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Zags11
03-23-2013, 07:20 PM
Critics were totally correct on us. Biggest joke is a different coach with this squad is F4 bound. Fire away, but its true. 14 plus 3s vs a crappy 3pt team. Its old.

Few has a ceiling. This was his best squad and his defensive strategy allowed them to claw back and finally over take us.

#1 ranking was cute but now just a pitiful sad joke. 2nd rd exit with this squad is a joke. Bell was non aggressive again. Stockton was fine.

Few is a great guy and good coach with a ceiling.

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 07:27 PM
Unfortunately agree. We are a perennial round of 32 team. Great for us, but something has to change if we ever want to play with the big boys.

katman50
03-23-2013, 07:30 PM
Critics were totally correct on us. Biggest joke is a different coach with this squad is F4 bound. Fire away, but its true. 14 plus 3s vs a crappy 3pt team. Its old.

Few has a ceiling. This was his best squad and his defensive strategy allowed them to claw back and finally over take us.

#1 ranking was cute but now just a pitiful sad joke. 2nd rd exit with this squad is a joke. Bell was non aggressive again. Stockton was fine.

Few is a great guy and good coach with a ceiling.

Couldn't agree more, even if I am a sore loser. We had all the talent, we had a favorable bracket, etc. Disappointing.

Virginia Zags Fan
03-23-2013, 07:30 PM
Few built this team. One day Few will leave and Gonzaga will be like Santa Clara or LMU.

g-ride
03-23-2013, 07:32 PM
Agreed

TM27
03-23-2013, 07:32 PM
Few built this team. One day Few will leave and Gonzaga will be like Santa Clara or LMU.

I appreciate Few. I disagree with you.

krozman
03-23-2013, 07:32 PM
Few built this team. One day Few will leave and Gonzaga will be like Santa Clara or LMU.

If few left it's possible. Be careful what you wish for. EVEN if you are correct and Mark Few has an incredibly difficult time coaching 3 point defense, we're never getting anyone better. In every other respect, he's the best we will ever have. Way off base to suggest getting rid of Few is an improvmenet.

TexasZag
03-23-2013, 07:34 PM
Who was the last 5-star recruit to come to Gonzaga?

ZaginLaw
03-23-2013, 07:35 PM
who was the last 5 star recruit to go to Wichita State or Florida GC?

Zags11
03-23-2013, 07:36 PM
I dont like saying this either. Few is a great guy. YOU may be right virginia but im strictly talking with this talent. No way should we be done. I like Few. Just maybe alright to admit to certain things.

Plus people said that bout monson too.

Upward
03-23-2013, 07:36 PM
Who was the last 5-star recruit to come to Gonzaga?

Daye?

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 07:37 PM
Critics were totally correct on us. Biggest joke is a different coach with this squad is F4 bound. Fire away, but its true. 14 plus 3s vs a crappy 3pt team. Its old.

Few has a ceiling. This was his best squad and his defensive strategy allowed them to claw back and finally over take us.

#1 ranking was cute but now just a pitiful sad joke. 2nd rd exit with this squad is a joke. Bell was non aggressive again. Stockton was fine.

Few is a great guy and good coach with a ceiling.

By all means... start up FireMarkFew.com

Pathetic. Absolutely pathetic.

Was it Few or Kelly and Harris who missed multiple bunnies?

Was it Few or was it the players who missed free throw after free throw?

krozman
03-23-2013, 07:37 PM
I think Micah Downs was a transfer but originally a McDonald's All american. Not sure about stars

GorgeZag
03-23-2013, 07:42 PM
It's tough to swallow because we will NEVER have a easier path to the elite eight. Probably never be a 1 seed with all the backlash there was and now the choke job the comitee won't give us the respect.

mihalevich
03-23-2013, 07:42 PM
Few built this team. One day Few will leave and Gonzaga will be like Santa Clara or LMU.

Amen...Im laughing at people criticizing Few......Like there is some special stratregy out there to defends 3's....Most of them were contested...Go watch any game and see the looks from 3 point land other teams get...you will notice there the same type of looks..difference is WSU shot lights out...give them credit...If anything we lacked quick guards to defend 3, especially with Bell out,
nothing to do with strategy..

Zags11
03-23-2013, 07:42 PM
By all means... start up FireMarkFew.com

Pathetic. Absolutely pathetic.

Was it Few or Kelly and Harris who missed multiple bunnies?

Was it Few or was it the players who missed free throw after free throw?

Did i say that? or is defensive talk here? He didnt tell thm to play tight on 3 point line. 14 3s, and 6 in row. THIS cost the game.

Never said Fire Few. Has a ceiling.

allnet59
03-23-2013, 07:45 PM
Fickle fans. Holy s##t This is Gonzaga not Duke, not Indiana, we don't get the five star players we get kids that come here and play their hearts out. We play in the WCC not the big ten or big East. I loved the fact they we got to be number one in the country even though I knew it was more because of the fact that everyone else was knocking each other off the top. Be glad were not watching year in and year out without ever having our Zags in the tournament. Playing in the WCC against maybe one or two top fifty teams year in and year out doesn't help. We can blame the coach or single out a player. Where does that get us. Tis has been a great ride and I will look forward to next season. Thank you seniors and coaches.

UberZagFan
03-23-2013, 07:45 PM
Few built this team. One day Few will leave and Gonzaga will be like Santa Clara or LMU.

Disagree completely. This team and brand has the ability to transition. Few is round of 32 bound and that is all. Many many coaches could have got this team to the sweet 16 at the very least.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 07:45 PM
Amen...Im laughing at people criticizing Few......Like there is some special stratregy out there to defends 3's....Most of them were contested...Go watch any game and see the looks from 3 point land other teams get...you will notice there the same type of looks..difference is WSU shot lights out...give them credit...If anything we lacked quick guards to defend 3, especially with Bell out,
nothing to do with strategy..

