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Bogozags
11-05-2012, 02:02 PM
Please forgive if this has already been posted...


By Miles Simon | ESPN Insider

"5. Gonzaga Bulldogs
There isn't a lot of depth in coach Mark Few's backcourt, but who would want to sub out Kevin Pangos and Gary Bell Jr. -- both just sophomores? These two guards made an instant impact as soon as they put on the Zags uniform last season. Canadian-born Pangos, who is tabbed in some circles as the next Steve Nash, actually spent time learning from Nash this summer with the senior Canadian men's national team. He didn't need much help last season, even early, with 33 points and 9 3s in his second game. He is a great shooter who can create his own shot and is very good at getting into the paint. Bell is small for shooting guard at 6-1 but makes up for his lack of size in heart and toughness. Bell is an elite shooter who made 52 percent of his 3s in league play. He is a great defender who has the build of a seasoned upperclassman. Pangos and Bell complement each other very well. The Zags have a solid backup point guard in David Stockton, and redshirt freshman Kyle Dranginis should provide good 3-point shooting off the bench."

cggonzaga
11-05-2012, 02:21 PM
Thanks bogo. Miles Simon knows a little something about great backcourts.

ZagNative
11-05-2012, 02:29 PM
Link (http://insider.espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/8596465/cbb-ranking-top-backcourts-college-basketball)

MickMick
11-05-2012, 04:21 PM
Now we are talking.

Remember the "bold predictions" thread that popped up a few weeks ago?

sheps001
11-06-2012, 02:31 AM
I thought GBJ was 6-3? It doesn't make much of a difference anyways. I have seen KC Jones of Boston fame and the late great Norm Van Lier and they were maybe 6 feet even.

bartruff1
11-06-2012, 03:56 AM
thanks bogo. Miles simon knows a little something about great backcourts..... + 1

cjm720
11-06-2012, 07:57 AM
Awesome. Collectively, a heckuva duo.

Baldwinzag
11-06-2012, 08:06 AM
much deserved. Nice recognition for our players & team.

I wonder if Delly & Holt will have something to say about these rankings this season...

or possibly Carlino & Haws as well...

Consider the backcourts of USD(best sub-6' duo in the nation, hands down;)), Santa Clara also features 2 explosive, proven guards, don't forget LMU either...

WCC may present some of the top guard combos in all of College hoops this season.

Should be a doozy & fun to watch all the great match-ups.

dnj116
11-06-2012, 09:12 AM
And how 'bout this from ESPN -- coming in at number 3 on top frosh from outside the "big six"


3. Przemek Karnowski, C, Gonzaga Bulldogs
2012 ESPN 100 Rank: Not ranked

A true 7-1 center, this big man comes to Gonzaga from Poland. After reviewing a ton of film on him, it's easy to see why he will be such an influence on the Zags this season. Left-handed and extremely skilled with the savvy to match, he can step out behind the arc and nail a 3-pointer off the catch. Bring him to the midrange jumper at the high post or short corner and he is equally comfortable and productive.

Blessed with a trustworthy pair of hands to score and pass, he has very little wasted motion in his approach. Near the basket his sweet spot is the left block going middle to his right shoulder. He also has great fundamentals and can lift a defender off his feet with a ball fake.

The Zags have an outstanding trio of big men returning in Elias Harris, Sam Dower and Kelly Olynyk, but don't be surprised if Karnowski stands out among that established group.

Gotta love it!

FlyZag
11-06-2012, 09:26 AM
Dellavadova was the WCC player of the year. He now is a senior and has gained some awesome experience playing against the worlds best in the Olympics. Add to that Holt, who is Bell's equal on defense and athleticism. Nothing against our guys... But Delly & Holt are pretty impressive too. I think ESPN missed the mark on this one.

That said... GO ZAGS!!

sittingon50
11-06-2012, 09:56 AM
I agree fly. Our 2 youngsters will really leave a mark on this program by the time it is all said & done, but THIS YEAR, Delly will be the man, IMHO.

