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GUnawinit
02-05-2012, 12:04 AM
I posted earlier my thoughts on our big, Rob! I'm not sure how all felt on the topic, but some agreed Scare isn't the answer.

In my opinion with Bell and Pangos we can win it all (in the future) with a nice big!

You got'ta get more production form the middle, but Mark and company keeps recruiting nice PG's.

Running off guys like (McDonald All American's like Villarino). I just don't get it!

It's just my opinion, we need players of lenght and can score. guys like Austin Daye.

Doesn't it bother you to hope every year to see OUR team get beat in the 1st round?

We now we can make the tourney, can't we feel confident at some point it doesn't need to be magic?

Let's put players on the court (Thru recruiting) that allows us to be more than that!

We have the key pieces (Bell, Pangos, Spangler, Dower), lets get a big that seals the deal. Remember the kid from Illinous(SP), that can score from inside and out! Why can't we recruit a young man like that???

I love love one NFL team that keeps me hanging every year, just as the Zags.

The program is beyond, the glass slipper, Butler proved that point!

Do we want the program to just compete or truly contend? Geez, St Mary's has caught up just in 2-3 years.

It's heart breaking to me too know GU is just a contender, the magic slipper is gone, the nation sees it, the mystic is gone....

Heck, Murray State at last glance is unbeaten....great game coming up with St. Mary's

What I'm trying to say here is, don't tease us as fans...don't have aprogram that says "we can win it" when in actuality we're just average!

Recruit good kids yes, but kids that allow us to win it all.

IS D. Stockton that kid, nope a legacy yes..but creates me heartburn all the same.

I love GU basketball, but winning "In my mind" is what it boils down too!

We can't have the program that lives in our past success, that has past long ago!

DCZag
02-05-2012, 03:51 AM
GU, man a dose of perspective; Villarino wasn't an all-american and he's really tearing it up at Appalachian State - NOT. Butler is sucking this year, staying good ain't easy; and it took SMC 11 years to catch up, not just the last 2.
Am I pleased with how we played in our 4 losses, no. Heck I'm not pleased with how we played in a good portion of our wins, but the sky ain't fallin'. We have a program that produces consistent excellence, it's a process. I'd rather win every year than make it to the FF once and drop off the map for the next 10 years.

Stache
02-05-2012, 06:12 AM
So recruit the best players in the country? Get the very best talent? Hmmmm, hadn't thought of that. ;)

willandi
02-05-2012, 06:28 AM
Ncaa should change the way recruits get selected by schools and how they select schools. It should be a mix of NFL, NBA and MLB. The worst teams get to pick first, there's a lottery to determine further order and if you don't want to go to the school, don't sign the LOI and sit out for a year, then try again. Maybe that way we could get a player that would normally go to Kentucky, Florida or that powerhouse Toledo!

What a stupid concept!

Booster
02-05-2012, 06:47 AM
I don't post often, but certainly an active reader and more importantly, closely linked to the program for the past 30 years.

GU ... easy big fella. Read up on some of the facts of what is arguably one of the most successful programs of all time. Fact. Most of us realize, though often don't convey, that success comes in far many forms than just wins. If you succumb to most every other program in the NCAA's, then sure, you're just looking for the wins. GU is so far beyond that. Get to know a few folks within the program and across the administration and you'll realize that the mission of the basketball program, in addition to wanting to win conference titles and national championships, is about driving the mission of the University; about being a Zag.

The fact of the matter is that we are not "just average", SMC has "not caught up in just 2-3 years", and "winning is not what it boils down to". For starters, we've made 13 consecutive NCAA appearances to SMC's 0. Sure, they've got a terrific program, but call back in about another 10 years to see how they've progressed. There is more pride, courage, and commitment in this GU program than most any other. It's about a commitment to doing the right thing, always. To those who define the opportunity in only wins are missing the point.

kclubfounder
02-05-2012, 06:56 AM
When I read the OP early this morning I was sort of hoping it would go ignored. I figured it was so silly I wouldn't dignify it with a response.

However, since the seal has been broken, I would like to nominate this as the OP "Turkey of the Year".

zag67
02-05-2012, 06:59 AM
Gunaw, 18 - 4 is NOT average. I think that if you check that percentage would be in the top 5 - 10 percent of ALL D-1 colleges.

Are we playing great? NO. Are we hustling and even in our losses putting out effort? YES. We had one blow out, lost to two big ten teams by 7 (without our complete team), and lost to BYU on the road by 10 (shooting 3 for 19 from the three and having way too many turnovers). Are we young? yes. Are they learning? YES. Do our bigs make some major errors? Yes, but it is not from not trying, in most cases they try and do too much because of a previous screw up.

Did you look at Sacre's hand? Oh they had to bandage it. Maybe he is not 100 percent. But you have to agree, he gives 100 percent with what he has. I (maybe alone) believe that he will be drafted into the NBA and will be there for many years. He has the hustle and fight that is needed to be a good backup center.

