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bigblahla
08-09-2012, 10:47 AM
ESPN's Top 25 2013 recruiting classes

http://insider.espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/classrankings

BYU is ranked 6th. St. Mary's is 17th. Gonzaga is unranked.

The above is part of a blog on SSF.

First let me say I hope Hermanson doesn't turn into a Brockman for SMC.

SSF is now reporting the Zags are looking at bringing in an unknown CC player class of 2013 for an official visit. Tried to find out info on 6'7" Chris Griffin but he wasn't listed on the Wabash CC team roster for 2011-12. This has me scratching my head and wondering what is going on with our recruiting?

Looks like we have recruited two 2013 mid-major level players in Meikle and Edwards. Coleman, eligible in 2013 should be a positive addition.

If the Zags don't get a commit from at least one of the 2013 prized recruits we are still after, Mathews, Johnson or Okonoboh will you consider it a disappointing recruiting year?

Either Mathews and/or Okonoboh would make me very happy.

What say ye Zaggies?

Go!! Zags!!!

DagsZags
08-09-2012, 11:21 AM
I would love Mathews and Okonoboh. Both of them would be perfect to keep the ball rolling on talent.

Goodluck is such a beast with so much potential that he could come in right away and dominate the paint. His O game is still a work in progress, but we've all seen what the coaching staff has done for guys like him, Robert Sacre being the most recent example. Obviously it's a bit of a longshot to get Goodluck, but he's the guy I'd be most excited for.

Mathews is a pure scorer from everything I've read about him. It seems like he has an all-around offensive game which is great, plus he would add size to the 2 spot, and would add more depth to the 3 of course.

I don't know a whole lot about Chris Griffin, but TSSF put up a great article about him today. Apparently he's a very athletic 3, with very nice size for the wing at 6'7".

http://www.slipperstillfits.com/2012/8/9/3230561/gonzaga-targeting-junior-college-wing-chris-griffin?tw_p=twt

MDABE80
08-09-2012, 11:25 AM
I don't see Coleman as a mid level. I don't see Meikle as mid level. I don't think we need a 2013 ranking to show our recruiting is effective. It's not our style. Few recruits to needs. We are full of very good talent. If the cuboards were bare, I cold see a huge recruiting effort. Next year expect a spurt.

Also though, those rankings are very good with 2-4 5 star kids.... I don't reley on them too much though once we get to the middle of the rankings. Just so much Summer talk to give the writers a job.

ZAGGED OUT
08-09-2012, 11:28 AM
I think we've done fine for 2013. We can't expect to have a huge class in 2013 when our starters are pretty solidified for the next couple years. Now, if we were to not land any of our big recruits in 14' and 15', then I may have some issues. It's just hard to bring in top tier guys and ask them to play 2nd fiddle to Pangos and Bell's 30 mins a game

bigblahla
08-09-2012, 12:11 PM
I don't see Coleman as a mid level. I don't see Meikle as mid level. I don't think we need a 2013 ranking to show our recruiting is effective. It's not our style. Few recruits to needs. We are full of very good talent. If the cuboards were bare, I cold see a huge recruiting effort. Next year expect a spurt.

Also though, those rankings are very good with 2-4 5 star kids.... I don't reley on them too much though once we get to the middle of the rankings. Just so much Summer talk to give the writers a job.

I don't see Coleman as mid-major either Doc, never implied he was. I hope you're right about Meikle.

Go!! Zags!!!

cggonzaga
08-09-2012, 12:21 PM
I don't see Meikle as mid level

Me either...he's low level. No offense to the kid and maybe the staff unearthed a hidden gem but I don't see it.

I agree with Blah but will take it a step further. If we don't get 2 of the big 3 targeted recruits it will be a disappointing class especially compared to what SMC and BYU have done.

On a side note, we really need to start getting some of these California kids!

cjm720
08-09-2012, 12:32 PM
Me either...he's low level. No offense to the kid and maybe the staff unearthed a hidden gem but I don't see it.