You press the arc and you dont sag down in post. Running at a guy late when he is shooting already, really isn't "contested".

You tell them dont sag. Dont double down.

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 07:46 PM
Did i say that? or is defensive talk here? He didnt tell thm to play tight on 3 point line. 14 3s, and 6 in row. THIS cost the game.

Never said Fire Few. Has a ceiling.

For all practical purposes... you did.

NYCZAG
03-23-2013, 07:46 PM
These are 18 year old kids! You can say its Few but he didn't stop Harris from scoring or some of those atrocious non calls? He wasn't guarding the kid who tossed the ball underhand and it went in? It's a game. They lost and its another day tomorrow. I know it sucks! Believe me you! I did my grad work at Gonzaga and played on two national championship teams at Williams undergrad! The difference is as I've gotten older I wasn't mad at them I was heartbroken for them. Now I'm going to roll over and hug my four year old who had his tonsils out and start a new day tomorrow.

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 07:47 PM
Agree with Zags11. Obviously a lot of people cope with losing by inflating how good our team is and denying any criticism. That's not how true fans do it.

CdAZagFan
03-23-2013, 07:47 PM
I disagree also... It wasn't Few that goofed up the inbound play, or overthrew the lob to Olynk, or didn't call the body bump on Olynk (or the traveling that occurred shortly thereafter). I would hate to find out where this program goes if Few leaves...

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 07:47 PM
For all practical purposes... you did.

You sure have a way with interpreting people's words to fit your agenda.

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 07:50 PM
You sure have a way with interpreting people's words to fit your agenda.


Critics were totally correct on us. Biggest joke is a different coach with this squad is F4 bound.

So what exactly is your interpretation on that? If he is so unhappy with the coaching he should be demanding change.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 07:53 PM
For all practical purposes... you did.

Totally. By saying Few is a great guy and good coach with a ceiling.
It is ok to talk rational hoops. They got some bounces but as a coach knowing 3 point shots are there only hope......

Made 6 3s in row. Guard the 3.

maynard g krebs
03-23-2013, 07:53 PM
Few is a great coach in terms of implementing a system and identifying players that fit the system. What he has done at GU is truly amazing. There are a handful of midmajor programs that have even come close.

Fifteen straight years in the tourney is amazing, and chances are that GU would not be as good if Few left. Those who ask for another coach, be careful what you wish for.

But he's certainly not beyond criticism. He comes across as a stiff, uptight personality (those that know him personally, feel free to correct me if that's not true, but he sure looks that way on tv) and his teams play tight in the tourney on what seems to be a consistent basis. I was hoping this group was different, but imo they played tight in both games.

We all have strengths and weaknesses, though, and on balance Few is one of the best in the game. Keep on knocking and one day the door will break down.

And I think the Zags win if Bell doesn't go down. He and KP are the team's biggest gamers.

Saxon_zag
03-23-2013, 07:53 PM
Few built this team. One day Few will leave and Gonzaga will be like Santa Clara or LMU.

ahahahahahahahahaha:vomit-smiley-007:

zagapotomus
03-23-2013, 07:53 PM
Just a question, did our team let us down or did the media create unrealistic expectations?

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 07:55 PM
Just a question, did our team let us down or did the media create unrealistic expectations?

The later of the two.

CaliforniaZaggin'
03-23-2013, 07:56 PM
Agree with Zags11. Obviously a lot of people cope with losing by inflating how good our team is and denying any criticism. That's not how true fans do it.

There is a difference between well reasoned criticism and starting a dumpster fire.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 07:56 PM
So what exactly is your interpretation on that? If he is so unhappy with the coaching he should be demanding change.

Its called making a statement. Not calling for a head. Id never want a calipari. He is dirty. Your good at assumptions.

Saxon_zag
03-23-2013, 07:57 PM
Just a question, did our team let us down or did the media create unrealistic expectations?

The media expected us to be a pushover 1 seed that would be the first top seed out and we proved them right. The players didn't let us down they gave it their all. Playing tiny guards and getting 3's drained over them is why we lost

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 07:58 PM
Its called making a statement. Not calling for a head. Id never want a calipari. He is dirty. Your good at assumptions.

So what was the point of the post? Obviously you are not happy with the level of coaching. Do something about it or quit bellyaching.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 07:58 PM
There is a difference between well reasoned criticism and starting a dumpster fire.

By talking hoops? I never once said fire Few. I JUst said he has a ceiling.

People said that bout monson too.

Oregonzagnut
03-23-2013, 08:00 PM
Few has not hit his ceiling. Few needs to learn how to build intensity and passion for the tournament. We were too careful, conservative and worried about losing. We didn't play our game and if Wichita doesn't hit 14 threes, we win.

This is sad, but Few will learn if he is honest with himself about his post season philosophy. (Or lack of it.)

The post season is no time to go conservative. Yet that is what he does and our team responds in kind.

CaliforniaZaggin'
03-23-2013, 08:03 PM
By talking hoops? I never once said fire Few. I JUst said he has a ceiling.

People said that bout monson too.

I was referring to more than just this thread. For example. ..

www.guboards.spokesmanreview.com/showpost.php?p=899612&postcount=3

Zags11
03-23-2013, 08:03 PM
So what was the point of the post? Obviously you are not happy with the level of coaching. Do something about it or quit bellyaching.

Cant talk hoops on a hoops board. Time to grow up. Few has a ceiling and thats fine but tired of excuses.

I do believe other coaches could do more. Plus this thread was about people getting defensive. You validated my point though.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 08:06 PM
I was referring to more than just this thread. For example. ..

www.guboards.spokesmanreview.com/showpost.php?p=899612&postcount=3

Yea so what? We made #1 and almost lost to a 16 and allowed 14 3s to end our season. Cant take away from what we did

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 08:06 PM
Cant talk hoops on a hoops board. Time to grow up. Few has a ceiling and thats fine but tired of excuses.

I do believe other coaches could do more. Plus this thread was about people getting defensive. You validated my point though.

