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bigblahla
11-12-2011, 11:39 AM
Wow!

After reading all the spew after our VICTORY I am now convinced that there is a majority here who will never be happy short of a National Championship banner hanging in K2.

For those that think Hart did a bad job on Chiverton exactly who would you have guard him?

We are a spoiled bunch of Zaggies with many unreal expectations.

Should have a poll as to how many here think EWU was a crappy team and we played very badly. Sad to think there is a large group here that would agree with that position.

We are an amazingly fickled bunch already ragging on our coach, degrading our own players and this after a Win.

Our TEAM, Coach and staff deserve better and we probably deserve a hell of a lot less.

Just my opinion.

Go!! Zags!!!

LongIslandZagFan
11-12-2011, 11:41 AM
+1,000,000

spike_jr
11-12-2011, 11:45 AM
I have about $1,000,000 reasons why Few should learn to defend 3 point jump shooters!

Martin Centre Mad Man
11-12-2011, 11:50 AM
I honestly never thought that I'd whine after the team wins a game by pounding the boards and fouling out the opponent's entire starting five. I still feel like whining.

GoZags
11-12-2011, 11:53 AM
This board's "meltdown" is similar in nature to the Washington Husky football board(s) after their opening season 30 to 27 victory over Eastern Washington at Husky Stadium.

What was missed by venting Husky football fans in early September was the fact that Washington played close to the vest -- not really showing anything in their game plan (i.e. UW didn't throw downfield -- they ran between the tackles -- they didn't blitz, etc). After all, they were playing Eastern -- and as tough as it was to watch -- they DID win.

Although last night's GU game wasn't fun to watch (i.e. GU didn't display 10 percent of the arsenal) -- it DID end up in a "W".

11 and 13 are still alive. How could those streaks possibly exist given that the team is in Coach Few's inept hands -- and not in the hands of the multitude of smarter, more basketball savvy folks that bestow their expertise on this board? Seems impossible to me.

Somehow -- I think the Zags will be okay -- despite the nonstop rumbling from the masses.

So -- the one thing I have to say?

Beat WSU.

Jedster
11-12-2011, 11:53 AM
+1,000,000

Ditto!

It's the first freakin game of the year and we're trying to integrate new players into some pretty important roles. Give it a break. We're not going to be running on all cylinders for a while.

ZagHouse
11-12-2011, 11:54 AM
We do this every year though by reading all the preseason hype and fan posts. We build these expectations up in our head and when the product we envisioned doesn't materialize on the court--we freak. That being said, I think most posts boil down to a frustration over the rotation, our lack of perimeter defense and Hart receiving more minutes than most feel comfortable with giving him. All three of those are valid concerns, some have possibly signaled for the end of the world a bit prematurely--time will tell. We did dodge a bullet, seeing as how yesterday was 11-11-11.

spike_jr
11-12-2011, 12:08 PM
ZagHouse - I think you are right on the money. I understand that this is the first game. We are not in practice and therefore it is a difficult to question the rotation and playing times. But, the inability to defend the three point line is nothing new. In fact, it is so old, that it does not seem like something that you can hang on the players. I honestly believe it boils down to coaching/defensive scheme.

izzjess
11-12-2011, 12:11 PM
that was not a victory... a win yes, a victory no...and there would be know win if not for the refs or, all the fouls witch ever way you look at it...

RockandRollJames
11-12-2011, 12:13 PM
Shut up.

75Zag
11-12-2011, 12:16 PM
If GU was UConn or Kentucky or UNC or Duke and the coach left a stack of burger boys sitting on the bench in order to play an assortment of walk on players, all this screaming and shouting might make some sense. But the fact is that Few decided for his own reasons that the kids he played were more ready or more practiced or more skilled or more compatible for the first game of the season than the guys he didn't play. It's not like the guys he didn't play are a bunch of First Team All Americans. Maybe they will be great players someday at some level or maybe they are duds. Perhaps some of each. Anyway, I trust Few's judgment.

Go Bulldogs! Get Bigger!

MDABE80
11-12-2011, 12:21 PM
Shut up.

lololoolololololllllllll.haaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!