I agree with Blah but will take it a step further. If we don't get 2 of the big 3 targeted recruits it will be a disappointing class especially compared to what SMC and BYU have done.

On a side note, we really need to start getting some of these California kids!

Have you ever seen him player out of curiosity? If not, what basis do you make your comments on? Personally, I see an under the radar kid with great length, better than average athleticism, range in his shot, and size with the ability to play multiple positions. A player that wants to be a Zag and expected an offer, which tells me he know he has skill (i.e., confident to boot).



Like a few have said, we're loaded now and have our starters essentially and unequivocally locked up for the next two years. Not worried in the least.

cggonzaga
08-09-2012, 01:08 PM
Yes I have seen him play both in person and on tv. He was not impressive and looked like a good not great high school player. Maybe he's getting better and I hope he is. Again I hope he's a hidden gem but to even call him a mid major level recruit after this past season is an overstatement.

So yours and others reasoning behind us not having a great 2013 class is based on our current roster? Because we're so good and deep it doesn't matter for 2013? And you all have been paying attention to the roster turnover the past 3 years? Not to mention you're counting on nobody getting hurt? Do most nationally ranked programs not consistently have good to great recruiting classes every year? That would be the reason they are a nationally recognized program. I'm not saying every class is going to be superb but when you have 6 open scholarships you have needs. If we don't have a good 2013 then it becomes critical we have a great 2014 class. I'd prefer not relying on freshmen in 2014 and possibly taking a step backwards while SMC and BYU are on the rise.

DCZag
08-09-2012, 01:15 PM
I usually don't get into the recruit thing, it's really useless conjecture - there is no way of knowing what the recruiting class is until a couple of years after they hit campus. You're talking about 16-18 yr olds - I'm not at all worried about our '13 class.

JPtheBeasta
08-09-2012, 01:23 PM
It's just hard to bring in top tier guys and ask them to play 2nd fiddle to Pangos and Bell's 30 mins a game

+1. We need to start bringing in some upper tier guys when our encumbants are juniors, IMO. We aren't really in reloading mode but seem to be more or less rounding things out with some role players that probably aren't going to get upset with less minutes. Depth is great, of course, and if we can get some top recruits sooner who don't mind sitting the bench, that would be great work by the staff. There might be a little paranoia because of a few recent hiccups in recruiting, but I'm pretty sure the staff has it covered :]

cjm720
08-09-2012, 01:27 PM
The point is, CG, that high level recruits expect to play right away. With our roster, it's pretty clear that the next two years a recruit's not going to come in and be anything but a role player.

Yea, it'd be nice to be Duke and have an all-american on the bench average 3 minutes a game and be seemingly content, but we're not quite there yet :)

My guess is that a lot of recruits we recruit either would love to be on out team or use as a springboard to BCS destinations...we are a WCC program, like it or not, that's always going to hurt us so we look to other areas.

I think Few's track recrod speaks for itself in producing wins and recruits that turn out much better than expected. I'll leave it at that.

CDC84
08-09-2012, 01:28 PM
I still don't see any player that Gonzaga is recruiting in this class who is a Gary Bell-type can't miss prospect. They need one. With all the great talent out west, it's disappointing to me that GU can't pick off a can't misser, and then complement that guy with players like Johnson and Okonoboh.

cggonzaga
08-09-2012, 01:43 PM
I still don't see any player that Gonzaga is recruiting in this class who is a Gary Bell-type can't miss prospect. They need one. With all the great talent out west, it's disappointing to me that GU can't pick off a can't misser, and then complement that guy with players like Johnson and Okonoboh.

Pretty much what I've been trying to say...to no avail apparently. I understand we're not Duke but we're not Eastern Washington either. This is one of the top programs in the country!

Vanzagger
08-09-2012, 02:00 PM
the type of season we will ultimately need to open that Cali pipeline may also mean one or two of are guys leaving early.

Kate and Edith

CDC84
08-09-2012, 02:15 PM
There is plenty of playing time available at shooting guard/small forward (for 2012/13) for at least one top flight prospect when you consider that Dranginis will be splitting his time between the 3 perimeter positions.