I think I may have said it before but I liken Delly to Casey; a guy that can by the force of his own will, lead a team to victory.

bigblahla
11-06-2012, 09:58 AM
Zags sweep Gaels in 2012-13.

Go!! Zags!!!

primal23
11-06-2012, 10:20 AM
Zags sweep Gaels in 2012-13.

Go!! Zags!!!

:pray:

OZZY
11-06-2012, 03:11 PM
Dellavadova was the WCC player of the year. He now is a senior and has gained some awesome experience playing against the worlds best in the Olympics. Add to that Holt, who is Bell's equal on defense and athleticism. Nothing against our guys... But Delly & Holt are pretty impressive too. I think ESPN missed the mark on this one.

That said... GO ZAGS!!

That was my first thought as well, as much as I love our starting guards, I was wondering if there would be 2 WCC guard tandems in the ESPN top 5 with Delly and Holt ahead of KP and GBJ.

More motivation for SMC as if they haven't been given enough already this pre-season with everyone but RTC's Alamedafan choosing the Zags to finish first.......

bigblahla
11-06-2012, 06:19 PM
That was my first thought as well, as much as I love our starting guards, I was wondering if there would be 2 WCC guard tandems in the ESPN top 5 with Delly and Holt ahead of KP and GBJ.

If Randy Bennett would quit gaming the system, go on the road and play good teams the Gaels would receive the national attention their talent deserves but he won't so only Delly gets his due. The team goes mostly unnoticed on the national scene save playing GU and BYU with their postseason dependent on the outcome of those games. At least that's the way it seems to me.

Just my opinion

Go!! Zags!!!

thickman1
11-06-2012, 06:49 PM
If Randy Bennett would quit gaming the system, go on the road and play good teams the Gaels would receive the national attention their talent deserves but he won't so Delly gets his due. The team goes mostly unnoticed on the national scene save playing GU and BYU with their postseason dependent on the outcome of those games. At least that's the way it seems to me.

Just my opinion

Go!! Zags!!!

+1

Zagdawg
11-06-2012, 07:20 PM
+2

ridgebackzag
11-07-2012, 04:13 PM
While Delly and Holt are a great duo, I'll take 3 more years with Pangos and Bell. There is a ton of potential there and I think that's what ESPN is factoring in here.

MJGoGaels
11-07-2012, 07:27 PM
If Randy Bennett would quit gaming the system, go on the road and play good teams the Gaels would receive the national attention their talent deserves but he won't so only Delly gets his due. The team goes mostly unnoticed on the national scene save playing GU and BYU with their postseason dependent on the outcome of those games. At least that's the way it seems to me.

Just my opinion

Go!! Zags!!!

Fair point about SMC scheduling. We'll see if RB gamed the system or pays a heavy price. However, if we are talking about getting an opportunity to see what Delly, Holt (Page and Walker, III) can do. Everyone will get to watch on Thanksgiving day - ESPN2 at 1:30 PST SMC vs. Drexel. Should be a good game and if they win will get the second game and championship game on ESPN 2. championship is on Sunday at 6 pm PST. So plenty of air-time to get the national audience if they win.
http://directvclassic.com/

But this thread is about who is really the best combo back court. No doubt Pangos and Bell did amazingly well in their first year but are you in the camp that says they are top 5 worthy? I would like to know your opinion on that one. Next, do you really rate Pangos and Bell higher then Delly and Holt? If so, what numbers or games and situations would you point to in support of your position? Head to Head games are probably best in your analysis.

Final thought: People's minds are changed through observation and not through argument. Will Rogers.

Oregonzagnut
11-07-2012, 09:17 PM
there is a popularity vote and the fact Gonzaga is more nationally recognized will increase their exposure for any poll or analysis. If you were forced to make an assumption about who will have the better backcourt, would you choose Kentucky or Florida?

Part of it is attempting to predict who will be the best backcourt come March. and more people will state their journalistic reputation on simple odds and perception. No argument, or stats, or even observation can make someone go against popular opinion and hype.