So ask for a better coach... if you are tired of excuses... act on it. Not being defensive. If you are that unhappy... act on it. Pretty simple. Demand change.

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 08:06 PM
The players we recruit win 31 of 33 games against standard teams. The players we recruit just can't outlast that team that plays their best game of the year. Championship teams do.

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 08:08 PM
The players we recruit win 31 of 33 games against standard teams. The players we recruit just can't outlast that team that plays their best game of the year. Championship teams do.

You mean like Georgetown?

WallaWallaZag
03-23-2013, 08:11 PM
And I think the Zags win if Bell doesn't go down. He and KP are the team's biggest gamers.

i'm a big fan of gb2 but he didn't do a thing in the 21 minutes that he did play...maybe our perimeter defense would have been a little better, but bell wasn't contributing much when he played pretty much the whole first half.

UberZagFan
03-23-2013, 08:13 PM
The later of the two.


By talking hoops? I never once said fire Few. I JUst said he has a ceiling.

People said that bout monson too.

At some point the discussion needs to.be had. This team showed up completely unprepared as compared to the opponents. This team came inches from losing to a 16. A team that is comparable to below bottom WCC. That is unacceptable. And then to show up like that for a second place MVC team on a neutral court? Quite frankly, inexcusable. Maybe if you had a history, but this is now par for the course.i

gonwick
03-23-2013, 08:16 PM
I don't think it unreasonable, after Davidson, byu, Syracuse, wsu, to say hey, maybe there is a problem here. To write it off year after year as "crazy things happen" is crazy . Crticizing few's ability to coach 3 pt defense doesn't equate to "fire few". It means that he needs help to fix it, either a new scheme, a new assistant coach, or a new recruiting strategy. Or to make better use of the personnel he has. If height helps, play taller players. To pretend there isn't a problem at this point is unreasonable.

If everyone is just grateful that few is here, and no one says hey, maybe there are things we can do better, this team has reached its apex this season. And I don't feel too high right now.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 08:17 PM
You mean like Georgetown?

Yea they have choked since 06. They aren't my team. Gonzaga is, has and will be. LIZ, by you repeating demand change and being sarcastic. You proved my thread and critics right.

We have had talented teams. As a 3 seed or better we are 4-3. So its obvious we aren't as good in march.

Once and Future Zag
03-23-2013, 08:19 PM
Critics were totally correct on us. Biggest joke is a different coach with this squad is F4 bound. Fire away, but its true. 14 plus 3s vs a crappy 3pt team. Its old.

Few has a ceiling. This was his best squad and his defensive strategy allowed them to claw back and finally over take us.

#1 ranking was cute but now just a pitiful sad joke. 2nd rd exit with this squad is a joke. Bell was non aggressive again. Stockton was fine.

Few is a great guy and good coach with a ceiling.

Can't wait even two hours to pour vinegar and salt on our wounds can you?

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 08:19 PM
Yea they have choked since 06. They aren't my team. Gonzaga is, has and will be. LIZ, by you repeating demand change and being sarcastic. You proved my thread and critics right.

We have had talented teams. As a 3 seed or better we are 4-3. So its obvious we aren't as good in march.

Again... you want it to change... do something about it.

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 08:20 PM
At some point the discussion needs to.be had. This team showed up completely unprepared as compared to the opponents. This team came inches from losing to a 16. A team that is comparable to below bottom WCC. That is unacceptable. And then to show up like that for a second place MVC team on a neutral court? Quite frankly, inexcusable. Maybe if you had a history, but this is now par for the course.i
To find what's really true, all you have to do is look at what objective people are saying. And I'll save you the time, no one is saying "but it's ok, we had a great season". So there you go. Whatever helps the underachiever apologists sleep.

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 08:21 PM
To find what's really true, all you have to do is look at what objective people are saying. And I'll save you the time, no one is saying "but it's ok, we had a great season". So there you go. Whatever helps the underachiever apologists sleep.

Call for change!!! Demand it!!!

Zags11
03-23-2013, 08:21 PM
Can't wait even two hours to pour vinegar and salt on our wounds can you?

It can be addressed. People can talk. This isnt russia. I am super bummed out for few,players, the community. It just is a reality now come march.

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 08:22 PM
It can be addressed. People can talk. This isnt russia. I am super bummed out for few,players, the community. It just is a reality now come march.

Get working then.

DixieZag
03-23-2013, 08:22 PM
Few is a great coach in terms of implementing a system and identifying players that fit the system. What he has done at GU is truly amazing. There are a handful of midmajor programs that have even come close.

Fifteen straight years in the tourney is amazing, and chances are that GU would not be as good if Few left. Those who ask for another coach, be careful what you wish for.

But he's certainly not beyond criticism. He comes across as a stiff, uptight personality (those that know him personally, feel free to correct me if that's not true, but he sure looks that way on tv) and his teams play tight in the tourney on what seems to be a consistent basis. I was hoping this group was different, but imo they played tight in both games.

We all have strengths and weaknesses, though, and on balance Few is one of the best in the game. Keep on knocking and one day the door will break down.

And I think the Zags win if Bell doesn't go down. He and KP are the team's biggest gamers.

Best post of the night.

Some of the things that make the Zags so unique are the very same reasons why the tournament has been such a tough nut to crack for this team. The Zags are a close knit "family bunch" that is the pride of the NW - - that makes them very very dangerous early in the year b/c they have been with each other since the last year and take the early season VERY seriously b/c that is when we pick up our "marque" wins and November is "prime" basketball month in Spokane b/c that is the only time of year when the Illinois - Notre Dame - Baylor and Michigan State's come calling.

But, we get lulled into playing "not to lose" too much in the conference, were we don't have to extend ourselves or get considerably better, where a "win" is nothing more than avoiding tragedy and where with each passing week, the pressure grows on the team to "break through" in the tournament. This team doesn't get to try to kill itself for glory in February, no offense to SMC - it just doesn't.