As far as Villarino, he was a ME first type point guard and in most ways, I was not sad to see him go. I am not sure he would have liked it this year, because I am not sure he would have been starting (let alone playing). And also as far as Daye is concerned, yes it would have been nice to have a player like him for four years. But in reality, he did not contribute as much as he should have. He was still learning and I think he wishes he stayed at least one more year to improve (but he did not).

Do we need a new big for next year? Yes, but do not expect him to come in and be a contributor in his first year. Only about 3 to 10 bigs IN THE NATION are able to come in and contribute in the first 2 years. It takes time to mature, get use to the speed of D-1 and contribute against players as big as them. Also most of them will not be players coming out of high school because they do not practice or play against people as big and fast as they are.

There is not another mid major that has performed at the level we have for the length of time we have. We just keep winning, like the energizer bunny just keeps running. Will we win the conference this year, maybe not, but it has been a great run and may go longer. Are we putting a competitive team on the court? Yes. Do they play at a high level? yes, but maybe not as high as we would like.

I really like the composition of this team and look forward to the rest of this year and into the future (even if we do not get another big for another year).
Go Zags. Have fun and see you at the dance.

GoZags
02-05-2012, 07:55 AM
Appreciate the passion -- but I have a few questions/comments on your "thoughts".


I posted earlier my thoughts on our big, Rob! I'm not sure how all felt on the topic, but some agreed Scare isn't the answer.

In my opinion with Bell and Pangos we can win it all (in the future) with a nice big! Agree -- those two guys are special -- and there's a very high ceiling for the Zags with those two kids anchoring the backcourt.

You got'ta get more production form the middle, but Mark and company keeps recruiting nice PG's. Huh? I don't think Karnowski is a PG.

Running off guys like (McDonald All American's like Villarino). I just don't get it! Huh? GJ wasn't a McDonald All American. He wasn't a team player. He's had over 1 1/2 seasons at Appalacian State (including his redshirt year) and hasn't done a thing.

It's just my opinion, we need players of lenght and can score. guys like Austin Daye. Yes -- Gonzaga's highest rated recruit ever was a good player with length and skills -- and although he WAS maturing a bit -- GU didn't reaps the benefits of all Austin could have offered.

Doesn't it bother you to hope every year to see OUR team get beat in the 1st round? Huh? Were you a math major? GU has been beaten in the first round 3 X during the current 13 year (and counting) NCAA tourney streak. That's less than once every four appearances. That's a little different than "every" year.

We now we can make the tourney, can't we feel confident at some point it doesn't need to be magic? Huh?

Let's put players on the court (Thru recruiting) that allows us to be more than that! Good idea.

We have the key pieces (Bell, Pangos, Spangler, Dower), lets get a big that seals the deal. Remember the kid from Illinous(SP), that can score from inside and out! Why can't we recruit a young man like that??? I think you'll like a combination of Kelly, Sam, Ryan and Karnowski.

I love love one NFL team that keeps me hanging every year, just as the Zags. Huh?

The program is beyond, the glass slipper, Butler proved that point! Huh?

Do we want the program to just compete or truly contend? Geez, St Mary's has caught up just in 2-3 years. (See -- were you a math major? Have difficulty counting?)

It's heart breaking to me too know GU is just a contender, the magic slipper is gone, the nation sees it, the mystic is gone.... Huh?

Heck, Murray State at last glance is unbeaten....great game coming up with St. Mary's Huh? I think there are a few teams (including GU) that would be undefeated if they played the 269th most difficult schedule in NCAA D1. That's the reason 18-4 Gonzaga's RPI is 25, and undefeated Murray State's RPI is 38.

What I'm trying to say here is, don't tease us as fans...don't have aprogram that says "we can win it" when in actuality we're just average! Huh?

Recruit good kids yes, but kids that allow us to win it all. Huh?

IS D. Stockton that kid, nope a legacy yes..but creates me heartburn all the same. Huh?

I love GU basketball, but winning "In my mind" is what it boils down too! Too bad the Zags have disappointed you.

We can't have the program that lives in our past success, that has past long ago! Huh?

Angelo Roncalli
02-05-2012, 08:18 AM
GJ Vilarino? Really? Please.

This season he's played in 19 of Appalachian State's 22 games, starting 5 games (but none recently).

He's averaging 3.4 points a game. But he puts in a lot of effort to get those three points as he's shooting .347 from the field and .125 on threes (2/16). His best percentage is at the free throw line: .467 (14/30). 33 assists to 31 turnovers.

jazzdelmar
02-05-2012, 09:15 AM
GJ Vilarino? Really? Please.

This season he's played in 19 of Appalachian State's 22 games, starting 5 games (but none recently).

He's averaging 3.4 points a game. But he puts in a lot of effort to get those three points as he's shooting .347 from the field and .125 on threes (2/16). His best percentage is at the free throw line: .467 (14/30). 33 assists to 31 turnovers.


schadenfreude, pontiff? kidding. i didnt know he was that awful. those are sub meech numbers. gibbs is doing better, i think. kids get overrecruited, thts the message.

