few has done. And doing it with a conference that doesn't prepare you well for the tournament makes it even that much more remarkable.

FEws ceiling is sw16 so far it seems. You said great coaches didnt win in 1st 15 yrs. You were half right, but other coaches showed signs of a higher ceiling.

During boehiem's title run with Melo, it was brought up that he felt relieved to reach the highest ceiling.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 11:36 PM
All my point is that few cant break through. We have had so many great teams that faded come march. I dont want a new coach as he brings so much more then coaching.

caduceus
03-23-2013, 11:42 PM
FEws ceiling is sw16 so far it seems. You said great coaches didnt win in 1st 15 yrs. You were half right, but other coaches showed signs of a higher ceiling.

During boehiem's title run with Melo, it was brought up that he felt relieved to reach the highest ceiling.

I truly hope you didn't go to GU, because it's clear that you were snoozing through Logic 101 if so. I never said great coaches didn't win in 1st 15 years. Read before posting. Learn about logical fallacies, because you shouldn't debate with only those in your pocket.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 11:55 PM
Does it mean anything that most great coaches took over a decade to win a national championship.

That is what you said. I provided information that the great coaches showed signs of a higher ceiling before a title win. Few has terrible 3pt defense strategy. It shouldn't be a disagreement there at all. Last 5 losses equated to opposition shooting 52%. That is 20% over the tournament average.

Your logic isnt being bought into. You tried to say great coaches dont always win til over a decade. These great coaches showed signs that they would get there.

Logic is Few is a .500 tournament coach with poor 3pt defense strategy. Factual too. That in ways show signs he cant adapt vs higher opponents. 24-44 vs top 25.

Oregonzagnut
03-24-2013, 04:34 PM
But anyone who thinks Mark Few can't or shouldn't improve is wrong. He does not have a ceiling or limit unless he stops learning and growing himself. He expects it, the university expects it, and the fans expect it. I expect it.

It is called learning and growing and that is what Gonzaga is also about. Few is not exempt from being told what his weaknesses are and he needs to work on them. Few MUST learn why we can't get past the 2nd round no matter how talented we are and many NBA potentials we have on the team. Few must learn to elevate. Not go conservative in March. His staff and team mates need to remind him when he is doing it too.

Few has a very dry and stoic personality. These are not traits that push naturally talented athletes to new heights and inspirational game play. Few can learn to redirect his need to be in his comfort zone and step out into the dangerous world of passion, emotion, anger and developing a nasty killer instinct!

Zags11
03-24-2013, 04:39 PM
I want Few to break through. At this time Few hasnt broken through. Alot is becasue of his 3pt defense. He shouyld improve and I hope he does.

Zags11
03-24-2013, 04:53 PM
I post all through the year especially after wins. Stuck up for flukey Butler loss. Stood up for DS when ax fell on him. Caud, I show up alot, read alot more.

I never said(AGAIN, AGAIN, AGAIN I SAY) I want Few Fired. I like him. I like him as a person and Has done tremendous things in this community. You have to call it what it is. At THIS TIME Few has a ceiling of SW16.

Why do you think its being brought up so much on here? on CBS? ESPN? Few has had enough GOOD teams. I believe he will break through but my confidence in March has waned but wont stop me from watching and rooting and wearing and showing there LOGO off.

I feel for Mark Few, Lyold, Ray, Jenniffer, Harris,DS,Kelly,GLE,Bell,Pangos,etc

I watch in my head and wish we had 1 more shot. Id love to see Mark Few not win 1, but 2, 3 or 4 titles. Greatest coach ever in Spokane and Gonzaga History.

When Mark Few breaks through, I will be cheering and happy he broke through. If he doesnt, then that is life. People can speak there mind and disagree with coaches or players. You arent a NON-ZAG fan or TROLLING. We can speak our mind. This season had a bitter, bitter end to it.

Caud alot more people are starting to wonder same thing I spoke(be it through PM's or replies) and analysts. I believe Few will break through when the 3pt defense picks up.

MJ777
03-24-2013, 05:10 PM
I want Few to break through. At this time Few hasnt broken through. Alot is becasue of his 3pt defense. He shouyld improve and I hope he does.

Few is too short to play good 3 pt D. We need a taller coach.

maynard g krebs
03-24-2013, 05:13 PM
St Louis is widely recognized as a great defensive team, and got blown out by an Oregon team that made 8-11 3's yest.