Then we enter the tournament with LOTS of fear, we could see it against Southern, the fear left when we got behind againt Wichita and simply had to play and then we made our run. We tore past Wichita when we were simply "balling."

Then, Gary gets hurt, a call goes against Kelly, Wichita heats up from outside - - suddenly we are playing tight again, coach is taking the air out of the ball every trip up. . . who knows?

I DO know this. A LOT of things had to go perfect for Wichita to win that game. . . they shot 58% from 3 and most of those near the end were over guys' hands or at the end of the clock and they hit all net. The refs swallowed the whistle, David had a mental hiccup at the WORST possible time. . . .

But, given who we are, our budget and most of all, our conference and schedule, we are going to have the same problems every single year where the team learns to deal with the highest talent levels early in the year and the pressure increses against poorer and poorer competition.

For the first time ever, I am thinking that perhaps the school DOES need to consider other options conference wise, or this pressure cooker scenario will simply repeat itself every single year.

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 08:23 PM
Call for change!!! Demand it!!!

I would, but you would delete it right away.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 08:23 PM
Call for change!!! Demand it!!!

Childish. Night night time for you LIZ, my emotional 5 yr old. See? That is sarcastic like you been. Back 2 rational hoop talk.

montanazag88
03-23-2013, 08:24 PM
For all practical purposes... you did.

He in no way said that. Now. Put your assumed basketball head on and address zag11's most accurate and truthful analysis. Sheesh, talk about passive aggressive.

Zag11. Just know everyone in zagland agrees with you and knows this is the place you will be admonished for having a basketball IQ combined with an ability to communicate the truth.

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 08:24 PM
Childish. Night night time for you LIZ, my emotional 5 yr old. See? That is sarcastic like you been. Back 2 rational hoop talk.

When have you been rational tonight? The fact is this... you are #####ing about something... incessantly... by your first post you have said the one thing you are #####ing about is NOT fixable in its current state. Demand change if it bothers you so much. Not being sarcastic, not being defensive.

What you are saying is NOT talking hoops... it is complaining.

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 08:26 PM
He in no way said that. Now. Put your assumed basketball head on and address zag11's most accurate and truthful analysis. Sheesh, talk about passive aggressive.

Zag11. Just know everyone in zagland agrees with you and knows this is the place you will be admonished for having a basketball IQ combined with an ability to communicate the truth.

Post of the year.

CaliforniaZaggin'
03-23-2013, 08:26 PM
The tourney is a crap shoot. It's win-or-go-home format makes it exciting, but it frequently allows inferior teams to move on while the better team goes home. That was the case tonight. I don't blame Few.

MDABE80
03-23-2013, 08:27 PM
reposted......... something to keep in mind;)

AP No. 1 Teams To Lose in Round of 32
Since 1994
Year Team Opponent
2013 Gonzaga Wichita State
2010 Kansas Northern Iowa
2004 Stanford Alabama
1994 North Carolina Boston College


It happens 40% of the time. or 33% in the past 9 years.

It's not exactly unheard of.
Honestly I don't know what the onlookers expect. Nobody's going to commit suicide of this. We had one helluva year. First time to No 1.....seeding was high. SO?
We lost to a team tonight. We only had a 32-2 record which is good enough for a no 1 ranking and a No 1 seed.
We did well. Sad to see us lose tonight but we'll be back next year. Hopefully Kelly stay...but if he doesn't we'll find another way to 25-30 wins.

Congrats to the kids and especially the Seniors. Job well done.

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 08:28 PM
The tourney is a crap shoot. It's win-or-go-home format makes it exciting, but it frequently allows inferior teams to move on while the better team goes home. That was the case tonight. I don't blame Few.

Good thing nights like tonight are anomalies when it comes to our team in the tournament.

LongIslandZagFan
03-23-2013, 08:28 PM
Post of the year.

Again... if he is so right... he should demand change. Otherwise what is the point?

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 08:29 PM
reposted......... something to keep in mind;)

AP No. 1 Teams To Lose in Round of 32
Since 1994
Year Team Opponent
2013 Gonzaga Wichita State
2010 Kansas Northern Iowa
2004 Stanford Alabama
1994 North Carolina Boston College


It happens 40% of the time. or 33% in the past 9 years.

It's not exactly unheard of.
Honestly I don't know what the onlookers expect. Nobody's going to commit suicide of this. We had one helluva year. First time to No 1.....seeding was high. SO?
We lost to a team tonight. We only had a 32-2 record which is good enough for a no 1 ranking and a No 1 seed.
We did well. Sad to see us lose tonight but we'll be back next year. Hopefully Kelly stay...but if he doesn't we'll find another way to 25-30 wins.

Congrats to the kids and especially the Seniors. Job well done.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but that would be 4/19 since 1994. Definitely not 40%

Saxon_zag
03-23-2013, 08:32 PM
The tourney is a crap shoot. It's win-or-go-home format makes it exciting, but it frequently allows inferior teams to move on while the better team goes home. That was the case tonight. I don't blame Few.

And this is what we get to say every year that we lose to make us feel better./

Almost but not quite as pathetic as kevin dunleavys "Georgetown was beaten down by their tough conference" excuse

CaliforniaZaggin'
03-23-2013, 08:32 PM
Good thing nights like tonight are anomalies when it comes to our team in the tournament.

After tonight, the Zags are 5-1 against lower seeded teams over the last five years. Yes, it's unusual. But feel free to keep focusing on the negative.

montanazag88
03-23-2013, 08:34 PM
By all means... start up FireMarkFew.com

Pathetic. Absolutely pathetic.

Was it Few or Kelly and Harris who missed multiple bunnies?

Was it Few or was it the players who missed free throw after free throw?

Are you saying we should fire up the "bench.olynyk.com" website?

gonwick
03-23-2013, 08:34 PM
Abe, my math isn't what it used to be, but 4 teams in 20 years (so, 80 number ones total) means 5% lose like gu. So, pretty rare.