Angelo Roncalli
02-05-2012, 09:21 AM
schadenfreude, pontiff? kidding. i didnt know he was that awful. those are sub meech numbers. gibbs is doing better, i think. kids get overrecruited, thts the message.

No Schadenfreude. GU had a left over scholarship and need. The kid is an incredible athlete. GU gave it a shot. It was pretty clear from early on that it wasn't going to work.

DixieZag
02-05-2012, 09:44 AM
Bwahahhahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

Funny, funny, funny Post.

Agree with Angelo.

If you want a great big man who plays outside in for the next two years, I think there is one, can't think of his name, I actually think I saw him recently, he had a bow tie on and he HAS to have some interest in us b/c he was on our BENCH. If he was playing HS ball in California or Wyoming, he would be a four-five star.

Oh God, the HUMANITY - LETS give up men's BB and go ALL IN in men's Water Polo, or even better, men's surfing. Because I don't know why Few hates 5 star kids also. He must hate Bell.

TacomaZAG
02-05-2012, 09:55 AM
Not really sure what to say, except that you just don't get it. Previous poster's have tried to enlighten you and, hopefully, you start to get it now. ZAG basketball is about more than wins, about more than living up to someone's misguided expectations regarding 18-22 year old young men.

The comment that shows me just how far away you are from "getting it", is the one about SMC having caught the ZAGS in 2-3 years. Sure, they currently have a better overall and conference record than the ZAGS, but stretch yourself a little and look back over the last decade and beyond, then look yourself in the mirror and try to say that again without laughing.

What the ZAGS have built over the last decade and beyond has yet to be approached, let alone duplicated. Maybe the streak(s) end this year, maybe not. Regardless, the ZAGS aren't going away. The future continues to be bright, along with the present.

Hop aboard, it's a great ride.............

Go ZAGS

willandi
02-05-2012, 10:04 AM
Bwahahhahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

Funny, funny, funny Post.

Agree with Angelo.

If you want a great big man who plays outside in for the next two years, I think there is one, can't think of his name, I actually think I saw him recently, he had a bow tie on and he HAS to have some interest in us b/c he was on our BENCH. If he was playing HS ball in California or Wyoming, he would be a four-five star.

Oh God, the HUMANITY - LETS give up men's BB and go ALL IN in men's Water Polo, or even better, men's surfing. Because I don't know why Few hates 5 star kids also. He must hate Bell.

Totally agree. I was thinking that Gonzaga should give up Men's B'Ball, it stresses the masses too much! I do think that if we added men's snow surfing, we, along with BYU, would certainly be considered the favorites, after all, we at least get snow!

Vanzagger
02-05-2012, 10:52 AM
if you walk into a poker room, most people these days no how to play solid hold'em. The thing is only 15% of the people you are looking at make any money long term.

Our problem the Final Four is the "Final Table" and Few looks like dead money. Why in the hell did he think Kentucky's new coach did not want GJ?

Go ahead Tom Hudson, Toby????, ESPN announcers, keep encouraging Few when he puts out a "kiddie" line up which he loves to do. Dead $

Look at Stockton's +/- the last 2 games. We have the talent and the length this year. What a waste. Oh well, we can tell bad beat stories and talk about next year.

Hey, even if you guys are satisfied with being lumped into the 85% of losing players who pay the house and then some, it's still fun and you will still win some hands. I promise to try harder to stop raining on your parade. Winning 80% of the time is not even possible in poker:clap:

810Suited
02-05-2012, 10:57 AM
the list of studly bigs that have tried to commit to Gonzaga that Few has said no thanks to is soooo long.

wish we had gj back kid would definitely be playing over pangos.

:1bestever:

willandi
02-05-2012, 11:07 AM
the list of studly bigs that have tried to commit to Gonzaga that Few has said no thanks to is soooo long.

wish we had gj back kid would definitely be playing over pangos.

:1bestever:

Sources on the bigs statement?
Wrong about GJ. He wouldn't be starting over Stocks, Pangos, Bell, Carter, Drangs, Sarbaugh etc. He would be getting les and less pt. His stats from this year show it.
Please look these things up before you make an emotional commitment to them. It will help you to stop looking foolish and/or ignorant.

Bocco
02-05-2012, 11:28 AM
the list of studly bigs that have tried to commit to Gonzaga that Few has said no thanks to is soooo long.

wish we had gj back kid would definitely be playing over pangos.

:1bestever:


Sources on the bigs statement?
Wrong about GJ. He wouldn't be starting over Stocks, Pangos, Bell, Carter, Drangs, Sarbaugh etc. He would be getting les and less pt. His stats from this year show it.
Please look these things up before you make an emotional commitment to them. It will help you to stop looking foolish and/or ignorant.

willandi, I think you missed 810's sarcasm smilie ...

Baldwinzag
02-05-2012, 12:33 PM
"Alas, how quickly the gratitude owed to the dead flows off, how quick to be proved a deceiver."