Shanachie
11-12-2011, 12:37 PM
We are an amazingly fickled bunch already ragging on our coach, degrading our own players and this after a Win.

Out TEAM, Coach and staff deserve better and we probably deserve a hell of a lot less.



Amen!

wiszag
11-12-2011, 12:58 PM
I think a lot of posters are missing the point...how can this board have approximately 35 meltdowns this season if the first game is ignored? How can we take a meltdown seriously after a loss if we don't meltdown after the first win? I think we'd be doing a great disservice to the traditions of this board if there wasn't a complete, irrational #####fest after every game. I, for one, don't want to see anyone on this board looking past the next opponent. We'll reconvene after the next game and have a whine-fest that we can all be proud of. We need to take this one game at a time and hopefully by the end of March or the beginning of April we'll be able to look back at a truly remarkable series of crybaby postings.

Carry on.

zag buddy
11-12-2011, 01:04 PM
BigB +1

zag67
11-12-2011, 01:45 PM
I think that someone should look at Duke's win. They won by one against Belmont. I think using what people say on this board, that Duke should look for a new team and also a new coach.

I think that many think the freshmen are going to come in and play like they did in high school. That is not going to happen. When you have two new freshmen, I would think you would want as much maturity playing the other positions as possible. After you play 1 or 2 games with Pangos and GB, then you can start bringing in Spangler. In this game we were not hurting on the boards. Hart might not be as good on offensive as some players or on defense as some players, but he does know the system better than most. Therefore the coaches did what they did.

NEC26
11-12-2011, 02:13 PM
I have to ask is fickled a word? I've heard of fickle but fickled? Pickled, tickled, never fickled.;)

Ezag
11-12-2011, 02:55 PM
Meltdown is just part of the healing process when we come to the realization that we are not as good in reality as we hyped us up to be in our minds.

bigblahla
11-12-2011, 03:12 PM
I have to ask is fickled a word? I've heard of fickle but fickled? Pickled, tickled, never fickled.;)

I never let Websters stand in my way, think pickled but different. ;)

Go!! Zags!!!

maynard g krebs
11-12-2011, 03:36 PM
I have about $1,000,000 reasons why Few should learn to defend 3 point jump shooters!

Few is only 5'8 or so, and probably lacks great quickness, in addition to not having much of a vertical. And, I think he has used up his eligibility.

TheGonzagaFactor
11-12-2011, 04:00 PM
that was not a victory... a win yes, a victory no...and there would be know win if not for the refs or, all the fouls witch ever way you look at it...

Yeah if they never called fouls it'd be hard to win. I don't think they called enough fouls on Eastern to be honest, they weren't even trying to play D in the paint.

U Zig, I Zag
11-12-2011, 04:10 PM
This is what we do, why is everyone so surprised?????

This isn't abnormal or even wrong. If the board was dead, then I would worry because then it would mean people are caring less and less.

The 'meltdown' doesn't exist. This place has been Three Mile Island since day one.

It's how we roll.

spike_jr
11-12-2011, 04:12 PM
Actually, Few has 4 years of eligibility left as he never played basketball at linfield or UofO. And at 5'8", he couldn't be any worse of a perimeter defender than what we witnessed last night

ZagLawGrad
11-12-2011, 04:22 PM
Not surprised at the meltdown of some.

But continually amazed at the expectations some have for the new Frosh on this team. Potential? Yes, but the cart is before the horse to think that KP and GBJ will lead this team further than last year's edition.

Regardless, I'll keep hoping for the best.

ZagFanInNC
11-12-2011, 04:31 PM
Actually, Few has 4 years of eligibility left as he never played basketball at linfield or UofO. And at 5'8", he couldn't be any worse of a perimeter defender than what we witnessed last night

You have a five year window to play sports from the day you start college, Few's elegibility ran out about 20 years ago. If he was a decent defender that hustled a lot he would probably give himself 30 minutes a game though.

