View Full Version : Another tough game for back court

01-20-2013, 04:34 AM
First, I am very proud and impressed that our guys came back and should have won. That was so tough - something Indiana had trouble with also.

One thing that has to be addressed is our back court scoring against tough defensive teams.

KP - 5 pts.
GBJ - 0 pts.
DS - 3 pts (but they were big)
KD - 0 pts

It is certainly true that when the bigs are working it there is far less onus on the guards or the 3 to score.

But, we really got shut down from outside same as Illinois (our only other loss).

Gary is a mystery to me. Not only did he not score Sat. but also didn't get much against UP. No doubt he is hurting but if he is hurting he probably should be rested until better. Pangos has a hard time finding his shot when teams can key on him alone from outside. Stocks is not a shooter, has a tough time getting open and it just isn't his game and not his role.

We will need to get another guy who can be a threat from outside when KP is blanketed. It seems to me that it would need to be either GBJ or KD.

We will beat all but 10-12 teams b/c few teams can guard everyone like that. But, for this team to go deep, we will need another weapon from deep.

I would post this same thread had we won.

01-20-2013, 05:06 AM
barham can be a threat from distance but he needs others to get him a wide open look to be effective. dranginis developing would be ideal of course. i have a feeling we won't be seeing the bell we want to see until next year.

01-20-2013, 05:10 AM
Hard to win when our starting backcourt only attempts 6 shots. Neither Kevin nor Gary are particularly good at creating their own shot against the better defenders, so we are going to have to run them off screens etc. for them to get their shots. We did not do that tonight at all.

Now, that being said, our bigs scored 54 of our 63 points tonight, great effort by Sam, Kelly, and Elias.

The starting backcourt needs more shots, especially from behind the arc. Kevin and Gary totalled 3 shots from behind the arc tonight, not enough....


01-20-2013, 10:40 AM
to analyze what didn't happen and suggest that is somehow the problem.

From the get go (on the pre game, pre taped, radio cast at any rate) Few said our plan was to stage an inside out game. that means to me we go inside, the role of the backcourt being to look for a big, not a shot. and we did.

Post game, counting the shots not taken and the apparent lethargy of the back court is to ignore that the ball made it into the middle and under the basket numerous times. One could posit by watching, too, that about 8-10 points did not get counted because they started out as 2 inch lay ins but DID.NOT.DROP.

How that converts to the backcourt escapes me. What it does say is the ball got to its intended insider and the insider got it to within inches of the intended field goal. What else can one expect in a game designed to do everything except put the brown thing in the round thing from as close as possible ?

That's what happened. BECAUSE, not in spite of, the backcourt, imo.

That said, the mystery of GBj's health and dearth of what appears to be up top shooting and even the apparent lack (i.e. we don't seem to see it) of plays designed to free up the likes of KP & GBj to take some shots, do seem to be worthy questions.

But if/until we get a peek at what is actually happening to GBj health-wise, for e.g., we are all just speculating in the dark. ANd one guess is as good, or bad, as another. Not sure what purpose guessing serves.

01-20-2013, 10:56 AM
Gamagain, don't put words in my mouth - - I never even implied there was ANY "lethargy" on the part of our backcourt nor would I. It is obvious to me that they worked their tails off.

Every team has their scoring threats and every team is well served by having balanced scoring - - which this team has had in most games this year but there have been teams able to nullify our outside threat.

When a team gets only 8 pts from its 1-2-3 position players in a game that is a "tough" game and worthy of at least noting. Especially when we do have great shooters from outside and I DEFINITELY include Bell in that category. I would like to see them find ways to exploit that great shooting, that is all.

01-20-2013, 10:59 AM
If hurt, GB should be sat for a chunk of time, two weeks, five games, not a half. Even it cost a game, which it won't, given his offensive contributions of late. It would allow others to play more, such as Dranginis and Barham. Few is loathe to experiment in such radical ways, he prefers to tweak PT. Go for it.

01-20-2013, 11:03 AM
I take a different perspective....if you watch all pre game stuff, some of the interviews with coach Stevens ( and other coaches) the butler game plan ( as other teams on occasion) was to remove or take out the guards in particular pangos and make the other zags beat them.....butler did just that and our bigs were the key to our success...trying to force action right into the butler game plan would have created a bigger issue......we are balanced tht makes us dangerous. And nt single action focused

01-20-2013, 11:10 AM
I will also say that as much as our guards were banged, hacked and thrown around they still did a very nice job taking care of the ball, limiting TOs and getting it inside.

They were not lazy, they didn't play poorly, they had a tough time finding a way to use their dead-eye shooting thus balancing our scoring threat. Against the very top teams in the country it is worth trying to even out.

01-20-2013, 08:00 PM
thought Kyle was more aggressive when he was in there last night. Loved it. Took a three and I was so hoping it would go in for him. Looked good and rolled out. I think he will get some more chances and I predict things start falling for him.

01-20-2013, 08:17 PM
thought Kyle was more aggressive when he was in there last night. Loved it. Took a three and I was so hoping it would go in for him. Looked good and rolled out. I think he will get some more chances and I predict things start falling for him.

agree...dranginis needs the opportunity to play and play without constantly looking towards the bench after every mistake he makes.

01-21-2013, 05:58 AM
Perhaps most important of all is having a three point threat, and preferrably several of them. Almost as important is having an effective defense against the three point play. I have yet to do a double blinded study on this, but it seems to me that one of the keys to winning since the inception of the three point play is to make more three point plays than your opponents. The Butler game found a delta of 4, meaning they made four shots more than we did. There was a time, when GU looked to make three pointers, and our kids had the skills and confidence to drain them. KP is a streaky shooter, and has troubles creating his own shot. GB is not operating on all cylinders.

For the remainder of this season, it would be nice to see coach actually emphasize the three point shooting, continuing to work on it as a skill set. I believe KD does have a good shot and he is tall enough to get it off. Elias also can make threes, and so can KO. Until we extend the opponents defense and close the delta factor, we are not going to get past the Sweet 16, methinks.

All that said, the game was epic. It ended tragically, but dramatically, and it was absolutely captivating, start to finish. I got the sense the game was kind of like Kismet. There was a sense of inevitability hanging over the Zags, playing in Hinkle. What a great venue, and obviously Butler didn't feel beating the Zags was another walk in the park.

Mark Few is being scapegoated by some of the posters on this board for the loss. I would look at it slightly differently. We almost pulled it off, there is no shame in our performance. The game exposed some weaknesses in terms of strategy and tactics. The emphasis on the inside game while failing to create three point opportunities, let alone defend against them, should be reconsidered.

Congratulations to the Butler Bulldogs. I think they are a great team, and have now moved into third place of Sili's favorite teams. I hope they go deep again, and bet they will.

Go Bulldogs, all of them!

01-21-2013, 07:45 AM
good post, Sili.

Guards win games in March...would be nice to be fully engaged each game (on offense). Hopefully this is an aberration.

01-21-2013, 02:45 PM
Agree with Gamagin and Sili. Coach's plan was to go inside almost exclusively. Number of attempts by guards confirm this. Was not necessairly their inadequacy. One of these days an elite team will go after our bigs or there will be foul trouble. We better have our outside players with more experience under their belt.

01-21-2013, 04:04 PM
I want to know how anyone on the bench other then Stockton can ever get in enough to ever get in game rythem. Barham was playing good defense when he first came in then air balled his only attempt and he got pulled at the next time out. Drag had the same thing happen after he missed a driving to the hoop shot as well. I wish coach Few would drop the leash sometimes and let the players get some confidence.