-- Sophocles

willandi
02-05-2012, 12:41 PM
willandi, I think you missed 810's sarcasm smilie ...

I must have. If so, apologies extended. If not...

Oregonzagnut
02-05-2012, 03:08 PM
I disagree the OP in most ways but GUnawin sentiment is correct. But it is like preaching to a choir.

IMO, it is not about recruiting right now, its the CONTENTENT in our program. From staff to fans and everywhere in between we are content and happy. Many members here habitually police to make sure no one vocally asks for more because it implies they are not happy and are hurting team spirit. For me it is about no matter how good or rich or happy you are today, you should always do your best to get better. It is an ironic paradox fans of Gonzaga are in, we want to win a N.C. but we don't want to change anything and to want it is not being a Zag or not a true fan. I wish I could talk to Few to see if he feels he is done learning, growing and changing for the better as a coach. I think I know the answer. TAnd that is all I want for him and for every other student at Gonzaga. TO REACH THEIR POTENTIAL. But I continually see potential lost and it isn't due to luck or a better opponent, it is our own heads and changing up before the game is over. We count our chickens.........

Our program clearly wants to get better but I see one very deep problem. Our program lacks clear defined goals and it lacks urgency in reaching those goals.

On the court, and in spite of what the media and fans want to believe, we are a horrible transition team. Our heads are way ahead of where our teammates are!! Haste is causing too many TO's, missed dunks, layups. It also affecting our FT's.

THIS MUST STOP!! 40 minutes of solid fundamental basketball! Period. If you give the horse its head, it will not win the race. Every jockey knows this. So why does Few let our guys continually blow a 10+ point leads because they start to "run and gun"! We get so sloppy the commentators routinely notice and tell the truth right on TV? When we stick to working the ball inside and defense oriented ball and we consistently get ahead by 10. then we go to run and gun and we blow it with sloppy play.

Stricter adherence to fundamentals, no letting up on our opponent or on our own game plan, and less micromanaging the rotation and using bench time as punishment.

This is just my opinion folks! Go ahead, the 2 admins that like to secretly give negative feedback can do so. But Few needs to figure out how to get us to the final four! Not let St Marys do it first. Few has to change his development of recruits. It is not the recruits we bring in.

DixieZag
02-05-2012, 04:19 PM
Leave it to Oregon to one up an already dumb post:

Oregon - I am pretty sure that the team has clearly defined goals: Starting with each game they suit up. Going undefeated, which would be the fulfillment of this simple goal would be "pretty good", huh? No one on this board would love it more than the people who have been on so long that they are mods or "mind controlers" or whatever.

Some of us remember life before Few (and Monson): I was there in 1989 - I think we had about 8 wins, and our redshirts (all 5) were regularly beating our starters in practice.

That doesn't mean that we are perfectly satisfied and don't want to do better. Many of us write posts with thoughts on how we think they could do better.

That does not mean that any common sense person doesn't believe that the person who would love most to win the FF or the Conference or whatever is Coach Few. Coach K, widely regarded as the best coach since Wooden has lost about 10x as many tournaments as he has won. They should get rid of that kind of lack of drive, lack of "vision", lack of the right "goals" even though I am pretty sure that they start each season and game with the first goal of winning the game that they are suiting up for.

Oregon, what happens when the coaches recruit the best players perfectly or as good as anyone can, say like a certain big from Portland. And yet, despite that effort, a phone call gets him to Kentucky??? In your world the coaching staff must breath a sigh of relief bc no one will expect them to win the national championship.

They MUST get there before St. Mary's??? What about Butler? A school none of us heard of before 4 years ago? If SMC can raise their game to that level before us, is there a damn thing the Zags or their staff can do about it?? Other than playing their hardest? In your world, yes. It is simply a "mindset."

We all try to get better everyday. That would include each Zag and the staff. I was totally pissed about our effort at BYU and the direction things were going but I don't question the coaches' will to win, nor the players. I don't question their heart. I don't question that they are always trying to get better. And I sure as hell don't question that no one is bothered more by that loss than the ones that were there, coaching and playing.

Keep writing your posts - it is your right as a fan and no one is blocking you or none of us would read them. Just don't question the heart or desire of the coaches' or the players bc unless you are in that locker room, you have no idea what is being said or done. That is not your right.

kclubfounder
02-05-2012, 05:00 PM
I disagree the OP in most ways but GUnawin sentiment is correct. But it is like preaching to a choir.

IMO, it is not about recruiting right now, its the CONTENTENT in our program. From staff to fans and everywhere in between we are content and happy. Many members here habitually police to make sure no one vocally asks for more because it implies they are not happy and are hurting team spirit. For me it is about no matter how good or rich or happy you are today, you should always do your best to get better. It is an ironic paradox fans of Gonzaga are in, we want to win a N.C. but we don't want to change anything and to want it is not being a Zag or not a true fan. I wish I could talk to Few to see if he feels he is done learning, growing and changing for the better as a coach. I think I know the answer. TAnd that is all I want for him and for every other student at Gonzaga. TO REACH THEIR POTENTIAL. But I continually see potential lost and it isn't due to luck or a better opponent, it is our own heads and changing up before the game is over. We count our chickens.........