Gonzdb8
11-12-2011, 04:38 PM
relax. this isn't a a meltdown, just fans doing what fans do. worrying, lamenting and second guessing the coach is part of being a fan for a lot of people, let em enjoy themselves. and why is it an unrealistic expectation that pangos and gbj, two highly recruited players, would be better than stockton and hart, a couple of walk-ons (who have obviously proved themselves solid role players). like everyone else i'm eager to understand what the method behind fews madness is. for now i'll give the guy the benefit of the doubt but its not like the questions being raised are outlandish.

go zags!

2wiceright
11-12-2011, 04:49 PM
Meltdown is just part of the healing process when we come to the realization that we are not as good in reality as we hyped us up to be in our minds.

I hate to say it but you make a good point there Ezag!

Johnnygu
11-12-2011, 04:53 PM
Meltdown is just part of the healing process when we come to the realization that we are not as good in reality as we hyped us up to be in our minds.

Not as good yet...let's wait and see what we look like at the end of the season.

john montana
11-12-2011, 05:03 PM
Look at the duke game? Belmont is the real deal...they probably should be ranked right now. You can't be serious with that comparison.

EWU, not so much. I don't think th sky is falling because we failed to beat EWU by 30 but I don't for a second believe EWU is all that good. Mostly, I think we need to play our best players.

And no, I personally do not believe that mike hart is one of our seven best players. Forget staters, etc...I don't think he is one of our seven best...at least I sure hope he isn't.

No, we shouldn't fire few or burn down k2 but I am honestly confused. Playing a walk on 29 minutes and wasting (yes wasting) the chance for our frosh to get some court time has me confused.

Do most of you honestly think hart is one of our top seven guys? We need to play our best players.

04ZagFan
11-12-2011, 05:40 PM
So tired of people posting about people posting.

Last night was an embarrassing performance. People are going to talk about it. There is a HUGE difference between winning a national championship, and stopping BAD teams from going off from 3 against us.

Basketball knowledge, people. If you don't get why so many people have a problem with the recent play of the Zags D, you probably don't know basketball.

awberke
11-12-2011, 05:47 PM
So tired of people posting about people posting.

Last night was an embarrassing performance. People are going to talk about it. There is a HUGE difference between winning a national championship, and stopping BAD teams from going off from 3 against us.

Basketball knowledge, people. If you don't get why so many people have a problem with the recent play of the Zags D, you probably don't know basketball.

Boo freaking hoo. It was one game! Go declare the sky is falling to someone who cares.

We will get better. I thought EWU just played their hearts out. They had nothing to lose and we did.

ZagWhoShotLibertyValance
11-12-2011, 05:54 PM
last night not embarrassing. that is silly on the face of it.

many are acting as if EWU did not play last night. that hayford did not coach. you are not giving these people their credit. you are spitting at them, honestly.

gonzaga played okay and is left open to speculation that they might have some issues defending the three (wow, alert the media) and generating offense (wow, lost our starting point guard and our starting shooting guard and have no real legitimate '3' -another shocker)

but ewu and their coach did things last night. they played. they made shots, they defended and they coached.

last night was not embarrassing.

but thinking it was embarrassing might be.

04ZagFan
11-12-2011, 05:55 PM
Boo freaking hoo. It was one game! Go declare the sky is falling to someone who cares.

We will get better. I thought EWU just played their hearts out. They had nothing to lose and we did.

It isn't ONE game. Do you watch basketball? Have you watched the Zags the last several years? We can't guard the three... I'm sure things will get better as well, but there is no reason NOT to talk about the weaknesses last night. Isn't that what a message board is for?

I'd love to be as happy go lucky as you, but unfortunately I know basketball, and I know Gonzaga basketball. It's a theme, and a bad one.

awberke
11-12-2011, 06:00 PM
It isn't ONE game. Do you watch basketball? Have you watched the Zags the last several years? We can't guard the three... I'm sure things will get better as well, but there is no reason NOT to talk about the weaknesses last night. Isn't that what a message board is for?

I'd love to be as happy go lucky as you, but unfortunately I know basketball, and I know Gonzaga basketball. It's a theme, and a bad one.