I hope that Karnowski isn't a one and done player. Then again, if he is, the team this year will be truly outstanding. But if he turns into that kind of player, GU really needs a non-redshirt candidate type big guy. I think Okonoboh is turning into an important recruit. He would be a nice addition to the 2012/13 roster. Plus he's a back end top 100 guy from back east. Getting him might open up some recruiting connections in the future. I am always in favor of recruiting outside your territory on occasion. It can pay off down the line.

cjm720
08-09-2012, 02:34 PM
I still don't see any player that Gonzaga is recruiting in this class who is a Gary Bell-type can't miss prospect. They need one. With all the great talent out west, it's disappointing to me that GU can't pick off a can't misser, and then complement that guy with players like Johnson and Okonoboh.

Per Scout.com: Gary Bell was a 70; Darrin J is 83 and Oko is 97. Love Gary, but the difference between those rankings is conjecture other than they are known ballers.

Again, love Gary and his game and wouldn't trade him for a lot of players out there, but the staff's doing exactly what you would expect.

cjm720
08-09-2012, 02:36 PM
I think Okonoboh is turning into an important recruit. He would be a nice addition to the 2012/13 roster.

I agree he'd be a nice addition, but NOT A CHANCE. SORRY!

CDC84
08-09-2012, 03:59 PM
I agree he'd be a nice addition, but NOT A CHANCE. SORRY!

You never know with the Coleman connection. Never say never :)


Per Scout.com: Gary Bell was a 70; Darrin J is 83 and Oko is 97. Love Gary, but the difference between those rankings is conjecture other than they are known ballers.

Gary was a can't miss, high major prospect who was wanted by UCLA, UW and others for at least three years. He was Mr. Basketball in the state of WA and was a universal top 100 player with all the services. He also played on a top of the line AAU team, which probably prevented him from being ranked higher. He was never going to huck up as many shots as Tony Wroten. GBJ had a longstanding reputation. I knew he would be great, and predicted on this board that he would be a starter within a few games.

Johnson still isn't even ranked by most recruiting services, although that could change. He's more of a late bloomer, which is great, but he just doesn't inspire the same level of confidence in me. I just don't have the same level of confidence at this point with him as I did with Gary. With GBJ you just knew.

BroncoZAG615
08-09-2012, 04:41 PM
I agree he'd be a nice addition, but NOT A CHANCE. SORRY!

Curious why you say that. Just because he's out East or do you have other knowledge.

Also, the folks that say none of these prospects are must haves will be very surprised when they see Jordan Mathews play in college.

bigblahla
08-09-2012, 04:56 PM
Curious why you say that. Just because he's out East or do you have other knowledge.

Also, the folks that say none of these prospects are must haves will be very surprised when they see Jordan Mathews play in college.

I think the addition of Mathews and Okonoboh to what we have and what is coming would put us in the land of the elite.

Is Chris Griffin really a serious prospect?

Love the info on SSF, thanks.

Go!! Zags!!!

Martin Centre Mad Man
08-09-2012, 05:46 PM
I always take the recruiting rankings with a grain of salt.

When you recruit from outside the Rivals Top 100 list, you find nothing but leftovers like John Stockton, Frank Burgess, John Rillie, Ronny Turiaf, Casey Calvary, Cory Violette, Elias Harris, Kevin Pangos, Dan Dickau, Richie Frahm, Derek Raivio, Adam Morrison...

cggonzaga
08-09-2012, 06:02 PM
Matthews would add incredible depth to the backcourt in 2013!