The easy 3 pt shot is part of what makes the tournament a crapshoot. Teams get hot. Statistically GU defended the 3 decently this year.

IMO the reason the Zags lose in the second round is that they play tight. A lot of guys get tentative and afraid to shoot. That's Few's weakness. Monson's team played loose and free, like FGCU is playing now.
Balanced scoring and 5 guys who would take big shots.

Olynyk and Pangos were a combined 14-39 yest. Rest of the team took 20 shots. That says the 2 guys that did shoot were doing so under pressure.

Everybody on Wichita, guys w/ lower %'s that the Zags, fired away with freedom and confidence. And they had half a dozen guys with 6-11 fg attempts. Balance and a bunch of guys with the green light and confidence.
Zags don't have it now.

Zags11
03-24-2013, 05:18 PM
Few is too short to play good 3 pt D. We need a taller coach.

LMAO. 1st legit laugh about Zag hoops since you know when LOL. Thanks :roll:

SunDevilGolfZag
03-24-2013, 05:32 PM
Mark Few has only reached the Sweet 16 4 times in 14 years as Gonzaga head coach, and never made it further. Among active coaches, only Fran Dunphy of Temple has as many tournament appearances without an Elite 8 appearance, and most of his appearances were with an Ivy League team --Penn.

In reality, the only monkey is according to you. He's the head of a great program that does not need criticism

Zags11
03-24-2013, 05:50 PM
In reality, the only monkey is according to you. He's the head of a great program that does not need criticism

This here is the problem. Mark Few the basketball God. I bet at your job if you kept creating the same issues over and over, you would get talked about or too. Its a messageboard.

MJ777
03-24-2013, 05:53 PM
This here is the problem. Mark Few the basketball God. I bet at your job if you kept creating the same issues over and over, you would get talked about or too. Its a messageboard.

Mark Few, please come to HR.

Zags11
03-24-2013, 05:53 PM
Happy retreat?

McZag
03-24-2013, 06:08 PM
Mark Few has only reached the Sweet 16 4 times in 14 years as Gonzaga head coach, and never made it further. Among active coaches, only Fran Dunphy of Temple has as many tournament appearances without an Elite 8 appearance, and most of his appearances were with an Ivy League team --Penn.

And Dan Monson only has 1 Sweet Sixteen in his career as the only other Zag coach to make it that far.

MTZag03
03-24-2013, 08:53 PM
Everybody on Wichita, guys w/ lower %'s that the Zags, fired away with freedom and confidence. And they had half a dozen guys with 6-11 fg attempts. Balance and a bunch of guys with the green light and confidence.
Zags don't have it now.

I agree. I am not a Few hater. I love what MF has done for this program and it would not exist without him. Regarding your point about balance and guys with the green light to shoot, it makes me think about all the shuffling on the bench this year. If a non critical player makes a mistake, they lose playing time. Of course you have to have accountabilty, but I fear that guys have been conditioned to value their playing time over all else and it adversely affects their performance. No 18-21 y/o can play loose and free knowing that they have that hanging over them. Heck, no human can do that.

Per my psych courses this seems like pretty bad policy overall.

Hoopaholic
03-24-2013, 09:00 PM
But were we not succesful with each player playing within themselves and their roles...or are some saying we should simply roll ball out and let the shots fly whenever and however they want? Seems to me the formula has been extremely succesful and this discussion would not be occurring if

Bell hadn't gotten hurt
If we made a free throw or two more during a game
If we had not had 2-3 mental errors
Shot 6% better than we did
A call or two at key times had occurred

First and fifth were not within our control
Items 2,3,4 happens

matty1090
03-24-2013, 09:49 PM
A coach who wins 80% of his games is going to make a final four at some point. I just don't see how it can't possibly happen. So this year wasn't the year. Few is still a young man in terms of the coaching profession. He's got plenty of chances ahead of him.