Our program clearly wants to get better but I see one very deep problem. Our program lacks clear defined goals and it lacks urgency in reaching those goals.

On the court, and in spite of what the media and fans want to believe, we are a horrible transition team. Our heads are way ahead of where our teammates are!! Haste is causing too many TO's, missed dunks, layups. It also affecting our FT's.

THIS MUST STOP!! 40 minutes of solid fundamental basketball! Period. If you give the horse its head, it will not win the race. Every jockey knows this. So why does Few let our guys continually blow a 10+ point leads because they start to "run and gun"! We get so sloppy the commentators routinely notice and tell the truth right on TV? When we stick to working the ball inside and defense oriented ball and we consistently get ahead by 10. then we go to run and gun and we blow it with sloppy play.

Stricter adherence to fundamentals, no letting up on our opponent or on our own game plan, and less micromanaging the rotation and using bench time as punishment.

This is just my opinion folks! Go ahead, the 2 admins that like to secretly give negative feedback can do so. But Few needs to figure out how to get us to the final four! Not let St Marys do it first. Few has to change his development of recruits. It is not the recruits we bring in.

My "opinion" is that it doesn't matter who your call your team. You will always be unhappy. If you are a Yankee fan, or a Duke fan, or were a fan of UCLA in the Walton years you would still find reasons to be unhappy.

I feel sorry for you and your kind. Life's too short. Sports is fun. Too bad you don't get it.

Bing
02-05-2012, 05:34 PM
My "opinion" is that it doesn't matter who your call your team. You will always be unhappy. If you are a Yankee fan, or a Duke fan, or were a fan of UCLA in the Walton years you would still find reasons to be unhappy.

I feel sorry for you and your kind. Life's too short. Sports is fun. Too bad you don't get it.

Perfect. Simply perfect.

Coach Crazy
02-05-2012, 06:03 PM
Just don't question the heart or desire of the coaches' or the players bc unless you are in that locker room, you have no idea what is being said or done. That is not your right.

I call bull. If you have ever coached, or been a leader in some capacity, there are often times when you can see when someone's heart or mind is not in something.

When I sat almost-courtside pre-game at the Marriott Center, during shoot around, you could see some things in the eyes (and behind the eyes) of some of those players. Some very troubling things. You personally may not be able to see it, but that does not mean others can't.

Bing
02-05-2012, 06:09 PM
I call bull. If you have ever coached, or been a leader in some capacity, there are often times when you can see when someone's heart or mind is not in something.

When I sat almost-courtside pre-game at the Marriott Center, during shoot around, you could see some things in the eyes (and behind the eyes) of some of those players. Some very troubling things. You personally may not be able to see it, but that does not mean others can't.

You had a good seat.

Good for you.

I'm also glad you've got your ESP -- and that you can share your foam finger'd thoughts about what's going on "behind the eyes" of people you don't know.

MDABE80
02-05-2012, 06:49 PM
I call bull. If you have ever coached, or been a leader in some capacity, there are often times when you can see when someone's heart or mind is not in something.

When I sat almost-courtside pre-game at the Marriott Center, during shoot around, you could see some things in the eyes (and behind the eyes) of some of those players. Some very troubling things. You personally may not be able to see it, but that does not mean others can't.


Probably FEAR Coach. Not ever having been playing before 22.7 crazy fans out for blood because of their last game. I'd be having my eyes do funny things too... Perhaps the eyes didn't deceive you but to define some oddity like the "lost look, the pain, hell hounds on your butt...and going to hell at tipoff thing" seems a bit much. I'd be plain scared. I still can't remeber a worse outburst by fans... FEAR does make you look "unusual".

Santangelo_for_3
02-05-2012, 06:55 PM
Personally, I'm not going to complain and moan about not making a final four or win a title.. Perspective. We are Gonzaga. What we have done is unprecedented. We shouldn't be nationally relevant. What has happened here since the 1998-1999 year is unbelievable.

But at the same time, I'm not going to give the staff/players a free pass because of this. I don't believe this team has overachieved like the first several teams did.. Those teams won games they weren't supposed to win. They showed up in big games. They had big time players. Recently, we've embarrassed ourselves in big games for the most part. We've Underachieved a lot in recent years.

Teams have gotten worse as the year went on. Players don't seem to get any better anymore. We don't show up in the big games.. Losses like Arizona made me proud. Losses like the last two to BYU and Syracuse make me mad. Those are embarrassing losses. I don't believe we have had teams good enough to win titles, but we shouldn't be getting BLOWN out in big games, either. I want to maximize our talent and get the most out of it, like we used to. Battles with UCONN.. Battles with Arizona. Not blow outs. Not regression. What happened?