Am I saying Pangos and Bell are more a popular or "sexier" pick than Delly and Holt? YEP!

WallaWallaZag
11-07-2012, 10:00 PM
Fair point about SMC scheduling. We'll see if RB gamed the system or pays a heavy price. However, if we are talking about getting an opportunity to see what Delly, Holt (Page and Walker, III) can do. Everyone will get to watch on Thanksgiving day - ESPN2 at 1:30 PST SMC vs. Drexel. Should be a good game and if they win will get the second game and championship game on ESPN 2. championship is on Sunday at 6 pm PST. So plenty of air-time to get the national audience if they win.
http://directvclassic.com/

But this thread is about who is really the best combo back court. No doubt Pangos and Bell did amazingly well in their first year but are you in the camp that says they are top 5 worthy? I would like to know your opinion on that one. Next, do you really rate Pangos and Bell higher then Delly and Holt? If so, what numbers or games and situations would you point to in support of your position? Head to Head games are probably best in your analysis.

who would smc likely play in the championship game?

holt would get more love if any of the national media had actually ever seen him play...the other problem with holt is that when he finally started consistently playing to his potential he got hurt.

MJGoGaels
11-07-2012, 11:04 PM
IF SMC wins through their side of the bracket, the other four are:
-vs. Cal-Drake and Georgia Tech-Rice. So we are hopeful to play Cal for the championship. It's the only way we can play them. Stanford and Cal won't play us one for one.
http://directvclassic.com/home/

ZAGGED OUT
11-08-2012, 06:43 AM
IF SMC wins through their side of the bracket, the other four are:
-vs. Cal-Drake and Georgia Tech-Rice. So we are hopeful to play Cal for the championship. It's the only way we can play them. Stanford and Cal won't play us one for one.
http://directvclassic.com/home/

Probably because SMC has done nothing to warrant a home and home

cjm720
11-08-2012, 06:57 AM
So what are the top 5 backcourts? Zags at 5, who are the others?

Bogozags
11-08-2012, 07:18 AM
Probably because SMC has done nothing to warrant a home and home

Not so sure that is the issue but rather recruiting competition.

IMO if either Cal or Stanford of the PAC12 play an SMC squad from the same Bay Area, that would legitimize that team, especially if SMC would win the game, which almost certainly would be a road game for SMC. I don't think Cal/Stanford play any of the Bay Area schools USF, SCU, or CSUSF as there is nothing to be gained and everything to lose. Which is why I think they don't play local schools. UNC, under Dean Smith, took the same approach and would not play any other NC schools not in the ACC unless they met in a tournament.

As we know Cal & Stanford both have high academic requirements and are "equals" within the PAC12. They are across the bay from each other so they can argue "their" side is better than the other side...of course there are other differences...

ZAGGED OUT
11-08-2012, 08:11 AM
Not so sure that is the issue but rather recruiting competition.

IMO if either Cal or Stanford of the PAC12 play an SMC squad from the same Bay Area, that would legitimize that team, especially if SMC would win the game, which almost certainly would be a road game for SMC. I don't think Cal/Stanford play any of the Bay Area schools USF, SCU, or CSUSF as there is nothing to be gained and everything to lose. Which is why I think they don't play local schools. UNC, under Dean Smith, took the same approach and would not play any other NC schools not in the ACC unless they met in a tournament.

As we know Cal & Stanford both have high academic requirements and are "equals" within the PAC12. They are across the bay from each other so they can argue "their" side is better than the other side...of course there are other differences...

I'm sure that does play a part in it, as does their lack of scheduling, etc. There is just no benefit for any legitimate teams to start a home-home with them. The Zags didn't just wake up one day and decide to start home and homes with Michigan st and Illinois, they played where ever and who ever they had to with no gurantees. I would actually like to see SMC and RB step up follow suit as it would only help strengthen our conference and RPI

Zagdawg
11-08-2012, 09:54 AM
But....they might lose a game to a good team if they play them on their court.---gasp.