What do you hope to gain by harping on it? Believe me, i was near punching myself in the face as they dropped threes all night.

But obviously nothing changes, it must be Few's defensive strategy, we don't need 10^6 posts/threads about how we can't guard the three.

04ZagFan
11-12-2011, 06:02 PM
What do you hope to gain by harping on it? Believe me, i was near punching myself in the face as they dropped threes all night.

But obviously nothing changes, it must be Few's defensive strategy, we don't need 10^6 posts/threads about how we can't guard the three.

I'd love there to be just one thread about it as well, but it's not my fault that there are lots.

Also, this is a message board. We come to vent. Last night was terrible, and even you admit it... This is why this board is here.. To discuss GU hoops, good and bad.

zag67
11-12-2011, 06:07 PM
So Kingzag, how many games did the Eastern coach win last year? If I am not mistaken he had a very good year. He came in to the game and his goal was to foul as many times as they could. The refs would get tired and not call all of them. And that is what happened. Also if we had made many of our early layins and foul shots, this game would not have been as close. We also screwed up and let 2 players make a couple of threes, gain their confidence and then they wre making off balenced shots from everywhere. No they were not Belmont. But SPU beat Arizona, so what do you say about them?

And yes, it is frustrating when you think we should blow someone out, but I think that the coaches were looking for ways to work 2 new freshmen into a lineup (with as little pressure as possilbe) and therefore tried to surround them with people that knew the system.

bigblahla
11-12-2011, 06:18 PM
So tired of people posting about people posting.
Last night was an embarrassing performance. People are going to talk about it. There is a HUGE difference between winning a national championship, and stopping BAD teams from going off from 3 against us.

Basketball knowledge, people. If you don't get why so many people have a problem with the recent play of the Zags D, you probably don't know basketball.It isn't ONE game. Do you watch basketball? Have you watched the Zags the last several years? We can't guard the three... I'm sure things will get better as well, but there is no reason NOT to talk about the weaknesses last night. Isn't that what a message board is for?

I'd love to be as happy go lucky as you, but unfortunately I know basketball, and I know Gonzaga basketball. It's a theme, and a bad one.

Yep! We give up the three and have lost to teams that hit double digits on us, not last night.

We stuck to our guns and rammed it down their throats til there weren't as many as there were before.

It's called picking your poison. I'll take Few's record over yours any day.

You are now the poster child for this thread the first GU fickled fan award winner it's yours until some other Jackass makes another asinine post degrading both teams.

We won and now so did you!!!!

:000tens::allhail: :000tens:

Go!! Zags!!!

Rio Runner
11-12-2011, 06:36 PM
You are now the poster child for this thread the first GU fickled fan award winner it's yours until some other Jackass makes another asinine post degrading both teams.

Classy.

GeorgiaZagFan
11-12-2011, 06:51 PM
You are now the poster child for this thread the first GU fickled fan award winner it's yours until some other Jackass makes another asinine post degrading both teams.

...then the Zags did just fine last night. IF you want to be top 25 caliber...the Zags have to bring much more (and play Hart a maximum of 10 minutes per game) EVERY team in the top 25 would beat the EWU team by at least 20 ....and look much better doing it!

snebzag
11-12-2011, 06:53 PM
Wow! It is alot like "SPY VS SPY" Same guys fighting each other in "Mad Magazine".
I just like to cut to the chase and put my thoughts in the 60 seconds the moderator allows me.
*Eastern played great with foul trouble and great shooting..
*Zags played poorly with no real sense of urgency or a rotation that worked. Three guys got NO minutes.
*I love Mike Harts energy, but 30 minutes on the court is too much.
*I felt like they lost last night, but I know they will play better as the level of competion gets better.
*Who will end up at the "3" position will define this team and its run into the first part of April.

MickMick
11-12-2011, 07:14 PM
The young guys will be carrying us through conference play.

04ZagFan
11-12-2011, 07:25 PM
Those of who think we were "just fine" last night need to either get glasses, or learn basketball..

I'm not saying we won't win 20-25 games this season and make the dance, because we will, but there is nothing wrong with debating serious weaknesses.