CaliforniaZaggin'
03-23-2013, 08:36 PM
And this is what we get to say every year that we lose to make us feel better./

Almost but not quite as pathetic as kevin dunleavys "Georgetown was beaten down by their tough conference" excuse

Wrong. This is the first time we've lost as the higher seed in five years.

Mantua
03-23-2013, 08:39 PM
The tourney is a crap shoot. It's win-or-go-home format makes it exciting, but it frequently allows inferior teams to move on while the better team goes home. That was the case tonight. I don't blame Few.

There is more truth in this!

Keep in mind that Gonzaga has built an incredible program in a very charming, but not terribly competitive conference. It's a small school that is geographically handicapped. The bucks are in the BCS schools. The question is about whether the program is permanently limited or are there options for improving the program going forward. Mark Few is not going anywhere. His creativity and vision and the creativity and vision of the whole community has brought us this far. Take a break. Recover. Then, ponder what constructive steps will take us forward.

GhostZag
03-23-2013, 08:42 PM
Can't wait even two hours to pour vinegar and salt on our wounds can you?

+1

Typical rant and disrespect from Zags11. Don't you just love the "disrespect comment" in his opening thread sentence and the closer on how he likes Few but... And you call yourself a fan.

HOOTER
03-23-2013, 08:44 PM
Didn't read the other post because I don't give a sh#t. Get used to this. This is our Zags.

TexasZag
03-23-2013, 08:45 PM
who was the last 5 star recruit to go to Wichita State or Florida GC?

Let's see how far they get and what kind of legacies they build for themselves over the next 15 or so years.

That fact that we've been this prominent for so long, even if we do fall short, is amazing, especially considering that we do not get the marquee recruits. To expect deep runs in March is like expecting World Series titles from the Mariners, when they cannot attract the talent necessary to make that happen.

Zag@LMU
03-23-2013, 08:47 PM
+1

Typical rant and disrespect from Zags11. Don't you just love the "disrespect comment" in his opening thread sentence and the closer on how he likes Few but... And you call yourself a fan.

Yes, believe it or not, all fans are not blind to reality.

zagray
03-23-2013, 08:58 PM
This team underachieved, i hate to admit the critics were right. I love Few but he does not seem to prepare the team with the right mind set for the tourney. We were the hunted, reactive with no killer instinct to sieze the moment. A team takes on the character of the coach and Few tightens up in the tourney. When was the last time the Zags played over their heads in the tourney and over achieved? I see a pattern and it is not pretty and it does not look like it will change anytime soon. We have something to do with teams playing their best games of the year! The days of being satisfied with just being in the tourney are over, this program is beyond that, we are past due with bigger expectations. Expect the choke and underachieve label to be used loosely until this program proves otherwise.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 09:12 PM
+1

Typical rant and disrespect from Zags11. Don't you just love the "disrespect comment" in his opening thread sentence and the closer on how he likes Few but... And you call yourself a fan.

More so a fan then u. I never said few is crap, etc. I said he has a ceiling. Typical from me? Go look how much i bash few or call for his head......I will wait...............

ZagLawGrad
03-23-2013, 09:14 PM
It's disappointing. But let's remind ourselves it's just basketball.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 09:14 PM
He in no way said that. Now. Put your assumed basketball head on and address zag11's most accurate and truthful analysis. Sheesh, talk about passive aggressive.

Zag11. Just know everyone in zagland agrees with you and knows this is the place you will be admonished for having a basketball IQ combined with an ability to communicate the truth.

Thank u

Club Prez
03-23-2013, 09:21 PM
Zag11. Just know everyone in zagland agrees with you and knows this is the place you will be admonished for having a basketball IQ combined with an ability to communicate the truth.

Please don't speak for me. I have been following Gonzaga basketball for over 35 years and I disagree with 87% of Zag11's posts, especially all of those in this thread.

Thank you.

GorgeZag
03-23-2013, 09:23 PM
The "oh well" attitude from some people on here is troubling to say the least.
"Oh well, Few is a great coach and can do no wrong. Oh well, there's always next year. Oh well, we're a small school in a small time conference and there's nothing we can do about it. Oh well, Spokane is/was a great city for me, but just isn't appealing to top basketball talent. Oh well, somebody has to lose."

Zags11
03-23-2013, 09:29 PM
Please don't speak for me. I have been following Gonzaga basketball for over 35 years and I disagree with 87% of Zag11's posts, especially all of those in this thread.

Thank you.

So which 13% do u? Few doesn't have a ceiling in march? I don't blame tournament losses on him alot. If you think i do, go ahead.

We have had enough talent to make another elite 8 run. Why haven't we? Its called a ceiling. When im wrong i admit it.

Stockton made me change my opinion on him. I was wrong. I pray few does too.

maynard g krebs
03-23-2013, 09:30 PM
i'm a big fan of gb2 but he didn't do a thing in the 21 minutes that he did play...maybe our perimeter defense would have been a little better, but bell wasn't contributing much when he played pretty much the whole first half.

Marshall is a smart coach. He knows GB has shot over 50% on the road from 3 since Jan 31 (including thurs. game when he hit a couple key 3's and was 3-6), so his man never left him. Gary's role on this team in the half court is mostly to shoot open 3's, only driving when there's an open lane. He's not going to try to create on his own, but the fact he's on the floor and has to be guarded opens things up for others, the inside guys especially. W/ him out there's only one shooter on the floor and that doesn't cut it.

The other thing, of course, is the 6 straight 3's late. If he's in, more ball pressure and harder to find shooters. Still think Zags win w/ Gary, even if he doesn't score. Opinions vary; that's just mine.

HOOTER
03-23-2013, 09:32 PM
The "oh well" attitude from some people on here is troubling to say the least.