MJGoGaels
11-08-2012, 07:36 PM
Probably because SMC has done nothing to warrant a home and home

I don't think I want or need an explanation of your inane comment but here's a current article discussing Bay Area basketball politics as USF and Stanford were able to work-out a one game neutral on Friday night.
http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_21957582/stanford-usf-rare-bay-area-matchup

BTW, SMC beat Cal the last two meetings at Berkeley. The last game was 2004 or 2005 in early round of the Coaches vs. Cancer. The Gaels went on to Madison Square Garden. I seem to recall that all the printed materials in NY featured Cal as the promoters expected the Bears to advance.

john montana
11-09-2012, 04:25 AM
Love our backcourt, but Delly trumps ours. He is the best player in the league and the smc backcourt should be on that list ahead of ours in my opinion. Delly is that good, and Holt is solid.

As for smc's schedule...I think Randy has wasted years of party mills, Omar Samhan, Simpson and now Delly sitting at home playing patsies rather than take those players out on the road and win some big games. I wish they would take a few risks.

MickMick
11-09-2012, 04:57 AM
If your body of work is over a decade long, you get the benefit of the doubt with the national press.

Still, GU has an obvious ceiling for these perks because they have not played in a title game.

SMC has a slightly lower ceiling (for national recognition) because they have not played in front of a national audience enough times. SMC and Delly still get plenty of well deserved accolades. I have seen a handful of articles this preseason.

SMC simply needs to maintain what they are currently doing, for a little longer, and they will be able to schedule high profile home games at a much higher clip. The program recognition will jump to another plateau when that happens. Some folks believe Bennett has already earned enough cache to be a little more aggressive with his home and home scheduling. I agree with that notion.

The WCC is vastly improved, so SMC doesn't need to blaze such a monsterous scheduling trail like GU did. There is room for improvement, however, with their OOC schedule difficulty. On the other hand, Mark Few has come to the realization that his OOC scheduling can be toned down a bit because the WCC has improved so much.

Bogozags
11-09-2012, 06:09 AM
I don't think I want or need an explanation of your inane comment but here's a current article discussing Bay Area basketball politics as USF and Stanford were able to work-out a one game neutral on Friday night.
http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_21957582/stanford-usf-rare-bay-area-matchup

BTW, SMC beat Cal the last two meetings at Berkeley. The last game was 2004 or 2005 in early round of the Coaches vs. Cancer. The Gaels went on to Madison Square Garden. I seem to recall that all the printed materials in NY featured Cal as the promoters expected the Bears to advance.

Just my opinion of course, but SMC will most probably never get top tier talent to consistently play home and home, because of the size of the home court. I hate that these large coliseums, they just take the game away from the fans IMO. I use to love watching West Coast basketball at UOP, CSU-Sacramento, UC Davis, Long Beach State to name a few...

Wish it wasn't the case but the size of your "gym" has a really big impact on who will come to play...Oh, TV coverage also has a bearing...

Why hasn't SMC played in Maui or any of the other overseas holiday tournaments? Seems like that would be a great opportunity to show their wares...

ZAGGED OUT
11-09-2012, 07:23 AM
I don't think I want or need an explanation of your inane comment but here's a current article discussing Bay Area basketball politics as USF and Stanford were able to work-out a one game neutral on Friday night.
http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_21957582/stanford-usf-rare-bay-area-matchup

BTW, SMC beat Cal the last two meetings at Berkeley. The last game was 2004 or 2005 in early round of the Coaches vs. Cancer. The Gaels went on to Madison Square Garden. I seem to recall that all the printed materials in NY featured Cal as the promoters expected the Bears to advance.

Well I for one am interested in how my comment is so "inane". It's pretty common knowledge. Go out and play top tier teams OOC, with a chip on your shoulder, and continue to do it til teams are forced to respect you. I also agree with having an above comment about the small gym, another disadvantage for big teams to come to your house. Just as it was/is for Gonzaga. As of right now, your players are demanding respect, but your coach and program are not. Just my opinion.