Zagsker
02-05-2012, 07:06 PM
GU, man a dose of perspective; Villarino wasn't an all-american and he's really tearing it up at Appalachian State - NOT. Butler is sucking this year, staying good ain't easy; and it took SMC 11 years to catch up, not just the last 2.
Am I pleased with how we played in our 4 losses, no. Heck I'm not pleased with how we played in a good portion of our wins, but the sky ain't fallin'. We have a program that produces consistent excellence, it's a process. I'd rather win every year than make it to the FF once and drop off the map for the next 10 years.

bingo:agreed:

cjm720
02-06-2012, 08:28 AM
I don't have the time or inclination to rip apart this post, so I'll just say this: bigs are hard to come by and Few and Co. has done an excellent job recruiting against bigger, more high profile schools. I'll add that there's likely not a team in the country that wouldn't want Rob on its team.


I posted earlier my thoughts on our big, Rob! I'm not sure how all felt on the topic, but some agreed Scare isn't the answer.

In my opinion with Bell and Pangos we can win it all (in the future) with a nice big!

You got'ta get more production form the middle, but Mark and company keeps recruiting nice PG's.

Running off guys like (McDonald All American's like Villarino). I just don't get it!

It's just my opinion, we need players of lenght and can score. guys like Austin Daye.

Doesn't it bother you to hope every year to see OUR team get beat in the 1st round?

We now we can make the tourney, can't we feel confident at some point it doesn't need to be magic?

Let's put players on the court (Thru recruiting) that allows us to be more than that!

We have the key pieces (Bell, Pangos, Spangler, Dower), lets get a big that seals the deal. Remember the kid from Illinous(SP), that can score from inside and out! Why can't we recruit a young man like that???

I love love one NFL team that keeps me hanging every year, just as the Zags.

The program is beyond, the glass slipper, Butler proved that point!

Do we want the program to just compete or truly contend? Geez, St Mary's has caught up just in 2-3 years.

It's heart breaking to me too know GU is just a contender, the magic slipper is gone, the nation sees it, the mystic is gone....

Heck, Murray State at last glance is unbeaten....great game coming up with St. Mary's

What I'm trying to say here is, don't tease us as fans...don't have aprogram that says "we can win it" when in actuality we're just average!

Recruit good kids yes, but kids that allow us to win it all.

IS D. Stockton that kid, nope a legacy yes..but creates me heartburn all the same.

I love GU basketball, but winning "In my mind" is what it boils down too!

We can't have the program that lives in our past success, that has past long ago!

Coach Crazy
02-06-2012, 08:39 AM
Probably FEAR Coach. Not ever having been playing before 22.7 crazy fans out for blood because of their last game. I'd be having my eyes do funny things too... Perhaps the eyes didn't deceive you but to define some oddity like the "lost look, the pain, hell hounds on your butt...and going to hell at tipoff thing" seems a bit much. I'd be plain scared. I still can't remeber a worse outburst by fans... FEAR does make you look "unusual".

You do realize that the crowd never even reached capacity during the height of the game, let alone shoot around? I have never seen a "major" arena like that so empty for such a long time. It didn't actually start getting filled until about 12 minutes or so until game time. It had nothing to do with fear of a crappy fan base. This team has played in some of the biggest venues in the country. And before you talk about us having Freshman on the team, they aren't the ones that I was worried about...

Coach Crazy
02-06-2012, 08:42 AM
You had a good seat.

Good for you.

I'm also glad you've got your ESP -- and that you can share your foam finger'd thoughts about what's going on "behind the eyes" of people you don't know.

Do you know what "foam finger'd"? Brush up on your vernacular. Look at my breakdown of the game. "Foam finger'd" implies that one does not have an understanding of the game itself, but cheers anyway. Nice try, though.

cjm720
02-06-2012, 08:57 AM
Teams have gotten worse as the year went on. Players don't seem to get any better anymore. We don't show up in the big games.. Losses like Arizona made me proud. Losses like the last two to BYU and Syracuse make me mad. Those are embarrassing losses. I don't believe we have had teams good enough to win titles, but we shouldn't be getting BLOWN out in big games, either. I want to maximize our talent and get the most out of it, like we used to. Battles with UCONN.. Battles with Arizona. Not blow outs. Not regression. What happened?

And then there's the St. John's ass-whooping we put on Lavin and Co....nobody thought we could beat the Big East beast, yet we dominated, we blew them out.

We've got to take the good with the bad....and overall our trajectory continues to climb.

Reborn
02-06-2012, 09:00 AM
Personally, I'm not going to complain and moan about not making a final four or win a title.. Perspective. We are Gonzaga. What we have done is unprecedented. We shouldn't be nationally relevant. What has happened here since the 1998-1999 year is unbelievable.

But at the same time, I'm not going to give the staff/players a free pass because of this. I don't believe this team has overachieved like the first several teams did.. Those teams won games they weren't supposed to win. They showed up in big games. They had big time players. Recently, we've embarrassed ourselves in big games for the most part. We've Underachieved a lot in recent years.