Zag-Coug
11-12-2011, 07:43 PM
I personally don't agree with the
"Hey guys, we won the game. Everything's cool and it will all work out."
mantra that some are projecting after this game. It was the first game of the year. That being true, you would expect disjointed play, perhaps even weak chemistry. You would expect lineup experimentation. I really don't have a problem with any of those things that I saw last night. Were I the coach, might I have chosen to play certain players more (or at all in some cases)? Yeah probably, but I trust Coach Few to figure these things out. If playing Hart 30 mins helps coach figure some things out about this team, I trust him.

What was really alarming to me is that here we are again, with yet another opponent drilling us from the 3-pt line and us seemingly having no clue what to do about it. And as someone posted above, it's a far more serious problem than 1 game. Look at the box scores of years past guys. This is happening like 10 times a year. I haven't checked it explicitly, but I wouldn't be surprised if this pattern occurred in 80%-90% of our losses.

EWU has some talent to be sure. But they don't really have a single decent post player. If you were game-planning before this game, you'd have to know (I mean it was painfully obvious), that the only way for EWU to be in this game was to hit some threes. Our perimeter defenders should have been up in people's grilles all night long. We have the big men to protect the rim should our perimeter defenders get beat. Dower, Sacre, and Harris had a combined 3 fouls between them.

To sum it up, am I happy we won? Yes! Do I think line-up issues will be tinkered with and ironed out as the year progresses? Absolutely. Am I concerned about the offense? No. Do we have a foundational issue with perimeter defense in our program? Looking at a sample size of multiple years spanning multiple player groups, sadly I would have to say yes.

04ZagFan
11-12-2011, 07:45 PM
I personally don't with the
"Hey guys, we won the game. Everything's cool and it will all work out."
mantra that some are projecting after this game. It was the first game of the year. That being true, you would expect disjointed play, perhaps even weak chemistry. You would expect lineup experimentation. I really don't have a problem with any of those things that I saw last night. Were I the coach, might I have chosen to play certain players more (or at all in some cases)? Yeah probably, but I trust Coach Few to figure these things out. If playing Hart 30 mins helps coach figure some things out about this team, I trust him.

What was really alarming to me is that he we are again, with yet another opponent drilling us from the 3-pt line and us seemingly having no clue what to do about it. And as someone posted above, it's a far more serious problem than 1 game. Look at the box scores of years past guys. This is happening like 10 times a year. I haven't checked it explicitly, but I wouldn't be surprised if this pattern occurred in 80%-90% of our losses.

EWU has some talent to be sure. But they don't really have a single decent post player. If you were game-planning before this game, you'd have to know (I mean it was painfully obvious), that the only way for EWU to be in this game was to hit some threes. Our perimeter defenders should have been up in people's grilles all night long. We have the big men to protect the rim should our perimeter defenders get beat. Dower, Sacre, and Harris had a combined 3 fouls between them.

To sum it up, am I happy we won? Yes! Do I think line-up issues will be tinkered with and ironed out as the year progresses? Absolutely. Am I concerned about the offense? No. Do we have a foundational issue with perimeter defense in our program? Looking at a sample size of multiple years spanning multiple player groups, sadly I would have to say yes.

WSU, Illinois, BYU just to name a few, went off on us last year..... It's an epidemic, but apparently pointing that out is not fair to Mark Few and the Zags. We aren't allowed to critique because we are a program higher than we should be..... :starwars:

willandi
11-12-2011, 10:39 PM
WSU, Illinois, BYU just to name a few, went off on us last year..... It's an epidemic, but apparently pointing that out is not fair to Mark Few and the Zags. We aren't allowed to critique because we are a program higher than we should be..... :starwars:

It's nice to know that we have a poster smarter than the majority of professional NCAA b'ball writers, from ESPN to CBS. I don't have a problem with you being that much smarter than them, but I take exception to your decision that you are smarter than me. You haven't yet proven that, but you insist that I, and many like me, have no basketball IQ, while you do. Quit with the opinions. Prove your position, with undeniable facts, or stop claiming your superiority.
Thanks