Looks like McLaughlin and Pope will be AA in 2014. What a coup that would be!!!

bigblahla
08-09-2012, 06:21 PM
Chris Griffin info while at Murray State.

http://goracers.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2317&path=mbball

Go!! Zags!!!

hondo
08-09-2012, 07:05 PM
We can inspect, bisect, dissect the recruiting lists all we want and never know for sure how this group or that group will work together until they have been together a while. Vertical leap. lateral quickness, number of stars after their name all have some meaning but give me 7 or 8 guys who just flat out refuse to lose and we'll win a bunch. A lot of it is chemistry, some of it is guys who have never gotten recognition and have this huge chip on the shoulder. Sometimes it's a psychopathic desire to dominate but many of these factors never show up in the recruiting publications. I've seen a lot of very talented studs get their arses kicked by a bunch a nobodys who just wanted it more. Projecting out 2 or 3 years who is going to want it more 30 some game a year is pretty hard. Sometimes you just get lucky and end up with guys who won't let you lose.

sittingon50
08-09-2012, 07:14 PM
sake, who says a kid coming in would have to sit? Without putting on your 20/20 hindsight glasses, would you have predicted that an incumbent starter from the previous year would be pretty much relegated to mop up minutes last year? We've had any # of guys drop out of sight before, who's to say some confident, talented kid couldn't come in and unseat a current starter?

OZZY
08-09-2012, 07:25 PM
I am in the camp that says that I trust that the staff know what they want better than the "average" poster on this board (myself included). I am thinking that Edwards may be a lot more than most believe......

There are often comments regarding California guys.....I am probably ignorant to some of the lure being so far away and focussing mostly on Canadian players myself.

It would be interesting to see in the last 5 years or so how many "California" guys have helped teams make it to FFs.......I had a look at last year, and only Kansas's Jeff Withey seemed to have made an real impact.

Oregon's Terrance Jones and Washington State's Payton Siva probably had as much if not more impact than Withey in the final four.

cjm720
08-10-2012, 06:24 AM
Curious why you say that. Just because he's out East or do you have other knowledge.

Also, the folks that say none of these prospects are must haves will be very surprised when they see Jordan Mathews play in college.

Simply because he's back east and also not listing us. I think those factors far outweigh having a friend soon to be a Zag. Unless, of course, they made a blood brother oath :)

cjm720
08-10-2012, 06:29 AM
Gary was a can't miss, high major prospect who was wanted by UCLA, UW and others for at least three years. He was Mr. Basketball in the state of WA and was a universal top 100 player with all the services. He also played on a top of the line AAU team, which probably prevented him from being ranked higher. He was never going to huck up as many shots as Tony Wroten. GBJ had a longstanding reputation. I knew he would be great, and predicted on this board that he would be a starter within a few games.

Johnson still isn't even ranked by most recruiting services, although that could change. He's more of a late bloomer, which is great, but he just doesn't inspire the same level of confidence in me. I just don't have the same level of confidence at this point with him as I did with Gary. With GBJ you just knew.

I'm definitely not disputing Gary's prowess. We've only seen the surface of his ability. I too predicted him as a starter, but was off by one game :)

I guess all what I'm trying to stress is twofold: 1) rankings don't mean that much unless you're talking elite players; and 2) just because we don't get a highly ranked kid it doesn't mean that the program's going to fall flat on its face. Especially true in light of having a solid starting 5 for the next two years.

ZagsObserver
08-10-2012, 06:37 AM
The new bodies Gonzaga is bringing in, with the exception of Coleman obviously, could end up as high major players but they were low to mid level recruits. Hard to debate otherwise to be honest...as much as I would like to.

BroncoZAG615
08-10-2012, 07:24 AM
Simply because he's back east and also not listing us. I think those factors far outweigh having a friend soon to be a Zag. Unless, of course, they made a blood brother oath :)

As stated many places, Rivals and Scout are far from infallible

http://fivestarbasketball.com/commitment-corner/05-31-2012-goodluck-okonoboh-prized-target-1

cjm720
08-10-2012, 08:21 AM
As stated many places, Rivals and Scout are far from infallible

http://fivestarbasketball.com/commitment-corner/05-31-2012-goodluck-okonoboh-prized-target-1

Thanks for the link...hope, there is. Kid can flat out get up!