This was going on here well before I became a member, and it will continue long after I'm gone. The Zags are the perennial underachievers and will be known as such for many years. This is their reputation. Deny it if you will... it doesn't change the fact. They can win big games... but only in November and December. Not when it counts. Few is a great coach in the WCC. But he couldn't get any team, no matter the talent or opposition, deep in the tourney if his life depended on it. Clearly his job doesn't.

ehk 21
03-23-2013, 09:33 PM
I'm a Portland Pilot alum who lives in Spokane who roots for the Zags when they aren't playing UP. We'll be happy to take Mark Few off your hands if you don't want him anymore.

In all seriousness, I do understand your frustration, but I think what it all boils down to is that college basketball is one of the most competitive endeavors on the planet. There just isn't much margin for error and even well-prepared teams must be pretty much perfect to get to the Elite Eight or Final Four. Look at UP... we have a pretty good coach who works like a dog and he has a devil of a time getting the Pilots out of the cellar in the WCC. That's how competitive it is.

And I'm not sure changing conferences is the big issue. Look at Providence, Seton Hall, Rutgers, and DePaul. They're Big East teams with more advantages than Gonzaga and they haven't been able to accomplish anything since Gonzaga began its run.

This may sound crazy, but I think the biggest problem, if this makes any sense at all, is that people love the Zags too much. Every day it seems like there's a giant full color spread on the front of the Spokesman, KREM/KXLY/KHQ devote ten minutes of each news cast to the Zags's, there's the Mark Few show on tv and the radio. SWX devotes half its broadcasting day to the Zags, etc. etc. etc. Back when I was young you didn't get that sort of attention until AFTER you won your national title. When you are treated like the most important thing in the whole Inland Northwest, it makes you tight when you run up against adversity, it takes away all the magic Kharma you had when you were the underdogs and your face wasn't plastered everywhere, and it takes away from the time you have to prepare to win when you have to talk to every media outlet from here to Toronto, and it probably takes away a bit of everyone's hunger.

My gut feeling is that the Zags will make another Elite Eight run when they aren't ranked, no one's paying quite as close as attention, when the Zags have built up some new underdog Kharma, and when the Spokesman has decided to stop putting full color "Go Zags" inserts into each and every newspaper it sells.

Vanzagger
03-23-2013, 09:34 PM
This team underachieved, i hate to admit the critics were right. I love Few but he does not seem to prepare the team with the right mind set for the tourney. We were the hunted, reactive with no killer instinct to sieze the moment. A team takes on the character of the coach and Few tightens up in the tourney. When was the last time the Zags played over their heads in the tourney and over achieved? I see a pattern and it is not pretty and it does not look like it will change anytime soon. We have something to do with teams playing their best games of the year! The days of being satisfied with just being in the tourney are over, this program is beyond that, we are past due with bigger expectations. Expect the choke and underachieve label to be used loosely until this program proves otherwise.

But true.

We did finally take care of business in the regular season. Next year....THE DANCE!

Vanzagger
03-23-2013, 09:37 PM
The "oh well" attitude from some people on here is troubling to say the least.
"Oh well, Few is a great coach and can do no wrong. Oh well, there's always next year. Oh well, we're a small school in a small time conference and there's nothing we can do about it. Oh well, Spokane is/was a great city for me, but just isn't appealing to top basketball talent. Oh well, somebody has to lose."

True. We need to hear it.

MJ777
03-23-2013, 09:40 PM
It's disappointing. But let's remind ourselves it's just basketball.

Michigan is in it's first Sweet 16 since 1994 and UCLA is probably firing it's coach after a first round exit and other issues. GU and Few can do better, but c'mon people it is just basketball.

thespywhozaggedme
03-23-2013, 09:44 PM
Few built this team. One day Few will leave and Gonzaga will be like Santa Clara or LMU.

The same thing was said about Monson.

ZagLawGrad
03-23-2013, 09:48 PM
Michigan is in it's first Sweet 16 since 1994 and UCLA is probably firing it's coach after a first round exit and other issues. GU and Few can do better, but c'mon people it is just basketball.



Disappointing loss. No doubt.

But, I can name a dozen things more important than Gonzaga basketball without a list to read from.

Keep some perspective. Some serious signs on here of a few people who have completely lost their mind over the game of basketball.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 09:49 PM
To illustrate why a team might have little control over its opponentsí three-point shooting, consider a ball screen situation. If a defender goes under a ball screen, the ballhander, assuming heís a good shooter, will be inclined to shoot. If the defender goes over the screen, the ballhandlerís response will not be to shoot a more difficult shot, it will be to not shoot at all. In this way, defensive strategies tend to impact the number of threes taken and not the percentage of threes made. By the end of the season, opponents have taken a mix of open and contested shots based on their own decisions, and from the defenseís point of view the distribution of these decisions isnít going to differ much from team to team. Thus, the resulting rankings of defensive 3P% are largely random, influenced some by opponents shooting ability.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 09:49 PM
In other words, youíd be better off assuming teams have no control over three-point defense than assuming swings over a two or three game stretch say anything about oneís defense. Iím willing to concede the Boeheim zone has some influence, but itís small. And I remain convinced that Ray Giacoletti had it completely backwards. If you want to keep opponents from making three-point shots, your best move is to prevent them from taking those shots.

Zags11
03-23-2013, 09:50 PM
kenpom.com

So its about defense strategy.

thespywhozaggedme
03-23-2013, 09:50 PM
reposted......... something to keep in mind;)

AP No. 1 Teams To Lose in Round of 32
Since 1994
Year Team Opponent
2013 Gonzaga Wichita State
2010 Kansas Northern Iowa
2004 Stanford Alabama
1994 North Carolina Boston College


It happens 40% of the time. or 33% in the past 9 years.

It's not exactly unheard of.
Honestly I don't know what the onlookers expect. Nobody's going to commit suicide of this. We had one helluva year. First time to No 1.....seeding was high. SO?
We lost to a team tonight. We only had a 32-2 record which is good enough for a no 1 ranking and a No 1 seed.
We did well. Sad to see us lose tonight but we'll be back next year. Hopefully Kelly stay...but if he doesn't we'll find another way to 25-30 wins.

