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View Full Version : Honest question about "Athletes"?



Kong-Kool-Aid
03-21-2013, 08:27 PM
Okay, this has always kind of struck me odd...

Do the media say one team has more "athletes" than another team or another conference as a veiled way to say they have more black guys?

I'm not trying to start anything... I'm Canadian though and certain figures of speech are different... so I'm just asking.

Is that what they mean?

DixieZag
03-21-2013, 08:40 PM
Sometimes.

"Athleticism" is usually defined loosely as speed, leaping ability, and strength - - fairly or not, those attributes are more often attributed to the black athletes than some deserving white athletes.

It goes the other way also, though.

You will here the terms, "skilled" or "fundamentals" more associated with white kids and unfairly ignoring many of the black kids that are equally skilled and fundamentally sound. The worst "race linked" label is "gym rat" - it almost always means a white kid (Kevin Pangos) that lives in a gym and does nothing but shoot and work on his skills even though there are hundreds of black kids that fit that profile to a T.

It's America circa 2013, most of it is harmless, some is laziness and some comes from age old stereotypes that need to go.

jazzdelmar
03-21-2013, 08:44 PM
Yes those codewords are still being used. Kenny Smith described in the Mexico front-line players as unathletic. Draw your own conclusions.

Zageist
03-21-2013, 09:47 PM
Yeah, struck as a ##### thing to say.

Birddog
03-22-2013, 04:07 AM
Sometimes.

"Athleticism" is usually defined loosely as speed, leaping ability, and strength - - fairly or not, those attributes are more often attributed to the black athletes than some deserving white athletes.

It goes the other way also, though.

You will here the terms, "skilled" or "fundamentals" more associated with white kids and unfairly ignoring many of the black kids that are equally skilled and fundamentally sound. The worst "race linked" label is "gym rat" - it almost always means a white kid (Kevin Pangos) that lives in a gym and does nothing but shoot and work on his skills even though there are hundreds of black kids that fit that profile to a T.

It's America circa 2013, most of it is harmless, some is laziness and some comes from age old stereotypes that need to go.
Dixie pretty well defined the terms there. I bolded the one part because IMO that is the disease that afflicts so much of so-called "sports journalism". I don't think there is a profession that does less for more. The radio/TV side is the worst. The Print guys and gals still have some skills but the good ones are disappearing fast. Sites like the Bleacher Report are eroding whats left.

The next class/lecture will cover "Physicallity".

Martin Centre Mad Man
03-22-2013, 06:36 AM
"Athleticism" is usually used to define speed and jumping ability when referring to basketball players. I've always believed that defining athleticism that way is too narrow and does not account for other physical attributes that help players be successful. The term is almost never used to describe balance, body control, endurance, or physical strength. J.P. Batista was not "athletic" because he was slow even though he physically manhandled superior "athletes" with physical strength and balance. Delly is not "athletic" even though his motor runs at top speed for 40 minutes a night and his hands and feet are always positioned to make plays against quicker players.

I don't believe that Southern had superior athletes. There was no front-line player on that team who could move as fluidly as K.O. or Harris. A lot of Southern's "blocked shots" that could be attributed to superior leaping ability could have just as easily been called "fouls" drawn by stronger, more agile Gonzaga players.

GoZags
03-22-2013, 06:46 AM
"It's kind of a misnomer about us. It's almost funny. They assume we are not very athletic. It's a big mistake."MarkFew December '01

The more things change .....

TacomaZAG
03-22-2013, 07:16 AM
IMHO, there are 3 types of college basketball participants; guys who are athletes, guys who are basketball players (high BB IQ), and guys who are both. The guys who are both usually go to the handful of "elite" schools, and the others make up the rest of the college basketball rosters.

Give me the basketball players any day of the week. I don't care if they're green, blue, or plaid............

Go ZAGS

TexasZagFan
03-22-2013, 07:45 AM
If Kelly Olynyk is not the most athletic 7-footer in the nation, he's in the top 5. He'll have a good career in the NBA. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the Mavericks draft him.