DADoZAG
08-10-2012, 08:46 AM
We can inspect, bisect, dissect the recruiting lists all we want and never know for sure how this group or that group will work together until they have been together a while. Vertical leap. lateral quickness, number of stars after their name all have some meaning but give me 7 or 8 guys who just flat out refuse to lose and we'll win a bunch. A lot of it is chemistry, some of it is guys who have never gotten recognition and have this huge chip on the shoulder. Sometimes it's a psychopathic desire to dominate but many of these factors never show up in the recruiting publications. I've seen a lot of very talented studs get their arses kicked by a bunch a nobodys who just wanted it more. Projecting out 2 or 3 years who is going to want it more 30 some game a year is pretty hard. Sometimes you just get lucky and end up with guys who won't let you lose.

There is no doubt that having that inner drive CAN surpass any athletic gift, and a team full of “gifted” players, without that inner drive, will often times fall short. I take your point to be that some of this board’s confusion when it comes to ZAG recruiting is because they neglect to take this into account, when staff obviously DOES take it into account. True dat...

That said, I will argue that the “inner drive”, part of what I call the upper half of the glass, CAN be seen in advance, at least to some extent.

When astrophysicists want to find a black hole in space, they look for the evidence of the black hole because the hole itself is not visible. The same is true in Humankind, I believe, and those intangibles that provide evidence of the inner drive or “IT”, as this board has so deemed, CAN be seen in advance.

The trick is in knowing what evidence to look for, and you're right, it's not going to be in the recruiting report.

Luck is for bounces and comes through preparation more than anything else. Recruiting, IMO, is a science.

Go ZAGS!

Vanzagger
08-10-2012, 09:48 AM
sake, who says a kid coming in would have to sit? Without putting on your 20/20 hindsight glasses, would you have predicted that an incumbent starter from the previous year would be pretty much relegated to mop up minutes last year? We've had any # of guys drop out of sight before, who's to say some confident, talented kid couldn't come in and unseat a current starter?

which would be convenient because at GU Boards, it's always about next year.

Vanzagger
08-10-2012, 10:17 AM
I am in the camp that says that I trust that the staff know what they want better than the "average" poster on this board (myself included). I am thinking that Edwards may be a lot more than most believe......

There are often comments regarding California guys.....I am probably ignorant to some of the lure being so far away and focussing mostly on Canadian players myself.

It would be interesting to see in the last 5 years or so how many "California" guys have helped teams make it to FFs.......I had a look at last year, and only Kansas's Jeff Withey seemed to have made an real impact.

Oregon's Terrance Jones and Washington State's Payton Siva probably had as much if not more impact than Withey in the final four.

Major love to the Canadian guys. PMAC won us some major games that people seem to forget because he wasn't a scoring pg.

There seems to have been a year where the Pac 12(10) had several under classmen enter the NBA draft. Let's just consider Kevin Love a California kid. He was in the Beach Boys.

It makes sense to me that GU having a big time bball program should be pulling just as many kids out of Cali as UofA and UCLA.

Morrison and the KC got us Daye.

bigblahla
08-11-2012, 06:16 AM
Tweet on SSF says GU looking at former Ole Miss player Jamal Jones. The following was posted on an Ole Miss site about Jones.

A 6-foot-1 point guard when he began high school, Jones has grown and developed into a 6-foot-8, 186-pound wing who still has a point guard’s handle and floor vision. A senior at Searcy High School in Searcy, Ark., Jones averaged 16.4 points, seven rebounds, two assists and two steals last season. He is a two-time all-conference selection under coach Jimmy Summers and is rated a 3-star prospect by Rivals.com. He chose Ole Miss over Arkansas State and Iowa State. He played for Team Arkansas in AAU ball.

“Jamal is as talented athletically as anyone we’ve brought on this campus,” Kennedy said. “At 6-8 he brings great size to our perimeter. His upside is off the charts!”

Jones was shown the door at Ole Miss for a "Herb" infraction, zero tolerance in Oxford.

Griffin and Jones both from the southeast US. I don't know much about either player but I like the fact we are recruiting the southeast.

Go!! Zags!!!