Congrats to the kids and especially the Seniors. Job well done.

No, but 33% isn't too common either, if we're being objective.

TheGonzagaFactor
03-23-2013, 10:08 PM
Critics were totally correct on us. Biggest joke is a different coach with this squad is F4 bound. Fire away, but its true. 14 plus 3s vs a crappy 3pt team. Its old.

Few has a ceiling. This was his best squad and his defensive strategy allowed them to claw back and finally over take us.

#1 ranking was cute but now just a pitiful sad joke. 2nd rd exit with this squad is a joke. Bell was non aggressive again. Stockton was fine.

Few is a great guy and good coach with a ceiling.

Didn't read through the comments but you are 100% right. I bet people were stupidly defying you, but we were overrated.

montanazag88
03-23-2013, 10:09 PM
Please don't speak for me. I have been following Gonzaga basketball for over 35 years and I disagree with 87% of Zag11's posts, especially all of those in this thread.

Thank you.

Consider yourself unspoken for.....and just to be clear, I've got nearly the same mileage on my zag luggage tags and have to say, if you honestly believe Few has no issues to overcome as it relates to the most common issues nearly half of the threads are currently and clearly dissecting, more power to you. I respect your 35 years nonetheless.

Thank you!

Zags11
03-23-2013, 10:14 PM
Teams in march madness shoot 32% from 3 pt land. We allowed 24-51. That is a joke.

LegacyZag
03-23-2013, 10:27 PM
This is a very helpful thread. It's shocking that it took about 5 second for the few haters to come out of the woodwork.

Zags11
03-24-2013, 12:04 AM
This is a very helpful thread. It's shocking that it took about 5 second for the few haters to come out of the woodwork.

What is a hater? Knocking down a person?

This is the point of the thread and it showed up in certain posters. It isnt "hating" to say your coach has a ceiling or needs to work on his poor 3pt defense strategy.

A hater is if someone said Few winning % is almost 80%. Then a person replied back "He has that % cuz wcc sucks."

Chicken Ball
03-24-2013, 07:15 AM
There's no contradiction in loving Coach Few and wanting better. Why can't we want to keep Few, but also want him to get better?

GUDan07
03-24-2013, 07:42 AM
This is a very helpful thread. It's shocking that it took about 5 second for the few haters to come out of the woodwork.

This is the prevailing sentiment that I cannot stand on this board. Either you think Few is some immaculate gift from God incapable of error or improvement, or you hate him and want him gone.

Few is one of the top coaches in the Nation and Gonzaga is luck to have him, but the fact remains that Gonzaga will not advance deep into March without improved perimeter defense.

ZagDaddy
03-24-2013, 08:41 AM
This is the prevailing sentiment that I cannot stand on this board. Either you think Few is some immaculate gift from God incapable of error or improvement, or you hate him and want him gone.

Few is one of the top coaches in the Nation and Gonzaga is luck to have him, but the fact remains that Gonzaga will not advance deep into March without improved perimeter defense.

This. +100

bballbeachbum
03-24-2013, 08:41 AM
These are 18 year old kids! You can say its Few but he didn't stop Harris from scoring or some of those atrocious non calls? He wasn't guarding the kid who tossed the ball underhand and it went in? It's a game. They lost and its another day tomorrow. I know it sucks! Believe me you! I did my grad work at Gonzaga and played on two national championship teams at Williams undergrad! The difference is as I've gotten older I wasn't mad at them I was heartbroken for them. Now I'm going to roll over and hug my four year old who had his tonsils out and start a new day tomorrow.

thank you

gonwick
03-24-2013, 08:49 AM
I actually don't know that I have seen many, if any "fire few" comments on the board. Usually the firing talk comes from those who refuse to accept any criticism of few and attempt to discredit detractors with a straw man argument set up in a reply. I totally agree that a nice middle ground is both possible and highly desirable. I like few, but he has flaws. I want him to stay, I want him to continue to grow and improve. He changed his philosophy on fouling when up 3. He can evolve, and it is reasonable to expect him to.

GeorgiaZagFan
03-24-2013, 08:56 AM
For ANYONE that understands the game of college basketball there are a couple of things you should know. Gonzaga did NOT lose that game ...Wichita won it by shooting lights out when it counted most ....7 STRAIGHT THREES to overcome an 8-point deficit !!!! are you kidding me? ..and still I believe the Zags withstand all of that and still win ..until the last three that is fumbled around as the shot clock is running out and the guy hoists up a three to beat the shot clock....AND IT GOES IN!!!!!!

Early and Baker shot 30% for the year from 3-point land ...they made 8-12 three point shots....and it was NOT bad defense!!!! It was their day and I believe they would have beaten EVERY OTHER TEAM IN THE NCAA TOURNEY with that performance.

The Zags did little wrong, FEW DID NOTHING WRONG!!!!

Give some credit to WSU and an unbelievable shooting performance for a team that was coming off a 2-20 game.

spike_jr
03-24-2013, 09:03 AM
Georgia, I have to respectively disagree. They shot well because the defense did not take the three point shot away. You can face guard guys and due other things to discourage three point shots. You can guard the three point line rather than sag into the paint. Furthermore, this is not an isolated incident - what happened in all three loses this year? Wichita St was not going to beat us in the paint. Why continually collapse on the drive when we have the advantage inside and no foul trouble?

HOOTER
03-24-2013, 09:03 AM
I actually don't know that I have seen many, if any "fire few" comments on the board... He can evolve, and it is reasonable to expect him to.

That's really all this is about. After doing this year after year with many different players it may be safe to say that Few needs to change NCAA tournament strategy. I'd never want to see him go, but these early exits are getting painful. This year especially with the #1 ranking and 1 seed. Not sure what needs to change, but clearly somethings gotta give.