Teams have gotten worse as the year went on. Players don't seem to get any better anymore. We don't show up in the big games.. Losses like Arizona made me proud. Losses like the last two to BYU and Syracuse make me mad. Those are embarrassing losses. I don't believe we have had teams good enough to win titles, but we shouldn't be getting BLOWN out in big games, either. I want to maximize our talent and get the most out of it, like we used to. Battles with UCONN.. Battles with Arizona. Not blow outs. Not regression. What happened?

I think what you fail to understand is how good the WCC is this year, and really every year in some ways. Look at Morrison's team when he was a Junior. That was a great team, but those guys had closer games in conference play then GU has had overall. Conference play is just so darn tough. When you play against a team that knows you so well, it is really harder to win,and it's harder to "look good."

The other thing is that this team is not as talented as most teams Few has coached. He said that at the beginning of the year. I think this years team has done great, and especially when Carter has had such a bad year. Who would have ever thought that he would play the way he has played this year. And it REALLY hurt the team to have Landry-Edi miss those 8 games. He is slowly coming around, as Marquis did last year. He certainly played a good game on Saturday. And he has had a couple other good games. There are still 6 more games for him to continue to improve.

Doing good in tournament play at the end of the year is all about peaking at the right time. Could St Mary's have peaked too early? We know that Gonzaga certainly HAS NOT. We'll learn alot on Thursday.

Bing
02-06-2012, 09:29 AM
Do you know what "foam finger'd"? Brush up on your vernacular. Look at my breakdown of the game. "Foam finger'd" implies that one does not have an understanding of the game itself, but cheers anyway. Nice try, though.

Yes, I do know. I threw that in there because in earlier posts you've used that term to refer to posters that in your opinion don't quite have your self proclaimed world class competition and coaching skills. Cheers.

GoGU
02-06-2012, 10:27 AM
Y'all need to play nice, now.

Santangelo_for_3
02-06-2012, 12:49 PM
We can keep talking about how good the WCC is this year. Guys, we were BLOWN out by BYU and Saint Marys this season. It's a valid argument if we played decent in those games, and they were close.

Santa Clara can go get BLOWN OUT against SMC and BYU. We killed ourselves and played absolutely terrible in those games. How good our opponents were is irrelevant in those two matches. We didn't play even remotely good. That's what bothers me. Not the fact that we lost. This team should never get blown out by a WCC opponent. EVER. SMC and BYU have both lost games this season. They aren't Kentucky and North Carolina. They should not be blowing out the Zags. No excuses for that.

cjm720
02-06-2012, 01:48 PM
Santa Clara can go get BLOWN OUT against SMC and BYU. We killed ourselves and played absolutely terrible in those games. How good our opponents were is irrelevant in those two matches. We didn't play even remotely good. That's what bothers me. Not the fact that we lost. This team should never get blown out by a WCC opponent. EVER. SMC and BYU have both lost games this season. They aren't Kentucky and North Carolina. They should not be blowing out the Zags. No excuses for that.

Why should we never get blown out by a WCC opponent? Have you followed St. Mary's and its success and recruiting lately? Have you played in a 3,000 or 22,000 capacity gym? The beauty of sports is that anyone can win on any given night...throw in a couple eggs and you can't get blown out. Happens all the time...

Santangelo_for_3
02-06-2012, 02:27 PM
Why should we never get blown out by a WCC opponent? Have you followed St. Mary's and its success and recruiting lately? Have you played in a 3,000 or 22,000 capacity gym? The beauty of sports is that anyone can win on any given night...throw in a couple eggs and you can't get blown out. Happens all the time...

Disagree. There is no reason to get blown out. Especially considering we blew ourselves out, really. Just played brutal. They beat us, but we helped. A lot. Go look at SMCs schedule and results. In terms of the WCC, our 19 point loss was pretty much their biggest win all conference season long. THAT is why we shouldn't be blown out. The last FOUR WCC opponents who went to Moraga, gave them a better game than we did. You're OK with that? SMC is that much better than Gonzaga, but not that much better than lowly San Diego or Portland? No excuses.

cjm720
02-06-2012, 03:00 PM
It's been a fun ride, but the Zags have been the targets of WCC foes for a dozen years and it's now catching up with us. You cannot discount that every single time we go into another gym, we're public enemy number one. St. Mary's might have blown us out (a loss is a loss IMO), and he student section flooded the floor. We're a big deal and to sustain it this long is a big deal. So, maybe St. Mary's let up vs. SCU...not against us. We've been the king at the top and there's only room for one.

I'd rather tip my hat to Randy Bennet and Co. than ##### about my own team.

kclubfounder
02-06-2012, 03:38 PM
Disagree. There is no reason to get blown out. Especially considering we blew ourselves out, really. Just played brutal. They beat us, but we helped. A lot. Go look at SMCs schedule and results. In terms of the WCC, our 19 point loss was pretty much their biggest win all conference season long. THAT is why we shouldn't be blown out. The last FOUR WCC opponents who went to Moraga, gave them a better game than we did. You're OK with that? SMC is that much better than Gonzaga, but not that much better than lowly San Diego or Portland? No excuses.