Ekrub
03-22-2013, 07:54 AM
Not Safe For Work but funny joke by bill burr on athleticism and Basketball "smarts"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkzlbC7MHgQ&sns=em

zagco
03-22-2013, 09:01 AM
Zagco sadly thinks it does sometimes unintentionally apply to teams that lack (or have) black players. However, he does not think it is used that way as much as it used to be.

Zagco lives in an area that does not have many black people (the Boise, Idaho area). He often watches youth sports in the area, and he certainly sees kids that he considers to be athletic, and they are almost always white kids. The two worst "athletes" on one of his daughter's school teams in junior high were black girls.

He remembers when he was in high school, you could get a group of the best athletes together to play 5 on 5 against our varsity basketball team (a very good team by the way) and beat them. Every one of them were white kids. Athletes beat non-athletic skill guys every time. Gonzaga is not "unathletic" at all. However, they might not have quite as many real athletic guys. Plus, giant guys are rarely real "athletic." KO seems fairly athletic for a big guy to Zagco.

Zagco gravitates towards players that are truly fast (good track speed), good vertical jump, movements that appear to be hops where the body changes direction, and balance. You can usually tell good athletes because they can make difficult things appear easy. Zagco eschews slow players, especially if they are not true posts. He doesn't care if they can run drills like Mozart and beat Larry Bird in HORSE. He picks athletes over skill guys all the time.

Ezag
03-22-2013, 09:32 AM
Stereotypes or not it Pretty much means YES....if you are an athletic team you have jumpy, black guys who can rebound and shot block and few white guys.....if you have lots of white guys you are fundamentally sound and can shoot.

former1dog
03-22-2013, 09:35 AM
IMHO, there are 3 types of college basketball participants; guys who are athletes, guys who are basketball players (high BB IQ), and guys who are both. The guys who are both usually go to the handful of "elite" schools, and the others make up the rest of the college basketball rosters.

Give me the basketball players any day of the week. I don't care if they're green, blue, or plaid............

Go ZAGS

Hank Gathers, RIP

UberZagFan
03-22-2013, 11:30 AM
Yes those codewords are still being used. Kenny Smith described in the Mexico front-line players as unathletic. Draw your own conclusions.

He's right though.

Zag79
03-22-2013, 12:46 PM
Athletic means athletic, not black. :doh: Anyone who uses the word athletic to describe a color of ones skin is a fool, and shouldn't be in a position to publicly speak on sports to begin with. I think some people may feel as if the term "athletic" describes a color, only because from their perspective most "black guys" are more athletic than the typical white players on the same court. Silly question, but not as silly as those that believe athletic describes a color.

kclubfounder
03-22-2013, 01:54 PM
Okay, this has always kind of struck me odd...

Do the media say one team has more "athletes" than another team or another conference as a veiled way to say they have more black guys?

I'm not trying to start anything... I'm Canadian though and certain figures of speech are different... so I'm just asking.

Is that what they mean?

Yes, but in 2013 it is almost without exception an African American member of the media who does it.

scott257
03-22-2013, 03:39 PM
If Kelly Olynyk is not the most athletic 7-footer in the nation, he's in the top 5. He'll have a good career in the NBA. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the Mavericks draft him.

I was thinking that on the way home from the Ticket's Hooky Palace today. I also was thinking that Kelly is someone that the Spurs would love to have. He is just the type of player they love.

FuManShoes
03-22-2013, 05:28 PM
To dispel the notion that athletes are of but one color, see: Florida Gulf Coast.

ZagsBaby
03-22-2013, 05:30 PM
To dispel the notion that athletes are of but one color, see: Florida Gulf Coast.

That one handed dunk late was filthy good.

Zag79
03-22-2013, 10:38 PM
To dispel the notion that athletes are of but one color, see: Florida Gulf Coast.

White boys yakking it, that was a display of dunkerage I haven't seen since UNLV ran and jammed. Fun game to watch, they can make a real run.