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gu03alum
02-22-2012, 12:16 PM
I have really soured on ESPN the last few years and the Chink in the armour title for a knick's loss was the straw that broke the camel's back. I haven't been to the site since then. I'm not totally free as my long time fantasy baseball league is hosted there. I hope that we can change it for next year.

Other things that ESPN has done that bothered me was with the reporting of Mike Leach and allowing Craig James, whose son was accusing Leach, to control the direction of the story. Bruce Feldman was let go from ESPN for helping Leach write a book even though he had ESPN's approval. Peter Pascarelli was taken off of the Baseball Today podcast for making a joke about a Bud Selig statue. ESPN held onto evidence about Syracuse's assistant basketball coach molesting ball boys. ESPN created Mel Kiper and Dickie V. ESPN appears to be behind all of the conference realignment. ESPN is by far the most expensive cable channel is partially to blame for consumers not being able to pick and choose exactly what channels they want to watch.

04ZagFan
02-22-2012, 07:52 PM
Welcome to the world we live in, my friend.

asoc
02-22-2012, 08:52 PM
I hope NBCSN takes off and can actually compete with ESPN to some degree.

ESPN is like your favorite biased cable news station. Pick whichever one you want. ESPN has its own agenda. And at some point sports needs to be about sport, not about money and entertainment. ESPN is a bad influence. I am sure if they had their way it would be no different than the WWE. Just entertainment.
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Are you upset because of the way ESPN handled the Chink in the Armor situation or upset at the comment itself and that they let it slip by?

Quite honestly, I can believe it was an honest mistake.
But ESPN should have a system of checks for all their content, even their web and mobile content.

I think with Max Bretos they had no reason to suspend him 30 days. He used the term on air. It is a common phrase.

They fired the headline writer for using it. I think they fired him because they needed to save face. Who was overseeing him?

I thought the guys on the Dan Patrick show had a nice discussion on that aspect of the situation. Maybe they have a bit of an axe to grind, but what they were saying seems to be true. ESPN controls every aspect of their product. How did they let this slip by? That 28 year old headline writer, writing a headline at 2:30 in the morning, shouldn't be the only person who sees it before it goes live.

webspinnre
02-22-2012, 09:28 PM
Frankly, I could easily see this happening by accident. I've used the phrase on occasion, and never would've thought to associate it with the derogatory term until this came up. It sounds like it may not have been an accident, which isn't cool, but I could see it happening pretty easily if it had been.

asoc
03-26-2012, 11:12 PM
Soooo. Was reading some discussion on another forum that started because of an incident at the most recent Sounders home game against the Houston Dynamo. One of their players called a ball boy a gay slur because he didn't give the ball to him properly when he was trying to do a quick throw in. The kid did purposefully roll the ball to him.

Anyways... The discussion I was reading got side tracked ab it. It had basically turned into bigotry in sports in general and also specifically about American Indian mascots and team names. It made me think of this.

ESPN cared so much about this "Chink in the armor" incident that they fired the guy. Yet they have no issue with the racist names and imagery of the Washington Redskins and the Cleveland Indians and Atlanta Braves.

gu03alum, If you see this post, you were very upset with ESPN over allowing that Chink in the armor headline go out. How do you feel about supporting MLB which allows their teams to be overtly racist in their name/imagery?

gu03alum
03-27-2012, 04:27 AM
Redskins and Indians are pretty bad. I don't have a problem with it if it is done with respect and with class. Chief Wahoo as a logo is pretty awful. Using a racial slur as your team name is pretty awful also. I'm not sure how those two teams continue to get away with it. I've always thought the Braves logo and name was pretty cool and I think if I was Native American I would be OK with them. I'm not sure how people feel about the Tomahawk Chop though. It seems a little derogatory to me so I think they should probably stop with that too.

I've always liked Notre Dame because I am half Irish. I used to wear a Notre Dame jacket that said Irish on the back. It does not bother me that they use it, but it would if they used it in a way that was demeaning or distatesful like Cleveland and Washington.

With all that said, I'm not sure what ESPN's role should be with this stuff. They could put pressure on the teams by doing an Outside the Lines report, but I'm not sure there is much else they can or should do. It's up to MLB and the NFL to force change in my opinion, just like it was up to ESPN to take action with the Chink in the Armour headline.

04ZagFan
03-27-2012, 12:00 PM
How do you figure "Indians" is racist...? Seriously? How soft are we?

GoZags
03-27-2012, 12:36 PM
How do you figure "Indians" is racist...? Seriously? How soft are we?

I don't know.

Would you support a team called the Atlanta Negros?

How about the Kansas City Caucasions?

Don't you think it's pretty cool when an Atlanta Brave hits a home run and Chief Knock-a-homa comes out of the tent and does a war dance? Almost as cool as if an Atlanta Negro would hit a home run and the "mascot" would come out and do a tap dance.

Just my opinion, but I don't think "soft" has anything to do with it.

former1dog
03-27-2012, 12:48 PM
I don't know.

Would you support a team called the Atlanta Negros?

How about the Kansas City Caucasions?

Don't you think it's pretty cool when an Atlanta Brave hits a home run and Chief Knock-a-homa comes out of the tent and does a war dance? Almost as cool as if an Atlanta Negro would hit a home run and the "mascot" would come out and do a tap dance.

Just my opinion, but I don't think "soft" has anything to do with it.

I grew up on a reservation (I'm not Native American, but all my friends were) and our High School team name was "The Indians".... All of my friends to this day are very proud of that, even the ones who are activists for Native American causes. There are quite a few of them, including one who went to Gonzaga.