The fact that he's won 80% of his games doesn't set him up for anything. Lets be honest, few is a good coach in the wcc but this conservative style of coaching won't get us to the elite eight, ever. The team played weak, unprepared, and sloppy the last two games. They absolutely did not look like a number one seed. This was a golden opportunity, and I for one am more than a little pissed off at how soft they played. They should have been the team "playing angry" after the first game, but no it was a ho hum business as usual mediocre performance. I hate to say it, but this was a huge embarrassing step back for the program. I'm not a troll for saying that, and I wish that some of the people on this board would be able to accept objective criticism of this team without being flagged or banned. I think then it wouldn't come as such as a surprise when we exit early from the tourney due to glaring weaknesses that the blind super fan failed to accept.

MJ777
03-24-2013, 09:54 PM
The fact that he's won 80% of his games doesn't set him up for anything. Lets be honest, few is a good coach in the wcc but this conservative style of coaching won't get us to the elite eight, ever. The team played weak, unprepared, and sloppy the last two games. They absolutely did not look like a number one seed. This was a golden opportunity, and I for one am more than a little pissed off at how soft they played. They should have been the team "playing angry" after the first game, but no it was a ho hum business as usual mediocre performance. I hate to say it, but this was a huge embarrassing step back for the program. I'm not a troll for saying that, and I wish that some of the people on this board would be able to accept objective criticism of this team without being flagged or banned. I think then it wouldn't come as such as a surprise when we exit early from the tourney due to glaring weaknesses that the blind super fan failed to accept.

Accepted. Coach and his assistants need to learn and evolve from this latest performance in the Big Dance.

MJ777
03-24-2013, 10:02 PM
But were we not succesful with each player playing within themselves and their roles...or are some saying we should simply roll ball out and let the shots fly whenever and however they want? Seems to me the formula has been extremely succesful and this discussion would not be occurring if

Bell hadn't gotten hurt
If we made a free throw or two more during a game
If we had not had 2-3 mental errors
Shot 6% better than we did
A call or two at key times had occurred

First and fifth were not within our control
Items 2,3,4 happens

If WSU makes 2 fewer 3s Zags probably win even with the injury, missed FTs, brain farts, swallowed whistles, poor shooting. But, they were on fire and stepped on the Zags toes at the dance. I bet they revert to their mediocre shooting in the next game. :explode:

jim77
03-24-2013, 11:50 PM
If you want to see a team NOT play tight.....or play not play "NOT TO LOSE"....watch Florida GC. They toyed with SDSU for the last 6 or 7 minutes.... if the Florida gators try their "up tempo" against GC....they are gonna get blown out. If you haven't seen them play...watch them. I was absolutely shocked watching them play....they have the best transition game in the country. They look like an NBA team....no joke. Them beating MIAMI was NO JOKE. When their on their game they are the best team in the country...period.

Oregonzagnut
03-25-2013, 12:37 AM
If you want to see a team NOT play tight.....or play not play "NOT TO LOSE"....watch Florida GC. They toyed with SDSU for the last 6 or 7 minutes.... if the Florida gators try their "up tempo" against GC....they are gonna get blown out. If you haven't seen them play...watch them. I was absolutely shocked watching them play....they have the best transition game in the country. They look like an NBA team....no joke. Them beating MIAMI was NO JOKE. When their on their game they are the best team in the country...period.

FGC has nothing to lose and everything to gain. Carpe Diem in its true meaning! You can see the freedom and fun in sports when you see teams play all out and play to their strengths, not to avoid their weaknesses. That loose mentality and freedom from fear of losing is something we did not have for our last 2 games. That is why when you are on top there is no where to go but down. Some people can't understand what it means to play "not to lose". When Gonzaga plays to try to preserve leads rather than just continue to play your game we get in trouble.

MDABE80
03-25-2013, 12:37 AM
Pretty fun group Kim. Lots of fun they're having out there. Fun to watch.
Back to Few though. A guy who wins 80% of his games, doesn't get nuked or investigated by NCAA, a guy who graduates his kids, a good father and no nonsense is a guy who has no reason to have that proverbial monkey hangin around.
If a man is motivated only by a FF will get into some trouble on this campus anyway.
Sure he'lkl get this team to a FF and maybe a championship. It's just ime.
He flubs once in a while.we all do. On the big stage he flubbed yesterday, Many have...over all though, he's managed to chose kids and other coaches who represent his BOSSES ( the University) very well.

I'd rather have him than someone who gets FF's and has the NCAA doing a colonoscopy on him and the university annually. Personally he seems to be doing well enough....could do better...but so could most coaches in the US.