UberZagFan
03-24-2013, 10:12 AM
For ANYONE that understands the game of college basketball there are a couple of things you should know. Gonzaga did NOT lose that game ...Wichita won it by shooting lights out when it counted most ....7 STRAIGHT THREES to overcome an 8-point deficit !!!! are you kidding me? ..and still I believe the Zags withstand all of that and still win ..until the last three that is fumbled around as the shot clock is running out and the guy hoists up a three to beat the shot clock....AND IT GOES IN!!!!!!

Early and Baker shot 30% for the year from 3-point land ...they made 8-12 three point shots....and it was NOT bad defense!!!! It was their day and I believe they would have beaten EVERY OTHER TEAM IN THE NCAA TOURNEY with that performance.

The Zags did little wrong, FEW DID NOTHING WRONG!!!!

Give some credit to WSU and an unbelievable shooting performance for a team that was coming off a 2-20 game.

Uber understands the game of basketball and he disagrees with your "opinion". Fact: Shockers were 14-28 (ESPN box score) from 3. Your opinion: letting Early & Baker go 8-12 from 3 was not bad defense and Few did nothing wrong. Just completely disagree with this and not sure how much bball a person much watch to understand the game of basketball.

Few's defense that entire game was predicated on the belief that if they take a bunch of 3s that is fine because they'll only hit 33% or so. When they lit up the first half from 3, did Few's team come out after half taking the 3 away (see posts above regarding defending the 3 which results in less 3s taken)? Nope. They came out and just let them keep taking them. Good thing (or was it?) was that they were missing them early in the 2nd half and GU went on its run. But then they started hitting them again -- and it wasn't like they were ever out of rhythm -- and Few's team did nothing to defend in a way that would change that. In the last 12 minutes of the game, they took 3 2pt FGs compared to nine 3s. IUHO, anyone that understands the game of basketball understands that type of shot selection is determined by defense as much as it is the offense.

GeorgiaZagFan
03-24-2013, 10:42 AM
Georgia, I have to respectively disagree. They shot well because the defense did not take the three point shot away. You can face guard guys and due other things to discourage three point shots. You can guard the three point line rather than sag into the paint. Furthermore, this is not an isolated incident - what happened in all three loses this year? Wichita St was not going to beat us in the paint. Why continually collapse on the drive when we have the advantage inside and no foul trouble?

i thought half their threes were with very good defense on them ..and some others were just plain luck ...like the fumbled ball with shot clock running out or the one where the guy clearly traveled ..drove in kicked out to Baker that was WAY out there ..nothing but net ...yes our defense was not the best ..but some of it was just their day to make threes

Zags11
03-24-2013, 11:35 AM
This is the prevailing sentiment that I cannot stand on this board. Either you think Few is some immaculate gift from God incapable of error or improvement, or you hate him and want him gone.

Few is one of the top coaches in the Nation and Gonzaga is luck to have him, but the fact remains that Gonzaga will not advance deep into March without improved perimeter defense.

Agree. I want Few here. Never, Ever have I said I didnt . It is ok to admit faults at times of need, just like it is ok to say Few did a awesome job.

Few if he wants to breakthrough the sw16 and last 4yrs the rd of 32. He has to take away the 3pt line. We gave up 51 3pt shots in 2 gms, and they made 24. The tournament average is 32%. Our last 5 tournament losses, opponents shot 52% from 3.

I like Few and think he is a great guy. It isnt "hating" to say Few should work on 3pt defense strategy. It isnt dislike nor is it asking for him to be fired.

The strategy works for the majority in the WCC.

TheOtherGreatOne
03-24-2013, 03:28 PM
why don't we just hire a tough defense minded assistant coach? wouldn't that help dramaticaly with our one glaring weakness. looks like an awful easy fix to me.

deathchina
03-24-2013, 05:28 PM
We recruit offense, not defense. You can't always just "teach" defense...at the end of the day players have strength and weaknesses, and our players were picked by Few and the staff to be skilled offensively. I'm not saying we can't make some improvements on the defensive side, but we're never going to blow up the other team's offensive sets like Louisville.

And we can't seem to recruit the elite players that can excel on both sides of the ball.






why don't we just hire a tough defense minded assistant coach? wouldn't that help dramaticaly with our one glaring weakness. looks like an awful easy fix to me.

livelaughzag
03-24-2013, 09:47 PM
We recruit offense, not defense. You can't always just "teach" defense...at the end of the day players have strength and weaknesses, and our players were picked by Few and the staff to be skilled offensively. I'm not saying we can't make some improvements on the defensive side, but we're never going to blow up the other team's offensive sets like Louisville.

And we can't seem to recruit the elite players that can excel on both sides of the ball.

I rarely comment, preferring just to remain quiet, but I do think deathchina brings up a valid argument.

I think it's saying something that our best defender wasn't even recruited, MH being a Zag was pure luck (fate?).

I'm making a generalization, but highest rated recruits and AA's have all been pure offensive players. Zags offensive system can attract some high level recruits and will continue to do so. Hopefully they can continue to attract higher level talent who can also defend at a high level.

matty1090
03-24-2013, 10:07 PM
So what was the point of the post? Obviously you are not happy with the level of coaching. Do something about it or quit bellyaching.

Longislandzagfan, why do you get so sensitive when anyone says ANYTHING critical of the zags? You put them on this pedestal, and anyone who dares to offer their insight on areas of improvement you go ballistic. This team had some glaring weaknesses, we were exposed on the biggest stage and this was nothing short of an embarrassment for the program. You say "demand for change" yet you and the other moderators ban any post that questions any of the tactics of the great and powerful mark few.

gbnyba17
03-24-2013, 10:44 PM
whoever says few and the zags don't need to change their approach to guarding the perimeter is absolutely oblivious. its not a mystery, its not calling few a terrible person or coach, and its not hard to see. the sagging/weak side help defense needs to stop or else this will keep happening.