Here's the logo:

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/3131/39294logo.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/10/39294logo.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

webspinnre
03-27-2012, 01:35 PM
For what it's worth, the local Catholic school are the Braves, and recently redid their entire mascot and approach. I was in the booth for the game this was first done in public.

http://napavalleyregister.com/news/local/justin-siena-unveils-new-braves-logo/article_028ceef6-fa13-11e0-8e34-001cc4c03286.html?mode=story

The Spokane Indians, the minor league baseball team, also worked closely with the local tribe to redo their logo.

gu03alum
03-27-2012, 02:13 PM
How do you figure "Indians" is racist...? Seriously? How soft are we?

Imo it has more to do with the chief wahoo logo.

Zag 77
03-28-2012, 01:46 PM
From Fox. A new sports channel.

http://bottomline.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/28/10907751-fox-reportedly-starting-channel-to-rival-espn

sittingon50
03-28-2012, 05:07 PM
Will it also be fair & balanced?

04ZagFan
03-28-2012, 09:22 PM
I don't know.

Would you support a team called the Atlanta Negros?

How about the Kansas City Caucasions?

Don't you think it's pretty cool when an Atlanta Brave hits a home run and Chief Knock-a-homa comes out of the tent and does a war dance? Almost as cool as if an Atlanta Negro would hit a home run and the "mascot" would come out and do a tap dance.

Just my opinion, but I don't think "soft" has anything to do with it.

Give me a break.

Why is "Indian" a derogatory term? LOL don't we have more important things to worry about?

Call em the Kansas City Crackers for all I care. People need to stop being so easily offended.

Zag 77
03-29-2012, 09:50 AM
I am amused when some of the loudest complaints about Native American/Indian nicknames comes from caucasians. Indians themselves seem to be a lot less worked up about being PC. Not universally, but the majority seem to be that way.

Examples of Indian mascots that are OK with their respective tribes:

FL St Seminoles
Illinois Fighting Illini

North Central HS Indians (Spokane)
Reardan HS Indians
Wellpinit HS Indians

Spokane Indians Baseball
Spokane Chiefs Hockey

Granted, some of the tribes have asked that some of the caricatures be cleaned up.

I would tend to take complaints about mascots being offensive if it comes from the applicable tribe itself.

I don't even think that MOST Indians are particularly worked up about the Atlanta Braves, Cleveland Indians or Washington Redskins.

webspinnre
03-29-2012, 10:25 AM
I definitely agree that the caricatures and mascots can be an issue, and it's been great that in general teams have worked with the local tribes to resolve those issues.

04ZagFan
03-29-2012, 11:25 AM
Zag 77 I totally agree... It seems to be white people complaining..

I know that franchises and schools with Indian or Indian related mascots take great pride in there team names.

I don't see a lot of outrage from the tribes themselves, correct me if I'm wrong.

gu03alum
05-02-2012, 05:01 PM
From Deadspin, an article about ESPN writer Sarah Philips (http://deadspin.com/5906658/is-an-espn-columnist-scamming-people-on-the-internet). Apparently she was using her connections with ESPN to trick people into trusting her. One guy gave up administrator rights to his successful Facebook page (https://www.facebook.com/NBAMemes). Another guy gave her cash for a website they were going to start together. She also used multiple pictures that she found online for her profile pics on ESPN and Covers. It is a very interesting read and it's incredible that ESPN hired her without really making sure she was legit.

follow-up articles on Deadspin:

more scams (http://deadspin.com/sarah-phillips/)

Weird tweets after article ran from Sarah (http://deadspin.com/sarah-phillips/)

Another scam story from the Nilsen Report (http://nilsenreport.ca/2012/05/01/former-espn-columnist-sarah-phillips-exposed/)

real pictures of Sarah Philips (http://www.thesportsbrewery.com/xyz/jfp/just-who-is-sarah-phillips-i-dont-know-maybe-just-an-ex-baller-from-sheldon-high-school)

Sarah and Nilesh's relationship (http://deadspin.com/5907081/sources-sarah-phillips-and-nilesh-prasad-picked-games-together-scammed-people-together-got-fired-from-t+mobile-together)

Guy found where she lived and took video of her residence in Oregon (https://twitter.com/#!/raymcguinness/status/197544566084222977)

guy took picture of her residence (https://twitter.com/#!/raymcguinness/status/197542736390389760/photo/1)

asoc
05-03-2012, 05:02 AM
Zag 77 I totally agree... It seems to be white people complaining..

I know that franchises and schools with Indian or Indian related mascots take great pride in there team names.

I don't see a lot of outrage from the tribes themselves, correct me if I'm wrong.

The conversation that got me thinking about this originally was started by an Indian.

zag944
05-03-2012, 10:29 AM
Theyve lacked an interesting an unique voice on their website ever since Bill Simmons has gotten bored. I still go there for news, but theirs no one that is fun to read.

Their tv is the best for college basketball in my opinion. I also follow the NBA and NFL pretty closely, and I think their competitors do a much better job overall.

gu03alum
05-05-2012, 10:00 AM
Deadspin has another post (http://deadspin.com/5907349/meet-nilesh-prasad-sarah-phillipss-scamming-partner-and-supposed-puppetmaster-%5Bupdate%5D?tag=sarah-phillips) about Phillips and Nilesh and pictures of Nilesh with Phillips.

http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/17li0olqf32bhjpg/medium.jpg