Your "there is no reason to get blown out" stance makes one wonder how much basketball you've watched in your life.

Santangelo_for_3
02-06-2012, 04:02 PM
Your "there is no reason to get blown out" stance makes one wonder how much basketball you've watched in your life.

Are you the designated personal insult guy? Good to know. I'll make a mental note of it. Since your response included no substance or worth, my response to you wont either. This is fun!

Zag79
02-06-2012, 04:20 PM
We should never get blown out vs we need 5 Stockton's... I don't quite know who to agree with. :lmao: Just kidding fellas! I believe it falls more in the middle. I don't think we should have lost as bad as we did in either game, and to me the coaching and rotation was the main culprit. But blowouts do happen, see North Carolina losing 90-58 at Florida State (ouch). At the same time, i agree that a blowout like we had at SMC with the talent we have is something i would hope not to see. I guess thats what makes sports so fun (and drives us nuts), you just never know. Take care of business at home during the upcoming stretch and we are good to go.

kclubfounder
02-06-2012, 04:32 PM
Are you the designated personal insult guy? Good to know. I'll make a mental note of it. Since your response included no substance or worth, my response to you wont either. This is fun!

I guess my post hurt a bit. Sometimes getting called out for a silly position creates some pain. Sorry about that. But I agree, discussing sports is fun.

kclubfounder
02-06-2012, 04:37 PM
Zag 79, nice memory on the 5 Stockton post. Arguing with you must be like arguing with my wife! :)

For the record, I'll stand by my opinion that having 5 guys who have remotely the court awareness/basketball IQ along with the effort of the aforementioned point guard would be a very good thing.

titopoet
02-07-2012, 07:46 AM
This has been a fun thread in Human dynamics and understanding. It started by saying we need to recruit an Anthony Davis or Michael Kidd-Gilchrist to win a NC. Reality check Kentucky pays their coach more than the entire program costs of GU.
Next someone made a poker analogy. (Though most true poker players would question Texas hold 'em as described as poker, more like a TV fake that looks sort of like the real thing, but that another story.) Saying to settle for only not wanting to play at the big table. Reality check. GU is a small Jesuit University in a very small media market, playing against UCLA, Duke, North Carolina and Kentucky and the rest, with more money and media. They are dealt a pair of Bullets routinely, while Few and co seldom get that advantage. Remember the Kyle Wiltjer chose to play backup at Kentucky than starting for GU.

Then came another saying that GU has grown complacent. Anyone watching Few on the sideline can easily refute that one. SMC has taken GU's playbook with undervalued foreign players and good transfers to build a good team. This has attracted national attention where there was none. The basketball world will be paying attention to GU and SMC when they play. Looking at that with out Beer Goggles of GU's past success would think that is absolutely a miracle. Two small catholic universities, with combined student enrollment less than Michigan State and one from one of the smallest media market and the other on the edges of their media market, playing in front of a national audience. Are you kidding me???

For those who think that all GU needs to win the NC is ...? All I have to say is:

"Earth to spaceship Lala Land. Earth to spaceship Lala Land. Go right, go right ... your are a billion miles from reality."

bigblahla
02-07-2012, 08:50 AM
This has been a fun thread in Human dynamics and understanding. It started by saying we need to recruit an Anthony Davis or Michael Kidd-Gilchrist to win a NC. Reality check Kentucky pays their coach more than the entire program costs of GU.
Next someone made a poker analogy. (Though most true poker players would question Texas hold 'em as described as poker, more like a TV fake that looks sort of like the real thing, but that another story.) Saying to settle for only not wanting to play at the big table. Reality check. GU is a small Jesuit University in a very small media market, playing against UCLA, Duke, North Carolina and Kentucky and the rest, with more money and media. They are dealt a pair of Bullets routinely, while Few and co seldom get that advantage. Remember the Kyle Wiltjer chose to play backup at Kentucky than starting for GU.

Then came another saying that GU has grown complacent. Anyone watching Few on the sideline can easily refute that one. SMC has taken GU's playbook with undervalued foreign players and good transfers to build a good team. This has attracted national attention where there was none. The basketball world will be paying attention to GU and SMC when they play. Looking at that with out Beer Goggles of GU's past success would think that is absolutely a miracle. Two small catholic universities, with combined student enrollment less than Michigan State and one from one of the smallest media market and the other on the edges of their media market, playing in front of a national audience. Are you kidding me???

For those who think that all GU needs to win the NC is ...? All I have to say is:

"Earth to spaceship Lala Land. Earth to spaceship Lala Land. Go right, go right ... your are a billion miles from reality."

Thank you titopoet.

Go!! Zags!!!

willandi
02-07-2012, 11:31 AM
Isn't Lala Land where Pepperdine is?

And yes, Thanks Titopoet!

FuManShoes
02-07-2012, 12:18 PM
Appreciate the passion -- but I have a few questions/comments on your "thoughts".

I was wondering why this dude put every ill-conceived and poorly formatted thought on its own line, but now I know. Nice additions, GoZags.